How The Internet Made Learning Guitar HARDER

[@TheLateBoyScout]

The Internet has also made guitar playing seem more intimidating. Practically every Guitar KZbinr plays WAY better than you think you'll EVER play. So you look at that, and you're kind of inspired, but you also feel like you're way too far behind to even try. My focus, from as far back as 30 years ago, has always been about learning songs, and writing songs. I'd love to be a better player, and I work on it, but I REALLY love writing, so that's where I spend most of my playing time.

[@WarrenPostma]

True, but as a guy who started to learn electric guitar in the 1990s, it wasn't much different. We weren't watching rando youtubers though we were watching EVH shred in front of 30K fans during live shots of them performing, on MTV (or Much Music in Canada) or doing highly scripted music videos. It wasn't less intimidating to put a GnR or Van Halen or Led Zeppelin record on and then try to learn that.

[@Hehehehhehehehehehehehhe78]

@@WarrenPostma Idk i wouldn't find EVH, Jimmy page or slash intimidating because you are trying to learn from them as they're idols to many. It may be intimidating because the song may be hard but I think what's he trying to say everybody is better than you on KZbin and it's hard because you feel like you won't be as good as them.

[@PaulWegmann]

an old cassette tape of yngwie malmsteem was intimidating enough for me, in 1998.

[@Satchboy71]

Joe Satriani inspired me to play the guitar back in the 80's because of his insane level of playing.

[@charlesoxley7242]

@@Satchboy71 Likewise. Joe Satriani, Alex Lifeson, Eric Johnson all inspired me due to their incredible level of playing. Also, it made learning those songs rather intimidating (at first).

[@miaoupha2370]

It's crazy to think that when Rick was young, bronze was just discovered...

[@cartilover7778]

Dawg we’ve had copper much longer than just the 1900s , we just hadn’t realized what it could do

[@fduranthesee]

lmao

[@martinmurry3]

I resemble that remark

[@TimSamoff]

😂

[@Wilbafarce]

Some say Rick invented the guitar in 300 BC

[@JensLarsen]

Great topic for a discussion! "learn songs" Completely agree!

[@JOTG2000]

Hell yeah. And don't be afraid to learn songs you don't know especially if it's suggested to you. And if it's an album tune, have a crack at one of the other, not so popular tracks on the album.

[@gssong7111]

Way too much instruction these days, you want to learn everything and focus on nothing. Now, nobody gigs and has to first be a video production manager, then a musician... Catch 22

[@bigbangattack97]

the best power ups in guitar are trying to learn songs you know you cant play.

[@gioigeniale6711]

@@bigbangattack97 My daily business. so true.

[@bullfrogboss8008]

I'd like to point out that another "bad" thing the internet does is distracting beginners with unnecessary gear-related information, while their gear is perfectly fine, especially for their level

[@billklement2492]

Gear is a big distraction. I've tried to avoid effects over the years to learn to play clean. To this day, I only have a few pedals, and the only one I use is the Stomp. Admittedly, there are lots of effects built in, but I like to keep it simple. Right now, I've been plugged directly into my amp. No effects other than overdrive. Not to say I don't sit down and have some real fun with the Stomp!

[@klasewiberg]

True!

[@jchabo82]

Plus the KZbin personality is always just trying to get views.

[@JohnnyOlsson]

This is a good point. "Back in the days" you would have to make do with what you had. It is said that a reason Russian hockey players a couple of decades ago had such remarkable skills was that they learned to play with absolute crap. Meaning that you either developed very soft hands, or your stick would break. And maybe the same is true for guitarists. Through amp simulators, I have access to gear I could only dream of twenty years ago, but does that make me a better guitarist? No! Most of the time I'm too busy flipping through presets and figuring out what every knob does to my tone to actually, you know, PLAY...

[@farqueleyou7578]

This was a problem when the industry was still 80% printed media and 20% online, now its a miracle that anyone gets good on guitar at all

[@E0001-i9j]

I love how Rick just rest comfortably on his guitar for an entire video without playing a single note. I often do that myself after 25 years of playing. You grow so accustomed to the tactile side of guitar playing that having a guitar in your lap becomes the most comfortable way of existing.

[@maromaro1337]

I think that young guitar players should always remember that most of the guitar videos on KZbin are "playthroughs" of songs and not actual live performances. You can get very easily discouraged when watching a "cut-and-sewed-mix" of multiple takes that sound like perfection. Just like you said Rhett - watching live performances is the best way to learn songs.

[@danieljensen2626]

I'm not sure if that's really relevant, they can get out more songs faster that way, but anything you can get in multiple takes is possible to play in one take if you practice it enough.

[@gtrriffs]

Thats why all my videos are just recorded on my phone. Press record, no cheating.

[@VeteranVandal]

I guess I should start playing again.

[@richardbrodbeckbeginninggu7330]

I fall into the category you discussed. I started last year. I am doing an online course. And so I can agree it is more convenient to learn online for me. I am older (53), work nights as a nurse, have a family and home to take care of, and taking college courses. So most of my “classes” on line are done between the hours of 1 am and 4 am on different days. This makes finding an in person instructor kind of difficult. I wish I could get one to ask questions too and get feedback from. An instructor also makes a safe place to jam with someone else (safe as in I wouldn’t feel like a novice and embarrass myself). And Rhett, glad to see you are continuing to do these vids. Hope you heal well so we can hear you play again soon!

[@williamknell864]

"Learn songs!" I'd say, "As early as you can manage, learn to sing AND play." Songs you like. Accompany yourself. All the years I spent going meedly-meedly meant nothing when I wanted to sing too.

[@danieljensen2626]

I was thinking that also when he said that. I think singing gives you a lot more reason to learn and practice entire songs instead of just bits of solos and whatever. That said, I still play a lot of bits of solos when I sit down to play, haha.

[@DavidDiMuzio]

Great video and discussion. There's definitely a challenge being a "learner" these days. It's both harder and easier.

[@jadelyel]

ive definitely felt this overwhelming feeling lately. Its so easy to watch KZbin lessons instead of just actually practicing and experimenting. And its hard to force yourself to learn a song by ear when a full in depth video is always a click away. I gotta dust off my record player and do this thing right.

