I Asked My Friend WHY She Had a Plantation Wedding \\ Tips on How to Have an Anti-Racist Wedding

This week I had a conversation with my friend @Abby Cox 's about her Plantation Wedding at a plantation home and bed and breakfast outside Richmond, Virginia.
Recently Blake Lively and Ryan Reynold's Plantation Wedding has been back in the blogs after they apologized.
They admitted their plantation weddings was a mistake that can be avoided.
Abby shows that even allies make mistakes, and she provides us with her insights on how to move beyond the regret of having a plantation wedding. She also provides some last minute tips on what to do if you are having a plantation wedding and are already feeling the sting of regret.
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[@Chamanthaify]

"Get married in your backyard with your friends and eat tacos" hahaha this is what my husband and I did - best decision ever. We rented an Airbnb on a lake, got married in the backyard, and catered tacos. It was great.

[@HalfNHalf.]

Haha that’s what I’m doing for my wedding on September 26th lol we were gonna do tacos but we decided we needed something that people wouldn’t have to put together themselves because of covid. So we’re doing wings😂

[@capucnechaussonpassion14]

The only acceptable way of doing a wedding !! Although maybe i would have chosen something else for the food but i'm from europe hahaha (even though homemade tacos can be amazingly good)

[@Chamanthaify]

Capuc!ne Chaussonpassion hahaha totally understandable. Tacos have always been a celebratory meal for us - though I couldn’t tell you why. New Years? Tacos! New job? Tacos! Moved to a new house? TACOS! So it fit for us. Though when we first thought of doing tacos we did do a bit of a back and forth of ‘wait... can we do tacos? Is that okay?’ Everyone seemed to enjoy them so it worked out.

[@blackdiamond4001]

Not gonna lie I would want that in my future wedd👌

[@SteppingStonevlogs]

Yes, to have all your loved ones with you but not spend tens of thousands of pounds on just one day. I would rather travel with my husband and see world together...make some memories to treasure when life gets busy and complex 😌

[@Kiki-7]

If everyone called them forced labour camps rather than a plantation it wouldn't cross peoples mind to be married there.

[@theforgetfulnugget8971]

I agree.

[@lauryn7840]

True

[@hunnyflash]

Idk how people can't have a negative connotation with the word "plantation". A plantation is a place specifically associated with slavery, even outside of the South.

[@JM-hn6vg]

Yeah, forced "labor" camps.

[@a.ml.t.9289]

That’s true if that’s what it was today but it’s not. It’s a big house now. It’s no longer that. There is not one slave in this country. Nobody not one citizen living has been enslaved. Every culture has been discriminated against and enslaved and this chick is discriminating against and shaming her friend publicly which is sad. I’d never do that to my best friend . I’m tired of hearing black people white people that’s racism because we are all supposed to be brothers and sisters no groups of people

[@maryk6678]

The major distinction between the U.S. and Germany is that Germany has a fierce academic curriculum that reveals the horrors of WWII to future generations. There would little to no room to romanticize WWII. There needs to be better way to educate our children to break the cycle! I still marvel at the fact that I was never taught about Black Wallstreet in PUBLIC school 🤦‍♀️

[@sharongrewal3363]

Your comment is spot on, but as a POC asking the question, why do you think this awful history (here in the States) is *not* as aggressively taught as in Germany? I could tell you why right now.....

[@maryk6678]

@@sharongrewal3363 I think partly because slavery is still happening today through mass incarceration. It's a more insidious method and it's honestly disgusting. I can't conceptualize what it's like being a POC right now but I'm sending you a virtual hug. 😔

[@meghankreger4672]

Or systematic racism, or the school to prison pipeline, or prison labor being modern day slavery 😭 really thankful for the BLM movement and that we are able to learn now and listen to convos like these.

[@daniellearias1396]

Idk how old you guys are (no disrespect maybe schools 10 years ago were different) but as a student in the u.s. slavery is aggressively taught and is accepted as a very bad thing. No one romanticizes it and even when I moved to the south everyone agreed it was not a good thing. we were taught about the lives of slaves and given materials to watch and read that were meant to unsettle us and provoke sympathy and outrage. Slavery is not taken lightly and is a topic taught every year from childhood as it should be

[@khaniyah1494]

Neither was I. All of my black history that was never shared in primary years of education. I learned from my parents books documentaries n college

[@saffronsleepsasmr9890]

I'm from England. When I went to visit Shirley Plantation in Virginia I was expecting a very educational, sobering, heartbreaking and educational trip that taught me and my family of the lives and history of the enslaved people that once resided there. It was absolutely nothing like that. We were shown into the main house and toured round every room learning about the family who lived there and the history of ownership of the house. The outhouses had sparse information on some foods and tools that would have been used by the enslaved and that was it. I couldn't believe it. I expected lists of names of the enslaved, exhibits that showed the hardships they went through, reports or diary entries. They basically promoted the enslavers and ignored the enslaved. Is this common in the US? I felt misinformed. Another point to note, is that the "rightful heirs" to the house still lived there.

[@ShawnGoodmanJazz]

You are available correct!!! I agree with you on what the plantations SHOULD be presenting!! 💯

[@cryptbeast3222]

It's very common. Southern pride towards the slavery days is shameless.

[@saffronsleepsasmr9890]

@@cryptbeast3222 wow, that's sad to hear.

[@JM-hn6vg]

Thanks for bringing over slavery to your colonies and starting this mess.

[@JM-hn6vg]

@@ShawnGoodmanJazz There were very few records of slaves' names except for their first names.

[@sarah-annecarney7552]

The was probably the most healthy conversation I have ever witnessed.

[@annejia5382]

A very healthy friendship also 💓

[@tcolley]

Just two people violently agreeing w/ one another

[@isabelament7114]

Two smart people who had different views who came together and had a calm discussion about why they felt that way. Thats what this should be.

[@bondfool]

Such a breath of fresh air.

[@calderondemorales2286]

Right! Wtf! Hahaha goals!

[@drenchaquaculture2680]

"Now that I know better, I do better." -Maya Angelou I am so glad we are having these conversations.

[@JM-hn6vg]

People are still going to visit, explore, and get married at plantations...

[@lauryn7840]

So am I!

[@lauryn7840]

@@JM-hn6vg Doubtful.

[@JM-hn6vg]

@@lauryn7840 No, they will. People have ties to plantations in more ways than one. Many people where I live were indentured servants or tenant farmers to former colonial plantations and manors. It's a connection to their past.

[@yuppers1]

Same. I also didn't think about these things properly. I couldn't see visiting a plantation on a historical tour without learning about slavery but I wouldn't have thought twice about attending a plantation wedding- until now. I know better now.

[@dlatortue1]

She keeps talking about how the home is riddled with trauma but so is the land. The landscape is a burial ground for so many who were never meant to be remembered.

[@jbadams022189]

Amen! Land stolen from the first people’s to be worked by people’s stolen from their land.

[@lynndiehl8126]

Land that was stolen from others long before that.

[@JM-hn6vg]

@@jbadams022189 Who'd the first people take it from?

[@JM-hn6vg]

That's everywhere in the world at some point in time.

[@cookiesaregoodtoeat6612]

This is land stolen from native people, fertilized with the literal blood sweat & tears of enslaved black people.

[@yolandaponkers1581]

As a native Virginian myself, I always wanted a plantation wedding, and I realize how truly horrific that is now. Because the historic plantation museums here are so sanitized and beautified, and the emphasis is placed on the slave owners and their families, the atrocities that occurred on them never came to mind. I just saw gorgeous homes with pretty furniture and manicured gardens. This is such an important discussion and I am so glad that this topic is being covered!

[@SimplyStormy]

And to think that a lot of that furniture was stuffed with the enslaved’s hair…. Horrific. Makes my skin crawl.

[@priscillanazar1152]

Woww my experience is so different and different perceptive. I didn’t know in our areas it was so sensitized

[@spandas590]

Did you end up having your wedding there

[@carinahelened]

Re: You wouldn't get married at Auschwitz. Obviously. So why aren't plantation homes memorial sites? Why is it okay to turn forced labour camps into Bed and Breakfasts? What the hell is up with that?

[@WitchOracle]

I'm guessing it has to do with them being private property rather than originating as state owned. Additionally, Germany had a national reckoning to examine their traumatic past in a way that has never happened in the US. As time has passed since the end of chattel slavery in the US (though I would like to give a gentle reminder to all that slavery is still legal in the US in the form of the prison industrial complex) white southerners have become increasingly protective and nostalgic of the whitewashed history they see as their heritage. The same arguments they have about the use of the (traitorous) Confederate flag and the Confederate monuments erected in the early 20th century by KKK supporters are the same arguments they have about plantations. I say all of this not to defend them but to attempt to explain some context and how these issues are all interconnected. I have to wonder if we had conversations with people to remind them that plantations were 1) forced labor camps, 2) more comparable to the horrors of concentration camps than they are to the average family farm, and 3) historical sites that should be examined rather than celebrated, would we change some minds? Would people ask more questions of these sites? How many of us demanding more honest and equitable representations of history would it take to change the narrative? Alternatively... Can we find an organization with lots of money to buy up these properties and do right by their history? Turn them into memorials and museums and historical sites that don't present the trauma in their soil through a rose colored lens.

[@NotYourMommasHistory]

Great questions,

[@mcwjes]

Exactly!

[@lilyann168]

@@WitchOracle"has to do with them being private property rather than originating as state owned." Hit the nail on the head. It was probably alot easier for the German gov't to decide what to do with their concentration/labor camps, in one fell swoop, because they already owned them. In the U.S., the gov't would have had to approach each family one by one to try and convince them. I wonder if "imminent domain" could have been used. But you know how us Americans are about our property...that would not have gone over well, IMO. Also not trying to excuse, just working out the reason. It really is an interesting question.

[@stillhuntre55]

@@WitchOracle Just for the record - Auschwitz is in Poland. Their nation was invaded by the Nazis, so making it a memorial was about national mourning.

[@ninobk196]

This is why inter-racial and inter-cultural friendships/relationships are so important. We have more to learn from each other than not, and it can be done in a constructive and in a safe environment where both people can ask questions about any given situation, and learn a different perspective. Regardless of whether each agrees or disagrees. The dialogue and exchange is the most important. A close friend of mine who is white also had a plantation wedding in Georgia. My boyfriend and I flew in for the wedding, and we were probably 4 black people there. We were so uncomfortable the whole time, I think I cried at one point because it was so emotional. I couldn't enjoy the wedding. I was happy for my friend's big day but I just couldn't enjoy it. We spoke about it later on but I just couldn't understand how she didn't see that this wasn't ok. It never occurred to her so it was literally out of ignorance and it was an opportunity to have an educated conversation about it. She was really embarrassed and apologized to my boyfriend directly. I also wondered what the white folks thought but I figured they were just tone deaf or ignorant.

[@sweetspicypepper]

If I were your friend I would be so horrified to hear this 😥 It really is the height of ignorance and privilege to not consider the impact this would have on your guests, even more so if they're already in the minority at your wedding. I live in Chicago so this is not something I've ever considered for a few reasons, but thank you for sharing your story for anyone who might think of having a plantation wedding.

[@ninobk196]

@Laura Nwogu It benefits both because often times we make assumptions and have preconceived notions about each other, so we both benefit from listening and learning from each other. I have never met a white person or any friend for that matter that I couldn't freely have these conversations with in my 47 years of adulthood. My experience has been that most people are open to listening and learning, if the delivery and space is conducive to a dialogue and civil conversation where everyone's opinions will be heard, without bashing or judgements. The experience I had with my friend was 25 years ago. As soon as I mentioned it, she was completely open, apologized and wanted to learn as to why her getting married in a plantation was hurtful to us, and that opened up a lot of conversations. I also wanted to know how she was so tone deaf. This opened a lot of opportunities for her to understand where I/we were coming from, and I also listened and learned where she was coming from, even though to me it was from a place of ignorance, but at least I knew where she was coming from and it shaped how to have the conversation in a meaningful and respectful way where both of us learned from each other as opposed to creating a chasm..

[@ngreat4390]

Who's to say her ancestors didn't fight for the freedom of black slaves? Once a person is white, bam, they're the offspring of the enemy but no one remembers there were white people on the right side of history who fought for freedom also and she could easily be a descendant.

[@ninobk196]

@@sweetspicypepper When we spoke about it she was pretty shocked and distraught. She was very ashamed at her ignorance which led to her lack of sensitivity, but it was not intentional. It literally was at the height of ignorance. But I think moments like these are opportunities for important dialogues. I have friends of many different countries and ethnic backgrounds. I have lived in 4 continents. There have been many times I have asked questions or said things that were insensitive to the other person. It was out of not knowing/ignorance, and they knew me enough to know my intentions. Had they not explained to me why certain topics were "off limits" and the reasons why, I could have carried on. They cared enough to explain things to me, and I was open to receive it.

[@sweetspicypepper]

@@ninobk196 your friends are lucky to have you! You don't owe anyone that patience and grace, but I hear you that it can be a learning and ...maybe even healing experience for everyone when we can give eachother honest, open, loving space to work this stuff out.

[@kimberlysh88]

A winery is just as beautiful and doesn't have this tragic history.

[@ClassicBulletsTV]

that part !!!!

[@MissMustang98]

Are we sure about that? Is the winery on land that was stolen from the Native Americans? Was there ever a battle of any kind there where humans lost their lives? California had slaves from Mexico, as well.

[@toasted_mello]

@@MissMustang98 every piece of land in the states is stolen from natives, by that logic it seems you cant get married anywhere except a reservation

[@jenniferlara2715]

... I don't think so.

[@laurainasia]

Right? I thought she was a history buff and that’s why she’s buddies with McKnight.. How could she overlook the history of a plantation??

[@nolagirl7082]

I give this girl lots of props for telling her story! The Internet and social media is not forgiving, and neither are comments on KZbin and she knew that she was going to get some bad ones, but she told her truth, and I appreciate the fact that she was honest about it

[@kristopherchandler8034]

YOU SAID IT PERFECTLY!!! Today’s social media world likes to burn people on the cross if you do one thing wrong but yet they all hide behind their keyboards with their flawed lives. I don’t even wanna have kids because the world is 10x worst then when I was a kid…. It’s sad

[@GettinFiggyWitIt]

She's completely fake. She's only bringing this up before someone tries to cancel her for it. She has worked extensively in historical fashion for a very long time. She knew, it didn't bother her then. It only upsets her now because she's terrified of being called a racist. She got to have her beautiful wedding and then pull the ladder up for everyone else and say "you're such a bad person for having a wedding at a place that glorified slavery." People need to quit being so hung up on this shit.

