God: An Anatomy, with Francesca Stavrakopoulou and Andrew Copson | Humanists UK In Conversation With

[@njhoepner]

I just finished reading God: An Anatomy. For all the decades I was a Christian I thought I read the Bible deeply, with my concordances and commentaries and such...but her book was an eye-opener. So many things I'd never noticed, so much context that I never grasped (even with my history degree). Great work!

[@stephenarmiger8343]

Thank you for having Francesca on your show. Many are in the angry atheist stage. Some will never move past it. I was stuck in it for quite awhile. People like Francesca and Bart Ehrman are giving us the gift of history.

[@MagickalDistruction]

As a Christian I love them and I love how they are bringing the people in good faith together who want to learn and live a life where we minimize harm!! ❤❤ hi from 2 years in the future

[@GAMINGBLAZE]

@@MagickalDistruction Jesus was a myth, Copy paste from Horus & Dionysus

[@isaacorozco6625]

"Insight into the ancient imagination" perfectly worded, that's why I find the bible so interesting as well even though I'm an atheist. It really is like time travel. Just ordered her book, can't wait to read it.

[@greglogan7706]

Issac, working with the bible really has nothing to do with one's faith when we realize it recognized it is both a historical document is a literary document expressing different ideas myths and so on of the authors... And in that sense it is all very real as are so many other ideas very real as long as we understand the fullness of what real is

[@edwardschneider6396]

" You believe in a book that has talking animals,wizards,witches,demons,sticks turning into snakes,burning bushes,food falling from the sky.People walking on water, and all sorts of magical,absurd and primitive stories, and you say that we are the ones that need help?"~ Mark Twain (1835-1910)

[@mmccrownus2406]

You believe in a universe out of nothing Life out of nothing... You strawman religions and fight the shallowest versions with no effort to go deeper

[@popeyedish]

@@mmccrownus2406 and you know absolutely nothing about the theory of evolution, abiogensis, science or atheism.

[@greglogan7706]

@@mmccrownus2406 Maybe if a deeper was ever presented - rather than simply arrogantly claimed - that would be most helpful

[@Markielee72]

@@mmccrownus2406 "You believe in a universe out of nothing. Life out of nothing". Now this IS a strawman.. The irony.

[@TheEvolver311]

@@mmccrownus2406 creation ex nihilo the explanation provided by the Abrahamic religions literally means out if nothing. That isn't a scientific claim it's a religious claim.

[@kori4580]

Francesca needs to write more books...I need her knowledge

[@StellaMontenegro]

*Brilliant Prof. Dr. Francesca Stavrakopoulou. Beauty and brains! ♥️ 🧠 🙌*

[@AdultDevelopmentInstitute]

Wouldn't you rather say brains first?

[@AdultDevelopmentInstitute]

@@StellaMontenegro - Maybe I think about it the other way around because I'm not very pretty ;)

[@tenniekomar6683]

After reading comments on about 10 videos of interviews of Dr. Stavrakopoulou, it is very concerning with the lack of belief that a woman can be both beautiful and brilliant. Her looks have nothing to do with her accomplishments. I wish men would just chill out on this topic. Often time they grow hateful of beautiful women with an intellect.

[@MrCanis4]

These billions of people now, and even these billions and billions of people who once lived and never believed in this god, those who couldn't know anything about this god, had satisfying and contend lives too. I'm pretty sure of that because I'm one of them.

[@horizons2358]

Yup, that's the reality!😑

[@macmac6817]

Atheism is a myth its not real. People claim it because either they're mad at God & or they love their sins. It takes more faith to believe in the atheist myth than believe in God the creator of the universe. Who could believe that nothing with no intelligence made the universe ? Time is running out for the lost. Cry out to God while you still breathe. Repent

[@MrCanis4]

@@macmac6817 so funny.

[@macmac6817]

@@MrCanis4 fake atheist give it away because they work so hard trying to prove it. They go as far as becoming professors in bible & traveling the Holy land. Lol They become mythology preachers even. The faith they have is tremendous. I will give them 1 positive thing & that is that they know more about the Word of God than the majority of mainstream Christians or the lukewarm churches of today.. Atheist try to be educated so they can be more convincing to others & to themselves of the myth. They do believe in God they don't fool me. Repent & obey Jesus & you will be the happiest person.

[@MrCanis4]

@@macmac6817 I don't believe there is a god as I don't believe Thor exists. If you can prove to me that Thor doesn't exist, then I can prove that your god doesn't exist. I just using the same method. If you can't prove that Thor doesn't exist. Then you don't have to require Atheists to be able to prove a negative. That would be very disrespectful. BTW: jesus? to me a meaningless person who may or may not have existed.

[@fpcoleman57]

Thank you for this. I've just bought a copy of her book. I'm grateful to her for promoting the study of the Bible for its own sake. I'm also an atheist and I love studying it. My reasons are: 1. Its primary importance in Western civilisation. The Bible is a profoundly important historical and cultural artifact. 2. Its continuing predominance in contemporary religious practice. 3. It rivals Homer's Iliad and Odyssey, the Maharashtra, the accounts of the pantheons of Greece and Rome, the Norse and Icelandic Sagas, the origin myths of China and Japan and others. The continuing cultural influence of these mythic stories is strong. So it deserves to be read and appreciated as great mythic literature.

[@lizlanman47]

I don't know. It's barbarous throughout. But I think that it's interesting to hear from an expert. I don't want to slog through it on my own.

[@fpcoleman57]

@@lizlanman47 I don't read the Bible as anything other than literature. It's fiction.

