Hyundai Ioniq 28 kWh degradation test

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[@OleksiiBodnia]

Hyundai IONIQ has ~30,5 kWh, but we can only use 28.5 kwh (by OBD). The car reserves 2,5 kWh to prevent fast degradation. So your battery is 28,5 kWh in total and 26 kWh available. Degradation is 28.5 / 30.5 = 93% That's it :)

[@gapreston]

Really valuable information. Puts the skeptics down, and reinforces my belief in electric vehicles. Thanks Bjorn!

[@watereverywhere]

Awesome. Bjorn, your enthusiasm for the Ioniq (efficiency, battery temp regulation, trunk sleeping and banana box test) was one of the main reasons I bought one. That and the fact that the Standard Model 3 wasn't available in 2018. It is such a pleasure to drive city and highway. We go camping with 3 kids no problem. I just wish it had better roof rack options and a bigger 40kW or 60kW pack but it covers 80% of our driving needs admirably.

[@GabrieleCastlunger]

I discovered today your channel because of the new ioniq, and I'm pretty sure that you're the best reviewer for elettric cars

[@pete9b]

Great and interesting video Bjørn, thanks!!..

[@djeffhawk7987]

To my little calculation the ioniq had a buffer about 1kWh. (approximatively 3-4%) You can overcharge the ioniq to had no regeneration for 7km on normal driving or 20km on hypermiling before you lost the first %. (100 to 99%) On normal charging to 100% you can do only 0.5km with the first %. To overcharge you have to preheat the car twice and that don't work everytime.

[@simoncanfer5030]

The hot air vents to the outside, via the wheel arch. You can feel the hot air with your hand!

[@gerbre1]

That makes sense. Just circulating the air inside and heating up the cabin would be strange.

[@6776823]

Gerd Bremer not really- if an issue was to arrive and battery was to give off fumes then it would be better to have them excluded from the car.

[@ME-cb1vw]

the warm air goes out throug the opening for pressure compensation, which is behind the bumper in the left and right corner. But not in an active way. The battery fan just puts the warm air in the space behind the trim on the right hand side of the trunk. So the fan outlet does not go directly to the outside of the car.

[@simoncanfer5030]

@@ME-cb1vw yes the fan lives behind the RHS trunk trim. Next to it is a vent to the wheel arch. Avoids any problems with water damage to the fan I guess.

[@themadjock1977]

I love my UK BEV IONIQ - 8000 miles travelled and still 137mi on GoM when fully charged, this summer (20-24C). It's my wife that always has the Heat/AC on but at least she loves it too (the IONIQ I mean)

[@saxphile]

Would love to see more degradation test on non-Tesla cars with active thermal management for the batteries. And FIRST!

[@eschlumpf8923]

good info, thanks for the effort

[@arthimodo]

Björn, according to CanIoniq, you have subtract Wh reg from Wh out (before you start to charge). Then you will get the total consumed energy. I you this tool very often. So, due to CanIoniq that Ioniq has even slightly more degradation. But nevertheless, thank you for the great Test.

[@MarcellinoGER]

I've done the same test in spring with my Ioniq at 100.000km. I drove 293km @ 8.5kWh/100km in a single charge with 1% left, that means almost 25.2kWh of capacity, ~10% of real Degradation. OBD SOH is still at 100%, now with 120.000km.

[@hemmper]

Impressive consumption 0.085/km, do you remember your average speed? (or was it strong tailwind the whole trip)

[@MarcellinoGER]

@@hemmper 57km/h average speed. Just cruising around the Bavarian lakes 😉

[@insevanhouts]

I just bought one with a 99.3% SoH at 118.000km, meaning it degraded through the top buffer. Not sure if I should sell it or not

[@MarcellinoGER]

@@insevanhouts The Ioniq has at the moment 248.000km, still 100% SOH, 14.7% Degradation after making a full charge with 3.6kW at an electric meter in comparison to a new one.

[@insevanhouts]

@@MarcellinoGER I can't figure the SoH figure. The top buffer is maximum 8% right? How is it possible yours displays 100% SoH while also showing significant and measurable degradation? And what would it mean that mine is at 99.3% SoH?

[@bederhajali]

Having the right tires makes a huge difference. I recently replaced my Michelin energy savers with Pirelli p4 And lost about 15%

[@6776823]

As you pointed out the 100% battery scale on the Ioniq is not to scale inso far as the inital 50% gives a greater range that the last %. If that is accepted then as you charged the car to 94% the remaining 6% is actually greater than 6% I believe it is closer to 8% of the battery. If that is accurate then the loss is somewhat less than you envisage. Love your videos- thank you for teaching me so much!

