Is $150K in Debt a Relationship Deal Breaker?

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[@Xzy-rv2nu]

If they get married; their finances will be the main reason why they will fight

[@debbielockhart7762]

He will be a fool to marry her, and he will pay every oenny of the debt.

[@littleme3597]

@@debbielockhart7762 AND MORE...

[@stuffykong]

Not even just the $ aspect; their living habits and attention to detail is misaligned.

[@faithbuenaventura3189]

"Why do you want to marry her?" "Because she's around."

[@DoubleDee382]

Yeah but he kind of talked him into an answer though. “she’s caring, hard-working, kind” “you are talking about HER, why do YOU want to marry her?” “…we have fun” “but you can have fun with ANYONE, so why do YOU want to marry her? At that point I think he pretty much said why. It might not be a good answer, but the host should have just said so at that point rather than beat an “I don’t know” out of him.

[@tristanrodenhauser5267]

@@DoubleDee382girls talk about this quite a bit… that it seems guys marry the girl who is around when they feel ready to get married but it’s not always the girl they had the best relationship with.

[@aladdout9454]

glad he asked kept digging in. A real one would have said "because I love her" or something or "I love being there for her" ... something. He basically said he doesn't really have a choice but be with her.

[@Anangelfromabove]

I hope he sees this.

[@Bidenvoterguy]

Its a hole

[@juicysmith38235]

I walked away from a 6 yr relationship bc my boyfriend wasn't transparent about his student loans. I finally got him to confess the total, $140k. He had no job 2 yrs out of school & his parents were paying the bills. I worked all through college & only went to school when I could pay cash. It took me 7 yrs to finish however I'm debt free. His parents made remarks the entire time that "no one can pay cash or be debt free." Well when I finally finished and told them I'm debt free the were so angry & even more upset when I broke up with their man child for being taught their same philosophy of life...

[@lisad56]

I paid cash for my undergraduate degree. I used all of my savings and I worked full time as a single mother. It can be done. Live very frugal and save every penny. I’m shocked when I hear people owing six figures in student loans when they don’t even go to medical school. 😱 I also went to a state university because it was cheaper than a private known school.

[@1lespaulfreak]

👏👏👏👏

[@juicysmith38235]

​@@lisad56 you are a very strong woman, congratulations 🎉🙌 Yes 6 figures in debt always blew my mind! My ex went for a BS in Psychology & couldn't find a job after 🤭😔 I heard 8 yrs after our relationship ended that he still lives with his mom & only held a minimum wage job for a few months ...

[@dianebrooks1859]

Also came out of college debt free. Best decision of my life

[@louiseerbslisbjerg7854]

​@@lisad56she went to medical school; She was doing a masters in medicine.

[@cyoohoos]

If “why do you want to get married” is a hard question…..don’t get married

[@catalinab7626]

For real!!!!! I was hoping he would say, "because I'm in love with her". None of that.....

[@melissam7067]

People feel so much pressure to get married. Being single is great too.

[@dynagroove1.020]

For a Man I can say coming home from work and cooking dinner listening to vinyl and not having to listen to a GF complain is Golden.

[@darkhorse9472]

@@dynagroove1.020 Hmmmm....or for a woman, not waiting on a man hand and foot and taking care of the kids.

[@KathleenMcNe]

I am -- and always have been -- blissfully and intentionally single. I'm able to spend my time as I wish. There are no arguments over finances or anything else. I have friends and family -- and my beloved dog -- with whom to socialize. After decades of hard work, living fugally, and making significant sacrifices, I have an eight-figure net worth and am now retired and able to travel for pleasure. Single life is perfect for me.

[@leahartlee29]

It sure is!!

[@dmoneydance]

I want a lover but being single feels so AMAZING!! 🤩

[@user-un6wf4cd9i]

As a woman myself I say run. That’s a lot to take on and she has no degree to show for it. If he really loves her and she loves him she’d work to make the debt smaller and if she’s not doing that I say end the relationship. That type of debt will kill the marriage and he’s going to become bitter because more likely than not it’ll become his problem and not hers once they marry.

[@RG-hf4et]

​@@SarahConnor562EXACTLY!!!

[@philwill0123]

​@@SarahConnor562costs went up in last 20-25 years. When I was at university, it was all paid, and I got a maintenance grant per term. Courses were 1.5k-3k per term. Govt took down protections on course costs and removed grants. Suddenly courses were 9k a year, living costs are 10k a year and you are going from couple of grand to 20k without effort

[@philwill0123]

She has a degree. She dropped out of the masters programme.

[@DarylClarke-cq1nl]

If the roles were reversed would any woman Marry or even date a guy with 156K debt and no degree or job to show for it? Why should he have to save her?

[@letsdothis9728]

Preach!! Yes!! Double standard for sure!

[@neisci]

More times than not, regardless of gender, is the behavior towards the debt. If the person is working really working towards paying it off, then sure. Debt shouldn't be a deal breaker.

[@PureJoySkinCareWaxStudio]

NOPE a woman wouldn't. He needs to RUN, RUN NOW.

[@PureJoySkinCareWaxStudio]

Hey, Dr., why use the word NERD as a negative and FREE WHEELING SPIRIT is a positive. 🤷🏻‍♀️. Stop labeling.

[@ineedhoez]

That's fair. But he didn't say that she was a bum. He just said she didn't finish it.

[@mikethemechanic7395]

Met my wife at 23 with 10k in debt and bad credit. She told me I had to pay off my loans and fix my credit before we purchase a house. Then we can get married. Spent 5 years working 6 days a week and side jobs. Glad I listened to my wife. Don’t get married till you pay all of your loans off. No kids either…

[@lynnmoz0616]

Perfect.

[@lynnmoz0616]

My ex & I had way different salaries. Me making way more. I paid off all his credit cards several times. He managed to bankrupt us. The beginning of the end. I thought he was a great guy in the beginning, too. Postscript: we had a daughter together. He owes me $7000 in child support which I'll never see He paid $0 towards her college degree. Never even bought her a text book. My parents & I got her through all 4 years with zero loans. Obviously, we're divorced. He lives in a duplex owned by his sisters husband & they now support him. I made it way too easy for him. But, in the past. And now I'm free to do whatever I want with little fear about $$$. I think your GF & her parents need to figure out what's next. My opinion, not your problem unless you get married.

