Is $150K in Debt a Relationship Deal Breaker?

[@juicysmith38235]

I walked away from a 6 yr relationship bc my boyfriend wasn't transparent about his student loans. I finally got him to confess the total, $140k. He had no job 2 yrs out of school & his parents were paying the bills. I worked all through college & only went to school when I could pay cash. It took me 7 yrs to finish however I'm debt free. His parents made remarks the entire time that "no one can pay cash or be debt free." Well when I finally finished and told them I'm debt free the were so angry & even more upset when I broke up with their man child for being taught their same philosophy of life...

[@lisad56]

I paid cash for my undergraduate degree. I used all of my savings and I worked full time as a single mother. It can be done. Live very frugal and save every penny. I’m shocked when I hear people owing six figures in student loans when they don’t even go to medical school. 😱 I also went to a state university because it was cheaper than a private known school.

[@1lespaulfreak]

👏👏👏👏

[@juicysmith38235]

​@@lisad56 you are a very strong woman, congratulations 🎉🙌 Yes 6 figures in debt always blew my mind! My ex went for a BS in Psychology & couldn't find a job after 🤭😔 I heard 8 yrs after our relationship ended that he still lives with his mom & only held a minimum wage job for a few months ...

[@dianebrooks1859]

Also came out of college debt free. Best decision of my life

[@louiseerbslisbjerg7854]

​@@lisad56she went to medical school; She was doing a masters in medicine.

[@cyoohoos]

If “why do you want to get married” is a hard question…..don’t get married

[@catalinab7626]

For real!!!!! I was hoping he would say, "because I'm in love with her". None of that.....

[@JonathanLGN]

Well, he did say that later on. I myself struggled to sometimes answer basic questions, or put my feelings into words. He is also speaking on talk. I’m sure there is a level of nervousness. You should be so judgmental.

[@clean280]

no, that's just a tricky question

[@rhondar828]

Was surprised John didn't call him on that

[@mikethemechanic7395]

Met my wife at 23 with 10k in debt and bad credit. She told me I had to pay off my loans and fix my credit before we purchase a house. Then we can get married. Spent 5 years working 6 days a week and side jobs. Glad I listened to my wife. Don’t get married till you pay all of your loans off. No kids either…

[@lynnmoz0616]

Perfect.

[@lynnmoz0616]

My ex & I had way different salaries. Me making way more. I paid off all his credit cards several times. He managed to bankrupt us. The beginning of the end. I thought he was a great guy in the beginning, too. Postscript: we had a daughter together. He owes me $7000 in child support which I'll never see He paid $0 towards her college degree. Never even bought her a text book. My parents & I got her through all 4 years with zero loans. Obviously, we're divorced. He lives in a duplex owned by his sisters husband & they now support him. I made it way too easy for him. But, in the past. And now I'm free to do whatever I want with little fear about $$$. I think your GF & her parents need to figure out what's next. My opinion, not your problem unless you get married.

[@kungfujoe2136]

yeah but a woman get get away with it because ...simps

[@dmoneydance]

💯% Heavy on the NO KIDs part!!

[@noelleirina5628]

if it took you 5 years to pay off 10k, when is she supposed to pay of 150k???? in 75 years??

[@debbielockhart7762]

I'm a woman with a very logical mind. I'm always the financial person in my relationships. I would run a mile from that person with $156k debt that dropped out with no plan. He'll end up paying this.

[@makaroner1174]

"I'm a woman with a logical mind" is like the grown up version of a pick me schoolgirls "I'm not like other girls!" Sorry but statements like piss me of so much. Such a nonsensical patriarchal-ass-licking thing to say. It's saying all other women aren't logical and further reinforcing the already idiotic male view of women being "emotional" just because they have emotional intelligence.

[@cowgirlcandice833]

100% this and I am a woman too

[@Tinycadancer]

She didn’t drop out with no plan… The debt is from her bachelors and masters degree which is what she didn’t complete… Why are there so many people in the comments who don’t understand basic things about college? She has to have her bachelors already in order to even apply for any masters program…

[@mynameisnobody3931]

​@@Tinycadancerbecause it doesn't matter.

[@mynameisnobody3931]

​@@Tinycadancerdebt is debt

[@DarylClarke-cq1nl]

If the roles were reversed would any woman Marry or even date a guy with 156K debt and no degree or job to show for it? Why should he have to save her?

[@letsdothis9728]

Preach!! Yes!! Double standard for sure!

[@neisci]

More times than not, regardless of gender, is the behavior towards the debt. If the person is working really working towards paying it off, then sure. Debt shouldn't be a deal breaker.

[@PureJoySkinCareWaxStudio]

NOPE a woman wouldn't. He needs to RUN, RUN NOW.

[@PureJoySkinCareWaxStudio]

Hey, Dr., why use the word NERD as a negative and FREE WHEELING SPIRIT is a positive. 🤷🏻‍♀️. Stop labeling.

[@ineedhoez]

That's fair. But he didn't say that she was a bum. He just said she didn't finish it.

[@ayyyejesterdazed]

There’s nothing wrong with longer engagements. Be engaged for 2-4 years and see what happens within that time.

[@Si-no-si-no-si-no]

I feel for him; it’s obvious he cares about her. He is analytical, so you won’t get profound declarations of love. His reaching out to work this out is how you can tell he cares about her. Asking anyone to take on that much debt it’s a lot to ask from a person.

[@PureJoySkinCareWaxStudio]

💯

[@isaactrujillo76]

Fantastic breakdown, this comment needs to be pinned.

[@winniethepoohandeeyore2]

Absolutely agree.

[@KarimeCastillo-t9g]

As a woman myself I say run. That’s a lot to take on and she has no degree to show for it. If he really loves her and she loves him she’d work to make the debt smaller and if she’s not doing that I say end the relationship. That type of debt will kill the marriage and he’s going to become bitter because more likely than not it’ll become his problem and not hers once they marry.

[@RG-hf4et]

​@@SarahConnor562EXACTLY!!!