[@chykim1]

Before he was executed, Ted Bundy also told the truth🤷

[@fairybliss7772]

Where was she canceled?

[@Rosemary46840]

@@GettinFiggyWitItyou could’ve had a point until the last sentence smh

[@ninegreydaisies]

I think calling them what they were, the forced labor camps, really helps break the romanticization of these "homes". This was the first time I had heard them referred to in that manner even though I knew that was essentially what they were. And that probably contributes to the problem of people thinking having weddings there is acceptable. Thank you both for sharing this conversation.

[@TheSerialHobbyistGirl]

Ed Baptist calls them forced labor camps in his book The Half Has Never Been Told. That was pretty radical at the time (2014, not that long ago!) He also calls the forced labor torture.

[@nataliejohnson9526]

Forced labour camp and torture and rape camps.

[@jorieshouse]

Cheyney actually addesses this at the end of the video: plantations were not primaily homes. The majority of the space and function is dedicated to labour, in this case forced labour of enslaved people.

[@michelea2326]

I find it weird that "plantation" doesn't ring as negative with people. That word stirs all sorts of bag energy in my actually body & spirit when I simply hear it. When I traveled to New Orleans for vacation, before I left so many people asked me "Oh! Are you going to take plantation tour!? The homes are so pretty!" When I gave a resounding "No! Why would I do that!?" everyone's eyes would widen and you would see people get uncomfortable. I'm too aware of the history I couldn't stand on that soil and not fall apart.

[@kobaltkween]

I'd actually say they were worse than that. They kidnapped people, held them captive, and abused them in all ways, not just forcing them to work. This is where children were raped. Where women were chained to beds, "bred," and then had their children sold. For generations. It's like if the movie "Room" was real, but when she tried to get away, the people who found her brought her back to her abuser, took part in her punishment, and then her boy was sold away from her. Oh, and yeah, they both work to the point that the work actually kills a fair amount of people. Still, I think the captivity and the sexual abuse are pretty key parts of that.

[@SMey54]

The reason that plantations are not memorials is because the “Rebel South” (institutionalized racism) is still held in fond remembrance - romanticized. We should treat plantations as places of torture and death.

[@myplaylists6310]

Yes! Like how antebellum parties STILL happen on college campuses! So privileged and so messed up

[@b2kzangelalwayz]

Alllllll of this

[@owowotsthis11]

I completely disagree

[@tracim3080]

@@owowotsthis11 look I’m white and Canadian so coming from a completely unbiased perspective. Plantations were places of murder torture and rape. They just are, that’s their history. Disagreeing with history is silly.

[@NYCITY3]

And watching Gone with the Wind.

[@Adinamfeldman]

It’s so eerie, the disparity between the horrific trauma and abuse of black people on the plantations and the aesthetic beauty of the nature and architecture on the property. It’s really astounding how such polar opposites could exist at the same time.

[@jesseleeward2359]

Not if you consider the pyramids or the the roman ruins or the the skyscrapers in New York where people just sat on the top without anything preventing them from falling

[@agood1]

the people who enslaved people, liked nice things. Its not wonder thebhouses are nice.

[@大城泉-c7d]

Shadows can only exist in the light.

[@jfcarrier9352]

Nice and big houses are a way to show wealth and power 🤷‍♂️

[@aazhie]

@@jesseleeward2359 Many of Egypt's pyramids were not actually built on slave labor. Workers on Egyptian pyramids specifically were artisans and many were buried near their art with their names recorded on their own tombs. I don't know about the South American pyramids, so can't speak for their history

[@AJ-jz3nb]

As a French women, I had no idea "plantation weddings" even existed. But then again, I work at an American WWII cemetery and people come to take wedding pictures there... so I shouldn't be surprised. I loved your conversation. Thank you for sharing!

[@Chris-oo7lr]

O.o I am French too and had no idea plantation weddings existed until I saw this video today. As a Black French woman, I can't say I did not tear up... But people come to take wedding pictures at an American WWII cemetery? What? Est-ce que je peux me permettre de te demander de quel cimetière il s'agit? Je suis super choquée... Il y a tellement de superbes endroits où on peut prendre des photos de mariage, je comprends pas...

[@l0v3lyniaa]

f-f-french people 😟⁉️

[@bonbonvegabon]

wedding shoots at military cemeteries? BAHAHAHAHHA MURICA!

[@margaretk.collins7113]

@@bonbonvegabon When my friends got married, they took photos at a military cemetery so they could get a shot with their still living grandmother and their grandfathers headstone who had been killed in Normandy. so it might not be a photo shoot so much as a way to include the dead in the life of the living

[@meh2481]

Yes because American whites don't like taking Accountability and deny trama

[@theodoreyoungman2111]

My brain didnt connect the significance of it until Abby mentioned Auschwitz and how people would feel if someone got married there. I'm not american, so I'm not as up on american history as others, but the Auschwitz reference really hit it home for me. I feel like a wedding in that setting would be horrific.

[@LadyDragonbane]

I agree 100%! It's one thing to know that something is bad but you understand things in a different way when it is compared to something more familiar.

[@BlitzsieLDiscoLSnow]

Yeah, exactly. I'm from the Netherlands and the only US history I had was in A-level history in high school (I think, not sure about what 4, 5 & 6 VWO translates to in US high school). We had a big chapter on Europe-focused colonialism, so we understood those horrors, a bit. And the last year of high school was basically from WW I to now, including watching films like "the boy in striped pajamas" and "saving private Ryan", which hit home the gruesomeness of that. But US slavery was more a passing mention of "oh yeah Western Indies Company we bought slaves in Africa and sold them to plantations in the US, which was bad, we don't do it anymore and we're trying to be more inclusive now". Nothing more. We get some political stuff that is related to European history (like the economic crash in 2008), but not much more than that. Comparing plantation weddings to Auschwitz really drove home the horror, because I know how bad Auschwitz was, but was never taugh explicitly how bad plantations were.

[@briannaesparza6657]

I didn’t make that connection either, and I’m black and my family is from the south.

[@TahtahmesDiary]

I'm really glad people are finally seeing this for what it is because people often act like we are exaggerating or just not moving on, but the reality is the Black Holocaust was devastating and the bones of our Ancestors literally line the ocean from Africa to the USA (and other countries) and that was just the beginning of the doubly horrific experience of chattel slavery-- some of the worst living conditions known to man for generations following. We aren't crazy and people get angry at us for making sure people remember and remember correctly.

[@SobrietyandSolace]

@@BlitzsieLDiscoLSnow Your honesty about this is really appreciated. Whilst we find ourselves banging our head against the walls thinking 'why don't they understand why this is a big deal/racist?' I appreciated that is just about the penny not dropping because of a lack of education or not framing the history in a certain way that you can identify with/relate to more.

[@YT4Me57]

I think that I was 8 or 9 years old when I realized that I wouldn't have been dancing in a grand fancy gown in the ballroom of a plantation mansion in those 1930s movies about the old South. To my horror, it occurred to me that I would more than likely be helping the mistress into her dress, grooming her hair, fanning the guests and putting up with nasty conversations about the problem with Northerners who were taking up for the "N-words". And then 4 little girls were blown up at Sunday School in the 16th Street Baptist Church. Talk about trauma.

[@wildflowerwanderlust692]

Wow. That is powerful.

[@madelinegutierrez1720]

Wow - I honor and appreciate you life experience. Yes - I have never thought in that scenario I would not have been dancing.

[@amypattie7004]

Wow, that is horrible, I’m so sorry you had to go through that

[@TABULOUS1]

Yeah. I have a nostalgic Spirit in terms of fashion/style/decor too, but it didn't take a whole lifetime of suffering apologists FOR ME to use my commonsense from a young age either. Fortunately though, mine didn't end cause trauma. It just inspired me to be aware of the CHARACTER of humans whose paths I cross and to choose My personal circles wisely... as did HarriettTubman. I ALWAYS recognize the ppl whose company is NOT a 'safe space' for ppl who look like Me #IndigoWomanProblems -- INCLUDING those who look like me, but always seem to find justification for colonized thinking/behavior. The latter are (skinfolks) whom I ALSO keep out of my personal circle and with whom I doNOT prioritize sharing Ancestral knowledge/wisdom. I'm proud of you and happy for you that you employed your intelligent freethinking & knew better from a young age. Few rarely do. May that consciousness continue to keep you protected as We suffer the orange regime. ✊🏽👸🏽💜

[@sophieplumbob2900]

God bless. This is something I too had to realize as a WOC myself. The world isn’t perfect now but I’m glad that things are getting better, conversations are being had, and rights are being wronged. And as frivolous as it as anyone of any color is able to dance in beautiful gown inside a ballroom. We still have a long way to go though.

[@crystalwilson8766]

As an African American, I thought when racial missteps happened it was a conscious choice. However, watching Abby become so distraught, I realized some choices are not made with ill intent. I would hope more honest conversations could happen like these to further healing.

[@melodymay4888]

This is a great way to put it! The conversations and honesty and learning encourages things like this to be less present and makes people more aware of issues like this

[@betsyb]

a lot of people tend to think they’re conscious choices, but i would say, as a white person, the majority of the time they’re not. there’s just a lack of understanding and perspective that needs to be unlearned

[@tchaney3777]

There is a lot of micro-racism that occurs that conversations like this help bring to light.

[@recklessmermaid]

nooooooo its so rarely a conscious choice with everyday people...our whiteness is a form of blindness honestly. and that's not an excuse, but we really look at the world through the lens of white privilege

[@ashakir622]

Frankly, it's the well-intentioned decisions that are all the more dangerous because they often go unnoticed. Abby summed it up very well by emphasizing the ignorance stemming from white privilege that goes into racist decisions and actions on the regular. The fact of the matter is, you can be a decent person with a heart of gold, but that doesn't mean none of your actions ever perpetuate huge problems like racism. Until ignorance gets nipped in the bud, this is a serious problem that can't be fully dismantled.

[@africajourney2182]

If only I had the money to buy a plantation house...I would write a sign on the outside of the house that says, To my ancestors that were enslaved on this plantation, this house is now yours.

[@tuesdaytalaga]

Where’s the gofundme tho? ✨ we can make this happen 👀

[@kthy31]

Yes I'm in!

[@Annimations]

I lived in a slave house converted to a apartment once and my landlord was a very beautiful lady who did just this!

[@Tadpole_Plyrr2]

Totally possible! I’m sure there are some bills somewhere saying which slave was bought and where they went to maybe with research you can find direct descendents and which plantation house they lived in

[@Goldenretriever-k8m]

Omgosh, they are dirt cheap though! Washington, Georgia was fairly unscathed in the civil war and has lots of them. Some of them are really well kept and of course pretty. It's so weird. It's like what do you do with them? I also think of the estates in Europe that royal and elite families owned, the money that built a lot of those places came from colonization and slavery in Africa and the New World.

[@britneymiles6246]

The reason these houses are so "big and beautiful" is because they weren't paying for labor. Slavery was a billion dollar industry in America. Even some big businesses today wouldn't exist without that benefit. When admiring the beauty, always remember how it was obtained.

[@aboz8649]

Word

[@wolftownesque]

Yeh even tho the south had less people (slaves were considered 1/3 a person) they had immense wealth because of slave labor. Their profits were 100%.

[@britneymiles6246]

@@wolftownesque Absolutely, and it even helped with the South's voting power.

[@christopherramsey4083]

As a black person. I literally would love to own one of there homes, but yea the trauma is so real. Even thinking about things walking to up to one, just hurts. But I want them Slave owners to be rolling in there graves.

[@javencummins1426]

@@christopherramsey4083 My mother (a black women) bought a house that used to be a slaver's family home. And going to it made me feel so empowered, so it is a double sword.

[@missSDW]

When she’s explaining how nobody said anything I’m wondering if that’s bc nobody invited were descendants of those impacted by this sort of trauma. A lot of ppl ignore what doesn’t apply to them.

[@eternallyrising1673]

“A lot of people ignore what doesn’t apply to them” YES

[@brooklyngirl89]

Exactly! She stated that seeing plantation on the marquee had no emotion in her mind and I immediately said its because you have no negatives feelings about it. You get to live your life without ever having to see a negative scope of the world that you live in day in and day out. No

[@ZairaBandy]

@@brooklyngirl89 so you would say everyone in the world should now all the horrific things that people have suffer in the past and in the present?? there are such bad things happening everywhere that it is difficult to know everything of everyone. You would have to research black american history, child trafficking, indigenous genocides, slavery, drug problems, woman being kill just because they are woman in Latin countries etc, LGTQ+ being murder. So much problematic things that you cant know everything and fight all the fights.

[@verlisawitt7137]

Zaira Bandy it would be unrealistic to expect anyone to know everything about the world. But Americans should know American history and Black American history is American History. America is notorious for hiding the ugly parts of American history from its people.

[@novatjerneld6764]

Yeah, as a Swede half of the wedding party probably didnt even know what a plantation was. I learned that first when I went to America.

[@mauriciomadera2498]

I completely understand this topic. In Mexico we have “Haciendas” colonial villas and estates that also have a terrible history about the exploitation of peasants in the past (that actually lead to the Mexican Revolution in the 1910s), but today they are tourist attractions and are widely used for weddings as well. People in all the Americas should be aware about this too.

[@SaVi3361]

That was what I was thinking about. These places are not so different to the plantations that our northern neighbors had, so why are we not talking about it?

[@alejandramoreno6625]

I just thought about that, and the ones in Yucatán used actual slave labour. I know people, woke people who got married in haciendas in Yucatán and never thought about it.

[@lifewithklc]

I never knew that, thank you so much for sharing that.

[@mellflowers]

Same thing in Brasil. Depending which state you're from, nearly every historical place is laced with slavery history

[@theguest4516]

Great reminder. Cuz it's all the same 💩💩💩.

[@bethanya99]

I remember as a teen going to a cousin's wedding in South Carolina described as "A Farmhouse Venue". When we arrived my Mom and I looked at each other and were like, "Oh my God, this is a plantation. People actually get MARRIED here!?" We asked my Aunt about it, and she told us, "It's fine hunny, it's the South". My cousin now deeply regrets her attitude and is embarrassed about it.

[@zuzannaosiak5665]

@@martid03 God didn't put any "natural beauty" there. Plantations, doesn't matter how fancy and pretty, were build in people suffering, for people suffering. Calling it a "Farmhouse" is just burying its disgusting nature and history. Honestly, all of them should be either turned into museums, memorials, or destroyed. Using former plantations as wedding venues or hotels is disgusting.