[@MrPikkoz]

i think this is more related to the overall battery capacity rather than the quality of the battery and the thermal management . Smaller battery = more cycles per range achieved =higher degradation, that's why i'd rather get the long range model 3 if i had to keep the car for few years.

[@DeerKoden]

Considering how often you cycle the battery through charge and discharge cycles, it's pretty good indeed. Given that degradation isn't linear but has a peak within the first year, i also expect the battery to reach 200.000km easily with not much more than 10 to 15% degradation.

[@ashton9699]

10:40 the battery dumps the hot air to outside of the car behind the rear bumper. The exhaust duct goes down and out, with a flap at the end so dirt and water don't get in.

[@vk6xre]

I think it is a small price to pay as an EV will still perform like it did out of the factory albeit with 10% less range. An ICE engine car wears rings, valve guides not to mention at 100k you are up for timing belt, fan belts maybe a tensioner. Also the ICE at around 90k would of consumed say 6 oil filters, 3 air filters, 60L of oil, maybe 2 coolant changes, a 12v battery, 3 fuel filters. I will predict that the car itself will be worn out before the battery is no longer viable and then the battery can be used for stationary storage... and then the battery can be recycled.

[@TBasianeyes]

I don't want to play something down here but your numbers for an ICE at 90k are way off for modern cars. At 90k I had 3 oil filter changes, 2 air filters, 20 liters of oil, no coolant change, no battery change and no fuel filter change. AND I didn't pay anything for this maintenance because it was included up to 100k. On the car I had before I changed the fuel filter, coolant and battery for the first time around 200k.

[@vk6xre]

@@TBasianeyes I agree, for your vehicle, but we don't drive your vehicle. Take for example a largish diesel 4WD which has a service period of 10,000 km. That is 9 services in 90k. Such a vehicle will use 9L per oil change so that is 81L of oil. Looking at a median of 15,000 km (10,000 mile) service intervals. BTW, you get nothing for free mate...It cost you, it was buried in the purchase price.

[@clayton4115]

@@vk6xre yeah and with Hybrid cars you need to change the 12v more often due to car going on / off all the time, i know i drive a hybrid.

[@thatpersonsmusic]

Clayton D'Cruz The Ioniq Hybrid actually doesn’t have a 12v battery www.caranddriver.com/news/a15341302/how-the-hyundai-ioniq-ditched-its-traditional-12v-lead-acid-starter-battery/

[@AB-yt4hd]

@@clayton4115 I owned a Prius a fiew years ago. Bought at 90000km and sold it at 200000km. I didn't have to change the battery (very small 12V battery). I did changed the oil myself and only went to a garage when I needed to change the break fluid. No proplem with this car. It is a very good hybrid. Today my wife drives a Ioniq EV (45000km/year) and I drive a Citroen C-zero.

[@RandomRockyCX]

Nice test Bjørn, I'm gonna try the same test this weekend in my Ioniq, mine is 2, 5 years and have almost 105.000 km😊

[@Simon-dm8zv]

What is the result?

[@RandomRockyCX]

6,5 % degradation😊

[@constructioneerful]

@@RandomRockyCX thanks!

[@philos31]

@@RandomRockyCX No. 0% degredation, you can not measure degredation in this way. You probably got around 26kWh out of your pack, that is correct, you wil get that from the pack if it is new. The degredation is in the upper buffer of the 31 kWh pack, the usable energy storage is limited to 28kWh and the BMS takes 5% from that top and 2 % form the bottom of that 28 to give you 26kWh. If you measure 26kWh now you still wont be able to see the degradition in your pack.

[@448yuppi]

@@philos31 hey where did you find those information? I am trying to find them.

[@AllCodPlays]

Can you make a model 3 battery degradation?? And more videos on M3 SR+

[@stokesd3]

My Ioniq PHEV overstates the SOC at the top end (so says 95% on OBD Car Scanner when display says 100%). At 20% the values are consistent and then it starts to understate as it gets towards zero for the bottom 5% buffer. Assuming the EV follows the same non-linear correlation, I would say that on a non degraded battery charging from 4% to 94% actually equates to 80% increase of charge. In Björn's test here I think only the top buffer has been removed through degradation (hence CarIoniq shows 100% SOC at the start of the vid). He has therefore charged 85% from 4-94 % so not so sure charging loss is as much as you think? That would also make the initial calculation based on consumption 227 * 109 / 0.91 = 27.19 kWh

[@therealcdnuser]

Just bought a used 2017 Ioniq with 10,000 kms. I love it! Only wish it had an app to check charge status and start pre-heat.