[@jimhart1959]

Ear training is so valuable. It teaches you to really listen, and in a band context it helps us to listen to the other musicians, and how your parts fit in the whole.

[@BrianSGuitars]

"Learn songs" just validated my beginner journey! I'm perfectly happy being the rythym guy.

[@JustSomeGuy]

I'm a self-taught artist, so learning music has been an interesting journey because I know that I'm missing a lot by trying to learn to play guitar and piano on my own, but at the same time, I know what interesting creative choices I'll make by not knowing all the rules first. The difference is that if I get confused, I can find out how to do what I want to do, whereas when I was learning to draw, I didn't have access to the internet or any art books, so I would know it was wrong, but couldn't figure out why. Interesting thing though was that I learned anatomy by comparing different artists' styles to see what they were exaggerating. The same thing is happening with music, especially since I listen to so much music. I'm recognizing notes, chords, and chord progressions, and then figuring it out on my own. That makes it stick in my mind more, and then I can check to see what I'm actually doing.

[@Payne2view]

Hi it is fun to see you in a different context. Small world.

[@39love31]

Some Guy, Love your Vids! They are Informative and "TRUTHFUL" ....As for the Learning of Music ...dude, You are a Artist...it will come Once you clean up the "Pallet" and have all the Colors...or In this case ... Notes and Chords Cleaned up and Arranged Orderly ;) Good Luck On your Musical Journey ... And Keep great content coming! Oh and BTW ...Maybe mention how you are coming along "Musically" On your Normal Vids? Just a thought. But what do i know? I am Just Some Guy.....WAIT....🤔I have heard that somewhere before! lol ;)

[@shatiquego9876]

May not agree with your vids but wish you the best of luck in your musical journey. Hope to hear a record or two from you in the near future.

[@26Manueli]

We are loosing this, most people don't see value on this anymore, I for one absolutely do and cherish every time I know about someone else how still does as well, thanks for your post.

[@MoreMeRecording]

The term "Self-Taught" is and has been a misnomer , period. Years ago - I mean YEARS ago - I bought Doug Marks instructional "cassettes" out of an ad in a guitar rag and something he said prefacing the lessons has always stuck with me: " If you've ever watched a guitar player, listened to guitar on a record, saw a live guitar performance on TV, seen a concert with your hero of the day playing etc and tried to cop it,, these are all forms of lessons. The only "truly self-taught player" would be some kid on an island who never saw or heard a guitar before, had one dropped in his lap and explored it on his own. THAT's "self-taught" 100% truth....I also considered myself to be self taught at that time but this helped me realize the term is a distortion of actually truth...

[@breadzeppelin2705]

NGL, when I tried learning songs by ear like the guitarist of older generations, (I tried this after 2 years of learning through KZbin), I realised that there are powerful tunes hidden in songs that you don’t expect. I then spent 6 months just learning nursery rhymes and rock-ifying them. They sound EPIC. My current favourite “rockified” rhyme is “Wheels on the bus”, anyone reading this comment, I advise you to try learning any tune you hear by ear and playing it on guitar, your playing will improve 100X.

[@mattgilbert7347]

That's how we did it back in the day, and it's good advice.

[@kenz2756]

I'd assume you're talking about solo electric. It's a LOT harder to learn fingerpicking acoustic by ear, you have to figure out exactly what chord and which voicing, and position it is. Then if it's a more complex song with interesting chords it'll be tough without looking at the guitarist's hands in the record.

[@guitardude4700]

@@kenz2756 I realize this is an old thread but I learned guitar from listening to Doobie Brothers “busted down around oConelly corners” that peaked my interest and that was the first song I ever learned. And everything was by ear

[@guitardude4700]

Thanks for that. I will persue that

[@kenz2756]

@@guitardude4700 That falls under the simpler fingerpicking songs. But stuff like Tommy Emmanuel's Angelina for example, is more complex and the tuning isn't standard. Very tough to learn by ear, you probably spend a while transcribing it first to a music score or tab.

[@Lamo2100]

The availability of information is a blessing and a curse if there’s no focus or goals. It’s very easy to skim the surface and learn tricks but more difficult to dig deep, conceptualize and consolidate. Less is more when learning an art or skill especially in the age of instant gratification, short attention spans and internet prodigies. Sitting with just two great albums can take you a long way.

[@curlyfryexperience]

Truth. I wasted a lot of time by just noodling around and trying the next shiny thing. I’ve only recently put my foot down and wrote down exactly what I wanted to improve at and learn and focusing on it, drastic improvements in a short time.

[@richardbuse228]

I started playing guitar back in 1966, and was completely self taught, and I don't read music to this day. Just learning bar chords was a major accomplishment back then, because the chord book I had only showed regular basic chords, and I didn't even know there was such a thing as bar chords until I saw a band where the lead player was doing them on his Flying V , and I had to figure out what he was doing. There were advantages and disadvantages to the way I learned. As you brought out, I developed a really good ear, but it took me a couple years sometimes to figure out things that I could have picked up in a couple weeks with lessons from a good guitar teacher. Now I am 72, and looking back at it all, it took a very long time for me to learn some things, which is probably not good. I guess you could say that it was a good thing I was learning guitar by trial and error instead of learning how to fly an airplane or scuba dive !

[@vicpnut1]

I need a brake pedal , I’ve noodled around for far to many years not advancing much past a beginner . Sadly I know the reason(s) … I dont stick with just one thing long enough . I get like a cat chasing a laser pointer with all the options out there .

[@nellayema2455]

Same here.

[@antoniomarinez461]

Me too 😔

[@firemarshal2629]

Same

[@craigdanj]

The next pedal you should buy for your guitar is....the break pedal...

[@mxh5647]

Exactly! This!

[@claytonhough3044]

Myself being 42, in between Rhett and Rick's ages, even the "official album tab books" like Pearl Jam Ten and Nevermind had sooooo many mistakes and bad "tip notes" etc...