[@vanessachaland6805]

Great podcast. Love both of you. Defying the myths of atheism, two of the most genuine, nicest, sweetest, kindest, most benevolent and altruistic people on the planet...both extremely intelligent as well. :)

[@Flyingtwiglet]

Love this. Really added colour to the religious debate and helped me articulate why I’m a non believer. But also that doesn’t stop you benefiting from the messages and enjoying the stories within

[@slimytoad1447]

I'll have to get Francesca's book now, ive always thought shes fascinating to listen to,especially when shes questioned by people with religious certainty

[@barraadhi4802]

🤔 *kzbin.info/www/bejne/bZWUZ3amjNVgpc0* *The source called the SOUL needs to be highlighted as a most intriguing matter.*

[@utubepunk]

@@barraadhi4802 🥱🥱

[@ChloeRichardson19]

One of my earliest memories is asking Dad why there wasn't a picture of god in my bible. Super interesting to learn about what the original version of yahweh was meant to look like. A bit funny that in reality a depiction of him would've been too explicit for my children's bible. The fact that I have access to brilliant information like this makes me so grateful born in this era :) Subscribed!

[@vectorstain]

I just bought a copy myself. Prof. Francesca is a master of her craft, I wish I had the ability to enroll in some of her classes.

[@heidifarstadkvalheim4952]

So like her aprouch to this theme - and its so needed. Read the book in English, but whould have loved it to be translated in to Norwegian ( or Danish - easy to read for us). Thank you Prof Stavrakopoulous !

[@timetoreason181]

Loved every second of this. Love the book too, started and a long way to go. We need humanism for neglected and abandoned humanity not religions or god/s. Keep up your good work!

[@axilleas68di]

We love Francesca.

[@Tumbledweeb]

Got it on Audible today! Professor Starvrakopoulou is always FANTASTIC! Awesome sense of humor too! Thank you, Professor!

[@woodygilson3465]

Wait... There's an audiobook?! Does Prof S. narrate? I'm going to have to look into this now. Lol

[@Tumbledweeb]

@@woodygilson3465 There is an audiobook too! And yes; She's narrating it herself!

[@woodygilson3465]

@@Tumbledweeb I'm loving the book. The audiobook is going be a great addition, I think.

[@elvinjonas5451]

i found this book on Amazon as an audiobook in the US. Congratulations Professor!

[@idio-syncrasy]

Great academic. Will check out the book when I can.

[@oscarg7460]

fascinating. TY.

[@007KevinD]

love this

[@eduarchavarria]

I would absolutely fall in love with Francesca after a good conversation on Hebrew Bible....well, I think I'm in love now BEFORE that conversation

[@Whimswirl]

“Red” likely doesn’t refer to what we call red in English. In many parts of the non-western world (even in African American English) someone’s skin tone being red just means they have lighter skin. So light brown skin tone would be referred to being red or “redbone”.

[@carolmiller5090]

1 Corinthians 1:18 (NKJV) For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

[@jsnel9185]

Reading the Bible cured me of my belief in the Bible. I've met few christians who know what the bible says. They normally know what their teacher said.

[@tym7267]

41:37 Professor‘s grimace here makes me giggle a bit very interesting interview btw, hope we can hear more from Prof Stavrakopoulou in the future

[@raycosmic9019]

God = Life Jesus = Humane Humanity Christ = at One with Life Empty of ego (separateness) = Full of Life Holy Spirit = Eternally actualizing Infinite potential Dream it, feel it, do it.

[@bobbybright9334]

Wonderful women

[@robertsemple299]

Very interesting conversation. I definitely experienced god's wind.

[@raymondsciara]

So the serpent in the garden of Eden could be interpreted as Lillith returning to talk Eve into disobedience. It makes more sense to me than the serpent being Satan since the devil wants to destroy humankind, not use a subtle ploy to give god and her estranged husband the finger in an epic way.

[@ixmix]

A brilliant speaker... especially when she stresses her point of view... look at her eyes and teeth and lips movement ... amazing

[@jaypeterson3754]

I like Dr. Stavrakopoulou's innocence in her approach to dissecting the scriptures. Being an unbeliever, she does not have to un-learn what she has learned, but rather follow the evidence to wherever it leads. Platonic philosophy was popular in the later Rome era, and Christianity had split into scores of sects by about 200 CE with the Roman sect mixing Platonic philosophy therein. Constantine didn't legalize all of Christianity, rather only the Roman sect of Christianity which had neutered God.

[@ravenshadowz2343]

I found her book on Amazon but it has a red cover instead of this cover, anyone know why that is?

[@tenniekomar6683]

The American publisher changed the cover.

[@sparXKuijper]

Lovely juicy Braaiins 🧟‍😊💞🥇AWESOME book 🏆

[@antonyisaacs8242]

The word Life fits in very well instead of the word God in all aspects for the Universal being we are.

[@berglen100]

Neville would smile about consciences wrestle each other.

[@Historian212]

Not sure about her explanation of why people remove(d) their shoes before entering holy places, in many cultures. I don’t think that was about “connecting”; rather, it was about dirt. Everything from dust to excrement was part of the environment, and it makes much more sense that this is why one takes the shoes off. In Islamic tradition, one washes the feet, too, before entering the prayer room. This a more likely reason for that custom. Sometimes, dirt is just dirt.

[@RaysDad]

Okay, I've ordered the book, mainly because I want to know how Yaweh has aged. Was he born an adult? Does he look like an incredibly old man now, or does he remain young and handsome?

[@Larry_left_a_comment]

Exceptionalism

[@davidrandell2224]

“The Final Theory: Rethinking Our Scientific Legacy “, Mark McCutcheon something new under the sun!

[@CastleVaniak]

25:44 Did Francesca just let it rip?

[@williamsabado4750]

If there’s a video of how Moses parted the sea or Jesus Christ walking on water I’d like to see them please 😅

[@Tysto]

“We are monotheists, unlike those pagans. We have only one god, & also an evil spirit, & also the son of god, & the holy spirit, & the holy mother.”

