In The Ring!!! UK vs. USSR Shotguns

Thomas Bland Sidelock and a Toz Hammer Gun.Two great nations; Two great guns; Two great gunmaking philosophies. Join me for my thoughts and what I have to teach you about these great shotguns. Don't forget to write your thoughts in the comments. What do you think about this boxing match? If you like what you see here please give me a like, subscribe, and check me out on Patreon. As always, thanks for watching!
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[@traviscochran6280]

I have a Toz 63, it is a 16 gauge Russian sxs hammer gun. It has chrome lined bores and is built like a tank. I have also handled a Toz 66, thats the 12 gauge version. I like the engravings on them. Mine has ducks, a rabbit, partridges, a fox and a hunting dog. I like these guns.

[@marcoceccarelli6415]

One of the best channels on KZbin. You sir are very knowledgeable

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Thank you Marco!

[@paulsimmons5726]

The English gun has the same elegance as some fine Italian pieces while the Russian gun reminds me of my grandfather's old Stevens single shot, the utility guns found by every kitchen door back in the good ol' days. It doesn't matter if you are wearing a tuxedo or overalls, you've got a double barrel to match. I enjoyed the review, take care.

[@rupertmcnaughtdavis7302]

Two extremes, but no preferential treatment in the review.There is just something about a hammergun that makes it quite appealing.

[@hamm6035]

As I look at the English shotgun the only words that come to mind are "Oh my"

[@alwayssomething3135]

Well spoken and very informative. I enjoy your videos! Thank you

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Thanks RB - I try.

[@YaoiMastah]

The USSR gun you're holding is a shotgun from Tula, the TOZ-54. Short piece of history: at the turn of the 20th century, the Russian Emperor sent out all sorts of envoys to look around in Europe, Japan and America for this new 'industrialisation' thing he kept hearing great things about. One bloke went to Belgium (Liege, to be precisely) and returned with a bunch of Belgian sxs hammer shotguns and some machinery. Tula was formed and they started making (relatively) high-end hammer shotguns. After the revolution and the Communists taking power, the Communist leaders (passionate hunters themselves) considered hunting a people's right and upgraded Tula with a brand new Belgium productionline to produce sxs hammer shotguns on an industrial scale. The TOZ-54 is a different story, somewhere in the 70's, the Tula management noticed that noone was really buying those sxs hammer shotguns anymore (what with modern alternatives and every farmer and every Lada Niva owner already owning one, the Russians have a lot of fond nicknames for Tulas), so they set a bunch of artists and designers to work to design a more modern, futuristic sxs hammer shotgun (as futuristic a hammer shotgun can be). The TOZ-54 is the result. I know this, because I've seen one in a local shop for 350 euros. I needed to do some research on it, because I wondered whether it was steelproof (alas).

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

I appreciate this so much! How the USSR sporting arms and ammunition industry survived and prospered must be worthy of a book. As for the TOZ I have an steel - I took it to the range and everything works as it should and I fired only steel - since I had nothing else - and the bores cleaned up to a mirror finish afterwards. If there is damage - it can't be seen. This is a very strong action. I fired some slugs as well...the shotgun was sipping Coke - nothing to it. I like the hammers a lot. Thanks for taking the time to write.

[@YaoiMastah]

There are books about that period, unfortunately only in Russian and some in German. It is a very interesting subject indeed, as the communists preferred everybody to go hunting to get some precious proteins to the table rather than producing enough food for everybody. Before that, hunters were not considered to be upstanding folk (either, you were a nomad who lived in a round tent or you lived in a rural village but were considered useless for the village and therefore sent into the woods with a gun). WWII also learned them that they should really have their subjects brush up on their marksman skills (their top snipers were often of the round-tent-living hunters folk) before sending them off to the trenches. The TOZ-54 you have, has the "Made in USSR" stamped in it, which means it was an export model (as the attempt to sell more Tulas in the USSR by redesiging them failed horribly). These are of somewhat better built indeed. But still, I personally wouldn't risk it (hunters insurance policies are very strict) without the fleur-de-lis stamped in the barrels. Eventually, I settled for the Pedersoli La Bohemienne. Also Belgium design sxs hammer shotgun. But made by Italians on modern computerized machinery (and Italian handicraft), steel proofed and removable chokes.

