Item Level Ruined Gear Progression In WoW - How To Fix It - Samiccus Discusses & Reacts

[@matmu52]

If they never did a damage squish, we would be in the Billions now.

[@Max-9871]

3:05 thats wrong. Itemlevel was in the game since classic just the average item level display wasnt there. Also classic and TBC item value management was terrible especially with proccs on trinkets/weapons so blizzard basicly randomly choosed how high the stats on a item will be instead of calculating them properly based on their itemlevel. Just pick like 5 lvl60 items with different item levels and compare their stats and you see what a mess blizzards item design was back then. You see items that have like 5ilvl more but less total stats which doesnt make any sense

[@Eyrrll]

Item level is not the issue here, as it has existed almost since the beginning (it just wasn’t generally visible in the early days). It was always intended to be a reference point to balance around… but early developers were hilariously bad at balancing, so vast differences in power existed with gear.

[@IAmNotARobot-OrAmI]

Item level wasn’t calculated. It was in the game from day 1, it just wasn’t displayed. It was still there and used to determine stat budget.

[@Wolverines9999]

It would’ve been amazing if the Legion weapon just kept progressing each expansion. Never have to worry about getting a weapon.

[@claytonbroulik8575]

There are too many item levels dividing gameplay. How many do 80's even have now? I know its all perspective. It just seems like it creates more divide and problems than its worth. Good review. Have a good day all!

[@leopeyretti8947]

most beautiful thing in D&D, BALDURS GATE, IS THAT you can find a thing on the first lvl that can be your BIS or a good choise to make your own gear plan, maybe u open a chest and thats your best chest because a random secondary buff, in retail is always you have to kill the hardest boss on the hardest difficulty to get a 3% chance to get your gear and then have good dices. The WOW problem is that everything its too obvious, there is no surprises, there are only growing ilvl numbers of items that are all equals. There is 0 of making your own way to play.

[@Experiment.626]

Gear score and IO were things we as the players forced into the game via addons. Both gear score and io were behind the scenes numbers that were data mined and addons were built around them so if you don’t like either blame the addon makers.

[@Experiment.626]

This also goes for raid finder and dungeon finder all things added by the tears of players. Then we end up saying they are shit and blame blizzard. We say listen to the community then punish them for adding features people cry for.

[@Experiment.626]

So to put it bluntly. Blizzard didn’t ruin gearing. Addons did.

[@Max-9871]

rio was made to speed up M+ group building to avoid searching the character name in blizzard laggy armory to check their highest Key completion so it was basicly a quality of life addon for people who run alot of M+. As someone who plays since classic and armory checked like 100 people per random raid i started beginning in Wotlk for gear and achievements i know why we have both and why we need both for LFGs

[@TheDeadGunslinger]

What would make gearing *feel* worth it, was if gearing in one expac, felt like it mattered in the next. If someone beats every boss at the end of a Mythic level raid, at the end of an expac, that gear should be high enough ilvl, and with good enough stats, to get in and complete at least Heroic in the next raid of the next expac. The gear in a mythic raid doesn't feel like it matters, because you're just gonna drop it next expac.

[@Sunsourse]

This might just be my experience, but I know that I do very much care what stats are on my gear. As a mistweaver monk, I get excited whenever I can find a piece of gear with haste on it, especially when the piece I'm replacing has a lot of mastery because my stat weights are very relevant to the amount of healing I can put out. But even beyond my experience. I find that item level serves a good purpose as a simple way for someone who may not really know what stats to aim for to look at their gear and judge its value. There are players that don't want to have to think super hard about what stats they have on their character and would much rather default to whichever piece the game says is better. How would a new player know whether X% versatility is better than X% crit? Let alone how much Stamina gear they should equip for these new mythic dungeons they've never done before. As for the number creep, I think that problem could be solved by having an in game setting that is on by default that rounded your damage numbers. I agree that 301,253 is less readable than 301, but 301 and 301k are just as readable. The problem isn't the numbers themselves, just how they're communicated. If a mob has 100 health and you do 15 damage to it, it is literally the same as if you did 15k damage to a 100k health mob because all the numbers are judged in context. It isn't even necessarily less accurate because if you hit someone with a 50% damage reduction with an attack that would to 5 damage, chances are the game would still display as if you did 3 damage even though the person's health might be held in the system to be 2.5 points lower from where it started.