[@russpearson9802]

I thought i was christian as a nieve kid, became an athiest as i got older and saw gaping holes in the gospel, and as an adult id call myself a agnostic, being rather open minded about who and why we are here, and im yet to settle on 1 individual idea of the human condition. I grew up in a plymouth brethren family. We were excommunicated and turned brethren, until a difference of opinions caused a parting of the ways, and we became open brethren. My fathers fire n brimstone sermons and hour long winded prayers were not appreciated, and we moved on to the gospel hallers, where we made a home. Talk about pius and hypocritical wankers. Lol. I have forgotten more of the bible than i can ever remember, ( i earnt my pocket money learning and reciting verses that were randomly chosen) and now having done considerable research, i believe the cover story of the bible is plagerised from other previous texts, but underneath there is a hidden code that tells the true story. One thing i can say is that the book of revelation has nothing to do with the return of christ.

[@juanfervalencia]

Was the dream dreamt by Isaiah or Ezequiel?

[@azish1000]

700 bc. Starting median Empire . United whit babilonian defit asurien. Its signifisen episode in that era.

[@redhammer1917]

25:35

[@redhammer1917]

Rip city fart who did it?

[@jesperandersson889]

one might almost say the idea of Augustine is at some fundamental level Jewish, we live in time we can imagine time, hence (obviously viscious cirle logic) think our way forward as one 'community' of 'believers' etc etc

[@johndavis9591]

When people use sheep droppings and camel droppings to fuel their cooking fire. I believe they had smoked something akin to mushrooms.

[@gunkwretch3697]

archaeologists found incense inside the holy of holies in the temple of Judah, it had dung and cannabis in it

[@jollyandwaylo]

Billions of people still burn dung for fuel today. I don't know what your comment is supposed to mean.

[@Historian212]

“Misogyny” is an anachronistic term when speaking of an ancient context. The question needs a much more nuanced take than is given here. This thumbs-up/thumbs-down approach is very culturally coded, and colors her discussion in a way that’s surprising for someone at her level.

[@mannersmatter6773]

But considering that there are many religions and they all have a God there are many Gods

[@je-freenorman7787]

Why are you not covered by main stream media?

[@pabloashan-deleon3088]

● My First QUESTION for; *FRANCESCA STAVRAKOPOULOU* 👇🏿 Was *PONTIUS PILATE*, who was, The Fifth Governor of the ROMAN Province of JUDAEA, and served under the Emperor, CAESAR AUGUSTUS a FICTIONAL Character in history or a FACTUAL Character in history ❓🤔💭

[@ciaran82359]

Factual character in a fictional gospel.

[@pabloashan-deleon3088]

@@ciaran82359 Penkethman Was "*JOSEPHUS*" a FICTIONAL Character in history or a FACTUAL Character in history ❓🤔💭

[@greglogan7706]

"The triune God Christianity presents - what a scam..." Right on!! I would like to note that not all christians buy into that scam...😇

[@elingeniero9117]

Arianism is a heresy. A false teaching. Check with any mainstream church.

[@greglogan7706]

@@elingeniero9117 Arianism denies Jesus of Nazareth - a MAN attested to by God - just like the hypostatic christology of trinitarianism does

[@slade8863]

Jesus is God bro

[@truthseeker8475]

"No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God (Spirit) and mammon (materialism)." (Matthew 6:24) Jesus is an avowed non-dual theist. He chose God over Mammon, and he wasn't disappointed. He succeeded where a compromising person fails i.e., he remained loyal to his faith in the existence in God and successfully proved the eternal nature of Spirit, and that eternal life does exist, by virtue of his resurrection. Well, as long as we live in a world of duality there will always co-exist these two divergent forms of "religious beliefs"- one theistic, the other atheistic. So long as duality exists, it's not possible to successfully maintain loyalty to opposites that the world of duality offers man. "I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live." (Deuteronomy 30:19). Man can choose only one of the two: Life or Death.

[@demesminp]

If I lived in UK, I swear I would make this woman my wife! I love when she crushes fundamentalists

[@happilyeggs4627]

Kind of like the Cerne Abbas giant.

[@LM-jz9vh]