[@kungfujoe2136]

yeah but a woman get get away with it because ...simps

[@dmoneydance]

💯% Heavy on the NO KIDs part!!

[@sophia8405]

Dude , walk away 😢

[@LaverneGrant-ff8ub]

I agree. He better run.

[@letsdothis9728]

No!! Don't walk! RUN!!! 🏃🏼

[@c.edales740]

Just like that. Just walk

[@lv4366]

He can't say he loves her immediately? Nope.

[@texan903]

Her excessive debt combined with her cavalier attitude about it, what is there to love?

[@jesssc402]

@@texan903but they’re thinking about marriage so he’s supposed to love her, at least have love for her. His answer sounds like he’s marrying to settle, not really because he’s in love..

[@markmessi9020]

​@@jesssc402I understand but to put it into perspective, this is the man's version of "Well, I would love him but he's broke and doesn't have his life together." He's conflicted and HAS to consider his options before he fully 100% says "Ok, let's get married"

[@michaelh2282]

No. It's a sign of maturity. Life isn't a teenage romantic comedy. You need to carefully consider a person's values, their life choices, their work ethic, their sense of responsibility, etc. Obviously, you need to love the person, but that should come AFTER you've vetted the person as someone whom you can build a long term future with, and not before.

[@philwill0123]

​@@michaelh2282this. People jump both feet into bad relations due to a) great sex/ super attractive partner b) fear of being alone C) sunk cost fallacy. D) laziness. Here it sounds like b, c and d.

[@zXBananaGamingXz]

I really hope he doesn't rush into this marriage

[@debbielockhart7762]

He needs to run.

[@debbielockhart7762]

I'm a woman with a very logical mind. I'm always the financial person in my relationships. I would run a mile from that person with $156k debt that dropped out with no plan. He'll end up paying this.

[@makaroner1174]

"I'm a woman with a logical mind" is like the grown up version of a pick me schoolgirls "I'm not like other girls!" Sorry but statements like piss me of so much. Such a nonsensical patriarchal-ass-licking thing to say. It's saying all other women aren't logical and further reinforcing the already idiotic male view of women being "emotional" just because they have emotional intelligence.

[@argentinaencanada]

I feel for him; it’s obvious he cares about her. He is analytical, so you won’t get profound declarations of love. His reaching out to work this out is how you can tell he cares about her. Asking anyone to take on that much debt it’s a lot to ask from a person.

[@PureJoySkinCareWaxStudio]

💯

[@isaactrujillo76]

Fantastic breakdown, this comment needs to be pinned.

[@winniethepoohandeeyore2]

Absolutely agree.

[@winniethepoohandeeyore2]

156k in debt.. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, He needs to walk ASAP OR he WILL be in for 1 HELL of a hard time. She IS showing she's NOT financially responsible.

[@JeremyTheEntrepreneur]

At the end of the day he will get her pregnant and than it’s really over. Financially liability of a baby and debt.

[@winniethepoohandeeyore2]

@@JeremyTheEntrepreneur Wouldn't surprise me. He needs to STOP being a SIMP.

[@ChadVanKlompenburg]

From a middle-class standpoint I completely agree I would not marry a woman with that much debt. They didn't ask the question about how much money she makes and how much money he makes... With my income I would never marry someone with 150k debt. John I think sort of incorrectly believes that love can solve it. Not if she makes 60k/year and so does he...

[@rickcurtis8319]

If you have to ask you already know

[@mcannonsr]

She’s going to want to be a stay at home mom, her debt will be an albatross on their necks for the entire marriage. Dr. J needed to challenge him on that. Big student loan obligations zap you of upgrading your car, zap you of financial security, they take the place of annual vacations. He needs to at least be challenged on what he will think if she wants to stop working after 1-2 babies.

[@consumerdebtchitchat]

PREACH!!

[@tabby73]

Solution would be wait with the babies until the debts are cleared.

[@user-gj1pq5zm4l]

If she’s a doctor, like he said, she won’t want to stay at home. She’ll feel the need to work if it’s truly her calling. I’m not sure why she was working on a Master’s instead of practicing Medicine already.

[@mcannonsr]

@@user-gj1pq5zm4l or maybe she dropped out of her masters’ program, like he said.

[@ineedhoez]

@mcannonsr This is true if you are broke... He might have enough money to be able to take care of everything that is needed for their family. Don't let poverty rob you of happiness

[@stevezelaznik5872]

Marriage should only be on the table after you’ve discussed difficult topics, finance chief among them. If you can’t agree don’t get married, full stop.

[@inspiteofbecauseof4745]

150,000 and no degree. Uh, no way would I date them. She’s aware and ashamed, but not concerned or ashamed enough to start doing anything about it. Those that “can’t work” while going to school, taking out loans far beyond the cost of tuition and books so they can often party and buy things with that money and later complain about having to pay it back or realize they majored in a degree that doesn’t justify the loan. He should run and find someone that is more on the same page financially as he mentioned they are on the same page about most things, but this is definitely a big topic that matters a lot to him or he wouldn’t have called.

[@MisterNightfish]

Spot on. Being "ashamed" doesn't mean anything if all you do is make some vague noises along the lines of "boohoo, woe is me". The 150k wouldn't be that much of a problem if it had been for a degree and if she was putting it to use. But if it's just random debt that wasn't for anything and that someone else has to pay off, that's an issue. I struggle to see how a decent person could even accept that. If I try to imagine me having this debt, I could not sleep at night if I made my partner pay that for me.

[@kensmith2796]

My sister married a guy who had a bachelors and masters in philosophy. He attempted a PhD but soon washed out. He never worked during all those years and had a lot of student loan debt. He quickly married my sister out of college and never worked a day in his life. My sister had to work and pay back all of his student loans. People that spend a long time in college pursuing liberal arts degrees generally aren't serious about working.

