Why it's so hard to hover an FPV racing drone

[@AA-kr6cx]

This made me feel much better, I have been able to fly around pretty well. But I found a tutorial to learning to fly and lesson 1 was hovering with some drills and I barely was able to do that, and I thought I just overall sucked haha. Thank you for explaining ground effect and everything in this video!

[@johnk8825]

Wow Liftoff Joshua has more hair and green grass and leaves. Glad you're doing this, it will help a lot of new pilots.

[@dondupuis5524]

Josh, I have been using your land in lift off. Thank god you dont have to replace all the window and hole in the roof I made for you with lift off. :)

[@Dorff_Meister]

Great discussion. I'm learning Acro in sims (to fly my Mobula8, which I've taken out twice and will again this weekend) and am loving it. I started in DRL and Velocidrone and when I was starting to get the hang of it and getting frustrated with the map sizes, I treated myself to Tryp. I absolutely love Tryp. The big, diverse maps have given me lots to look at and fly around and through. I was originally flying with 20 degrees, but moved to 40 degrees last night. I feel like 40 has given me a greater speed range (and/or I'm just getting better). I've been spending 30-60+ minutes a day in the sim and I see improvements every day.

[@djilly75]

this is good video explaining how quads fly. too many people who fly still don't understand. good job Joshua

[@pro2stinger426]

2:05 quadcopters fly because of the 3rd law of Newton. `Every action has an equal and opposite reaction`. When you push the air molecules down with 100N you will also receive 100N in the opposite direction

[@scottbattaglia8595]

"Ratcheting stick" 😂 is that the technical term i should look up not an anlog stick as compared to a controller with a digital stick.....this is not a negative, thank you for making the hobby far more easily approachable. Your videos got my 9 year old nephew into the hobby. Its been funny having something i love so much that my nephew is interested in. 👍🏼😁

[@professorb3744]

OMG! you got me.... I was like "what kind of camera is he using? Everything looks so green and vibrant! Almost digital" lol

[@leonie9248]

The "Uncrashed" simulator is pretty awesome too. Unreal Engine graphics - just wow.

[@oceano271]

You know you're the bomb when you get your own land in a game 🎮

[@AddictedQuadroner]

That Roma F5 is missing some parts from the camera cage. Looks like it's been through some testing lately :)

[@peppedetto]

my god you have video for everything, thank's joshua Bardwell , you help me a lot also with crossfire. thanks , your italian follower

[@dronefeverpty9594]

You are such a nice mentor, i just bought Liftoff because of your guidance and Rotor Riot history, new on the fpv world, but can you share your rates if is possible?

[@Gosuminer]

First rule of the Rates Club: You don't talk about your rates. Jokes aside, someone other's rates will almost never help you getting a stick feel you like. I would suggest starting with 800 deg/s on all axis, flying 20 packs (over several sessions), doing some changes, rinse, repeat. Rates are strictly personal preference. Some freestylers fly 1200 deg/s, some racers 400 deg/s, some have very high expo (not necessarily the value called "expo" but something that makes the sticks less sensitive in near the center) some use linear rates.

[@dronefeverpty9594]

​@@Gosuminer oh! thanks a lot for your explanation and advice, i will do that starting today, im on baby steps on this FPV world at this moment, highly appreciate it!

[@ASR_385]

More sound effects to add to the list. Really want to see a JB edition of Open TX sounds/narrations for my Tx16s

[@KatrinaLeFaye]

Wow, thank you this have been having similar problem in another sim.

[@janbolinas9982]

just my opinion, to make hovering easy, i pump the throttle mid rate to 66 or 77, so that im hovering at 20-30% stick

[@nxu5107]

Thamnks Joshua, You break this down so well. I learnt something today.

[@0xeb-]

I was wondering if I suck or that is the nature of this. Thanks for clarifying.

[@brandonnorris1026]

Wait til iNav starts supporting more boards than we get pos hold alt hold. I am sure there is a CLI way to go about doing this.

[@hackerssuck589]

doooood , i love your vids :) and your sound effects :P

[@atkatsom8745]

Such beautiful property Joshua 👏💚

[@genefoxgreenmountaindroning]

Thank you Josh for the great advice

[@leopoldomolina1763]

I thought the propellers effect was related to air pressure above and underneath each propeller and not with pushing down air particles

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Those are the same thing.

