Episode 056: James Boulton on Bessie Blount | Renaissance English History Podcast

[@anncorsaro224]

I understand that Bess Blount’s boy was illegitimate. But if Henry was powerful enough to break with Rome and change his nation’s religion, why couldn’t he just “legitimize” the boy?

[@Dee-xy1xk]

The people rejected The actions of HVIII. The nobility were paid off or killed.

[@ElizzzaB]

He was about to but his son died, of pneumonia.

[@lemongrabloids3103]

I always wonder what would have happened if Fitzroy had survived…. Considering both Mary and Elizabeth were both bastardised but then later became Queen

[@sidoniewinterpasternak9938]

Mary and Elizabeth were born from the legal, albeit disputed, marriages. Even if legitimized, it would be highly improbable that the nobles would ever accept the "true bastard" Fitzroy as their king

[@gwinniboots]

Good question.

[@sodoffbaldrick3038]

Bessie Blount and Mary Boleyn were both my 13th great-grandmothers, so thank you for this.

[@britgirl70]

Just found out Bessie is my 12x grandmother too!

[@juliagetty-gordon2500]

I'm not sure how she fits into my ancestry..but she married Edward Clinton , whom my family is related to..! Just learning about all of this, so fascinating!

[@NikNak500]

@sodoffbaldrick3038 I'm also a direct descendant of Bessie's-Hi!

[@ssmele]

Actually, though her first pregnancy ended in a miscarriage, her second pregnancy ended in giving birth to a healthy son. He lived for 6-8 weeks, and died from sids? I’m surprised people so often don’t realize this about Catherine of Aragon.

[@edithengel2284]

Catherine's babies couldn't all have been SIDS deaths, though. There were both miscarriages and stillbirths among them.

[@linharvey9177]

Bessie Blount's mother Catherine Peshall was the daughter of Sir Hugh Peshall, who was one of Henry Tudor's bodyguards during the Battle of Bosworth Field. He was then knighted on Bosworth Field by Henry.

[@marijaneflore372]

I'll add that to the family ancestry ❤️❤️

[@johannashiels-cy3cz]

Wow isnt history amazing i love it........

[@karenlacaille5608]

@@marijaneflore372 ok she is in my family too .grandmother is a Blount. From USA James a Blount is my Gandfather he can’t to the USA??? 1600

[@annbotley8453]

@@karenlacaille5608£

[@juliagetty-gordon2500]

Me tooo thru her third husband Edward Clinton

[@margaretlouise6200]

Anne Boleyn allegedly said that Henry had neither the skill nor the physical ability to "please a woman." Ouch. Not exactly the character painted in Starz "The Tudors" who kept them all panting, bosoms heaving. If Anne's comment had got back to Henry....well.....

[@ivyrose779]

If I remember correctly, the issue of Anne discussing problems in the bedroom with her brother’s wife, Jane, came up in her trial. I believe her brother, George, was given a note about it to read and answer questions about during his testimony. He was told to not read it out loud since it would be embarrassing to the King, but he did read it out loud anyway. I wish I could’ve been there to see all of their faces when he did that!

[@amandadassonville4043]

I think by the time he got to Anne he was just about done and quite gross, being fat and that stinking leg..... Not in the best of health at all. 🐝

[@veronicamaine3813]

Fun fact this is James Blunts ancestor.

[@Odanti]

Great biography of Bessie Blount. I enjoyed it very much. ❤️🙏❤️

[@ryanblount6216]

Very interesting and very important to me as I have always wondered about my heritage

[@NikNak500]

I know we traced our family back to Bessie many years ago, but this is the first real information I've seen about her. Very interesting!

[@johnday6392]

Excellent. Very informative video about this beautiful but little known lady.

[@beth7935]

If Henry VIII could have legitimised Henry Fitzroy & made him his heir, then couldn't he have done the same with Henry Carey, if Henry Carey was indeed his son? Or would it have been legally impossible since Mary was married to William Carey when he was born? From what I've read, a child born to a married woman was legally her husband's child by default. (Barring impossibilities like the husband being in another country). Could Henry VIII have changed that law, as he did so many others?

[@margaretlouise6200]

I'm sure Henry could make any laws he felt like making, although after his death a bastard heir made legal would be all too convenient an excuse for someone contesting the throne and perhaps war to settle it. It's another form of: "You can dress em up but you can't take em out..." Or maybe lipstick on a pig.

[@sheilaleslie1323]

The wars of the Roses was still in living memory. Some of the issues had been about illegitimacy. The Titulus Regius had declared Edward the V and his brother illegitimate. Edward IV’s parentage had been questioned (even his mother didn’t contest it). The line from John of Gaunt n Katherine Swinford had been barred from the succession for the same reason. Some historians even question the legitimacy of Henry VII’s father. Henry was only the second king in the Tudor succession and their claim was on shaky foundations. I think this is why Henry was so desperate for a legitimate son n heir.

[@Dee-xy1xk]

The people would NOT accept a string of bastards. And the nobility were killed or paid off.

