9 Worldbuilding Mistakes Every New Writer Makes

[@Jed_Herne]

Get 'The Ultimate Guide to Rebuilding a Civilization' with a 10% discount: jedherne.com/rebuild (then use code JEDBOOK10) Thanks to Hungry Minds Publishing for sponsoring this video!

[@the_cringe_nerd]

To bring up point one. One of my favorite things in LOTR is Tom Bombadil and when asked Tolkien replied, "I have no idea why he is there, he just is."

[@nor4205]

I always mention Tom Bombadil when I talk about the book to a person who has only seen the movies or if someone argues that ALL movie adaptations are worse than the original books...

[@noahe2894]

@@nor4205 Tom Bomby will always be my favorite character

[@davidoliver7510]

Yes. I have deep love for Tom Bombadil and Goldberry. Both spirits. And gold berry is the rivers daughter. And Tom is eldest. Older than even Gandalf.

[@ComicsOdyssey]

Yes! Some things can just be there!

[@noahe2894]

@@davidoliver7510 Do you think he could be the oldest creation of Illuvitar?

[@wachyfanning]

It sounded like the Romans were less interested in the past as much as they were with preserving the Republic. "Remember your ancestors" doesn't mean "Do whatever they did in the past" it meant "We already fought for a republic once; don't let it go to waste"

[@Jed_Herne]

Great nuance

[@DarrylCross]

> "Remember your ancestors..." > "He and 23 other senators..." I guess that makes Marcus Junius Brutus the original 23andMe?

[@Roar_eh]

I snorted at this

[@SiqueScarface]

Yes. Why do you think is 23 the number most associated with hidden truth and conspiracy?

[@jameydunne3920]

Sounds like the seeds to a cool story. A person does a genealogy search which triggers, conveniently, 23 related people who have a historical connection. Throw in some Romeo and Juliet, toss in a touch of Hatfield and McCoy, and let the stew simmer...

[@rursus8354]

I'm a programming teacher. It seems the rules of not overwhelming the pupils also applies to fantasy. Also imagine a baby learning how reality works: first we have the MOM-context: mom is a smiling face giving you food and comfort, then the baby come to learn the arm-and-feet context, when not hungry and not asleep there are four funny things that you can wave, jerk around, touch things and grasp them. All knowledge acquisition should go outwards from situation to situation, so that the person conquers them one by one by testing and learning on how to achieve effects in that situation. There should be an entry point from one situation to the next one, so that things don't become overwhelmingly complex.

[@jesustyronechrist2330]

I think with programming, the biggest hurdle isn't the rules, but the terminology and lack of awareness of "why we do things" a.k.a. best-practices. Hence you only really learn both through trial-and-error and experience. Like, I still remember being a junior and not even knowing how to read documentation. Yeah. So I think that might apply to fantasy writers (or any) too: They might see this advice (best-practices), but not fully understand it due to the terminology.

[@MusicalXena]

"All knowledge acquisition should go outwards" makes me think of Vygotsky's Zone of Proximal Development. I have found that to be a very simple, but shockingly effective, way to think about teaching any subject to any person. Sounds like you think in a very similar way. 😊

[@reaganmonkey8]

11:50 That reminds of a scene in C. S. Lewis’s _Narnia: The Horse and His Boy_ where the main character had grown up in a fishing village. This was the description when he saw mountains for the first time: “Om the far side of it were huge blue things, lumpy but with jagged edges, and some of them with white tops.” Which feels like exactly how someone who has never seen them would describe mountains.

[@naomistarlight6178]

Reminds me of how I literally thought mountains were imaginary/fantasy until I went to Colorado as a kid 😂

[@Rynewulf]

@@naomistarlight6178Oh Ive felt that, and had the inverse of telling disbelieving people how flat, wet and near the sea everything is around here. (And recently had a bad netflix sports thing show snowy mountains in the background of my area, when we almost dont even have mountains in the country)

[@JForrestFisher--76]

The biggest thing I learned about worldbuilding is we usually apprach it backwards. I was admiring the mystery that Horizon Zero Dawn is built around and trying to figure out how to do something even a fraction thst powerful myself. I even searched for tips to create mystery which mostly went nowhere. Eventually I figured out its not about creating mystery, it's about having the discipline not to sabotage the mystery. Most writers who created as interesting a concept for their world would be eager to share it with the audience ASAP. "In te not too distant future, self-replicating machines were created, then so now you play as a hunter in a post-postapocalyptic world populated by machines!" Which sure it's a cool concept but it cuts the throat of the setting's opportunity to offer a deep mystery to unravel. Instead they showed us just enough to hook us but kept all the awesome stuff hidden, and the mystery just happens. And some great writing makes it pop of course!

[@jesustyronechrist2330]

I would like to add that not only is the world-building backwards, it's not taking any steps forward. We're not specific enough. Honestly, I think the mystery in Horizon Zero Dawn is... anticlimactic and self-sabotaged from the get-go due to them treating literally everything as a grand mystery revelation. SPOILERS BELOW Let me ask you, when you learned in the "twist" the machines are actually terraformers, did you go "Yoooooo holy shiiiiiiiiiit?!?!?!"? I doubt it. You probably went "Oh neat, that makes sense, I guess." It's not a factoid that changes how you see the world. And terraforming? That's a pretty boring and vanilla purpose for the machines. It's right up there with "to kill all humans/life" for robots. Now imagine if instead of that being the big twist of the entire game, knowing the purpose of the machines is terraforming is common knowledge. It's not a mystery at all and the tribes actively USE the machines to terraform their landscapes. THIS would explain how they've been able to build grand cities and such despite having stone-age technology and wisdom. Instead, the mystery is now solely about WHY the robots are terraforming and why they're animalistic. I think now the mystery is more focused on far more interesting questions and keeps the player/viewer engaged in things that won't have anti-climactic reveals to. And personally, the question of "what is the purpose of the machines?" isn't as compelling as "why were they created for that purpose?"

