How P2W is Throne & Liberty?

[@BoE420]

Dude dropped 20k on lost ark then stopped playing. Nothing he says matters

[@tehjunkfood]

Right? I’ve been playing this for a while, have 3k power on a healer, and my gear is optimized. I still get stomped in pvp vs a ton of p2w players. I was the top healer in lineage 2s top guild. And super high rank in wow pvp. This game is grindy as fuck lol. Lineage 2 was worse though, sort of. Only because the cap was way higher though. You could pay $10,000 and not get any gains in L2 lol. You would buy enchant scrolls and they could fail . My guild in L2 owned everything though, and I was hero so we had a ton of control for making money. The top guild that owns the main city in throne gets 500k lucent and 10,000,000,000 gold a month. Lucent is $13.50 for 500. So if you control the main castle you make enough for your guild to buy everything they need really.

[@partyboy1076]

this the same guy who dropped $20k on Lost Ark. Dont listen to these type of people.

[@Jacobb..]

Don’t forget the quit part too

[@CabreraAparicio-xm1gs]

WHAT!!??

[@cain7925]

Sucks to be poor 😂

[@briancenteno8159]

Fr bunch of brokies

[@Ebani]

@@cain7925 Sucks more to be rich and pay that much tho

[@Kirschable]

Shroud never play a game for too long his opinion means nothing

[@indica1420]

Honestly true. Unless its like a pvp shooter game he shouldn't be talking lol

[@heyjulzdontmakeitbad]

Yep they play for easy early content, once the hype died down they leave (which is understandable) but take their opinions with a HEFTY amount of skepticism. 😂

[@Despond]

Pop players, they will just shift to the hype games for clout. People need to understand they are gamers too, there's nothing magically about coming to an accurate conclusion yourself.

[@faultline3936]

And it also doesn't help that MMOs are not his genre. Not really "means nothing" tho, but it definitely means less, in comparison to say, Asmon, and players like myself who've been playing MMOs since the 2000s

[@MirrorBlood]

But hes right though 😅

[@sinkWad]

Dude. That wasn't an answer to the question. That was a complete dodge.

[@edwardhilgendorf8458]

This tells you all you need to know lol

[@VivianWabbit]

He quite literally compared it by stating it was so bad to the point nobody liked the game and now it isn’t. You wanna find out then play it dawg it’s free, n prolly the least p2w mmo ive ever played 😭

[@cain7925]

U havnt seen a pay to win mobile game 😂

[@sinkWad]

@@VivianWabbit He doesn't STATE WHY it is this. Saying OH IT WAS BAD BUT NOW IT NOT SO BAD. That DOESNT MEAN SHIT.

[@SySH78]

its almost as if he was sponsored to stream the game and not badmouth it.

[@Gloriousnone]

"not that bad" for him....

[@noble137]

he’s right it’s not that bad for korean mmos. if you don’t want to listen to mans opinion don’t, it’s just an opinion.

[@jalleheavy895]

Me and my friends enjoy the game and we haven’t puta a single dollar on it

[@noble137]

@@jalleheavy895 yeah i haven’t spent a dime but have earned $50+ of the p2w currency which lets me get a bunch of stuff off the shop etc

[@noble137]

@@jalleheavy895 my friend sold an item for $130 to some whale yesterday in fact xD

[@MagisterMittens]

@@noble137No one cares about how bad it is “for korean MMOs”. People care about how bad it is.

[@IHazMagics]

I don't think Shroud understands why it's bad. It's not an economies of scale thing, it's a hard "can you buy power?" because what Shroud doesn't seem to get here, is that it's the fact that you can do it that's the problem not the degree in which you can do it.

[@xabii7254]

do u even play it?this game is a play to win... Is really easy to get that power in free to play. You can get free game money only for seling items, my friends in 100hours are close to top player.

[@IHazMagics]

@xabii7254 500 hours and a top 50 guild on a server. Yeah, last time I check I played it.

[@EniGmav34]

Im at 3,3k cs in one week just by whaling so yes its P2W

[@IHazMagics]

@EniGmav34 exactly. I'm not inherently sayings it's pay to win. But you can at least pay to have an advantage over someone else simply through swiping the card.