[@Alesana907]

I stayed in Georgia with my aunt for a summer many years ago and coming from philly it was a complete culture shock. The plantation homes, the statues of Confederate leaders and even just the sheer pride of waving Confederate flags was just baffling to me. You really see how proud these people are with their "heritage". I never understood how people were so proud of waving around a traitorous flag that never represented America and in fact represents separating and going against America

[@Sika6061]

@@abbiem1263 Yeah, and if you're from Georgia, they'll talk about the reason there are so few plantations compared to other states is because of Sherman's March, and they say it with disappointment. The south is a whole 'nother country.

[@e.jenima7263]

OMG it is teachnicly not a plantaion.....just another historical home, nothing to feel bad about in itself.

[@twebster179]

@@e.jenima7263 you can say that because YOUR ancestors were not traumatized and tortured there. Did you not actually WATCH this, or did you just watch it to defend your butthurt?

[@angelwingsamore]

I live in Virginia and the amount of plantation imagery is insane. There is a neighborhood that was built in the past 15 years that is named (blank) plantation with contemporary houses and I genuinely think people are just ignorant and think plantation means “fancy southern house” instead of a place of profound sadness.

[@Lillyk96]

Absolutely I live in MD and people see them as an "Old Farm with a Big Fancy House" not place that exists FOR the enslavement of people. So many places in the US exist because of slavery and/or genocide but the Plantation (like a concentration camp) exists to continue and up hold that institution.

[@turtlewrenandbee]

I think this is partly because all of the areas in which enslaved people were forced to live have been torn down decades ago. All we physically see the big white house where, in some sense, the prison warden lived, while the prisons themselves have vanished to be replaced by pretty gardens and big trees. Because we can't see the evidence of the horrors anymore, it's made it easier to forget.

[@TahtahmesDiary]

I believe if they had to verbalize what was "southern" they'd do a Freudian slip on themselves and face that they DID know what it meant, they'd just been doing word gymnastics to avoid explicitly admitting it to themselves.

[@BlitzsieLDiscoLSnow]

Ouch, that's painful. Luckily most of us are waking up and realizing this is not okay.

[@ah5721]

omg . that's just not right !! why not magnolia estates ? or ____ chateau? 0.0

[@Wombletron]

Thank you for this discussion, and for using the phrase “forced labour camps” because it made a visceral connection in my brain.

[@markburchert7633]

Came here to say this as well. This was something I never saw, but framing it this way forces us to really see it for what it truly was.

[@madelinegutierrez1720]

Yes @Angela Tracey and ​ @Mark Burchert me three! I just talked to someone about this using the words "forced labor camps" and for a second I thought they were going to be like "how dramatic" and instead they said - after a small pause - "Yes that what they were really."

[@sarah-annecarney7552]

Me too. The word plantation has such positive social connotations we really need to change the language being used. I couldn't agree with you more.

[@kamillebremer4208]

Absent Minded interesting I’ve never associated the word plantation with anything positive. Quite the opposite actually.

[@hayati6374]

I would compare it to a German wedding in Auschwitz / any KZ.. so ignorant

[@terralia644]

Everyone's being like "I study history, I'm not American and I wouldn't have made this mistake." Meanwhile, I'm not going to lie to myself - I study history, am also not American, and in the heat of wedding planning, where I would've had to find a big venue for cheap under budget constraints? I 100% would've done this without thinking, without intervention from a more aware/less wedding-brained friend. Admitting it is the first part of confronting the problem - thanks for sharing a vulnerable conversation; I learned a lot.

[@Kick0a0cat]

Thank you for being honest.

[@elainelouve]

Yes, it seems always in the comments people are saying how wise *they* would be and would *never* make any mistakes at all. Not just this topic, but many others as well. Kind of like everyone is a better than average driver. It just shows lack of self awareness or humility. I didn't have a plantation wedding, because I'm not American, and we never had plantations here (we were too poor and too colonized to have slaves after the iron age LOL). If I were American, or had married one, I might have quite possibly made the mistake, because it's an old and beautiful building. Difficult to know, and I got married 20 years ago, so the topic wasn't even discussed back then as much. Btw I also studied history, including some history of racism.

[@ashleydemarcos8589]

Great point!

[@haleylquinton]

I know this is an old comment but I'm now feeling really disturbed because I did some research and several of the popular wedding venues in my city used to be owned by slave owners and they had slaves. They aren't "plantations," but I don't see how there's a huge difference between a "plantation" and a house where there were slaves.... If I happened to be getting married, I would definitely pass on a plantation wedding. But I might choose one of these venues while having no idea slaves lived there! I had to specifically search the name of the venue plus history... and most people aren't going to do that. They see a pretty venue that's in their price range and they choose it without knowing it's basically a plantation!

[@radishfest]

​@@haleylquintonfewer bodies in the ground, maybe? Less likely to be disrespecting remains? But yeah. No thanks. Shame on them. It is really good that you did that research. I wish more people would just... try, you know? Most of the wedding industry infuriates me honestly. They don't care about much besides money. The backyard venue advice was so real. State and national parks are fantastic choices too (IF leave no trace is respected) since you can ask about what events/ceremonies are okay. Check to see if there are any sacred sites. Tribal reps work with parks. It's been irritating seeing people use the idea of Native Americans as an argument for why partying on a forced labor site is like, totally chill. Apparently we've suffered (and done nothing else) across every square inch of the US. 🙄 There's a state park I considered spreading my dad's ashes at since he always treated it with reverence. Called and asked - the dome is not for that, do not scatter ashes there. So easy to be respectful. On top of that, it's absolutely not a pleasant resting place. More specifically, cos it's neat: Wronged/lost spirits stay there! A general theme is callous sacrifice not goin' well. There's a couple stories about disposed-of women calling out in fear as they try to get home... (The granite makes eerie noises as the temperature changes. It can sound like wailing and screams. Who am I to say this isn't the work of spirits?) Also the rock swallowed Spanish invaders and trapped them lol - they do a lil screaming too. I love the rock so much for that one. Local lore is important. People should learn more history. It's not even hard.

[@imapandaperson]

People having plantation weddings reminds me of the lyrics of "strange fruit" The whole song, while about lynching, juxtaposes the scenes of the beautiful south with the images of the horror that took place there, criticizing the romanticism people have of the south "Pastoral scenes of the gallant south, the bulging eyes and the twisted mouth" But yet it becomes a blind spot when people aren't taught or reminded about history ---- and that's a failing of our system in how it edits and erases history

[@sarar4270]

@@moakristiansson5257 my music teacher makes sure that he teaches that song to all his students every year. I'm glad he does that

[@meghansullivan6812]

Very apt comparison. Thank you!

[@Sleipnirseight]

I heard that song in my high school history class. Absolutely haunting. The US definitely has an issue with inadequate education, but to be fair, the woman in this video was a historian, who at the time of her wedding was giving tours in historic Williamsburg, and educated people about slavery. She knew full well what she was doing. But probably found it more convenient to pretend otherwise.

[@reneep4269]

I just heard that song for the first time a few days ago in one of my classes. I've never heard a more haunting song.

[@camillam3583]

ohh my god. thank you for introducing me to this song. it's masterfully written and stirring, and i think it helped me process and understand some things a little better. i am white hispanic. i hold so much privilege... i don't think i've ever actually cried about slavery/racism until now. i think often, when educated white people consider slavery, we've heard of it before. we think we know what it means. it's easy to just know that black people were treated horribly, but it requires thought and time to consider that oh my god. bodies were beaten raw; blood was spilled. *plantations are a hub of trauma*. it's all rather easy for us to ignore, because while for plenty of us it might hold personal stakes for people close to us, rarely does slavery hold personal stakes for *us*. yes, we know that the system screwed black ppl over because once white people (the ones who had all of the power) started seeing black people only in the context of working for white benefits, they couldn't really see them as anything else. and we know that the trickle-down effects are present in modern american socioeconomics. we know that a century and a half have not been enough to erase the deep-run roots of the heavy 19th century prejudice. we're able to know all these things, but i think sometimes it takes an evocative line from a skilled writer to drive home that slavery in america was a very big thing that happened to huge groups of people attacked consistently, viciously. every single person brutalized under slavery, no matter how strong their willpower, experienced trauma. "black bodies swinging in the southern breeze" each of those bodies held a human life, humans who from the start had most every privilege and right snatched from them, life last of all. humans who felt big things and lived lives and connected with other people and who, if they'd been born somewhere sometime else, could have been happy. there are so many laments i could give for each black person killed under the "peculiar institution". i wish i knew how to honor them better. like i said, i have a lot of privilege, and i have a lot of learning to do. i still probably definitely have internalized racism inside of me. but i think i understand a little better now. ty

[@ThatsEunice]

The fact that they turned it into a bed and breakfast would confuse people. There’s a possibility that people wouldn’t even have a clue.

[@efranklin755]

She said she was a historic slavery interpreter and "plantation" was in the title...she knew.

[@nicoleandrews8967]

I think you’d have to *want* to not know. I cannot imagine that people are that clueless. Careless, yes.

[@whyamigae9666]

I’m not read up on these kinda things, and I’m far from being married. But wouldn’t you research the place and ask around for reviews before going? If it’s a historical place wanting to know most of the history.

[@JM-hn6vg]

Many plantations do that to earn revenue to research the slavery and discover the slaves' graves on their grounds to tell a story. Being listed on the National Historic Landmark Registry is the first step.

[@JM-hn6vg]

@@whyamigae9666 Most places in the old colonies have mixed histories. There maybe a manor house that had slavery, but there is history where an old family member was a war hero for the Union or a signer of the Declaration of Independence, and there may have been a Native village on the grounds.

[@atlroxmysox98]

I feel like getting married at a plantation is a sure fire way to curse your marriage.

[@lyfewithfena843]

Agree

[@JMarieCAlove]

Explain. Because I truly doubt it. If that was true, then why do people who got married at several million other places around the world, why did those couples get divorced or had bad marriages, physically and emotionally troubled marriage? And most never got married at a plantation. Getting married anywhere on Planet Earth, doesn’t define the marriage. People have had weddings at the most beautiful places and spiritual atmosphere, family and friends wish the couple love and blessings throughout their marriage, pray over the couple, but one day the marriage goes bad where it’s not fixable or bad things happen to the couple, but that couple got married in a church! That’s not suppose to happen! Only if you get married at a plantation?! My cousin had a beautiful wedding, married her high school sweetheart, they had two precious babies, a couple of years after they got married, her husband was murdered, but no one could find his remains for over three years! So of course, no one knew what happen to him until some field worker outside of the city, found human bones and a skull... the Coroner told my cousin that her husband was shot three times in the head, it was even more devastating for her and her kids and his family to go through grief all over again. The funeral was held at the same church they had their beautiful wedding at... nowhere near a plantation.

[@atlroxmysox98]

@@JMarieCAlove Ah well that was what we in the industry call "a joke". Are you sniffing glue? I make one comment and suddenly some crazy ass on the internet is telling me about her cousin's husband's skull remains. I would just feel weird about getting married at a forced labor camp, that's all.

[@xubs5919]

@@atlroxmysox98 people don't get sarcasm on the internet. Like at all

[@Jazilou]

@@JMarieCAlove mayhaps chill a little bit. It was a joke, but it also wasn't a joke that said "this is the only way to curse your marriage", it was a joke that said "wow, I feel like that would start your marriage off on a bad foot". But either way, sorry for your cousin, but this joke had nothing to do with him. Relax.

[@bblovesyou1]

My friend comes from a toxic “old south” family who live still in the “family home” which is a massive plantation site. They host weddings there and to make it even worse they converted the terrible buildings that the enslaved people lived in into the guest accommodation which they describe as “quaint, historical cottages” in their brochure.

[@dimplesd8931]

OMG 😱

[@beardpandaa]

That's actually really horrible holy crap

[@Omnihilo]

Hooooly. Freaking. Crap. I’m assuming said friend is the black sheep that got out of that dynamic?

[@BirdieBirdieBirdie566]

Yikes

[@kingexplosionmurderfuckoff9376]

So what do you expect from them? Do you want the property demolished? I don't think it's fair to expect a family to destroy/sell all of their land to cater to your beliefs.

[@josheydubs]

A slave plantation, a literal forced labor camp is a site where people were tortured and suffered from great atrocities. There is nothing romantic about slavery.

[@salvie777]

well... that’s literally what the video is about

[@t.j.7789]

I just had a white man ask to sleep with me, said I was his fantas, he explained how he's married, has kids!!! Shit, what's in it for me???!!! No dinner, no romance, no money!!!! No Black woman wants to be a White man's flavor of the week!!

[@victoriarudolph6453]

@@t.j.7789 He had no respect for you. That's disgusting! I'm sorry that happened. Us black girls always have tales like this. I live in the UK you can imagine being in a majority white country how frequently this can happen?

[@Z5Z5Z5]

I dont know how people can be so dumb?

[@mimi_j]

I guess it turns them on smh

[@raggedyhaggity250]

Can this topic be an article in bridal and fashion magazines? We might as well promote awareness in places the future brides look for inspiration to plan their weddings.

[@ertfgghhhh]

GREAT IDEA

[@Deeliciousone]

The reason it's not been already is that weddings are a huge income for these plantations, arguably their major income, and the magazines aren't going to kill off a revenue stream of their own to talk about something they don't have to. Basically, they're on the same team and shooting a whole leg of the industry means someone can now come screw with you.

[@acebaker3623]

The more beautiful the Plantation House, the more money that house made from the labour of enslaved peoples. Think about it.

[@redclayscholar620]

Think about the technology behind an Iphone. The factory they are made in is so horrible they put nets up by the windows to bounce them back in. Human greatness comes from what can be gleaned from human suffering.

[@e-maginne]

When she kept saying how beautiful it is, all I could say is gee I wonder why? Maybe it’s because of the slaves that were forced to build and upkeep it.

[@vsanchez7158]

Exactly!

[@kailebrogan447]

i agree. The more beautiful the more blood, sweat and tears. Which is awful to think of but it's important.

[@jadegemsss]

That explains the Madame Lalaurie house to a T... 😨 Edit: y’all do not look her or that house up unless you are comfortable with gore. most historical accounts don’t hold back with how evil she and her husband were towards black people.

[@AnnaInReaderland]

I’m going to be 100% honest. I didn’t realize plantation weddings were wrong at all until this past week. This video has not only changed my mind but opened my eyes to really look more at what I’m surrounded by constantly being from southern Louisiana. White privilégié always confused me because I didn’t fully understand the whole meaning of it. Now I see it clear as day with the fact that I never had to think of places like this making me uncomfortable or uneasy. Thank you for making me think about this and educating me more

[@JM-hn6vg]

Because white privilege doesn't exist. I'm part Asian and all of my Asian friends and acquaintances did better in school, never got arrested, and make much more money than me. Isn't that privilege by those standards?