[@snarkyboojum]

Liked as soon as Josh crashed. Funny guy :D

[@dr07828]

So hovering an FPV drone in 3rd person? Much easier than in the google. All this stuff you talked about is valid, except that there is a new issue when you put the goggle on. Camera Angle. The biggest thing to overcome is getting used to your camera angle. It's obviously easier to do with a low angle. But even a slight angle has a drastic effect on your perception and flying. If you look straight forward and level, your going to be moving and going to have to increase thrust. When I started out this was a huge hurtle for not only hovering, but also landing. I had quite a few 5 foot or better disarms. BEEP............ THUD! What I did in the beginning, I used a reference point. My self. I would launch my quad pointing at me. Made a mental note of it. Hovered a bit. Took off. Landed. This way I could build a gauge in my head of where and how the quad was in space based on my self in the cam. When I cam in for a landing using this, I was able to very quickly set the quad down softly on the ground. However, general flight and stick time, you end up just getting to the point where you can hover and land in the goggle without even thinking. As you practice, you learn. Things get easier. Maneuvering the quad starts to get more effortless. Spaces which seemed small tend to get bigger. As in, a gap you thought was really tight, as you practice becomes less tight and more open. Initially it was hard to fly in tight closed in area's, and now it doesn't matter. I never started out with a Sim. Just built my quad, and flew it in Airmode from the start. Of course I slammed into my own head at like 40 MPH because I got cocky and thought I could buzz past my self, but using a sim has helped later on. It's stick time.

[@rawfpv1207]

i love how the devs have given the pilot a stevia wonder head bobble too

[@haydenpaulwoodger3562]

Thanks, I couldn't figure this one out.

[@Blakeaholics]

Is that supposed to be Le Drib in Liftoff? If so they squished him lol

[@TheHotrod03]

He looks like he is drunk and trying to fly.... 5:00

[@kantony6694]

Was just practicing my hovering a few hrs before I saw this, great minds think alike lol

[@DurfSUN]

Thnx! You're very helpful, it's appreciated

[@MikeKinney8675]

I learned something today, for sure

[@nomario]

I'm wonder that the simulator has effect of airmode?

[@VoltageLP]

Hovering is easy Rotating with the left stick while maintaining altitude is hard

[@CyberWallX]

really cool video as usual, only the autogenerated subtitles seem to be on acid

[@AmerikaiEletemValojaban]

A 3D version of your property!!!!!!!!!!!! That's FUCKING COOL!!!!!! (This comment was written sober)

[@dracko9971]

Is there any option to minimize the ground effect, because i think my drone to much bounce, the ground effect to responsive after it hit the ground it can lift up around 1 meter height

[@PkwyDrive13]

Looks like... Drib in the simulator. 😂 I bet he has eyeliner on under those goggles

[@kdeclinetostatendeclinetos6707]

For me the biggest problem with hovering in one place at one altitude is fact that I cant see the ground, because camera is tilt up for speed flying.

[@dana2750]

Josh or anyone who may know, does the DJI transmitter that comes in the FPV bundle work with the Lift Off simulator?

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Yes it does.

[@jschlumpberger2594]

I dig the facial hair, Joshua!

[@MrExel47]

Hi Joshua. Great video for a beginner like me. I don´t want to invest in all the stuff just jet. Can you recommend a cheap controller for practicing in the sim? Later on I´d like to fly a cinewhoop for film making. I´m not going for hardcore acro or racing. Thanks in advance!

[@PianoManPaul]

A lost Cetus X Quad (from the kit), a 6S GEPRC Cinebot 30 (elrc/nebula) that crashed and ruptured the lipo battery, frying the AIO and 1 motor ($250 CDN repair bill - assuming the nebula cam system is still intact) - if it got up to $1000 wasted I swore I was going to quit fpv entirely and go back to my good ol' Air 2S - and NOOOW I see this video!! Hovering is the worst ... but every hour in this Liftoff, I seem to get more of a hang of it. This may turn into "FUN", rather than "COMPLETE F%*&ING NIGHTMARE" after all!

