Identity Politics and its Discontents

The Michael Shermer Show # 385
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For much of history, societies have violently oppressed ethnic, religious, and sexual minorities. It is no surprise that many who passionately believe in social justice came to believe that members of marginalized groups need to take pride in their identity to resist injustice.
But over the past decades, a healthy appreciation for the culture and heritage of minority groups has transformed into a counterproductive obsession with group identity in all its forms. A new ideology aiming to place each person’s matrix of identities at the center of social, cultural, and political life has quickly become highly influential. It stifles discourse, vilifies mutual influence as cultural appropriation, denies that members of different groups can truly understand one another, and insists that the way governments treat their citizens should depend on the color of their skin. This, Yascha Mounk argues, is the identity trap. Though those who battle for these ideas are full of good intentions, they will ultimately make it harder to achieve progress toward the genuine equality we desperately need.
Shermer and Mounk discuss: the identity synthesis/trap • Israel, Hamas, Palestine • why students & student groups are pro-Palestinian and anti-Israel • the rise of anti-Semitism in recent years • proximate/ultimate causes of anti-Semitism • the rejection of the civil rights movement and the rise of critical race theory • overt racism vs. systemic racism • the problem of woke ideology • Trump and the 2024 election • the possibility of another Civil War • What should we do personally and politically about the Identity Trap?
Yascha Mounk is a writer and academic known for his work on the rise of populism and the crisis of liberal democracy. Born in Germany to Polish parents, Mounk received his BA in history from Trinity College Cambridge, and his PhD in government from Harvard University. He is a professor of the practice of international affairs at Johns Hopkins University, the founder of the digital magazine Persuasion, a contributing editor at The Atlantic, and a senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations. He is the author of numerous books, incl. The Great Experiment: Why Diverse Democracies Fall Apart and How They Can Endure (featured on President Barack Obama’s summer reading list).
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[@sherrydionisio4306]

The shame is, the “Left” today seems not to hold the opinions and values of the “old left.” The Left today seems to exemplify the old Right.

[@bryanutility9609]

You were just lied to back then & now. Nothing of their intentions & attitude changes just the means to power.

[@MsMrshanks]

Shermer you have a great knack of asking the exact questions I would ask given the opportunity. Thankyou sers....

[@williamrunner6718]

Yascha, a very insightful guest Michael!

[@aminam9201]

They live on hatred and grudges! That’s what unifies them !

[@spacebookpub3376]

What is the name of the theory mentioned at about 21:00? Labnic?

[@user-jf9hz2km2c]

The thing is alot of the people who oppose identity politics often make reference to their identity in order to help justify their opposition they say things like "heres how the obsession with identity has negatively impacted my identity group".

[@aminam9201]

Say “anti-Semitism” and it will cause terrorism and moral intimidation, but say “anti-Palestinian” and it will have no effect! They are both supposed to be equal human beings! What made the same term different according to race? Anti-black Africans is not equal to anti-Semitism! Why?!

[@aminam9201]

What is the difference between the constructive human intelligence and the destructive irrational meanness?! Are they the same thing?! What is the difference between humans and apes?!

[@Pacer...]

👍

[@aminam9201]

Only humans can build human civilisation, and humans means the pride of mankind both humanity and pure human intelligence instead of the destructive irrational meanness (they call is politics!). what a great civilisation!

[@bryanutility9609]

Politics is for rulers and slaves make due what they must.

[@jazmx]

a small suggestion let's count all the facts that we have about the killings that happened since Oct 7th.. and then start again?

[@GaaikeEuwema]

Facts are extremely blurred. I don't know about you, but I find it extremely difficult to find factual news in this war. I do think Israel doesn't allow much press in Gaza, which can be justified as Israel doesn't want to kill journalists, and electricity blackouts don't help either. That death numbers from Hamas officials etc are just blindly accepted by media is strange and I imagine many deaths can be attributed to Hamas, either accidental or for exemple in efforts to prevent citizens leaving the north. That said, historically the IDF hasn't proven to be the most reliable news source either. So very difficult. There's no confusion possible though about the fact Hamas is a complete immoral terrorist organization that committed brutalities against its own population and israel and continues to do so.

[@aminam9201]

can any American citizen become president if he doesn’t show obedience and loyalty through offering sacrifices to the goddess?!

[@aminam9201]

How did they lose all human characteristics while they were praised and supported by pimps?!

[@KaiseruSoze]

If we can't figure it out, natural selection will.

[@aminam9201]

How did they become gods who are not subject to question and reckoning like other humans?! How did they become sacred gods without humanity? How did they gain all these advantages at the expense of humans and humanity?! How did they turn governments into slaves?! Where did they get all that power?! Miracles!

[@Mr.Witness]

Altruism

[@aminam9201]

Do you know who is the only one who can kill humans without accountability?! Do you know who you offer sacrifices, loyalty and obedience to without expecting anything in return?! He's a goddess.

[@aminam9201]

What is the difference between anti-Semitism and anti-humanism?! The difference seems huge! is not it! It seems like the difference between gods and slaves! There is no one left with us for crimes against humanity! It is as if she was embodied in anti-Semitism only! How did they build that castle (Castle of the Gods)?!

[@seizetheday9546]

*Malcontents .. or Discontented Persons. Pick one

[@tuckerbugeater]

They're both ways of expressing dissatisfaction.

[@gn2540]

He lost it at the end with his whole Trunp Derangement Syndrome.

[@elainesabatino7467]

Trump 2024! 😎 No White Guilt Forever! 🤍

[@richardanderson-ze3sk]

C'mon, Shermer. Gotta bring President Trump into it.

[@bryanutility9609]

Diversity is our greatest weakness.

[@grosbeak6130]

A Jewish classical liberal. Ok.

[@elainesabatino7467]

Trump 2024! 😎

[@samivirtanen4020]

So we should not trust Palestinian organisaations numbers but we should trust Israeli numbers? How can one be so one-sided about the situation? Trying to be objective :"Every civilian casualty is a tragedy" when the death toll of Gaza is now we'll over 10000. And what exactly is the difference when Hamas kills a child and when the Israeli army kills a child? Especially odd since the God of the chosen people specifically says: you shall not kill. But that doesn't apply here? Intellectually lazy, biased opinions that misses the whole complexity of the situation. Very sad.