[@PyromancerRift]

Blizz use the ilvl nowa because it is easyer for them to create items. It's all about efficiency for them. Less work = more money.

[@babelincoln2092]

Im sorry but this is sincerely wrong. Stats matter to an insane point, people just stopped doing the work and started using websites to copy bis lists. There are soft and hard breakpoints, different weights for different classes and specs. Some specs take more versatility for dungeons and more haste for raid for example. The only true part of his video is that items are the same every tier with a different name and stat weight, but even that doesn't matter, that's just the most nitpicky way of challenging loot options. The only difference from classic is that there aren't a million on use or proc items that are overpowered to an insane degree and there aren't overtuned stats like hit chance. Those 2 things are the only reasons there were lower requirement items being used later than intended. If they didn't exist people would automatically move to going for the item with the most strength, agility, int or spirit.

[@KristinLawrence-p3k]

People who think stats dont matter must not play at a high level. My feral and rogue are VASTLY better with the right stats. In Nyalotha I went down 5 ilvls and my dps went up because I optimized stats.

[@babelincoln2092]

@KristinLawrence-p3k i dont even know if it's a high level vs low level thing. I think it's just an issue of people following guides instead of understanding things like their crit soft cap. There's some basic knowledge that alot of people at every level never took the time to understand

[@PyromancerRift]

If my belt gave me 10% dps, i would remember its name. The only reason i chase trinkets, it's because the DPS increase is massive.

[@jigsaw6954]

I still remember getting the heart of rage trinket on my dk in cata i felt like a god

[@RobertHanson-f3i]

You mention how this is player driven by gearscore... but it's also in large part due to how the primary stats became homogenized by class. AGI means nothing for non AGI classes, STR means nothing for non STR classes, INT means nothing for non INT classes, things like HIT disappeared, etc. The stat system was far more complex originally because there were more relevant stats. Gearscore might have impacted how people rated gear, but Blizzard chose to reduce the stat mechanics to the simplest option.

[@zachishot17]

the issue is so many levels of content difficulty gives different levels of items. this makes it meaningless when i loot an item from a heroic dungeon or a heroic raid.

[@phoenixsmith1922]

This video is supper disingenuous. Every single time Bliz adds something non item level the playerbase goes nuts and complains until it’s all equal. Titanforging, reforging, leng cloak. Legion legendaries were cool and random upgrades, they were HATED by wow players. Legion weps, people cried, let people choose their covenant, people cried and got mad. Corruption? Ya people cried until there was a vendor. Wow players wants the best gear given to them, they don’t want ring on getting the super boost gear, history tells me wow players will cry until they “balance” any system that’s brought out

[@chasexchaos9392]

Meh…. Most of what you’re referring to is a small percentage of people upset, and not the same group of people in almost each instance you referenced. People will complain EITHER WAY, just like they do even without those systems. Basically… Your comment is irrelevant

[@phoenixsmith1922]

@ I could show you that most the player based hated these things while current. Every single system we’ve gotten has been taken out or reduced to a vendor before phased out. Every single system. The only reason you think it’s irrelevant is because you live in nostalgia. KZbinrs complained endlessly about that stuff until it’s gone. Almost every time it’s reduced because people got tired of farming or flat out refused to do so on an alt(legion and BFA) it happens every time without fail, if you disagree name 1 system that’s been added and kept around lol

[@TheDeadGunslinger]

THIS

[@jamesmott5181]

Yes but a purple item that has the same item level as a blue item, the purple will be able to be equipped at an earlier character level.

[@Schizim]

So, on single target, in dragon flight. I played enhance shaman. I min maxed haste and mastery. My friend and I swapped all my haste and mastery for crit and verse. I lost less than 5% dps. WITH THAT BEING SAID. When I play elemental and don’t get overloads due to low mastery, it feels bad. Also, main stat is so far over blown, it has made secondary stats almost irrelevant when it comes to item lvl.

