How Tekken 8 Turned Dragunov Into A Disaster

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[@liv3vil-Kei]

All I've learned from this video is that it's about time to nerf Devil Jin.

[@StasionSpasski]

Overused joke = not funny Edit: I like chaos

[@liv3vil-Kei]

@@StasionSpasski Who said I was joking??

[@OG_Tsu]

@@StasionSpasski hilarious joke, i laughed

[@wyzin5865]

​@@StasionSpasski the joke wasnt for you then no one asked for your opinion

[@Asteio_re.karagkiozi]

​ @StasionSpasski It's not overused ,it's reality

[@SpScarletSpider]

This is what happens when you send a guy like Dragunov to go on vacation. He unleashes hell upon earth. There's a reason why he was always on the battlefield in every other Tekken game.

[@XIVDock]

😂

[@attorneygeneral4719]

Can’t wait for this vid to be outdated within 5 seasons

[@nathanwhiting5475]

Probably out of date in the next patch considering he's the most complained about character now that Azucena died a while back

[@soldier257]

God willing.

[@arhlein7872]

I need it within the next month

[@GBELCHIOR616]

Hes gonna be nerferd after the end of Tekken world tour finals.

[@okamimemos1716]

So it's still relevant for 4 seasons then?

[@BSJINTHEHOUSE420]

All these character breakdowns are all leading to the Jin breakdown to end all Jin breakdowns.

[@avoidthevo1d]

To be fair the breakdown wont really be THAT exciting, because jin just has fundamental tools that are really good and thats pretty much it. Its not gonna be as over the top as with Yoshi for example, jin doesnt really break the game's rules, he just exceeds within those rules. Like yeah we already know d2 is good (reactable offline), that heat smash is good, electric, poking. Yeah he is good but it will not be an interesting vid, thats for sure

[@tongpoo8985]

I'm waiting for the Alisa one. Jin is ridiculous but everyone knows why already.

[@SolidSonicTH]

Jin has stuff that spreads him across too many scopes in this game. He doesn't have that firm gameplan that I was used to in older games.

[@nixuniverse5240]

Dragunov is a character I picked up at the end of Tekken 7 because I needed new characters to play (since all of my previous mains were removed 😭) but I had no idea they were going to do this to him. Me & Drag Nation were super hype when we saw he actually has some lows now, but we had no idea it would be this crazy.

[@sliippy2152]

dude I remember being happy that he finally has mids in this game then release day comes and you start seeing qcf4 and hatchet and the joy turns into sorrow

[@v-1235]

I started on tekken 7 as well with Dragunov back in season 3 (hoo boy) i'm all for the nerfs to the damage cause i think Dragunov should not have that damage potential and even another nerf to hatchet but let's be real, Dragunov needed a power low, there's so many d2 you can do until you eat a low parry, in tekken 7 it was even worse but even now a low parry or an i13 ws move hurts enough and leaves you in a very bad position against some characters. Mainman said it in a video on tekken 7 dragunov, he probably forgot, "Dragunov fundamentally on paper doesn't work, he's not a functional character" here's the video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/op-8d5aHm79lrZY Another video talking about problems with dragunov where he says quote: "Lacks a power low": kzbin.info/www/bejne/eaOzhWaCgN2mpc0si=algfUc1lsatH_1-_&t=8803 There has been some universal system changes that helped him (like the standarization IWR moves), and of course it's a completely new game, but yeah, I'm all for nerfs but the character needs a decently damaging low, even if it's a situational one TL;DR: Hatchet too strong, needs nerf, but still needs a decent power low (not an OP one like the one we have) for the character to work.

[@countdookie6987]

I honestly don't understand how people complain about his power low. Like, how? It's fuck all when blocked, and only gives him +3 on hit, while Bryan's is faster, way safer, and gives +5. Drag's power low plays perfectly into his identity, which is pure rushdown molestation. He WANTS you to duck to actually start using his mids. His main problem is his SNK4, not his hatchet kick. I don't understand why people still can't grasp it. He already has pretty shit tracking and can easily be stepped. His game plan is simple and easy to execute. The string that holds it all together and makes him almost unbearable is his SNK4, which even I agree is stupid. He deserved a power low, he needed a good way to condition his opponents to duck. He's supposed to have good lockdown capabilities, but when his already strong mid lockdown got another addition with SNK4, it became too much. F3,1+2 is a good addition too, but its his SNK4 that's the problem

[@jr-2nd]

@@countdookie6987 It's not about the poke, it's about the situation that the rival has against him.

[@ashimashi1]

I was so happy to see my main drag buffed and being top tier then saw all the backlash and how op he is and was like dammit I dont get to be happy lol

[@connorsutton8745]

I'm convinced that half the Jin players I've fought are actually a dog chasing its tail on a DDR dance mat. When they actually know what they're doing, it feels almost impossible to fight him.

[@DatNinjaDude]

Very accurate statement, I don’t think I have beaten any of the competent Jin’s I’ve fought 😂

[@hyunka2756]

Can you do a break down on how to make Jin impossible to fight against?

[@fxlja]

​@@hyunka2756 not that hard. Learn to place and time your moves correctly. Then replace whatever move you planned with EWHF for highs, f4 for mids, and d2 for lows. You get a free pass to blue ranks with just that alone.

[@slimballs9650]

@@fxlja Wait, what about 2,1,4?

[@hyunka2756]

@@fxlja and when you're past the scrub bit and people block hellsweep/d2 (sometimes db4 as well) on reaction what do you do? Other than just playing better than the opponent with timing/knowledge of course

[@StreetGrindTV]

The skip over Yoshi and Xiaoyu does not go unnoticed lol

[@jovan7365]

More jokes

[@aavavertu229]

Dragunov at launch: best jab, best male character movement, best dmg, best frames, best wall carry, receives hatchet kick (was +7 oh), full throw game + throw specialist, is a string mixup character, very easy to play and linear moves track way more that supposed to. What could go wrong? edit: forgot the ridiculous wall combo, what else?

[@kato093]

And Feng was much stronger and worse 🤣 How did that happen? Dragunov crybaby whining started after he was nerfed, that's the funny part

[@AtaIarion]

He's also the sexiest male character

[@Cadebloodborne2]

​@@AtaIarion nah..

[@genji4456]

Womp womp best farms!best jabs! I’m done with tekken for community

[@57Folhinha]

ON GOD BRO ​@@AtaIarion

[@DaPhenomAce]

Too many plus frames, too much tracking, too much heat, too much rage

[@SnowflakeSSQ]

Basically more reward than the risk you're taking with almost everything in this game.

[@Yocking]

1:38 im genuinely surprised he said well done to lars

[@krishufc]

with a good tone too im happy my main was respected for once.

[@Yocking]

@@krishufc yeah exactly lmaoo

[@CelestialReaper]

​@@krishufc he is not lol. He is in everyone's bottom 5 next to Lidia, Panda, and Azu. All his mixup are fake and can get interrupted. And they took away most of his tools since T6. All he has now is two bs hopkicks that highcrush on startup and lowcrush in the middle of its active frames. But almost everyone has that. Yoshi, DJ, And if course Cloudio

[@djw_tekken8490]

​@@krishufc lmao he had these animations where lars got obliterated on wheelchair whenever some one donated back then

[@djw_tekken8490]

​@@Yockinglmao he had these animations where lars got obliterated on wheelchair whenever some one donated on twitch back then

[@illfate757]

Azucena is a meme, From OP to unseen. Leo is sadge, unpopular opinion though bears and ling are fine after all these patches. Pretty much agree with everything else.