[@Firebreath335]

The problem I see is that Shroud just buys everything he needs. He’s talking about how pay-to-win has decreased, but I still feel his opinion is slightly skewed by how much he spends.

[@faultline3936]

Of course it's gonna be skewed. If I'm not mistaken, MMOs are not really his thing, and he never really played MMOs that long to have enough data and have a solid conclusion. FPS and MMOs also have different market strategies, it's only really been recently where everyone just started adopting battle passes and loot boxes in every game.

[@olov1422]

@@faultline3936 Shroud says he has played wow since classic and that most of his gaming hours has been sunk into wow other than cs but I can't really take any of his takes seriously because he plays a game for 2 weeks then drops it for the next one.

[@justcrap3703]

​@@faultline3936 bro making stuff up 😂. He plays WoW as long as Asmon did and he plays other games off-stream. Maybe it's you clowns whose opinions shouldn't be taken seriously 😂😂

[@LongLooongNaaaame]

​@@faultline3936 you just don't know shit and stupid. He's been playing wow for years and you never replied to those who said the same thing to you and keep spamming the same type of replies like a bot.

[@frrmrr4314]

@@faultline3936its only recently that lootboxes and bp’s are in all games? I know for a fact youre not a gamer. That shit been going for atleast a full decade in all genres of games

[@pokemonie131]

In last stream where he plays with Kanon. Shroud went pay 2 win and purchasing extracts from the auction house and gear........ How is it not that bad.

[@abdelrahmanrad]

that's not p2w.

[@pokemonie131]

@@abdelrahmanrad he advanced a lot in damage overall in PVP.

[@jasonyun1158]

⁠@@pokemonie131that’s pay to progress. Pay to win is like in lost ark where if you don’t spend money, you’ll never get your awakened weapon. Pay to win is like in maplestory where you spend three-five dollars a pop on a cube item to look for your desired stats which is around 26% upgrade on main stat on a piece for 16 different pieces and the average estimated rolls for cube per item is around 800~ totaling about 2.4-4K an item. Which over all would give you 300% power difference from a non spender. There is a difference. As he said the game offered 1-3% per 1000$. Is the game greedy? Yes. Is the game pay to win? Nope.

[@djghod4391]

@@pokemonie131 thats literally every mmo lol

[@phillipp5538]

@@djghod4391yes. Just because every mmo is pay to win, does not make it not pay to win lol.

[@Cjbreezey]

Much love to shroud but if the P2W wasn't that bad you wouldn't do it in the first place but he already started swiping cause it does make a difference.

[@duzx4541]

I just heard him say in stream, that it’s definetly not nescassary but it safes you a lot of time

[@jsshhdddifjfjudh366]

?? there is no p2w here its not that bad just like he said. it just makes him grind less that dosent mean its just straight up p2w what are u guys on about

[@MunKDaDDyy]

​@@jsshhdddifjfjudh366what you just described is pay to win, paying money to advance in the game faster than somebody else who didn't pay is paying to win

[@Cjbreezey]

@@jsshhdddifjfjudh366 Bro even Kanon said on shrouds own stream live that the game is as P2W as it can get. I actually tend not to care if a game is P2W i can afford to drop a couple thousand on a game and move on but I don't do it because its just stupid and like throwing money into the ocean on a game that honestly doesn't have a future in the west; when it starts to get involved with PVP of a game it taints the whole purpose of PVP which is fair competition that is skill based. I come from the vanilla wow days and these practices have become common place because companies have figured it out gamers/humans are impulsive most people can't control themselves. People end up spending way more money on these P2W games than sub games over time and companies know this. There isn't anything to argue here you can buy gear/materials to upgrade said gear/traits and even those pets/morphs which i will be honest provide a tiny advantage but an advantage regardless.

[@jsshhdddifjfjudh366]

@@Cjbreezeywell the only p2w i saw was the trait thing but it dosnt make alot of difference ive heard so its not that big of a deal

[@AndThenShwarmaAfter]

i remember when shroud wasnt such a shill and supporter of p2w bullshit. such a disappointment

[@staplayah8087]

Or maybe he loves playing mmos lmao. He literally said he isn’t a sponsored streamer of the game.