[@chairmankaga101]

The deficiency is kids don't seem to be starting bands and jamming with with friends. That's the fountain of creativity that the internet doesn't provide. Throw a couple of beginner guitarists, a guitar washout with his uncle's bass, a skater who "knows" how to play drums and a choirboy into a garage together, and a year later... well you might not have virtuosos, but you'll have a band, and at least one of those kids will have written a song or three. Instead, the grand aspiration of seemingly most young guitarists is to be featured in a shred collaboration video.

[@coreyryan97]

Ive just joined a band and I’ve progressed more in one band jam session then I do in a week of grinding out KZbin videos

[@weizenw]

It’s harder nowadays, not as many kids interested in guitar or rock music anymore. And if a kid does decide to pick up an instrument and has some interest in rock or metal or prog, etc, he will likely be influenced by some KZbin virtuoso or solo artist

[@Updog89]

The pandemic probably made this an even bigger problem! Plus I do think a big part of the decline in jam-based music in popular music has something to do with the decline of the middle class and increased academic and extracurricular demands of school. It’s a lot harder to find the time, space and resources to play with friends. Feel bad for kids these days…

[@leaharrington4472]

I started teaching myself guitar from books at age 12, which was in the late 80s. It was slow going, and i lived in the country, a long way from any music stores. I learned by ear, from other people, from magazines, from records, and from sitting for hours with the instrument to try to figure out what so and so meant by a specific phrase in an interview. It was tedious and slow and i would've drunk gladly from the fire hose of internet information. I envy people learning now.

[@timontide6404]

I think one of the huge benefits to learning the way you did, figuring things out, by ear or otherwise, is that it helps the information stick. I can read some excellent tab and play the song well in a day or two, but I don't usually remember it well. If I have to figure it out, I think the application of brainpower actually helps wire the brain's synapses better. Might be me though.

[@Imokyourok440]

I lived in the country too. Small town. There weren’t any badass players around to show me anything so it was a slow process.

[@pdub4600]

I’ve been playing for almost 15 years and I’ve been dealing with basically all these exact issues. I’ve recently decided to just buckle down and learn the blues. Adding that structure has helped me tremendously....

[@TOPTENTRAVEL01]

Love what you both said about learning songs, and then figuring out the scales behind the notes, etc. John Mayer says that players should "learn the why" behind the songs they learn, so that really struck home to me. Get better, Rhett!

[@st.fiacre6685]

The thing is,40 -50 years ago in rock music, there was a certain awe and respect for musicians that where played in the radio media, the massive stadium rock bands for example.They had cult followings, and were looked at as demigods, as you counted your pennies to buy the next studio album. Now days everybody has a two second attention span with the overwhelming choices presented to them on the internet.Everybody and their mother can play a Yngwie Malmsteen solo from tab. Its like 'Alexa,next song please'..

[@tomrwills]

I am 33 and just started lessons. I already knew C, D, G, Em chords from years and years ago but that is it. I watch Rich's channel too and several others and now I want to actually learn what these things are. I feel ridiculous in lessons sometimes since I am just starting but it is fun learning something new.

[@joejones9520]

good move, I dont know how people get thru life not knowing how to play guitar...

[@Play-On7]

As someone who started playing guitar in 2020 here are my thoughts. By far the best thing the internet has done is break the stigma that one needs expensive gear to sound great. The thought of buying/wanting expensive music gear is a large hindrance when one starts out as we want to sound like our heroes that made us pick up guitar in the first place. The second great thing the internet has done is make shopping for music gear more accessible than ever. Not all of us live in a major metropolitan area, and being able to browse and shop around in the comfort of our own homes is only a plus. What I have found from trying to learn guitar from the internet is that the people who put out the material have forgotten what it is like to be a beginner. Instead of showing me music theory, show me how to hold a pick, where to rest my hand in the guitar, how to increase finger dexterity etc. These are things that are taken for granted by people who have forgotten what it is like to be a beginner. That is why I opted to go with in person lessons instead of one of the dozens of online courses that are out there. With in person lessons the teacher knows what it is like to be a beginner because they meet new students all the time, and they build their lesson plans around new students. As for what songs I choose to listen and learn; I had a list of songs that I wanted to learn on guitar and in a year's that list has only gotten longer. I find that KZbin is the best way to discover music as the KZbin algorithm does a great job of recommending music based on what you listen to on KZbin. And the great thing about the KZbin algorithm is that it does not discriminate based on age or popularity of the music.

[@shnoop123jimbo7]

I think the best way is to play so much to the point u can “know” which note or chord to play as if it were instinctual, I just bought 100 tab books across all genres

[@IanYS]

This is an oversimplification but I feel like it's easier now to become a "guitarist", but harder to develop as an *artist*

[@whatilearnttoday5295]

What Rick Beato offers is the former and nowhere near the latter.

[@lebe220]

Harder to develope as an artist? I don´t think so. Creativity affords courage, through all ages. Maybe people lack courage nowadays.

[@IanYS]

@@lebe220 I don't think it's just a matter of the "courage" of the individual. It's also the nature of the music industry now vs decades ago. Creativity and innovation are not encouraged by labels and studio execs because they prefer to stick to what they know will sell

[@thulsa_doom]

IMHO, probably is: most of people try to sound like somebody else. When I'm in the process of composition, I don't listen to any music at all to not take the risk to affect my music. I do my best to sound like myself, not like everybody else.

[@Kaz999998]

@@IanYS Not that I disagree with you on the fact that labels don't encourage innovation, but the fact that it's more recent phenomenon? Not true at all. Labels since as far back as the 50s have been doing the same thing; capitalizing on trends of what is currently hot and sticking to that to make their money. Sure, back in the day record labels took "risks" on artists that were different from their contemporaries, but these were risks in the sense that they knew they had something, but the risk factored in on how profitable their return would be; it's not like how you're thinking where the risk is the act of bringing on somebody that was very experimental. Bottom line is record labels only go after tried and true artists. Labels will only try to go after "innovative" artists if they can find a way to do so strategically. The true musical innovators you're thinking of are the ones who lay down the ground work with heavy experimentation and an avant garde approach to music, and those people are usually unsuccessful and get panned by critics for being too wild. The innovators you're describing are people who were inspired by those earlier artists, but found a way to break through to the mainstream by simplifying aspects or adding a pop appeal to the things their musical grandfathers' laid down for them.

