Vinnie Vincent OWED KISS money, never signed the contract

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Here is the interview : Vinnie Vincent - SATURDAY Atlanta Expo Interview - kzbin.info/www/bejne/gJLTlaGJn5yogrMsi=22fhMpXP7V2gmeLs If you want to read the contract, it's here - kisstimeline.com/timeline/vinnie-vincent-is-hired-as-new-guitarist-in-kiss/

[@SiberianHusky666]

Please. None of the principals involved have a shred of credibility. None. Zero. So believe the particular pathological liar(s) you want to believe.

[@johnhagan582]

You can't believe a word Gene Simmons ever says .if anything Kiss still owes Vinnie for filling Ace's shoes. Vincent was a phenomenal player and wrote some amazing guitar parts on their music while his time in the band

[@CrisisActorJonsiri]

I come from an Insurance family. I was a broker and worked at the company level. My dad had been a Specialty Lines Broker and had always told me, "If it is not written down, IT DIDN'T HAPPEN." Shredding is not the same a due diligence.

[@kawada1]

He pulled the same stunt with Carmine Appice a couple years earlier. History shows he would never relinquish control of his music under any circumstances no matter how it adversely affected his career.

[@DunmoresMovieMania]

Paul even tells a story about ringing Carmine to ask him about what Vinnie was like, and Carmine warned Paul not to get involved - but KISS were in a bind with an album and world tour scheduled, so they had to go with him.

[@jeffpotts6187]

Vinnie didn't shoot himself in the foot. He sawed off both legs instead...

[@dgenerated]

👍

[@FortessofShred]

I don't disagree, but I think he showed restraint in that interview: I'd have called them "Piss." I wouldn't be using their name 🤷🏻

[@antilaw9911]

I remember a kiss documentary where Gene said about Vinnie... he would literally hang himself while being offered the keys to the kingdom "

[@bb-gc2tx]

vinnie is a very odd self sabotaging person

[@dirtydave2691]

He really is a strange dude.

[@dgenerated]

The guy certainly knows how to shoot himself in the foot

[@CharlesScott-wo8dr]

Your just echoing what paul and Gene said.

[@lipantaza9758]

So he couldn't survive $550 while in the band, but when he left the band, he used KISS money to take a year off work, and travel the world, while having this family. They offered him four times as much before he took the year off, and $100k a year, he should have ran with that!

[@jonmccormick8683]

Band Members like V.V. are under retainer when not performing. -but being under retainer is sort of rare for most musicians.

[@grantorino2009]

Spot on!

[@TheTN24]

Yep and then blew through a massive contract with Chrysalis records that they in turn gave to Slaughter. Dude was his own worst enemy. Not to mention when the police went through his house in Smyrna he had dead dogs in his freezer. Just massive issue's.

[@Mike_D_5150]

Irresponsible. There is no way around it.

[@imagine9265]

VINCENT IS A FRUIT HE SELLS OLD GUITARS 🎸 CLEANS THEM UP AND SIGNS THEM FOR MONEY HE SUCKED !

[@tk75jo]

He didn't want to sign away his publishing. Very sensible if you write great songs.

[@masonwilliams567]

Funny how he says he wasn't making enough money, but took a vacation after they fired him🤔😄

[@rondellschuyler7074]

Always have a lawyer. Especially a entertainment lawyer and never sign a legal document unless you consult your lawyer before you sign it. Period

[@ronwilliams1094]

I just realized that fact. Every story I’ve heard about Vinnie and KISS’s salary offers never mentioned his attorney. Who negotiates something that important without a lawyer?

[@brianstrutter1501]

He never signed his contract so the $550/wk was until he signed his contract. $2000/wk isn't bad money for 1982. Also need to remember KISS wasn't bringing in nesr as much as they were in 1976 and 1977. So if their sales increased Vinnie would have been able to get even more money

[@jamiedona402]

He needed to understand, at that time, he was working for a COMPANY, not just another band. Do your job, and do it well, and don't complain, and he might've got more.

[@ricdale7813]

Vinnie blew his own deal in KISS. He played games by not signing when in reality he wasnt getting a better deal anywhere else. He tried playing hold out hard ball but Gene and Paul are the Masters of that game and called his bluff. Whats left out of this story is how VV purposely degenerated himself and behaved erratically in hopes of putting pressure on Paul and Gene too somehow cave into the type of contract VV envisioned he was due. I still thing VV f'd himself. While the KISS contract didnt give a lot of royalty and ownership perk's it was front loaded with cash per week at a highly generous rate for the early 80's. I know most of you wouldnt turn down that contract when the other option was a flat out $500 a week. VV screwed himself and then continued his goofy self management and ran his own self into obscurity.