"When we say…Jesus Christ…was produced without sexual union, and was crucified and died, and rose again, and ascended to heaven, ***we propound nothing new or different*** *from what you believe regarding those whom you call Sons of God. [In fact]…if anybody objects that [Jesus] was crucified, this is in* ***common*** *with the sons of Zeus (as you call them) who suffered, as previously listed [he listed Dionysus, Hercules, and Asclepius].* Since their fatal sufferings are all narrated as not similar but different, so his unique passion should not seem to be any worse." *Note how Justin (Martyr) is less of a fool than modern Christian apologists. He admits that differences don’t matter.* Since each and every one of the suffering and dying gods are slain by different means, one cannot argue the mytheme requires exactly the same means of death. “But Osiris can’t have inspired the Jesus myth because Osiris wasn’t nailed to a cross” is a stupid argument. The mytheme is simply death. Being killed. Suffering and dying. The exact mode of death can vary freely. It makes no difference to the existence and influence of the mytheme. It’s simply the particular instantiation of a generic abstraction. *And Justin’s argument (that Satan invented these fake religions to confuse people) entails Justin agreed the mytheme existed: indeed, it was demonically promulgated, multiple times. Intentionally.* *Likewise, Justin notices the mytheme is not virgin birth, but sexless conception. Of which many examples had already been popularized in pagan mythology (there just happens to also have been examples of actual virgin born gods as well). And by his argument (that the Devil was deliberately emulating the Jesus mytheme, in advance), Justin clearly accepted the same principle for “rising again” after death:* the particular exact metaphysics of the resurrection could, like the exact method of death or conception, vary freely. The mytheme consists solely of the abstraction: returning to life. Somehow. Some way. We will say bodily, at the very least. But what sort of body (the same one, a new one, a mortal one, an immortal one), didn’t matter. *If it had, Justin would have made the argument that “those gods” weren’t really resurrected. But that argument, never occurs to him. Nor did it to any other apologist of the first three centuries.* *Ancient Christians well knew there was nothing new about their dying-and-rising god. Not in respect to the mytheme.* Their claims were solely that his particular instantiation of it was better, and the only one that actually happened. *They didn’t make up the stupid modern arguments that dying-and-rising god myths didn’t exist or weren’t part of a common mytheme everyone knew about. For example, in the same century, Tertullian, in Prescription against Heretics 40, makes exactly the same argument as Justin. Funny that. They had better access to the evidence than we do. They knew what was really and widely the case. We should listen to them.* Google *"Dying-and-Rising Gods: It's Pagan, Guys. Get Over It. • Richard Carrier"* ------------------------------------------------------------------ Google *"Ehrman Errs: Yes, Bart, There Were Dying & Rising Gods - atheologica"* Watch *"Dying & Rising Gods: A Response to William Lane Craig"* by Derreck Bennett at Atheologica. Watch *"Asclepius: The Pre-Christian Healer & Savior"* by Derreck Bennett at Atheologica Google *"Virgin Birth: It's Pagan, Guys. Get Over It. • Richard Carrier"* Google *"5 Pagan Parallels to Jesus That Actually Aren’t Bullshit - Atheomedy"* Google *"Christian Apologetics: The Art of Deceit - Atheomedy"* Google *"Defending the Resurrection: It’s Easy if You Lie! - Atheomedy"* Google *"Majority of Scholars agree: The Gospels were not written by Eyewitnesses - Escaping Christian Fundamentalism"* A good site written by an actual Biblical scholar. Google *"Contradictions in the Bible | Identified verse by verse and explained using the most up-to-date scholarly information about the Bible, its texts, and the men who wrote them -- by Dr. Steven DiMattei"* Google *"How do we know that the biblical writers were* ***not*** *writing history? -- by Dr Steven DiMattei"* Also: Google *"How Did The Gospel Writers Know? - The Doston Jones Blog"* Google *"Yes, the Four Gospels Were Originally Anonymous: Part 1 - The Doston Jones Blog"* Google *"Gospels Not Written By Matthew, Mark, Luke or John - The Church Of Truth"*

[@open2626]

When people read the Bible and struggle with all of these inconsistencies and things that don't make any sense, just look for the seminal texts (Sumerian, Akkadian, Babylonian, etc) stories written thousands of years before the Bible. It explains, very overtly, that the deities they looked up to interacted with them on a daily basis! This translates to; these "gods" were beings just as we are, but had better knowledge/technology. I did not listen to this entire show but I am getting a jist here. She is an atheist, trying to make a point that fits her world view (this is just a bunch of made up stories by humans, only about humans...lol). I'm not a subscriber to any organized religion. This is not imagination! There is so much more to the Biblical stories (again read the Enuma Elish and/or Atrahasis). This is like someone doing a movie review about the story of (pick any movie that was remade decades later), how about Footloose? And then talking about how bad it (Footloose from late 2000s) was, without even acknowledging the original that was done in the '80's!

[@inyobill]

I suspect tha the good professor's book would be a good bit more interesting to me than the Bible.

[@bobbybright9334]

Jesus would be a freemason as described by his knowledge

[@secularfoundingperiodhistory]

I'm curious as to why Jesus was baptized if he was perfect to begin with and always perfect I thought baptism was for sins and repentance what was Jesus repenting for and what was his sins this is just getting more ridiculous the more I think about it

[@David-kz2im]

It is quite interesting to see how excited Francesca gets when she talks about genitalia…

[@0004W]

How many pages is the book ..?

[@Alec_Collins78]

Mot who?

[@samconduct1356]

She's brilliantly intelligent and a wonderful human being, but it feels like she's trying to punch against God and determined to succeed.

[@Th3Pr0digalS0n]

You have done a great job of attacking the doctrine of men. The trinity is not biblical. If believers in the One True Almighty Creator studied history and language as they should, Christianity and Judiasm wouldn't exist. And if secular humanism studied the ancient scriptural texts without bias they would be able to see the story of creation played out. We all need to study more.

[@grahamekellermeier8280]

Witches demons ,faeries sounds like a Harry potter book.

[@woodygilson3465]

Two fart sounds starting at 25:44. Wtf is that?! 🤣

[@Semapho0ore]

25:44 is a bit disturbing

[@chrisribaudobranding]

Interesting, from a purely materialistic point of view. She categorically, a priori, cancels the role of faith.

[@normster1000]

I guess it's more than obvious why she won't offer critical analysis of the Quran.

[@thingmagig3896]

Because she's not a Qur'anic scholar. She has spoken about this before.

[@loki6626]

Even if she is avoiding criticising it for the obvious reason, who can blame her.

[@stevenv6463]

People get so butthurt that academics don't criticize Islam. It isn't some conspiracy. Besides the academic study of Islam being quite young and a good number of academics being Muslim (though this happens with Christian and Jewish studies), the Islamic sources are simply more trustworthy, more careful and precise so a lot of studying it is understanding how Muslims understood their religion.

[@JAMESCARNEY273]

To say that God called to Abraham for absolute devotion to God only was because God was lonely is about the worst interpretation of that you could make.

[@urbandiscount]

Why? It's a theme that's picked up in Midrash as well

[@buddy.boyo88]

25:43 an evil spirit in the room ?

[@twinflames4249]

Hmm you sound like Foolish fish that l subscribe to

[@dianaelliott3654]

Don't buy this book. It is very disrespectful to people of faith.

[@Joe-wy4cx]

The strongest argument presented between the pair of them is their sniggering and patronising talk about people of faith…

[@paulm5443]

I think you will find FS tends to criticise the stories and texts rather than the believers. Having said that, people of faith do need criticising.

[@jollyandwaylo]

I didn't think they were presenting arguments, just discussing ancient practices and beliefs.