[@philwill0123]

​@@SarahConnor562costs went up in last 20-25 years. When I was at university, it was all paid, and I got a maintenance grant per term. Courses were 1.5k-3k per term. Govt took down protections on course costs and removed grants. Suddenly courses were 9k a year, living costs are 10k a year and you are going from couple of grand to 20k without effort

[@philwill0123]

She has a degree. She dropped out of the masters programme.

[@Tinycadancer]

He should marry her because she understands college and the degree process more than you do… You cannot get a masters without first completing your bachelors… Her debt is the bachelors and masters she didn’t complete combined… A bachelors alone at some schools can be hundreds of thousands of dollars on it’s own babe.

[@faithbuenaventura3189]

"Why do you want to marry her?" "Because she's around."

[@DoubleDee382]

Yeah but he kind of talked him into an answer though. “she’s caring, hard-working, kind” “you are talking about HER, why do YOU want to marry her?” “…we have fun” “but you can have fun with ANYONE, so why do YOU want to marry her? At that point I think he pretty much said why. It might not be a good answer, but the host should have just said so at that point rather than beat an “I don’t know” out of him.

[@tristanrodenhauser5267]

@@DoubleDee382girls talk about this quite a bit… that it seems guys marry the girl who is around when they feel ready to get married but it’s not always the girl they had the best relationship with.

[@aladdout9454]

glad he asked kept digging in. A real one would have said "because I love her" or something or "I love being there for her" ... something. He basically said he doesn't really have a choice but be with her.

[@Openingtheshadow]

I hope he sees this.

[@Proud5050man]

Its a hole

[@winniethepoohandeeyore2]

156k in debt.. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, He needs to walk ASAP OR he WILL be in for 1 HELL of a hard time. She IS showing she's NOT financially responsible.

[@JeremyTheEntrepreneur]

At the end of the day he will get her pregnant and than it’s really over. Financially liability of a baby and debt.

[@winniethepoohandeeyore2]

@@JeremyTheEntrepreneur Wouldn't surprise me. He needs to STOP being a SIMP.

[@ChadVanKlompenburg]

From a middle-class standpoint I completely agree I would not marry a woman with that much debt. They didn't ask the question about how much money she makes and how much money he makes... With my income I would never marry someone with 150k debt. John I think sort of incorrectly believes that love can solve it. Not if she makes 60k/year and so does he...

[@melissam7067]

People feel so much pressure to get married. Being single is great too.

[@dynagroove1.020]

For a Man I can say coming home from work and cooking dinner listening to vinyl and not having to listen to a GF complain is Golden.

[@darkhorse9472]

@@dynagroove1.020 Hmmmm....or for a woman, not waiting on a man hand and foot and taking care of the kids.

[@KathleenMcNe]

I am -- and always have been -- blissfully and intentionally single. I'm able to spend my time as I wish. There are no arguments over finances or anything else. I have friends and family -- and my beloved dog -- with whom to socialize. After decades of hard work, living fugally, and making significant sacrifices, I have an eight-figure net worth and am now retired and able to travel for pleasure. Single life is perfect for me.

[@leahartlee29]

It sure is!!

[@dmoneydance]

I want a lover but being single feels so AMAZING!! 🤩

[@DrLove01]

A buddy of mine met and married a lady that had quite a bit of debt. He paid off all of it. Two years later, they were divorced. He thought they were going to be married for life and he wanted to start off on a good foot. After the marriage, he had very little money left, basically his life savings were gone. He was never the same again.

[@TLA123y6f]

That is so sad. It's horrible when someone else puts you in a very bad position. It changes you. I can totally relate.

[@tabby73]

Wow that's a tough life lesson 😢

[@FabriceLabako]

Bro...why would he even pay HER debts? I would NEVER pay somebody else's debt. I would lend it interest free but would give it away.

[@debbielockhart7762]

Foolish of him. This guy should walk.

[@dmoneydance]

Ouch!! 😢

[@lv4366]

He can't say he loves her immediately? Nope.

[@texan903]

Her excessive debt combined with her cavalier attitude about it, what is there to love?

[@jesssc402]

@@texan903but they’re thinking about marriage so he’s supposed to love her, at least have love for her. His answer sounds like he’s marrying to settle, not really because he’s in love..

[@markmessi9020]

​@@jesssc402I understand but to put it into perspective, this is the man's version of "Well, I would love him but he's broke and doesn't have his life together." He's conflicted and HAS to consider his options before he fully 100% says "Ok, let's get married"

[@michaelh2282]

No. It's a sign of maturity. Life isn't a teenage romantic comedy. You need to carefully consider a person's values, their life choices, their work ethic, their sense of responsibility, etc. Obviously, you need to love the person, but that should come AFTER you've vetted the person as someone whom you can build a long term future with, and not before.

[@philwill0123]

​@@michaelh2282this. People jump both feet into bad relations due to a) great sex/ super attractive partner b) fear of being alone C) sunk cost fallacy. D) laziness. Here it sounds like b, c and d.

[@AnaBananaM28]

As a woman I feel like John gives women a lot of passes, TBH if it was the other way around I don’t think he’d be saying the same thing.

[@KathleenMcNe]

I agree with you.

[@MrsRobinson398]

Same

[@Aristaifly]

Yes, he started right with asking if a caller didn't like the attitude towards the debt but then moved to the caller needs to accommodate her. What about her to accommodate the caller as well? You see our future together but perhaps I come with the baggage that looks scary, here is my plan...

[@CM-cy3qo]

Completely agree

[@simoneXox]

As a woman, i also agree

[@zoraster3749]

Simple rule. You don’t marry someone with debt more than their annual income. Is $150k a dealbreaker for marriage? Not if she’s making $150k a year. If she’s making $50k… no marriage until the income goes up or the debt goes down. Just take the emotion out of it and stick to the numbers. Edit: that’s the minimum to even have the more detailed conversation but really the goal is to have zero debt. A dentist making $250k and having $300k in debt is a lot different than someone making $40k a year with $30k in credit card debt.

[@ineedhoez]

A decent general rule but it still mandates a conversation. Find out what they are going to do about it.

[@afriendorfoe]

I like that rule of thumb of not marrying if the debt is more than their income.

[@mylesgray3470]

I agree. First year out of college, your career annual salary should be equal to your debt as a first year worst case scenario. If not, it shows the person is not a good financial planner as this stuff is easy to estimate before starting college.