[@kenadams3951]

Your a good teacher. In all your Videos

[@chrischiampo7647]

Really Nice Doubles There is Just Something Amazing About Double Shotguns 😮😮😀😊 Thank You For Sharing These Fine Shotguns I Really Like the Double Triggers 👍🏼

[@453421abcdefg12345]

A very nice Thomas Bland double, Thomas Bland was well known for making mainly wildfowling guns, and your example, being almost unengraved, is probably one of these, but as you observe, still wonderfully made and finished, it is of course one of the plainest guns made due to it's utilitarian purpose. Many thanks for posting this. Chris B.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

You're most welcome Chris - it is hunting gun for sure - still so fine though.

[@swkohnle08]

Thank you Mike for sharing another interesting presentation. When you consider the mechanical precision of old firearms, you can’t help be impressed by the old craftsmanship.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Super fine firearms Stephen - I was just handling them last evening - still a revelation - how carefully they are made.

[@ronlafitte6864]

Mike, I stand in awe of such quality old-world craftsmanship and elegance. If I owned one, I’d feel as if I needed to be wearing a suit and white gloves. I’ve never seen a high-grade SXS in person but I guess your videos are as close as I’ll ever get to seeing one. Thank you for this wonderful insight! All I can say is “Wow!!!”

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Thanks Ron - I've learned so much from guns; lessons in science, tools, production and history...among others. All the best.

[@roeng1368]

I do like that Bland. There is an excellent little book called "The Birmingham Gun Trade" by a chap called Williams. In this book it shows period photographs of some of the gun quarter workshops where really high-end guns and rifles were made. The conditions were pretty shocking, very little in the way of machinery, the hammer and chisel, as well as the file were the tools of the trade. Yet the gunmakers did an excellent job, light, lithe, sweet handling guns, beautiful wood, engraving, properly hardened and finished.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

I have to get that book. And for all the boasting of our time involving technology - perhaps we forget ourselves and lunge forward, constantly seeking greater and greater speed - yet not knowing where we are going or what it is we hope to find. I've walked for a mile on a road in the middle of no where and seen more than I did in a car crossing the whole country. : )

[@roeng1368]

Well technology is about getting rid of the need for skilled peoples labour really isn't it ? I have seen factories where most of the tasks, even menial tasks are automated. A cnc machine does not need breaks, time off, does not get sick, does not get tired, or go on strike.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

I know you are correct. I'm stupid and old fashioned. I like people - all of them. An entire empire of machines isn't worth even one person to me.

[@roeng1368]

You may be old fashioned, which in my opinion is not anything to be ashamed of, but you are not stupid.

[@armedbrit493]

@@UnitedStatesOfGuns The old skills endure yet! I live near the T R White & Co workshop, fantastic arms... then again I also helped to clear the G. Bate and co Birmingham workshop 6 years ago.

[@SamuraiAkechi]

I own IZh-58, 12 gauge, with extractor, fixed full choke and half-choke, based on Anson-Deely system. Very comfy gun, with great birdshot groups, slugs often go a little higher than the bead. The original stock is pretty punishing, if you grab the gun in a wrong way, the trigger guard hits your finger when you shoot. Anyway right now I'm happy shooting clays at the range with it. It's probably half a century old, my dad got it as a gratitude gift from the guy who used to run a gun store and found it in a used segment, and finally I got it when I decided to become a responsible gun owner and a hunter. I bet this thing is going to run smoothly for next 50 years with basic care, however, the wood looks pretty weary.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

I have the same gun. Such a rugged design. Excellent steel. You could freshen the stock with Briwax or any similar wax. The wood and finish on mine just got dry over time. The wax solved all that. I suppose any oil for wood might work too. Good hunting and shooting!

[@josephsoltes1250]

You and your videos are the best.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

I am humbled by your kind words. Thank you for writing me.

[@stevecochran2677]

Beautiful wood on that UK double.

[@thakurnileshprakashsingh]

Please share some double rifles and 275 Rigby.