[@leabeauty837]

He’s a man. He definitely doesn’t need to find someone on the same financial page, but he just doesn’t need to get with anyone with more than maybe 20k of debt max

[@Cashhhhew]

Exactly. That amount of debt just for undergrad and partial grad school is crazy. I only had to take out $30k for grad school and it paid off in the end. I cannot fathom $150k for anything less than medical school.

[@alexa_4292]

She has a bachelors degree at least but no masters

[@zoraster3749]

Simple rule. You don’t marry someone with debt more than their annual income. Is $150k a dealbreaker for marriage? Not if she’s making $150k a year. If she’s making $50k… no marriage until the income goes up or the debt goes down. Just take the emotion out of it and stick to the numbers. Edit: that’s the minimum to even have the more detailed conversation but really the goal is to have zero debt. A dentist making $250k and having $300k in debt is a lot different than someone making $40k a year with $30k in credit card debt.

[@ineedhoez]

A decent general rule but it still mandates a conversation. Find out what they are going to do about it.

[@afriendorfoe]

I like that rule of thumb of not marrying if the debt is more than their income.

[@mylesgray3470]

I agree. First year out of college, your career annual salary should be equal to your debt as a first year worst case scenario. If not, it shows the person is not a good financial planner as this stuff is easy to estimate before starting college.

[@melinated2497]

I agree with this rule of thumb

[@jaylove3487]

A buddy of mine met and married a lady that had quite a bit of debt. He paid off all of it. Two years later, they were divorced. He thought they were going to be married for life and he wanted to start off on a good foot. After the marriage, he had very little money left, basically his life savings were gone. He was never the same again.

[@user-lf2lf6wy4z]

That is so sad. It's horrible when someone else puts you in a very bad position. It changes you. I can totally relate.

[@tabby73]

Wow that's a tough life lesson 😢

[@FabriceLabako]

Bro...why would he even pay HER debts? I would NEVER pay somebody else's debt. I would lend it interest free but would give it away.

[@debbielockhart7762]

Foolish of him. This guy should walk.

[@dmoneydance]

Ouch!! 😢

[@samyish]

DO NOT MARRY HER STUDENT LOAN!

[@jaelgopilan3279]

Correct, thank you for commenting on that.

[@AnaBananaM28]

As a woman I feel like John gives women a lot of passes, TBH if it was the other way around I don’t think he’d be saying the same thing.

[@KathleenMcNe]

I agree with you.

[@MrsRobinson398]

Same

[@Aristaifly]

Yes, he started right with asking if a caller didn't like the attitude towards the debt but then moved to the caller needs to accommodate her. What about her to accommodate the caller as well? You see our future together but perhaps I come with the baggage that looks scary, here is my plan...

[@CM-cy3qo]

Completely agree

[@simoneXox]

As a woman, i also agree

[@Alessandra-ec2hr]

It sounds like he does not want to marry her but hasn’t realized it for himself yet.

[@MirrorsforEyes]

He doesn't sound very excited about the idea of marrying her. I don't blame him about the debt concerns, but the just doesn't sound interested in taking the relationship past what they got.

[@khalilwilson2586]

Would you be excited to marry someone who has 150k debt, not eager about paying it off, and you’d be expected to help that person if yall got married ? On top of that, if you get divorced you won’t be able to recoup any of that money.

[@Dansyoung]

And why would a man be excited about marriage? Seriously, what does a man get in marriage that he doesn’t have while dating?

[@cc3822]

It's funny that he just found out about the crazy amount of debt, and John put him on the spot by asking why he loves her. I'm sure he is trying to justify why he loves it after the lie/crazy amount of debt. If she loves him, she would put in more effort to get rid of the debt, which should be her responsible. John's advice is reckless, and Will damaged a family if he gets married. Stupid.

[@MikeyPaper]

If a man had that much debt, he would be disqualified from the dating pool, if a woman has it, its forgiven and pitied. Notice the double standard?

[@sharondoan1447]

Yes, that is a deal breaker. No marriage until she is debt free. Don’t marry anyone who cannot manage money or anyone who cannot commit to her own choices.

[@neoalley]

Dr. John literally said the opposite. Either work on it together or walk away. If there is a "no marriage until debt free" then walk away because their is a chip on his shoulder, he thinks he's better than her, and marriage is not forcing her to solve her problems on her own.

[@hayley179g]

Your attitude isn't wrong, he maybe shouldn't marry her, it wouldn't be good for them. But saying that not having a trust fund for medical school is "not being able to manage money" or that dropping out means a lack of commitment, that's the ignorant part.

[@Ruthie_867]

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[@GeorgiaHaven]

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[@joannamelika]

Hello , I am very interested. As you know, there are tons of investments out there and without solid knowledge, I can't decide what is best. Can you explain further how you invest and earn?

[@WalsonKatherine]

Same, I operate a wide- range of Investments with help from My Financial Adviser. My advice is to get a professional who will help you, plan and enhance your management skills. For the record, working with Andrew Louis Stella, has been an amazing experience.

[@Haliyaiowa]

I'm favoured, $90K every week! I can now give back to the locals in my community and also support God's work and the church. God bless America,, all thanks to Ms Louis Stella 😊🎉

[@ocarsTony]

Hello how do you make such monthly?? I'm a born Christian and sometimes I feel so down 🤦‍♀️of myself because of low finance but I still believe in God

[@megc5350]

My husband is a chemical engineer his student loans were 35k. We just started to hammer them down to get them off our plate. We paid highest interest / biggest dollar combo first then changed how the monthly payments are distributed to the remaining loans… get a handle on them soon than later

[@Chet_24]

You mean he did

[@RG-hf4et]

$35k in loans is nothing compared to $156k. Your husband is a chemical engineer & he will always have a healthy income & someone with his experience will always be in demand. This gal blindly went way over her head & it doesn't sound like she makes a ton of money either. These are 2 different situations.

[@JP-uy9kq]

These 2 situations aren't even close. SMH

[@megc5350]

@@Chet_24 no we are paying them off . I work full time and as a married couple we make all our decisions together .

[@sheiladiaz2359]

@@megc5350but your husband has his degree she has $150,000 in debt and no degree which shows that she doesn’t follow through and he has every right to be concerned. It sounds to me like you and your husband did teamwork together and had a plan.