[@TheInternationalJew-vn4bn]

@@staplayah8087 and i have a airport i want to sell you

[@jaredh923]

@@staplayah8087 It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@sunbro6647]

He’s legit not supporting p2w lmao, he’s saying it’s pointless and nobody should actually spend money on power ups. Do you know how bad your comment sounds?

[@gazzy2551]

you gonna be quiet for people buying gold/gil/silver and than buying items/equip. because you don't give a fk about actual p2w, its just a tool to hate something

[@summergamers3070]

If you can pay for skill increases it’s not good, only thing you should be able to buy is cosmetics. That’s a good setup. Not this.

[@CHOP874]

His opinion doesn't matter on MMORPG's, he's as casual as they can possible become.

[@lucasianholzbauer5949]

P2W hits endgame aswell as this game becoming a job in order for ppl to enjoy the full perks

[@russellsmith7174]

"Not that bad" scrolls for 6 years to get through the shop. What's actually sad is he doesn't see the irony

[@thiusw]

tell me what in the shop is pay to win

[@blowcujoh]

@@thiuswyou can buy anything you want with lucent on auction house. Literally you can be endgame within a minute with your money.

[@jukkapoika7643]

AH is The shop ppl refer when talking about p2w@@thiusw

[@NiNjAcAt5677]

If anyone's still wondering if this game is P2W, you unlock the auction house at level 40 which lets you buy pretty much any gear in game with real money. If that's not the definition of P2W idk what is.

[@jaredh923]

​@@kyleayres7141 Idk how much you get paid to post these comments, but T+L is one of the MOST egregious casinos masqerading as a game in the past 10 years.

[@eastjavaID]

​@@kyleayres7141yes, if you robot and dont have life, you can get everything by grinding.

[@jukkapoika7643]

​@@kyleayres7141how much Have you made with selling food on AH

[@Cabz.]

But why didn’t you include the part where all f2p players can earn real in game currency for free… I’m f2p and I’ve earned over 3k lucent, realistically I can buy whatever I want.

[@eastjavaID]

@@Cabz. Yeah, thats reasons to hecome farmer

[@Damian-oh9pk]

shroud will sink thousands of dollars into it then quit a month later....

[@subway_guy7635]

the fact he said it was so good people wanted more 😭, the mf cannot handle playing a non-fps game

[@Awhrii]

He is millionair so ofc, thats like spending 10bucks for him

[@stevengeyer9617]

Dude spent 120 on just 1 weapon. Like ......yeahhhhhh ok.

[@nub4eva]

Bros gonna drop thousands of dollars and say its not that bad...

[@TokeZ12GRay]

It’s not paid to win, but this dude spent well over $100 making sure he has maxed out gear, full skill sets and all top-of-the-line gear😂😂😂

[@xaivang6379]

The game isn't pay to win. You are able to unlock traits and everything else easily. Every week you can choose from purple gear or trait unlock you get 20 of them and you need about 50 to 100. The only pay to win part is if you want to speed up the process by purchasing the same item with the trait you want.

[@xaivang6379]

You also need to join a guild and use the token you get on the blue trait unlocks and if you want to make lucent you can buy the red trait extractor from the guild shop.

[@harrybaghamian4134]

For people who are real and aren’t robots in society, first of all I got level 50 in 14 hours of gameplay, there is no “do this you’ll get level 50 in 6 hours” that’s just not real from my understanding so far. Second of all, there’s very little pay to win rn, you can buy currency so you can buy things off the AH, it’s not terrible bc there needs to be an already existing supply of player gained equipment and it’s VERY possible for you to get that currency on your own. If you get a perfect trait on a purple weapon and put it on a lithograph you can make thousands of the paid currency. Yeah it’s difficult and grindy but it’s a fucking mmo it’s not a sandbox game, if you enjoy grindy games with cool skins and a great world this game is probably good for you, there’s ALMOST always multiple ways to get different things as well which is great bc you’re not locked to one thing and get bored of it, certain things like raid boss mounts are locked behind a certain raid but that’s about it

[@jaredh923]

It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@denzyytrevyy9788]

Too lazy too read

[@Cabz.]