[@scottnokes]

Rhett, I have played guitar since I was 9 years old, so 47 years now. While I love it, I have never devoted the time necessary to progress to advanced playing skills. Watching master players like Glen Campbell and Roy Clark on TV when I was a kid was so inspirational. Playing songs on my guitars, in mostly simple but expressive ways, and singing along, is totally enough for me.

[@blairmanstevo2013]

Thrashed on guitar for years… now that I have some of that extended time available… my own immersion into utube guitar schtuff is showing results! Its still frustrating to stay disciplined… but if you really want to swim… jump in the water. Thanks to ALL you guys.

[@zpangle]

A lot of us were learning easy to jam together set lists for garage and basement. Played Jackson five for 7th grade talent show, Beatles for 8th, '74, '75. In high school, Bowe, Kinks, Stones, Deep Purple... Easy stuff to garage jam.

[@eljison]

Great advice - learn songs! I know that Rick and Rhett understand and implied this, but I would specify to learn songs from start to finish. So many players I know play great chops and bits of songs, but never play a song from start to finish. I found out early that non-guitar players are not impressed with your chops as much as they enjoy when you play a song they know all the way through.

[@drdre4397]

These discussion type videos are my favourite. If you, Rick and Dave did a podcast every week of this format that'd be a dream. Excellent videos!

[@stevefielding8324]

The internet has allowed everyday Noodler's (like most of us watching) access to Paul Davids, Robert Baker, Rob Swift, Steve Stine, Carl Brown, Brian Kelly, Brian Sherrill, Marty Schwartz and the list goes on. The level and quality free to all is just amazing and we all appreciate it!

[@stanskipworth]

Thank you, both, Gentlemen. You each are very generous with your ideas and suggestions, all of which are quite important and helpful.

[@tedparkinson6892]

I've been playing guitar for 45 years and I'm pretty good. :-) But I've never transcribed anyone's solo (ditto for saxophone which I studied in University). Rick's example of learning Larry Carlton solos applies to a relatively small number of players. I do have a background studying music theory and harmony and I can read tablature and music notation as well. It is really exciting to learn new songs quickly by finding them on the web, learning techniques from so many teachers etc. Personally, I fingerpick, use a pick, play folk, jazz, rock, blues and just mess around. So I rely on the fact I studied music to give me a structure for learning. And I also know that some 12 year old is always going to post a video playing stuff I'll never be able to do. That is just how life works. Enjoy the moments and the songs.

[@joejones9520]

the internet is a miracle for the average player who would never have learned much by ear or would have learned it wrong....Im aware that a lot of the stuff I now play is not really stuff that the real me should be able to play, it's like Im looking at someone else's hands when I look down at mine sometimes, it's wonderful!

[@tedparkinson6892]

@@joejones9520 Good point, but you are still the "real you" when getting stuff from tabs!

[@klasewiberg]

I'm so sorry about your arm Rhett, hope you feel better soon and can play guitar agian soon. I also have an injury right now and miss the guitar so much.

[@jamesryan1939]

Best advice ever, learn songs. My biggest road block was when I got my first guitar at 14, my parents signed me up for lessons. I quit after six months, because it was all theory, sight reading, and scales. I started playing again at 18 when I got my first computer with internet. I discovered tabs and learned my first song, smells like teen spirt, and I was instantly addicted. I started playing four hours a day and learned every song I liked. Then that lead to scales, triads, etc, and polishing up the songs by ear and fixing mistakes. I wish that would have happened when I was 14, I always feel like I lost that import time.

[@1186Dean]

I love the genuine friendship that you two have. Always very apparent. Great video....... I’m that guy who is 15 months in to this journey.

[@chris4087]

I agree with so many of the comments. I feel like I need to learn it ALL to be any good. But you can not learn it ALL just not enough time in a life. I've learnt just to focus on the music you want to play I think having a goal to shoot towards. I look at these crazy players I wish I could play like that it's fun to play crazy fast but unless that's your goal it's very distracting. As Rick basically said one note can say more than a hundred. So I learnt I have to slow down as unfun as it sounds. This is just my journey of course.

[@JL-fs9wh]

Both you guys inspire me! Thank you! I am an old dude that picked up the guitar at 55. I am now 60 and love this guitar journey. Most the time both you guys are over my head, but love watching/listening.

[@petercheney8316]

I woke up with "Never Gonna Let You Go" in my head. Damn you, Rick Beato.

[@mitchyahr1424]

Love this video. I am one of the masses who picked up guitar during the quarantine, and this was very helpful on my development.

[@HerrMeier007]

I actually agree, I started playing 4 years ago and are now actually going to a music school working on my bachelors degree in music. When I started out, I mostly started because I discovered the old greats for myself like Gilmour, Page our Clapton and I wanted to play like them. It was actually incredible difficult to figure out where to start. Most of the stuffs I learned by ear, by just listening to the tracks over and over again, but a lot of the time I got some help from KZbin tutorials etc. I actually watched so many videos that I didn’t really know where to start when it came to applied theory and stuffs like that and especially gear. Being someone who started late I already earned some money on the side and could spend most of it on gear. So only 4 years in I had a total of 3 acoustics, 5 electrics, 2 practice amps, 2 tube amps, one profiled and god knows how many pedals. Mostly just because I always thought I need the best gear from the absolute information overload on KZbin. At the end of the day tho I think I couldn’t have learned that fast if it wasn’t for today’s tools and I probably wouldn’t study the thing I love right now if it wouldn’t have been for the thousands of hours of content I watched. Still there are so many things like a better ear and a better feel for rhythm which I have to work hard for now because I missed them the first time around. I guess it all has it’s ups and downs, but we can’t deny we live in a great age for guitar today!

[@carlboswell986]

I'm 63, and I would say there is never a time to quit learning! Good discussion from the two of you!