[@letsdothis9728]

Don't do it bro. It's not your problem. Have her show you she can get rid of it before you marry. DONT DO IT!!

[@midnightblue117]

I’m a woman and I AGREE with you!

[@RG-hf4et]

​@@midnightblue117Another woman here. Don't marry her!!

[@georgehilas8454]

It is nuts that they give teenagers the ability to rack up a mortgage worth of loans when their brain isn't developed enough to understand the impact it will have on their financial stability long-term.

[@angelicaangel2624]

Great point!

[@Bloquita5]

“Mostly just the financial stuff” is not just the financial stuff. It’s going to dominate the entire relationship until it’s addressed in an intentional way by her.

[@santafilipina9020]

He and his girlfriend have different approaches to doing life. I say put the breaks on talks about marriage. My goodness, he couldn't even articulate why he wanted to marry her.

[@stevezelaznik5872]

I know a couple that lived together for years and never got married. The man was deeply in debt and the woman made good money. She was happy to pay the lion’s share of the mortgage but didn’t want debt collectors garnishing her wages. He totally understood. If the person deeply in debt does not understand their partner’s perspective, the partner should walk away

[@4legs4paws55]

He doesn’t sound at least but excited about his partner - he is not ready to marry her

[@joetheboy04]

Would you be excited at inheriting 150k debt by marrying a man with a bachelor degree?

[@cur244]

He knows there's a ton of risk taking on that debt.

[@RG-hf4et]

​@@joetheboy04Nobody would be excited to marry anyone who has that much debt unless they are some kind of surgeon & will be able to pay it back. Doesn't matter - male or female.

[@katiejon17]

It doesn’t sound like she’s someone to be excited about. Marrying someone shouldn’t feel like a loss.

[@ashleyricks3380]

It's difficult to express feelings when put on the spot, especially if you aren't a super expressive person in general. I'd give him some grace here. 😂

[@reneehouser2925]

Their relationship is doomed at this point. He isn't ready and she's totally irresponsible, unable to finish what she started- they both probably just assume their inheritance will cover their "forever" loans 😂

[@alexa_4292]

She didn’t finish her masters, she still has a bachelors

[@reneehouser2925]

@@alexa_4292 like the confused boyfriend said- she needs to take some classes in FINANCE.... Either way, she didn't FINISH what SHE STARTED- there's always more to the story. How TF is she gonna pay that off with a Bachelor's? 😆🤣😂🤦 Typical... she's not. She expects someone else to HELP HER! And she will QUIT other things in life when she loses interest or the challenges of adulting overwhelm her. This will become a PATTERN of behavior, a habitual choice. She made her bed, she needs to be responsible 100% for the quality of sheets that she has chosen-

[@hdon8190]

When he asked him why HE wants to marry her, him pausing and taking his time on how he wanted to answer, spoke volumes. When you are deeply in love with someone, you will answer immediately. They will have issues down the road regarding finances if they don't nip this in the bud and stick to a tight budget until its paid off

[@nikkizetlian4421]

You marry someone because you love this person, not because you have fun together.

[@Trolly.Troll.]

What do you love about the person.

[@zacnbend]

Gave him the ultimate simp advice. If you go tell her that she will walk all over you for the next 20 years till she divorces you

[@rebeccaabel4589]

He does not really want to marry her

[@PureJoySkinCareWaxStudio]

Do ya blame him? I would marry a dude like this.

[@consumerdebtchitchat]

Exactly. The call is more of an affirmation to NOT marry her - LOL.

[@neisci]

I would say it's not the debt, it's the behavior towards the debt. Some people understand the weight of it, work towards paying it off, and never take any more debt. Others just see as a walk in the park, nothing to worry about as if the debt will evaporate on its own while accruing more debt. Needless to say, stay away from them.

[@consumerdebtchitchat]

That first sentence!!!

[@MikeyPaper]

Mental gymnastics 😂. Sorry to break it to you, but it ACTUALLY IS the debt. $150k in student loans is NO JOKE!!

[@neisci]

@@MikeyPaper Of course it's no joke, that's why you work and pay it off🙄. WORK. It's it as if people no longer know that word

[@katiejon17]

1) so she is NOT a doctor. She dropped out before finishing her master’s degree, and to be a doctor you need a masters plus a PhD. 2) you live together and she hid her student loan debt until recently. Is she a liar? Not sure. But she is absolutely deceitful. 3) she isn’t such a “hard worker” nor is she “motivated”... she quit school after accruing $150k in debt, and before graduating. **I’m saying as a SAHM and wife - she isn’t equally yoked with this caller in character. Walk away. She has a whole lot of maturing to do before even talking about becoming a wife and mother. It’s her debt, she doesn’t want to deal with it, she’ll marry this caller and make it his problem... and then divorce. I’d be very careful.

[@PureJoySkinCareWaxStudio]

💯

[@terriesmith2616]

Bingo 🎯🎯💯💯

[@penelope5500]

Yes, her accrural & attitude about all of that debt (& not even making a plan to deal w/ it) speaks to a fundamental difference in values & lifestyle choices. I felt like the Dr. was just sort of glossing over that. If I were this guy I would want to see that she is at least addressing & doing something tangible about her problem before I jumped in & married her.

[@jessicabender1301]

Katie: wrong. I have a doctorate wo a masters. That is flat wrong

[@atk_1]

Not sure how she is a “doctor” without even having a masters. NOPE.

[@nathangill8404]

What's the plan for this debt honey? "No plan". Ok bye. That conversation needs to happen.

[@katherinecolson2350]

Absolutely agree 💯

[@David-wo9un]

What’s the hurry to get married and take on her debt?😊

[@BREEZYM6015]

What's the hurry to get married? 😂

[@ST-rj8iu]

because he thinks it will "save" him. I am so confused why so many think marriage somehow changes your life. Especially marrying someone that is lower socioeconomic status, etc.

[@cliveford5596]

Almost certain this ends in divorce…

[@daleweiss9507]

Once the debt is paid off.😉

[@alberttang6955]

​@@daleweiss9507 Pretty sweet deal.

[@Dansyoung]

The best way to prevent divorce is to avoid marriage.