[@melinated2497]

I agree with this rule of thumb

[@mcannonsr]

She’s going to want to be a stay at home mom, her debt will be an albatross on their necks for the entire marriage. Dr. J needed to challenge him on that. Big student loan obligations zap you of upgrading your car, zap you of financial security, they take the place of annual vacations. He needs to at least be challenged on what he will think if she wants to stop working after 1-2 babies.

[@consumerdebtchitchat]

PREACH!!

[@tabby73]

Solution would be wait with the babies until the debts are cleared.

[@LovesLakes]

If she’s a doctor, like he said, she won’t want to stay at home. She’ll feel the need to work if it’s truly her calling. I’m not sure why she was working on a Master’s instead of practicing Medicine already.

[@mcannonsr]

@@LovesLakes or maybe she dropped out of her masters’ program, like he said.

[@ineedhoez]

@mcannonsr This is true if you are broke... He might have enough money to be able to take care of everything that is needed for their family. Don't let poverty rob you of happiness

[@hdon8190]

When he asked him why HE wants to marry her, him pausing and taking his time on how he wanted to answer, spoke volumes. When you are deeply in love with someone, you will answer immediately. They will have issues down the road regarding finances if they don't nip this in the bud and stick to a tight budget until its paid off

[@lisasmith742]

My thoughts

[@rickcurtis8319]

If you have to ask you already know

[@sophia8405]

Dude , walk away 😢

[@LaverneGrant-ff8ub]

I agree. He better run.

[@letsdothis9728]

No!! Don't walk! RUN!!! 🏃🏼

[@c.edales740]

Just like that. Just walk

[@megc5350]

My husband is a chemical engineer his student loans were 35k. We just started to hammer them down to get them off our plate. We paid highest interest / biggest dollar combo first then changed how the monthly payments are distributed to the remaining loans… get a handle on them soon than later

[@Chet_24]

You mean he did

[@RG-hf4et]

$35k in loans is nothing compared to $156k. Your husband is a chemical engineer & he will always have a healthy income & someone with his experience will always be in demand. This gal blindly went way over her head & it doesn't sound like she makes a ton of money either. These are 2 different situations.

[@JP-uy9kq]

These 2 situations aren't even close. SMH

[@megc5350]

@@Chet_24 no we are paying them off . I work full time and as a married couple we make all our decisions together .

[@sheiladiaz2359]

@@megc5350but your husband has his degree she has $150,000 in debt and no degree which shows that she doesn’t follow through and he has every right to be concerned. It sounds to me like you and your husband did teamwork together and had a plan.

[@stevezelaznik5872]

Marriage should only be on the table after you’ve discussed difficult topics, finance chief among them. If you can’t agree don’t get married, full stop.

[@stevezelaznik5872]

I know a couple that lived together for years and never got married. The man was deeply in debt and the woman made good money. She was happy to pay the lion’s share of the mortgage but didn’t want debt collectors garnishing her wages. He totally understood. If the person deeply in debt does not understand their partner’s perspective, the partner should walk away

[@Alessandra-ec2hr]

It sounds like he does not want to marry her but hasn’t realized it for himself yet.

[@Bloquita5]

“Mostly just the financial stuff” is not just the financial stuff. It’s going to dominate the entire relationship until it’s addressed in an intentional way by her.

[@samyish]

DO NOT MARRY HER STUDENT LOAN!

[@jaelgopilan3279]

Correct, thank you for commenting on that.

[@therhymerr]

150K is generational debt. This man will sacrifice his life to meet her needs and it’s not gonna turn out the way he thinks once she gets mad he won’t buy the latest car, house or purse and Johnny down the street or at work will once the debt is paid off.

[@nikkizetlian4421]

You marry someone because you love this person, not because you have fun together.

[@Trolly.Troll.]

What do you love about the person.

[@4legs4paws55]

He doesn’t sound at least but excited about his partner - he is not ready to marry her

[@joetheboy04]

Would you be excited at inheriting 150k debt by marrying a man with a bachelor degree?

[@cur244]

He knows there's a ton of risk taking on that debt.

[@RG-hf4et]

​@@joetheboy04Nobody would be excited to marry anyone who has that much debt unless they are some kind of surgeon & will be able to pay it back. Doesn't matter - male or female.

[@katiejon17]

It doesn’t sound like she’s someone to be excited about. Marrying someone shouldn’t feel like a loss.

[@ashleyricks3380]

It's difficult to express feelings when put on the spot, especially if you aren't a super expressive person in general. I'd give him some grace here. 😂

[@georgehilas8454]

It is nuts that they give teenagers the ability to rack up a mortgage worth of loans when their brain isn't developed enough to understand the impact it will have on their financial stability long-term.

[@angelicaangel2624]

Great point!

[@IAmTK950]

because the government could care less as long as they get their money back. it’s all apart of their scheme

[@zXBananaGamingXz]

I really hope he doesn't rush into this marriage

[@debbielockhart7762]

He needs to run.

[@inspiteofbecauseof4745]

150,000 and no degree. Uh, no way would I date them. She’s aware and ashamed, but not concerned or ashamed enough to start doing anything about it. Those that “can’t work” while going to school, taking out loans far beyond the cost of tuition and books so they can often party and buy things with that money and later complain about having to pay it back or realize they majored in a degree that doesn’t justify the loan. He should run and find someone that is more on the same page financially as he mentioned they are on the same page about most things, but this is definitely a big topic that matters a lot to him or he wouldn’t have called.

[@MisterNightfish]

Spot on. Being "ashamed" doesn't mean anything if all you do is make some vague noises along the lines of "boohoo, woe is me". The 150k wouldn't be that much of a problem if it had been for a degree and if she was putting it to use. But if it's just random debt that wasn't for anything and that someone else has to pay off, that's an issue. I struggle to see how a decent person could even accept that. If I try to imagine me having this debt, I could not sleep at night if I made my partner pay that for me.