[@JForrestFisher--76]

@jesustyronechrist2330 lol it's worse than that. There were some quests I hadn't completed so after the reveal about what the project was I want back to do them before passing the point of no return. And then without the mystery motivating me, I DNFed the game lol. But at the same time, it seems pretty obvious they are terraforming. I certainly never got the feeling from the worldbuilding and gameplay that the animal-like robots were the bad guys in the story. I'd say though, that a mystery doesn't have to be great to motivate the audience. I was pretty sure what the project was for a long time. There weren't a lot of options available, especially given the clue of the post apoc game world. It's kinda the real world of the Matrix just not as ugly. But fiction doesn't have to be the greatest thing ever as long as it's decently well written, reasonably interesting to read, and gives a sense of progression, and fresh enoughnot to be a chore. The other thing is the most comortably fun thing to read, watch, or play is something that's like 90% derivative, based on what we already like, but just fresh enough to be interesting. And that's what's going to reach a mass audience. There is a thrill to finding something that feels really original though. Those tend to be more niche thpugh.

[@shaitarn1869]

The worst example of an info-dump I ever came across was in a story where the main character wakes up to find his village under attack y bandits. He grabs his bow and runs outside, crouching down behind the wheel of a burning wagon to see what’s going on. The writer then started to tell me about the character and world. It was a real ‘You have to be kidding me!’ moment.

[@ravenwilder4099]

Re: point 5: I mean, third person omniscient is a valid writing perspective - though if it suddenly pops up in what's otherwise third person limited, then yeah, that could be a problem.

[@etaaramin9361]

Depends. Some writers (Orson Scott Card especially) use chapter openings to write from unique perspectives to give understanding that viewpoint characters either don't have or wouldn't make sense to give. Usually the perspective is of a character, but the concept extends to whatever you'd like. The thing is you've got to be consistent with it. If your chapters are heft enough, and you do it every chapter, the reader gets into a certain cadence that can even draw them deeper into the story. Doing it at random can have the opposite effect. I personally like opening a chapter with a poem in omniscient perspective that either clarifies something important in the previous chapter, or foreshadows something coming in the next chapter.

[@magiv4205]

Good Omens has passages written in third person omniscient, and it works GREAT because the narrator is literally god lol.

[@Ψυχήμίασμα]

I agree. Take the writings of Lord Dunsany, HP Lovecraft, even Tolkien himself, there are passages and entire stories of objective descriptions. It depends on how it is done. I think specifically limiting descriptions to only POV-subjective based, can feel contrived. There are how characters see things, but, also, how things objectively are in a world. So, it would make more sense to have objective descriptions of a world interacting with character subjective descriptions of it. Both should organically occur in a story.

[@hxppythxughts7149]

I sometimes give an existing personality to the 3rd person omniscient view. Personality from a certain character featured in that chapter, usually by the end of the paragraph, like a bit of quip, optimistic or pessimistic remark about certain things that happen in that chapter.

[@tedpogorzelski1514]

Wow that first piece of advice is solid. I was always obsessed with filling the gaps of my world and lore, and realize that the enigma of the world begs readers to keep reading

[@robertgronewold3326]

In my book, I actually used an infodump to my advantage. My main character was being thrust into his first tutoring lesson alongside several other established students, and the tutor started to grill the students about various political and geographical things, allowing me to basically dumb a lot of reader interest information into the text, while at the same time having my main character panicking about how many terms and names were being thrust upon him in a matter of minutes.

[@trekkie1701c]

I did a bit where the characters were going through tutorial videos, getting small tidbits about how the shields work on their ship (which they stole), weapons, etc, and getting frustrated because they're trying to figure out how to lock the doors for privacy. It's a sci-fi story, granted, but I still thought it made for a funny scene. Debating on an edit going back and poking fun at the 'as you all know' trope and having a video go "Doors function as a way to partition a space" and the character getting super exasperated and go "I KNOW WHAT A DOOR IS TELL ME HOW TO LOCK IT"

[@robertgronewold3326]

@@trekkie1701c That sounds hilarious.

[@Alsadius]

On the topic of Roman cultural norms, they had some really fascinating ones. Like, they were obsessed with the idea of how important it was to use your own words - any profession that required people to use somebody else's words (actor, public herald, etc.) would be a very low-status profession, and it would have been scandalous for a politician to have speechwriters, they way that they all do now. Studying history in real depth is great for world-building, because you get a ton of examples of wildly different societies that were nevertheless real ways that humans can live.

[@chadmagnus5850]

My favorite loredump style is from the Wheel of Time novel. Robert Jordan's loredumps were always so simple and easy to digest and fitted into the current events of the story, without holding it back.

[@samuelferrell9257]

Yeah he did a pretty good job of that between talking about dresses.

[@naomistarlight6178]

​@@samuelferrell9257some else mentioned how he goes on and on about dresses! 😮

[@lancenwokeji6349]

The deer hunting example reminds me of something I’m currently writing in a story, in which a king’s brother jumps on the back of a large boar to try and kill it while it’s injured. It’s unsafe, but I choose to treat that as a character moment that proves how reckless and wild he is. The other characters admonish him for it, too.

[@jesustyronechrist2330]

This is almost like Hans Capon from Kingdom Come Deliverance lmao.

[@tealkerberus748]

Characters doing stupid is an important part of story. It just needs to be identified as stupid.