[@Iappreciatelife]

Imagine this video being presented to Harada by his team and he goes:“Hmm, great video, anyway any suggestions for nerfing Devil Jin?”

[@Asteio_re.karagkiozi]

well done?!?!?!(1 month later )TK:patch only for dvj 🤣

[@sebaschan-uwu]

I swear the dev team probably watches tmm's ranting videos

[@FightDiaryEra]

More like " What's the next microtransaction we can add?"

[@ThatPinkOtter]

Jin was absolutely made the way he is so that new players can play him and see some amount of success. As far as most newcomers are concerned Jin and Kazuya ARE Tekken, and I distinctly remember conversations about this during T7 with people who were interested, then immediately lost any interest in the game when they heard Jin and Kazuya were two of the hardest in T7. Besides that, with story mode being largely for the casual audience and the amount of time you spend playing Jin during the story it only makes sense to dumb him down. The issue with how they did it comes down to making his buttons too good, what he needed was a handful of simple to execute effective tools, not an entire damn arsenal of them. Demon paw and DF2 are more than good enough to carry players who are new, anything beyond those two things being as strong as they are is absurd imo, but that's just my take on the whole thing.

[@KDBSPORTS_ENT]

I agree, I thought it was a mistake to make jin that damn hard to play in t7.

[@falaflani4831]

i mean it kinda makes sense coz even in tekken 3 my first tekken, i thought jin looked cool and tried him and immediately realised that this character ain't for beginners. but i kinda liked it since u kinda like had to earn the privledge of playing such a badass character like him and heiachi. granted i ended up being a disgusting waifu player with nina but that's besides the point

[@sebaschan-uwu]

Lol the first time I played tekken was tekken 5 and I immediately went to play armor king and lili

[@ReformingMortalDaemon]

Ah yes Shaheen/Kazuya/Lars/Bryan are the epitome of honesty and Jin is an abomination of design. Excellent non biased opinions as always

[@SnowflakeSSQ]

As an unbiased mf, all of these mentioned are cancerous to fight and I hate every character equally.

[@BananaSegredinho]

Saying Bryan is disonest compared to any character in this game is the epitome of skill issue

[@BortaMaga]

Lars?

[@marshawn_ing]

Idk I would say kazuya and Bryan are pretty honest in my experiences with this game compared to most characters Lars hasn’t been too much of a problem for me either but he does encourage some monkey like play Fuck shaheen though I loathe fighting him

[@P_Pacey]

​@BananaSegredinho Bryan pocket since T7. I agree. Getting stepped as Bryan is a jumpscare on it's own. Or pressing anything other than Hatchet/1+2 is risk. Only Bryan players respect being CH by Bryan. As a Lee main it feels great having a CH exchange all game. True honesty.

[@Ghostkilla773]

Damn he gave Asuka and Jun a great job.

[@SnowflakeSSQ]

Don't know what's with everyone giving Asuka a C tier or something. Guess it's okay to have safe launching sabakis.

[@johnnymonsterrrr]

@@SnowflakeSSQ bro this wasnt about balance this was about design

[@フランス人の熊さん]

​@SnowflakeSSQ they had it before Dragunov comes. Deal with it😅. The dmg and the juggles, with the double leg mindgame on heat, still get him stronger. Release Drag on Tekken 8 debut was mad stupid, abusable and cheap af... glad they nerfed this shit because this is fraud blue rank achievement...

[@SnowflakeSSQ]

@@johnnymonsterrrr Yeah but even besides this she is always in C tier in every tier list for some reason.

[@SnowflakeSSQ]

@@フランス人の熊さん Yeah but this is the thing with every character in this game. They have tools that they used to have but then they also give them all the Heat and Installs juice which makes them really dumb to deal with. Giving stances, Heat moves and crazy install mechanics to characters while keeping their old stuff makes them super overwhelming and honestly makes me think if there even is a tier below A in this game.

[@Dragydragster]

man, feelsbad, i-ve been a drag player since tekken 7, and for so long dragunov was barely talked about, nobody cared, low tier character, but i still stuck with him cause i liked him. Now Tekken 8 comes around and everyone shits on dragunov players, just insult after insult.

[@yuries19]

I see your point and am sympathetic to your situation, but 90% of drags play him cause he's op and that is gay as fuck

[@v-1235]

Remember the past: kzbin.info/www/bejne/op-8d5aHm79lrZYsi=1i8k4t6F5JA3-3DB&t=12 The character didn't work back then, yeah he's too much now, hatchet needs a nerf and the combo damage needs a nerf, but the character quote: "Fundamentally, on paper, doesn't work" he needed a power low back then and now he needs a power low, just not what we have now and certainly not a cranked up version of bryan's hatchet kick like what we got on release

[@MMDAQ]

Just keep playing drag and don't worry about it. Once he gets nerfed (he will eventually, first year just has no major patches) stick with him.

[@countdookie6987]

You're not alone dood. Been my main since 6. I agree that he still is ridiculous, but people complain about the wrong things. It's pure cancer

[@Flintc08]

“Boohoooo my character carries me now it’s not fair 😭😭😭” That’s how you sound…..

[@shaftmastr7753]

Okay, saying drag's lows were "mediocre" is an understatement. They were awful. He needed hachet kick. I will agree that he probably doesnt need the amount of damage that he has, but thats just the game. He is extremely strong but like i dont think he lost his identity, considering i can go back to 7 or tag 2 and play him exactly the same way as i do in 8 and see success. Sneak 4 is the best move in the game i agree but like it puts you far enough away and leaves drag crouching so its not as if he can just press it over and over with no consequences

[@benhunter5977]

Saying Xiaoyu dosent commit is delusional and its hating just to hate. As a tekken god supreme the 50/50 are crazy but if guessed correctly are very negative.

[@nayd5043]

He just hates her and always has, he used to dodge people playing her instead of learning the matchup. Not to say that he hasn't improved but I'm just waiting on the "Why is Xiaoyu broken" video.

[@rainkage773]

He can't play her anyways, xiaoyu is not easy, her ss is trash lol. And she does commit, no safe heat engager in the neutral unlike most characters and he says she doesn't commit.

[@Lancorian]

We can just ignore anything he says about Xiaoyu because it's just hate and untrue things most of the time.

[@DannyBob08]

Great to see im not the only one noticing it.

[@bigbangbot-SuperSqank]

The thing I find funny about Dragunov is that in Tekken 7, people were complaining about how Dragunov had been heavily dumbed down and how he lost his identity. Now, we’re in Tekken 8 and they’ve managed to do it all over again. They managed to dumb down an already dumbed down Dragunov.