[@restfulplace3273]

There is an app to monitor details. Idk if it or anything can start pre hear

[@arenjay3278]

Bjorn you should do a magnetic advertising sign you put on the cars you test with ad space for sale. You drive a lot lots of people would see your mobile ads.

[@dronerdroner783]

Worlds best Bjørn

[@familiebittroff7581]

great to see. Drive an Ionic with 24.000km from 12/2017 do 95% AC Charging. Now iam interessted in results with a 200.000km Ionic. Lets see.... :-)

[@aszandek]

Hi, Big like for that! Thx!

[@Ultravore]

I really wonder why Nissan can't put something as simple as a cooling fan in their Leaf cars. It's such a simple solution and works so well. For liquid cooling I get it, that is probably quite expensive, but a fan? Come on Nissan! And why are you still stuck on Chademo... that plug is pretty much dead now.

[@MrPaukann]

Their battery enclosures are the same since the first leaf. You can put a battery pack from a second gen leaf into a first gen leaf. You can even get it working in an old leaf (almost, the SoC indicator won't work). I guess, it's not about manufacturing costs, it's about development costs and retooling of the manufacturing machinery. Although, I've just googled, the cases are slightly different, so I don't know why. May an engineer somewhere at Nissan is too stubborn to admit, that it's a bad engineering decision.

[@joeaverager]

@@MrPaukann I think even the SoC indicators can be corrected now with a little third party help. Nissan won't invest any more money in the Leaf b/c of Ayria. They'll choose to let the Leaf die which is a shame. Keep the Leaf as a cheaper EV and sell the Ayria.

[@florianfreytag5550]

If you compare the voltage of a ionity charger with the can values, you should get the loss on the Cables.

[@JackMaslovCZLive]

2:43 Björn: "This part here is really low!" The car: *increases consumption*, "You were saying something?"

[@boloborkowski9429]

8% its a good shieeeet, I love you man

[@govindkhatuwala5257]

Good

[@andreasnorstedt3680]

Thermal heat loss is likely around 3% on DC charging where conversion losses are likely already accounted for. You can calculate it by battery weight (200kg) x specific heat capacity of lithium cells (approx. 1000) x temperature rise in degrees Celsius (preferably uncooled temp rise under 30 degrees) divided by 3600 gives Wh. Answer/charged Wh gives approx thermal loss in %. Given an average temp rise in the battery of approx 15 degrees at a 24800Wh charge gives 3.4% which corresponds well with expected battery efficiency. 24.8kWh - 0.833kWh gives approx 24kWh actual charge and divided by 0.9 gives available capacity at 26.6kWh. This is likely close to original capacity and battery shows little to no degradation from new car stats I've seen. You're likely to see similar discharge losses of 800Wh (3.4%) which gives you 26.6 - 800 = 25.8kWh and if I'm not mistaken that's what the GOM said. You shouldn't hip shot the efficiency losses, you might as well hip shot degradation then.

[@a2jettagli]

Test 24 kWh e-Golf battery degradation! I have a 2016 SEL with 48K miles and I measure about 6% degradation but it's hard to know because I'm not sure what VW starts us with.

[@onedankind8168]

10% at nearly 100k km is pretty impressive. I’m sure this means tons of fast charging. Really that’s amazing.

[@sp1es]

I'm trying to ascertain my real battery capacity on my classic ioniq too, I did a similar test to you, then extrapolated the information as the battery wasn't completely flat and ended up at the same 25.8kw, my car is 5 years old but has only done 43000 miles, would be nice to get to the bottom of this as I don't think the cars SOH can really be trusted

[@rukasuara]

could it be that the obd wh out is the sum of all energy that has gone out of the battery that session, including regen? so capacity would be wh out minus wh reg

[@KiwiShoot]

Always thought there was slightly more than the 28kW battery that claimed, the computer just kept saying it's charged to 100% when it actually wasn't ? Still that's good battery life after than much mileage !

[@pedronunes1353]

Is there some kind of OBD / LeafSpy for Tesla? How can you test the degradation of a used Tesla before you buy it? For Leaf is easy with LeafSpy showing the SOH...

