Jennifer Crumbley demands new trial | Motion Hearing

[@lizzthatvegan1207]

I am a liberal I had a very hard time with the parents being charged. It made no sense to me. How can he be charged as an adult AND the parents be responsible? This was one of the worst charging decisions I've seen. And the fact that the jury found then guilty? Mind-blowing 🤯 aren't we supposed to be responsible for our own individual choices in this country?

[@darrenlocke5627]

@@lizzthatvegan1207 I understand your point. However, there are a lot of people in prison who didn't do the crime, but had Knowledge, planned or assisted in some way. The parents provide a gun, the kid had issue they knew about and they didn't do anything about it.

[@lizzthatvegan1207]

@darrenlocke5627 I get what your saying but they parents didn't hand him the gun and say have a good day at school honey. There was, imo, inadequate proof that they were even negligent with the firearm. They weren't required by law to lock up their firearms so what law was broken? And I could maybe kind of see your point of their son was charged as a minor but the second they charged him as an adult, he became 100% responsible for his choice. At least that's how I see it.

[@darrenlocke5627]

@ good debate, I am not 100% sure if that was some WI thing. But I do know parents have been held accountable in the past mostly around underage drinking issues. I guess we wait and see

[@lizzthatvegan1207]

@@darrenlocke5627 criminally responsible or civilly responsible? I was unaware parents could be held criminally responsible for a minor doing something the parents aren't aware of. If the parents hand them drink after drink that's one thing but if they don't know it seems like a stretch to me. But every charge depends on the facts of the case so I guess I can see a scenario where that could be appropriate. I don't know. I'm a big fan of personal responsibility. I think parents being held criminally responsible for a teenagers actions is a slippery slope.

[@kaiserwilhelm1938]

Something is horribly wrong with this case: -child, who is a minor, is charged as an adult for muder -parents are also charged based on the fact they failed to supervise their minor child/were accomplices to the crime Beyond that, for the last ~10 years the school was in custody of the child for the vast majority of the child's life and had credible, and actionable evidence to prevent the shooting.

[@4spikers]

She is a hostile judge!! and is being a total C U Next Tuesday!... This attorney is so good and he is correct in his motion to demand a new trial.

[@l.a.w.79]

On the rewatch crew here and man on man, I have so much to say, but this space forces me to be brief. The defense attorney hit the nail on the head. And the judge is NOT impartial. She can’t reason her way out of a trash bag.

[@RSCSBIB]

The judge is gaslighting! Just like the nonsense about them being a flight risk because they were hiding even though the attorney was trying to negotiate a surrender.

[@daniellem905]

What a mess of a hearing.

[@Karalambia]

Schools are vigilant about kids attendance. Had the Crumbleys said that they were taking him home. I think the school would have pressed for him to stay. Parents are aware of schools stance on this and you are under pressure all the time when dealing with school so you would likely not offer to take your child home

[@greenbeagle13]

Wow, this poor guy is trying to climb a greased pole. This Judge is horrible - she doesn't even want to hear this. 😒😒

[@sonastysorude]

At trial, the judge often responded to defense by insisting she’d done soooo much research and is sooo familiar with case law on X issue… it came off as very defensive. If anyone working in a job that requires specialized knowledge (electrician, doctor, lab tech, car mechanic etc etc etc…) responded to inquiries with “trust me bro I know it all,” I’d be highly suspect. The [judge] dost protest too much, methinks.

[@julie5845]

33:28 she seems unnecessarily hostile. I don’t really understand the point of having to argue an appeal to the trial judge that already decided the defendant was guilty. It seems like a waste of resources to change a judge’s already made up mind

[@tlltallman6353]

You all have got to like, if you watch like the video, it’s super easy way to support Uncivil at no cost to you!

[@MrAmc1291]

Oh God this judge is horrible. She's so weak even during the original trial.

[@RSCSBIB]

She’s unbelievably biased… does she realize it?