[@andrewking4885]

I agree. I read he tried to hold the band to ransom as he knew G&P desperately needed a guitarist after Ave left.

[@SpencerHamby-ft1fn]

Yea, all true, he's gotta be a dip-shit, and hate to break it to ya, not a really good guitar player either 😢

[@samright4661]

Vinnie screwed himself Kiss was offering really good money for the early 80s! Bruce Kulick was a much better fit for Kiss ..

[@DrMidnight-oz1rk]

Before Vinnie made kiss popular, they were a novelty kid's rock band. A band so uncool even the Monkeys were better. Kiss was a band you wanted to pass on until we heard Vinnie's true rock music. Starting with "Love it loud".

[@naturalbornscorpio929]

​@@DrMidnight-oz1rkKeep telling yourself that & one day you will believe it.

[@leokimvideo]

Vinnie was pulling a lot of the spotlight off Paul. Especially during media interviews. Gene & Paul always prefer the other two players to be passive. The sort of guys who just rock up and play the songs without upsetting the Kiss apple cart. Are we surprised the contract is so unfair. No. Considering Vinnie helped write one of Kiss's biggest hits he was really shafted.

[@philipdefibaugh5683]

Gene is right. Vinnie is the most self-destructive person he knew. Had he stayed in KISS, he would have been as big if not bigger than Ace, but he got greedy and went into obscurity while Ace is still a remembered legend.

[@dirtydave2691]

Eddie Trunk still loves him/her.

[@sauletto1]

🤣 him/her..... lol "exactly !

[@acesteele8559]

$2000 a week is TWICE what Randy Rhoads was getting. Vinnie's canract was seriously overpaying him. Plus 7 cents per copy for publishing is more than the industry norn 5.75 cents per copy. Vinnie shot him self in the foot.

[@SpencerHamby-ft1fn]

Yea , he's the self -destructing type. I've met similar and don't really know what makes them tick. Maybe they're not completely fulfilled in life unless there's turmoil and drama, and their whole life is turned upside down.

[@greatunz67]

what's a 'canract'?

[@kafesociety1759]

@@greatunz67don’t be an ass

[@dirkjewitt5037]

So, he needed money to survive because the money wasn't right but could afford a worldwide vacation? Vinnie is the definition of "F" around and find out.

[@Myrrhkuri]

thats what I was thinking...he didnt make enough with his "550" a week, to live and support his family, but was able to take 4 yrs traveling around the world after being fired..lol apparently he was making a lot more than he was claiming

[@Lordhumongus]

That contract was actually a good contract for Vinnie and ill be 100 bucks it was more valuable than anything he did after

[@ricdale7813]

I totally agree. That 80's contract was huge for a relatively new unknown guy in an already well established band. VV is nutz though so yeah.

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Apparently Vinnie thought that he could form his own band that would take off. He got a record deal but it didn't last long. Turned out that in real life, it's not as easy as it seems. Without a doubt, Vinnie was very talented and Paul and Gene admitted it but he was a bit delusional as well.

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Vinnie wrote such beautiful songs with Vinnie Vincent Invasion

[@kawada1]

​@@karsguitarchannel6088 Agreed, the music was strong although the production on the first album, YIKES.

[@Lordhumongus]

Super talented guy. Super delusional. Sometimes the biggest hurdle people face is the one in the mirror

[@KennethFinuf]

What I liked about this version of kiss Eric Car and Vinnie Vincent had their own makeup (image). They should have kept it that way!! I never liked a fake Ace and Peter Criss !! 😮

[@thelearninghistorian]

Lol, Ok.

[@richardheadly7466]

I agree, I remember buying KISS alive IV symphony without knowing Ace had left (I'd assumed the farewell tour was the end & tuned out). You remember there was no band photos on the outside of the CD. So, got it home & saw Thayer in Ace's make up, I was done. I tried, I still try once in awhile but I just can't do it. I even started to enjoy Sonic Boom when I bought it because they're still good songs but then I heard Tommy singing about electricity & it was so lame. They even had Tommy doing a fake "Shock Me"? It's just not very cool.

[@jamiedona402]

You got that right. I hate paul, and gene for doing ACE, and Peter dirty to sell their own creations to put on two scabs.