[@alexanderjokkmok396]

I just love your movies 👍😀👍

[@pedrotiagomedeiros]

Hi Bjorn! I have an ioniq EV, inspire living in Portugal, with a warm weather, I never made fast charges, so I never heard the battery cooling fan working, but I don't think the air comes inward the inside of the car like you claim. I think the air comes out by two cents located in the back of the car between the metal body and the rear bumper. Next time you have the car can you try film with the IR camera beneath and behind the car? Best regards!

[@christiankuppler6643]

Not more kilometers but smaller battery: my i3 from 2013, 89500 km, battery 17,5 kWh capacity actually, started with 19,1 - 19,3 kWh. Minimum of degradation too.

[@B0r0]

Its been around the traps that the battery capacity is actually 30.8kwh with software hiding the last 10%, so you really only charge to around 90% hence the long warranty for battery degradation. If you get your 25.8kwh and add the additional 10% you will have 28.38kwh, which is quite close to what you recorded. This gives an error rate of just over 1%

[@MikeDeeee]

Usually more of the buffer is at the bottom. So charging to 100% on display may mean charging 97.5% SOC of battery specification. 0% on display may mean 7.5% SOC of battery specification. (I don't know the actual numbers for the Ioniq but that's generally how it works).

[@emobilityat]

You have to stop the App after driving. So Wh Out is all you get out from battery. And Wh reg ist all you have regenerated during driving. Wh-out - Wh reg is capacity of battery netto, on scaling it to 100% SoC. Starting the App again during charging to see Wh reg as value going into battery charged from charging station.

[@TBasianeyes]

The problem is that the app crashed after the first 5km so he ended up with some numbers that don't add up.

[@arenjay3278]

What are the range differences between the different drive modes or regen modes? Is there someway to test this?

[@karla6999]

Hi Björn! First, thanks for your work. I drive an IONIQ just like that since 05-2019 and I‘m using EV Notify to read car data. On several trips I‘ve noticed that the car has used (much) more than the available batterycapacity of 28kWh by looking at the CED valus that should show the consumed energy. I assume this is due to rekuperated energy, shown in the CEC values. Is it correct to subtract the recuperated amount from the used amount of energy to get correct values to figure out the real actual capacity of the battery? If I do it that way I get to ~27,5kWh now, after ~50.000km. All the best for your future real family life with the youngster and I hope you still will have time for videos then! 😉👍

[@ME-cb1vw]

could you compare the battery voltage at 100% with other ioniqs with different milage? Also a test of the internal resistance would show degradation.

[@volvocars5189]

Let's do a re-test in a couple of years again.

[@pinedorecords]

I am contemplating purchasing one today. Do you still recommend? Please advise😊

[@volvocars5189]

@@pinedorecords I can highly recommend the Ioniq Electric after 63,000 km/3 years ownership. No faults at all.

[@constructioneerful]

@@pinedorecords after 40000 miles in mine I totally recommend them. Gets even better when the charging network in a country improves.

[@dragospahontu]

@@pinedorecords if you buy an EV, it has to be new.

[@WrathChild-NZ]

compare to the 2018 leaf?

[@felixklusener5530]

The OBD tool measures the consumption including regenerated power. If the tool claims 28 kWh consumed and 2 kWh regenerated, that means 26 kWh consumption.

[@bjornnyland]

Regen was only 0.5 kWh.

[@vernongenvenice]

Hi bjorn.. Iam planning to buy hyundai ionic 2019? Do you think it is still ok to buy a 2nd hand electric car? Thank you and more power…

[@jimmyhii3]

hey Bjorn, do you use a stabilizer for filming? Your 'handheld' shots look quite stable!

[@TBasianeyes]

he uses DJI Osmo

[@MattPSU02]

So why are the Kia Soul batteries having issues, but the Ioniq batteries seem relatively OK? They are both air cooled and similar technology, right?

[@Trixor83]

Hej Bjørn. Vi har en Renault Zoe 22KW fra 2013 som har kørt 123.617km. - Iflg. mine udregninger har den tabt ca. 10% af batteri kapaciteten. Så der er mange år tilbage i den bil :) Translation: Hello Bjorn. We have a 2013 Renault Zoe 22KW that has driven 123,617km. - According to my calculations it has lost approx. 10% of the battery capacity. So there are many years left in that car :)

[@bjornnyland]

*kWh

[@Kateryna745]

Hello, dear. What is the program of diagnostic Hyundai Ioniq?