[@kensmith2796]

My sister married a guy who had a bachelors and masters in philosophy. He attempted a PhD but soon washed out. He never worked during all those years and had a lot of student loan debt. He quickly married my sister out of college and never worked a day in his life. My sister had to work and pay back all of his student loans. People that spend a long time in college pursuing liberal arts degrees generally aren't serious about working.

[@leabeauty837]

He’s a man. He definitely doesn’t need to find someone on the same financial page, but he just doesn’t need to get with anyone with more than maybe 20k of debt max

[@Cashhhhew]

Exactly. That amount of debt just for undergrad and partial grad school is crazy. I only had to take out $30k for grad school and it paid off in the end. I cannot fathom $150k for anything less than medical school.

[@alexa_4292]

She has a bachelors degree at least but no masters

[@brandonmwilson1907]

When I met my wife, she had recently graduated her residency with $170k in debt. We dated for 18 months before I proposed, and we married debt free because she’s so amazing and sacrificed so deeply.

[@lauriep6831]

Being a doctor with debt is way different from a lot of other professions.

[@MirrorsforEyes]

He doesn't sound very excited about the idea of marrying her. I don't blame him about the debt concerns, but the just doesn't sound interested in taking the relationship past what they got.

[@khalilwilson2586]

Would you be excited to marry someone who has 150k debt, not eager about paying it off, and you’d be expected to help that person if yall got married ? On top of that, if you get divorced you won’t be able to recoup any of that money.

[@Dansyoung]

And why would a man be excited about marriage? Seriously, what does a man get in marriage that he doesn’t have while dating?

[@cc3822]

It's funny that he just found out about the crazy amount of debt, and John put him on the spot by asking why he loves her. I'm sure he is trying to justify why he loves it after the lie/crazy amount of debt. If she loves him, she would put in more effort to get rid of the debt, which should be her responsible. John's advice is reckless, and Will damaged a family if he gets married. Stupid.

[@avp6730]

It doesn't even seem like they are that serious... He says they hang out. That's maybe the reason she didn't tell him - she doesn't think they are that serious..

[@katiejon17]

1) so she is NOT a doctor. She dropped out before finishing her master’s degree, and to be a doctor you need a masters plus a PhD. 2) you live together and she hid her student loan debt until recently. Is she a liar? Not sure. But she is absolutely deceitful. 3) she isn’t such a “hard worker” nor is she “motivated”... she quit school after accruing $150k in debt, and before graduating. **I’m saying as a SAHM and wife - she isn’t equally yoked with this caller in character. Walk away. She has a whole lot of maturing to do before even talking about becoming a wife and mother. It’s her debt, she doesn’t want to deal with it, she’ll marry this caller and make it his problem... and then divorce. I’d be very careful.

[@PureJoySkinCareWaxStudio]

💯

[@terriesmith2616]

Bingo 🎯🎯💯💯

[@penelope5500]

Yes, her accrural & attitude about all of that debt (& not even making a plan to deal w/ it) speaks to a fundamental difference in values & lifestyle choices. I felt like the Dr. was just sort of glossing over that. If I were this guy I would want to see that she is at least addressing & doing something tangible about her problem before I jumped in & married her.

[@jessicabender1301]

Katie: wrong. I have a doctorate wo a masters. That is flat wrong

[@atk_1]

Not sure how she is a “doctor” without even having a masters. NOPE.

[@sharondoan1447]

Yes, that is a deal breaker. No marriage until she is debt free. Don’t marry anyone who cannot manage money or anyone who cannot commit to her own choices.

[@neoalley]

Dr. John literally said the opposite. Either work on it together or walk away. If there is a "no marriage until debt free" then walk away because their is a chip on his shoulder, he thinks he's better than her, and marriage is not forcing her to solve her problems on her own.

[@hayley179g]

Your attitude isn't wrong, he maybe shouldn't marry her, it wouldn't be good for them. But saying that not having a trust fund for medical school is "not being able to manage money" or that dropping out means a lack of commitment, that's the ignorant part.

[@yajwells6153]

I've made this mistake, tough to get out of this if you dont handle it the right way.

[@letsdothis9728]

Don't do it bro. It's not your problem. Have her show you she can get rid of it before you marry. DONT DO IT!!

[@midnightblue117]

I’m a woman and I AGREE with you!

[@RG-hf4et]

​@@midnightblue117Another woman here. Don't marry her!!

[@nathangill8404]

What's the plan for this debt honey? "No plan". Ok bye. That conversation needs to happen.

[@katherinecolson2350]

Absolutely agree 💯

[@noelleirina5628]

Student debt is not "living beyond your means".

[@pinkpugginz]

exactly

[@angel794]

How can you get $150,000 in debt without even finishing a Master's degree? High overspender, doesn't complete her degree, he avoids debt like the plague. Sounds like a match made in hell. Money is one the biggest issues in fights.

[@aladdout9454]

You have two options: 1) Run and don't waste her time and yours. She has a lot to figure out along with her finances. Don't look back. 2) Give her sort of an ultimatum/maybe even guidance? she has to take care of her debt by working her ass off starting with getting better job/jobs. You may date her and see how things are after a few years. This would be hard.

[@samanthasmiles9112]

Top reasons for divorce: Finances, religion, kids (to have or not to have), and in-laws. It's all cute in the beginning. It's not so cute after 10+ years.

[@reneehouser2925]

Their relationship is doomed at this point. He isn't ready and she's totally irresponsible, unable to finish what she started- they both probably just assume their inheritance will cover their "forever" loans 😂

[@alexa_4292]

She didn’t finish her masters, she still has a bachelors

[@reneehouser2925]

@@alexa_4292 like the confused boyfriend said- she needs to take some classes in FINANCE.... Either way, she didn't FINISH what SHE STARTED- there's always more to the story. How TF is she gonna pay that off with a Bachelor's? 😆🤣😂🤦 Typical... she's not. She expects someone else to HELP HER! And she will QUIT other things in life when she loses interest or the challenges of adulting overwhelm her. This will become a PATTERN of behavior, a habitual choice. She made her bed, she needs to be responsible 100% for the quality of sheets that she has chosen-

[@yashpatel261]

This is the comment i was looking for. His girlfriend is an irresponsible person unwilling or incapable of finishing what she started. If she quit on this responsibility what else could she quit on ? Raising a family is not easy and requires some degree of fortitude.

