Improved Cases, Compressed loads and FPS

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[@shannonnunn]

Best load development I have found is finding the flattest velocity variation between a spread of charge weights to find the most consistent load and the lowest es spread... I go between .3 to .4 grns between charges and find the least amount of velocity change between 3 to 4 charges... There are usually two nodes and you can even hear the difference when your barrel is in harmonic attunment with the bullet.... Plus using quick load to find the best powder for case fill and burn rate so you can build a barrel or load to have complete powder burn and reduced muzzle pressure. At 3 to 4 thousand psi at the muzzle the bullet will be asleep as it leaves the muzzle. I like belted magnums the best for improving cases.... I made an improved case out of a 7mm weatherby case to 35 degree neck and it has 91 grn h20 capacity. I run the 195 Berger at 2950 on a low pressure node to save brass... My brass lasts 10 loads easily... The improved case reduces the brass flow and. Hardens the soft norma brass around the shoulder just enough to give it characteristics of the stronger Papua brass... The neck is already thin and consistent in the brass and the neck length is .333 so it is a good length for a .284..... My reamer was designed to chamber the 180 hybrids but it also allows a longer usable barrel life with the 195's. The funny thing is both bullets have nodes at 2950 using different powders so it is nice to have options that have same velocities and poi.... The 180's run off of h1000 which is good for extreme weather and the 195 run on reloader 33 which is a good case filler for long range shooting.......

[@markandsamafterwork]

Thanks Shannon, Cheers

[@DOUGLASLASH-xy4ct]

I'VE BEEN RELOADING AND SHOOTING FOR OVER 40 YEARS, AND I AM STILL LEARNING EVERY YEAR HOW TO IMPROVE MY PERFORMANCE, AND I HAVE FOUND YOUR INFORMATION VERY REFRESHING AND INFORMATIVE! THANK YOU FOR YOUR INFORMATION! MERRY CHRISTMAS TO YOU AND YOURS!

[@markandsamafterwork]

Thanks Douglas, and a Merry Christmas to you and yours too, Cheers

[@mikemagnum7987]

This report takes me back to the late 70s and early 80s when I was working with the .308 in sniper rifles for LE applications. I was working with 150 grain projectiles and 4064. 49 grains was a compressed load, but in the rifles that the load was being worked up in, it matched the Bbl. harmonics perfectly and shot three shot clusters or one ragged hole at 100 yards... Tested those rounds in an old model 88 that I had restored from some very rough shape and glass bedded from stem to stern and it would group three into a cluster that no one would believe, and it would do it any day of the week so could be displayed to the unbelieving upon demand in some cases... Mark, you are definitely the Top Dog in this work today. That you share what you know or have learned along the way is evidence of your good character my friend!

[@markandsamafterwork]

Thanks Mike, that sounded like a great rifle, glad you liked the vid, Cheers

[@rapidrrobert4333]

Bravo!!! So much happens after the trigger is squeezed. Thanks Mark

[@markandsamafterwork]

Yep, Cheers

[@Villepillle]

This was a really interesting one. Thank you!

[@markandsamafterwork]

Cheers

[@triptideom]

Thanks for the video, great information here! I thought it was common sense, and obvious that a slightly compressed load is the best way to be sure the same amount of powder ignites as consistently as a fella can control, every time, but you're the first i've heard talk of it on KZbin. I haven't watched every video ever made, but, well done. Thanks again!

[@markandsamafterwork]

Thanks Tom, Cheers and all the best.

[@HanstheTraffer]

"Fill the case up, Jam a bullet in and shoot it" I did that once. When I first started reloading 22lr (the only caliber I have reloaded to date) after initial success with progressively stronger loads...I decided to just fill the case, jam a bullet in and shoot. Now the 22lr, being developed for black powder has FAR MORE case capacity than needed. In fact most commercial 22lr rounds are loaded less than half full. The experiment that I did was before I even had powder scale. Just eyeballing a commercial round it was evident that I should not go over 1/2 capacity (capacity of a 22lr is about 4.2 grains). I had me an old Remington 514 for testing and figured it was way over-engineered and would handle a 22lr with a full case of modern pistol powder. Remembering an old friend's approach to driving fast cars, "If you don't push them past the limit, you will never know where the limit is" hahahahaha So I proceeded. with safety glasses a grinding shield, welding gloves and heavy coat. I shot the double load. Catastrophic failure. It blew out the extractor to never be found. The gasses went back through the bolt directly in my eyes (fortunately shielded) and the case was torn in two pieces. Sorry for sharing that.

[@markandsamafterwork]

Hi Hans, well a dumb as that was, at least you lived to tell the tale, at I suspect learned a little that day, lol, Cheers

[@VLDezy]

Glad I found this video.i have been worried about compressed loads.reason is becuz I have a custom barrel with a short freebore 6.5creedmoor.jam is at 2.669 COAL..I found 140 grn BTHP the best bullet to load with to this barrel for its ogive pushed back compared to an ELDM bullet.

[@markandsamafterwork]

Cheers

[@montaego]

Thanks for this. Just working up 308win loads with Barnes 168grain tsx and Vihtavouri n550. The Sako finnwolf needs a short COAL to feed and eject properly and I was concerned over the compression of the powder.