[@Braincho]

Hi, nice videos! How do you bring up those stick position pointers at the bottom of the screen? is it part of Liftoff or its separate app? Also i wanted to ask: my drone is gliding one direction after turn, and i do turn with both sticks9 yaw, roll, then pitch with a bit more throttle, but it still want to kick me out of the turn like centrifugal force pushing. Any advice please? Or any discord or other group when i can ask some fellows for a bit of help. I'm pretty new to this. Thanks!

[@stussykim]

coz lighter drone flies faster?

[@alloutofdonuts3998]

This is cool but I would still feel kinda weird about flying at your house without permission lol!

[@zhangjohh1954]

Can you tell me how to leveling without watch the level indicator ? I see lots pilot no need the level indicator, but they hover very well

[@JoshuaBardwell]

It's just practice. Look at what direction the quad is moving and counteract it with the stick.

[@zhangjohh1954]

@@JoshuaBardwell ok, I've to play harder :D thx

[@DanFliesDrones]

Im pretty sure that Im in love with you at this point 😅

[@fawkeyes5111]

since i'm in the fpv-hobby i read about "how hard it is to hover". i'm no good pilot but hovering was never hard at all. neither los nor fpv-style. what am i missing here?

[@its_Savian]

Feels weird when I'm flying to JB house in liftoff feels like I'm a intuther! 😂

[@jandomingo9806]

I like the ratchet feel.. just the smallest amount.

[@dittyfpv7615]

SOMEBODY ADD THE SOUNDS TO RHE DRONE SOUNDS PLAYLIST

[@davidrgilson]

Having a physics background helped me when I was learning to fly, as I understood the idea of "cosine loss".

[@wudz_fpv]

You need 💎🙌 to maintain throttle control lol

[@potatopilot16]

Haha YES

[@StillIt]

I mean just hold right?

[@dansmith9406]

HODL

[@KiloWattPlays]

That's why flying below zero is always a challenge

[@MasterApeFPV]

Hodl the throttle like your $GME ! Or ask other apes to help

[@yakoholic3735]

Guess who is going to have the coolest dad at career day.

[@WinstonSmith1984]

If I ever have to live in a pod, and "own nothing and be happy", then at least I can play Liftoff and pretend I'm Joshua Bardwell from 2021 and before.

[@mapolinski]

But you won't own a computer or a controller so you won't be able to play, sorry.

[@ssql]

@@mapolinski r/whoosh

[@hackwise]

I want to maintain my throttle throttled badly

[@ranudar5666]

Good instructions and explanations. I trained a lot by hovering line of sight, then "walking the drone", then flying a lot in the sim FPV. I also had the impression that that flying simple race courses in a simulator after the initial stages is a good way to practice because you are somewhat forced to fly first this turn, then that turn and so on. In the beginning you crash maybe 30 times after the first gate, then you manage two gates, then more and more, then a whole lap for the first time (yayyy!), then you shout out because you crash 100 times just before finishing the third round (and the race) and then you manage your first recorded finishing time (congratulations! :-)).

[@johnsmithe4656]

This Liftoff level (Bardwell's Yard) is how I found JB. After I flew around it a few times I was like "Who's this Bardwell guy? And why does he get his own map?" I get it now. Great map too. Small but effective. Something poetic about that.

[@neonoir__]

Hardest part of this is not being able to see forward. I have flown for 1.5 years and still can barely do this in fpv. If you need to hover for safety or something and can't land, just go a bit higher and do little dives to see down. Or you can circle

[@juliansjames]

Back in 1994 I started flying RC helis. I blew a fortune on spares and repairs. Thankfully the CSM flight sim arrived before I threw the towel in and within an hour of firing it up, I was hovering (although nose in would take considerably more time to master). As Joshua says, honing your skills on a sim is one of the most prudent financial decisions you'll ever make! And the RC heli / quad skillset transfers directly to flying full size helis too. 😉

[@DavidBauer38]

8:52 The Liftoff Bardwell house even has the missing rail on the fence!!! Wut?!?!?!