[@hutchd71]

Love this car,but in Scotland even the Hyundai dealership can't get there hands on the ionic.

[@gzcwnk]

What year is the Ioniq? 2017? or 2016?

[@horstlederhosen1826]

The SOH number reported via OBD was still 100% - Since the measured battery health was 92%, this implies the SOH number isn't a representation of the battery health as percentage, but something else.

[@sondac999]

Probably including the expected degration so SOH is just used to detect batteries that perform under specification.

[@dlamboo84]

Thanks for the great videos Björn! When looking to all the degradation videos I wonder if it wouldn't be more accurate to just read out the 'cumulative charged' values before and after charging, and then do the math. Then you don't have to guess the charging loss. Or am I missing something?

[@bjornnyland]

That value is not correct.

[@dlamboo84]

@@bjornnyland you're right, the last few days I also noticed it's always 28kwh after full discharge/charge even if it's only 25kwh

[@restfulplace3273]

Has anyone found a cheap supplier for replacement battery packs?

[@ProfessorHamer]

Bjorn something doesn't add up, it's not possible to magically get a fantastic range with 8% degradation. Be careful using the car's efficiency calculation since in the menu there are two settings, one will calculate since last full charge, and the other from power on. If you didn't charge to 100% I'm not sure it resets properly if it's the same day, likewise if you power on and off with other setting you will reset it. The eco menu shows the final trip efficiency too, and should match the numbers that are shown when you power off.

[@bjornnyland]

Of course I charged to 100 %

[@pierremorant8885]

Hi Bjorn, thanks for the video, glad to see that you're back to business with the Ioniq :) I'd have 2 questions: 1) Do you know if this Ioniq was fast-charged a lot, or rather 7kW AC? 2) on french forums, several people have reported (and me too) that the full usable capacity at 0km is not 28, but rather around 26,6 kWh. So possibly there's an unusable buffer of 1,4 kWh somehow... Did you experience the same with a new or very recent Ioniq? Best regards from south of France, Pierre

[@hanspoulsen1869]

Yes. When the car is new, there is 5% in the buffer. I have tested with a dongle and the torque app. When the cars shows 100% there is only 95% in the battery. There is also a funny error at least with my firmware. The 3 indicator lamps behind the wind screen that blink during charging, follow the real percentage, not the one in the display... So actually you can monitor the degradation if you sit around when you approach 66% :)

[@crisman72]

Can you please write the name of the app you used for connecting the obdlink to the smartphone? thanks!

[@stokesd3]

CanIoniq

[@donatoottawa]

Thanks for your video! I own an Ioniq and I’m looking for an app that gives me the battery info. Can you provide a link to the app? Please and thank you :)

[@bjornnyland]

Search for CanIoniq

[@guidomies1433]

Hi Björn, which thermal detector module are you using?

[@leokowalski]

Guido Mies, it Looks like the Flir 1.

[@eatcochayuyo]

Has this car been fast-charged a lot?

[@arenjay3278]

Remember you have regen brake charging as well.

[@CompaqP920]

"8% is good shiiet!" 😄👍

[@horstlederhosen1826]

The irony of someone advertizing oil filters on this video

[@Reason077]

I always get cheesy ads for solar panels when I watch Bjørn's videos. Or an ocean clean up charity. Or, occasionally, Norway tourism ads.

[@randallnicely760]

Hey Bjorn, will you be having a look at the new Hyundai ioniq,???

[@felixklusener5530]

@Randall Nicely Look on his Facebook page. He tested the new Ioniq in the Netherlands today.

[@randallnicely760]

@@felixklusener5530 thank you.👍🏾

[@gerbre1]

It's always good to know the history of the car, the percentage of DC charging versus AC charging. DC means higher degradation. Bjørn, do you know how the car was charged in the past?

[@Haveagrated]

Gerd, it's not really the charging itself but how long the cars stays at high SOC. So rapid charging 2 or 3 times a day and than coming home at 50% is actually better than coming home early say 2pm charging full and than driving next day in the morning. Nobody does it of course at least in the UK where we have cheaper night rates but some dealers do keep theirs EVs charged at 100% for days and they don't even know how badly it's affecting the battery health.

[@MikeDeeee]

@@Haveagrated And to add to that, high SOC is especially bad when at high temperature. So what you want to avoid is to have multiple HPC charging sessions always to high SOC on a hot summer's day. Or charge to 100% just before parking your car for a couple of weeks on an outside parking lot (e.g. at an airport). Always best to be around 50% when not using the car for longer periods.