[@comanderlucky656]

Just noticed how in your bookshelves, you have them with spine facing outwards, exept for the books you authored, which have their front cover facing out instead. Gotta say, nice little easter egg lol

[@adrimacfer1815]

It's called "product placemente" hahaha

[@alexogilvie9668]

Dune is also cover-outwards, but yes, haha

[@adamleafy275]

Logistics is my biggest obstacle in writing

[@hades555-sd7ql]

So I bought The Thunder Heist- finished it today. And oh my God. I've always been a bit of a skeptic on whether his advice works, but it TOTALLY DOES. Without spoiling, the ending was so well built up, I want to know more about Prowlerak, and what Gabine did to earn herself the death sentence. Would highly recommend. Keep up the good work

[@NiteOwl2000]

Yo I almost forgot about that place even though I read the book. They sounded evil asf I want to see more of them. I want to know more about them and Kef’s crew too.

[@Jed_Herne]

Thanks for the kind words! I'm glad you enjoyed it. At this stage, the plan is to return to the Twisted Seas once I've finished my current project (the sequel to Kingdom of Dragons).

[@DrCrazyEvil]

​​@@Jed_Hernejust found your channel mate, is there any chance there will be any audiobooks on audible? I saw you only had one so far but written several so was wondering if more are coming! Don't get me wrong just one audiobook is still huge!

[@NiteOwl2000]

I’m not gonna spoil anything, but you should read The Sailor’s Gambit if you want to see more of Prowlerak. It’s a prequel novella set in the Twisted Seas universe that follows Kef on an adventure. It’s a quick read and I think you’ll like it if you enjoyed The Thunder Heist.

[@hades555-sd7ql]

I didn't know there was a prequel. I'll check it out

[@NiteOwl2000]

Thanks for dropping this before the contest. I’ve already prepared my entries for rounds 1 & 2, now I just need to watch this, finish my final pitch, get a haircut, and record the videos. I appreciate you doing this contest at all, it’s reinvigorated my passion for my story again after I hit a rut 20K words in. Also, good luck to everyone else participating!!!

[@Yattayatta]

Great video Jed, number 1 really is so important, and it ties into something else that is important as well, trust that your readers can understand without having every little thing spelled out to them.

[@Aeras89]

I've gotten feedback on my first chapter from a tiny handful of strangers and this seemed to be something people were incapable of considering. It was weird. I was giving details where you read between the lines and people are like, explain more! I'm just sitting here like... explaining more is not the point!! Use your deductive reasoning skills!!

[@t3amtomahawk]

​@@Aeras89 The day will come where a reader gets it, and they'll be your biggest fan. Keep it up!

[@Aeras89]

@@t3amtomahawk There were some who understood the assignment. It was a huge relief cause I was like... am I writing this shittily or do these guys just suck at reading between the lines?? 🤣😭

[@rmt3589]

1:38 Good, we're on the same page. Was scared for a sec. I like knowing the "truth", and the percieved truths, even if the audience doesn't know. Helps me stay consistent, the roots that determine the leaves.

[@pressstart2640]

On the don't fill every gap point. I had a music teacher in middle school that would always talk about the "sound of silence" (not the song) The mind just kind of fills it in as what should be there, even if that sound doesn't exist in reality. If the gap is noticed the brain will use promta to fill it. If its not noticed then its not noticed.

[@Celeborn93]

A thing i've noticed that i'm doing a lot with my world building, is that many of the cultures i present are in the middle of some revolutionary change, or at a pivotal moment regarding their prosperity etc. I don't know why, but i just find it exciting to throw my characters into a shaky foundation.

[@jesustyronechrist2330]

The world is never static, hence why. There's a coup, a natural catastrophe, a civil war, a famine, an emigration crisis, an immigration crisis, a political protest, etc. happening all around the world at any given time. Most of the world lives on a shaky foundation and even a utopia would be rifed with problems. That's conflict. That's drama. That's interesting.

[@qdLuke]

Damn early, good to be watching this as I'm working on my entry for your worldbuilding competition too lol

[@Jed_Herne]

Good luck!

[@tomjoyce7037]

Yep, I wish I had watched this before I submitted.

[@TheDoomKnight]

Worldbuilding competition? I hope I am not too late for that.

[@tomjoyce7037]

​@@TheDoomKnightI think you have until 13th December (if I remember correctly).

[@guilhermeclaro3596]

​@@tomjoyce7037But the competition is just a pitch for the concept of the world, most of the points brought up in this video are how to approach it narratively

[@Amazon.Prince]

This is why Tolkien and others have a separate document for the info dump. Worldbuild separately, then make it as a reference resource

[@Rynewulf]

Tolkien didnt publish any of his worldbuilding stuff in his lifetime, his son and grandson did that. He seemed to hate people searching for lore outside of the fiction itself

[@Amazon.Prince]

@Rynewulf haha exactly! I would feel the same if anyone wanted to read my unstructured, unfunny, blocks of endless paragraphs that amounts to an insane timeline/dry history text book. BUT LET ME KEEP THAT. Tbf, Tolkien's worldbuilding is of course a masterclass in linguistics itself. So I'm glad the heirs of Tolkien published it (if they hadn't, I bet oxford would have done the same and made it accessible as published diaries or letters available only upon academic request, beyond the public reach).

[@Ishansciencechess]

I made these mistakes, i didn't know they were "mistakes" thank you very much 😭

[@tand8100]

Mistakes r fine as long as u do em right

[@lionspawfilmandphoto]

This is great information when writing a fictional play too when run-time is an element to constantly consider.