[@dcwyman49]

I think Rhett hit the nail on the head when he said discipline is key. What's the goal and how do I get there? Then staying on the path and keeping it simple.

[@bassmonsteradsit7160]

Well said @Rhett Shull and @Rick Beato. I'm in an age between you both. Born in the early 70's and started playing in the early 80's. I'm all ear, still to this day. When I have songs to learn for the Classic Rock band I play with here and there, I still listen to songs to learn them and use KZbin to watch peoples covers to pick up certain things that I just not catching. I've oft imagined what it would be like to start learning guitar, or any instrument for that matter, anytime within the last 10+ years with so much being available online. Ear training would fall to the wayside if left unattended or brought up in conversation, such as you both have.

[@secularZoo]

A Shull video from the Rick-Cave! can't wait

[@rylanhudson9319]

I can’t wait for the Rick cave to feature a video with nick cave!

[@MiketheNerdRanger]

I got my first electric this past May, started learning to play seriously this year. The "drinking through a fire hose" analogy is the most apt way to describe what it's like. There's *SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO* much information! What do I learn first? Where do I start? Where do I go next? Do I need this? *Don't* I need this?? It's driving me up a wall! So I'm really glad you guys were able to address this; helped a ton!

[@laughingatoblivion]

Interesting video, I like hearing peoples journeys through this stuff. In the UK in the 90's when I started learning guitar I used to buy guitar magazines that had tabs in them and then a CD with a version of the song to guide you. Often the CD's would also have the odd song by random artists as well. You basically had to go with what the magazine was giving you so you sort of got the best of both worlds. Exposure to random stuff you wouldn't normally listen to or try to play but also decent tab to help you play it. I sadly had a tendency to learn the verse or the hook and then didn't learn the rest and totally skipped any music theory that I deemed 'too hard', so I only feel like I became an 'intermediate' guitarist in the last few years when I started playing again after a 5 year break and really focused on expanding my knowledge of the instrument and filling in the gaps which the internet has definitely helped with. (I still never seem to bother learning songs though?)

[@dbvetter7485]

I started learning guitar in 1975, I agree, I had to figure out everything from listening to records over and over. But now I’m so thankful for KZbin and tablature.

[@TheStiefmeister7]

Everyone give Rhett a hand for this video...maybe an arm too...

[@mikesharpsongs]

At the very least, a new clavicle?

[@spikejones7450]

😅

[@Sleepgarden]

his appearance cost an arm and a leg. but there was a discount on the leg

[@philbert006]

Learning the guitar is a matter of practice and dedication. Of you don't have the drive to stick with it, it doesn't really matter when or where or how much information miss available. It comes from your heart and soul, and that's all there is to it, in my humble opinion.

[@morbidmanmusic]

Yes, always when more info is available, science.

[@jrlopez4341]

You are so right I was born in 59 and playing guitar for a long time since I’m seven years old all I Gotta say is everything I heard is from the album or fusion guitar teachers classical guitar teachers they taught me a lot you guys are awesome keep up the good work

[@anonymousforensic]

I’m 29. The internet became casually accessible in middle school. Cell phones trickled in through high school. Friends started all getting smartphones mid college. I feel like I came up with a diet of low quality pop music. If you didn’t have close friends or family pushing something else, I didn’t get exposed to it. I remember going to a traditional church service with a friend and studying the hymnal because what I was hearing was so interesting. No one around me played instruments. All music programs were cut in budget cuts from the schools I attended. No one was asking anyone to join a garage band. I started acoustic guitar in high school on a $100 epiphone, but definitely couldn’t afford a teacher. I would use Ultimate Guitar for tabs but they were almost always wrong and it was frustrating. I had one friend who also had a guitar and we struggled to jam together without just playing the exact same thing. I wasn’t really excited about any particular bands who relied on guitar, so I was aimless in my development of a personal tone. In college, I saw a FB post for a band that needed a bassist and bought a cheap bass that day. I learned the 4 notes I needed for the tryout and faked it enough to make it. I played with that band for 5 years. I learned everything I needed for that band from a Walking Bass Line book I found on Amazon. Now I learn from a mix of theory books and KZbin. It’s still pretty hard to connect with a band despite social media tools. Recording and gear is very accessible though. Spotify made it possible for me to go back and explore 50s, 60s, and 70s music. Different documentaries on Netflix and Amazon Prime got me stoked about bands or recording studios I didn’t know about before. I don’t know that it’s better or worse! I wish I’d had a better diet of music early to develop a more defined palette. I wish I’d been thrown in with other kids early and found the joy of jamming with others early on. I wish I’d been a super fan of guitar based bands way earlier on. I’d be a better musician for it, but I still have years of life left to learn, enjoy, and catch up!

[@kennethhoneycutt4513]

That was one of the best videos I've seen in a long time and it couldn't have come from two better people than from you two guys that is so awesome that you two got together and got the old school and new school perspectives I am an aspiring musician I have been trying to learn how to play guitar for a little over 20 years and both of you are right there's a lot more information but there's a lot more that one could get bombarded from as well thank you guys for your time and for sharing your knowledge and ideas with the rest of us I want to personally thank both of you

[@budgetguitarist]

Nostalgia doesn't change the fact that there's a billion times more info out there. How many 14 year olds could play Eruption in 1979? How many can now?

[@Mexxx65]

Probably the same amount of 14 year old prodigy's in 1979 could too, just that you didn't have youtube to see them all back then.

[@budgetguitarist]

@@Mexxx65 I think the players back then likely had the same talent level - what they didn't have was someone to teach them. When Eruption came out, there wasn't a guitarist in my small town who had a clue what Eddie was doing. Once you learn what he's actually doing, it's hard but not as hard as you think.

[@jamiemarsden3823]

rock is shite the electric guitar is shite anything other then a decent electro-acoustic should be used as a smash'it'up end piece lmao

[@bradwebber3211]

@@jamiemarsden3823 your a tool

[@jamiemarsden3823]

@@bradwebber3211 your a tool.🙄🤣

[@felixp535]

Having a real guitar teacher actually pointing out bad habits / things you're playing incorrectly on a technical standpoint is actually very important. Not mandatory, but helps a lot, especially when trying to speed up you guitar playing. I have this very bad habit of moving might left hand fingers wayyyy to much, especially the pinky, but now I'm aware of it, and trying to find solutions. Watching tutorials is very helpful (and most of the time free!), but it's nothing like having a real dedicated guitar teacher with lots of experience.