[@bearbait2221]

I like to see the difference of machining and guns and machining is history to me. The first large lathe ever made had made a cannon barrel first then a bigger engine cylinder to make the lathe more powerful. MAN I'M ENVOYS OF YOUR COLLECTION THANKS FOR SHARING YOUR PASSION FOR ALL GUNS AND DESIGN. I know there are more of us then we think so thanks from Alaska. I dont see art guns Ive found a few in old collapsed cabins rusted to bits cant read makers marks Alaska is hard on guns or any metal things dont last long here.

[@karamelles98]

Nice video, we still have many of USSR era hunting shotguns floating arround in our market, because compared with other comercial weapons- they definately are the most available ones for beginners because of their price.

[@CandidZulu]

Russia can make very nice guns too, TsKIB makes some of the most lovely guns one can ever wish to own.

[@roeng1368]

I remember a russian brand called "Vostock", which were advertised in the uk shooting magazines backin the 1980's. They were supposed to be very good shotguns. Cz rifles were produced behind the Iron curtain for many years, and were and are truly excellent rifles, making everything from .22's up to the African heavies.

[@CandidZulu]

Vostok is a TsKIB brand, like Baikal is a Izhmash brand. TsKIB is in Tula, where there also is a gunmaking school, and a museum of arms technology.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

I have to get over there - they must have vast gun works and make countless guns - maybe many we don't know. I forgot - aside from war and sports - there is tourism; I can be one of those. : ) Thanks for the information.

[@marcoceccarelli6415]

Can you do a video on World War 1 and World War II rifle scopes. I would like to see what different countries use for scopes.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Okay Marco - good idea; I'll round up what I can. Thanks for the idea.

[@Mudpuppyjunior]

Just discovered your channel and love it. Knowledgeable but modest and unassuming and with a fair viewpoint for all manner of arms. The tiniest of quibbles and it might not even be one, depending on how one defines "successful" but the Mongols occupied most of western Russia for almost three hundred years. That seems fairly successful even if ultimately they were expelled.

[@mattsheed9671]

I have the same Baikal Hammergun got to say USOG it fits me well and shoots well. And it's nice as a Englishmen, to see English shotguns been praised by good people like yourself.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Hi Matt - Those Russian guns are tough - so tough; and the English guns are the best : ) ...truly a privilege to own. Thank you for your kind words and all the best to you!

[@mattsheed9671]

@@UnitedStatesOfGuns thanks for your reply. Baikal Over and under was my first 12 bore.Unfortunately I cannot afford a decent English Shotgun. Do you own any nice Beretta Shotguns bye any chance? I've a Silver pigeon with 3.5 Magnum Chambers.

[@xxxxxx5868]

UK: "Our shotguns are made of the highest quality hardwood, that has been aging since 1887, our barrels are made by the finest gunsmiths and engraved by the finest artisans, it has 100 parts and everything has been fit into perfection" USSR: "The cyka shotgun fires powerful 12ga for maximum capatilist destruction, when broke use as melee, not one step back blyat *chugs vodka* "

[@453421abcdefg12345]

cody sonnet: I think you must be on some kind of medication!

[@zoesdada8923]

First! Guns and weapons are history. Without the implements of war we wouldn't know very much at all about civilizations of the past.

[@MegaBoilermaker]

Forgot to mention that the firing pins are fitted with re-bound springs.

[@MegaBoilermaker]

And safety hammers (the Baikal).

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Thank you both!

[@geraldswain3259]

The Russian shotgun can double up as a good club ,or for growing your runner beans up!.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Hahaha Gerald, Maybe so but we won't tell Vladimir.

[@chrischiampo7647]

Could You Kindly Do a Video on Release Triggers On Shotguns 😀 Thanks in Advance

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Hi Chris - yes - good suggestion & thanks as always.

[@rajindersinghchandel2402]

Please make some knowledgable video on sxs hammer midland guns birmingham .Their material and quality.....thanks

[@ronsindric4241]

If KORTH made a double, how do you think it would compare to the British gun in this video ?

[@DrBreezeAir]

The best sporting shotguns were produced under the name МЦ. The finish and the attention to detail are really impressive. They still command very substantial prices.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Please send a link - are they similar to my TOZ O/U - the one in my video?