[@Avarn388]

Great video. I know for me I had a general idea for my world but once I figured out the plot and characters( I put that under the umbrella term of story), I utilize the world building to help address details and plot problems so as they serve the plot. For example, one of my characters is non human and I explain how they can sense the world in a way that’s unique even from the other races/ humans. This plays a role in the climax of my book because I had a problem that needed to be resolved with magic and I needed better setup and establishment of the magic. I’m being vague but the point is that whatever lore, or world-building it needs to be relevant to the story you’re working on. For example, fellowship of the ring we learn about Mirhril from Gandalf while in Moria. This makes sense because Frodo has a vest made out of it and he was given it to keep him safe. And it plays a role in saving his life later on. Aka, an element that mattered. It wasn’t just fluff. Audiences do not want an encyclopedia of your world when reading. They want compelling characters and an engaging plot. The setting needs to complement those and not crowbar itself in.

[@verytigey]

My favorite thing to do about world building to avoid dumping too much info on the reader is taking Tolken's approach and basically writing my world's "bible"; basically just a book of the whole world and its creation and history and how it works. Not only is it nice for the readers who want to know more, but it's also a good guide for me, and a good way to sort out my thoughts so I dont leave any huge potholes or add something unnecessary

[@LowReedExpert1]

8:50 Another example of this, from a musician's perspective, is a small book I dropped that didn't understand instruments. They had a whole page or two describing the band "Dragging bows across their trumpets", "playing a whole song in one breathe on their violin" - stuff that makes zero sense to anyone with basic music knowledge. Or even in movies when they have live diegetic music and the mix includes instruments that aren't even there

[@naomistarlight6178]

Also even in a woodwind or brass instrument you do breathe into, one breath for an entire song makes no sense. I play clarinet. Instruments mostly need a whole hell of a lot of breath per note. There's no way you'd get out more than a few notes. Just stretches my suspension of disbelief too much, even if it were the right type of instrument.

[@HaldanDichmann]

As a writer, I wanted to quickly give my most sincere thanks for content creators like yourself who share your knowledge and experiences. It made being a writer possible for me. I don't have the money, or the time, to pursue a formal education in creative writing. Videos like this are my classroom. Thank you!

[@Jed_Herne]

I'm glad it's been helpful!

[@Nova11435]

​@@Jed_Hernefor parallel worldbuilding you (basically) word for word described the basic plot of the war eternal by Rob Hayes. Was that on purpose?

[@Warrior_Culture]

It was funny to me when you used the example of a warrior culture in which strength and honor are defined differently by different characters. I've had very lengthy real-world debates about that very thing with more than a few people. As well as debates about what it is to be brave, as I believe bravery by choice is more profound than bravery by necessity. I should just condense them for a story scene.

[@ВладиславТавриец]

The urge to tell readers everything about my world is the biggest problem that I have, lol. "Ow, look, there's my Rome in decline, and then there is my version of Sassanid Persia, and a lot of barbarian guys with Germans, Hunns, Celts and Slavs among them, and inhuman races and sentient animals in some parts of the world, btw, they all have a lot of diverse beliefs, ethics, customs and myths". Usually I ask myself, if this worldbuilding stuff I want to tell about now necessary for all my plotlines, or not, and if not, I remove them from text. The other problem I face is that as a history geek (especially of antiquity, Byzantium, ancient Slavs and Rus\Russia) I can't always realize which things are understandable for mass readers and which are not. One of my betas yesterday asked me to explain what gastraphetes is, for example (the language of my novel is Russian, but this word is as rare used in Russian as it is in English). Great video, love your content)

[@capitanspoiler7393]

if i may, i think point 5 should also take into consideration WHAT the reason for the character being there is. true, a thief would look for "targets" but, if he got into the inn to avoid being captured, he would look for a place to hide. likewise, if he just got into town after a few days of travel, he might subconsciously pay more attention to the smell of food or to where the most "comfy looking seat" is

[@sicshop]

This like most of your videos was mad helpful. Keep up the great work.

[@j.munday7913]

The thing about Romans revering the past is almost the opposite today. We're stuck in the "right now" of things. I'm guilty of trying to fill every gap. I have to rein myself back sometimes.

[@TheMightyBattleSquid]

Not really, "I was born in the wrong generation" and "kids today..." are common enough sentiments they've been observed and memed to death.

[@j.munday7913]

@@TheMightyBattleSquid People have always been like that. There's ancient correspondence that echoes that sentiment. I'm talking about how people are more likely to kill you for clout on social media, than because your grandfathers were enemies.

[@sabikikasuko6636]

About 2, parallel worldbuilding. Parallel worldbuilding isn't NECESSARILY bad as a storytelling device, as long as the connectons are still there. During our history, we don't get presented with all of the relevant facts in the entire timeline. To put an example, we know that Brutus killed Caesar, but not necssarily why beyond the "he was being a king". And we know that rhe republic became an empire, but we don't know how. To people who haven't studied Rome, it might seem like it just happened. Instead, there is great pleasure to have knowledge in the back of your mind, and then have that knowledge be recontextualized into greater depth by the connective tissue. Doing parallel worldbuilding isn't necessarily wrong, as long as it doesn't STAY parallel. I hold that the most interesting worldbuilding comes from the most outrageously disconnected ideas that are then recontextualized into a cohesive narrative, because lets you craft the most interesting version possible of your world, instead of running s simulation and seeing what happens. Allow yourself to kitchen sink as long as you clean the kitchen afterwards, make up a few battles that came from the aether and then, when the battles themselves are amazing, make up all of the surrounding context. And when you teach them to your viewers keep in mind: they don't need to understand everything, they only need to accept it. As long as you teach everything they need eventually, it'll be fine. In fact, the "oh!" moments when two unrelated ideas are suddenly connected, or an idea is suddenly connected to the greater worldbuilding, that's a feeling you want to abuse as much as possible. To steal your example, imagine if the book told you that there were these islands that everybody treated incredibly non-chalantly. The viewer is like "well, I guess we have floating islands". But then you learn rhat everybody knows about these islands because they are where the gemstones are mined, and now your mind goes back through the entirety of everything it knows about the islands and recolors it with this new knowledge. That feeling can truly be addictive.