[@jwanda10]

without my contacts i actually couldn’t tell you weren’t flying outside.

[@imothy]

eventually google earth will have everybody's house mapped out so we can fly FPV

[@fpvcruzer]

Thanks so much for this video! I am just learning to fly acro and look forward to using your drill to be able to fly more smoothly and with better control. Thanks for taking the time to help us newbies, I really appreciate your clear explanations!

[@Arek_R.]

I'm a noob and I can go thru some of the race tracks in lifhtoff 100kmh but cant do it slow hover 5kmh lol

[@acrocheezefpv]

you should do #3Packsaday liftoff edition. thatd be dope

[@SlattFpv]

I just made a video about throttle control as well ! Mines assuming your alittle more advanced then this but im sure it will help !

[@moritzeinsele7268]

Hey Jb my radiomaster TX16S has some very wierd mulufunctions i have a video on my channel showing them. Please I really need help. I have to get flying again

[@AddictedQuadroner]

If this doesn't help you, nothing will: kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZoPZgnmXppKDnZo - I do believe you have either corrupt SD card (or defective, that's a possibility and it's quite common), or corrupt installed firmware. Find a new SD card, and follow Joshua's advice. In that video, he even used the same radio I believe.

[@moritzeinsele7268]

@@AddictedQuadroner I tried all of that and even swiched the SD card but still not working

[@xLUGUBRIOUSx]

Waiting on my first drone/nanowhoop to show up now. I appreciate you and your channel for helping me thus far. I already want to build a o3 3" to explore the neighborhood

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Good luck!

[@KiloWattPlays]

You forgot one tip, start with 0 camera angle!

[@kevins1552]

I dont think that's a good tip. 10 degrees or so is good, or else they get no roll controll while turning

[@KiloWattPlays]

@@kevins1552 sure, I went from sim to real on 0 the first day, and went about 20 ever since, but for in the sim first time I'd still advice 0, if there's any experience then skip that 0 yeah, for sure

[@slickheisenberg8208]

Is there a firmware that enables us to hover automatically? What would be required to add this feature?

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Inav would do that, with GPS and compass sensor.

[@RealAmayaKami]

Is there any fpv drones that can do freestyle right out of the box no bets flight or anything?

[@canadiangemstones7636]

Yep, buy a DJI.

[@grepboy]

Best way I learned to hover FPV in Acro is with a shovel. Stick the shovel in the ground about 20 feet away from another vertical object (like a tree or fence post), then hover directly in front of the shovel keeping your altitude constant and keeping the other object lined up directly behind the shovel.

[@cpt.mistavista517]

This is called using a parallax and its how I trained myself. Excellent technique for learning.

[@Nyancat703]

That shovel is going to have some dents lmao. Joke apart, that's a good idea, i'll be doing that.

[@jhughes2286]

Is that a digital replica of Drew?

[@DyeFamous]

No No No Joshua! The quad doesn’t fly because it shoves air molecules down into the ones below them! That’s a side effect! The blade creates a low pressure area above it, the atmospheric pressure below actually pushes up on the blade to try to equalize the pressure. It’s all Bernoulli. It happens on both sides of the blades, that’s why blades, wings, ect often are curved along their length, allowing the top surface to have slightly more length, and therefore slightly more area to create negative pressure along the top; IE Lift. Love your work bro! Couldn’t have gotten anywhere without you!

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Conservation of momentum is also a contributor to creation of lift. You can still generate lift with a flat fan blade that is not an airfoil and has no Bernoulli Effect.

[@SlanginDirt1]

Yup like flying at your house! You've taught me most of what I know about quadcopters,thanks. I bought liftoff through your link, hope it helps. Just started the sim yesterday. Thanks for all the tips! Really help

[@fpvrc9829]

Teaching my brother to fly, I told him.so many times, the reason you having trouble is because you too close to the ground, get it In the air before you start going all over the place..... he got it eventually....

[@IslandCreek]

Flying l.o.s as a newb is the worst advice imo.. I know because I took that advice and then since I have no idea what I was doing or then can tell which way is facing which past 15 ft.. got stuck in a tree.. imo l.o.s Flying should come secondary

[@HVM_fi]

Propeller is rotating wing and you forget the Bernoulli's principle part of the lift, ground effect rises pressure underside of the wing...