[@VERYR4RE]

yeah, I recently watched a TMM vid about how Tekken 7 ruined Dragunov lol

[@BluahGhaa]

Because they butchered his wr2 completely, give tekken7 dragunov a wr2 with some tracking and he will be a more than a decent characters. His current state is a joke.

[@nixuniverse5240]

@@bigbangbot-SuperSqank wait until Tekken 9 and Jin will be able to do wave dashes just by mashing down forward

[@davidparry5310]

Should we be surprised? I mean, these are the same folks who responded to complaints about T7 being too aggressive, nerfed movement etc, etc, etc by making T8 _even more_ skewed towards CQC and hyper-aggression.

[@kamitenshi3825]

When you refer to the hatchet, you talking about the release hatchet or the version he has in October? A stagger block for a plus 3

[@Noum77]

0:10 I've always been saying this: the dev team seems like having a turd in place of their brain when they are balancing these characters

[@niar1126]

Hot take but beginner characters in fighting games should be of course easy to learn and have viable techniques, but should also help players grow on their fundamentals.Jin is one of those characters where you dont need fundamental because of his auto evasion, d2 not being launch punishable,and ff2. No need for patience,defense, and understanding of space when playing this character.Same thing goes for drag and yoshi who break the game in multiple ways.Take ryu for example in sf, easy to learn but fundamentals are needed.The only characters i can think of that apply are paul,asuka,leo,and claudio

[@hivemind514]

yeah d2 has to be nerfed, how come lars db4 is -26 on block and no tracking and jin d2 is -14 and tracks? The only other difference is that db4 is 19f and d2 is 22f. Both are basically impossible to react to online anyway

[@leonelgarcia2651]

Not even season 1 dragunov of tk7 was this cancer good lord

[@MerrStudio]

I think Bryan hits a bit too hard. I mean yeah he is wall dependent, but half of his stuff counter hit launches with good frames on block and his combos do 100 damage without heat

[@SnowflakeSSQ]

I agree man, he's definitely gonna be in people's top 5s but for now these lazy developers can't nerf the characters we have been crying about for like 4 months or more.

[@SupMaHomies]

It's perfectly balanced and I can explain why. Bryan has extremely weak pokes, and in this game permanent damage comes from strong pokes and lows. The characters in top 10 all have great pokes and/or lows or throws, which = permanent unrecoverable health. Bryan doesn't have this, so to compensate he has massive combo damage. However, if youd notice, when Bryan launches you roughly 70% of that damage is recoverable. As a Bryan main I can say that literally every day I play I can launch someone to low hp and they end up recovering 50% life. Tldr: He has weak pokes so to make up for that he has high combo damage, but as a further way to try balance that most of that damage is recoverable.

[@lilbxz9905]

that is not about it.... u just dont get it c: try play bryan then say something c: is not like when u playing dragunov and ling or lidia when ur only job is mashing buttons and win c: behind character like jin,bryan,lee is some effort i dont know why tmm tablking about jin badly when he is not that supper overrpovered u can react to his moves and his damage is not high c: but he cries overhim in every tekken becouse he is cooler than kaz

[@Haags_hopje_070]

I agree that his damage and Ch are crazy. But he also has downsides to him. His block punichers are one of the worst in the game. While a character like Jin has insane damage and Ch launchers and has one of the best block punishment in the game. 29dmg i10 wall spatting punish. i14 ws launcher. Oh yeah and for some reason he has a i15 hopkick too.

[@Conor-r6i]

@@Haags_hopje_070 I'm a Bryan main and I disgaree. He has poor 10f and 12f punishment, but his 13f is ok (if you're close to a wall to lifts the opponent up for a full combo), 14f jet upper launch, and his WS punishment from 13f is phenomenal. He is far from being the worst. There are so many moves in T8 that are 14f that he can stand launch that completely change the flow of a match. Dragunov has multiple strings that are -14, Reina has -14, Heihachi headbutt -14, Bryan WS1 -14, Hwoarang/Nina/Paul powercrush -14 just to name a few. It's a BIG game changer having a 14f launcher

[@charlesfreeze3997]

As someone whose highest ranked character is Leo, seeing basically every video that talks about characters goes "Oh Leo is in the game, I forgot". Hurts me each time.

[@SonOfSparda2024]

Problemly because he is very irrelevant in tekken story and his character is not that interesting to others. They made him to be a nonbinary character that can be customized to be a girl or a boy. He used to have boobs in tekken tag 2 and i thought he was girl dressing up like boy at one point. But now the customization was dumb down a bit in 8 since he doesn't wear skirts or female bikinis and i now know he is a guy just not as muscular as the other male characters. Gameplay wise I am still learning him. I play up to 10 characters with him being my 11th.

[@UncleHyena]

Dw real ones know he’s the coolest character in the game, very good balance on risk reward, the most expressive combo game and rewards strong small tekken and adaptability. A tekken appreciator’s favourite. Dont be hurt by generic takes. MainMan and a lot of bandwagoners were talking about how boring and average Shaheen was not too long ago cuz they never bothered to explore the character. Just gotta keep showcasing the character and inspiring the masses I say 😤

[@SonOfSparda2024]

@@UncleHyena I think mainman just like character that displays cool, ruthlessness, tough guy, energy. It says alot about him because he is a kazuya main, and his submains are heihachi, mardak, king, armor king, Bryan, paul, and little bit of devil jin.

[@robertdunne1842]

It hurts but atleast Leo is flying under the radar a bit, I think Leo is actually sleeper op but he's nowhere near as op as like yoshi n drag and also no one plays the character so the people who do play him have knowledge check advantage sometimes. Leo mains stay winning

[@sebaschan-uwu]

Tbf leo is the most forgettable character in the game. Her design also is quite boring though I liked her tekken 7 costume. I really like some of her moves though and the playstyle is cool overall.

[@kipos1592]

Devil Jin "Great JOB" DVJ player after hearing that gonna find u and kill u. MomoDog aint coping anymore he is malding

[@PKrazorleaf]

Momodog punching the air if he hears this. Seriously tho, how the hell does he say GREAT job to Devil Jin??? Lmao tmm has some wild fuckin takes 😂

[@briane8465]

DVJ I'd say is a great character in a sea of overtuned powerhouses. Having to utilize majority of the moveset is what every character should be. He does have major flaws in certain areas(like neutral range and such) but I'd rather see the roster toned down to his level rather than buffing him to rival the rest. My view of this comes from me absolutely hating how jin and drag turned out to be in t8 after absolutely loving them in previous tekken titles for how much I had to utilize their moveset and how good I had to play.

[@Asteio_re.karagkiozi]

​@Steponmeplease-gy8es we don't want to be top,s tier broken ect. However, it cannot be in the bottom five.Its fcking DEVIL jin ,not facky chloe

[@jR0xas]

Why are the hard to play characters so much worse than those who are incredibly easy? Hard characters should always be stronger than easy ones just because otherwise it's unbalanced.

[@Rius9106]

Hard characters do have more potential in this game. You just need to be incredibly good.

[@baconbitz7804]

Characters should not be balanced around their difficulty

[@CkWk78]

@@baconbitz7804 Uhhh...Yes TF they should!!!!