[@TheRoleplayer40k]

I've never been gotten by a youtube advertisement before, but, I just bought that book cause it looks awesome, thanks for 10% off

[@BlazanatorX]

Brilliant video, just in time for the world building competition!

[@SiqueScarface]

Michael Ende in "Neverending Story" (not the movie) has the phrase "But this is a different story and shall be told at another time." spread out numerous times over his novel. The second part of the book is actually all about world building, because Bastian has to literally build the world anew and gets tangled up in the outcomes of his worldbuilding.

[@naomistarlight6178]

That sounds interesting, I haven't been able to find the book in English

[@SiqueScarface]

@@naomistarlight6178 Penguin books has the Neverending Story in the "Puffin Clothbound Classics" edition. Another edition is from Dutton Books for Young Readers.

[@janm.johansen9806]

This is really good, helpful end well-structured advice. Thank you.

[@Arthur-oy4nj]

This is acctuality a good video.👍🏻 Good job.

[@Lark88]

About trapped in present norms, that was one of my biggest gripes with Aragon. Despite being a kid living with his poor blacksmith uncle, the MC's living conditions and morning routine had little difference from a kid in Midwest America.

[@rilohoneu6030]

the julius brutus thing gave me chills

[@trecsyuh729]

Authors are afraid to stray from present norms spesifically because of the fear that people might accuse them of bigotry.

[@naomistarlight6178]

Yeah this is a problem when you want it to seem grounded in historical realism.

[@bonbonzilla]

this is literally the first sponsership that completely sold me on a product

[@XavierSchwindt]

6:32 = Basically the elivator pitch of one of my books. Great video Jed! Blessings!

[@sophysticatedpsycho]

I backed the Kickstarter for the Book. It's AMAZING!

[@lindanorris2455]

HA! there are very FEW MOVIE DIRECTORS in 2024 - that can world build in the manner that you are speaking of. So FEW horror & fantasy directors today that can world build or keep that built world throughout the entire film. WOW!

[@luissosa320]

"Gaps can be a feature not a bug" my friends, behold... the Todd Howard of book writing! 😂😂😂❤❤❤

[@bretsheeley4034]

You want to build an iceberg. :)

[@jesustyronechrist2330]

16 times the writing

[@zinogre6225]

Hey, could you do a video on how to do early chapters? Because I’ve been really struggling getting through chapters 2-5 on some of my books and I can’t find a good video to help me. They’re all just about Chapter 1/Prologue which I already nailed. I can get the introduction, midsection - end written easily, but I keep getting tripped up in those first couple chapters after the beginning.

[@upg5147]

What exactly is the problem?

[@kingofhearts3185]

I agree. It's such a fine line when we have the initial premise of the story but the plot hasn't hit its stride. Easy to drag, drown in exposition, or seem to skip the keynotes.

[@upg5147]

@@kingofhearts3185 Those opening chapters are the time you take to characterize your main character, show us their personality and their normal life before the inciting incident that changes everything. You can also use it to worldbuild and set up other characters and mysteries. Think of it like art, right now, you are laying the background colors and landscape so you have something to actually add the rest of the work too.

[@kingofhearts3185]

@@upg5147 I mostly agree. I write about a retired mercenary hired to lead a fairly routine job after a decade out of the game, mainly chosen because the contract is legal but morally shady. The opening chapters are him making arrangements to leave before the morning he actually walks out the city gate for the first time in over a decade. The opening is all day in the life and chatting with industry people for a week. So I guess lock-in rather than inciting incident.

[@upg5147]

@@kingofhearts3185 That sounds perfect. If there are any, this would be the time to talk about other mercenaries on the job, the clients he is working with, what he is helping them with and why, along with any bits of worldbuilding. Is this a cyberpunk world, wild west, fantasy?

[@Kutomi1]

Why do thumbnails of writing advice videos always say "Don't do this" and then show the literal coolest thing ever?

[@naomistarlight6178]

I really don't mind floating huge things. Irl we're on a floating ball in space. Low gravity or anti-gravity magic is an easy explanation. It just has to have some explanation and justification. In Baten Kaitos (JRPG game), floating lands and flying whales were part of what made the world so unique.

[@t3amtomahawk]

I trunked a novel for entirely unrelated reasons, but sitting through this, I know there are some of these mistakes in there. The editing phase will be that much better guided. Thanks for the tips

[@keithprice3369]

non-Objective descriptions descriptions was one of the only things I hated about Wheel of Time series (other than the pacing in Jordan's later books). Jordon continuiously went into great detail about clothing, for example, when in a POV of a character who would never notice such things.

[@xoso599]

To steal a quote; 'Human behavior is economic behavior. The particulars may vary, but competition for limited resources remains a constant.' If you are presented with a culture worldbuilding question in your story that you don't already have an answer for, work backwards to the economic activity that underpins the human behavior. If you want something to happen that's economically stupid, just remember that's what government is for. The most insane things in our world are the products of government regulation making the viable and dominate economic activity and methods illegal. This causes alternative methods be forced onto the market and kept in business by regulation alone. 13:54 Love the jump cut so the hand talky guy can load up on the props so he can keep his hand moving so his brain keeps working. Great video even if I think it would be funny to hand you two very full drinks to hold.

[@lilowhitney8614]

I mean, the flipside is also true. If you want some evil or opressive thing to be commonplace, just make it have economic value and make it unregulated.

[@rufusmay9615]

This sounds more like your own personal biases than an objective analysis of real world behaviour. While there are certainly 'bad' government regulations, there are also plenty of examples of people behaving irrationally, immorally, or self-destructively, and government regulation being a means of curbing that.