[@Gentilejedi]

When the bills come in the front door, love goes out the back window.

[@hayley179g]

Aaaalll the way out into the ocean, where there are plenty of fish

[@kissengerc9468]

I hope he is not going to help her pay for her student loan. Those guys will never learn 😢

[@brewsandbass5572]

Big mistake. He's going to marry that 156k.

[@KristaldeauCityLights]

Willing to bet she wants to be a stay at home mom, and he'll be expected to pay off the debt.

[@jtixtlan]

I recently worked with a team of 8 people between 28-34 years old. Six of them had college debt between $40,000 to $100,000 and had dropped out around 1/2 to 3/4 through. So, they are burdened with this debt and have NO degree on their resume! People! Don’t do half a degree in random order. At least plan out the courses as an associate degree program so if you quit, you have something completed to put on your resume. Same debt, same investment of time and effort, but you have an associate degree on your resume instead of “some college.”

[@bethl]

Good advice. And doing it at a community college is even smarter!

[@Ufoupmyass]

he didnt say he LOVED her .... WHICH IS THE ONLY REASON TO MARRY

[@ineedhoez]

Not true. Love doesn't pay the the bills.

[@fromheaventoearth5779]

Yup. Marrying for l"ove" is why so many get divorced. ​@@ineedhoez

[@beataimiolek4856]

Love does not guarantee a good marriage. Mutual respect and compatibility- having these 2 give more chances for a successful marriage than love. Especially that we choose who we want to love. And there's so many ppl choosing wrong person to love again and again and getting hurt as many times.

[@ineedhoez]

@beataimiolek4856 hell yeah!!! I have loved quite a few people that would have made horrific life partners!!! Love is a fantasy. Shared values, mutual respect, and a willingness to find mutually beneficial solutions builds healthy marriages.

[@fromheaventoearth5779]

@@ineedhoez Ya. Much more to it than just love.

[@Gabexyz3]

SHe dOeS LiVe bEyOnD her mEaNs. Bro you know what he meant.

[@katiejon17]

But do you grasp what he meant?

[@Hunter2847]

I don’t know what he meant, tell me what he meant

[@stevezelaznik5872]

What Dr D meant was that she doesn’t have to live a flashy lifestyle to be living beyond her means. He was implying (and I agree) that the failed masters degree was another form of consumption for her.

[@marcenelj]

It all depends on how she feels about this debt. If this debt doesn't bother her and has an i-dont-care attitude about it.. Run brother

[@u.2b215]

I'm sorry but what lousy advice. Telling him to tell her he's a nerd, that he loves her more than life itself and that the debt makes him unable to breathe. John might be talking about himself and his own wife but that doesn't apply to everybody else. Taking John's advice could lead her to completely disregard her responsibility and even think that she carries little blame.

[@hammypie]

Agree.

[@Goddess.Cash7]

I didn’t think that it was bad advice. Debt will affect their lifestyle as a married couple like having kids and the schools they’d go to and extra curricular activities that are available to them. No one wants to be married and miserable because of a past mistake. I think that being encouraging and loving is a good idea. If her love language is words of affirmation he was on point. He basically said plan a way out with her don’t do it for her. It’s a relationship not a dictatorship. Plus the way they go into the marriage is going to set the expectation of how it will continue.

[@katiejon17]

I have rarely ever seen John give rational, sound advice. But he sure threw out insults to “Texas men”.

[@khalilwilson2586]

He would’ve never given this advice to a woman. He would’ve asked her if she could’ve trusted him and that it’s a big responsibility she would be taking on.

[@lorirogers9304]

I don’t like John’s fuzzy wuzzy ideals about life. He isn’t aware of hard life really can be.

[@user-vw6fu3yd4e]

This woman will RUIN this man.

[@debbielockhart7762]

True!

[@evanl889]

I honestly think John’s advice would be different if it was the female caller calling on her boyfriend. I hate to say that but it’s been a trend in his videos. He he talks down to the guy and coddles the girl.

[@benjaminfairchild411]

Noticed this a lot. Very frustrating to see

[@imveryhungry112]

She doesnt seem to want to discuss the debt or finances. Thats a huge part of being married. I wonder if she isnt as committed as he thinks she is?

[@debbielockhart7762]

She wants a white knight to come along and pay it. And this caller is likely going to. I think he should dump her ass.

[@RG-hf4et]

She's committed but doesn't want to discuss finances. She's probably making the minimum payments, hoping they get married, and he will help pay the student debt. She's being quiet about it for a reason.

[@imveryhungry112]

@@RG-hf4et Makes sense. Its just something isn't quite right because if you think about it finances are a really very major part of a marriage because it determines many things such as where you can afford to live, if you can afford to get a house or not etc.

[@ayyyejesterdazed]

There’s nothing wrong with longer engagements. Be engaged for 2-4 years and see what happens within that time.

[@jessicabender1301]

This man is wise to challenge this. Her debt becomes his if he's married to her. Does she have a plan? Does she show that he follows it? Why the heck do you drop out?

[@evaswritingvault3066]

There's about to be a lot of single millennials and Gen Z if student debt is a deal breaker 🤷🏽‍♀️. Literally everyone I know has student loans.

[@darex0827]

It's not so much that they have debt, its what they think about said debt. If they are putting everything they possibly can towards the debt and working 80 hours a week, I could live with the level of debt since it won't be around long. If they aren't treating it like the disaster it is, different story. Mindset is everything.

[@Evil-Rod-Farva]

It’s $156K. That’s quintuple the average.

[@AnthonySopran0]

It's okay for the women just not the men

[@Gabster1990]

I wouldn't say it's a deal breaker if they are working towards paying it off.

[@joanlovelace7338]

​@AnthonySopran0 ⁉️what⁉️ Dr John said he did the same ,,,,it's not a male/female thing.. You a woman hater ⁉️

[@mcclaryo148]

It sounds like this guys has a plan for his life. The best advice I got was to pick a spouse not for where you are now, but where you plan to be as you get older. If you have to put on kid gloves to talk to your future spouse, it may not be a good fit as life gets harder as you age. Kids, job loss, pandemics, and death. You need to be able to be direct and to the point at times. If she is not appreciative of the advice you give her now, there is no magic switch when you get married. If you are better and smarter than her when it comes to money, and she doesn’t want to take your advice…run.