[@reneehouser2925]

@@yashpatel261 yes, there is a ripple effect when it comes to being resilient and dedicated, or not. It's generally an indicator of the potential to become a pattern of behavior. There are single parents with much greater challenges who manage to push through graduate programs! Hopefully she doesn't become a mother anytime soon or there will just be more videos complaining about the cost of childcare- I mean the cost of paying someone else to raise your child(ren). I feel supported and encouraged by your comment! 😊

[@shellyb5014]

It’s really annoying how Dave and now John makes stupid comments about people being doctors with this high ass student debt when it reality any time you get a degree in America, it comes with a HEFTY sum of debt. The issue isn’t the borrower, it’s the fact that universities charge exorbitant amounts of money.. and so many professions outside of doctors require degrees!!

[@Bringon-dw8dx]

Agreed. This is the reality of modern America. Not everyone can have wealthy parents

[@u.2b215]

I'm sorry but what lousy advice. Telling him to tell her he's a nerd, that he loves her more than life itself and that the debt makes him unable to breathe. John might be talking about himself and his own wife but that doesn't apply to everybody else. Taking John's advice could lead her to completely disregard her responsibility and even think that she carries little blame.

[@hammypie]

Agree.

[@Just-a-Girl-7]

I didn’t think that it was bad advice. Debt will affect their lifestyle as a married couple like having kids and the schools they’d go to and extra curricular activities that are available to them. No one wants to be married and miserable because of a past mistake. I think that being encouraging and loving is a good idea. If her love language is words of affirmation he was on point. He basically said plan a way out with her don’t do it for her. It’s a relationship not a dictatorship. Plus the way they go into the marriage is going to set the expectation of how it will continue.

[@katiejon17]

I have rarely ever seen John give rational, sound advice. But he sure threw out insults to “Texas men”.

[@khalilwilson2586]

He would’ve never given this advice to a woman. He would’ve asked her if she could’ve trusted him and that it’s a big responsibility she would be taking on.

[@lorirogers9304]

I don’t like John’s fuzzy wuzzy ideals about life. He isn’t aware of hard life really can be.

[@consumerdebtchitchat]

If getting US out of debt requires that I work even more than I already do (50 hrs a week) - Then NO. I can't be with them. This is because at MY age (57) and medical conditions, I am already physicallly taxed out with knee arthritis. A younger person MIGHT be able and more willing to work those extra hours to pay off her debt. And like people have pointed out below, she'll want the whole castle and expect HIM to fork over the 3 jobs to keep her in a lap of luxury. There are less financially complicated women to marry who can achieve goals.

[@ineedhoez]

Agreed. this is definitely a young people's conversation. I'm 40 and i'm not dating someone who hasn't met the appropriate developmental milestones for my age.

[@JakeAkstins]

Plenty of women out there with no debt. Dont pick one with 150k. Thay is a downpayment for a house.

[@Gentilejedi]

When the bills come in the front door, love goes out the back window.

[@hayley179g]

Aaaalll the way out into the ocean, where there are plenty of fish

[@HighwayLand]

Knowing that this is slightly different, I married my woman just seven months ago, She was 60k in the red and I was $86K in the green, I had zero hesitation on paying off her debt, and we've been good from there on. In a couple more months we are taking a vacation to new york city. If you absolutely love her then don't let anything get in between you.

[@Drayonis]

She decides she wants a divorce next year ( you're going to be suicidal).

[@kitchensink7345]

Why not make her be accountable for her debt, now she will expect and know you’ll pay off any debt she accumulates. Loving someone is holding them accountable

[@Gotoworkkk]

That’s a BIG roll of the dice.

[@LaverneGrant-ff8ub]

@@kitchensink7345 he needs a prenup saying if they divorce, she is responsible for her student loan debt.

[@katiejon17]

But this many concerns and issues with just a girlfriend is crazy. On top of that, they have been living together... and he said his girlfriend has only just recently told him her debt, and she was not happy about discussing it. So she’s deceitful. This is a relationship where you walk away.

[@Alberlight.19]

I agree 100% with Dr. John. Of course the 150k debt is one problem. However, with a consistent plan that much can be payed off with no stress. In my opinion though, the biggest issue is that the caller is not being direct on his reasons to why he likes her. I'm worried if he's with her only for convenience or because it feels correct to do so. Also, He is not having proper conversations with his girlfriend. Having a family is not a single player game.

[@rebeccaabel4589]

He does not really want to marry her

[@PureJoySkinCareWaxStudio]

Do ya blame him? I would marry a dude like this.

[@consumerdebtchitchat]

Exactly. The call is more of an affirmation to NOT marry her - LOL.

[@kissengerc9468]

I hope he is not going to help her pay for her student loan. Those guys will never learn 😢

[@brewsandbass5572]

Big mistake. He's going to marry that 156k.

[@Bike4Life231]

She realized after the fact that she took on too much debt? Run far far away, buddy. If the person doesn't plan and isn't realistic about that kind of debt, that's a no in my book. If you're having to worry and overthink it, and can't give a good reason why he wants to marry her. Nope, nope, nope.

[@ineedhoez]

150k and didn't finish it? Yikes. This is such good advice. I would need to see her plan and her executing it. I totally understand Why people are screaming run?But I think what this call illuminates Is how important it is to learn to have difficult conversations in our relationships. John provided excellent advice on how to approach difficult subjects. 1. Create a shared vision for the future. By doing this, you're letting the person know that you are not abandoning them but you're trying to solve the problem so that you can be together. 2. By focusing on dreaming about what the future could look like, You are Illuminating the picture for your lives. This Creates optimism an excitement for the future. 3. By being vulnerable you articulate why The issue is a problem for you. You talk about your fears and your needs. You create a space where each person can see the other person. You can see your partner and see that the problem is outside of your partner. Unfortunately, the problem may be your partner and your fundamental incompatibility. You can't explore this unless you sit down and have the difficult conversation.