[@paulaitix77]

such a shame, she was such a talented song writer and guitarist

[@mr.c8033]

Ok. But Vinnie has a long, long, loooooong history of flat-out ripping people off.

[@grantorino2009]

When the contract said that VV’s songwriting would be owned by KISS, it didn’t mean specifically G&P. It meant the band collective. Same as G&P did with the songs they wrote. If VV couldn’t make it on $240K a year with expenses paid in 1983, he was as big an idiot as G&P, among many others, have said. He managed to travel the world on his “meager salary” after getting fired. Vacations that the rest of us could only dream about. This guy is a nut.

[@wavular]

No kidding..

[@wavular]

Plus he's more woman than man..

[@narcismo2474]

@@wavular Dude looks like a lady😂

[@DrMidnight-oz1rk]

​@@wavularall the rock bands looked like that back at that time.

[@section8usmc53]

​@@wavularHave you seen Paul Stanley and Steven Tyler (ironic)? They, among several others, look like old ladies no matter what they are doing or wearing. A lot of these guy look like that. It's really weird.

[@wj74]

Vinnie all heart no brains, saddest thing about it. Btw Gene and Paul had that magic with everybody they played with.

[@markherring3513]

Not really...Tommy knows the songs really well....but aint no magic there. Hes obedient, compliant and dependable. At this stage of the game thats all the "magic" Gene and Paul needed. Tommy and Eric contributed NOTHING to the KISS legacy other than filling the positions to play the old KISS songs people want to hear.

[@brianstrutter1501]

Vinnie co-wrote 8 of the 10 songs on Lick It Up, not 9. Played on 9, did not play the solo on Exciter. Rick Derringer played that solo. Vinnie played on 5 songs on Creatures, not 6. And yes co-wrote 3 songs on Creatures. Vinnie is an egomaniac and a liar. No one who has worked with Vinnie likes or trusts him at all. Mark Slaughter and Dana Strum have nothing good to say about Vinnie. Vinnie just wanted money because he was broke. Doesn't mean KISS owes him anything. So yes, what a shame. If Vinnie had just signed the contract and wouldn't have been an egomaniac he would have had everything he had ever wanted and then gotten more money

[@grantorino2009]

When the contract said that VV’s songwriting would be owned by KISS, it didn’t mean specifically G&P. It meant the band collective. Same as G&P did with the songs they wrote. If VV couldn’t make it on $240K a year contract with expenses paid in 1983, he was as big an idiot as G&P, among many others, have said. He managed to travel the world on his “meager salary” after getting fired. Vacations that the rest of us could only dream about. This guy is toxic.

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Yes, I think Vinnie knew that he was very talented and he believed he was worth more than what KISS was offering him. He thought he was gonna form his own band that would take off. He wanted to prove KISS his worth. He got a record deal. He wrote beautiful songs with his band but unfortunately it didn't last long. Turned out that in real life, it's not as easy as it seems. Looks like Vinnie was a bit delusional as well.

[@charlesbronson4282]

Imagine how good Animalize and Asylum would have been if Vinnie and Jackson stuck around

[@ferox965]

Would have been better if Kulick did all of Animalize.

[@DrMidnight-oz1rk]

​@@ferox965kiss you would pass on. They're an uncool kid's Jew rock.

[@ferox965]

@@DrMidnight-oz1rk WOW...spoken like a true inbred. Don't burn a cross on anyone's lawn.

[@jamiedona402]

Animalize - Asylum - Hot In The Shade - Crazy Nights would've been a whole lot better. Liked Kiss around that time, but they had probably two good songs on all those albums, IMO. The lyrics was just like throwing crap against a wall to see if it sticks.

[@scottyjordan3036]

The 2 VV albums are as good as ANYTHING ever written as long as you are into the bands sound. Perfect records.

[@billhogue9523]

The second VVI album is technically the first Slaughter album 😅😅😅😅

[@Abefroman-lq3md]

Pure 💩

[@mojorocketman]

As bad as Vinnie was made out to be by Gene and Paul, the early 80's was a time when Kiss realized how much money the threw away in the 70's and were very tight with money, so I would side a little more with Vinnie about his contract. I doubt the contract that's available to see is genuine. What Paul and especially Gene is too narcissistic to ever accept, is the Kiss brand was dying and Vinnie almost single handedly saved the band with his fresh song writing. I remember as a kid listening to Kiss in the 70's and seeing their movie, then they disappeared until I saw on TV the music video of Kiss's Lick it up which I knew even at the age of 12, that was an old band, but they were still keeping up with all the new hair bands and rocking it. Considering Gene is worth 200 million and Paul 100 million, it would be a drop in the bucket to give Vinnie a little thank you bonus for saving the band. His ex wife had to work as a prostitute to make ends meet, and she's now dead. Had Kiss payed him his fair share she might still be alive. Had Vinnie not been in Kiss, they would probably be playing in Casinos to crowds of 300 people right now.