[@baconbitz7804]

@@CkWk78 a hard character shouldn’t be bad but they also shouldn’t just be the best because they’re hard

[@sebaschan-uwu]

​@baconbitz7804 you're right, hard character's shouldn't be op like akuma in t7 but if the hard characters are bad and the easy characters are good then the game becomes braindead. Some characters should be hard to pick up and hard to get value out of their good tools and some characters should be easy to pick up and hard to master/get value out of

[@enderbold7038]

Hearing "Fuck you" when he scrolls to the bears made me so proud to play them.

[@JobeLovo]

Ew

[@hands-ongaming7180]

@@JobeLovo cry

[@quarohnholliday]

​@@hands-ongaming7180 his comment made you cry

[@Gsdntflx]

@@hands-ongaming7180irony

[@JobeLovo]

@@hands-ongaming7180found the bear sexual 😂

[@sakimiyanaga6251]

When you're fighting Jin, even in tournaments you will always notice that's it's Jin always playing defense. CBM vs Kane and Trench (Jin vs Yoshimitsu), CBM vs Shadow0z (Jin vs Claudio), CBM vs AK (Jin vs Shaheen), CBM vs Dawood (Jin vs Alisa), Book vs Fahrzeen (Jin vs Victor), all of these are games where either Jin lost or even if he won Jin was always on the defense. Jin is not a character who will give you easy wins. Statistics last patch is evidence of that. Tournament results are evidences of that. Testimonies of pros who actually know what they're talking about are evidences of that. TMM GETTING DESTROYED EVERYTIME HE PLAYED AS JIN, is an evidence of that. Also, always remember that TMM HATED Tekken 7 Jin. He lamented the existence of EWHF which according to him shouldn't launch on normal hit (not the regular wind hook fist). He lamented the launching hellsweep which pros like Arslan said was a non-factor. He rejoiced every patch that he got nerfed. TMM was never a fan of Jin in any tekken game. He called Tekken 6 Jin, bland and boring. This is not a person who's trying to make the game better, this is a person trying to shape the game to what he wants.

[@shaghilathar3588]

That doesnt change the fact hes a joke design wise.

[@sakimiyanaga6251]

@@shaghilathar3588 You know what in my opinion is a joke? Guard breaks. Tekken used to be about having a good defense, timing your offense and then using lateral movement to your advantage. The guard break mechanic spits on that. Many characters in this game have guard breaks that demand no execution. Jin does not have the privilege of having a guard break. So in my honest opinion, these characters are the joke. The big difference is I know some people enjoy them so I will not demand for them to be nerfed. That's called having respect.

[@shaghilathar3588]

@@sakimiyanaga6251 No, guard breaks existed since tekken 3 its just that more characters have them now. And the guard breaks are nowhere near as powerful as any of jins tools. He already merges every archetype and has almost every kind of move and you want to give him the one thing he doesnt have. Thats not called having respect

[@Adajio-_-]

@@zackariahp1873uf2 -13 and when u do d2 no counter combo just guarantee follow up. Thats all Jin needs.

[@sakimiyanaga6251]

@@shaghilathar3588 The funny thing is even the creator of the video were talking under in implores you not to use tekken 3 and below because they are all horribly broken games. Because if you are, then all the characters in this game would look balanced compared to Ogre in Tekken 3. The jack-of-all-trades is in itself an archetype and you should stop pretending that it isn't. Every game has a character that can do everything while not specializing on anything. Jin imho takes that role. He has a perfect grab game, but not as perfect as King's. He has quick lows, but not as oppressive as Zafina's (who perfected Knee in TGU btw). He has 50/50 but not as effective as Kazuya's. He has forward pressure but not as strong as Dragunov's wr2 pressure or Claudio's. The fact that I'm valuing the money people spent to play the character they like is called having respect. Oh... and it's not the one thing that he doesn't have. 1. Launching parry that works on jabs. 2. Back turned pressure that Xiaoyu and Raven abuses. 3. A 10 frame launcher 4. A launching grab. 5. A slide. 6. A launching low on normal hit (that means not d2) 7. A ground throw. 8. A generic df2 that launches on clean hit. 9. Lili's sidestep. Even TMM agrees that Jin's movement is worse than even Kazuya in this game.

[@v-1235]

I posted this as a reply but i'm going to post it as a full comment: I started on tekken 7 as well with Dragunov back in season 3 (hoo boy) i'm all for the nerfs to the damage cause i think Dragunov should not have that damage potential and even another nerf to hatchet but let's be real, Dragunov needed a power low, there's so many d2 you can do until you eat a low parry, in tekken 7 it was even worse but even now a low parry or an i13 ws move hurts enough and leaves you in a very bad position against some characters. Mainman said it in a video on tekken 7 dragunov, he probably forgot, "Dragunov fundamentally on paper doesn't work, he's not a functional character" here's the video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/op-8d5aHm79lrZY Another video talking about problems with dragunov where he says quote: "Lacks a power low": kzbin.info/www/bejne/eaOzhWaCgN2mpc0si=algfUc1lsatH_1-_&t=8803 There has been some universal system changes that helped him (like the standarization IWR moves), and of course it's a completely new game, but yeah, I'm all for nerfs but the character needs a decently damaging low, even if it's a situational one You cannot go from "the character on paper doesn't work" to "they ruined the design philosophy", if the character didn't work then the design philosophy needed to change, if Dragunov worked fine but was bad then it's fine i don't care about using it, I was using it at it's worst and still liked to play the character even if it was frustrating, but let's at least be consistent on opinions. TL;DR: Hatchet too strong, needs nerf, but still needs a decent power low (not an OP one like the one we have) for the character to work.

[@SolidSonicTH]

Once again that statement I heard prior to 8's release holds up: "it doesn't make players study harder, it just gives the opponent more homework." The tools several characters have (and not even like crazy oppressive characters, but have certain moves in their toolset that are "just good" without needing a caveat or "...unless your opponent...") are given properties that would have NEVER existed in an older Tekken game. Do-everything moves where the opponent either just has to KNOW it's coming and preemptively react or even simply respect it because all the alternatives are a throw of the dice or do nothing to impede the opponent's offensive posture (you CAN respond to it but you'll barely have any rewards for doing so and the setback the opponent gets out of it is easily shrugged off). Game very much has a "just don't get hit, bro," vibe to it. All you can do in some situations is to just avoid making contact with your opponent's move because if you do then that's all they needed.

[@danielesottile9165]

I'll start by saying that I'm a jin main and that I preferred jin in T7, I also say that jin is now a much simpler and more effective character than before, I'm just very curious to hear you go into more detail about this character, because when you talk about dragunov or yoshimitsu, you clearly say what they are really too strong in, you even dedicated a video where you explain what yoshi's OP moves are, where you really show why yoshi breaks the game, the same goes for dragunov, but for jin you just say simply that it is too strong, without giving a real explanation of what the technique is with which jin breaks the game, I conclude by saying that I also think that Jin is a bit too strong, but I wouldn't compare him to a Yoshi, honestly if I had to make a ranking I would also put him below Xiaoyu, I'd like to see you go deeper into this analysis on Jin

[@DannyBob08]

You r wrong, totally wrong. Jin is way more stronger than Yoshi, and Ling is not even in the same league. If you cant see that being a Jin main, u woudlnt understand even if he explains it. Ill just give u 2 moves that does that for jin. f4 and the easy mode for the most powerfull atack in the game, easy electric, he have much more than that anyway...