[@AnnaInReaderland]

@@JM-hn6vg no because they worked for that. As a white person I never had to fear for my life when pulled over by the police. I was never given the talk on how to keep safe if that were to happen. I was never told about Juneteenth and the significance of that holiday. I never saw a plantation as anything but beauty and stunning architecture (not even registering the true hurt it caused). Until last year I didn’t even know certain words were extremely racist and offensive until a black friend of mine explained to me why. Because of my race and how my race is raised we typically never learn these things until someone of color tells us about them and many more because it doesn’t apply to us. We have lived with the rose-tinted glasses for far too long with our ignorance and naivety. That’s what I have come to understand is white privilege. Because of my skin I never had to think about things I should’ve educated myself with a long time ago.

[@JM-hn6vg]

@@AnnaInReaderland If your parents never had to give you a talk to obey the police when you get pulled over then you live in a very affluent area, and it's not based on your race. My parents gave me that talk, and I'm only a little bit Asian in my ancestry. The whole goal of this recent "white privilege" narrative is Marxism disguised as social justice pulling on the heartstrings of the distant past. It's an excuse to delegitimize private property rights for those who are labeled as privileged, and eventually redistribute based on class, or per BLM and other SJW groups, on race. This is exactly the gameplay rhat led up to the Soviet revolution in 1917 in Russia.

[@Beyt_El]

@@JM-hn6vg You’re hilarious. Your blatant willfulness to overlook the clear signs of racism in this country toward black peoples of African Americans is beyond laughable. It sends me into hysterical laughter because it makes me realize it was people LIKE YOU back during chattel slavery that justified that atrocities committed against slaves. The doctors that experimented on black women without any form of anesthesia. The “scientist” that deliberately stabbed holes into the skulls of helpless little black baby slaves. The slave master that stripped children away from their mothers and fathers for the sake of profit. Public lynchings, the complete destruction of communities and the murders of innocent and black men and women all justified because of lies YOUR brothers and sisters made up. PATHETIC.

[@emmad4308]

@@JM-hn6vg dude, I'm not American, but from an outsider's perspective and being in a country that also has major issues with racism (Australia, particularly towards those of Asian Ancestry and Indigenous Australians, that's a whole other can of worms), America is rascist as hell and white privilege is ABSOLUTELY a thing. You don't have to worry about being pulled over randomly because of your skin colour. That every interaction you have with the police, people who are meant to help and protect in theory, are more likely going to end with you leaving this earth and leaving your family heartbroken. You don't have to deal with the small, well meaning comments that are actually not well meaning and thinly veiled insults, but they are ok apparently because they aren't physically causing harm. I could list more, but I'm sure others in the comments could chip in with their personal experiences. This is coming from a white person (I also have a disability and am LGBTQ+, so trust me when I say I know exactly what it is like to be treated lesser than another human being or not even human because of things out of my control). It sucks ass btw and it's tiring as fuck. I have no idea how to explain to you that racism towards African Americans is so extremely obvious and blatant, and I have no idea what set of rose coloured glasses you have on to not be able to see that. Have you not been paying attention to the news, for idk, the past few centuries???? You need to LISTEN. Open up your ears to what people are saying and take it onboard. If a person of colour says "hey this is very rascist and hurtful", it is that. Because you don't experience racism, and that's what white privilege is. It is being blind to things that do not directly affect you. It is turning away from the suffering and hardship of other people because it's not something that affects you. You absolutely should take onboard what people are saying, and then use your privilege to best help, by listening, and calling out others racism when you see it happening. Make them aware of it, and hopefully so they change their behaviour and don't contribute in that way anymore. It's changing your behaviour and holding yourself accountable and learning. Does white privilege benefit me? Absolutely! I'm white. It's in the name. It's counteracted a bit of my being gay and autistic (police violence is also a constant threat looming over my life), but it is still there. I don't have to deal with the sheer nonsense my friends of Asian heritage have to put up with. Someone once told her to go back to her own country. Complete stranger, doesn't know her. But he did know what she looked like, and judged her on that. Bold words from a white Australian man who clearly hadn't paid attention in history classes. That's just an example how open some people can be with their racism. Heck, some people in America wear MAGA hats and wave confederate flags around, that also extremely openly racist and very not ok. Again , it's blatant, but it's apparently all ok if it doesn't affect you personally. It affects other people on a daily basis and gets them killed. No idea why I need to explain having basic empathy and some basic critical thinking skills is a positive, good thing, but here we are.

[@tstarr8314]

Actually saying that the purpose of the plantation house was not a home makes a huge difference in helping me (not American) to understand why it's an issue to have a wedding there. I saw a home, not the head office of a forced labour camp.

[@ashtenchambliss284]

Exactly. Slave masters would stop in every couple days, once a week or even once a month depending on how many plantations they owned. Abuse, starvation, and r*pe by his overseers kept them subservient between visits.

[@FezziOnloud]

Slavery that’s why

[@JuliaMarieH]

As an American, that helped me too. Many old homes probably have dark histories that we may not know about, but plantations aren’t just homes.

[@idanalhadjri5586]

I'm not from the US and this also helped me understand more. Thank you so much.

[@themaggattack]

@Tuatha De Sidhe It doesn't matter whether the SLAVE DRIVERS lived there or not. The point is that the main purpose of plantations was farming through SLAVE labor. This can not be overlooked.

[@roddenak]

The most well-known plantation home is the White House. Is that a conversation we’re going to have?

[@pauliedoodle1939]

Roddena Kirksey It’s even called the WHITE house 😬, awkward. Lol

[@jacquecomposanto3792]

I hadn't heard of it being a plantation, so I googled around. There is a plantation in Virginia called the White House (search White House (plantation) in wiki). Looks like it was Martha Washington's home and possibly its name was the inspiration for the name of our current capital building. However, I did find an article from the White House Historical Society titled 'Slavery and the White House.' Enslaved people built the white house and many slaves were part of various presidents' households. Paraphrased from the article: At least twelve presidents were slave owners and at least nine presidents had enslaved people working at the White House. There is also TIME's 'Slaves at the White House Did More Than Just Build It' and Chicago Tribune's 'The truth about the White House and its history of slavery' that are pretty informative. So either way, the capital building is steeped in this history, but it's rarely acknowledged. :(

[@wandanemer2630]

Holy shit

[@Colleoleen]

It wasn’t though. It was built as a residence and administrative site for the President, it was never used as residence and administrative site for a planters’ business. But I see your point, there was trauma in the house, there was enslavement when Jefferson brought his slaves from Monticello to serve him.

[@XanSprouse]

We need to.

[@EvanCorndog]

I remember visiting a plantation in Louisiana, there was a couple taking wedding photos there, it's apparently super common because of the "beauty" there. I also remember taking a tour inside of the house and I remember very little was said about slavery or the enslaved African Americans. The tour guides spoke lavishly of the luxuries of the home and all about the white families and their lives, it was so incredibly romanticized and devoid of the disturbing reality.

[@doodoodoodle]

Booker T Washington memorial in Va is pretty good. It's a real small place but I remember it being really informative when I went

[@MiniMidgMom]

afroculinaria.com/2019/08/09/dear-disgruntled-white-plantation-visitors-sit-down/

[@user-wz4mu9ok7q]

You must of had a bad tour guide.

[@carolhill5181]

This is good to know because one of the things I’ve wanted to do for years and years is go to a real plantation and actually learn about and see what happened there. Not just reading about it in a book, but intentionally facing the horror of slavery and grieving over it. I have zero interest in going to a place that leaves all that trauma out, as if the people didn’t- and still don’t- matter. I guess I just assumed that at a historical site, they’d actually care about historical accuracy. It’s sickening to realize that they would romanticize the property, as if it didn’t matter at all HOW the wealth was accumulated. I don’t even want to accidentally spend my money supporting any such place. So now I know, if I ever do make it to the South, to a plantation, that I want to make sure I support historical sites that tell the Truth and are educating people on what actually happened. Even better if some of the money goes to non-profits that help make amends for the damage done to black lives. (Are there places like that? If not, WHY NOT??)

[@believeroftheword4627]

@@carolhill5181 if you do make it down south, make The Whitney plantation a destination. It's in Louisiana, outside the New Orleans area. It is a former slave plantation purchased and owned by living descendants of slaves who lived there and they opened it as a museum to the Black story of plantation life. Link below. Disclaimer: I am not affiliated with The Whitney. I'm just a woke white girl. www.whitneyplantation.org/

[@GreenviewStudioGallery]

I wish the ghosts of the slaves popped up and scared the hell out of everyone.

[@pookabunny2051]

a great movie idea would be a privilaged couple getting married on a plantation then them being haunted by the restless spirits of the dead bodies they stood on to say their vows. the marriage could slowly fall apart as they are tortured by the ghosts.

[@adefran718]

Love this

[@lauryn7840]

There was a lifetime movie I saw some years back,where a man and his wife moved to a house he inherited,and it was haunted by the ghost of a slave woman.She didn't have a problem with the wife,but any descendant of" Massa" ......oh you were in serious trouble.She ended up putting the husband in the hospital.They finally figured out,they had to find her baby's skeleton,and bring it to her when she was haunting them.I can't remember the name,but it was good.They had to move quick cause she started terrorizing the wife,and they couldn't figure out why.They finally realized the wife was pregnant...with a boy.Had it been a girl,it would have been cool with the ghost. Ya'll can use your imagination as to why she had a problem with "massa" and his male descendants.

[@JM-hn6vg]

No such thing as ghosts.

[@DreamsReality7]

I always say ,it's funny it's always white people from the 1800s in movies as ghost. You would think the pain the slaves felt ,they would actually haunt.

[@brooklynthuesday9410]

I think she (Abby) simplified it initially best... there’s a lack of empathy.. in America there’s empathy for the holocaust... That happened in Germany 🇩🇪 ⛓ BUT NOT SLAVERY ⛓..that happened here 🇺🇸....

[@RollingOnFire]

The strange thing too is that slavery happened a lot in Europe and way before America and much longer yet when people think about slavery they think of America first even when they're not american

[@RaspyMommy]

@@RollingOnFire Can you give me a bit of info about this slavery in Europe. I'd like to learn more. I will Google but I want to make sure I don't miss what you're talking about.

[@lizlip6303]

Yes Lady yes! Sometimes I have a hard time explaining how I feel about this subject, sometimes I'm not even sure how I feel, just that I feel a way! Thank you for having the eloquence I lack & sharing your beautiful thoughts. ❤

[@lizlip6303]

@@RollingOnFire this is oddly true. I like to think it means Americans are more progressive than we give ourselves credit for. But another truth is that some of the loudest racists are also American. Folks around the world prolly can't help but notice that & it skews the thinking.

[@lizlip6303]

@@RaspyMommy not sure if you're being sarcastic, but in case this is a legit question, try googling "conquistador".

[@itstatilol4392]

No hate toward Abby, really enjoyed the interview, but I want to emphasize the importance of self-awareness as part of your discussion about negative pushback toward plantation weddings. It’s important to remember that it isn’t the responsibility of our POC friends/family to educate us on what is right and wrong. It is absolutely important to listen to POC when they share w us about their experiences, but it’s also on all of us to continually educate ourselves on the social systems we live in and how we be actively anti-racist. It was great to hear about all of Abby’s learning and development since her wedding! Thank you for creating such a great video xx

[@pontiaceast1024]

Oh my goodness somebody gets it!

[@dawnworthy6358]

@itstatilol You are, of course, correct. However, it is at their peril if "POC" do not engage in this behavior. White people very rarely seek out information regarding the impact of their behavior on other peoples. "POC" don't have a desire to or enjoy entering into those types of conversations. The majority of the time "POC" are drawn into those types of conversations by an overwhelming need to stop behaviors or ways of thinking that have negative impacts on said people. The second most common instigator of these types of conversations is White people themselves. They inadvertently do so by attempting either to demonstrate they understand (when they do not) or when with their "safe" (not like the others) [insert ethnicity here] friend, they sheepishly request an accounting of the group's perceived behavior. Yes, one does long for the day when being an ethnic buttinsky is no longer a requisite part of the being ethnic package.

[@ephemeraltrash6209]

@@dawnworthy6358 why did you put POC in quotes every time tho

[@dawnworthy6358]

@@ephemeraltrash6209 Because "POC" is a term being used to remove the important differentiations between disparate groups of people who are not White. It's an initial political step to cover-up the individual needs the government is responsible for attending to. For several groups which fall under "POC" the statistical data which is clearly evident for a given group can become, at least, unclear and at most hugely distorted as the are blended into to the "POC" soup. For example, the needs of first generation Asians are clearly different than the American descendants of slaves; yet, they both fall under "POC".

[@pelayo341]

Why would I be antiracist? Why would I not want the same ethnocentrism you want to afford to nonwhites?

[@springchick19]

As a white person who grew up mostly in Virginia but doesn’t identify as “Southern”, we just weren’t taught to see these places as sad places. We were taught to see them as these beautiful homes of important historical figures and as the heritage of the state. Yes, we learn about slavery but it’s through the lens of “look how good we are that we stopped doing that.”

[@madelinefireleigh1390]

“Look how good we are that we stop doing that.” Mentality damaging? Like should we feel more ashamed of those houses? I am also a Virginian local. I’m just like you we see them as beautiful places but I’ve always felt very aware of the dark past simultaneously.

[@madelinefireleigh1390]

springchick19 I guess I’m trying to say is us even in admiring them as beautiful places over romanticizing even if people just live there not necessarily having celebrations

[@springchick19]

Oh yes. I’m not saying they should be seen as places for celebration. That was just the sense that I got growing up. Not that I thought we should be patting ourselves on the back, but that a lot of people acted that way

[@Mary-zu4kc]

I honestly can't imagine admiring houses like that, especially after the Holocaust comparison. I live in Germany and it is a huge deal to always remember the ones who were unjustly murdered in WW2. To me it just seems weird that apparently in the US it's this normal thing like hey look a plantation!!! how pretty!!! When in actuality seeing them should make you shiver.

[@sarahholland2600]

@JewTube - Censor Yourself. Or we'll do it for you. I think they shouldn't be seen as places to celebrate. But if they were used for something with maybe a plaque acknowledging it's past or there was some effort to helping preventing modern slavery charities I'd feel that was more appropriate . It's glossing over terrible things otherwise & silence is acceptance. I haven't articulated it very well but I see how wrong it is to say oh that doesn't matter. It does . It should .