[@xoso599]

@@rufusmay9615 I wasn't passing a moral judgement on the regulations. I was just saying they make uneconomical activities viable. While recently ruled against as not a legitimate transportation, to comply with the Jones Act which bans foreign-flag vessels from transporting cargo in between US states, used a provision that allowed them to do that if the cargo traveled over Canadian railways. Clearly a nod to shipping goods from west to east to get into the Great Lakes on a ship then to other US states using the Canadian railways for the land connection. So the outcome is a company taking fish from Alaska by boat through the Panama Canal, to Canada, unloaded onto a truck, the truck is driven onto a train. The train drives back and forth 100feet then the trucks drive off to make the final delivery after having moved on a Canadian Railway. Without the Jones Act they wouldn't stop in Canada, would have a fake 100foot long railway (Bayside Canadian Railway BCR). And the extra cost of the longer trip and the fake railway would be avoided. This is just like one example I can remember off the top of my head. The world building point is that if you made something that's stupid by accident and are stuck trying to fix it, never forget the power of government regulation to provide a believable explanation for silly things that really shouldn't exist.

[@StarShipGalactica]

This is great advice. I'm working on a scifi/outer space type project as background info/texture for the main story. I LOVE the bit about the goverment. You can get contrived with that

[@rufusmay9615]

@@xoso599 You claimed "that's what government is for" and "The most insane things in our world are the products of government regulation making the viable and dominate economic activity and methods illegal". While it's true that government regulation can be that, it's also true that can happen without it and regulation can encourage rational behaviour rather than discouraging it. Simple examples would be climate change, the NFT market, and crimes like theft.

[@5BBassist4Christ]

I tend to way overthink the worldbuilding of my book, but I still agree with tip #1 whole-heartedly. Although I wrote an entire math system for the elves, I intentionally do not say how the humans got to the world or where they came from. Although I describe the different mythologies, I never definitely say one is right. I have different characters present their arguments, and some of the characters just deny blatant history, and although the story sheds special favor on the mc's religion as it takes his perspective, it is never intending to say, "Yes, he is right in all of his beliefs." I think mystery is what made Baba Fett so popular in Star Wars. It gives us opportunity to imagine and fill in the gaps for ourselves, and maybe even debate with other people. Heck, I have a whole head-cannon of how Jon-Jon accompanied Iroh on his quest to find the last dragon after his son died. I have a whole head-cannon on what side of the Civil War the Dragonborn sided with, and how he then used that position to unite Skyrim and the rest of the old empire to fight against the Thamor. This is what people want to do in a story; and this is what I want readers to do in my book.

[@Bayesic]

10:32 "In most cases you should not be trying to write a guide book that objectively describes your world. You are writing about a character's subjective experience of that world." I think this applies to Sci-Fi as well and is why I had such a problem with the Three Body Problem trilogy, and *especially* Death's End. There are pages upon pages upon pages of "This happened, and then this happened and then this happened which caused this nation to respond like this and then they did this" and it's like man I don't care about any of this because I'm not seeing how this impacts our characters in any way whatsoever.

[@yassinemiri3555]

This video is just awesome ! (and very helpful) Thank you Jed !

[@Jed_Herne]

Glad to hear it!

[@ScarabicEnterprises]

Really insightful video, I really appreciate the input and it has sparked a few new ideas for me. Parallel Worldbuilding: The interesting thing about this, is that the rules work differently depending on the kind of book. I do agree that there should be a link between different aspects of the lore, but it's not always necessary as context is very important. I am in the middle of creating a TTRPG, in which, when people play the game, they have ALL the lore available to them through the handbook, but are able to pick and choose what they wish to include in their sessions. They can take the game mechanics and ignore the lore, or use the lore and go with a different set of mechanics, either way, the Game Master and players get to create their own world using the TTRPG as a base. However, if creating a story that isn't interactive, I agree that leaving in a lot of mystery (especially to start with) is an incredible tool for worldbuilding. Allowing the readers to connect with the characters of the story and discover their relationships and interactions with the world, sprinkling in lore here and there along the way, keeps a reader's attention. The same can be said when it comes to being a dungeon master / game master, as boring the players with lore dump won't make for a good experience. Readers or players need to have food for imagination and should be blown away with the twists and turns with a story that unravels over time.

[@BW022]

One good way to avoid "filling every gap", "parallel world building", and "boring info dumps" is to having initial chapters with isolated action or events. If you start your story with a short chapter on say a mage involved in a fight or conflict... you can skip all the world building and info dumps and just focus on the character and magic. Readers will be so engaged in the story and magic, they won't care if the explanation isn't complete and there is no context to the greater world. Chapter 1: A mysterious mage outside an inn suddenly consuming gems and using magic to ambush a courier is fine. Chapter 2: A noble lady overhearing how her father's position is in peril as the courier he sent off never returned and was carrying a secret which could ruin their household. Now you can work in local politics at the nobility level while ignoring magic (already established) or the history of the place. Again we don't care immediately about everything else, we're just worried for her over he house's issues. etc. The fact you don't know everything at every step is a bonus. It leaves more to discover.

[@katsandall3673]

I know so much about my world building idea's that is unlikely I will make a mistake when writing about it. It's a shame most of it won't be mentioned in the novel as I don't want to info dump.

[@machonacho91]

That's not a bad thing, mind you. It's great you know so much about your own world building, since it will make for organic and natural feeling writing and progression. Knowing that much is way more beneficial for you during the writing process, which in turn is beneficial for the reader to feel immersed but not overwhelmed. Most readers can infer enough information without being told directly :)

[@StarShipGalactica]

TACTICAL inconsistency? Sign me the hell up I'm all about inconsistancy. in fact, Inconsistancy is my middle name. Inconsistancy is the basis on which my entire being resides on.