[@danielesottile9165]

@@DannyBob08 I know that Jin is a very strong character, heat smesh completely broken and personally I would remove all the electrics from him during the breaking step, perhaps giving him a tokken below the waist like other characters also have, which in case an electric were to enter gives you the possibility to have only 1 electric from the breaking step, in this way he would become a deeper character, at this point I think that Jin's problem is linked to the fact that he has his electrics who start in a simple way, remove those he seems to me to be a character as dangerous as others, F4 is a move that he also had in T7, the only thing they did in T8 is that now after F4 entering a combo is very simple and I'm the first to not appreciate this, maybe what I wrote isn't clear, I would nerf jin, but I wouldn't say he's the most broken character in the game, but I also know I don't have the experience of TMM, so I would have appreciated an analysis done by him on the character

[@Anshu21-i2z]

Bryan isn't "Great Job" at all bro!! How tf a character can have enormous amounts of CH tools when a character like Steve doesn't have much CH tools in this game because this game was meant to be aggressive by design Not to mention his insane combo damage at the wall which Bryan never used to have in earlier Tekken games because of his taunt oki at the wall. Qcb1, qcf1+2, ws3, snake eyes 3+4 2, hatchet are all too strong moved along with CH strings like 121, d24, df23, etc

[@TheEpocHunter]

Man Dragunov is really overtuned... nerf Devil Jin

[@JunKazamaFan]

Dragunov's "Ignition Switch" (qcf+4) is literally a perfect attack. There is practically no downside to just throwing it out whenever.

[@TheLifeLaVita]

jab

[@TekkenFan-e]

QCF4 just resets the neutral, there are no guaranteed follow up after that, Jun sidestep 4 is more powerful frame trap where other character is close to you and you can continue the offense.

[@JunKazamaFan]

It's not a "God Mode" move, but I would still say that it does too much for one attack.

[@TheLifeLaVita]

@@JunKazamaFan just remove the tracking (which it doesn't have, if it clips it's a bug)

[@TekkenFan-e]

​@@JunKazamaFan its just overhype , QCF4 sucks as compared to Jun SS-4. even if you delete that move, people will still cry about his other moves.

[@StarScreamX]

Season 4 Dragunov bottom 10 Has no mid Running 2, qcf4, db 3+4 all nerfed to hell Top 2 characters dlc kunimitsu and untouched yoshi

[@SShaBazzz]

Azucena I would say needs some small buffs. To be honest, the very last nerfs to her should be reverted.

[@JoseRatahi-Koia]

Maaaaate shut up. Drags last 2 years in TK7 was so terrible that JDCR had to use Armour King 😂. Drags mids weren't hitting, he needed 2.5 combos to be able to kill. Use would be crying if Drags d2 was counter launcher like Jin's.

[@2D_is_all_I_need]

it's always like this. New characters in those kinds of games are op af, because they have a nerf window so that players are happy that the developers did something. Rarely a character is actually playable against/balanced, and those might have a buff window or little to no changes.

[@akebo92]

Why “f you” to Kumer and Pander? I think this is the best iteration of them and if you lab even like 5 minutes of them, you know a lot of their stuff is very punishable and they got to commit

[@mongerponsky2779]

Anyone who hates the Bear matchup isn't being serious, there's literally no mix to the bears, and literally every low being launch punishable besides one is actually cruel and dB 2 should be buffed

[@Adajio-_-]

Tmm since T7: Nerf Jin

[@lilbxz9905]

yeah realy he just does not like it jin is one of the balanced chars in the game

[@IzNebula]

Funny how the video is about Dragunov, but he somehow finds a way to end the video talking about Jin.

[@nayd5043]

@@IzNebula And Xiao

[@SplitSeoul]

@@lilbxz9905u don’t know shit

[@Ti7Vk3y]

8:35 I'm so casual that I wouldn't even call myself a Tekken player as much as just a Tekken watcher, but didn't he say that flash was the best move in the game?

[@CD44F]

Flash is probably the best defensive/turn stealing/momentum stopping move. Qcf4 is far and away the best offensive move though

[@Sin-pt2eq]

It sucks cuz even the well made characters in this game just lack a lot of identity compared to the old games. It’s all super aggressive, I think if they just buffed the hell out of movement to have defense meet the aggressiveness the game would be a lot more interesting to play and watch.

[@payloSK8]

The fact that Zafinas d3 in high crush, counter hit launcher low, +7 on hit, -13 on block but because of the tarantula stance u can only do ws4 and nobody talks about it and people call it balance is crazy!!! Also a mid from stance that’s +6 on block, ch follow up for 56dmg!! In comparison Lee d3 is -1 on hit! Let that sink for a minute! Watch the latest match between Knee and shadow20oz , please count the d3’s! Yes it’s that good 1:03

[@SwipeGameplay]

1:13 how are lidia and zafina balanced? They are underbalanced in important areas. For example they have TERRIBLE launchers! which is a extremely important concept for getting combos going in this game.

[@ViewtifulJae]

Crazy thing is they stripped him of his best moves in t7 and somehow he hits so hard that it doesn’t matter. I personally miss the more technical counter hit focused drag man.

[@saadlakho5888]

Tekken 7 drag was weak as he lacked strong lows and intimidating mids, but thats solved here where he has SNK 4 and that +6 heatsmash

[@VERYR4RE]

he was weak cause he lacked intimidating mids?

[@Bigpoppapump313]

He was never weak in 7 he dominated first 2 seasons. Are u a zoomer??

[@BluahGhaa]

Brainfart coment.

[@tekkn_579]

@@Bigpoppapump313what about the last season?

[@countdookie6987]

​@@VERYR4REarguably, yes. Not as intimidating as lets say, Heihachi. Yes he still had really good mids with b1+2, B4,3 and wr2. But the problem with two of those moves are, they're easily steppable, and they're slow. B4,3 is his truly good mid move, which is still non-jailing. His way of breaking someone's defense is like what TMM said, constant pokes, annoy the shit out of you, or grabs, which are easily broken. But both can be dealt with relatively easily. You don't have to duck, if you can get a read on either of the two with a well-timed hopkick, he's done. He had a lot of mids that knocks down/wallsplats, but most of those moves are unsafe(ff2, ws1+2/qcf1+2). Some of em being high or a non-jailing/non-guarantee strings(df1,4 and 2,1,3)

[@usmansubhani7482]

Dragunov is the very essence of what I dislike about the current Tekken 8. I’d heard they wanted to make every character to an ‘S Tier’ level, but that being their response to Tekken’s balance issues is what ruins it all. If there is 1 character who gives more than every other character when putting effort into, then you make it “Dragunov, The Game”. Though I hate Alisa more because she made Jack obsolete. Why use the slow, big, low dmg robot when you can use the faster one with the same reach? As a former Jack player (now Yoshi), I hate what they did to my boi.