[@gerbre1]

Mike Dee Currently I‘m parking the car for longer times at around 80%. That‘s too high I guess. I will reduce it to 70%. Lower than that I will get range axiety.

[@MikeDeeee]

@@gerbre1 Hard to say. If your car or wallbox supports it, you can also set it up so it charges to 50% when you plug in, and then to 80%, 90% or 100% just in time for you to leave.

[@dragospahontu]

It doesn't matter that much if the battery is cooled

[@sonytest5601]

Do you calculate regenerated energy during bracking?

[@moestrei]

The Ioniq does

[@osterreichischerflochlandl4940]

Old information, but nevertheless: Maybe the Ioniq does only show the consumption of the drive train but does it also include energy consumption for electronics and heating? The temperature display showed 15°C and you were going with a T-shirt for 2,75hrs? I don't think so. You may have to add at least 0,23kW*2,75hrs=0,63kWh just for electronics consumption and maybe another 0,5kWh for heating. In total that would then be 25.77+0.63+0.5 = 26.9 kWh, i.e. 3.9% degradation.

[@colinmaynard2879]

Didn't the app (before you pulled over to recharge) 28.5kWh and 1.0kWh regen so 27.5 used?

[@bjornnyland]

Don't trust the app. And watch the whole video to understand what was going on.

[@pinedorecords]

I am contemplating purchasing one today. Do you recommend? Please advise 😊

[@constructioneerful]

Yes. Excellent car fast charging and very efficient.

[@colinoverton790]

Wow an EV Ioniq, very rare in the UK.

[@rab6121]

Colin Overton In Norway they stopped selling the hybrid version. It didn’t sell at all. Only the EV is popular. Same with Kona. 99% is electric, they also stopped selling the gas version now.

[@moestrei]

I thought 28kWh is the gross capacity and the nett would be about 26kWh meaning almost no degradation ? Correct me, if I'm wrong. That was confirmed by SOH = 100% also...they just reduced the top and bottom buffer a little. Cooling the battery....surely they do not suck in air from the inside and dump hot air inside again, must be to the outside. Great car,the Ioniq Classic!

[@HenriZwols]

Hyundai lists battery capacity as useful capacity. Therefore the gross capacity is larger than Hyundai lists.

[@silviu7568]

The gross capacity is 30.5 kwh on ioniq and nett is 28.

[@zechrisd1]

nett capacity around 26.5kwh so yes degradation (visible degradation) is around 0%. First time I disagree with Bjorn

[@silviu7568]

@@zechrisd1 i do own an Ioniq and the net capacity is 28 kwh , that's for sure and i guess you're wrong...

[@zechrisd1]

@@silviu7568 It's not what we noticed on french forum automobiles-propre. Did you ever charged more than 26.5kwh ?

[@markfitzpatrick6692]

I would love 24kwh I can get max 10kwh in my 2012 leaf

[@Haveagrated]

It's sad :( I'm sure you can get Kia/Hyundai used EV soon as these are getting really affordable now.

[@stevejordan4299]

Does it mean that you would complete the 1000km challenge 8% quicker in a new Ioniq 28kwh.

[@jor7137]

No, because the top of the battery is charged slowly anyway.

[@adrianguggisberg3656]

Something is wrong with this Ioniq. My Ioniq has more km on the clock and I don’t get such shitty charging performance nor do I have any degradation outside the buffer. I keep records of the consumption since the beginning, which allow me to calculate a difference in capacity and it hasn’t changed at all. So far, the buffer has swallowed all existing degradation. Your Ioniq either was abused or has some other problem

[@samgal3435]

Not so bad with my LR model 3 i've already reached 6% by driving 15k km or so...

[@Hans-gb4mv]

A lot of fast charging I assume? Cause if not, I would not like to call that normal.

[@samgal3435]

@@Hans-gb4mv don't really know ... Is let's say 1 supercharger charge /week for 2mo + 4 trips over the 15k km a lot ? I've been told the degradation is non linear you get a peak at the very beginning then merely nothing ...

[@dragospahontu]

@@Hans-gb4mv fast charging doesn't matter on batteries that are cooled, batteries are a lottery sometimes. Maybe you get a good one that will last 10 years with 1%deg, or a bad one that will get 1%deg after 1 year.