[@izzywox8246]

I appreciate the way you broke this down

[@ineedhoez]

@izzywox8246 I try! We live in such a fear-based society where we are all terrified of being hurt. So we just keep ourselves bottled up and disconnected. Is such a scarcity mindset. The amount of people. Who are scared about losing money, If a marriage fails vs m the benefit that you get of having a wonderful family and creating all of these life experiences is just sad. Money is ruining people's lives.

[@RG-hf4et]

​@@ineedhoezPoor judgemental is ruining people's lives!!

[@Songbird36able]

John you're giving him the wrong advise. Her financial situation is not his problem unless she's fixing to become fiance/wife. Then she needs to talk, listen and be honest about "her" jacked up finances. If she doesn't want to talk you need to walk. Period!!

[@neisci]

I would say it's not the debt, it's the behavior towards the debt. Some people understand the weight of it, work towards paying it off, and never take any more debt. Others just see as a walk in the park, nothing to worry about as if the debt will evaporate on its own while accruing more debt. Needless to say, stay away from them.

[@consumerdebtchitchat]

That first sentence!!!

[@MikeyPaper]

Mental gymnastics 😂. Sorry to break it to you, but it ACTUALLY IS the debt. $150k in student loans is NO JOKE!!

[@neisci]

@@MikeyPaper Of course it's no joke, that's why you work and pay it off🙄. WORK. It's it as if people no longer know that word

[@katmac5045]

On the one hand you are the perfect partner to sort out the debt On the other hand you would be in a situation you never wanted to be in and tried hard not to get into yourself And here you are getting yourself into it

[@katiejon17]

John is the one overcomplicating this. This caller is talking about a GIRLFRIEND. Not a wife. This many issues and concerns before marriage? Walk away.

[@ineedhoez]

That's what's wrong with the world right now. We discard people and treat them as they are disposable. All John is telling him to do is have the appropriate conversation. He's teaching him how to communicate properly. He's teaching him very valuable skills that are going to lead to a successful relationship. The gentleman may still end the relationship because she is unwilling to do the work that's required to clear the debt. But he will have learned how to be an excellent communicator and it will serve him well in his next relationship.

[@Dansyoung]

@@ineedhoezOr the problem is people take on debts and don’t pay them off. It is not your responsibility to pay for someone else’s poor choices. You will get burned.

[@ariannagalluzzo]

@@ineedhoez Respectfully, this chick played herself by withholding information and racking up debt to the tune of six-figures without a degree. Her track record sucks and she's a young person with a world of problems. What is there to communicate, really? One thing that I learned in the dating world is that if you see red flags in a person there are plenty of other people out there that are, at the very least, less problematic. If this guy was my brother I would tell him to cut his losses and start hanging out with winners.

[@racheltarentino3314]

​@@ineedhoezthank you😮 someone with sense

[@ineedhoez]

@ariannagalluzzo You don't know any of that. From what was stated in this call, It doesn't seem like they had a conversation about it during the dating process. He also didn't express anything that would indicate that she expected him to pay for it. You are doing a whole lot of projecting. Once again, all John is telling this man to do is to sit down and have a conversation. That's it. They are going to sit down and have an open, honest, and vulnerable conversation. After that, he'll be able to assess whether or not she's the type of person that he is going to want to build a life with. Until then, you are just making a big ass assumption about how she got there, her attitude towards her motivation to fix it, etc. Money is not a problem in relationships. Your values surrounding money are the issue. You need to talk to each other to explore this information. The goal in a relationship should always be to seek to understand the other person's perspective. Your values may still be misaligned, but at least you can make a decision based on factual and accurate information. Stop letting fear make your decisions in life. You can get used and abandoned by somebody who doesn't have any debt. Use your words.

[@Liz-c7d]

I think your advice was perfect, Dr. Delony, in opposition to what most of the commenters are saying. So many visceral reactions, assumptions, "what ifs" and "RUNs!" without taking into consideration the many sides and yes, difficulties, of a loving relationship. No compromises and communication for them! Good luck, RUNNERS!

[@izzywox8246]

🎯

[@marcenelj]

It all depends on how she feels about this debt. If this debt doesn't bother her and has an i-dont-care attitude about it.. Run brother

[@David-wo9un]

What’s the hurry to get married and take on her debt?😊

[@BREEZYM6015]

What's the hurry to get married? 😂

[@ST-rj8iu]

because he thinks it will "save" him. I am so confused why so many think marriage somehow changes your life. Especially marrying someone that is lower socioeconomic status, etc.

[@InvestgoldUK]

To put this in perspective, I met someone, we had children together. Years later, when we split up she expected me to pay half her student debt. I meanwhile scrapped through my education without accruing debt. Told her to get lost and fortunately this was one battle on which the state agreed with me - I live in Denmark, but good god no way should you take on someone elses debt. You have different values already and it won't get better. Another woman with the right values will come along, she already expects you to pay it off one way or another.

[@newyorke172]

I was in debt because of a divorce and deadbeat dad. It was a situation I didn’t create, so I hope I won’t be judged for it.

[@evaswritingvault3066]

There's about to be a lot of single millennials and Gen Z if student debt is a deal breaker 🤷🏽‍♀️. Literally everyone I know has student loans.

[@darex0827]

It's not so much that they have debt, its what they think about said debt. If they are putting everything they possibly can towards the debt and working 80 hours a week, I could live with the level of debt since it won't be around long. If they aren't treating it like the disaster it is, different story. Mindset is everything.

[@Evil-Rod-Farva]

It’s $156K. That’s quintuple the average.

[@AnthonySopran0]

It's okay for the women just not the men

[@Gabster1990]

I wouldn't say it's a deal breaker if they are working towards paying it off.

[@joanlovelace7338]

​@AnthonySopran0 ⁉️what⁉️ Dr John said he did the same ,,,,it's not a male/female thing.. You a woman hater ⁉️

[@donnaallgaier-lamberti3933]

I would not want to marry a many in this much debt. My fiance' told me he was in about $16,000 debt in the mid-80s' and told him I would not marry him while in debt because I simply do not believe in living in debt. He was racking up debts on several credit cards, living beyond his means and not paying attention to how he was living or how much debt he was racking up. We made a a plan for him to get those debts paid off before we married and he did it. We made a new budget together and both agreed to live within that budget - and he did it. I took this as a sign that he was willing to do what was necessary. We did get married after about 2 years in a very simple ceremony at the Justice of the Peace, and had a simple homemade reception afterwards, no honeymoon, no diamond because we did not have the cash up front. We are every bit as married and rebuilding our future together.