[@laurahackett7045]

I live in a plantation home that was built in 1854. We did not know it was a plantation when we bought the home and it broke our hearts when we found out. We bought the house to save a piece of history (it was abandoned and collapsing). We DID know that the home was built on some of the first land taken from the Choctaw tribe and, to me, buying it was a way of reclaiming something taken from my ancestors. This home was built with so much care and skill and now that we know what it is, we've worked very hard to make sure that the people who were captive here will always be remembered and honored. There is a cabin on the property still and it's become a safe space with a plaque listing the names we've been able to find in records and dedicated to those who lived there. In our restoration of the home we've worked hard to make sure we keep things historically accurate but we also want to keep it humble and not celebrate what it was. I do think it was important to save it as a piece of history not as a status symbol but to educate and make sure this time in history absolutely is remembered and that people, especially white people, understand and remember the atrocities that happened at places like this. My small town is still very stuck in the past and we're working really hard to fix that. Making this house a teaching point and not a status symbol is our first step towards that. Making sure that the people in the community know we're here to help if they need it and keeping a small food pantry for people in need has been important to us. We don't have much but we try to do everything we can to help those in the community and take steps to apologize for the things that happened here so long ago. We've had family friends ask to have weddings here and we won't do it. We don't want this to be a place that is celebrated.

[@haleylquinton]

This comment made me realize that there are probably historic homes where slaveowners lived and had slaves that aren't technically "plantations." I feel like it never would've occurred to me to research the history of historic homes before choosing a venue before now! ... is it somehow different if it's an old house where there were slaves versus "a plantation?"

[@haleylquinton]

aaaaand yep. I did a super quick google search and found that a popular wedding venue where my good friend works and where I've gone to several weddings once belonged to a slave owner and there were slaves there. It's not called a plantation. It's an old house and no one would know there were slaves there without doing research. I live in the south, so I feel like any historic home from before emancipation probably had slaves! I've probably been to a dozen slaveowning homes for weddings and I never thought about it.

[@laurahackett7045]

@@haleylquinton typically a plantation was a certain amount of land and the crops grown were typically only cash crops like cotton. Our property only has 5 acres now but when the home was built it spanned nearly an entire county and was one of many pieces of land the owner held.

[@rnandcn2004]

As a Canadian I would equate this with getting married at residential school where Native children were taken from their families and cultures. It doesn't matter how pretty the natural surroundings are, the past is to visceral. When we have school assemblies or community meetings in "white" culture (at least all those I have attended) before the meeting/ceremony/ assembly the land we meet on is verbally recognized as the ancestral lands of the local tribe or group. It doesn't give back anything that has been taken by previous govt or people, but it does alter the thinking around ownership and public lands and land agreements moving forward.

[@madelinegutierrez1720]

Awesome!

[@thisishersong]

Canada has a lonnnng way to go for indigenous rights. I have a friend who is Algonquin. Until meeting her I had no idea the issues they face in Canada. Its very sad.

[@Liieszy]

"It does alter the thinking around ownership and public lands and land agreements moving forward."..Does it though?

[@madelinegutierrez1720]

@@thisishersong The exact same happened here in US - and Google "The Trail of Tears" labled that as far back as there was no empathy and no one cares if Native Americans were crying.

[@rnandcn2004]

@@Liieszy perhaps not for everyone. I know for myself growing up I had no concept that much of what we think of as public land belonging to the govt wasn't truly govt land. I believed it had been traded or a treaty had been made about it. But for my children to hear that the land their school is on, the land that we use for girl guide meetings, the land that town hall meetings are held on, is acknowledged as unceded territory, I think will change things at minimum in the attitudes of the next generation. My husband comes from up North and he has said the general attitude around natives where he grew up was pretty racist. I grew up in a big city, and didn't really know any native kids most of my friends were immigrants. But my cousin lived not far from a reserve and ended up having a child with a man from the Squamish band. She has stayed very active in the cultural activities of the band and made sure her son participates in everything from social events to joining a war canoe racing team. My own children are growing up in a much smaller community that has a strong Native population. None of them have ever come home and described a friend they have as "native" they are just friends. In our school they have the opportunity to learn Native drumming, the elementary school provides classes for everyone on native language as well as (french sort of) and english. They do projects in younger grades on Native mythology talking about how and why certain animals are how they are now. And in older grades they learn about residential schools and even speak to people who were there. So perhaps for many adults the reminder that the land a meeting takes place on is just an annoying stall before the real meeting... But I think and hope that it is one of the first small steps towards understanding what our neighbors, our friends, and often our family members have lost unjustly. I know that even in my area their is a lot of racist attitudes from both sides. But I see in the children pure friendship. Loving their friends because of who that person is, and that kind of love will make changes in the next few generations that will be made out of mutual caring and respect.

[@emmapirato]

I'm in so much awe of Cheyeney's grace and generosity of spirit in this video. Abby is truly blessed to have such a wonderful friend.

[@moondaiandtrashpandadeluxe]

100% gracious class

[@m.maclellan7147]

Excellent video. Truth, caring, & uncomfortable conversations that need to be discussed.

[@canadian.mommy-of-4592]

Thank you so much for sharing! Beautiful and informative conversation.

[@lavendarcrash2941]

Now as a 35 year old grown-up I couldn't imagine having a plantation wedding. When I started planning my wedding in my mid-20's though? If it fit my budget I might have gotten suckered in by a place's aesthetic before considering its history. She acknowledged it was privileged ignorance, and coming from a similar background I can understand what she means. Now we know better so we do better.

[@sarahr8311]

Yup. I got married at a park near me because I could rent a pavilion for $75 and it was pretty. If there'd been a plantation nearby that was cheap and pretty... well I'm privileged enough that I didn't think much about these things growing up. I probably would have thought of it as a venue and nothing more.

[@midgey50]

I appreciate the way Abby said that as white ppl our ignorance comes from not having that taught empathy about things like slavery and broader racism. One of the things I’ve been learning is how to engage in the uncomfortable truths like this because we have to. It’s our responsibility. Thank you for this video and discussion Cheney.

[@Mary-zu4kc]

I don't think it's about empathy, we just don't have to experience this part of history regulary. For most black people, the people born on these plantations were their grandparents or other people in their immediate family. I agree that we do have to discuss these things and raise awareness to more issues like this, but personally I think black people are forced to confront themselves with their history more than we are. I'm not American though and I don't know the most about plantations.

[@gabrielalopez4606]

I get it, but as someone who is not white, I feel like there's this big pressure for white people to get everything right. I think everyone is a bit ignorant to everyone else's sufferings. Instead of putting people in categories, we should look at each individual's situation and judge them for that. I don't agree with making non white people victims or making white people the bad guy/ making them feel guilty for being white and "privileged". Everyone is privileged in areas others aren't and we each have sufferings that others don't have.

[@conniq1585]

@@Mary-zu4kc I disagree with you in that I DO believe it is about empathy. About being able to understand someone else's perspective and experiences. I can understand not knowing. If you don't know, then you don't know. But I've lost count of how many times I've tried to explain to someone why their actions or words are problematic and they either: 1. Minimize what I'm saying, as if it's not important 2. Try to gaslight me, as if the problem is all in my mind 3. Accuse me of bringing up things that happened years ago 4. Completely disregard everything I'm saying 5. Accuse me of playing the race card. For most people it's easier (and more comfortable) to result to deflections rather than to listen, reflect, learn, and work to do better. The thing I absolutely LOVE about this is the fact that Abby can admit where she made a mistake, own her ignorance at that time, and work to do better. That's all we can ask for. The issues is alot of people don't want to make the effort.

[@Aster_Risk]

@@gabrielalopez4606 We're not being made into the bad guy. We're being expected to actually start paying attention to things that non-white people usually can't escape from. Also, these people aren't being made into victims. We're learning to treat them the way we always should have. It's not hard to be empathetic and actively combat racism. It takes practice, but that's something that is our job to work on.

[@kimberlyjones8152]

@@ifonlyiwereanalien oh trust me there are def people of color that try to make whites feel bad they arent perfect angels like media wants u to think. Also how can u speak for all people of color?

[@LadyDragonbane]

As a European I think the Auswitch comparison helps us understand it better. It's too easy to think "So what? The bad thing is in past. It's just a pretty house now!" but I don't think anyone would EVER hold a wedding at a concentration camp. I started watching the video while on break and that was the last thing I heard before going back to work, and I think it will be useful to have had that sink in between watching the rest.

[@mandyh9832]

Agreed.

[@MsLilly200]

Ok but if all of auswitch was bulldozed and turned into pretty gardens, and the only building that was left behind was the overseers beautiful home that was just called the Camp House or something. I could see people 100 years from now having weddings there. Because most people don't research the history of the place they're gonna use for their parties.

[@user-ri2qn4qo4k]

Honestly, if you two did a podcast of your conversations about race I would listen to it, and I'm sure a lot of other people would too. This was an incredible discussion. Thank you so much for sharing it. ❤

[@you.tuber98]

M yess!! Cheyney and Abby podcast!!! I would listen and blast it in traffic and make sure everyone around me has no choice but to listen 😂

[@lucidstreet]

Oooh, agreed! A podcast about history / race / friendship with these two would be fantastic!

[@Aster_Risk]

I think it would be such a helpful and approachable way to educating so many of us on issues about race.

[@pameladavies337]

When your friend is considering a plantation wedding: "I'd love to celebrate with you but I can't celebrate at a venue where hundreds maybe thousands of people were enslaved, abused, raped, had their children torn away from them, and people were murdered with impunity for multiple generations. I'm sorry, I can't celebrate with you there."

[@MelanatednNature]

Exactly 👏👏👏

[@milkymommyz]

When I moved from California to Georgia, My dad wanted to go through Louisiana on the way back and stop at a plantation to check it out and learn more about slavery with my family. He found one single plantation that mentioned and talked about slavery, and called me up appalled that these plantations wouldn't even mention slavery, they just talk about the "masters" life. Moving to the south has definitely been an adjustment for me.

[@JM-hn6vg]

There isn't much documentation on the lives of the slaves that lived on the plantations because sadly they didn't have much of a life. They worked and slept, and had a little bit of downtime on Sunday. That's pretty much it.

[@ziesnowleopard]

@@JM-hn6vg that reminds me of the “not one scrap” character arc in Wolf By The Ears. It’s a great book.

[@ziesnowleopard]

That’s really terrible and disgusting!

[@Nocturne22]

I remember a friend who visited a Virginia plantation (this was the late 90's) and she was enamored with the tour of the mansion. Apparently, all the tour talked about was the lives of the slave owners, especially how the lady of the house i.e the slave owner's wife, would dress and bathe and do her hair. It's all romanticized into this sick fantasy where stuff just magically happened. No mention of the enslaved people.

[@samaraisnt]

This is STILL true, i think only one other one added a damn *plaque* that does not even use the word "slavery"! People will go to the site that teaches actual historical facts about the atrocities perpetrated against enslaved people and white people will literally leave pissed off...like they're angry that they wanted to have a good fun park stroll of a cute little house and they had to be confronted with the ugly reality of slavery...There's an interview w one of these singular tours on the last historical plantation house and she gets asked really really infuriatingly racist questions. Most don't believe it was 'that bad" that's the south for you. It's called McLeod Plantation btw.

[@wildcatste]

I appreciate calling plantations forced labor camps- it breaks the romanticization. Thank you for this conversation. Some beautiful places to get married: botanical gardens, museums, national/state parks (some have very picturesque indoor and outdoor venues and are some of the cheapest wedding venues around), wineries, a fancy Air BnB house. I've been to stunning weddings in each of those places.

[@eye4truebeauty355]

PLANTATIONS ARE LABOR CAMPS PERIOD.(NOTHING CAN ERASE THAT PAST )

[@TABULOUS1]

PERIODT..... but Imma finish perusing the comments to check out the apologists tho'. It's taking everything I've got not to block damnnear everyone here... But I get it. This is a society where colonization runs deeeeeeeep.

[@JaylaBillions]

🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣

[@aboz8649]

Say it louder got the people in the back!

[@TM1Forever]

K S 👍🏾

[@Ericatheinspirer]

Right!

[@MeganCristina465]

I truly do love these women's relationship! They truly are friends! When Abby started crying at the thought of her friend being offended and not coming to the wedding had me in tears! Abby made a mistake and understands what she did. Thank you for speaking on this subject. It was interesting and educational. 😊

[@hellomoron]

I love that she’s able to say “I have no excuse. I was an idiot.” Like she admitted that there was no good reason for it. Thank you Cheney for having this conversation. Instant subscribe. 💜

[@alexia3552]

Yeah, I'm really excited to see personal growth like that. That's the kind of thing that heals friendships and grows society in a better direction.

[@kenzielanning6862]

I love this too! I wish more people were given the chance to recognize their ignorance/mistakes and learn from it, instead of being "cancelled" or bullied.

[@pelayo341]

Yes there is. We can remember our ancestors just like you people do

[@ultraboombean]

Yeah I think certain things are just normalized here in the South definitely. A ton of people do this sort of thing without thinking about it with their family and friends oblivious too.

[@boop4904]

I had all of those exact same thoughts. Including the instant subscribe.

[@sweetEpie08]

I appreciate your decision to share this as well as Abby's humility and transparency in the discussion. I first found out that many white Americans didn't think of plantations as slave camps like last month and I was flat out shocked. I'm Nigerian-American and it truly never occurred to me that there was any other way to frame them. I'd highly recommend the podcast episode entitled When White People Say Plantation from The Sporkful to anyone who's interested in further understanding the disconnect

[@davichigbue1835]

I was looking for a comment like this omg I am also a Nigerian-American and hearing stories like "Igbo's Landing" growing up, I still can never understand how people look at plantations or even hear the word plantation and don't become frightened or sad.

[@LadyxBleu]

I was shocked when I saw a plantation wedding on that old TLC show Four Weddings. I remember one of the guest brides was Black and when they asked her how she was feeling she said, "Well, I'm Black and I'm at a plantation, sooo..." I can't believe anyone would ever think a plantation is an appropriate location for a wedding.

[@PHlophe]

i think you didn't ask yourself why she responded that way. we've all been captive at least once in those types of situations where we feel like not offending caucasians even thought we think differently. and home girl was probably one of what 2 or 3 black people. I feel very bizarre if i am the only person of color at weddings . i am guarded automatically and i tend to avoid pictures .

[@LadyxBleu]

@@PHlophe I'm very confused by your response. I don't think you understood anything I was saying. The Black bride made everyone very aware of how uncomfortable she was which I get completely and agree with. I was incredulous at the white woman who chose to have her wedding at a plantation.