[@tszegvary]

I learned guitar in the 80s and early 90s. Tabs: crap, agree. Resources to build a comprehensive understanding of music: scarce! Today, it's very easy to find resourced to explain theory and many other things music (see Rick's channel). Don't think there is a better or worse - it's all how you decide how to use all the resources available. Listen to people like Rick and Rhett, but make up your own path to learn music.

[@t3hgir]

I like tablature. Should it be the only way you learn songs/licks and approach the guitar? of course not.

[@tszegvary]

@@t3hgir me too! Sorry, I meant I agree the quality was crap in the 90s. Today tabs are great! I transpose music, too and share with the community. Standard is high nowadays!

[@ryanwilson5936]

@@tszegvary Listening to incorrect tabs on GuitarPro will always be a favorite past time of mine lol.

[@ronniechun-akana6433]

Ronnie C.A., I am 70 yrs. old. Learned music by ear. My family didn't have much in way of record player so music was learned from A.M radio. I had a Kay guitar that was so hard to play and my music book was Mel Ray Chords. I did my best. Still playing and learning. And "Old School" no effects. Love both of your guys and perspective. Thank you.

[@timothynemecek]

The issue isn’t the learning tools, it’s the volume of information and a lack of focus because people are inundated with information. Then we dabble in concepts and techniques without mastery as we hop between ideas in an endless loop. This is because content is about consumption, not really learning to mastery.

[@acousticguitars123]

Im 48 and I can tell you that it is so much easier to learn today with all the free videos! All I had was a few guitar lessons to try and run with but I guess that could be kind of too much information in the beginning

[@farqueleyou7578]

Yeah most of the boomer legends here probably don't condone but if it wasn't for ultimate guitar and guitar pro my learning process would have taken a lot longer, plus sight reading is fun af

[@ryansnydercg]

Yes - easier to learn specific things, harder to learn in general

[@bernieorbust6104]

Excuses excuses

[@ryansnydercg]

@@bernieorbust6104 hey man you don’t know what you don’t know.

[@newgunguy4176]

Bingo!

[@newgunguy4176]

@@ryansnydercg 2nd.

[@johnnorris1983]

Who said learning should be easy.. Intuitive. Brain widening. This should be easy.. Make it fun...

[@vince8081]

True, i find wonderful today that i could find any tabs, informations or videos to learn a song, BUT i really devellop my ears by translating directly from the CD or cassette (start guitar in 92). I can now translate anything just by ear it, to me that's the real treasure i will keep to the end. Great video guys.

[@WilliamHaisch]

“I did not have downloadable relations with that online service.” - Rhett Shull

[@RobsSchoolofMusic]

Dude! This is the convo we had on clubhouse a few months back.

[@LD10000]

I had to play a record and listen for the open "E" or "A" to tune the guitar to get it close. My friends and I would go back and forth on how to play a song. Yes, to get the right fingering you would have to "trial and error". I would figure something out then see a friend or cover band play the same song and the fingering was different, frustrating... basically you had to focus more... NOW, there are a bunch of people online playing songs incorrectly, then there is something on the sidebar to distract when the patience level is maxed out. The plus side is, there are experts, like on this video, that share correct knowledge. Stay away from that sidebar...

[@IanOPadrick]

I'd say there are more and more people playing it the easy way. I don't think there's a wrong way to play a piece of music, as long as the notes are in the right order. Like, sheet music for guitar doesn't have what string to play, just the note. And you can play the note of the open high E in 5 places on a standard tuning guitar. As for the side bar, I agree. Websites are designed to maximize clicks so more ads will play so that the site makes more money, and this is leading to a lessening of the average attention span

[@joejones9520]

in 2014 when I first used a guitar tuner, the clamp on kind, I realized Id never been in tune, not like I now could be, and it's so fast, ahh, I used to get so frustrated sometimes tuning up that Id give up for the day.

[@SteveHatzman]

I like the information that is out there today. I’ve picked up my guitar after not playing for 20 years and have learned more in the last couple months than I ever knew before.

[@Benry1]

Haven’t watched the whole thing yet, but I believe the same people who would have been good at music 100 years ago are the same people who get good today. There’s so many resources that anybody can go on KZbin and learn the basics today, and that is fantastic. But you don’t become an expert by watching 10k hours of KZbin videos, you become an expert by getting lost in the sounds of your instrument for 10k hours! There’s way more beginners today than ever before but the same cream will always rise to the top

[@DJC955]

Learning songs is such a powerful tool. I started out by playing along to songs. You learn how to use techniques in a practical way.

[@Funkybassuk]

“Musical” kids don’t play in bands with other people anymore. They have entire recording studio set-ups in their bedrooms and play 5 instruments badly and continually put out half-arsed videos. The best way to learn is by playing with people who are better than you and having live shows coming up. Nothing forces you to improve like sucking badly in public.

[@ExpatZ266]

Sadly that is true for musical old farts these days as well. A lot of that has to do with the massive loss of music venues and live music in pub and bars over the last 2 decades. What band stays together when there are only 8 places to play spread out over 200 miles and several hundred bands not playing either in the same area for the same reason? Not much incentive there to deal with moody band mates two or three times a week when i can just sit down any time of day or night in my office and record something I came up with. But then I am in my 50's and have some modest skill on the guitar and enough musical experience to not sound bad on the bass and keys.

[@the_instinct3788]

@@silent5486 Sadly, yes

[@TheGrelots]

Playing in church took my playing up in magnitudes.

[@srfhdx5584]

I’d rather play 5 instruments well enough for non musicians to think I’m good than be a master of one

[@TheGrelots]

@@srfhdx5584 I think if you do production of any kind then learning any instrument thourougly will improve your ear and make putting ideas down easier, but if it's just a hobby then of course keep it fun.