[@ИонаддавСуровый]

@Usog installations Hello! I apologize for my English. The TOZ-54 rifle model you saw in the video is a cheap shotgun that costs $ 400-500. The Russians have good pistols, starting at $ 2,000, the MC brand produced by ckib. Your review is good, but it is not correct to compare pistols of different price ranges. TOZ is consumer goods.

[@DrBreezeAir]

@@UnitedStatesOfGuns kzbin.info/www/bejne/pKiQkJJ4rM2YmbM Sorry for taking so long.

[@4555joe]

The difference is that the Brits make guns for the 1%...with prices in the thousands And the Russians make very good guns that work for the regular people but there are Some that cost are Iqbal or better than Holland & Holland!!!

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Great comment.

[@Waidman]

Dear sir, i am thinking of buying a new side by side shotgun since i am a big fan of traditional hunting shotguns, but the only thing is, here in the Netherlands we can only shoot with steel shot. So i need a side by side that is steelshot proofed and has the fleur the lis barrel stamp. I came across the Merkel 40-E shotgun which in in cal.12 is steelshot proofed. But they seem to talk about a ‘Merkel top-down principle’?! Do you know what they mean with that? and can you tell me some more about it?! Also other suggestions about steelshot proofed side by side’s are very welcome!!! Thank you for reading, Yours sincerely,

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Hello MrYoungnastyman, I did not know you are restricted in the Netherlands to steel shot only. Thanks for letting me know. I did receive several letters from your fellow citizens describing how restricted you are in the Netherlands and that there is much anti-gun sentiment. I'm very sorry about this misunderstanding involving firearms. I have been told about the occupation of your country and how impossibly difficult it was for your people - as the loss of freedom is for all people. I have also been told about how important and unforgettable liberation is and was for the Netherlands. In order for liberation to occur, guns were necessary - and remain the most important indication of liberation and respect for liberty. Sorry for that footnote commentary. As for your shotgun : Merkel and other gun manufacturers focus on steel shot as a marketing tool - which is fine. The so called "top down" idea is that the gun is designed in every way to handle steel shot - the theory being that steel shot is so brutal and destructive to barrels and gun mechanisms that entirely new methods and materials are needed. The truth is, that the steel shot (in most shotgun shells) travels the length of the barrel in a plastic cup - just as lead shot does. The steel generally does not make contact with the barrel. At the muzzle, due to choke, the steel shot does not compress as easily since the steel is harder than lead and does not deform as easily either. So a more open choke is not a bad idea for using steel shot and achieving patterns similar to lead. Of course, steel is less dense and decelerates for quickly than lead shot due to surface area and other factors. In short, the Merkel is a superb shotgun and so are many others. I had the good fortune to test many shotguns with steel shot. I only noticed tighter patterns and on some thin walled shotguns the choke was opened slightly by the passage of the short steel shot column in the choke area only - and after that the shotguns produced more open patterns and there were no other changes or damage. Operating pressures and everything else is just about the same. Hope this helps. BTW - you'll have a superb shotgun in that Merkel.

[@mefirst1211]

Some Russian shotguns are of very high quality like the MTU which is definitely a work of art, check it out.

[@thesheepman220]

If you were standing at a peg of a drive of pheasant and duck you would choose the bland, if you were out in the rough weather rain ,snow etc and general hunting you would choose the baikal , the baikals also have chrome barrels

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

I took the Baikal to the trap club. I'd take that Baikal for both - for me.

[@thesheepman220]

USOG yes I agree but here in the uk for some snobby people that just wouldn't be cricket lol ,fortunately I'm not one of them I don't shoot driven game ,I shoot a lot decoying waterfowl and rough shooting I use a aya sbs non ejection cost me 100 pounds in like new condition had for yrs still working great it's my pigeon and crow shotgun I also have the same shotgun in 20 bore which is very nice best regards steve

[@leeadams5941]

I can just picture some guy being out and having to fix the sling with a nail, one question? Have you ever seen a Russian gun of the same quality with the British guns? From some of their artwork I would think they could produce some fantastic weapons. BTW I prefer hammers.

[@north005]

Do you have any Remington Model Sevens? I’m wondering how they would serve as a lightweight alternative to a full size rifle (especially considering the high cost of “mountain” rifles).

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Hi Adam, The Remington Model 7 is a brilliant rifle. Had one in 7-08. Accurate, light, quick to the shoulder, excellent stick design. You can't miss. I recommend them without hesitation. All the best to you.