[@LoveyourzAF]

That's deep. But exactly the point. This world is crazy.

[@LadyxBleu]

@eric haase The large object that just flew over your head? That was The Point.

[@LadyxBleu]

@eric haase It is not my responsibility to educate you and I have no obligation to respond to your "point of view". My snarky comment was to inform you that you sorely missed the point of the video. I would suggest watching it as many times as is necessary for you to grasp it.

[@gothempress]

I am getting married next year and am still trying to choose a venue. This helped a lot. I live in an area where there's been a lot of non-white pain, especially regarding indigenous people, and this has made it clear to me that I need to understand and ask questions about the locations for my festivities. It isn't fair to have a celebration on the back of torment. Abby, thank you for having the moxy to share your experience so white people like myself can learn before the mistakes are made, and Cheyney, thank you for having the strength to speak openly on a subject that brings out the most vitriolic conversation at times, because it is so important.

[@lizlip6303]

Non white pain? I'm not sure about that. I could bring up little Irish girl slaves, American settlers, but let's stick with the big one that I'm sure hangs out in your family tree too: Women. They were property of their husbands, fathers, brothers etc just as slaves were. Even the best treated slave lacked freedom of choice as to how they lived their life - same as any woman of any color in Victorian times America. When you get married, I hope you experience all the joy that you can possibly hold. Every female ancestor of yours I'm sure would rejoice at your ability to be able to choose your own husband & place of ceremony. The fact that you have concerns about this, speaks to the sweet nature you obviously possess. ❤

[@christinacody5845]

@@lizlip6303 What the hack?? Understanding another's perspective that is not historical to our own is the very POINT of this video! Non-white also includes indigenous/Native American individuals, for what it's worth.

[@lizlip6303]

@@christinacody5845 exactly! What they're talking about in this video is historical to my own as a descendant of slaves. So are the Native Americans that you so awesomely mentioned & I've got some of them Irish slave girls too. They were all related to each other, couldn't seem to be able to get off of it for several generations. I'm so glad you said Native Americans! So many of these comments are very offense with trying to compare American slavery to genocide & Auschwitz. I wasn't gonna mention it, but the only victims of genocide in America are Native Americans. This lady that I was commenting to, is an obvious sweetheart & I'm trying to be positive & all that. All of our lady ancestors had it rough, your assumptions about my perspective are your own.

[@madelinegutierrez1720]

Botanical garden - beautiful and will always be there.

[@lizlip6303]

@@christinacody5845 this morning at church, our Preacher talked about white folks trying to help our cause. In the spirit of Sunday, I came back to you. I've been called some things by older white ladies before, but 'hack' was a 1st for me lol. I want to say thanks for being willing to fight for our equality. Both you & the lady above obviously have pity for my people, & I can appreciate that. Although I would rather your empathy rather than sympathy. This is why I tried to bring up what I think is common in American white ancestry. How would you behave at a slaughtered pioneer's homestead you descended from that is now some museum. Please behave like that if you're gonna visit a plantation. You prolly have more Irish girls than me obviously, but their way of life was terrible too & I think all the ladies are important. ❤ Having yall be empathetic towards the cause will more bring you to a place where you maybe don't see how we're diff before anything else, we have more in common imo than we do differences. I hope you can pick up what I'm trying to put down here & receive all the Blessings you are open to receiving. Happy Sunday.

[@laundrybasketfullofhopes9930]

Black history should not be limited to just one month. It's barely touched on in schools. Thank you ladies for having this conversation and sharing it with us. I'm from the Midwest and never even knew plantation weddings were even a thing. Much less thought about the racial aspect of one. We are taught to be ignorant of these aspects. I appreciate the light you shed so we can grow and show more love.

[@annicat648]

There are similar historical houses in Australia that have a local history of violence and crime towards local aboriginal people. Our story in Australia is different to America, but I hope we can take after you in discussing and improving how we manage these historical sites. Thank you both so much for sharing!

[@YlvaTheRed]

100% agree. White Australians collectively need to do better.

[@CarolWoc]

We do need to do better. ❤️

[@katerrinah5442]

As an Aussie this isn't something I'd ever considered so thank you for bringing this up

[@blakesby]

Yeah, I was just thinking that I didn't feel like we had an equivalent issue as far as problematic locations commonly used as wedding venues. Maybe we don't have as many, or probably just not as many obvious ones, but we definitely have plenty of problematic issues in Australian society in relation to people of colour.

[@annicat648]

@@blakesby Racism in Australia has a very different history with the monumental harm done to Aboriginal people. I think the issues that we need to work on are slightly different, but we can definetly take after the US in the movement to acknowledge historically traumatic locations.

[@kennyinliverpool]

I like how respectful this is. Authentic friendship is how the world changes?

[@a.ml.t.9289]

Respectful? I wouldn’t embarrass my friend publicly and make her feel like crap publicly? The lady isn’t racist and she did nothing wrong. There is no slaves in this country. She shouldn’t feel shamed for her own wedding. It makes me sick how divided we are today. All these groups blacks whites they are referring themselves when we are supposed to be equal. What privilege is it when you have to be shamed and belittled for having a wedding at a house that had bad events 200 years ago

[@melodymay4888]

@@a.ml.t.9289 this woman chose to talk about this and isn’t being embarrassed. Please educate yourself on white privilege and how those same issues still last before you comment something like this

[@moneybags999]

@@a.ml.t.9289 No one said she was racist. I doubt Cheyney would be her friend if she were. I have much more to say but I'll just leave it at this.

[@a.ml.t.9289]

@@moneybags999 this is a very debatable subject so yes there is tons to say on this. It’s not that the girl called her straight up a racist but the video is so disturbing to watch. It’s like this girl has done this awful horrible racist thing and she’s begging pleading for forgiveness. The way the world is today and how people attack people and this has been a real touchy subject recently and it’s like everyone is walking on eggshells. I can’t understand this girl putting on her friend and throwing her to the wolves for something she did that wasn’t wrong. This was her wedding no one else’s and who cares what house she had it in. There were no slaves there and hasn’t been for over a century and she obviously has no racist bones in her body and seems very tolerant And she’s sitting there begging for forgiveness for no reason. I can’t imagine if the roles were reversed on that channel. It just disturbs me hearing black this white that. I thought we were men women brothers sisters one big American family and I’m so tired of hearing everyone put into a group and labeled and that’s that. What if that girls family wasn’t even here during slavery or she was mixed but no matter what because of her skin color no matter where she’s from she’s gonna be discriminated against and treated differently and she’s on a “stage begging” when we should have moved past this in the 1800s and 1900s. We shouldn’t be treating anyone differently or living in the past.

[@moneybags999]

@@a.ml.t.9289 "the video is so disturbing to watch." Only because YOU don't agree with it. As a black person, I found it intriguing to understand the thought process of a white person. Clearly, many of us did, too! "It’s like this girl has done this awful horrible racist thing and she’s begging pleading for forgiveness." SHE realized HER error. The fact that she understood the dilemma means that she is not a racist. She honestly felt bad enough to talk about it. She is not beginning for forgiveness. She is engaging in dialogue. "The way the world is today and how people attack people and this has been a real touchy subject recently and it’s like everyone is walking on eggshells" I guess if you're the type of person who doesn't take other people's feeling into consideration before you speak, then I can see why you would feel like everyone is walking on eggshells. " I can’t understand this girl putting on her friend and throwing her to the wolves for something she did that wasn’t wrong. " This happened BEFORE they even knew each other. ABBY wanted to discuss it so what's wrong with that? Just because you are A-ok with people partying at a forced labor camp doesn't mean other people feel the same way. It's about respect. Think about it. Why do people build monuments on the grounds where something bad has happened? To respect the lives lost. Having a plantation wedding is like dancing on the graves of the dead. Or, perhaps, you don't have respect for dead slaves because, after all, they were just slaves? I think a lot of people think this way unfortunately. The Civil War mentally wiped the slate clean for them. Anyway, you don't have to agree but at least try to understand the perspective. "she obviously has no racist bones in her body and seems very tolerant" Exactly, which is why she wanted to discuss it. No one is calling her racist but you are trying to create that narrative. Some white people do things out of ignorance, feel bad about it & want to learn from it. I know I've made cultural missteps in the past. I didn't tell anyone to give over it. I owned it. "she’s sitting there begging for forgiveness for no reason. " No, she is not! " It just disturbs me hearing black this white that." Sorry. That's reality. Move to Iceland. LOL Sorry, Couldn't resist. "I thought we were men women brothers sisters one big American family and I’m so tired of hearing everyone put into a group and labeled and that’s that." Evidently, NOT! I don't think you're in the mindset (yet) to be able to process this. You want to tidily sweep things under the rug despite the rug being full of huge holes where stuff keeps oozing out. "What if that girls family wasn’t even here during slavery" But she is still American & this is part of the American legacy. If a person, immigrates to the US from Poland (a country that had no part in the slave trade) & they are racist towards blacks, do they get a pass because they weren't here during slavery? If I go to Germany & do something that offends Jews, am I excused because I'm American? " when we should have moved past this in the 1800s and 1900s. " Tell that to the people who demand the right to display & worship their Confederate flags & Civil War hero statues & monuments. Tell that to the Neo-Nazis at Trump rallies. Are you actively telling those people to move on or just the black people? "We shouldn’t be treating anyone differently or living in the past." Of course we shouldn't but that's how it is. Having discussions like these even with the discomfort that comes with it helps to build the MUTUAL RESPECT required to move forward. You're either down with it or you're not.

[@habituscraeftig]

I think commodification has a role to play in this, as well. We are a culture that is used to purchasing things without considering where they came from.

[@moonbeamstry5321]

Amen to that. How about the smart phones we buy? People are here discussing slavery on devices that were more than likely made in sweat shops by people who're so underpaid they may as well be slaves.

[@hope1575]

@@moonbeamstry5321 @HabitusCræft There's not really any ethical consumption under capitalism; it's all exploitative to some degree. I think it's important that people know that, but it's impossible to really conceptualize the full extent anyhow. I think a historical building of any age is going to have some trauma associated with it... but they are just buildings now to some degree. I don't think we have to attach such morality to their use. Does having a wedding in a catholic church mean you condone child sexual abuse, or religious oppression, the inquisition, the crusades? Does all that associated trauma really factor in to the use of the building because someone likes the architecture? Pretty much any other historical building is going to be associated with the systems of abuse and exploitation that were going on at the time. I'm confused about where the line should be drawn. I don't think people are wrong to feel strongly about this however.

[@moonbeamstry5321]

@@hope1575 very well articulated comment. I too am unsure where I think lines should be drawn. On one hand, I think western culture has become alarmingly addicted to outrage culture- hollow misplaced hypocritical virtue signalling and altruistic narcissism. Emotional extortion isn't legitimate kindness or understanding. On the other hand, I wouldn't expect a Jewish person to want to attend a wedding being held at a concentration camp.

[@Jaded42O]

@@moonbeamstry5321 I think the line should be drawn at having weddings at grave sites where tons of black people died but I guess that’s not really that serious to you.

[@moonbeamstry5321]

@@Jaded42O I said that I wouldn't expect a jewish person to want to attend a wedding at a concentration camp to imply that I fully appreciate why a black person wouldn't want to attend a plantation wedding.

[@Fitbody_bysarah]

Her friends nervous laughter is very telling of how difficult this conversation is for her.

[@curlybeautyblogger]

As it should be.

[@My_Lacrimosa]

That's because she knew she fked up and that what she did was bad

[@23ahndra]

Black woman here who was the photographer at a plantation wedding. My self and two members of my family were the only Black people there. I didn’t really realize the gravity of it until I was there. Whitest thing ever. Zero stars, do not recommend.

[@RowdyBoy82]

You sure this wasn't the movie, Get Out?

[@Goldenretriever-k8m]

you know something? i actually went to my friend, who is black's wedding at a plantation type house in Georgia. Isn't that weird?

[@RowdyBoy82]

@@Goldenretriever-k8m There's a difference between a "plantation type house" and an actual plantation.

[@Goldenretriever-k8m]

@@RowdyBoy82 that's true but I'm only saying that bc I don't remember it in detail much anymore, it was like 10 years ago. I do think it was a plantation but not like a huge plantation, if that makes sense, but like a smaller one.

[@Deenique16]

@@Goldenretriever-k8m yikes

[@oldprofile7126]

I got married at a 'mansion' and it never occurred to me to question the obvious history. Now doing research I discovered that it WAS part of a plantation. WTF I feel like such a hypocrite. I would never have gotten married anywhere that SAID 'plantation' but I didn't even question this place. It's a historic mansion in the south, how could it not have been part of a plantation? It never ever occurred to me or anyone I knew.

[@TheAubreeC]

Well now you're a bigot so what will you do with yourself now, bigot?

[@britabenton3441]

Tommy Pain ?????

[@angieoakman5478]

Why you gotta be so rude Tommy Pain???

[@acat6291]

All you can do is move on you’ve learn from your mistakes keep learning.❤️

[@carcarbinx98]

@@TheAubreeC what the fuck. Get a life

[@rachelkrumpelman5131]

I just love to see two women having each other's backs. What a great friendship! It is scary to talk about racial issues but it absolutely has to happen and keep happening. ❤

[@MeetFrizzie]

THIS! It’s so rare to see two friends both so willing to have an uncomfortable conversation like this.

[@rachelkrumpelman5131]

@@MeetFrizzie I know!! But, having these uncomfortable conversations are necessary to heal our racial division in our country. I hope that one day this will no longer be rare but instead commonplace ❤❤

[@charlesmaximus9161]

“Division”. The only people sowing division in this country (and all the western world, for that matter) are vapid, evil, left-wing anti-whites like yourselves. And the host doesn’t “have her back”. The white European girl is simply caving to her out of deathly fear of appearing “racist” (though she will never admit this). This is essentially what all white leftists do; they go with what’s socially acceptable out of fear of social castigation. And you would be one dishonest individual to deny that being radically ultra-progressive isn’t currently en vogue. She sees what happens to people like myself for daring to question the realms-beyond-obvious agenda (which is well-funded and astroturfed) and she doesn’t want to be singled out. We all know what happens to people who show any shred of dissent or criticism of social progressivism. Although, I have absolutely no doubts that you’d deny it. By the way, Rachel…are you Jewish? A clear and simple yes/no answer will suffice.

[@rawfermews4186]

@@MeetFrizzie It's so funny to men when white people say conversations about race are uncomfortable because 9/10 you mean it's uncomfortable for YOU as a white person to have to confront your racial bias.

[@cheshiredeimos1874]

If you want the natural beauty, consider a national park or botanical garden.