[@Hans-gb4mv]

@@dragospahontu time to go back to school. Heat is only part of the issue. Think of it like a rubber band. The more times you stretch it, the less force you can put on it.

[@dragospahontu]

@@Hans-gb4mv that is also true, but heat is the main problem, after charging cycles. Probably if you drive .mostly in the city, you will have less charging cycles.

[@josephjohn907]

People say that it is the best ev

[@SamsomiteMight]

People are wrong

[@Haveagrated]

Best EV for newbies and short distance travellers. I got Soul 30kWh and it's even more perfect for me as I use it as a daily work van in my town. Perfect size, length (better than Ioniq as it's more compact and shorter) flat roof so easy to put ladders on. 10 times better than ENV200 by Nissan.

[@MikeDeeee]

@@Haveagrated There are many EVs for short distances. But for a long time the Ioniq was the best BEV for long distances if you didn't have the money for a Tesla Model S or X (no Model 3 in Europe then). You had to stop often, but not for a long time, and you could drive fast. Björn managed an average speed of 81.6 km/h with the Ioniq of this video over 1000 km; with a new one and perfect conditions you can get to around 88 km/h (24 hour record is 2106 km).

[@clayton4115]

would not it have been easier to get the SOH % to see the degradation ?

[@bjornnyland]

SoH can't be used.

[@afr11235]

Def a cool test. However, my guess is that you actually have zero visible degradation. The battery is 10% larger than 28kWh both to protect the battery and give a buffer as the car ages so drivers will not notice a range drop. You measured 28575 Wh out, 1025 Wh regen, so 27550 Wh net out. With 4% displayed SOC, this implies a full battery of 28.7kWh The actual size of the battery is 28.8kWh, so pretty close. At this point I'm afraid I have to point out that the SOC indicator is the most inaccurate part of the situation. Unfortunately, SOC is most inaccurate right after the battery is disturbed through charging. If we assume the SOC is about 95% accurate, 94% SOC could be 89 to 99, so who knows what the real SOC is after your 24.8kWh charging session. This is partly why fast chargers are never allowed to charge the vehicle to 100% (and the BMS will never allow a true 100% charge anyways).

[@hollymolly518]

battery doesn't only degrade with usage also degrade with time.

[@DeerKoden]

Correct, but modern batteries are more stable than the ones you'd find in the I-miev and such cars from around 2010. Also, keeping battery temperature under control has improved things quite a lot.

[@MikeDeeee]

And calendric degradation depends a lot on the SOC. So for someone with a short commute that leaves at 08:00, uses 5% each way and who plugs in when he gets home at 17:00 every day, the car sits at 100% SOC for 60% of the time, and at 95% SOC 35% of the time (the rest is driving or charging between 90% and 100%). This would result in very high calendric degradation, and even more so if the car is parked outside in the heat.

[@AB-yt4hd]

@@DeerKoden The C-zero (aka I-miev) I own from 2015 (50000km) is perfectly fine. I didn't notice any degradation yet (and with so small range, I will notice a degration very quickly, especially in winter). I worry much more about the transmission as some people had problems with it. But so far so good ;) no problem for me yet.

[@DeerKoden]

@@AB-yt4hd is it one of the latter packs with the SCiB tech?

[@AB-yt4hd]

@@DeerKoden No, as far as I know, the SCiB packs where only for I-Miev sold in Japan. It is a 16kWh pack with LEV50 Lithium-Ion cells.

[@lelisamohamed4355]

Digadation test

[@hemmper]

13:32 My wife actually stays 25. But the upkeep is costly as I keep marrying a new girl every year.

[@BaraDun.-]

How is it in terms of handling? Comfort of travel? Road noise?

[@joeyjeremiahkkf]

Handles well with a low centre of gravity, silent and vibration-free ride, and road noise is well dampened (although the Michelins they provide could be better).

[@AdamDadeby]

What's the name of the Ioniq app? "Can ??"

[@stokesd3]

CanIoniq. It's on Play Store.

[@AdamDadeby]

@@stokesd3 Thanks.

[@azera55555]

why does the new ioniq have slower charging speeds??

[@martinchromy206]

It has lower number of battery cells than the old one, so it starts with lower voltage(and therefore power) and also end at lower voltage. Same reason why e-Golf charges slower.

[@felixklusener5530]

They use a different kind of cells with less cobalt now. The new cells are cheaper and better for the environment, but they can't be charged with 2,4 C like the old cells.