[@BertDaBeethoven]

Bro skips a whole section of the patch notes because Leo was there and now this lmaoo. I swear this guy is going to see Leo become top 1 in tournament and still never talk about him. Also nice analogy with the chop down the tree thing. I think Claudio ALMOST fits that same ideology where he has some of the best mids in the game but also shit lows but I'd totally be fine with him getting toned down at this point. Also also Heihachi still needs damage nerfs and you know it. edit: just went back. 1:37 probably the best part of this video

[@kodiak809]

what MMW means is no matter if he was buffed he is still a forgettable character 😂 dude's been a dead characters for years now

[@JobeLovo]

Heihachi needs nerfs 😂😂😂

[@RandomGameClips27]

who is Leo ?

[@songoku6067]

The only reason ppl lose to Leo is cause no1 plays the char and they lack matchup knowledge Leo has hard tracking issues and predictable strings just a high mid tier char

[@JobeLovo]

@@songoku6067doesn't it have a high evasion hell sweep a form of kempo and aop and a super evasive mid launcher that is safe on block ?

[@dominiclacroix9489]

one night i got like 7 Dragunov in a row. This is so toxic i left for the night, never knowing if another one was waiting. Win or Lose these matches are exhausting

[@Rockanichu]

This is my first tekken, randomly chose Leo and stuck with him since. Quite fun and simple for beginners. I do agree Drag, Jin, and Alisa are cancer. I find Jin to be the hardest matchup, Jin's close to mid range is like mix up hell... traps, staggers, grabs.. I call the area the Mishima zone. scary.

[@Mxne.]

Alternative title: Dragunov turned tekken 8 into a disaster

[@Ti_Fire]

I legit read it as that at first. And its a better title.

[@UncleHyena]

I disagree his moveset is OD. But I also think the system mechanics heavily reward his archetype. He’ll never be low mid tier in this game imo like he was in 7 cuz defence is heavily nerfed, turtling with brain dead counter hit buttons. People have to actually work for defence now but now Drag’s approach and offence is also too easily accessible without damage nerf considerations

[@diibadaa9502]

What is a difference between a "joke" and a "fuck you"

[@tekkn_579]

Dragunov was designed to always be strong in T8 🤷‍♂️ there’s so much bs added to this game and it has deviated so far from what Tekken traditionally was,that you can’t really take it that seriously and I don’t think Harada intended it to be. Tekken 8 now more than ever is meant for casuals.

[@SnowflakeSSQ]

I'm surprised there are still tournaments and people consider this a competitive sport you can be good at, those days are behind us.

[@SonicRiders]

Yeah, this by far is the worst Tekken as far as the series goes, I enjoyed having to chop down opponents in 7. The game was honest, 8 is just a huge mashing monkey fest.

[@YoBoryy]

Yeah man I agree nerf kazuya

[@BurpVA]

So basically, this is a Dragunov Video and A tierlist video with "Welldone" and " A joke" as a rating, honestly.. I agree with everything he talked about here

[@johnsonjunior547]

imagine if they would just walk back the iwr change instead of being stubborn about making the game have less skill expression

[@SenaproDXD]

Boy I know you didn’t skip over Xiaoyu in the beginning.

[@EGreddragon07]

Xaoyu is not a brain dead charicter. She has a lot of pressure in heat but without it other chars have more pressure.

[@SenaproDXD]

@@EGreddragon07 ofc. I know. I main Xiaoyu. I just like when people talk about her.

[@Regulus-uu7pb]

He's the biggest xiaoyu hater

[@weiwu1442]

xiaoyu’s pretty hard to play actually

[@Regulus-uu7pb]

@@weiwu1442 yeah and not nearly as op as mainman says

[@luxolars]

Just imagine if you this to a drag player in 2019. They wouldn’t believe anything 😂

[@damastah100]

I can't take TMM talking about character identities seriously every time he does it cause IMO giving Kazuya a demon paw is straight up against Kazuya's identity in past games(not talking about strength of the move here, cause there are multiple stronger demon paws in this game: Jin's ff2, Lee's ff3, Reina's ff2 into Sentai to name a few, I'm talking about the fact he HAS it, let alone it getting boosted tracking during heat) so this all just sounds like "rules for thee and not for me" bs to me. He does this to several characters and ofc no one is ever gonna properly be able to engage a dialogue with this guy because the people that DO make response vids and whatnot, he just facken skims over the video and doesn't even acknowledge the other side's points cohesively, EVER.

[@azuresaiyan9005]

Saying Steve is well balanced when he’s crappier at what he’s supposed to be good at than other characters like Victor or King made me roll my eyes.

[@damastah100]

@@azuresaiyan9005 because it conforms to what TMM "thinks" is their supposed identity, even tho Steve is supposed to be THE counterhit machine of Tekken(trailer literally calls him "Counter-Punching Paragon") and yet B1 is his only real threatening counterhit. I dont even main Steve and I think they should restore at least his CH df2. The fact that both Bryan(who even lost some of his CH launches cause they now give minicombos instead going from T7 to T8) and King both beat Steve in terms of counterhits is just, yeah. There are so many things this guy just doesn't comprehend for him to be spewing out these platitudes about "identity" and what makes a character a joke or not.

[@chakrashadow3220]

He said before that it was broken, and that when it was "nerfed," it wasn't nerfed enough. I do agree though, Kazuya has way too much now. I liked him because he wasn't super good and was very demanding, but now he's just broken.

[@v-1235]

Just look at what he was saying about Dragunov in Tekken 7 Quote: "Dragunov fundamentally on paper does not work": kzbin.info/www/bejne/op-8d5aHm79lrZYsi=1i8k4t6F5JA3-3DB&t=12 Dragunov needed a hatchet, not the hatchet we have and certainly not the hatchet that we got on release, but the character needs a power low, d2 is just not enough especially in tekken 8 with the fact that it's -1 on hit

[@theonegreat4978]

​@@v-1235it's enough because it's high crash, unseeable and hit hard, so no one want to keep getting hit with it. Hatchet is quite reactable that's why pros don't use it that much except when they take risk.

[@fancyhermit7]

Dragunov went out sad and the of Tekken 7's life cycle. But ever since he came to Tekken 8 he was awesome again to the point where he was a character that people used a lot of they wanted to win match without struggling

[@mofix2016]

The match between lowhigh and raef in evo winners top 24 was the moment I realised that how much Jin is busted in T8

[@garret7494]

Hearing mainman say Raven was done well makes me happy.

[@Pavidota]

It's impossible to have any form of discussion with fighting game players about balance or honesty or design because everyone conflates these 3 things as if it's one thing, kuma is extremely balanced but I don't think many people would be considered an "honest" character but people go so fucking up in arms discussing stuff they have absolutely no idea about

[@namelessking361]

Jin was a dysfunctional character in T7, they actually fixed him in T8. They could maybe nerf the damage but the design in T8 is a lot more interesting and the Zen stance cancels and transitions make his gameplay very varied

[@KDBSPORTS_ENT]

@namelessking361 i agree, jin is better in T8 but they won't hear you because of their hate for him lol.