[@skellzzed8255]

As someone who is learning music today this video was very helpful in offering a more enlightened perspective.

[@glassslide]

Yes, the availability today is incomparable to anything that existed previously.

[@chrisbauman2562]

Thats why no good music is made

[@glassslide]

@@chrisbauman2562 None?

[@chrisbauman2562]

@@glassslide i havent heard one catchy original rock,classic rock, anything that has a guitar,since early 00's.

[@rogerbarreto2846]

@@chrisbauman2562 tim henson from polyphia has got your back

[@chrisbauman2562]

@@rogerbarreto2846 yaaaa try guthrie govan bud. Watch any interview with him, he says exactly the same stuff i say. And its a huge difference in listening to an actual master with any sound he wants vs tim that talks like he's the best thing god produced but can only play his own songs and one trick pony

[@AzSamad]

This is such a good discussion. I started learning guitar in 1996 and it was mostly from friends, books guitar magazines first, then via weekly classical guitar lessons. Everything I listened was on CDs or cassettes too, so listening was more focused. With all the streaming platforms now, things have changed a lot. Access is great, but choice paralysis can really stop us. Thanks for the video Rhett & Rick!

[@mrjljjl]

It's like a taking a drink of water from a fully opened fire hydrant way too much access to information and too many distractions

[@mikewoods6697]

Guys--thanks for the advice and encouragement. I am a lapsed player, who left my playing days as a teen and joined the real world (or the Matrix, I'm not sure which). i have been an avid follower of music ever since. Rick and I share love of classic performances from our youth (JM, Steely Dan, etc.). Approaching retirement, I am moved by my fallen hero Chick Corea's admonition to keep playing music. I will definitely be using both your channels as the course work for my future study. Thank you Rhett also for a fresh and clear headed appraisal of current gear. It is appreciated.

[@tothefieldsmusic4553]

"Alright, kid, we can either afford to get a stereo or a guitar. If we get you this guitar, you're going to have to be the stereo."

[@neiladdison5614]

Ooooh... this is such an interesting conversation! I think KZbin is an absolute blessing and I have improved much more over the last few years,(having picked up my guitar for the first time in about 15yrs), than I did previously using tab books etc. You do have to be careful though. There are huge amounts of channels that will teach incorrect info or bad habits and the KZbin rabbit hole can lead to watching lots of videos rather than playing/practising guitar. Also, there are a lot of people with lots of gear that can lead you to believe that you ‘need’ certain stuff to progress - largely untrue. Another massive plus for today though is the staggering amount of great quality, affordable gear that is now available. The Squier Classic Vibe range, PRS SE stuff, Epiphone bossing it... Katanas and their competitors, TC pedals.... the list goes on. If you find gear inspiring then now is a great time! If you find it daunting then ‘now’ is a mine field!! Bottom line is that I am enjoying playing guitar such a huge amount and channels such as these inspire me daily. I have got to a point now though where I think I am going to invest in a lesson a month or something in order to gather direction in my playing. There will never be a complete substitute for an actual, real life teacher.

[@md7306]

I learned how to play the "Let It Be" album note for note at about 12 . My older sister said now try " black magic woman" thats too hard for a little kid. I took the record every day after school till I masteredit and 43 years later i know it like my social security number because of her challenge!

[@klee_of_c8082]

Great story! Great song!

[@vox1003]

Virtually anyone can learn those songs

[@adam_mawz_maas]

@@vox1003 Virtually anybody can learn most songs as long as they put the time in. The number 1 reason people fail at learning anything is lack of consistent practice.

[@richardstones6445]

I am 67. I began playing in 1969 and played for 26 years. Then I stopped and didn't play again until the beginning of 2023 when I retired. After nearly 25 years of not playing, re-learning was almost a "beginners" experience (although, I was amazed at how enduring and persistent guitar "muscle memory" was in some ways). My objective now is really to just learn songs and develop a repertoire to enjoy myself. Having experienced both "eras" personally, I can say with confidence that learning today with the internet is a huge blessing and makes it 1000 times easier... I know there is some content that is crap and may actually hinder you, but it's pretty easy to know the good from the bad. Thank you both for being "the good ones"!

[@nahuel6136]

I don't like it when I'm watching a cover from a small channel and someone's asking for tabs, a lot of guitar players depend too much on tabs.

[@Guitarplayer724]

Exactly, That's one of my pet peeves. A guy is providing a free tutorial on a song and someone asks if he can provide tabs too. Some people don't want to put any work into it at all.

[@TallicaMan1986]

@Vexxter it's not that we have time for guitar. Its we MAKE that time.

[@TallicaMan1986]

@Vexxter and that's exactly my point. Youre doing all of that. You pretty much only have yourself to blame. You literally have nothing to complain about if you have no time. That's 100% on you.

[@tedparkinson6892]

@@TallicaMan1986 ha ha, good theory. I play guitar every day, but with a full time job and family obligations, there is only so much time. And then what to practice? Playing and singing covers for an open mic? Learning a new jazz standard and soloing? Playing a bit of classical? Working on my blues finger picking? And then I also play keyboard which has its own set of things to play and practice.....

[@Nomad_za]

Great video! I love how Rick says that one should learn to play songs before you learn technique. My x told me that I was being stupid by learning to play my favourite songs and she made me feel terrible when ever I played guitar.

[@danieljensen2626]

Lol, tabs are STILL wrong a lot of the time. I usually find myself looking them up to get the gist, but fixing the details by ear. I also change fingerings a lot because the way that works for other people isn't necessarily what works for me.

[@pvandervalk]

Totally agree about learning songs. And if you can do it, learn them by ear. It's really tuned up my ears and has been my saving grace on many occasions.

[@davyboy9397]

Something I would like to see from all these virtuoso KZbin guitarist is how well they can play with a band ? They are amazing solo players but how good is their team playing skills? Would like to see more of them play live with a band. Edit: Rick and Rhett are super accomplished session gig musicians, I'm not talking about them.