[@yeahbee8237]

Have you ever run across a baikal mc6 or mc8? Legendary o/u, with the usual rep of being indestructible but having some elegance to, a soviet olympic Trap shooter helt the world record for many years. He used the same shotty for his whole career Vostok made great rimfire olympic pistol and rifles to Alot coming out of russia even in the ussr days werent bad A lada niva is one helluva car to!

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

I'd buy either in a heartbeat - I have a sporting Baikal - can't remember the model and it is vaulted up right now - it has the 3 screws on each side of the forend - but no hinge pin - fantastic shotgun. I'll keep an eye out but maybe will have to find overseas somewhere. The Russian cars can be seen in various places in the EU - look fine - seem to be Fiat based maybe 124s and the smaller 4X4 is cute and apparently tough - maybe that is the Niva - I'll Google.

[@ziauddindin3727]

Good information. Thank you for sharing this with us. How do you compare Russian shotgun to that of a British? Do you sure that Russian shotgun will last as well as British? Thanks again in advance.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

I have a hunch the Russian shotguns, much like the Russian people, are unstoppable. Parts are big, the steel is excellent, springs are robust, the wood is straight grained. Tough, tough guns - I lost track of the times I've fired my Baikal O/U - no issues. Are they pretty - well, not so much - but in the swamps and uplands, pretty is as pretty does.

[@giorgituriashvili8420]

Toz-Tulski orujeini zovod-Tula's firearms factory!

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Thank you Giorgi! : )

[@waldemar4919]

Just yesterday have returned home with BAIKAL IJ-27E 12GA O/U. This shotgun is really build like a tank ... I think I can use it as a hammer and then I can shoot it without any problems :) Russia may have many serious problems but for sure they know how to make, maybe not that fancy and beautiful, but reliable and effective weapons.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Hello Waldemar! Those Russian guns - unstoppable. My favorite O/U is a Baikal. The AK is, like the Russian people, virtually without equal - collectively unbreakable. Your shotgun is an "end of the world" gun. I buy them in a heartbeat.

[@Romin.777]

You forgot Belgian guns. They had a huge industry with 1000 patents, also in the U.S. ;)

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Hello Romin - you are so right. In fact, of all the cities in Europe I remember Brussels as special. I din't want to leave - even though the local people seemed puzzled by why I liked it so much. Belgium is where Browning went when the American industrialists lost their vision - at that moment. FN . Also, in Brussels I learned that many English and other guns and rifles actually originated from Belgium; and were not so marked - and credit was taken for them elsewhere. These are the vagaries of commerce and nothing to alarm - yet the truth remains. I have noticed so many things in guns. Thank you for reminding me. Liege is one of the greatest gunmaking places ever. I sent my falling block double there. Anyway, life is full of mystery. Thank you for your note and I hope you are in Belgium - if so, you are the lucky one. All the best.

[@Romin.777]

@@UnitedStatesOfGuns Thanks for your reply! Forgotten Weapons has a video on all the proofmarks you can find on firearms from 1900 until 1950 i believe wich was interessting. I read that Liege had 1500 different gunmakers at the turn of the century but a lot of them were subcontractors. I recently bought my first (Belgian) side by side. But there is no brandname on it but the serials on barrel and block match. But through it's stamps i have concluded that it must be from 1924. Some stamps started and some ended in that year so it must be right from that timeframe. It's in good shape for it's age, very little play between barrel and block, you have to twist it really hard to feel it. Barrels sound like bells when tapped with little pitting and what i like the best are the long 30 inch barrels and it has second to none arabesque engravings. Just a plain piece. Well actualy i'm just north of Belgium in the Netherlands but i do have friends in Antwerp. I wish you all the best and really enjoy your channel. Take care. :))

[@Gungeek]

I think that's a TOZ-54 :)

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Thank you - sometimes I miss important things! : )

[@Gungeek]

i had to look it up to make sure, the 54 has the squarish hammers and the toz-66 has rounder hammer and a bit different stock. :)

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

I can't put this gun away - such an appealing gun. I like the hammers - the way the whole gun comes together - the works.