[@markandsamafterwork]

Cheers

[@Leverguns50]

I really enjoyed this video agree with what you’re saying, I have a lot of people telling me I like to try unique in my big 50-110 WCF, course I laugh at that I don’t like to try something that can get double or triple or more charges of powder Chargers and your case, really enjoyed the video thanks for sharing

[@markandsamafterwork]

Thanks Man, glad you liked, and yes there always someone that need to suggest, where as if it ain't broke, lol, Cheers

[@dennisdekker5201]

Great explanation

[@markandsamafterwork]

Cheers

[@jackd.jeffries3358]

Always learn something! Thank you! Shoulder angles are more relevant than I had previously thought.. I used to shoot archery competitions.. and having the fastest setup wasn’t as rewarding as having a forgiving setup.. I’d rather have a slow hit than a fast miss. Cheers

[@markandsamafterwork]

Yep, cheers

[@jeremygordon4179]

I've noticed with certain powders and bullet combinations you have to compress some. Case in point 7mm-08 ends up compressed with almost all bullets with imr4350 if you wanna get even close to the max load.

[@markandsamafterwork]

Cheers

[@taconobaka1688]

Heh, I can't really argue with you because your results speak for themselves, but it was my understanding with ladder testing that you find a velocity node so things like temperature and other factors that might effect muzzle velocity slightly don't interfere as much with the consistency. Keep on, keeping on!

[@markandsamafterwork]

Do what works for you, Cheers

[@lovetoflylovetofly3843]

Excellent information! Thank you for this.

[@markandsamafterwork]

Cheers

[@waynevivianboof]

very insightful, thanks for all your great content.

[@markandsamafterwork]

Cheers

[@toddb930]

My limited experiences with a compressed load showed me that the bullet seating depth would have more variation due to the bullet being pushed back out on some rounds.

[@markandsamafterwork]

Hi Todd, no not quite, many other details in involved, will all make sense in time to come, Cheers

[@rocketsurgeon1746]

Pretty good testing showing polishing chambers doesn’t affect case grip. Take a look

[@markandsamafterwork]

Well that can be the case, but then again I have seen real world experience to say it does, but as in everything, depends on the details, Cheers

[@gristlepounder]

Ditto on compressed loads. Been doing that for years in FTR competition.

[@markandsamafterwork]

Cheers

[@johannesvanhoek9080]

Very interesting and informative video and I thank you , seems like you and I are on the same page in theory’s even though you execute more because of location and Availability of open land to shoot , PS. Couple of thoughts in regards to all of this , I’m just thinking - Making sure that the projectile that’s going into the case is exactly parallel with the case or with the centerline of the case so that it hits the rifling equally on all sides after the explosion , Also the distance from the ogive to the actual rifling or lands I assume is very important also and one last thought, am I correct in thinking that the heavier and longer the bullet the tighter or twist of the rifling needs to be To stabilize that longer heavier bullet ! THANKS FOR THAT PARTICULAR VIDEO , I THINK IT WAS MUCH NEEDED 😊.

[@markandsamafterwork]

Yes all correct, we have many other videos explaining more of these details, glad you liked, Cheers

[@neilblackman2965]

Do you volume match your brass? I watch a video where the guy did this , and the uniformity he was achieving on his velocities was remarkable.

[@markandsamafterwork]

If I have issues with uniformity, yes, but usually avoid by using good brass, Cheers

[@stanlucas1932]

Mark, so how do you determine your max charge? I assume you choose a max SAFE weight that produces reasonable es & sd? On a separate note, what's your opinion on bore rider/+P throat designs? Thanks and keep up the great work, it's much appreciated.

[@markandsamafterwork]

Well as said, I run to any pressure signs, I rarely use speeds, much more an ELR group, but of course I can, I have the range, most don't and so can't. As for bore riders, they by design are a trade off, they allow a larger projectile and a little more powder by having the bullet further forward, but the bore rider design, lowers the bc, so they work some times and not others. I prefer not to use, Cheers

[@amirdzaferovic3489]

Great Video Mark and Sam. Just short advice if possible, 300 PRC 230 gr A-Tip i will get very nice extreme spread of 5-7 fps on 10 rounds, but it won't group. Best group i can get is 1.2 inch at 100 yards. Any ideas? Yes my rings and all bolts on rifle are tight and toured to spec nothing is moving. Thank You

[@markandsamafterwork]

Well really couldn't say without being there, but as said main times, it can be about the rifle or the shooter. Not saying this is your problem, but for lots of folks, the first time they step up in calibers, they find this sort of thing and most cases although what they are doing works fine for the smaller ie 6.5cm, 260, 308 etc, both the hardware and shooters form are not up to it, and some lessons or some research is required. All comes down to the bullet leaves after the rifle has started to move, more bang, more movement, bigger group. As said, couldn't suggest what is your issue, but this is what is true for many, Cheers

[@amirdzaferovic3489]

Thank you 👍🏻

[@bradleytyrrell4417]

Very good info in this one mate makes one do a lot more thinking about things. One question for you I have a 243win and I'm pretty keen on getting it turn into an ackley improved 243 what is your thoughts on the 243 ackley cheers mate

[@markandsamafterwork]

Thanks Man, yes they work great, lots of folks swear by them, Cheers

[@dennisrutan3052]

Out of curiosity would blowing out the shoulders (improved) on a .375 RUM gain much, in the ways of accuracy vs velocity?

[@markandsamafterwork]

Well might do, as said works well for some not so much for others, ask around see what folks have done, and what they found, Cheers

[@michaelreed1380]

So, should I keep scooping powder up with my brass like a measuring cup through flour or no? 😎

[@loadmastergod1961]

No! Sprinkle into palm of your hand and eyeball the charge like a pro

[@markandsamafterwork]

You idiots, lol, Cheers

[@michaelreed1380]

Cheers!