@@jaredh923are you sure you’re playing the same game? Coz you over exaggerated on a different level.

[@jukkapoika7643]

I could somewhat deal fully as f2p but the daily and weekly limitations is just a turn off for me.

[@brandonwalker4767]

Aged like cheese

[@PoesYT]

you can literaly drop 100 and buy purple gear from auction what you mean its not that bad :D

[@saltedbleach4512]

That does not make a good build?

[@hysteriaval]

@@saltedbleach4512then just look one up

[@PsycheHED]

@@saltedbleach4512 It does since it's all purple. That's why he's saying it is bad.

[@saltedbleach4512]

@@PsycheHED oh okay I'll get a better understanding on It then. Kinda seen that the auction is $$ only 😔

[@XrowBlue]

A 100 wouldn't cut it dawg. Yeah sure you fully stacked on purple but they have no traits, no upgrade and shit stats. You need to spend at least $1000 in lucent to be decent enough to steamroll pvp but you're gonna beaten by leviathan

[@bruddah_]

This was definitely a clip to make people think it isn’t, but he has said it is p2w af, and don’t let anyone try to argue it isn’t. So did his whale guild.

[@Glubbdubdrib]

I've only spent 20 bucks on the game at the start for the battle pass and level pass. With my main and alts in the last 7 days, I've earned about $1400 worth of Lucent. It really isn't pay to win. Just gotta know how to play the game. That's enough to get the traits for my build once more of them enter the market.

[@Aaronsplace]

2000 dollars gets you every single slot bis except weapon and u get second best so u pay thousands for 99.9 percent power not 1 percent

[@viadlmlr]

If someone says it’s not that bad it’s bad

[@hughjanus4698]

In his new video Shroud complains they took away a pay pass option bc he has no shortage of money 😂

[@sanjayw9878]

I understand appearances, but when a game allows you to buy "99.99$" as an option then it's a game where 100% you will NEED to pay to compete and stay relevant at end game

[@vasyarogov4388]

Never underestimate whales.

[@Sethekk11]

It's honest to god not that bad people. In order to pay to win, you're paying 300 dollars just for a single item.

[@KayonLeague]

people really think that shroud having good reflexes and being good at pointing a crosshair and clicking into a characters head on a shooter means his opinion on games is more important lmao

[@papabearjonez]

Bro had me at $1000, guess I’m out.

[@rhycebell9832]

You get everything by grinding you don't need to spend any money in this game

[@jaredh923]

@@rhycebell9832 It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@dasanistar3284]

⁠@@rhycebell9832Your saying this statement like it changes anything thank god you can get everything by grinding if they paywalled it be another issue but if I drop some money its going to speed things up surely

[@eastjavaID]

If you robot and dont have life, maybe yes you get everything by grinding. ​@@rhycebell9832

[@GPatch]

Have not paid a penny to play it…. You would only need to if you want to change your build. They know people get bored with playing the same style over and over again and will eventually want to switch and the way they lock you in you have to pay to convert your points to the next one or you can try to just play the game to upgrade your stuff again, but without all the buffs that you got for levelling up your character, those weapons will not, get very powerful. That’s when people play to convert their skills from one weapon to another

[@bookbookbook1]

Paying any amount of money for any power in an instant is p2w doesnt matter if its 2% or 200% increase lmao

[@happyfortunegaming389]

Wen you open with is it payed to win and the count argue is “it’s not that bad” 🤣

[@bilbonuggs1567]

Crazy to watch a clip of shroud we’re he’s not throwing his iconic baby fits

[@shadowtyrant82]

you can literally buy "gold" in this game

[@jaredh923]

It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@willuigi64]

nope. soon as you say “it’s not that bad”, it absolutely is that bad.

[@InnoV8Official]

This proves that SO MANY people have comprehension issues. Let me break this down.. He says "Its not that bad." Hes saying the P2W doesn't give you any value becauae youre paying thousands of dollars to have a 1% jump in power. A 1% advantage is nothing in a pvp situation or even pve. Pay attention to what hes saying. The P2W is bad but its so bad that as a value that no one is doing it.