[@Gungeek]

got a soft spot for hammer guns myself :)

[@Gungeek]

got any Husqvarna underlevers?

[@Romin.777]

I like hammers. Reminds me of the old wild west. :))

[@satwik180]

Dear sir . First of all I would like to thank you for making a video on doubles . I'm happy to know one of your gun was imported to India and then later on passed to your country. I have an old catelog of antique indian fire arms ( imported from UK ) I'll surely check weather the gun is listed in that. If I have any reference I'll surely mail it to you with original MAXIMUM RETAIL PRICE In 1930s . Secondly ..... I kindly request you not to dry fire any weapons as it might reduce its value in future and you have all the tendency to break firing pin and or firing pin spring . My gun guru used a wooden block placed infront of firing pin to discharge the loaded striker of the gun . This will keep your gun new. Eventhough I might not have much experience like you but please consider my appeal . Regards Sathvik India

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Wonderful advice Sathvik - thank you. I don't want to break firing pins and springs : ) Thank you! The Thomas Bland sidelock : I'll send you the serial number later. Thanks for offering to check in your catalog. All the best, Mike

[@satwik180]

Sure sir . Can you please tell me who was the Indian importer of the gun in India ??

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Army & Navy Bombay, India

[@MegaBoilermaker]

@@UnitedStatesOfGuns Use "snap caps" or a block of wood (as suggested by your Indian contributor). In one of my former incarnations as a Forensic Metallurgist I twice investigated gun explosions caused by broken firing pins protruding through a breech face detonating on closure. (Mossburg slide action and Webley bolt action). In both cases the firing pins were work hardened to the point of eventual fracture by comstant "dry firing".

[@sjoormen1]

I own toz 35 gun and if those shotgun is even close to one I own qualitiwise I wouldn't mind owning that one too:-))

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Your shotgun is a tank and my TOZ guns are just about impossible to beat. Never a problem, always reliable. Take care my friend.

[@borisbuliak3626]

Very nice shotguns. The English is beau the Russian more like a hammer. They both spew fire.

[@haseebjarwar1480]

What do you say about spain guns sidebyside

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Spain makes some of the best shotguns on earth. The lower priced models from the past sometimes need more attention to heat treatment; other than that - Spain produces guns that are quite similar to the British best guns.

[@mre.w.2850]

99% of Spanish guns use the H&H actions it was a intended to be a exact copy but affordable, now AYA command very high money and does arrieta both fantastic quality Spanish guns and almost all hand made and fitted

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Hi Harvey - superb guns. I had an AYA 20 and my goodness...what a charming, light and superb shotgun. The detachable sidelocks are incredibly well made and used to be affordable. I suppose they still are...depending : )

[@mre.w.2850]

USOG 100% agree, funny thing is even the cheaper spanish sidlocks somtimes use aya made locks, keep a look out and check behind the locks for the aya marks, overall they are brilliant guns cheaper if the keen eye can find one sub 3k but solid reliable and 2 3/4 chambers too, it's also the hand fitting now has picked up it's own in today's gun collecting market but great for authentic game shoot gun with the quality of a English gun but more shootable. you should do a new comparison video on a English sidelock compared to aya no2 or 1, or arrieta if you can find one, also old English guns tend to be 2 1/2 chambers and Don't like stout rounds as Well tend to be a little harder on the old actions:)

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

You're very effective Harvey - I'll be dreaming AYAs now....I think I can see them floating around the gun room already! The only exception to all this is one Sarasqueta I had that started closing oddly. After awhile it was too much to ignore. Close examination showed the water table cracked right across the table where it met the standing breech. Further testing disclosed poor or no heat treatment - the steel was soft throughout - no surface hardness whatsoever. Probably an exception; but there it is.

[@worddunlap]

What a great couple of shotguns to compare. The Soviet era in the East was responsible for some pretty bad products in the end as communism proved to be a failure. State owned manufacturing caused the workers to put forth the most mediocre and even inferior products. When everyone is equal regardless of talent or performance it's simpler to be blatantly average. Did you mention the date of the Russian shotgun? I personally love hammers on guns. My uncle owned an old double barrel with hammers and he always called it his "Rabbit Eared" shotgun. As always, Great Video!