[@namelessking361]

@KDBSPORTS_ENT exactly and all the fundamental tools they're complaining about now are stuff he always had in T7 that were just as good like 2,1,4 or B2,1 or B3,2 or DB4 or D4 or 1,2,3 or 1,2,4 or hellsweep etc etc. The only real changes are giving him Samsara and D2 but those are very punishable and you get launched for them. You won't see them often in tournaments for that reason

[@namelessking361]

@KDBSPORTS_ENT some characters can launch D2 if they block it but in general, it's really easy to backdash and make it whiff so you can launch Jin and get a full combo

[@KDBSPORTS_ENT]

@namelessking361 Yep! I main jin and am tekken king! I play against tekken gods and God of destructions all the time, and d2 is useless to be real. If you try to spam it, you will get punished to death and lose for sure.

[@Sir_Robin_of_Camelot]

How can you call him more interesting in T8, and then dismiss his zen cancel and b1 stance from T7 that created way more freedom and expression? T7 Jin was a way cooler design imo.

[@SomnusShinra]

Jun Player here since T8 launch. Jun was a NIGHTMARE when the game came out. Her healing was way too much and it made the hp loss factor a joke and with no risk using the Kazama Powers. Now, Jun is well balanced and for me it's fun using her and fighting against her. I love playing Jun and it's one of my favorite characters alongside Lee. I hope they can balanced the characters that are a joke like Alisa, Dragunov and Jin...

[@moosasaboor1221]

"Character that are really annoying to deal with , very tricky and seem very bullshit. But once you learn the matchup, you'll learn that they HARD COMMIT" But has tmm TRIED learning the matchup for Xiaoyu and Alisa is the MAIN question?......(Understandable for Jin/Drag) Cuz Xiao and Alisa also take risks and have pretty defined weaknesses but ppl still yapp without learning the matchup

[@b0ost3rz]

just learn how to guess

[@Rius9106]

Idk what part of being backturned in front of your enemys face isn't hard committing. And thats like a good 1/3 of xiaoyus offense. A lot of moves are unsafe and - on block. Tmm is just spitting some stupid stuff for entertainment purposes i guess.

[@MarcellGyurjan]

@@Rius9106 also people who complain about AOP crushing certain mids forget to point out that it doesnt block lows. if it didnt crush some mids, itd be worse than a duck

[@rainkage773]

@@moosasaboor1221 ling is hard to play, Alisa nah. Don't mix ling with Alisa, the robo requires no skill to play and she's busted af.

[@rainkage773]

@@Rius9106 cuz he gets trashed by mister croft, can't blame Tmm there. He's getting old.

[@_mass_477]

T8 probably hired Riot for these balance changes. Buffing characters mindlessly and hoping players "make it work."

[@Alex-Omega]

Hes wrong when saying theres no idea behind Jin. The idea behind Jin is having a strong, easy to play character. Thats it. As hes the main protagonist. And from a business perspective, this is only logical and everything else would be stupid. What he was in Tekken 7 was the biggest mistake. The posterboy of your franchise CAN NOT be a difficult character, simple as that. He needs to be appealing to a wide range of players. And those sweaters lik him are simply the minority, by far. Plus, Tekken 7 Jin was also just one variation of the character throughout the entire series. MainMan speaks about him like Jins legacy always has been a super complicated and demanding character, which is simply not true

[@lilbxz9905]

jin is not easy character to play

[@metsu-satsu4280]

You mean Jin _wasn't_ a complicated and hard-to-play character for the majority of the Tekken games?

[@Alex-Omega]

@@metsu-satsu4280 Not as complicated as in Tekken 7, not even closely

[@matitone]

Jin was always hard to use except for Tekken 4 (Just Frame Laser Scraper lol), from 5 up until 7 he was always hard to use due to his poor jab range, poor oki no evasion tools and high execution requirements, tekken 8 removed all these weaknesses and made everything else easier like ewhf and f4 ch combo

[@metsu-satsu4280]

@@Alex-Omega Elaborate.

[@namaerro6738]

Pople have been complaining about yoshi even when he was garbage tier. So your points are not valid. People'll keep on hating

[@lilbxz9905]

nope yoshi is stupid

[@OGBetter]

​@@lilbxz9905 Insanely stupid, character needs tons of nerfs

[@namaerro6738]

@@OGBetter people will keep on complaining even if he gets to the point of ttt2 because of samurai cutter and flash. 🤣 just get good scrub or change game

[@namaerro6738]

@@lilbxz9905 you surely aint much behind then 🫢

[@Bakfor]

Yoshi has never been garbage tier in Tekken 8. Past iterations are irrelevant since he is a completely different character in this game

[@supergamebox7776]

Genuinely what is it with you and Leo? You just hate on him for no reason it’s weird imo

[@Bakfor]

Guy just hates anything effeminate

[@ironfistgaming77]

Jin will for no good reason will always be a joke for TMM. No matter how much you cry TMM wont do shit to Jin...just cuz of your opinion and pointless jealousy.... no offense...you will always be my most loved Tekken content creator

[@JobeLovo]

Bro has a complicated relationship with tmm💀

[@S1lverArr0w]

Waiting for people to realise how strong Lili is in this game, After proper nerfs (if she isnt touched) she will easily be top 5

[@aymanehomail4307]

Xiaoyu well done

[@sebaschan-uwu]

I love these videos where tmm is just talking about something

[@lurkinlittlesquares6691]

9 mins of muh design philosophy (even tho i agree that drag is strong) but still everyone knows what he can do and isnt even cheesy unpredictable like xiaoyus, kings, alisas, lars etc esp yoshi when nearly everyone else's design philosophy got changed too, esp mishimas drag is really strong but other characters problems gets swept under the rug because of him lol

[@Rius9106]

Dragunov remains the biggest offender still. Dominating from low ranks all the way up to biggest tournamets.

[@Tekkenforlife9036]

Exactly, if all these people were given a choice to fight against Yoshi, eddy, Alisa, king or Dragunov, they will choose Dragunov every time

[@pizza-frank]

As someone who started in t8 and loves the concept of drag I fully agree. It seems like every new tool they gave him took away a fundamental weakness he needed to stay balanced and to make his gameplay interesting. Now he just seems like a faceroll stomp chjaracter. I really hope his 1.09 nerfs are actually interesting so I can feel less bad for playing him. Personally I'd make snk4 similar to a deathfist by making it unsafe on block and not hit grounded but still reset neutral with pushback and still do chip on block. DB34 should be removed, he shouldn't have a high damage low. Some sneak transitions should also be removed even though I love most of them. 2 1 snk is oppressive considering how good his jab pressure is and b4 2 snk removes a lot of counterplay to that string. Maybe also nerf his non-wall combo damage. I feel like he should HAVE to get wall in order to do absurd damage. IMO Drag should be a character with good, scary plus frame mids that can be stepped and good grabs. He should be required to use d2 or ff3 for tracking and d2 should be the counterplay for grounded opponents.

[@Bakfor]

Leo is a well made character. A fairly straightforward strike based character with some stance mixups and enough evasion to deal with the overly aggressive nature of this game. Not overly flashy but has some pretty satisfying moves as well. It's nice having a character where the T8 mechanics have not completely overridden the character and you can still play pretty clean defensive Tekken as well.