[@Brata19]

I thought you guys are supposed to be atheist, yet you coming back to polytheism. Anyway the concept of the 'ultimate god' was always there, you can see it in hinduism with brahman, also in china they have tien (heaven). I'm suprised she didn't go there, then just stuck with west & middle-east bias. So the tension of mono vs poly - theism is in the manner of 'representation'. Like the difference between the avatars of god vs the prophets of god...

[@David-kz2im]

Biblical scholar Kabane (Seraphim Hamilton) has some videos on this topic.

[@jollyandwaylo]

It seems they are talking about history, not their personal belief system. Ancient people were basically polytheists for the most part so when discussing ancient beliefs polytheism is going to keep coming up. The Catholic Church today with all their saints is a form of polytheism to my way of thinking.

[@Brata19]

@@jollyandwaylo Do I have to believe that history is neutral & written by neutral people? If polytheism is the main theme since ancient time, then why e.g, most Christians still regard themselves as monotheist? What's wrong with polytheism? Even so, majority & in time doesn't mean that's the truth... that'll also crush atheism in an instant. One can ask why then Socrates sentenced to death? Even in the historical Greek was not all the way polytheism, although that seems to be the winner. So there are nuances... just because you found some bones in the caves doesn't mean all people only lives in caves.

[@jollyandwaylo]

@@Brata19 I don't know what point you are trying to make. You seem to be throwing out stawmen to defeat but you aren't defeating them. What does Socrates being killed have to do with this? Catholics would consider themselves to be monotheists but they also worship all those saints. I don't care what they consider themselves because that is their business but it seems to me to be a form of polytheism. Also what was the random comment about crushing atheism? None of this has anything to do with atheism. This is talking about the history of belief, not of evidence of gods.

[@Brata19]

I disagree with the point of Judaism as polytheistic, to the most part they're monotheistic. I agree with the Christian part though, because clearly there was some mixing with Greek Helenistic. The other stuff I mentioned because it's not being addressed, so I speculate on her bias. If this just an innocent history telling, then why only focused on specific culture, then draw the big picture of how God's look like..

[@KatySei]

"motnaim" = hebrew term for waist, not loins. Ashera usually mentioned with BAAL. 'Palestein"/ "Syria Palaestina" the roaman province did not exist during the Babylonian rule. but from Bar Kokhba's revolt,132-135 CE as a form of humiliation. Learn your hebrew and do history - not politics "DR" Francesca .

[@curious011]

actually try learning the hebrew as you are not correct.

[@ChildofGod98765]

Living with lupus has it’s challenges. I’m in a lot of pain swollen joints, fever , and fatigue are just a few, because of my condition I declined the vaccine, and was fired over my decision. Since than I’ve been struggling to provide for my two autistic children. My husband passed away three years ago, so I’m all alone. I have no family nor friends. Both of my sons are non verbal so as a mommy things can be a little more difficult. I don’t know how we are going to make it through the winter I had to catch up on back rent because I quickly fell behind. I spent my savings durning the beginning of the pandemic. I couldn’t pay my electric bill this month. I’m still waiting on the state of assistance. I’m so embarrassed of my situation. I never thought this could happen to me, but I have nothing but Faith that God will provide. He is a good and merciful GOD! Keep Faith in Him.

[@kirkmarshall2853]

God doesn’t exist and Lupus is no reason to not get the vaccine

[@kirkmarshall2853]

You have a responsibility to those children not to an imaginary being and the lies of right wing losers

[@simongiles9749]

I've seen this exact story posted in multiple atheist channels. I suspect it's a work of fiction.

[@k-3402]

@@simongiles9749 Definitely. It's a pretty distasteful attempt at satire, I think.

[@waterfrancis4794]

Francesca Stavrakopoulou IS TALKING A LOAD OF NONSENSE IF SHE TRULY THINK SHE KNOWS THE BIBLE AND SHE CLAIM TO BE A BIBLICAL SCHOLAR LET HER DEBATE MICHEAL BROWN

[@curious011]

So, michael brown, NOT a scholar of any kind, has what it takes to put her in her place huh? He tried with Ehrman and lost so bad it wasn't funny. Brown cannot prove anything he claims, he uses the bible to interpret the bible. no outside sources, nothing. just whatever pentecostal nonsense he brings to the text.

[@curious011]

yes, brown has the LORD speaking to him. he claims to hear directly from God-literally. and yet what he hears conflicts with others who say God speaks to them. who is right? and on an on the foolishness goes. Francesca has years of research on the ancient world, she's been in digs and uses extensive knowledge of both the biblical text and archeology to prove her points. brown just says he's heard from God so we need to believe him and HIS version of the text.

[@waterfrancis4794]

@@curious011 show me a prove that Brown ever made this claims you're speculating like this Stavrakopoulou lady

[@waterfrancis4794]

@@curious011 THE PROBLEM WITH MINDS LIKE YOURS IS THAT EVERYTHING THAT IS WRITTEN IN BLACK AND WHITE IS TO BE TREATED LIKE NEWS PAPER ;YOU OBVIOUSLY ARE BIAS FROM THE WAY YOU LOOK AT THINGS;IF YOU ARE A HONEST PERSON WHO CARE FOR THE TRUTH WHY DON'T YOU LOOK AT THE WORKS OF "IVAN PANIN" A RUSSIAN MATHEMATICIAN" WHO THOUGHT Albert Einstein .His WORKS AND FINDINGS ON BIBLE NUMERICS ARE STILL INDISPUTABLE TODAY.LOOK AT IVAN PANIN'S FINDINGS AND SEE HOW IS WORK MAKE YOUR francesca stavrakopoulou A SHISH KEBAB

[@waterfrancis4794]

@@curious011 WHEN YOU DEAL WITH THE BIBLE THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS BIBLICAL SCHOLAR;ASSOCIATING SCHOLAR TO THE BIBLE IS UTTER NONSENSE BECAUSE THE BIBLE IS A BOOK OF REVELATION IS NOT LIKE YOUR EVERYDAY NEWS PAPER

[@DM-vt9xb]

A modern feminist sjw perspective on ancient scriptures, lol this made my morning. My kings, let us not forget that in every religion, including atheism, there are wiser, and more experienced minds ready to present their biased perspectives in a enlighten way. Have a blessed day atheist.