[@DBallyousee]

I miss the days where people actually knew the names of gear, rather than just the stats. used to be a thing saying "I have xyz" and people would be like, daaaamn I've been wanting that for a while

[@SophsDad2022]

That’s still a thing, i still remember gavel of the first ones and I didn’t even play a class that could use it just because how good it was

[@Kytrion]

now it is mostly (Necrotic wake boots) or something like that. boss' weapon / trinket

[@fadedtimes]

only trinkets are actual items or a few items that have extra effects. I wish we had more weapons with flavors, not even sure why they give items names anymore.

[@malohn2068]

I miss on-hit effects. What sounds cooler? Mortal strike does 50% more damage or Mortal strike has a 25% chance to cast itself again (Can proc off of itself)

[@ГбонгЫыкнев]

first one

[@ThyFleshConsumed]

Definitely option 1.

[@havtor007]

2:42 kinda but also no. Yes gear score was an addon HOWEVER blizzard always used item level it was just hidden Other then that good video

[@Samiccus]

Your right it was hidden but the only thing the players had to go off of was the color of the name of the item.

[@havtor007]

@Samiccus Errm not exactly we had BiS lists Hunters even had a proto raidbots in wrath. Femaledwarf webpage did the same as questionllyepic does for healers now.

[@havtor007]

@Samiccus Not really right in wrath femaledwarf was launched a webpage for Hunters that did about the same as questionlyepic does for healers now. Theory crafters became bigger. And more.

[@MultiCina]

The player base is to blame on ALL OF THIS, item levels and in association damage meters have ruined so much of the game…. My alts that are the PROPER item level for NORMAL Nerub’ar Palace are getting ignored 90% of the time in pug groups because you have ilvl 625+ in queue 😒

[@xMovingTarget]

Biggest crit on my enhance shaman was something like 18.852.251 with Tremor from surging totem(sundering). These numbers mean nothing anymore. They are too high.

[@MrLisso98]

Item level existed, But it was not important. There was an option under interface that said "Show Item level"

[@khaosgaming6826]

5 years ago I said gearscore was part of what broke the game, that you used to be able to get an item and it might be good even if not bis for the whole xpac... I was called stupid and didn't know what I was talking about....and now people are starting to recognize it

[@mikaelbentley9870]

The masses always call someone names when said individual foresees a problem they cannot. From the heliocentric solar system, to C vacks, it never fails. One day you’re proven correct but… everyone will just say they were always on your train too and it was the other everyone else shouting you down.

[@AgentOroko]

@sammy I solved this a long time ago;. remove all stats from gear. Blizzard assigns each armor type a set of stats, we the players don't get to see them. Congrats, all PVP is now skill based. Raids can all be tuned based on normalized stats on every encounter. M+ will reach a max level because it becomes mathematically impossible to go higher. All gear is cosmetic. Adons often make up for lazy programming. The fights are now overly complicated specifically because of add-ons like weak auras and DBM. If those are taken out of the game, then the fights don't have to have umpteenth phases and 14 Mechanics each Phase. Blizzard can solve these issues. The question is will they? I doubt it.

[@Samiccus]

For PvP this idea could work but when it comes to getting gear and progressing in a raid or anything else the feeling of getting gear that makes you strong it core to an MMO in my eyes. I love the feeling of being maxed out at the end of an expansion or season and going god mode on content. I feel like if gear were just a cosmetic thing then it would lose some of its luster. Maybe I’m in the minority here but to me going big D matters

[@fozzyrinker313]

I hate item level, and yeah it was called gearscore. I raided all through that expansion as a Horde Holy Paladin.

[@PyromancerRift]

When you tag for a group, they see the highest ilvl you could have. Not the equiped ilvl.

[@kylehofmeister6906]

I don't even know why they have colors for gear anymore, it doesn't matter. Gearing isn't fun or interesting.