[@Doungen]

lmao tell me you have absolutely no plan about games without telling me you have absolutely no plan about games

[@TheBlainers1]

It makes me so happy to see other people in the comments coming to terms that shroud is such a sellout anymore lol.

[@krofnoops]

You shroud fans are like a life support machine for this man 😂

[@LongLooongNaaaame]

Wdym he isn't getting much subs and donos unlike his earlier streaming career nor encouraged his viewers to donate and subscribe.

[@seryph4204]

Most of the servers are Prepaid only, you pay for standard items, not better items. You pay for standard XP, or your character grinds like it's final fantasy 5 with no river.

[@karasutsuki1733]

The shorts bout how it used to be, not how it is now, which is what I wanted to know lol

[@jaredh923]

It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@amazinglyaverage590]

Truly its not that bad, you can easily make thousands of Lucent just by trading stuff in the AH

[@xIxHaZexIx]

Not that bad, meanwhile you can buy full top tier sets of gear for cash.

[@danielbowen2523]

Alot of people are saying pay to progress which kinda blows my mind in a pvp heavy game. Content is time gated slowing down F2P players. Then ontop of that alot of the content especially for later gear is pvp locked. So someone who pays money to get passed the time gate gets to the later game gear faster and then has an advatage in the pvp content giving them better gear faster. This is 100% pay to win a F2P player will never surpass these hurdles unless they get help from P2W players.

[@dazzybotha6564]

Paying that type of money on a game is bat sh1t crazy.

[@kaisanuay2199]

Yes it is it takes me 2 weeks to get one armor and the traits ik whilst someone can swipe and be maxed out in a day

[@Ispy10101]

Its not pay to win. My friends and i have all hit 50 without a hint of having to buy anything from the store. The AH uses coins you can buy, but you can also sell your gear for those coins, and the game gives you plenty of ways to get your own gear without ever buying anything.

[@XrowBlue]

Well if you are fully fledge pve, yeah you're in your own world after level 50. There little to no content after reaching level 50 and has done every dungeon. The only pve related leaderboard is the infinite tower and that too will be riddled with whales being the top 1

[@jaredh923]

It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@KRANative]

p2w if you want 3500 combat power or more faster, otherwise grind for a couple of months and you may get close to that depending on trait luck rolls on gear and how many graphs mats you can get to flip traits or how lucky you are with playing the auction house with drops.

[@cyrilwah]

That's why they don't open SEA server for this game.

[@awakenedBanana]

So, 'not bad' means that you can basically pay to skip the additional grind that you have to do as a f2p player. I assume Shroud paid to skip that entertaining and very engaging grind. I've never considered the grind in a Korean MMORPG as very fun and I always felt like it was a wall that keeps you from the fun stuff. I've heard of pay for convenience(which a lot of content creators consider it as paying for a problem that the devs have created), but this is more like paying to go through a wall, put by creators to stop the players from having fun in the game. WoW also has a 'repetitive' grind that helps you with gear upgrades, but I've never considered mythic+ dungeons as anything but engaging and fun to do.

[@jaxwild7595]

If you need to make any excuse and say it isn’t that bad. It isn’t worth playing period.

[@greencaptain2783]

Its worst type of p2w, you use currency bought by real money in auction house

[@Kovac_hater]

You can but lucent coins and spend it in auction house to buying a heroic weapon that gonna almost oneshoot on arena …. 🎉

[@Jake-el5wz]

Games shouldn't be pay to win at all. Even a bit is unacceptable

[@gnoomlord]

well you can get max gear at day one if you swipe enough so its extremely p2w, the amount of people willing to do that is very small though so its "not that bad"

[@yofedstyhrega4594]

The answer should be a quick? Oh its not. The fact that its "its not that p2w" is just sad

[@BallBusta]

Damn, he's delusional if he thinks it's "not that bad". I'm 2.5k combat power and I still get one tapped by whales at 3.4k+. Doesn't matter how good you are, if the enemy has max evasion on their gear, you'll be lucky to get 2 hits on them before you're gapped.