[@LM-jz9vh]

😂

[@elingeniero9117]

Just because you need the crutch of religion why do smear me with your idolatry? Does it feed the insecurity of your superstition? You worship idols. A-theist do not. Is your intellect so limited that you don't understand that.

[@doxholiday1372]

"When I discovered that Jesus was Jewish" Has the entire world gone mad? I keep hearing more and more biblical scholars repeat this false assertion that Jesus was a "Jew". It's as though people lose their reading comprehension when they pick up the bible. I don't get it. FYI it's IMPOSSIBLE for a Galilaean to be a "Jew". The ONLY word rendered "Jew" in modern translations of the New Testament is the ancient Greek word IOUDAIOI - meaning A CITIZEN OF JUDAEA. Jesus was a CITIZEN OF GALILEE. Not Judaea! Galilee and Judaea were 2 completely different countries, in 2 completely different kingdoms. He was incorrectly referred to as "KING OF THE IOUDAIOS/JUDAEANS" by the foreign wise men who traveled from the east, and Herod the Great being an Idumean usurper (Look it up, Herod wasn't even an Israelite, his ancestors were from Edom/Idumea) who wasnt familiar with the Israelites' scriptures took the misnomer and ran with it. The fact that it was recorded doesn't mean he was right. Just because the bible records something doesn't automatically make it true. Whether something is true or not has to be determined by the facts. "When Herod the king had heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him. And when he had gathered all the chief priests and scribes of the people together, he demanded of them where Christ should be born. And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet, And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel." Mat 2:3-6 He was to rule God's people, "the Jews ", right? Oh, wait, it says HIS PEOPLE ISRAEL. Let's go to the first place the word "Jews" appears in our bible translations (notice it isn't in the Torah)... "Then Rezin king of Syria and Pekah son of Remaliah KING OF ISRAEL came up to Jerusalem to war: and they besieged Ahaz, but could not overcome him. At that time Rezin king of Syria recovered Elath to Syria, AND DRAVE THE JEWS FROM ELATH; and the Syrians came to Elath, and dwelt there unto this day." 2Ki 16:5-6 See that, Israel went to war against "the Jews" and drove them out of some territory. The words Israel and Jews are NOT interchangeable. The foreign wise men mistskenly assumed the prophecy about Messiah being born in Bethlehem of Judaea meant that his parents lived in Bethlehem and that it would be his home town. Those who've read the whole story know there's a plot twist... "And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus, that all the world should be taxed. And all went to be taxed, every one into his own city. And Joseph also went up from Galilee, out of the city of Nazareth, into Judaea, unto the city of David, which is called Bethlehem; To be taxed with Mary his espoused wife, being great with child. And so it was, that, while they were there, the days were accomplished that she should be delivered. And she brought forth her firstborn son, and wrapped him in swaddling clothes, and laid him in a manger; because there was no room for them in the inn. [...] And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord; [...] And when they had performed all things according to the law of the Lord, they returned into Galilee, to their own city Nazareth." Luk 2:1-7, 22, 39 His parents weren't Judaeans from Bethlehem, they were traveling from Nazareth in Galilee to Jerusalem in Judaea to register for the Roman census when his mother went into labor. You'd think people who study and talk about the bible for a living would put 2 & 2 together at some point. smh They make the same essential mistake that Herod the Great made by hearing (or reading) someone who doesn't know the details of Jesus' life refer to him as "Judaean", or "King of the Judaeans" (except now the word Jew has been inserted everywhere Judaean used to be, so they call him "Jew" instead of Judaean, but the principle is the same) and assume they know what they're talking about. Then they repeat the error and pass it on to others...And around and around we go. Later in the gospels Jesus was ACCUSED of claiming to be "KING OF THE IOUDAIOS/JUDAEANS" by false witnesses hired by some of the (Idumean) religious leaders who wanted rid of him, because doing so would force the Romans to execute him as a traitor. "Now the chief priests, and elders, and all the council, sought false witness against Jesus, to put him to death; But found none: yea, though many false witnesses came, yet found they none. At the last came two false witnesses," Mat 26:59-60 "And from thenceforth Pilate sought to release him: but the Jews (IOUDAIOS/JUDAEANS) cried out, saying, If thou let this man go, thou art not Caesar's friend: whosoever maketh himself a king speaketh against Caesar." Jhn 19:12 Jesus, on the other hand, never referred to himself that way. Nor did his disciples or family members. "Then Pilate entered into the judgment hall again, and called Jesus, and said unto him, Art thou the King of the Jews (IOUDAIOS/JUDAEANS)? Jesus answered him, Sayest thou this thing of thyself, or did others tell it thee of me? Pilate answered, Am I a Jew (IOUDAIOI/JUDAEAN)? Thine own nation and the chief priests have delivered thee unto me: what hast thou done? Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews (IOUDAIOS/JUDAEANS): but now is my kingdom not from hence." Jhn 18:33-36 Even Pilate, a Roman governor, figured out that he was being misled and realized it actually wasn't his own nation that had delivered him up, and tried to use Jesus' Galilaean citizenship to set him free. "And they were the more fierce, saying, He stirreth up the people, teaching throughout all Judaea, beginning from Galilee to this place. When Pilate heard of Galilee, he asked whether the man were a Galilaean. And as soon as he knew that he belonged unto Herod's jurisdiction, he sent him to Herod, who himself also was at Jerusalem at that time." -Luk 23:5-7 (This was a different Herod who was the Tetrarch of Galilee) Pilate figured out 2,000 years ago what the entirety of western academia seems incapable of grasping. (Take out a map of 1st century Palestine and notice that Galilee is 2 countries north of Judaea) Even the help understood this basic fact. "And a maid saw him again, and began to say to them that stood by, This is one of them. And he denied it again. And a little after, they that stood by said again to Peter, Surely thou art one of them: for thou art a Galilaean, and thy speech agreeth thereto." Mar 14:69-70

[@paulm5443]

Think she was explaining that this is what she was told/discovered when she was a little girl. Her expertise and interest is the old testament rather than the new. I personally think it's unlikely that jesus existed as a single person and was probably more of a myth, so it's a bit of a moot point.