[@JM-hn6vg]

Privately owned venues are better despite the past.

[@melodymay4888]

@@JM-hn6vg there are still lots of great places that aren’t filled with racial trauma though

[@nevadag606]

Or a local orchard or winery!!

[@O2life]

We had our wedding at a small amphitheater up a beautiful mountain canyon, followed by a hamburger and hotdog reception at a lovely little public park. All together it cost less than $100 to the parks services to rent the space. I wouldn't do it any other way.

[@softwaifu]

National Parks are Stolen Land.

[@rebeccab1335]

I absolutely love the trust and respect you two have for each other. Thank you for modelling how productive, honest (and yes - uncomfortable) conversations look & sound for a world that’s too often hell-bent on yelling out and then running away. 👏🤝🌈

[@francescabrzezicki1293]

Abby's comment that "the house is riddled with trauma" really struck me.

[@cupcakeangel365]

I'm African-American and want to have a plantation wedding. To me there wouldn't be a better way to pay homage to my ancestors than to freely and legally get married where it was once illegal.

[@gigiw.7650]

cupcakeangel365 That sounds lovely! Best wishes 💖

[@lillieburge8994]

👏

[@BlkOnyx0508]

Sad story. Ignorance is bliss?

[@tracycameron2580]

I love this!

[@Queen-ty1xz]

Theres a huge difference between a white woman and an African american woman having a plantation wedding, of course. I've made some reflections about it, and I just want to bring up the points i came across, I'm not at all telling you what you should or shouldn't do as it is not my place to do so since I'm a random white lady who is not from the USA. So, the first thing I thought was what is the point of a homage. If the people your paying homage to died a long time ago, what's the goal? In situations like this the goal would be to cause sensibility to people living in the current times about the atrocities that already happened and what were the impacts of those atrocities in future generations. The fact that people in that location were tortured and explored is never going to change, the question is what do we do with this memories? A wedding doesn't seem like a way to bring some sort of awareness about the things I mentioned, unless it is a pretty unusual wedding mixed with interventions about the consequences of slavery until this day. Weddings are usually about celebrating love, and union and the attention is all on the groom and the bride. In a wedding like this, is there any room to reflect about the atrocities committed in that place and the long term effects of them? To me it just seems that no one would want to think about this sort of thing during a wedding. Most weddings are an homage to the bride and the groom, as people are together to celebrate their union, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with this. But to me it seems impossible to have a ceremony meant to celebrate the couple and at the same time pay a homage to people who aren't around anymore. To finish, I'd ask what effect would a wedding in a plantation have as a homage? Basically none, you'd be giving money to the same company that promotes weddings in plantations to white women that want to live their "southern bells" (aka slave owner) fantasy. I don't know if you are engaged and planning your wedding, or if you were just talking about abstract future plans, but of course you should do what feels right for you and your fiance. I'm not trying to opinion on your life decisions, those are just some things I thought since you were not the first African American woman I've seen saying that would have a plantation wedding. So I've been thinking about this for a while and just wanted to share some ideas. Hope you're doing well

[@angelamartin1717]

As a black woman, when I pass a plantation in south Louisiana, I look straight ahead...never looking directly at the land...don’t want anyone following me home. But Ms. Abby is a grand lady with her views and receptiveness of change 👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾🙌🏾

[@dollface6843]

I wouldn’t step foot on a plantation, I’m too sensitive and receptive, I’m to scared I’d hear/feel the pain 😕.

[@nicholegallo1090]

@@dollface6843 I’m not black, I’m white, but I’ve always been receptive to the dead. And if I even stepped on a plantation myself, I’d feel it, I feel pain, and confusion. I’d feel anguish, exhaustion. I know my eyes would begin to water as the pain of the buried and the forgot would rise. But I feel as though it would confuse them. Why I white woman is crying in their presence....

[@JM-hn6vg]

@@nicholegallo1090 Are you sure those weren't demonic forces?

[@nicholegallo1090]

@@JM-hn6vg oh no. Definitely not. I get very emotional when I sense the dead. I think when it’s a demon I feel it as well but differently

[@JM-hn6vg]

@@nicholegallo1090 How can you tell the difference? Demonic forces usually trick us into believing that they're human souls that haven't been judged.

[@Lalaworld2116]

Jaw dropped when she said her job is talking to people about slavery but didn’t think twice about the location. She knew what she was doing and didn’t care at the time. I’m happy now that she acknowledged what she did was wrong and that she learned from her mistakes. I see growth in her

[@jennym.9929]

yeah. i didn't buy that either. her loud laughter afterword was totally awkward js

[@kirieltee]

SHE KNEW WHAT SHE WAS DOING. Exactly.

[@Niphredyl]

I'm European and I'm aware what a plantation was... I don't get this. Really. She seems educated. I mean it's basic knowledge. The problem must lie in that it's a b&b, by function so a hotel basically surrounded with nice scenery and the house does look nice... still it was like a POW camp It is also not realistic to turn every Southern manor into a museum, probably. In my city there would be every palace in the downtown a museum, where people got tortured, unfortunately (ghetto, ghettoized palaces, germandarie chambers, political prisons, etc) But the most famous are museums of course. There has to be balance.

[@ludmilafascia7956]

Like how are you that close to that part of history and not realize wtf your planning your wedding around? That is what doesn't click to me. Maybe it's the lack of common sense here...Because even if I knew the bare minimum about slavery, and was planning a wedding, a Plantation Wedding would sound HELLA RACIST to me. #justsaying

[@Lalaworld2116]

@@ludmilafascia7956 exactly! Thank you! It definitely don’t take a lot of knowledge to know. Most Plantation even have pictures and knowledge cards of what went on there in the houses. Plus most people like to ask the history of the house/place they have events in when it come to older land

[@angelicapepinillos388]

I can’t believe the amount of people coming after Abby especially in the replies to other comments. After she CHOSE TO PUBLICLY SPEAK OUT. She could have stayed silent, she could have not wanted to relive her wedding and marriage; which she doesn’t like. She decided to start a conversation, and even cried about how her friend could have felt. She is learning, she is growing, she is not perfect, but even Cheyney is proud of her and called her an ally in 32:15. Grow up and learn to forgive those who truly show change and growth like Abby.

[@Jaded42O]

That’s what happens when you have a plantation wedding, she is not owed forgiveness from other black people just because she was forgiven. A truly apologetic person realizes their actions have consequences and this is one of them. Opening up allows yourself to be judged, she is not the victim here.

[@myplaylists6310]

@@Jaded42O I agree. She is not owed anything and a true apology is not given for an outcome. I do think that people giving her a lot of h4te is cynical and will stop true change from happening if people are only ever going to be met by animosity.

[@Jaded42O]

@@myplaylists6310 black people reacting to white people who do racist things is not what’s stopping “true change” from happening. Black people having natural reactions to normalized racism isn’t cynical, maybe black people are tired. Non black people being racist is what’s stopping true change. You do not agree with me, you’re blaming those who don’t accept for stopping true change. Insinuating that in order for change to occur, we must forgive when that’s not the case. I don’t think she’s a bad person, but I don’t want her as an ally..

[@angelicapepinillos388]

@@Jaded42O the thing is she took accountability, unlike KZbinrs apologies, unlike racist celebrities, she truly said she was in the wrong. And that is what sparks change. The hate she is getting and the fact she is not being given an opportunity to show the true ally she is, like Cheyney said- is what irks me. Because other people can be given the “pass” for far worse stuff and actions- but someone who shows true remorse like Abby can’t. She is more than forgiven by me, and lots of other people because she had the balls to stand in front of a camera, be remorseful and admit her wrongs. Unless the people commenting didn’t watch the whole video.

[@sandracheeks1811]

I would never try to publicly justify or apologize for anything because you only get hate for it. Just accept that people are pissed and forget it. As this and other apologies show, your remorse is of no consequence to anyone. No one cares if you’ve changed and there is no way you will be allowed to out-live your mistake.

[@alexarias5717]

These kinds of conversations are the ones that should be taking place in pop culture and social media much more than reactionary or confrontational type "debates".

[@heatherlee2967]

+++

[@nina-um4mm]

It’s very strange hearing people talk about being unaware of history. I am Middle Eastern and I remember when I was a very young girl (12 years old) I started to learn how to cook. Okra stew was a big part of middle eastern cuisine and I would research recipes to learn. A lot of the cookbooks said the vegetable came from Africa. I was curious how it got there so I did more research about. Many books pointed towards the East African slave trade. That was when I learned about slavery in the Middle East. After that I went on a major research on how Africans were and still are treated in the region my ancestors were from. It’s very shocking to see Americans choose southern historical sites without researching its history.

[@JM-hn6vg]

It's not just Southern. Slavery existed in every manor in the North or South, as did slavery exist everywhere in the world at some point. Great thing about the US is that slavery is abolished, and the US enforced abolishment throughout the world. This is not true for the Middle East and North Africa.

[@nina-um4mm]

That is very true. Although countries in the middle East have abolished slavery it’s still practiced in a different form. Laws do not protect African and south East Asian who come to the Middle East thinking they will work as household maids and nannies. For anyone reading this please research how African and SE Asian workers in the middle East are treated. It is horrible and we need to stop it from happening

[@JM-hn6vg]

@@nina-um4mm There are still slave markets in Yemen, Libya, and elsewhere.

[@uhsaywhat]

She knew what a plantation was but didn’t connect it to the trauma of the slavery! Everyone in the US knows what a plantation is...it’s was the base of economic success.

[@JM-hn6vg]

@@uhsaywhat True, but it was also the base of manumission as well.

[@cecerericha4404]

Can I just say that I love that Cheyeny knows that a plantation wedding is wrong hands down. But she still wants to here someone else’s perspective, she doesn’t have to coz it’s wrong. But she sits down with a great friend of hers that admits to having a wedding at such a terrible place. Abby looks back and knows that it was wrong and she didn’t consider it because of her white privilege. These two sat down with each other and discussed this issue. From the perspective of a black women, and from the perspective from someone in a place of privilege. It’s respectful, enlightening, and constructive. They sit down and talk and make themselves better. If every conversation discussing ‘controversial’ topics was like this the world would just be so wonderful

[@DJPoundPuppy]

THIS IS THERAPY. This conversation is healing (at least for me). I needed to hear what Abby said. I appreciate your video. Just a few hours ago I was on the phone with a pale friend explaining the perplexity of appreciating the beauty of antebellum homes.

[@FlyingWonderGirl]

Celester sorry, I don’t understand... before war homes? Like 1700 homes?

[@DJPoundPuppy]

@@FlyingWonderGirl Southern homes that were built during slavery and even thereafter that appear in a similar style. I was raised in New Orleans and as a young girl of course I found the local architecture to be fascinating.

[@FlyingWonderGirl]

Celester okay, I’m not from America, I think it has a different meaning here 🤷🏻‍♀️ as pre-war era. Architecture is fascinating!

[@madelinegutierrez1720]

This is why the French during their revolution wanted to pull done and destroy things made by / for the aristocracy.

[@madelinegutierrez1720]

@@DJPoundPuppy Having studied (and study) architectural and interior design styles through history - I do think there is a point where we can stand back and look at that "tapestry" or 3 story columns outside a whom and simply admire that a HUMAN made them. This architecture and interior details are from a time when they were crafted by hand - and the HUMAN accomplishment behind that I think needs to be honored - while we acknowledge who it was that made it - and what the "makers" life was like. We all talk easily about how the pyramids were made by slaves - it's a very known fact - but they are still incredible and a sight to see.

[@sierraroses5679]

Being newly engaged and living in Virginia my one stipulation was no plantations. It's so important to have these conversations. Plantations are not romantic.

[@ScarletShade13]

As a german who has never been in the USA, I am astonished that the "plantations" are still there?! Not burned down or abandoned but used for weddings of all things? What? I am happy that I stumbled over this video, its great how much Abby grew as a person. But I can't get over the fact that these places are still around and not treated as the monuments of suffering they are!

[@6_blocks_under]

because the USA doesn't care about the people descended from those kept on plantations

[@Wednesdaywoe1975]

Oh yeah. Most of them have been turned into bed and breakfasts.

[@lunayen]

Most of these plantations are still owned by the original families, who of course wouldn't allow the homes to be burned down. Plus, they're now associated with B&Bs and wedding venues, so people think it's "okay" now to get married there.

[@thevampirefrog06]

The leaders of the confederacy died free and wealthy. White America on the whole was never forced to have the reckoning Germany did post-WWII.

[@summerfoley2481]

The main issue is that there are no (or at least very few) very nice, large, old houses in the USA that were not associated with slavery. You guys in europe do have nice buildings that were not associated with prison camps or similar. So, it is either destroy every historical building we have (including the White House) or continue to have and use the historical buildings that have problematic pasts.

[@onegirlarmy4401]

I was a silly white woman too, who had dreamed about a "Sweet Home Alabama" wedding when I was a preteen and teen. I didn't have a "dream wedding," but it was only recently that I realized how horrific plantation homes are.

[@zgebres]

I liked that movie, I remember them making it clear that it wasnt a slave plantantion.

[@rissarys25]

As a black woman and a historian, I'm not mad at her. Let's be honest she got what she paid for, a pretty place with bad juju. They're divorced now.

[@SuggahBrown]

As she should 😌

[@ngreat4390]

That's not why they're divorced tho

[@ngreat4390]

@@SuggahBrown you're just saying hateful crap. Please tell this house how wishing her ill makes you a better person than slave masters

[@SuggahBrown]

N Great lol, I didn’t wish her ill 😂 the ancestors took care of her ass. I agreed with the original poster that she got what she paid for 🤷🏾‍♀️ I could really give a fuck what a slave master did because their descendants are paying for it now. Who tf are you anyways? The KZbin police??? 😂😂

[@michellemybelle4360]

In summary, its above me now

[@magdaciwis5920]

You can tell that Abby is embarrassed. She encourages being different and she is very tolerance and respectful as she proved in her many videos. What she did wasn't interpretation of herself, she made a mistake. I am happy that she can talk about this. Good to be here, with all respect to Black-Americans 💗

[@heatherlee2967]

+++

[@shallnoTfear]

Honestly that whites would have a plantation wedding shows how American history is taught in schools and the culture. I am not white or black, but know enough of American history to know that it is utter disrespect to have a ln event at a plantation. In my mind, plantation = American chattel slavery

[@JM-hn6vg]

There are events at plantations all the time.

[@heatherlee2967]

As an American I’m pretty ashamed of our country’s lack of shame around this. Omg it’s ridiculous

[@JM-hn6vg]

@@heatherlee2967 You're ashamed of the shame that wasn't ashamed?