[@Kondze]

You can buy a lot of premium cash to buy lithographs on the auction house and easly upgrade your gear by a lot, I do like the game but he is talking bs. For like 50€ you can REALLY upgrade your character. Also you can buy items itself so not only you can upgrade your gear but also you can buy a base item for it.

[@TetherT]

didn't i hear shroudy is 3k deep now..how p2w is it "its not that bad"

[@douglascutis7662]

I know some chinese that would pay 10k for 1% power....

[@plasmahandoku1073]

So i played about like, 50 hours. In the beginning or at the moment no. Mainly because you have to farm dungeon rng and the world bosses from milestone. BUT, you can hard P2W by buying World Boss weapons and armor. Also putchasing weapon upgrades and the biggest thing of them all is buying upgrades for Active and purple skill to the max at +15. One of our guild member is a whale and he just destroys everything as a dagger and crossbow. You can imagine all your ability are blue or Purple +1 and have to grind it. Imaginr seeing a guy with purple +15 on all skills.

[@distortish]

LMAOOO I know lots of people who would easily spend 1-2k for 1.5-2% increase 😂 even 1% is huge if your attack speed is fast especially when you’re min maxing

[@Doomagheddon]

I'm lvl 50, sns/wand and am ridiculously powerful and haven't spent a cent.

[@fade9004]

The multi millionaire is saying it's not that bad. Meanwhile, the whale guilds have full bis and completely control every conflict world boss.

[@MPH69420]

End game is so unbelievably P2W in Throne its not even funny.

[@solojammer9500]

Guild system is really bad tho. Top guilds can conquer every corner of the map and they make alliances. They're not against each other. Only pvp boss drop good stuffs so you don't need to spend cash if you can control it. Small guilds like us don't stand a chance against them. You got like 1/10 pve boss a day.

[@XrowBlue]

Hi, Im from the future. The game is p2w. Your fans can cope but it is what it is. If you are f2p, good luck grinding for months to even come close to whales with fully traited purple gears that can tank pretty much every attack your throw at them.

[@jaredh923]

Hi, Im from right now. The game is p2w.

[@hartley94TV]

He says that, but spent money on it xD

[@SophieBonner-z1t]

I've noticed a disturbing trend around this game with influeners downplaying and down right lying about its pay2win model. They want to normalise pay2win under the radar, because it means they as rich influencers maintain the advantage for stream content - just like how they use bot lobbies and hacks in shooters - which means more money and popularity for them. If you don't all start checking these guys on this bs they'll get away with it, and generic pay2win slop will provably demonstrate that it can succeed in the west, making other studios follow suit. Stop sucking this guy off and call him out

[@robinw9405]

shroud is not right person to comment on that really, ppl are crazy to pay 50k for bullshit upgrades and then quit the game, i know ppl who pays 10k to crappy phone app games just to be top of everyone and showoff for a 5 second satisfaction, P2W is totally new gamba

[@nharj7674]

What does the combat feel like? Is it smooth like wow or clunky like gw2?

[@ThePuppet001]

It's clunky and laggy if your not running on a decent PC console sucks to play on

[@jaredh923]

It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@TikachooYT]

People who say it's P2W aren't even playing the game as they don't understand it's not P2W and their comments are irrelevant

[@jaredh923]

It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@Doungen]

Then explain why it's not p2w

[@DiamondTrailRanch]

Swaffs at "thousands of dollars for 20% power". This guy isn't in a bracket with any of his viewers

[@feeltherose]

bro he already drop 20k on t1... it aint even t2 yet, bro is rocking tevent greatsword n bellandir staff, aint no way those are cheap maybe comment on the game once the honeymoon phase is over

[@xbrowningboi2x]

Wait wtf are those weapon packs? Not on ps5?!?

[@MrTranzformer1]

1% power what? You can buy full set of gear and weapons that isnt 1% power

[@xFTPxJesusx]

It’s not even p2w it’s more like pay to progress faster. Everything thing they’re paying for a f2p person will get it just takes longer

[@jaredh923]

It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@jinkxy2370]

p2w is the umbrella term and pay to progress is one subgenre of of it, so if you say it is pay to progress it is indeed by definition p2w.