[@dougsteeleguitar]

Agreed. Yes you can burn, write a goddamn song that rocks!! Play that song live!! Move around!!

[@mrgslearningvideos9197]

Best and most applicable comment on KZbin guitarists I've ever read.

[@lebe220]

Michael Palmisano just got invited to play onstage. Did a good job, I suppose.

[@davyboy9397]

@@lebe220 I don't know who that is. I'll check him out

[@johnchristie298]

All excellent points Lads! I started playing in 1966, Mel Bay. Started playing dead music and Allmans and top 40 by 1968 (and Guitar Masses). We used to go into music stores that had books and sheet music and memorize a verse of the song so we could play it, did that with Brown Sugar ahahah, anyway, I used to put the turntable in between 33 and 45 so I could slow down solos and learn them. For some reason tuning was never an issue?? But I can remember seeing a band play the CSN version of Woodstock and it instantly clarified where I should play it on the neck. KZbin helps with that. So much content..........thanks guys

[@deepspacetheater]

A good friend of mine once lamented that he couldn't do smokin' blues-rock solos like his friends could, and consequently he felt like the lamest guitarist on his local circuit. "Give me a break," I said. "Who's the one who has taught himself to play acoustic pieces in the styles of Jan Akkerman and John Renbourn? Who's the guy who can play in the styles of James Taylor, Justin Hayward and Neil Young? YOU'RE THAT GUY. Imagine how those blues rockers feel when they see you do that!? So, I think you have less to complain about and a lot more to be proud of." We are individuals in a creative realm that has rules of logic but few other rules that are worth a damn.

[@jacobstrickland5825]

I have been playing for 3 years and have only checked tabs to make sure I am in the right tuning. I find a song or an album and sit down and play until I can't anymore. I have compiled a style from everything I have listened to. I am also lucky to have a band class which teaches me the theory I need to know. Tbh i have no idea what im doing on guitar i just play until i get something i like and record it and write it down. This channel is also my motivation when i have given up

[@DaddySantaClaus]

Ahhh, That old saying "smooth seas never made good sailors"

[@mspirit]

Made a lot of progress in recent years thanks to KZbin. I stagnated a lot when I was young. This are examples of great guitarists and therefore the learning process they have in mind shows their gift and commitment. It's like they take the adversity of their experience has a positive but it's all it is, it's their experience has crazy talented guitarists. For most people if you don't show them the way they will get lost. That's why guitar teacher were and still are important.

[@dudley509]

I gave up on KZbin, I felt no direction. Who's going to keep you from bad habits that are hard to break. I am taking lessons from a great teacher, I have come so much further and enjoy learning so much more. The Interaction is what was needed.

[@billregan1981]

Good video Rhett! I’ve been getting back into guitar after not playing much the past 10 years or so. I started in the late 90s, had a band in college, but then life happened and just didn’t play much. Have really been enjoying getting back into it but it’s crazy the amount of information out there on a platform like YT nowadays and easy to get sidetracked and junk around too much. And the comparison thing…ugh. It’s the thief of joy. I too regret not having a teacher when I was younger. I winged it too much!

[@unacuentadeyoutube13]

I'm a 14 year old child who has been playing since July 2020. I'm into rock from the 70's and I enjoy some 80's too thanks to the electric guitar my mom found and gave me as a gift. I love Led Zep and so my mum does, so some of the first riffs I learned were from them (heartbreaker, blackdog, whole lotta love). Every night I go to the dining room where's the laptop with a guitarplug in downloaded and I play for her. Now I'm learning the second solo of Comfotably Numb, her favourite PF song and I think mines too. While I was playing, she turned his head and said the greatest compliment she could ever say: I though you were listening to the actual song to understand it first. I also love Deep Purple and Rainbow (I love Blackmore's playing and both bands), so I'm interested in learning some exotic scales as you said (Hungarian Minor for example). I also feel overwhelmed from time to time with all the videos I watch: what song I'm learning next, what price/quality gear should I buy, etc. This video helped me a lot. From now on, I'm just going to focus on learning a few things, but doing it accurately and concisely. I'll try to develop my ear too. I found some tabs for blackdog, but it doesn't sound like the original. I'll listen to it over and over again, especially the lower run at the end of the intro riff. Thank you very much. You helped a guy right here!

[@Peeper1849]

Love this stream......mom bought me that first guitar from Montgomery Wards. brought it home at 5:00 pm from work.....Locked myself in my bedroom......came out at 8:00 that night and played 3 songs for them...easy ones...but it was all about the songs!

[@2dazetake]

Rick is the fire station,not just another hoser, the man is multi instrumentalist, with a wealth of information, he's definitely paid his dues, and has years of practice, experience, and a passion for music,he deserves to stand up for himself, in his battle with the fair use algorithm's he still faces to this day, he's an extraordinary teacher, thumbs up Rhett.

[@joethebar1]

When I heard the call to play bass back in 85, I’d already dabbled with the trumpet for a couple years. Had a piano lesson when I was a young kid. Even had one drum lesson when I was 7. With bass, the first thing I worked on was technique and timing. And I learned songs- thousands of them. I studied how the chords and notes worked together. I had a Handful of lessons when I first started the bass; I guess I was gifted because my teacher told me to stop coming- he felt i would figure it out on my own. I wish he didn’t do that- I learned some things the hard way.

[@Svtjdc04]

Great video! 8years ago I bought a cheap guitar from a local pawn shop, apparently the previous owner didn’t take care of it and it very difficult to play.... last month I picked it back up and made a deal with myself, If I learned to play two songs I’d buy myself a brand new guitar.... simple two cord songs... I’ve been practicing every other day (due to fingers being sore) but the girlfriend says I’ve made some improvements so that’s my motivation..... I do however want to learn musical theory! But I think being able to fall back on something you can play will be inspiring to continue the journey.... Long story short I want to thank you guys and others like you on these social platforms for the time you take to teach us!

[@fallsarian5371]

This is spot observation! I'm trying my best to Segway into the next tier of playing, but I'm trying to be concise and organized on how I approach the process.

[@IvanBassist]

Great discussion! Hope your shoulder heals quickly!