[@edithengel2284]

I think the fact that Mary was married to another man would have made it a legal nightmare--the child of adultery and legally the son of William Carey. That is, if Henry Carey was Henry's son.

[@freshwater2101]

I find a facial resemblance in this miniture you title Bessie Blount and the miniture of Henry Viii's son Henry Fitzroy. As Henry Fitzroy's mother this would make sense that it is Bessie Bount. She was held in high regard by Heny Viii

[@chiasanzes9770]

Henry had More than Two mistresses. There's a video done by historian of Henry's women. Elisabeth Blunt is only most known because she was supposed to be a great beauty.

[@businessfinancecoach]

I don’t think her looks had anything to do with it…. It was that male she birthed!

[@amandadassonville4043]

I don't think there would've been a son if she was ugly! 🐝

[@satsumamoon]

So , name one fact about Henry VIII....he was a tosser a real piece of work , was the first thing that came to mind 2) He died eating a surfeit of eels. 3) Non-such Palace 4) He wore cool clothes and large suits of armour. 4) He got rid of religious buildings , some he "gave" to "friends" .

[@edithengel2284]

He wasn't the eel-eater. That was Henry I (also said of King John).

[@wiscochic861plutochic5]

James VIII was my 15th great grand uncle. Margaret Tudor his sister was my 15th great grandmother. It is interesting to learn more about my anscestors thank you for your wonderful videos.

[@julianolan2860]

I am very interested in the changes to Petty Treason as regards wives killing their husbands!! I saw a video about Angel Makers that referred to a Poor Law in the early 1880s that denied any assistance to women pregnant out of marriage and absolved any man from responsibilities to the upkeep of the child as well as the State assistance?? Combined with the treason laws it means the legal place of women was dire!! How differently were these laws from those for slaves? Thank you for your carefully insightful talks. Regards from Australia- Julia Nolan

[@annbotley8453]

How different our nations history would have been if Henry & Katherine had produceda boy who 😅 27:26 lived to inherit the throne. England would probably still be a cathlolic nation

[@nativetexan53]

I didnt know the bou died so young. I wondered why he was mentioned in history but then nothing! Thank you for solving the mystery.

[@kimberlyperrotis8962]

The English surname Blount is actually pronounced as Blunt, not Blownt.

[@musicloverlondon6070]

I read somewhere that the singer, James Blunt, is descended from her.

[@dianepayne1102]

Bessie may not have been the first woman to bear Henry a son . Other mistresses were married women and therefore their children would have been viewed as being their husbands child. Bessie was different though , because she was single and so there was could be no doubt about who fathered her child .

[@haileypike1213]

what are your sources? I've become interested in Bessie blounts story and would love to read more about her.

[@julieblackstock8650]

try Bessie Blount by Elizabeth Norton.

[@bridgettehutton646]

Bessie Blount had a son for Henry VIII while he was married to Catherine of Aragon. Henry accepted him and named him Henry Fitzroy, meaning son of the King. He died when he was about 17 years old.

[@juliagetty-gordon2500]

Bessie married Clinton, whom. Related to...so interesting..just learning

[@OurBucketListHasHoles]

Thank you Heather💜

[@mimimatasar3699]

So interesting! Thanks 👍

[@johnsax1445]

Blesses Blessee Bessie Blount

[@sherryd3299]

Bessie is not mentioned until 11 minutes in.

[@dorriegalea6449]

Not much about Old Bessie Blount

[@marijaneflore372]

Found out she my great grandmother ❤❤❤

[@AnnetteMurphyger]

?

[@anncorsaro224]

Thank you. I pressed SEND right before you answered he question.👍😁

[@lisaparker5836]

What about Ann Bolyn's cousin (Madge) that she asked to "take care" of Henry's needs while she was pregnant? Or was that just creative license of "The Tudors" from Showtime?

[@averyross4481]

Was Jane Seymore not also his mistress at one point? He was also linked to Marguerite Of Nevarre no?

[@edithengel2284]

No, Jane held out for marriage, and Marguerite would have laughed at him.

[@elizabethsmith4556]

The picture on the front of this video is not of Bessie Blount but of Mary Boleyn, sister of Anne. Such a fundamental mistake does not bode well for the accuracy of this publication.

[@hteysko]

conorbyrnex.wordpress.com/2013/01/22/a-portrait-of-bessie-blount-c-1500-1539/ People will argue about this portrait as long as the sun rises, I'm sure. That article is by an expert and lays out the reasons why this is a historically accepted portrait of Elizabeth (and particularly why it is very likely NOT Mary... The reasons are compelling), and I certainly wouldn't call using it as such a fundamental mistake 😂. I stand behind my work, but you don't have to, Elizabeth. That's why we're all taught to research, and practice critical thinking. If you decide it really is Mary (especially after reading that article!) then more power to you, but please don't try to insult me by saying it's a fundamental mistake. If it's such a fundamental and basic mistake there would be no need to argue about it, would there?