[@lynnokrzynski8720]

All he had to do was sign the contract.

[@naturalbornscorpio929]

Correction ..Vinnies ex-wife became an escort because Vinnie was a dead beat Dad which mite explain why his twin daughters want nothing to do with him.

[@doctordetroit4339]

Vinnie kept Kiss relevant in the 80s and hence beyond.....he saved Kiss. Gene and Paul could not buy a hit with all the money that made back then. They tried and failed many many times.

[@naturalbornscorpio929]

@@doctordetroit4339 No, taking the make-up off saved them along with "Animalize" & "Heavens On Fire" didn't that album go platinum?

[@garycoates4987]

It's really hard to take any of his claims seriously, his own band VVI for all intensive purposes fired him by reforming without him and taking over his contract as Slaughter. He's giving the whole world the impression he's impossible to wirk with . You simply can't claim you can't survive on your paycheck and support your family then travel the world on a luxury vacation for a year. Maybe he wasn't making the money Paul and Gene were making and wasn't uber rich but it really doesn't sound like he was struggling in any way at all. I've also heard how a few years back he was set to make a comeback tour and flaked out on appearances and performances some that he'd been paid for doing in advance. It seems like in his case Gene and Paul the business end of Kiss is more credible and gene may be telling the truth the Vinnie has ethical issues.

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Yes, Vinnie knew that he was very talented and he believed he was worth more than what KISS offered him. He thought he was gonna form his own band that would take off. He wanted to prove KISS his worth. He got a record deal. He wrote beautiful songs with his band but unfortunately it didn't last long. Turned out that in real life, it's not as easy as it seems. Looks like Vinnie was a bit delusional as well.

[@bryanmontgomery996]

I appreciate that this video is impartial and fair. I am a huge fan of Vinnie Vincent and his tremendous talent, however, I cannot deny that with Vinnie's genius has come a bit of madness. He cannot seem to stop himself from getting in his own way and ruining great opportunities. I hope one day we can see everything he has to offer and that he can find peace in a world he sees as so hostile towards him.

[@ministerofdarkness]

Hey Vinnie is a good neighbor! I see him out wearing his muumuu watering his lawn talking to himself.

[@OrieCipollaro]

Is he trans now?

[@SpencerHamby-ft1fn]

Yea right, funny

[@jamiedona402]

mumu, lol

[@michaelanthonygagliardi7395]

I knew the Cusanos in the 90s, I worked with Ann Marie, Vince was a mess, so was she

[@thefonzkiss]

More details please. That’s the one who was murdered?

[@michaelanthonygagliardi7395]

@@thefonzkiss Yes, I worked with her at Sebastian International in Woodland Hills. Would see the twins from time to time and Vinbe would pick her up after work. She would tell me don't ever talk to him, he is depressed, so I kept my distance

[@naturalbornscorpio929]

​@@michaelanthonygagliardi7395From what I've read it was due to substance abuse.

[@jamesmccormick875]

Vinny did all of this to himself. He plays the constant victim role but we all know he’s only a victim of his own actions.

[@naturalbornscorpio929]

According to the many internet surveys you are 100% correct.

[@jimmyteerex2177]

I don't blame Vinnie for not wanting to sign the contract. The $2500pw headline pay was pretty good but it still conned him out publishing and most of his songwriting which by rights he should have earned several million for given how well Lick It Up did.

[@ohmtronseedling]

the contract doesn't seem all that bad, really.

[@ssinistrari2257]

Let's get real. There are MANY great guitarists, some mentioned on this video, who got ripped off. And some knew it, it's a chance sure, but then they could have other chances, who knows. Great talent doesn't sit by the wayside. A weekly paycheck for a hired guy, fine. BUT WHEN YOU WRITE, music, lyrics, etc., that is different. That is a whole different animal. That is THE BAND or the LABEL then calling on TALENT to help them. What's it worth? That is when it gets to the $$$ and the contracts. There are always promises... Young guys out there with talent but no mind of business at all. So the more experienced or pros really cleaned up with the inexperienced youth. Fair? Don't talk about fair in the biz, it is dog eat dog. Every man for himself. For Vincent, he knew what the deal was, he TRIED to get something out of it, so did Vivian Campbell and all the others. Many got screwed. Oh, some can all just say water under the bridge NOW, but if it was a situation where ALL parties had EQUAL representation, there would be more better off guys out there. In the immortal words of Randy Rhodes: "I think I signed some things that will come back to haunt me..."