[@ineedhoez]

It's not about putting on kid gloves. It's about knowing how to communicate properly. Most people do not know how to get their message through, So this is good advice.

[@mcclaryo148]

@@ineedhoez based on the conversation I heard, it doesn’t sound like he has an issue communicating the issue. It sounds like Dr John is given advice on how to communicate in a way to prevent her from shutting down during the conversation. To do this Dr John is saying to take it away from her and put the burden on himself. I completely understand how this can keep the line of communication open during the conversation, but for people with a plan for their lives, this can be exhausting. Sometimes you just need to say, you caused an issue and how do we fix it. That communication is clear and kind and something you both can take action on.

[@beataimiolek4856]

If I was in this situation, I'd not expect my boyfriend to marry me and be somehow responsible for my debt. The truth is, I don't imagine myself saying "yes" before I sorted out the troubles I've put myself into. If she walked out on him because he'd want to wait with marriage until she cleans up her mess, I'd say she was not the one. And on that note, my advice to the caller would be: support her, help her plan how to pay off her debt and watch her progress. Her being able to follow the plan and get things better is a proof that she's capable of making wise financial choices in marriage.

[@Aleeleebug]

I didnt get the sense that this man loves his girlfriend more than life itself, but John keeps putting those words in his mouth. Dont know why.

[@InvestgoldUK]

playing up to the ladies in the audience, my guess. Poor guy, he needed a wise man to say no.

[@terriesmith2616]

John always does that. He's a major simp and simp is gonna simp.

[@bethl]

@@terriesmith2616then why are you listening to him?

[@brandonmwilson1907]

When I met my wife, she had recently graduated her residency with $170k in debt. We dated for 18 months before I proposed, and we married debt free because she’s so amazing and sacrificed so deeply.

[@lauriep6831]

Being a doctor with debt is way different from a lot of other professions.

[@LaverneGrant-ff8ub]

Is John out of his mind? Her debt takes away from their quality of life. He is going to be the one carrying the load. Since she gave up on her 150,000 career goal, who is to say she won’t give up on marriage when it gets so hard. Also, if she decides she actually does not want to work or want to pay to pursue another educational goal, she may decide not to listen to his input. He best get a prenup saying if they divorce he is not responsible for repayment of the loan, get it notarized and check the laws of his state to see if an attorney has to review it. So much happens in life and we do not know the other person. He sounds like a decent guy and sad to say they end up marrying someone who will not treat them well. Run dude before it is too late. All the worry he has is an indication of danger. Better listen to it and not brush it off with the feel good psychoanalysis crap John is giving. I am a female and I say again Run dude run.

[@ineedhoez]

All john told him to do was talk to her. The man can't decide to move forward or exit the relationship until he understands what this woman's plan is for her debt. Clearly, the debt is not a deal breaker cause he would have expressed his concerns about debt during the first date. Stop discarding people. Have the difficult conversation.

[@cedricbethea]

​@@ineedhoezyou sound like the naive guy who is surprised when your spouse says she wants a separation, you're clueless 😂

[@ineedhoez]

150k and didn't finish it? Yikes. This is such good advice. I would need to see her plan and her executing it. I totally understand Why people are screaming run?But I think what this call illuminates Is how important it is to learn to have difficult conversations in our relationships. John provided excellent advice on how to approach difficult subjects. 1. Create a shared vision for the future. By doing this, you're letting the person know that you are not abandoning them but you're trying to solve the problem so that you can be together. 2. By focusing on dreaming about what the future could look like, You are Illuminating the picture for your lives. This Creates optimism an excitement for the future. 3. By being vulnerable you articulate why The issue is a problem for you. You talk about your fears and your needs. You create a space where each person can see the other person. You can see your partner and see that the problem is outside of your partner. Unfortunately, the problem may be your partner and your fundamental incompatibility. You can't explore this unless you sit down and have the difficult conversation.

[@izzywox8246]

I appreciate the way you broke this down

[@ineedhoez]

@izzywox8246 I try! We live in such a fear-based society where we are all terrified of being hurt. So we just keep ourselves bottled up and disconnected. Is such a scarcity mindset. The amount of people. Who are scared about losing money, If a marriage fails vs m the benefit that you get of having a wonderful family and creating all of these life experiences is just sad. Money is ruining people's lives.

[@RG-hf4et]

​@@ineedhoezPoor judgemental is ruining people's lives!!

[@Msthanomjit]

I am sorry but this is not for me. How do I know that he/she will change her way and wouldn’t drown me too? I just can’t.

[@ineedhoez]

You sit down and have the conversation.

[@cajbaf]

​@@ineedhoez I think you should marry her and take on her debts. Have all the conversation you want while swirling down the drain from her stupid decisions. I would in no way marry this person before she paid off HER debt

[@katiejon17]

John is the one overcomplicating this. This caller is talking about a GIRLFRIEND. Not a wife. This many issues and concerns before marriage? Walk away.

[@ineedhoez]

That's what's wrong with the world right now. We discard people and treat them as they are disposable. All John is telling him to do is have the appropriate conversation. He's teaching him how to communicate properly. He's teaching him very valuable skills that are going to lead to a successful relationship. The gentleman may still end the relationship because she is unwilling to do the work that's required to clear the debt. But he will have learned how to be an excellent communicator and it will serve him well in his next relationship.

[@Dansyoung]

@@ineedhoezOr the problem is people take on debts and don’t pay them off. It is not your responsibility to pay for someone else’s poor choices. You will get burned.

[@ariannagalluzzo]

@@ineedhoez Respectfully, this chick played herself by withholding information and racking up debt to the tune of six-figures without a degree. Her track record sucks and she's a young person with a world of problems. What is there to communicate, really? One thing that I learned in the dating world is that if you see red flags in a person there are plenty of other people out there that are, at the very least, less problematic. If this guy was my brother I would tell him to cut his losses and start hanging out with winners.