[@davidcashin1894]

Love that you mentioned "Logistics". For me this is a huge world killer. To the point that I often have to make the decision to consciously ignore authors mistakes. Hunger games is horrific in it's misunderstanding of logistics, many sci fi stories have no concept of the industrial base required for technology. Even really excellent authors like Tolkien (are there any farms and farmers outside of the Shire?) and Azimov (mid 20th cent obsession with atomic energy) . And let's not get started on "hard magic" systems suggesting they are based in science when they totally ignore the conservation of energy. Finally, this is mostly a Hollywood thing, the misunderstanding of warfare and weapons.

[@naomistarlight6178]

Well, I think the Hunger Games logistics not making sense is on purpose. The Capitol controls the Districts like the British Empire once ruled colonies. Colonies were once reduced to a single commodity they were instructed to make for export to Britain at the expense of their own internal benefit/welfare/economy. That's what is being criticized by the Capitol being the bad guys.

[@EpicArtNerd]

THANKS FOR THE VIDEO! ive been struggling withworld building so this is really helpful!

[@Ninjastyle124]

Thank you for your point about Objective Descriptions; I've always been told that my writing feels detached and dry when describing things, as if in-between character dialog there's just a third voice saying "Mount Doom in the Evil Bad Shadowlands exists over there. It is evil and gloomy and doomy and shadowy. It is the place of the great war where Good Guy McGoodguy killed the Demon Lord," as if I were dumping a wikipedia article in-between character interactions. I never really thought about describing things from the characters' perspective or only describe what the characters would care about or know.

[@davidioanhedges]

It wasn't just that they revered the past, but that it was ingrained in the Roman people that they utterly detested Kings, the kings in question were not Roman but ruled the Romans, and were the worst kind of kings (at least according to the Romans) The last was Lucius Tarquinius Superbus - Tarquin the Proud, who gained the throne by murdering his wife, brother and predecessor

[@ComicsOdyssey]

As a reader I prefer cultural monoliths with some exceptions because it makes the exceptions feel …exceptional! I want the Ferengi to be greedy profit motivated mysoginists so that the stories about those who buck the mainstream feel significant.

[@ivarsild]

So... I do not know thing about the writer, but he still teaches here. What a bold man?!

[@naomistarlight6178]

One thing people don't often do well with logistics in modern fantasy settings, is they act like mass production was a thing in the middle ages. Remember it wasn't and clothes were expensive. Also transport was slower and so people ate locally growing produce, and made clothes out of mostly local materials.

[@luistarlarry8729]

0:50 So true. Wow. Not even a minute into the video and Jed is already spitting facts. I am a huge fan of the fantasy and lore in the Dragon Age video game franchise. Their latest entry, Dragon Age: The Veilguard, is a good example of amateur writers feeling tempted to explain everything. They destroyed the fascination I had for their lore when they revealed the history behind the major religion in their universe, the blight (something I was really hooked by), lyrium etc. I enjoyed the version I imagined in my head a lot more than what they revealed. Their explanations ruined the fantasy for me. Now I have very little left to wonder about since I now know every major pillar in that universe is probably caused by an elf who toyed with power ages ago. Where is the fun in that? This revelation was unnecessary and has also made previous heroic characters in their franchise look like fools for believing and even dying for that religion they have now casually destroyed. Not to talk about the modern day western norms written into a medieval fantasy. It's all very immersion breaking. Your tips are really eye-openers, especially for an aspiring writer like myself. Thank you.

[@jesustyronechrist2330]

I think listening to Tolkien and his hatred for allegory fixes A LOT of these issues lmao. I too am a fan of Dragon Age and Veilguard was clearly written by ChatGPT in many parts. Like, take a shot everytime they say "weird". It's like in every convo almost. Not "strange" or "odd" that would fit the fantasy setting better. "Weird". It took me out of the immersion every single time it happened because I started to notice it.

[@777gpower]

11:31 you can achieve near objective descriptions if you have enough perspective characters visiting a common area. 3 blind men see a wall, a tree, and a snake- 10 blind men might be able to put together that it’s an elephant.

[@logannichols5848]

This is very reassuring. I have missed all of these. I do keep a second document going that explains things in a more encyclopedic method and is much more expensive.

[@benjystrauss2524]

My favorite example of bad logistics is the Kaminoans from Star Wars's Bad Batch. There is no reason why they wouldn't back up Jango's DNA. Not only is DNA everywhere, but it can be digitized, and probably needs to be so for the cloning process. As a bio-informatitian, this broke the immersion for me.

[@smokinggnu6584]

You know, i usually skip over sponsor bits, but gawddajm, i want that book! I can't afford that book by any stretch of the imagination, but i *really* want it!

[@Midori_Seabreeze]

That cultural monoliths is such a big one. Some might try and fix it with a token character who thinks differently. I know this is a world-building video, I just hope other viewers heard the plural “warriors” Jed used and not “oh, I need to make my MC fighting against the norm of their culture.” Many people think differently essentially, not only the MC.

[@BookofAnswersYT]

I have world builders disease it’s not contagious unfortunately but it is however fatal. Prognosis is long but I’ll probably die with books in the mail indent on getting new ideas for the last finishing touches for my posthumous novel

[@naomistarlight6178]

I actually think an "oops all world building" series could be entertaining if it's presented as a fictional guidebook or encyclopedia about a world that doesn't exist.

[@termsandapong7094]

Mistake #0 is using AI instead of hiring an artist to make a thumbnail.

[@spiffywolf2850]

Could you do a video on how to make good capitols in fantasy?

[@adog733]

I’m definitely guilty of that info dump. I remember the first stories I posted online, every chance I got I introduced a new character that could have been shown later and had nothing to do with the current situation. Then I wrote their entire life story because I wanted to show off all my characters.