[@sharonanne6293]

Elizabeth Smith ..What is ur source for saying its Mary Boleyn.. Iv never seen this portrait before saying its Mary

[@elizabethsmith4556]

@@sharonanne6293 tudorfaces.blogspot.com/2011/10/two-new-faces-hornebolte-portraits-of.html I find the Roland Hui arguement convincing. Sorry to be so long replying but have not been online. The portrait has had a number of attributions through timeand cannot be definately said to be Bessie Blount.

[@elizabethsmith4556]

@@hteysko No insult intended, but to state as definate something which is actually controversial gives me no confidence in the text. History, being written by the winners and spun thru time is often presented as truth tho in fact simply opinion.

[@nancybeveridgetaylor3256]

@@elizabethsmith4556 your misspelling of the words argument and definite when calling a well researched portrait into question calls your "research" into question as well. 😉

[@sheilalopez3100]

I think he abandoned them when they became pregnant. And, like Mary Bolyn he didn't acknowledge them as his own.

[@LeoBrightLight]

He acknowledge his son with Blount and named him after his name. He even introduced him to everyone in several ocassions

[@sheilalopez3100]

@@LeoBrightLight sure he gave him a Duke. But Mary's daughter, he didn't even acknowledge. Of course, he would acknowledge a son. That goes without saying. Anyone who knows anything about Henry VIII' knows he was the world's biggest. Chauvenist.

[@LeoBrightLight]

@@sheilalopez3100 that’s exactly my point, so don’t mention Mary Blount’s treatment like Mary’s. Mary had a sigh plights and was just a time pass, with no respect at all. While he did gave a little respect to Blount and grant Blount’s husbands handsome rewards and land. She was never poor. Unlike Mary who suffered poverty.

[@sheilalopez3100]

I was referring to Mary Bolyn ( I never speii that right so bare with me). He loved Bessie, he dumped Mary.

[@sheilalopez3100]

@@LeoBrightLight it's Bessie not Mary.

[@savannahmanzone3394]

Why didn't Henry the 8th marry Bessie Blount

[@Dee-xy1xk]

The people would NOT accept a string of bastards. The nobility were killed or paid off.

[@ElizzzaB]

He was married to Catherine of Aragon at the time.

[@annsutherland6553]

Very good enjoyable

[@tonyinuae]

The name is actually pronounced 'Blunt' as in the adjective.

[@julieblackstock8650]

very interesting.

[@MiaTheodoratus]

Please name the musicians….if it’s there I didn’t see it

[@josephcollins6033]

Help! All of my life I have read that Bessie was the owner of a bar!!! Gentry!! Not what I thought. Of whom am I thinking?!!!!! Thanks.

[@TinaVirgilio]

🎉great !

[@valeriejane5054]

AMEN THANK YOU LORD GOD AMEN AMA

[@user-lq1yt8hm2t]

我喜愛喝一些Europe 進口的水果茶葉，很少drink coffee！

[@Cate7451]

Good

[@Lulu-ut9pv]

Bessie showed she was able to birth "healthy children" and could have ligtamized" HF by marrying his mother Its sad that so many children died before their 3rs birthday and the same is said with women dieing from child bed fever

[@penelopejarecke3821]

Yes, it must have been heartbreaking to be a parent in those days.

[@edithengel2284]

Henry was married to Catherine of Aragon at the time.

[@Lulu-ut9pv]

@@edithengel2284 yes but when Bessie became a widow .. he could have married her

[@edithengel2284]

@@Lulu-ut9pv He could have. But I think he thought he could marry Anne Boleyn and have a legitimate son, and that he could perhaps legitimize Henry F. later, if he needed to. Henry F. was Plan B, I guess.

[@Lulu-ut9pv]

@@edithengel2284 yeah, when he divorced Anne of cleaves she was technically available too.... But by then he was fascinated by Catherine Howard

[@user-lq1yt8hm2t]

除非是淡的coffee！

[@sharonanne6293]

This was good so i went to the queens of England podcast, that was good till he got talking about how so called professional historians should use quotes to where they got their sources from. He finds it annoying Alison Weir doesnt put where her quotes come from. Does he realise who Alison Weir is? Who is he?? Where is his sources for this little chat?

[@wildliferox2]

Wikipedia advises 'Alison Weir is a British author and public historian. She primarily writes about the history of English royal women and families, in the form of biographies that explore their historical setting. She has also written numerous works of historical fiction.' And there lies the difficulty. Inference, narrative or plain fiction is not the same thing as recorded evidence.

[@wildliferox2]

I would add Alison Weir is highly respected as an author and on this period, but I do agree, its important to know what is historically recorded, what is inferred and what might otherwise remain poetic licence.

[@birgittebernstein9167]

He is stille right! No matter “who Alison Weir is”.

[@aprildysart3791]

Guy is

[@mentak2593]

For some reason, I always thought “Bessie Blount” sounded like a Tudor-era stripper name.

[@nazlsenay7312]

...

[@maureenoneill2847]

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