[@Yourhighness7777]

he didnt say he LOVED her .... WHICH IS THE ONLY REASON TO MARRY

[@ineedhoez]

Not true. Love doesn't pay the the bills.

[@fromheaventoearth5779]

Yup. Marrying for l"ove" is why so many get divorced. ​@@ineedhoez

[@beataimiolek4856]

Love does not guarantee a good marriage. Mutual respect and compatibility- having these 2 give more chances for a successful marriage than love. Especially that we choose who we want to love. And there's so many ppl choosing wrong person to love again and again and getting hurt as many times.

[@ineedhoez]

@beataimiolek4856 hell yeah!!! I have loved quite a few people that would have made horrific life partners!!! Love is a fantasy. Shared values, mutual respect, and a willingness to find mutually beneficial solutions builds healthy marriages.

[@fromheaventoearth5779]

@@ineedhoez Ya. Much more to it than just love.

[@RShaun]

Run. And figure out what you want other than to not be alone.

[@jtixtlan]

Going into tremendous debt for any degree and quitting without completing the degree is a huge red flag. It shows potential for great financial irresponsibility. Even worse, is expecting a partner to take on the consequences.

[@hayley179g]

Do you have a tough degree like medicine?

[@RG-hf4et]

​@@hayley179gShe doesn't have a medical degree.

[@jtixtlan]

@@hayley179g Mine is engineering and MBA.

[@Teewriter]

Oh my goodness, if you really love the woman, you put a plan together and not get married until you feel comfortable with the amount of debt she has. And it really is no reason to get married unless you plan on having children. This is the case, with all this debt. Make a plan or it’s a dealbreaker because you’re wasting your time if you don’t.

[@Gabexyz3]

SHe dOeS LiVe bEyOnD her mEaNs. Bro you know what he meant.

[@katiejon17]

But do you grasp what he meant?

[@Hunter2847]

I don’t know what he meant, tell me what he meant

[@stevezelaznik5872]

What Dr D meant was that she doesn’t have to live a flashy lifestyle to be living beyond her means. He was implying (and I agree) that the failed masters degree was another form of consumption for her.

[@FreeSpirit47]

A person being so deep in debt even from walking away without a degree, is more common than some people realize. My friend worked so hard to get her Masters Degree without student loan debt. She met a really great guy. They dated for a year. They married. The whole time they didn't discuss finances or debt or any of those hard subjects. As it turned out, HE was $180K in debt. She found out about this 6 months after they married. Sure, he had his degree, had scored a great career. It's the hiding of debt from her that she was angry about..

[@RG-hf4et]

She should be angry.

[@FreeSpirit47]

@@RG-hf4et That's what I thought, also. I worked very hard to become debt free over a decade ago. I'm single, I don't date at all. If I were to date someone & it turned serious, I would for sure have him disclose to me any debt that he has before proceeding any further.

[@Grace-rx7cv]

Do people not listen? She has a degree. Just not her masters degree.

[@cliveford5596]

Almost certain this ends in divorce…

[@daleweiss9507]

Once the debt is paid off.😉

[@alberttang6955]

​@@daleweiss9507 Pretty sweet deal.

[@Dansyoung]

The best way to prevent divorce is to avoid marriage.

[@millyday]

Sounds like an old one! Can we have call ins of "where are they now?"??? Would be awesome to hear how advice went that was taken and not taken!

[@B___3]

Yesss!!

[@santafilipina9020]

He and his girlfriend have different approaches to doing life. I say put the breaks on talks about marriage. My goodness, he couldn't even articulate why he wanted to marry her.

[@beataimiolek4856]

If I was in this situation, I'd not expect my boyfriend to marry me and be somehow responsible for my debt. The truth is, I don't imagine myself saying "yes" before I sorted out the troubles I've put myself into. If she walked out on him because he'd want to wait with marriage until she cleans up her mess, I'd say she was not the one. And on that note, my advice to the caller would be: support her, help her plan how to pay off her debt and watch her progress. Her being able to follow the plan and get things better is a proof that she's capable of making wise financial choices in marriage.

[@raem7287]

Yes a 6 figure debt is scary but it's not impossible to tackle...but if she's not trying to pay it off as fast as possible like working 2 jobs, 60+ hours a week then you should run. Plus if you're having trouble stating why you want to marry them then you should also run. It should be easy to list many reasons why you want to marry your potential/future spouse.

[@mcclaryo148]

It sounds like this guys has a plan for his life. The best advice I got was to pick a spouse not for where you are now, but where you plan to be as you get older. If you have to put on kid gloves to talk to your future spouse, it may not be a good fit as life gets harder as you age. Kids, job loss, pandemics, and death. You need to be able to be direct and to the point at times. If she is not appreciative of the advice you give her now, there is no magic switch when you get married. If you are better and smarter than her when it comes to money, and she doesn’t want to take your advice…run.

[@ineedhoez]

It's not about putting on kid gloves. It's about knowing how to communicate properly. Most people do not know how to get their message through, So this is good advice.

[@mcclaryo148]

@@ineedhoez based on the conversation I heard, it doesn’t sound like he has an issue communicating the issue. It sounds like Dr John is given advice on how to communicate in a way to prevent her from shutting down during the conversation. To do this Dr John is saying to take it away from her and put the burden on himself. I completely understand how this can keep the line of communication open during the conversation, but for people with a plan for their lives, this can be exhausting. Sometimes you just need to say, you caused an issue and how do we fix it. That communication is clear and kind and something you both can take action on.

[@JerseyDevilJerseyGirl]

Here I gotchu: Yes. It is.

[@debbielockhart7762]

He's just so hapoy he's "getting some" that he's willing to throw his life down the tubes. Holy crap!

[@SamCurtis-yk8cv]

His first response to the question about why do you want to marry her should have been - I love her 🤦‍♀️

[@Aleeleebug]

I didnt get the sense that this man loves his girlfriend more than life itself, but John keeps putting those words in his mouth. Dont know why.