[@doxholiday1372]

@Paul M I appreciate your input, but that doesn't address my point, or the arguments I made. I get that her interest in the OT was renewed, I'm not disputing anything about that, and regardless of the various opinions about the historicity of Jesus, the Israelites themselves were in fact a historical people written about outside of the scriptural texts by historians including Strabo, Hecetaeus of Abdera. Diodorus Siculus, Flavius Josephus, etc, as well as mentioned in Assyrian and other inscriptions. And of course by the Romans. My point was that the texts which mention Jesus, whether you accept him as a real individual person or not, are about a man from Galilee, a Galilaean, not a Judaean. And since he wasnt a Judaean there's no possible reason for calling him a "Jew". Galilee was a completely different country north of Judaea, and none of its citizens were ever referred to as Judaeans, the same way that Canadians have never been referred to as Americans. Because it wouldn't make any sense to do so.

[@doxholiday1372]

My other point was that there's no basis for calling Judaeans "Jews", since the Greek form of Judaeans in the ancient texts (Ioudaios) is what gets "translated" as "Jews". I put translated in quotes because rendering Ioudaios as "Jews" is definitely not a translation. If it was a translation it would by necessity include the English equivalent of the Greek prefix "iouda" and the suffix "-ios" , ie Judae-ans. (-ios in Greek and -ans in English both mean "people of") It's not a translation it's propaganda. Judaeans = inhabitants of the kingdom of Judaea (Based on citizenship) Jews = members of the Jewish people (Based on birth to Jewish parents) By switching Judaeans to Jews in translations of ancient texts it makes people believe the two entities are one and the same, and yet that's impossible, even if only for the reason cited directly above. You can't take a text from the past and exchange the inhabitants of a particular kingdom with the name of a people who aren't inhabitants of that kingdom, especially after multiple centuries have passed. (Especially when that kingdom no longer exists) Even if that people legitimately began as emigrants from that place, and they along with all of their descendants never intermarried with anyone outside their gene pool, or allowed converts from outside their gene pool to assimilate with their people, because the text is specifically referring to that kingdom's inhabitants - not their descendants, and especially not their descendants after millenniums of intermixing. Yet not only have the people we knows of as Jews done both by absorbing countless converts and marriage partners from all over the world throughout multiple centuries, but the population of 1st century Judaea wasnt a single homogeneous nationality to begin with. The Judaean population consisted of multiple ethnic groups including but not limited to Idumeans, Canaanites. Shelanites, as well as foreigners from Babylon. (Josephus Antiquities 13.9.1, The Jewish Encyclopedia, Edox/Idumea, Judges 1, Genesis 38:1-5, Numbers 26:20, Exodus 12:28, Nehemiah 13:3) For example an Idumean was the king of Judaea when the 1st century rolled around. "Herod was born in (or around) 72 BCE in Idumea, south of Judea. He was the second son of Antipater the Idumaean, a high-ranking official under ethnarch Hyrcanus II, and Cypros, a Nabatean Arab princess from the city of Petra in what is now Jordan. Herod's father was by descent an Edomite, whose ancestors had converted to Judaism. Herod was raised as a (Ioudaioi/Judaean) Jew." -Wikipedia, Herod The Great Israelites descended from Jacob, whereas Idumeans did not. And Herod was by no means an exception, Flavius Josephus recorded how the nation of Idumea was incorporated into the kingdom of Judaea beginning in 125bc. "Hyrcanus took also Dora and Marissa, cities of Idumea, and subdued all the Idumeans; and permitted them to stay in that country, if they would circumcise their genitals, and make use of the laws of the [Ioudaios/Judaeans] Jews; and they were so desirous of living in the country of their forefathers, that they submitted to the use of circumcision, and of the rest of the [Ioudaioi/Judaean] Jewish ways of living; at which time therefore this befell them, that they were hereafter no other than [Ioudaios/ Judaeans] Jews." -Antiquities 13.9.1 Jews used to admit these things in their own literature. "They were again subdued by John Hyrcanus (c. 125 B.C.), by whom they were forced to observe Jewish rites and laws (ib. xiii. 9, § 1; xiv. 4, § 4). They were then incorporated with the Jewish nation, and their country was called by the Greeks and Romans "Idumea" (Mark iii. 8; Ptolemy, "Geography," v. 16). With Antipater began the Idumean dynasty that ruled over Judea till its conquest by the Romans. Immediately before the siege of Jerusalem 20,000 Idumeans, under the leadership of John, Simeon, Phinehas, and Jacob, appeared before Jerusalem to fight in behalf of the Zealots who were besieged in the Temple (Josephus, "B. J." iv. 4, § 5). From this time the Idumeans ceased to be a separate people." - The Jewish Encyclopedia, EDOX/IDUMEA And that's just one non Israelite faction of Judaeans, there were several others. So, 2,000 years ago the Judaeans (which Jews claim to be) consisted of several disparate nationalities with completely different lines of descent, yet somehow after two millennia's worth of foreign marriages and conversions we're supposed to believe they became pure Israelites who all descended from Jacob/Israel. Anyone who actually looks into the facts will realize they're the victim of a massive propaganda campaign.