[@law6800]

I'm waiting for Drag to get nerfed to oblivion so I can finally play him, he was my main at the end of T7

[@kamitenshi3825]

You know how to read patch notes?

[@law6800]

@@kamitenshi3825 I’m not picking up what you’re putting down

[@kamitenshi3825]

@@law6800 don’t be so afraid of the truth my friend. If you know frames and you know how to read patch notes properly. Nobody can trick you. Dude really thinks Dragunov is anywhere close to how he was in January lol.

[@law6800]

@@kamitenshi3825 i get that he’s nerfed, but if he’s not bottom 10 I’m not playing him

[@b0ost3rz]

honestly theres no way to nerf him back to t7 level

[@SolidSonicTH]

I think Heihachi is balanced for his tools but his damage is too high. I like his kit (they plugged some holes but still drive the player into a specific lane with how you're expected to handle him) but the obscene damage he can do feels awkwardly high (like I shouldn't have been rewarded for doing so little work - Warrior Instinct should obviously be horribly oppressive and rip through opponents like paper).

[@traezaX1]

After maining Dragunov in TEKKEN now we eat😂😂😂😂😂 ain't complaining with the free wins

[@B1gLupu]

Dragunov's Hatchet is pretty bad nowdays. It's range is so bad that it misses if you try to use it when an opponent wakes up on the wall, you need to wait for them to wake up fully to use it. On top of the shit range, it's slow, so you'll get jab checked out of it regularly. It being only +3 means it's basically neutral, since even a midcheck trades with a jab. It's also launch punishable, so if it's blocked, you die. Unlike Victor's launch punishable low, you don't get a full launch on CH, just another hatchet on a grounded enemy. It's just bad, and if it were attached to any other character you wouldn't even care.

[@trinixjin8039]

jin complaints here should only apply to fujin and below. All jin mains can take pride in the fact the character is difficult to play in high ranks, this is based off the character's poor ranks stats.

[@anibalmattiwos7613]

Finally people are realizing how much they fucked Jin. Seeing all the changes they made to him i was so upset i just switched characters, been playing Jin since t6 and i don't touch whatever monstorisity they have created in t8... Whatever that thing is, its not Jin.... and i have zero repect for anyone who plays that thing cause that thing plays itself. Appeal to the lowest common denominator, "cause main protagonist has to be easy", ruined what was a perfect design.

[@zex69]

I disagree with MainMan on his Jin take ... I think the devs made T7 Jin as the best portrayal of that games mechanics ... lets give the protagonist the exact move for every small interaction and let the players learn the game thoery by playing Jin ... In T8 they wanted to make the game more easy to learn and introduce overarching moves that can give more solutions to a situation ... enter T8 Jin the protagonist who can press less buttons and doesn't need a knowledge archive to react to an exact situation ... they did a great job and also made him the go to first character for newcomers ...

[@KanoTheMercenary]

Forget Dragunov, Jin players have been getting carried since T5 and im tired of it 😂. That character has always been top 5 and keeps getting constantly overlooked.

[@jinpachichulo7561]

Tekken 8 isn't that complicated to fix. They just got stupid trying to reinvent the wheel. All they had to do is keep legacy play and adjust a few things. Making strings jail on block was just stupid. Remove that and things Aputena is instantly fixed. Fix SS and Dragunov could possibly be instantly fixed. But nah, they wanna make everything unsteppable and safe on block. Tracking, inescapable throws etc. Stupid game design. Like heat wasnt bad enough. They punished us for having skill.

[@shahabgohar3350]

i think it is like a strategy to buff certain characters so that people can play it and have more audience. If the dargunov and yoshi are not that much good in T7. then it is their strategy to buff certain characters per game to increase their useage

[@Sparklenuts]

At some point, everyone plays the same and it sucks

[@brandonspringfield2861]

True but the super F'd up part is some characters are better at playing the same 🤦🏾 just being overall OD character.

[@kaiok6776]

Unique is bad, unique is gimmicky, unique is ~too much knowledge check~ too much cancer, everyone needs to play like a mishima.

[@Carlisho]

I am by no means a pro player, in fact just a blue ranks weekend warrior trash, but playing Leroy has the benefit of being a really good sneak 4 counter, it is very easy to get the perfect parry on sneak 4 and since Leroy got buffed you know how much damage that perfect parry leads to. So yeah if you struggle against Dragunov give Leroy a try Definitely not biased comment and im definitely not trying to get more people to be Leroy enjoyers, trust

[@thecritic8947]

Dragonuv was not hard in tekken 7, hella safe great movement hella plus frames. A headache to defend against lol it was life free wins

[@JESSROCKEDChannel]

agreed. the RAW snk4 is just too OP. ulsan knows this and he is abusing it everytime. we already have heat dash, that alone is already a good pressure tool. no need for OP base form plus frame moves. i would suggest to make heat become a tool to break the spacing like a combo breaker to cater the defense side as well.

[@TekkenFan-e]

Dragunov rushdown playstyle is built for tekken 8, no other character come close to dragunov offense and that is the core philosophy of this character. you thought after last major nerfs in may, dragunov would drop down to top 10 characters but how he is still number 1, even with back to back nerfs almost every patch.

[@erjohn5404]

this is what bandaI doesn't see everyone doesn't give a fuck much about tehe cosmetics or whatever what is ruining the game is the tier S this is the perfect example dragunov. imagine fighting him a lot in high rank.

[@GodKingIssei]

Welcome to the King of Iron Dragunov 8! Left/Right-> Choose fighter-> Sergei Dragunov! Opponent choice-> Sergei Dragunov! Stage-> Into the Dragunovsphere Low health-> Rage Drag! God of Dragunov Achieved 😅 Now nerf Devil Jin again! Namco amazing company 🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡

[@azteckjumbie9344]

Heiachi. Lidia..Reina nor Raven are balanced...Raven is a braindead cheese character

[@CkWk78]

Go use Raven and see how you do in Blue rank or higher. Just bc Raven is spankin that azz (your azz) don't mean he's braindead.

[@hassansabbah4241]

Raven braindead? Since when he is in my opinion slightly underpowered he deserved I15 launcher he is pretty hard and even getting to blue and onwards is pretty hard with him

[@Ti_Fire]

@@azteckjumbie9344 they are some of the most balanced chars what are you smoking

[@LonesomeSparrow7]

TMM really said "great job" when hovering over Asuka? O:

[@WhosGrimpy]

As a Leo main we are overshadowed but I think we could use a little cane

[@TekkenFan-e]

dragunov was the most predictable character in Tekken7 with basically two moves (d2 & running 2) and no actual mids. In tekken 8 he got some competetive moves and everyone is losing their mind. Still he is the most honest character in the game with no gimmicks, you need some tekken skills to play dragunov, you have to sidestep , backdash and whiff punish to reach decent rank. As compared to all those other bullshit characters like Eddy, Yoshi, Kuma, Feng, Alisa requiring zero movement, just mash and win.

[@vv4983]

Delusional drag main

[@keidz03]

I was expecting that Leroy doesn't exist! Thank goodness.

[@bigaj6901]

Feels good to hear TMM call Lars a well-designed character 💪