[@pseudopetrus]

I have a Baikal 12 g. single shot made in USSR, it is old and I bought it for next to nothing, it has some wear. But everything works perfect and when I pull that gun out, I can't help but think that some Soviet farmer or woodsman used one just like it to put dinner on the table. Putting meat on the table has been such a common theme in so many cultures and in this case, the single shot Baikal might not be something the farmer boasted about, but he would have boasted about the game he brought home after a successful hunt. I guess those kind of thoughts is why I consider my humble Baikal such a special part of my little collection.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Yes - good remarks - my Russian friends tell me the same; no incentive to excel for the individual in that old model of government. Hopefully things are better over there now. I remember writing about the fall of the USSR and my thesis was that it is better for the West if that part of the world remains communist since communism limits to the productive capacity and imagination of the people; which results in a less formidable opponent. Young thoughts from a young mind but I still like it. As for hammers - yup - I think they are great!

[@pseudopetrus]

Interesting argument, I never thought about it that way, I guess if the rulers take away the fruits of extra effort, extra effort becomes pointless.

[@worddunlap]

My thoughts years ago were similar. When the Wall came down I wept. I met someone on the other side and so did they. I don't think the younger people can appreciate it fully. It seems we needed the Soviets so we don't chase our own tails...

[@pseudopetrus]

I have Russian roots that go back to the pre-communist days, which is so far removed that it is not really part of my identity, but it has caused me to have a great interest in Russia. There is no question in my mind that the communist regime caused a lot of suffering and I think from hearing about my relatives that travel there, they still have a bit of a hang over from that communist binge.

[@jimf1964]

I love hammer guns. But is your comparison truly fair? You said yourself there are some shotguns made in Russia that are quite ornate, and there are some low end British guns. This is almost more an example of our impression of a country. Don't you think? The rugged, simple guns are probably more prevalent because the country is poorer, but I'm pretty sure the Russian elites didn't use a shotgun like this.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Great points Jim. Thanks for writing.

[@jimf1964]

USOG Thank you for supplying videos interesting enough for me to put some thought into.

[@ИонаддавСуровый]

That's right!

[@danrunner84]

I like Russian shotguns. I had a nice Baikal over under...probably made in turkey, lol

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Just about indestructible...those Baikals

[@midlifecrisis7888]

Are you an engineer? You sound like one, just like me. My GF is Russian, and she beautiful but very tough, Russians will each shit and ask for seconds, we have no business getting into a suffering contest with them, they always outlast their enemies. We on the other hand, are soft and corrupt society.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Hey seymore - I only studied engineering out of personal fascination with guns and anything mechanical. I also read history - the history of Russia is the story of a remarkable and unstoppable people - as you know. Russian guns are the same. : )

[@annabeltheunicorn9374]

Not a fair comparison really. You would have to match the equivalent prices for that. As our factories or makers are not set up to make stove pipes we left that to Leige in Belgium

[@MegaBoilermaker]

I bought a 16 gauge Baikal Hammer double 60 years ago and is as tight as new even today.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Hi George - the Baikals seem to be built on the Russian "500 year " window. A Russian fellow told me this is so no one ever remembers a Baikal failing.

[@MegaBoilermaker]

@@UnitedStatesOfGuns I also have a Baikal rifle in .308 and have used Russian military equipment in various countries whilst working for the UN including Helicopters so I would agree with your friend's opinions. Keep up the video's they are always a good watch !

[@galerivs]

those are not comparable guns.. one is thousands $$ and one is hundreds $$

[@ИонаддавСуровый]

quite true

[@brankozaja2984]

Russian MC sxs is High quality gun not TOZ or Baikal

[@toomaskotkas4467]

You are comparing two different classes of shotguns: one is made for the working class people and another one is made of the elite. You should've compared the elite class of the Soviet shotguns that were made for the communist elite or a custom-order you can buy now.

[@benjacobs6531]

Im big on Russian small arms.

[@UnitedStatesOfGuns]

Russian firearms are tanks. More AKs then any other firearm - as you likely know. TOZ makes fantastic shotguns and rifles. Baikal shotguns are among the best.

[@gff1371]

What is up with your hair

[@annabeltheunicorn9374]

That Russian thing got a bit to close to that bit of junk for my liking lol