[@stuart940]

tldr

[@LM-jz9vh]

@Dox Holiday Where are people getting the idea that Jesus wasn’t Jewish? *Was Jesus Jewish and, if he was, how would that have influenced his experiences as a young man growing up in Galilee?* *"Was Jesus a Jew? Of course, Jesus was a Jew. He was born of a Jewish mother, in Galilee, a Jewish part of the world. All of his friends, associates, colleagues, disciples, all of them were Jews. He regularly worshipped in Jewish communal worship, what we call synagogues. He preached from Jewish text, from the Bible. He celebrated the Jewish festivals. He went on pilgrimage to the Jewish Temple in Jerusalem where he was under the authority of priests.... He lived, was born, lived, died, taught as a Jew.* This is obvious to any casual reader of the gospel text. What's striking is not so much that he was a Jew but that the gospels make no pretense that he wasn't. The gospels have no sense yet that Jesus was anything other than a Jew. The gospels don't even have a sense that he came to found a new religion, an idea completely foreign to all the gospel text, and completely foreign to Paul. That is an idea which comes about only later. So, to say that he was a Jew is saying a truism, is simply stating an idea that is so obvious on the face of it, one wonders it even needs to be said. But, of course, it does need to be said because we all know what happens later in the story, where it turns out that Christianity becomes something other than Judaism and as a result, Jesus in retrospect is seen not as a Jew, but as something else, as a founder of Christianity. But, of course, he was a Jew."

[@r1madbrit]

Ecosystem of Gods???? Stop grabbing cliche words and using them when they have NOTHING to do with gods! Francesca was interesting so thank you.

[@johncollins2834]

Should have started…’Is this just made up salacious and irreverent rubbish’..

[@inyobill]

My imaginary friend is better than your imaginary friend.

[@k-3402]

We're going to have to engage in warfare to settle this.

[@inyobill]

@@k-3402 Clearly, no other solution is possible.

[@monceftayahi]

As always, Prof. Francesca delivers: facts mixed with her unique humor... Love Francesca!

[@colclark107]

Another must read and addition for my library! Thanks so much, Francesca - and you, too, Andrew!

[@donaldsmith7685]

Have ordered the book. What a treasure FS is.

[@TheGrassdawg]

So happy you are on the planet! And on the topic of “not truly grasping the truth of the text” is classic cult tactics. Thanks again for your courage and diligence in studies!

[@greglogan7706]

Great point RE cult tactics - evangelicalism is simply the biggest cult there is...😖

[@philg6613]

I've just bought the book after watching your podcast. Francesca is a breath of fresh air in a crowded and often hostile group of 'believers' and 'non-believers' arguing for and against the pantheon of deities that have come to dominate the lives of billions. I come from a generation where religious belief was assumed and an atheist was as strange a being as a vegetarian. How times have changed ... or have they?

[@garyt123]

I would actually rephrase your comment regarding "groups of believers and non-believers arguing for and against", to "believers and non-believers arguing for." Personally I don't believe, in the true atheist sense (not the agnostic sense), and I see the arguments as being totally one sided. They believe, I don't, and they can't accept my non-belief. They think my atheism is somehow some weird _activist movement,_ and I..... simply don't give two hoots about whatever they want to believe. They however label, categorise, threaten and generally make trouble for, atheists.

[@davidwright8432]

Saw the book; bought instantly (well, as long as it took Amazon to deliver); loved it; this interview gives you a very fair account of the book! Charming, provocative, informative, questioning. Thanks, Francesca!

[@michaelbriscoe8441]

A sky wizard of Oz,becomes a zombie carpenter to save us all from a magic apple curse?That people is why mankind is doomed

[@jvlp2046]

Jude 1:4/paraphrased... "for certain people have crept in unnoticed who long ago were designated for this condemnation, ungodly people, who perverted and turned the Grace of God into LASCIVIOUSNESS/LEWDLINESS (sexual immorality) and denying the deity of the Lord God (YHWH) and Lord Christ Jesus." ... Amen.

[@kirkmarshall2853]

Henotheism is the term I’ve always heard for a group that accepts that other gods are real but choose to worship one over the others. And by that terminology, the Israelites who wrote the Bible seem quite Henotheistic, believing that many other gods/angels/demons all exist in a very Mt Olympus like hierarchical system.

[@andybeans5790]

The first commandment backhandedly admits that there are other gods, but that Yahweh prohibits their worship amongst his followers

[@kirkmarshall2853]

@@andybeans5790 also god says “they must not be allowed to eat from the tree of life lest they become immortal like US” who is the US he is referring to?

[@scienceexplains302]

I got the idea of god’s body when I read that Yahweh was going to show his backside to Moses in Exodus 33.23.

[@miguelthealpaca8971]

He likes showing his private areas to his favourite fans.

[@jdmitchell6559]

Michelangelo depicted God's bare butt with great panache on the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel. It has *got* to be a brilliant piece of irony. (He is known to have been particularly p*ssed off by the church authorities at the time).

[@impossiblenamechoice]

What a brilliant discussion. Thank you Humanists UK and Prof Stavrakopoulou. I’ve started the book and it’s great!

[@annford6640]

Ah ha... so then, Jesus, Yahweh, etc. were apparently "trending" in their time. The ever-present generational gap, elders-wise. The phrases, "Jesus movement..." and "fill the gap to fix the flaw." Both telling and thought provoking. Thanks Humanists UK ~~ :)

[@davidwright8432]

The way you put it emphasizes the curiously human behavior of so very many gods ... one might be tempted to ask, who was made in the image of whom. exactly?

[@chindi17]

I pre ordered the book and I hope to receive it soon here in America.

[@adonaiMym]

Dear Dr. Francesca is just an atheist who loves to explore the Hebrew Bible. That's it. Nothing special. 😉It is ridiculous that many people are surprising for her work/book/views. In my country, there are many Buddhist monks who knows a lot about the Christians Bible but they don't believe it as factual. 💁‍♂