[@evexperience7756]

The battery is if I remember correct 31 kWh. Why you ended up with only 25 kWh is hard to understand. Did you recharge to 100% with an AC top up after the dc stops at 94%? There are Ioniq with over 120,000 km with no degradation so maybe the battery has a defect?

[@simoncanfer5030]

The useable capacity is 28kWh, new. Maybe 31kWh gross. Bjorn corrected for the 90% charge - this battery certainly has some degradation. Even though the BMS reports 100% health :)

[@marqueswilsonn]

60k miles and 8%battery lose? Terrible

[@Haveagrated]

Hahaha haha. Most people claimed you won't even get to 100000km before battery dies so 8% seems like a real bargain. Your ICE engine and turbo are usually 30-50% worn when reaching 100k miles and this is for good decent ones. Most of my friends already replaced turbos in their ICE cars or even engines in 150k cars and for latest BMW this could be nearly the cost of replacing the pack with a new one.

[@TBasianeyes]

Well with a turbo car it is just like with an electric car. You need to take care of it to get maximum lifetime out of it. Turbo: No hammering when cold, no parking directly after hammering, good oil (no 5W30) and more frequent oil changes than recommended. Electric: No charging to 100%, no fast charging when battery is hot, no deep cycling, no hammering when battery is extremely cold.

[@Haveagrated]

Thank you for your comment. It seems there are some people claiming that 8% degradation per 100000km is bad so just wanted to enlighten these sort of drivers that their daily driven ICE cars are far worse and they are quite happy with it, even more, they expect it to be this way. Eg. If the turbo on a modern Diesel starts smoking they say 'yep, that's about time as it says in the book 150k Turbo life span' Same goes for injectors, engines, and really there is DPF and EGR which won't last that long, and driven in the city can cause hundreds of problems every year to mislead drivers (taught for years that Diesel is the best car ever, greener than the plant itself) Sadly many don't know how bad for environment Diesel is and how much it costs to repair it and maintain. 8% loss of battery capacity seems like a peanut especially it does not at stall the car and does not affect daily driving for 99% of population (10-50miles to get to work). Choked DPF or filthy EGR valve do affect the car and moat likely won't even let you get to work (limp mode or just won't even start).

[@dragospahontu]

@@Haveagrated but it is still pretty bad. It should be standard to get like 5% in 10 years. Otherwise EVs will become too disposable.

[@hectortruquis9258]

Did you see SOH?

[@bjornnyland]

Check the end of the video.

[@hectortruquis9258]

@@bjornnyland SOH is 100% = batery 100% capacity

[@JohnDoe-vx3z]

The BMS is rigged, so it is difficult to make accurate statements about degradation. I however think the battery health % value reflects the user perceived capacity.

[@HenriZwols]

Your wife may not stay 25 but she is Asian, like that car. Asians tent to preserve longer.

[@agapewindhoek]

Or saying that an ICE will have the same power output and compression after 92000Km,....... in your dreams big boys..... I wonder what Chanos and Lutz have to say for themselves after their predictions fell so short..... Poor big boys...... their toys are still only toys compared to the Tesla and the only car to come close to to the Tesla but that still falls short is the Porsch(e) Tycan........

[@dragospahontu]

Lexus/Toyota can actually have the same compression after 500,000km if properly maintained. The EU should mandate strict laws to make manufacturers put proper batteries in cars. Otherwise they will become disposable products, became no one will want a used EV.

[@curiouspeople6441]

That is worst than Tesla

[@pawek9528]

Get old Leaf with 200kkm mileage and you realize that car with 80km range is rubbish.

[@Haveagrated]

Leaf is the worst EV of the whole lot. Bad design and no improvement. Why would you Base your experience on a car which was a newbie and had tons of design flaws? Move forward man, don't think like Nissan!

[@joeaverager]

@@Haveagrated Actually in 2017 or so Nissan chamged their battery chemistry. Look up the lizard battery. Yeah, odd name. Supposedly corrects many of the original battery short comings but yeah, no liquid cooling.

[@PeterEVcharade]

OBD seems to be showing total out of the battery, whether the charge got there by charging from the wall or from regen while driving. So, you could have a capacity of (say) 25kWh and get 5kWh through regen during a drive from 100% to 0% and the OBD would count 25+5=30kWh as coming out of the 25kWh battery. It would count 5kWh that went in from regen on a separate line. To see the real battery capacity, you would have to subtract total regen from the total battery out.