[@RyanTehPyro]

I hovered mine right into the side of my head. I think I need to round out the curves big time! And maybe clipping the top ends like training wheels.

[@gus8378]

I've found a good way to hover and fly slowly and precisely. I've set a switch to have Angle mode, very low rates, 10 degree tilt limit, 50% scaled throttle and max expo on it. It's almost perfect to maneuver it through tight spots and land it precisely. I'm able to take off and land it from my car's roof, and reach it through the sunroof. I wish betaflight had a good altitude hold mode, to use with a barometer. Then it would be perfect.

[@fourwallsphoto]

Newbie here would appreciate learning how to do this, esp getting one switch to do all this in mid flight

[@Anadrol88]

Excellent idea thanks !

[@MiniMicroFPV]

I recently started using Liftoff and I’ve been getting a kick out of virtually flying at your house! I must have learned to hover back in my RC heli days. Nose-in LOS felt like a big step!

[@robertdroner]

Me too, totally agree on nose in learning.

[@MCsCreations]

Fantastic tips, Joshua! Thanks a lot! 😃 Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊

[@russsmith9042]

And yes, Bardwell if it wasn’t for you wouldn’t be still trying to learn how to fly. I’ve got my FPV drone flight controller has your name on it. The quad was built by somebody years ago don’t know who but I don’t think it’s ever been flown but have all the information of what’s in it blah blah blah and I’m still stuck on wanting to fly instability mode versus acro, coming off of a DJI.! back to the quad though I got the box goggles and all that I have YET to get it in the air other than hovering around and then about 8 to 10 seconds in oh crap it’s out of control and hit my OH SHIT !Switch and come crashing to the ground, but not from very far up because I’m still just kind of hovering. I would like to go in the Beta flight and set it up a switch where I can at least have it in stability mode if I wanna fart around with that yes I know I should be learning on a trainer and to fly acro, and this is kind of creating bad habits, but the bad habits have already been created from DJI . But as of right now, I would like just to fly for a minute because I haven’t flown in a while because I got rid of the DJI and this is all I have and I haven’t been able to fly because I can’t fly acro I wanna fly in stability mode and I’ll slowly transition into acro at my pace. Any help from you or any of the greatly talented multi rotor, rotor riot, gang will be greatly appreciated. I’m 53 years old and I’m almost computer illiterate, but I’m trying, but still makes me slower than a turtle in the field of peanut butter at understanding this. Thanks Russ And by the way, your son is adorable. He’s probably already flying stability mode. He could probably teach me.

[@AnotherCG]

Not an issue with most dji drones. But of course they are slow AF compared to racing drones. I'm looking for a receipe of speedybee/betaflight that emulates position hold like a dji. Will, keep updating this comment as the video plays out. My questions are being answer as you go.

[@St3v3theWeave]

Mid-life child, here. Brand new to all of this. Been watching so much of yours and other's content. Just subscribed to you because of the shameless baby plug. "See this baby..."

[@kerrynmacdonald6407]

not that hard to hover

[@noisy_boi_fpv_3920]

Yip my thoughts

[@KiloWattPlays]

we're talking quads not vacuum cleaning 😁😜

[@JavisHD]

I think the idea is, when the newbies (including kiddos!) are struggling, it's important to acknowledge that these skills are difficult, and give them something small to work on.

[@kerrynmacdonald6407]

@@JavisHD yes i know but to me hovering is the easiest part in fpv quad flying

[@captainbritain6737]

First time you get your hands on an Fpv drone, yes it is difficult to hover especially with crap gear or coming from DJI or toy drones

[@SteveGergetz]

Misleading title. I thought I was going to learn something about how hard hovering is with a racing drone having something to do with the SPECIFICS of RACING drones...like large camera angles (which TOTALLY screws me up when hovering), powerful super-responsive motors, or something like that...something that is peculiar to racing drones. In fact, what was addressed in this video wasn't even specific to FPV drones, but rather all drones (minus altitude control). Instead all we really got was simply: "Why it's so hard to hover a drone" Just sayin'

[@TailSpinRCSpain]

What is Drew doing, set the dogs loose.