[@heatherlee2967]

@@JM-hn6vg Lol yeah

[@thevampirefrog06]

I have relatives who grew up in a college town in Virginia, and the local elementary schools celebrated Robert E. Lee day instead of MLK day. In the 2000s. One of them remembers being intensely uncomfortable with it when she was like 10, even as a white kid.

[@empirex334]

"Would you get married at a concentration camp because the commandant had a beautiful house?" Very succinct. The answer is: Of course not!

[@caroaraujog]

So, I dont know why KZbin brought me here, I was watching snake hatching videos... but I am grateful, this was an eye opening talk. I didnt even know there were plantation weddings in the united states... I think the equivalent in mexico would be marrying in an hacienda, but slavery is so rarely talked about in mexico I am not certain if slaves worked in haciendas

[@pipermarie8393]

Thank you for peaking my interest....I am now off to find snake hatching videos because I didn’t even know that was a thing 💜

[@caroaraujog]

If anyone is wondering, i did my research and yes, mayan natives were enslaved and made to work in haciendas in the Yucatán peninsula. And yes, some of them are now used for weddings.

[@sarahroberts7374]

@@pipermarie8393 Snake Discovery is a lovely channel- you must see their alligator Rex! Go Herping has interesting reptiles too. But yeah going back to the OP - my home feed is full of both animals and philanthropic / ethical / social justice topics. Feed the algorithm with positivity and you will get good stuff recommend to you. Only downside is you get addicted to KZbin lol xx

[@hotchocolategirl1der]

Idk about haciendas, but one of the first African slave rebellions in the Americas was in Mexico, led by an enslaved man named Gaspar Yanga. Mexico, at one point, had one of the largest enslaved African populations in the Americas. Spain did in Mexico what the English did in America, but Spain did it a few years earlier.

[@sadespair]

For real, i was watching task master. I have never heard of a plantation wedding but i also never think of weddings. This is so interesting

[@pirrikko]

Just recently, someone I know got married on a plantation. A few weeks later I saw her very passionately arguing with someone on facebook about the importance of BLM and protesting. The dissonance there is so, so strange.

[@ivetterodriguez1994]

I've heard they're common sights so no one thinks twice about it. is it true? I would never have my wedding at a Mission here in California. I'll pick a nice park over that!

[@chaseback5102]

I also wonder if the thought could be.. “this is a beautiful place.. slavery is “over” I’m not prejudice, I have black friends, if it were really an issue, someone would say something to me... “ and that little voice on the inside that tells you something isn’t “right” gets pushed down because people want what they want.... and If they realize that what “THEY” want could be offensive, they would have to inconvenience themselves by changing their choices. Not being willing to do so, do not want to make changes.....so they act willfully ignorant and push false innocence to justify their choices.....I appreciate her being so candid and did not make any excuses for her decision

[@melissathomas218]

I hope you pointed out the irony.

[@CocoaHerBeansness]

@@Catcatcat299 The same way they help all people. The invention of the nuclear family was designed to isolate people by fracturing the wider community. This makes people easier to control because they're vulnerable. It's a technique of colonial culture - it allows 'units of reproduction' (a husband and his baby incubator) to be transported to new settlements. Whenever the nuclear family model is imposed on a culture you immediately see domestic abuse, child abuse, and misogyny. Even in cultures where these things never previously existed. This happened fairly recently across a lot of Africa.

[@pirrikko]

@@AnalEyesAnalyzeAnalLies-666 This is such a wild thing to think about plantations, who by definition used chattel slavery for ‘farming’. It’s not a fun little family orchard who paid their workers. Anyway, this is a bad faith comment. You certainly didn’t watch the video, or ever bother to learn about southern plantations.

[@bettyhabtemariamivares3543]

I’m an afro-swede. Born and raised in Sweden, so I was a little shocked to hear that the groom and his family went along with this 😕 People in Sweden know of the plantations and what happened there and most of them wouldn’t do a wedding at such places. At least that’s what I’ve thought my whole life. That aside, I think your friendship is amazing and respectful. I also think owning up to mistakes is something Abby did wonderfully. This is something we all should strive for in life as it would be for the greater good 🍀 Most people would just get defensive about it.

[@mimz1173]

I am Swedish and I agree with you. There’s literally not a single swede who doesn’t know that plantations are BAD, RACIST and part of enslaving black people. However… Sadly, not all people seem to care, despite having the knowledge. But if we see what kind of politicians were recently elected for government here in Sweden it’s not a surprise that some people just don’t give a f*ck about other people. 😩 but I’ll try to stay positive, I guess we have to ❤ I am SOOO happy that this video came out and that Abby really wanted to shed light on her own mistakes 🙏🏼

[@callmepiee2009]

I'm guessing it might be part of why he's an ex-husband now.

[@My_Lacrimosa]

How was it a mistake when she knowingly went there? If you knew about it living on the other side of the world then she definitely knew about it

[@erit3662]

[paraphrase] "The main purpose of a Plantation was never to be a home... they were forced labor camps." I agree with everything else said during this amazing video, but that single statement spins the perspective SO QUICKLY!

[@madelinegutierrez1720]

But - it's the one thing I disagree with. They were meant to be opulent homes. Show pieces of the owner's wealth, class, breeding and culture. The owner's spoke Greek and Latin, their daughters had cotilions where they met young men of the same "standing." They just thought they were just as correct and behaving rightly as the Rajas treated India's "untouchable" caste - that people were born into and could never change.

[@erit3662]

The word Plantation does not denote a house, manor, or mansion. The term plantation is used to specify a large farm or estate on which cotton, tobacco, coffee, sugar cane, or the like is cultivated, usually by resident laborers. So while there may be a very nice, opulent home ON a plantation, that nice house and social standing was based on the plantation.... a system of long term forced labor camps.

[@madelinegutierrez1720]

@@erit3662 Yes I agree - but the Opulent home and the forced labor camp can't be separated. Unlike "factory farms" today owned by CEO who probably never even tour it. Plantation owners and their families were on site / in sight. Our "estates" from the revolutionary war until the Civil War - were also forced labor camps. The word Plantation arising from the type of crop produced. Mount Vernon was George Washington's estate where his beloved Martha lived always and between them they had 317 slaves, about half had been in Martha's dowery, most rotated around the farm and waterways depending on the season. It can't be said these estates and Plantations weren't homes - the whole purpose of the forced labor was to keep the family that lived in the Big House and their heirs at the level of luxury and society they were accustomed to. The words plantation and estate refer to lands that always included that Big House with wealthy people.

[@madelinegutierrez1720]

@@erit3662 Check out Wikipedia's definition of Plantation Home "In the American South, antebellum plantations were centered on a "plantation house," the residence of the owner, where important business was conducted. Slavery and plantations had different characteristics in different regions of the South. As the Upper South of the Chesapeake Bay colonies developed first, historians of the antebellum South defined planters as those who held 20 enslaved people." Note they say the says plantation centered on Plantation Homes.

[@ashtenchambliss284]

@@madelinegutierrez1720 the word Home is misleading in the wikipedia article you brought up (and anyone can edit a wiki page anyway). Plantation owners often owned two or more, so the Big House was often empty except for the slave housekeepers. They were show houses, used for hosting business meetings, impressing white colleagues, or giving the owner's family a vacation while he could still conduct business.

[@SewRena]

I remember looking for venues with all the specks that she had and every time a Plantation would come up on my list (there was a lot since we live in the south) I could not even consider it. It was just so creepy and strange. I had a farm wedding that was built specifically to be a venue so there was zero history attached to the venue. No animal ever set foot in the barn.

[@madelinegutierrez1720]

HA!

[@leora_in_london]

@Rebecca Kearney okay, but if you know 100% something bad happened there, it's on you to acknowledge that.

[@esmep9387]

@Rebecca Kearney You're the kind to do a plantation wedding if you could 🙄

[@samiam2088]

“Plantation weddings” are historical gaslighting, plain and simple. The building is pretty and opulent and makes for great wedding photos and that white washes the actual history.

[@janicegibbs7871]

The plantation including the master house was built by master builders, these master builders were slaves

[@JustJen1386]

Literally

[@alexia3552]

Really good point, all those pretty Instagram photos make for great PR

[@Splexsychiick]

Yer. I feel like for a lot of people it makes it accidental. They really don't realise what they are doing. Yes it has a horrible past but the pictures will be so bueatiful. Omg the authentics. A beautiful venue. No deep thinking. And if they did think about it they are just dismissive of it to focus on their beautiful special day.

[@Nitzpitz]

How is it different from a castle wedding in Europe though? Those beautiful houses were owned by privileged people that took advantage of others too.

[@tealablu3759]

The ease of these ladies talking about a difficult topic is really quite lovely. No acusaciones, no guilting, just an honest convo about something that my white privilege and geographical location doesn’t force me to think about

[@miamivicemami]

You’re defending holding a celebration at a forced labor camp

[@moneybags999]

@@miamivicemami No, I didn't get that at all. I got the impression that @Tea was saying that because of her being white & perhaps not living in the South (or even in the US?), this was something that was not at all on her radar because she was totally removed from it & this conversation in fact put this issue on her radar & made her think about it.

[@betsyb]

@@miamivicemami no, take a step back and focus on what they’re saying. they’re not defending plantation weddings at all. they’re just appreciating the fact that they’re having an honest and civil conversation on the bigger picture behind why stuff like this happens, which is a very valuable and educating conversation to have

[@junes5657]

Abby, I applaud you so much for sharing such a private moment that was so painful for you in so many other ways. You are brave for stepping into the crosshairs of the 2020 racial forest fire is our reality right now. I love watching things on KZbin, but I am not one to post anything EVER! So know you have touched someone out there. Cheyney, Thank you for hosting this interlude. Conversations need to happen and keep happening. It is very easy to sit back and judge what someone else is doing and we all can identify what is wrong once it has been pointed out to us. It takes conviction and courage to identify and act on something hidden or normalized. To two beautiful women, Thank you both for being brave enough to speak up.

[@SavageBubblegum]

When I was a kid in SC we would take school trips to a plantation maybe an hour away, I can tell you that it is just pure ignorance. Our trips there were "look at this beautiful house! " to "we're now passing the slave quarters ☹ anyways let's make candles" to "the mean northerners murdered the poor innocent family look here's the daughter's bloodstain 😭". It doesn't make it okay by any means but we literally grow up not knowing any better.

[@ahhh4117]

I went on a school trip to an alligator farm in preschool but this is just abhorrent jesus christ, why

[@TT-di4qz]

I am from SC and that is the truth! We went on a field trip in sixth grade and that is exactly how it was represented. When I grew up and discovered the truth, I was shocked.

[@hollymcdermott2785]

Saaaaame and it wasn’t just one trip either 🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️

[@ms.anonymousinformer242]

When I worked for a company that provided cleaning services in homes, a customer had a home over 100 years old. She showed us a tunnel that went into a secret room , for hiding people during the time of the underground railroad. It was nice she didn't hide it or build over it when she bought the house. People need to be shown stuff like that to see how real it was.

[@brittanyrouse1057]

Tennessee here and we too grew up having field trips to different ones, and they STILL do this with my children now. It always felt uncomfortable and strange.

[@redzeppelin24]

As an immigrant who learned about America’s history through school and the horrors enslaved people went through... I can’t imagine being ignorant about a plantation, or any trauma filled place of history....

[@scotte8629]

the problem is that it's literally everywhere (some places worse than others admittedly). So any places in the south can have this trigger issue...

[@MsMollah]

Where are you from originally?

[@rikitawimberly775]

I don't think she was ignorant of the history of the plantation. That would be quite hard to believe. I think she meant she was ignorant to why having a celebratory event at a site with that particular horrific history would be problematic. She's never had to be conscience about the correlation between the history of the site and her wanting to have an event there because of her white privilege.

[@JM-hn6vg]

Where ever you immigrated from I'm certain there are horrible places that people know or don't know about, but they still visit and patronize.

[@PhoenixKyuketsuki]

The problem, as someone else has already noted, is how many of them there are. You become numb to the spectacle of “Plantation, Exit this way” signs everywhere. It becomes a “normal” part of the southern backdrop that you stop thinking about it/block it out, especially if you grew up there. But that in and of itself, the *ability* to block it out, is a privileged one. Basically too many people have been profiting off of old plantation houses and it has normalized them as an acceptable part of the southern backdrop because “weddings!” or “history!” or whatever. All of it is bad, and honestly not even education could really fix it because again, something common becomes easy to ignore. Really it should be made illegal to make a profit off of plantation houses- that might do it.

[@Elena-er7zp]

I was at a Plantation in Louisiana. One of the descendants of one of the enslaved was in line for tickets a couple of people ahead. Once she got to the window and made her connection known - OMG - it was like a celebrity had arrived. The lady came out from the booth, no need to purchase a ticket, a golf court arrived to take her to the main house, everybody was telling everyone else in line who the lady was. It was literally oooos and aahhhs and people straining their necks to see her. I was like “damn” and I felt lucky to have stood close to her. No point really - just a story from touring a plantation I felt compelled to share. I really do appreciate how these museums have changed how they present the stories of the enslaved and I wonder if this would have been the response in the 1990s.

[@taylormorgan6192]

I’m glad she was willing to talk about her decision. It probably isn’t easy to expose the bad decisions that she made in the past.

[@audfosutv2500]

Two intelligent, beautiful women having a hard but necessary conversation...thank you so much❣.

[@sarahdaestrela6098]

The point that plantations were forced labor camps that happened to have beautiful homes in them, rather than plantations being beautiful homes that unfortunately had a tragic history associated with them is the reframe I think most of us non-Black folks needed and never heard before. It is so simple but it explains why my first reaction to the video title was "Oh yeah that sounds kind of bad, I guess" instead of genuine revulsion.

[@sherryg1838]

I agree. When I think of a plantation, it’s associated with tragic history and I have negative feelings about it. However a wedding venue is just a wedding venue. There is a disconnect in my brain.

[@GeorgeABMoore]

“Get married in your back yard with your friends and eat some tacos, it’s great!” My sister actually got married in our grandma’s back yard! Our mom and aunt baked the cake, and all the guests brought something to eat and it was great fun! No dance, no super judgmental ‘what do you think of my present’ staredowns, just a bunch of laughs, good food, great conversation, well-wishes and love. I’ve been to some really fancy weddings with like three dozen guests, at least one with waitstaff, a traditional dance, and all the speeches, and they’ve generally felt very cold and formal in comparison to the plain and simple love in a backyard wedding. The place doesn’t really matter in the long run if you can laugh and be happy with the ones you love! Those are the memories you will cherish and share with the kids.