[@ndi88]

at this point they can just get rid of item names entirely and name them like "The Belt" or "The Boots" and nobody even notice lol

[@PyromancerRift]

Regarding the tanking stats he's wrong. He is talking like everybody plays at a good level. But having more health and more armor is a safety net for when you pug with bad people. Also, tanks in high keys use tanking trinkets, not DPS ones. In mythic invitational they do 9 10 11 keys with 639 ilvl gear.

[@Buntijr]

I guess I don’t understand the problem; you can min/max every piece, if you need to, but you can also not care if the content you run doesn’t require it (and the vast majority of content doesn’t, I’d argue). I don’t want to farm the BiS [insert every slot of armor here] like I do trinkets. If every slot was a trinket and I had to care about every slot as much as I care about trinkets, I’ll never main a character again because the community will start to put arbitrary scores on the effects and it’ll be a number go brrrrrrr again. Personally, I don’t need every piece of gear to be memorable; I want fun content with a few cool pieces of gear. I (personally) don’t care if most gear is cookie cutter/algorithm/formulaic.

[@Dr0Damyen]

I totally disagree with your statement that raids and dungeons will always feel the same. I played FFXIV for a while and those raids and dungeons really feel different. Especially with the changes of the last two years. Next week they are introducing a new raid mode again after all the new dungeon modes they introduced. You could argue that Blizzard did the same with Delves, but I have the feeling that FFXIV introduces new modes more often and is more willing to try out new things. I would love a legendary item each expansion that lasts at least the full expansion or maybe two expansion. Like the weapon in Legion, like the cloak in MOP. An item that grows with you during an expansion. Or something similar to FFXIV where you have relic weapons.

[@netovalcacer359]

Ilvl, Io and Ratings. We payed attention. It wasn't about all this.

[@Yvario]

Are people really that hurt over item level and damage squish? When you get bored, just go back to an old expansion and one-hit the Lich King. 😂

[@rengarlothbrok5696]

Stats >>>>>> ilvl Guys, 612 DH perfect stats Melting the charts on ST bosses vs people 620+ ilvl

[@Echo22WC]

I remember the first time my Aimed Shot crit for 1,000 in ZG 😂

[@Deathstroke-mz5ty]

Rotation over stats...... mechanics over stats

[@sterling112]

This new ring,It has a higher stamina by a long way and a high item lvl.But it nerfs the s*** out of my mastery and crit.Where is the bin cos I want to throw this in it.

[@michaelmorgan6048]

We’re hitting for millions right now tho..

[@MrLisso98]

The new things is recently in this last 2 expacs that are staying before DF all new shit was just for one expact only, it's good that they realised evergreen content is the way to go

[@yeminthway830]

i miss reforging

[@jaypietersen6093]

If this were even remotely accurate the new ring would be an auto equip. Hope this helps people not buy into this, BIS exists fr a reason. Math. Done by sims. For the extra stupid, like the peron making the video crafted gear @636 where you can tailor your stats to what you want. If the player base and the commentstors aren't smart enough to grasp that then by all means please keep makng these vids LMAO 🤣🤣🤣

[@kekk9365]

yo idk who you are, and idk who send you. but i like how you make your videos. i like the topics, and i like that you remind me of spergs a few years ago. i really hope you popp the fk off and own the whole WOW youtube thing. im sick of those depressive wow crybabys. i want people that like MMORPGs to talk about WoW bc thats what it is. its all about the world and the feel of the game.

[@Samiccus]

I love the game so even when I talk about things that should be fixed I like to remind people of that. Glad you like the content my man!

[@ragganmore6113]

What an L take Video, that got nothing in it apart from crying about things they definetly do not understand.

[@petarpetrov725]

30 minutes yapping for nothing. everyone knows this. everyone wants best parses now .. not ilvl...

[@dwiksux5079]

Parses are only looked on serious mythic guilds, in heroics or m+ is all ilvl and io score

[@Nayloss]

@@dwiksux5079 I once saw a clown looking for parses to accept people in a heroic raid pug

[@dwiksux5079]

@@Nayloss you said it, just a clown