[@TimsDrones]

Quads fly via an equal and opposing Newtonian reaction to the quads action of accelerating air downward.

[@dondupuis5524]

The little one is why I am a patron, my wife feels you can not be making money” flying all those toys. Around “ouch” whilepatrion I am spending thousands crashing them. She says you look like a great dad, so your son should want for nothing, started at at $1, pation, my wife say I have to atleast buy him a Big Mac , so she pushed me to $5. A month. I see more expense coming, we need a code word when my wife walks in and And you can hide kid. 😳 just kidding about your boy but not abound our monthly membership. You are worth every buck I push you way. I think your cool and very honest, you doing awesome work. Well if you can’t tell sleeping pills kicking in. Night

[@500Driver]

I'll be "that guy" - your explanation of the aerodynamic forces is a little off. A propellor on an airplane creates thrust (to overcome drag) and airplane wings create lift (to overcome weight/gravity). Multirotors (easier to say than multipropellors) use propellers to create thrust and lift depending on the "tilt angle" of the aircraft (no tilt = 100% lifting force / 0 thrust, 90 degree tilt = 0 lifting force and 100% thrust). The lift force vector "points up" and the thrust vector "points laterally in the direction of travel) - you describe lift pointing down and thrust pointing opposite the direction of travel. I was a full-scale helicopter flight instructor and your description of the aerodynamic forces is what nearly 100% of students intuitively think at first. "Ground effect" is an especially confusing issue as well (airplanes and helicopters both experience ground effect). The effect only occurs about 1 to 1.5 "wingspans / rotor diameters" above the ground. I believe "ground effect" is fairly negligible for small multirotors but certainly trying to "hover in the bubble" is challenging and being a few feet above the ground in "cleaner / undisturbed air" makes hovering easier.

[@thaidenthach9806]

So what's the problem when you raise the throttle and instead of being leveled it pitches in random directions. even without touching the right stick ever.?

[@jjooyycc33]

Hi I trying to find mistake witch I have on my new meteor 65 it drifts back left after less than one minute fly time it means on begin it starts stable but after one min it starts to adding pitch back left dosent help to make it straight I need to compensate it util I reset by sticks( save reboot) on the end it is worst on my 5 inch this isnt in reciver I have all 1500 if I trim radio it just change time when it come in ... what it can make ? I have no idea (I tryed to change motors but it is new and if some spin less or more BF should compensate I think

[@ATN007]

They might have nailed Your property, but it that dude is You, they have been very kind to Your .... fur... weeeeeee! :P

[@Milan-Bozic]

Hi, why drone fly away with arm on? All setups are ok. I turn it on and drone fly up without my command. Thank you in advance.

[@DexterDavidDexterSD]

I spent 4 months practicing in the sim before my first real life flight. It took some time to get the hang of things after flying irl. Also, in the sim, you have nothing to lose but irl, you can end up in $100s in damages if you crash so I tend to be more careful. Anyway, my point is that learning in the sim was super worth it. I now dive mountains and do flips and rolls without thinking too much. I think I should start an fpv channel

[@Gosuminer]

This is one of the topics where theory is nice to know but does not help beginners at all. Because understanding all of this will not train your muscle memory and there is just not enough time to analyse the situation cognitively before you're crashing. So just get into the sim and train hovering. It won't work at first but you'll get there eventually. P.S. Liftoff's physics simulation is still ridiculously off. When did you see the last 5" quad that needs more than 30% throttle to hover? Sheesh!

[@adakalyoncu1913]

Guys hear me out, get a cheap 3 channel helicopter. It'll teach you throttle control. You can as well get a toy quad but make sure to get one without altitude hold. And try to fly it los in your living room. And try to hit gaps like between celing and door or under chairs and stuff, all los. Don't go fpv Don't use a tinywhoop, just try to fly slowly and controlledly almost like a mavic. Also get through gaps as slow as you can so quad has time to actually bounce up and down and go haywire and you have to use your sticks to correct it which will get you used to throttle control

[@Rocketman0407]

Is just cruising/hovering around in a FPV drone a lot harder than flying RC planes?