[@sonastysorude]

UhHhHh…. Is this judge seriously saying the defendant can’t argue that the prosecution intentionally violated discovery rules because it’s an attack on the character of the prosecutor??? (35:34 - 36:53) . Call me crazy but I think she may be taking whatever case she quotes waaaay out of context

[@nannybannany]

They didn't charge the school but wasn't one of the security personnel charged and found innocent? I remember watching that trial but maybe it was a different case? EDIT: I looked it up and I am thinking of the Parkland with Nicolas Cruz. Ethan absolutely was properly found guilty. I am incredibly uncomfortable holding the parents responsible given these circumstances.

[@amyfay5791]

How does the law work if someone thought someone was dangerous but didn’t report it and something happened? Like if you knew someone was driving drunk or something like that? This one was difficult for me. I do think parents should start being held responsible for bad parenting. Just expecting a screen and school to raise their kids.

[@RSCSBIB]

We blame the driver. We don’t blame the car and we don’t blame their friends who saw them driving it.

[@amyfay5791]

@ but can there be shared blame in a scenario like that? Legally.

[@Bama_Rose]

@@amyfay5791Unfortunately YES, say the driver was at a bar and the bartender LET THE DRIVER LEAVE, the bartender can be held responsible. The bartender has a responsibility to deny service and take their keys, IF they could tell the person was legally drunk. (There’s more to it, that’s the simple answer though.) I think the parents should be held responsible in some way. BUT there is ALOT more to all of this than came in due to Ethan not being able to take the stand and vice versa something’s came in that shouldn’t have. It was a catch 22 so to speak. I personally think 15yrs is too long, as it’s serving no purpose. I heard a lot say they would NEVER do what she did. However, unless someone has been in that actual spot, they never know what one would do in reality.

[@amyfay5791]

@ such a tragedy for all. The only thing that led me to agree guilty was the fact they knew he was capable of it and in the short time that day knew he had possible access and desire to do it. The meeting with the picture and her comments to coworkers and then the text “don’t do it” before she knew what had actually happened are what pushed me to think guilty. As far as sentencing idk what is “fair” or “just”. I’m angered to learn how awful they were at loving and parenting him but many have suffered worse and did not do what he did. This case is another that weighs me down Inside.

[@amyfay5791]

I appreciate the replies! Wish I could make the lives more often because I aways have so many questions and comments. I’m not that smart and sometimes it’s hard to understand it all.

[@cherylrevell3081]

Look, I get it about the problems with this case, but I just don't have it in me to give that woman a pass. The prosecution screwed up IMO by using the school personnel against the mom, the same people that contributed to that tragedy, but she and the father failed their mission as parents and look what happened. I just don't have sympathy for her actions & omissions. Nor do I give any sort of pass to the school. Since when do you get an alarming report, shrug when the parent waffles about being too busy and send the student back to class. Sure, the prosecution fowled it by charging the teen as adult and then charged her incorrectly (maybe). But we have a society that's had it hell and back with school pew-pews, so prosecutors think they're doing right by the public by charging parents too. They're not entirely wrong, Jennifer was irresponsible - fact. But schools are getting away with murder, literally! By negligence while claiming immunity protections, explaining away why they can't, etc, ad nauseum! My county spent hundreds of thousands on security for the Board officers, while complaining they lacked funds for school security. Imagine that? We're pushing them for an audit they've failed to do for years. I have choice questions for that school official who failed to have that teen's backpack searched. Legal problem? Ever hear of a school resource officer?

[@shanedaley6236]

I'm not disagreeing with you she vary well may be guilty with her husband but then the state also charges the 15 year old as a adult and of course the school should have been charged at least in civil by the other families

[@RSCSBIB]

The judge is clearly biased in favor of the prosecution and has been throughout the entire case. She is gaslighting for the prosecution and has been since reasonable bail was denied. This is really sad.

[@grolaw]

The chain of causation is not in question when a toddler / incompetent person obtains a parent’s loaded firearm and discharges the weapon destroying the life of an innocent person. In this case the child was provided with the firearm by his parents. The child has a long history of psychological disorders that, by law, would have prevented him from buying, owning, and using a firearm. The law prohibits minors owning a handgun. But for the gift of the firearm by the parents to their psychologically impaired minor son the murders would not have occurred.

[@RSCSBIB]

It’s not a child in the eyes of the law, it’s an adult.