[@racheltarentino3314]

​@@ineedhoezthank you😮 someone with sense

[@ineedhoez]

@ariannagalluzzo You don't know any of that. From what was stated in this call, It doesn't seem like they had a conversation about it during the dating process. He also didn't express anything that would indicate that she expected him to pay for it. You are doing a whole lot of projecting. Once again, all John is telling this man to do is to sit down and have a conversation. That's it. They are going to sit down and have an open, honest, and vulnerable conversation. After that, he'll be able to assess whether or not she's the type of person that he is going to want to build a life with. Until then, you are just making a big ass assumption about how she got there, her attitude towards her motivation to fix it, etc. Money is not a problem in relationships. Your values surrounding money are the issue. You need to talk to each other to explore this information. The goal in a relationship should always be to seek to understand the other person's perspective. Your values may still be misaligned, but at least you can make a decision based on factual and accurate information. Stop letting fear make your decisions in life. You can get used and abandoned by somebody who doesn't have any debt. Use your words.

[@nancypicchi9224]

This guy needs to bow out. He’s more concerned about his LOSS. Wake up! You will regret taking this on.

[@aladdout9454]

You have two options: 1) Run and don't waste her time and yours. She has a lot to figure out along with her finances. Don't look back. 2) Give her sort of an ultimatum/maybe even guidance? she has to take care of her debt by working her ass off starting with getting better job/jobs. You may date her and see how things are after a few years. This would be hard.

[@InvestgoldUK]

To put this in perspective, I met someone, we had children together. Years later, when we split up she expected me to pay half her student debt. I meanwhile scrapped through my education without accruing debt. Told her to get lost and fortunately this was one battle on which the state agreed with me - I live in Denmark, but good god no way should you take on someone elses debt. You have different values already and it won't get better. Another woman with the right values will come along, she already expects you to pay it off one way or another.

[@HighwayLand]

Knowing that this is slightly different, I married my woman just seven months ago, She was 60k in the red and I was $86K in the green, I had zero hesitation on paying off her debt, and we've been good from there on. In a couple more months we are taking a vacation to new york city. If you absolutely love her then don't let anything get in between you.

[@Drayonis]

She decides she wants a divorce next year ( you're going to be suicidal).

[@kitchensink7345]

Why not make her be accountable for her debt, now she will expect and know you’ll pay off any debt she accumulates. Loving someone is holding them accountable

[@Gotoworkkk]

That’s a BIG roll of the dice.

[@LaverneGrant-ff8ub]

@@kitchensink7345 he needs a prenup saying if they divorce, she is responsible for her student loan debt.

[@katiejon17]

But this many concerns and issues with just a girlfriend is crazy. On top of that, they have been living together... and he said his girlfriend has only just recently told him her debt, and she was not happy about discussing it. So she’s deceitful. This is a relationship where you walk away.

[@millyday]

Sounds like an old one! Can we have call ins of "where are they now?"??? Would be awesome to hear how advice went that was taken and not taken!

[@B___3]

Yesss!!

[@MrRaErickson]

DONT DO IT

[@caligirllala1267]

Never once has he said “I love her”. Unmmmm that’s very concerning…..😢

[@sidni.d5989]

The first thing she said about her is that she's selfless....not that he loves her...yikes to both of them! They definitely shouldn't get married.

[@ineedhoez]

I caught that too!!!! he loves her because she doesn't have any boundaries and she is a dormat. Tell me you are a narcissist without telling me you're a narcissist.

[@katmac5045]

On the one hand you are the perfect partner to sort out the debt On the other hand you would be in a situation you never wanted to be in and tried hard not to get into yourself And here you are getting yourself into it

[@rootedhabits]

He doesn’t want to move forward with her and be responsible for her debt. He wants to see active progression on this from her.

[@westbccoast]

Don’t walk, RUN. Absolutely do not marry anyone with debt. Let them clear up that debt and they will if they serious about marrying you. Never marry someone who dismisses and won’t talk about debt and you not on the same page financially. Please don’t do it

[@sherizelchicago]

You don’t have to be debt free to be married. You do have to be able to pay that debt and have a plan to pay it off.

[@westbccoast]

@@sherizelchicago As long as by you, you mean the person with the debt. No one and I mean no one should pay off someone else's debt. No way would I marry someone with significant debt, 150K is insane. Getting married or tricking someone into marriage without disclosing the debt is next level marriage fraud at all levels and shows you exactly the character of the person (male or female). It's unconscionable to deceive someone or expect someone to pay off your debt. A hard pass for me, lots of fish in the ocean with no debt. Make sure you also understand each others debt before committing to anything serious and making sure you both align with financial goals before getting married. A lot of people including myself never ask/asked that question but should. Clean up your debt before getting married or marrying someone, it's really that straight forward.

[@v.anessa1451]

when John asked him why he wanted to marry her, i kept waiting for him to say bc he loved her and he knew she was the one or something like that but he never did 🥴 his answer was basically that she checked off all the right boxes. very in-line w his first move upon hearing of her debt being to pull up spread sheets. ik this is j speculation from me, but perhaps the caller is emotionally constipated. this relationship needa to be put on pause, not even bc of her debt but bc he might need to take a step back and figure out if its actually what he wants. bc stepping up to help her chip away at a 6 figure debt is a HUGE decision. and once they have children, itll be even more costs

[@WesternGirlEasternEyes]

It would be for me. They will struggle the rest of their lives grinding to pay this off. This will be a huge stresser down the road and will end up bringing resentment. They will be house bound. Work to live, don't live to work.

[@FreeSpirit47]

A person being so deep in debt even from walking away without a degree, is more common than some people realize. My friend worked so hard to get her Masters Degree without student loan debt. She met a really great guy. They dated for a year. They married. The whole time they didn't discuss finances or debt or any of those hard subjects. As it turned out, HE was $180K in debt. She found out about this 6 months after they married. Sure, he had his degree, had scored a great career. It's the hiding of debt from her that she was angry about..

[@RG-hf4et]

She should be angry.

[@FreeSpirit47]

@@RG-hf4et That's what I thought, also. I worked very hard to become debt free over a decade ago. I'm single, I don't date at all. If I were to date someone & it turned serious, I would for sure have him disclose to me any debt that he has before proceeding any further.