[@InvestgoldUK]

playing up to the ladies in the audience, my guess. Poor guy, he needed a wise man to say no.

[@terriesmith2616]

John always does that. He's a major simp and simp is gonna simp.

[@bethl]

@@terriesmith2616then why are you listening to him?

[@La-libellule]

But her debt will become his..I disagree with your advice this time sir

[@MrRaErickson]

DONT DO IT

[@melinated2497]

Having debt is a problem, but problems can be solved if you have a plan and the means to execute it. This woman has debt and no graduate degree to show for it. She is looking for a meal ticket or Captain Save'em. I had debt when I married my husband but I also had a plan for advancing my career to get the ROI and accelerate my debt repayment ability. It's paying off literally and figuratively.

[@imveryhungry112]

She doesnt seem to want to discuss the debt or finances. Thats a huge part of being married. I wonder if she isnt as committed as he thinks she is?

[@debbielockhart7762]

She wants a white knight to come along and pay it. And this caller is likely going to. I think he should dump her ass.

[@RG-hf4et]

She's committed but doesn't want to discuss finances. She's probably making the minimum payments, hoping they get married, and he will help pay the student debt. She's being quiet about it for a reason.

[@imveryhungry112]

@@RG-hf4et Makes sense. Its just something isn't quite right because if you think about it finances are a really very major part of a marriage because it determines many things such as where you can afford to live, if you can afford to get a house or not etc.

[@Hiya-k1i]

I feel for the girlfriend. If they break up I hope she makes it out of debt and finds a man who actually loves her. Turns out men are not capable of loving women unconditionally better than women can like they claim lol

[@sallythibodeaux7992]

He never said He loved her until he was told to say he loves her. I don’t think he’s ready for that step.

[@famj4860]

Nooooo! Don't get married. I'm a woman and I'd be so embarrassed to burden another person with my debt because I live below my means. Don't get married if she's in so much debt. It will cause stress in your marriage. You might end up divorcing because of it. Don't do it.

[@clericstorm2009]

Depends. If the person can evidence they have been and will be paying off that debt then not a dealbreaker. If they aren't addressing it or are accumulating more, the yes.

[@jessicabender1301]

This man is wise to challenge this. Her debt becomes his if he's married to her. Does she have a plan? Does she show that he follows it? Why the heck do you drop out?

[@ericalashan1923]

Why can't she make a payment plan?....she's going to mess ur money up too...

[@nancypicchi9224]

This guy needs to bow out. He’s more concerned about his LOSS. Wake up! You will regret taking this on.

[@zacnbend]

Gave him the ultimate simp advice. If you go tell her that she will walk all over you for the next 20 years till she divorces you

[@de4774]

Hello John, I think both of your concerns about this loan seem a bit misplaced. At 0.36-0.38, you asked if she is a doctor, and he confirmed she is. For a physician, this loan amount is relatively average. The typical medical student graduates with over $200k in debt, so she is slightly below the average. While this may seem alarming to the general public, it is a common burden for American physicians, which is why doctors often feel underpaid despite their high salaries. Although this is a private loan and she won't qualify for loan forgiveness, there are several ways to manage it. She can take extra shifts or pursue side gigs to pay it off quickly. Alternatively, she can use her regular income and bonuses, but this may lead to more interest over time, as many doctors experience. I am a strong critic of the medical school loan burden and cost inflation, which have harmed our healthcare system and many doctors' finances. However, a $156k loan is not a deal-breaker for a physician or someone planning to become one. She is still below average and in a relatively good position.

[@hayley179g]

How can she be a doctor if she hasn't even finished her Master's degree? Is that possible?

[@hayley179g]

But you're right, especially judging from all of these ignorant comments

[@RG-hf4et]

She has a bachelor's degree. She ain't no doctor.

[@LaverneGrant-ff8ub]

Is John out of his mind? Her debt takes away from their quality of life. He is going to be the one carrying the load. Since she gave up on her 150,000 career goal, who is to say she won’t give up on marriage when it gets so hard. Also, if she decides she actually does not want to work or want to pay to pursue another educational goal, she may decide not to listen to his input. He best get a prenup saying if they divorce he is not responsible for repayment of the loan, get it notarized and check the laws of his state to see if an attorney has to review it. So much happens in life and we do not know the other person. He sounds like a decent guy and sad to say they end up marrying someone who will not treat them well. Run dude before it is too late. All the worry he has is an indication of danger. Better listen to it and not brush it off with the feel good psychoanalysis crap John is giving. I am a female and I say again Run dude run.

[@ineedhoez]

All john told him to do was talk to her. The man can't decide to move forward or exit the relationship until he understands what this woman's plan is for her debt. Clearly, the debt is not a deal breaker cause he would have expressed his concerns about debt during the first date. Stop discarding people. Have the difficult conversation.

[@cedricbethea]

​@@ineedhoezyou sound like the naive guy who is surprised when your spouse says she wants a separation, you're clueless 😂

[@amandawithlov3908]

I told my now boyfriend (before we got serious) that I will be graduating with $170k and no penny to my name when I'm done with my doctoral program. His response was that he sees this as an investment in my career and he sees how great I am with money so he's not worried about it. I'm pursuing a career with a projected income of $250k starting.

[@RG-hf4et]

Don't drop out like this chick did.

[@pinkyblessed2218]

Caller can you live without her? If yes, move on. If not postpone marrying her until y’all tackle the debt & 100% clear it up. For everything she pays to the debt you could match in a separate account. Then when she reaches 1/2 way you pay your account to the debt.

[@mikeymyke]

$150k debt but is a doctor = not a dealbreaker $150k but has a degree with a low paying job = date but dont marry $150k but dropped out = dealbreaker

[@hayley179g]

Great, so your advice is if you don't know for sure you'll be a doctor, don't go to med school.

[@RG-hf4et]

​@@hayley179gThis isn't med school.

[@Alexander44665]

As far as Dr. John saying that if a guy telks a woman she needs to do x to be worthy of getting married-that's not going to work-he's wrong! Women do that to us all the time. We men have the same right.