[@MrSniffles007]

"it's not that bad" - dude, the game is literally just p2w!!! you can buy buffs, items, item-upgrades, endgame stuff and so on in the shop! It's just all p2w... -.-

[@MumboJumboZXC]

“It’s not that bad” That’s a lie.

[@treue2008]

Uh, he's just wrong. It's about 5k to max out your gear. It's bad however the game has a paper scissor rock system. A f2p can still blow your ass up

[@jaredh923]

It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@SySH78]

come on shroud... to a multi-millionaire even a private jet is "not too much money"... at least try to stay in touch with the common folk.

[@BIGBOSS-bj9cy]

كيف اقدر اعيد توزيع الستات ؟

[@TheFinQ]

You shouldnt take p2w opinions from shroud he buys out the entire shop in every game (lost ark eg)

[@zigzagkillah7666]

Lost ark is the ONLY example any of you give... and he openly admitted to that aspect, and that is why he doesn't play it. But you all act like he is still trying to be a pro at it, and still playing it, when he is not.... If anything he did us a service in showing that it was P2W, and to not play it because of that. He still plays WoW on Thursdays, but no Lost Ark ... I wonder *why* ? Remember he is an entertainer, and his revenue counts on us coming back and watching him, and interacting with each other on his stream and his KZbin vods/shorts.... So Lost Ark, a game he no longer plays, and has given FAIR warning that it IS pay to win up front and also inbetween the lines, is your only argument .... Seems like you need a new argument .... because this one has been debunked.

[@DequaLB]

It's less on global, but more on KR servers.

[@jaredh923]

It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@JediMentat]

The game's awesome, legitimately. Just nowhere near enough PvE content

[@Iloveyourmom8888]

I haven't found any game that can compete with BDO yet.

[@quervo151]

wow

[@pr4zaVIDZ]

Yeahh it's not that bad, until it is

[@xbrowningboi2x]

Na wife tho the p2w isn’t bad at all as a ps5 player it’s just grind able to get really good gear so basically every rpg to exist. You CAN use money to buy gear from people who don’t need it but that’s the easy way out

[@CityOfRainbowz]

Dude this is the next new world, let’s be honest, just enjoy it while it’s popping and within 6 months everyone including streamers will be gone

[@Florin-r6i]

Given the fact game usually dies in 3 months and this is how much it takes for a f2p to catch a p2w if the f2p spends tons and tons of time and grinds like a madman I would say every f2p is getting scammed! You re basically there for the fun of p2w players! The more you play the more you ll want to pay your way into winning because of how bad you are compared to them and how much time you invested in the game grinding already! Dont be fooled this game gives p2w players fun at the expense of f2p players! Thats the truth and everybody should know this! Its not like play the game for the story lets be serious!

[@chunlee-r1u]

anyone who wants lucent?i have kept some

[@MyNameIsSalo]

So it’s abusively P2W, got it. This is the same game that has completely disabled all trade between players unless you spend real money. You can only trade with the premium currency which is generated through real money. How is that not the most broken ass P2W game ever? And the devs write it off as “we are combating bots”. There’s a million steps you can take to reduce the effect of bots before going P2W

[@arejectedape8753]

Lol. I play this game a lot and the only real pay2play comes from battle pass and leveling pass you still have to play a shit ton. 20 $ a month pay2win and you can't really go passed that. You all crying about shit you don't know because you never gave it a chance. Edit. It was very p2w at one point. They took most of that out on the actual release.

[@Alifnaufalp]

how bad is your fps game?

[@Darkangel_YT506]

It's pay to win if you want to pay to win and not put in time to farm

[@jaredh923]

It is one of the WORST pay2win casinos pretending to be a game in the past 10 years. Dont listen to the youtubers being paid to talk about T+L. Its absurdly bad and this is still release, new tiers of upgrades havent even been released yet. Its BAD.

[@Darkangel_YT506]

@jaredh923 literally nothing you have said relates to the game much its a free to play and pay to win if you want to pay you don't need to pay to get good just put in time simple