[@Grace-rx7cv]

Do people not listen? She has a degree. Just not her masters degree.

[@Diashi1267]

This is a big problem for modern relationships

[@elizabethg7806]

I think your advice was perfect, Dr. Delony, in opposition to what most of the commenters are saying. So many visceral reactions, assumptions, "what ifs" and "RUNs!" without taking into consideration the many sides and yes, difficulties, of a loving relationship. No compromises and communication for them! Good luck, RUNNERS!

[@izzywox8246]

🎯

[@sallythibodeaux7992]

He never said He loved her until he was told to say he loves her. I don’t think he’s ready for that step.

[@RShaun]

Run. And figure out what you want other than to not be alone.

[@consumerdebtchitchat]

If getting US out of debt requires that I work even more than I already do (50 hrs a week) - Then NO. I can't be with them. This is because at MY age (57) and medical conditions, I am already physicallly taxed out with knee arthritis. A younger person MIGHT be able and more willing to work those extra hours to pay off her debt. And like people have pointed out below, she'll want the whole castle and expect HIM to fork over the 3 jobs to keep her in a lap of luxury. There are less financially complicated women to marry who can achieve goals.

[@ineedhoez]

Agreed. this is definitely a young people's conversation. I'm 40 and i'm not dating someone who hasn't met the appropriate developmental milestones for my age.

[@raem7287]

Yes a 6 figure debt is scary but it's not impossible to tackle...but if she's not trying to pay it off as fast as possible like working 2 jobs, 60+ hours a week then you should run. Plus if you're having trouble stating why you want to marry them then you should also run. It should be easy to list many reasons why you want to marry your potential/future spouse.

[@khalilwilson2586]

Marry her with a prenup in place that for every dollar you help pay off while married if she divorces you then you’re owed that money back. If that can’t be done then find someone else

[@stevezelaznik5872]

That’s a recipe for a spouse to abandon the relationship but stay married on paper. It seems like a safer option is to remain unmarried but help her with payments. If she walks away in a year he’ll have lost a year’s worth of payments which is way less than the $78,000 he’d otherwise owe

[@khalilwilson2586]

@@stevezelaznik5872 helping her make payments and they’re not married is an even worse idea. Help her make payments for 18 months and then she finds someone else then what? You still lost the money you helped her with. Doesn’t matter if it was 78k or 20k. That’s still money you lost

[@cajbaf]

I don't like either of these ideas. I 100% am not paying on something they did to accumulate that insane debt.

[@khalilwilson2586]

@@stevezelaznik5872 helping her with payments and not being married is just as stupid as marrying her and accepting her debt fully as your own. It’ll all be wasted money if there’s nothing set in stone for reimbursement

[@khalilwilson2586]

@@cajbaf could always just leave her but if she’s a good woman outside of the debt then I think you should try to make it work with something set in place that you won’t be take advantage of.

[@JoshuaTrinityWolf-dc4up]

LOOK, I've been happily married for 43 years so I wouldn't be worried about the debt. Honestly, my wife I call molly Micmess and she has soft teeth that get cavities easily. I have 3 brain cuncussions and a neurological disorder that is serious from childhood injury. BUT,.....I would dump someone that is a manipulative liar right from the start and doesn't disclose the debt. LASTLY,....don't marry people to rescue people I tried that over the years and it fails 100 % of the time !!!

[@bcent5758]

Why is college not subsidised by the government like in the rest of the world. Every country needs doctors, it doesn’t make sense.

[@kitchensink7345]

She needs to pay off before they get married,

[@donnaallgaier-lamberti3933]

I would not want to marry a many in this much debt. My fiance' told me he was in about $16,000 debt in the mid-80s' and told him I would not marry him while in debt because I simply do not believe in living in debt. He was racking up debts on several credit cards, living beyond his means and not paying attention to how he was living or how much debt he was racking up. We made a a plan for him to get those debts paid off before we married and he did it. We made a new budget together and both agreed to live within that budget - and he did it. I took this as a sign that he was willing to do what was necessary. We did get married after about 2 years in a very simple ceremony at the Justice of the Peace, and had a simple homemade reception afterwards, no honeymoon, no diamond because we did not have the cash up front. We are every bit as married and rebuilding our future together.

[@Alexander44665]

"You are trying to solve a shamful problem with a spreadsheet and that is not the way to a woman's heart." Translation: Don't confront reality. Never ask her any difficult questions. Never say anything that would make her uncomfortable. Allow her to continue to live in fantasy land. Be the quiet clean up crew behind the scenes.

[@KathleenMcNe]

The only way to confront and solve this financial problem is to generate a spreadsheet and a plan (with follow-through) to pay off the debt. Feelings have no place in this.

[@Alexander44665]

@@KathleenMcNe Amen!

[@Alexander44665]

As far as Dr. John saying that if a guy telks a woman she needs to do x to be worthy of getting married-that's not going to work-he's wrong! Women do that to us all the time. We men have the same right.

[@Ja50nkAt]

Is the kitty really that good buddy? There are other women that won't put you 150k in debt when you marry them.

[@famj4860]

Nooooo! Don't get married. I'm a woman and I'd be so embarrassed to burden another person with my debt because I live below my means. Don't get married if she's in so much debt. It will cause stress in your marriage. You might end up divorcing because of it. Don't do it.

[@Bike4Life231]

She realized after the fact that she took on too much debt? Run far far away, buddy. If the person doesn't plan and isn't realistic about that kind of debt, that's a no in my book. If you're having to worry and overthink it, and can't give a good reason why he wants to marry her. Nope, nope, nope.

[@betitos11]

This dude will never combine finances or help her pay that debt 🤣🤣💀

[@clericstorm2009]

Depends. If the person can evidence they have been and will be paying off that debt then not a dealbreaker. If they aren't addressing it or are accumulating more, the yes.

[@l3hxy]

If the question is.. does this woman make me happier in life than $150,000 in debt would make me sad.. you either haven't found love, or you have some priorities to work through in yourself

[@debbielockhart7762]

He's just so hapoy he's "getting some" that he's willing to throw his life down the tubes. Holy crap!