[@venihiam1591]

The library of Congress casually appearing in this video was crazy 😧. I'd ik wrong please do correct me but I'm almost certain that's the library shown

[@Jed_Herne]

It's the State Library of Victoria (in Australia) - my 2nd favourite library in the world My #1 fave is the Library of Congress - which the Vic library absolutely steals from :)

[@dexterdix8766]

Well reasoned! A very enjoyable video.

[@Mortyrian]

very well thought out thank you.

[@Mulletmanalive]

“Don’t make your cultures monoliths,” is great advice. On the other hand, don’t let this advice twist it into the situation that Hollywood has arrived at, where every civilisation is the same because that’s how writing works…:p

[@naomistarlight6178]

I think it's fine to give a civilization or group of people a couple of values they share, but also it's important to show that different people buy into their culture's main values to varying degrees and also have their own selfish motivations. Like I can say, "exaltians value trade and commerce" but it would be weird to take that to such extremes that no one is a warrior or any profession besides a merchant. And having one value be adhered to that much also breaks the logistics rule. Like the Dothraki being so all about being mounted warriors that they don't have sheep or cattle or edible animals besides horses, doesn't make a whole lot of sense. The Mongols did have cattle.

[@WritingAdviceUA]

Yesterday bought Across the broken stars. I really like tension there, Leon constantly gets new challenges and dilemmas. Chapter 4 has a vibe of scene from Inglorious bastards where Landa interrogates french Farmer

[@lordfabulous6198]

Most of these aren't an issue for me as a new writer, and I think that's partly because they are the very reason I don't read a lot of books: excessive detail. My writing style is strictly "show, don't tell" to such an extent that the lore is rarely explained directly. You just learn as the characters go about their day or while on missions, finding something new in each scene. The intention is to immerse the reader and make them feel actively involved in unraveling the story's details (but not to the extent that they end up lost). The main weakness was separating my main characters and taking them on individualized journeys for their own subplot to expand the scope of the world, refine their character arcs, and building the plot. While the intention of doing that is great, being a new writer, it's overwhelming.

[@Notorious_Taco]

New vid for my world 🔥🔥🔥

[@michaelwoodhams7866]

Two examples of famous literary worlds sprung to mind as making these mistakes: 6 Static worlds and 8 Cultural monoliths: David Eddings, The Belgariad. Each nation has its 'hat': merchants, warriors, pseudo-Romans, etc. Over four thousand years, one nation has been destroyed and one created. The nature of each of these nations has not changed during this time. 4 Poor logistics: Mervyn Peake, the Titus Groan books. A fascinating isolated society, but *nobody grows any food*.

[@Friedrichsen]

Very useful even for other genres or writing in general 👍

[@plague9910]

I think an interesting concept as part of workdbilding can be a something that was before gods, eldritch beings and all of that insanely powerful creatures, and will be after them. Some kind of force of nature like death, or time, or order and chaos. And interesting concept can also be giving that something a personification. Some kind of body, like Tom Bombardil was a personification of the nature itself (at least in my opinion)

[@brantjustilian3791]

The magic system in the first two books I already publish, A Strange New World and A Strange New Visitor, uses a magic system based around memories.

[@Ghostwolf65029]

I found that givung them a 1/10 of the gold that is stated in any of the supplements works best for me. My players are so excited when they get a few gold, because they're so used to copper and silver.

[@FatisDonut]

Though I haven't even written enough to make any of these mistakes... I have a sneaking suspicion that mistake #6 will be a massive future headache! My world is very, very large- and it just so happens to be a Xianxia where characters live for notoriously long periods of time. So just by imagining how much work there is to be done I'm... 😭😭😭 -I desperately need to master the art of avoiding #1 and #9 ASAP.

[@jesustyronechrist2330]

Here's a question: What do you actually do with the concept of living long? I see this all the time and 8/10 it seems people are adding long-lifed races etc. because "it's cool". It's like the idea of seeing big ass numbers as people's ages scams us into thinking "oh this person will have so much wisdom despite looking like a 20-year-old." and they literally have 0 and act like any 20-year-old.

[@lucas_girardi]

4:29 Loved it! That's it!

[@sybro9786]

Excellent video

[@herosupport1606]

trapped in present norms is a sin and I return those books if I can. I want to escape from the world not get dragged back into it. I returned a book because the author had a character load 4 rounds into the chamber of a hunting rifle. btw you can only put one round in a chamber at a time.

[@Vi-percane]

Hey Jed. I've recently gotten back into writing and I've literally been binging some of your videos. Anyway I was wondering about your opinion on 1st and 3rd person writing, I would love to see a video on it sometime if there isn't already. Thanks😁

[@n00bplayer72]

Point 3 makes me think of Dragon Age: Veilguard. Classic High-Fantasy setting, but the writers could only see it from a modern viewpoint: Modern jargon and vernacular; modern sarcastic, quippy dialogue; and strange things like a pirate guild that doesn't actually steal or pillage???

[@louc.6735]

One of my techniques is writing really stupid infodumps as I'm writing a story and then cutting them out in later drafts.

[@spacerunner357]

I like having fun with my stories and also talking about the history a bitish and environment

[@briankidd340]

Dude, it's freaking me out. Any time I let my eyes relax a little, your eyes weirdly fill with fire. Spooky

[@DylonCanterberry]

So I’m just wondering if a story can have 2 inviting incidents? The first one meant to tear the protagonist down, establishing the politics and characters in his home village while showing the development of his trauma, and the second is meant to get him started on his journey of growth. I’m hoping to tell 2 stories inside of one, the main focus being the protagonist but also telling the story of the world and using world building to add to the protagonists story.