[@Bingbing611]

I know a guy who subbed for Peter Criss before the news of his drug problems became public He said he was paid $2500 a week and was with KISS for 18 months. He said most of the time he played pinball machines backstage but was required to perform with the band a handful of times. Clive Davis hired him for the gig with the assurance of more work if he kept his mouth shut about Criss.

[@sylverspice]

Not true. If that was the case, we would have seen photos of the fake Catman. Someone else would have talked. Good story though...

[@Bingbing611]

@@sylverspice It’s absolutely true I studied with him for almost 3 years He has tons of proof You should soak your head in

[@sylverspice]

@@Bingbing611 Unless I have visual proof AND confirmation by other KISS employees, trust me, I know some of them, your story is that...a story.

[@sylverspice]

@@Bingbing611 Show the tons of proof and I will believe you

[@littlebritain64]

I have read that a guy was hired for one gig after Peter Criss was ill. Is this the case?

[@ericecho]

I watch all your vids and love the rock n roll drama😂 Especially how much everyone was paid. More ozzy / sharon stories pls those are always good lol and idk if youre familiar with the horrendous Rob Zombie/White Zombie tour stories but those are hilarious. Especially the ones with The Melvins

[@ericecho]

And a side note, the melvins toured with kiss and said kiss were way more professional, respectful and truer rock stars than rob zombie

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Big thanks, I appreciate!!

[@nickslade3978]

No wonder gene called him the most self-destructive person he’s ever met

[@ricksantana1016]

Granted the contract was an (equitable employment agreement), although when you read deeper into the financial details the contract was merely a stipend. The late great Bob Kulick was quoted on KZbin referencing to Vinnie’s tenure with Kiss; “Vinny should have signed his contract to reap the future benefits of being in Kiss”.. Incidentally towards the end years of Bob’s life he to felt quite slighted by Kiss, chiefly by Gene and Paul… Agreed; Speculatively speaking; Had Vinny remained with Kiss throughout the non makeup era Kiss definitely would have been in a much higher echelon within the “metal musical genre” of the 1980’s and perhaps as a result he would have acquired much more “residuals” as time progressed and much more additional compensations, If Vinnie bit the bullet and shown more professionalism perhaps the business dynamics would surely have been more beneficial to him financially and personally.. Although there is no denying that Vinny’s “creative infusion” within the band created a “musical magic” on a level that was never seen before, in my subjective opinion I believe that the “Creatures Era” was the most “musically succinct” throughout the Kiss genre, Vinny by far is the most phenomenally talented lead guitarist and song writer Kiss has ever had he could easily play rings around any other Kiss guitarist… Personally it my hope the Vinny can pull himself up and out and release all his talents to perform once again and go out with a bang! I have been told once your down flat on your floor the only way to go is up… “Keep on Rocking Vinny!” 🤘🔥🤘

[@dimebagdave77]

Who knows what exactly is going on in Vinnie's head.. but i enjoyed his contributions to Kiss. With Vinnie to this day there always seems to be a very large string attached. I just wanted to hear him rip🤘 many thanks Kar's Guitar Channel

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

You are very welcome, great pleasure!! Thank you

[@robertwells6454]

Vinny is not a professional by all accounts from just about anyone that He worked with. No one has anything good to say about working with Him. He has a lot of drama with Him.

[@guitarherocallahan3510]

Very interesting! Thank you, great upload!

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Glad you enjoyed it, many thanks!

[@Hammerhead547]

Its easy too see why paul and gene got so frustrated with vinny's live playing. Just listen too The Boys Wanna Rock and you'll see why they said his live soloing was "awful", he just didn't know how too self edit.

[@scottwhite2757]

Excellent Rock History !! Rock On Kar/Shawn..✌️

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Many thanks Scott!! Rock on

[@DunmoresMovieMania]

Vinnie: complains about not being paid enough to buy a house or even a decent car. Also Vinnie: "...used the money he got in KISS to take a long vacation, traveling the world for a full year and visiting places like Tahiti, Philippines, Mozambique, India..."

[@HocusPocusFocus69]

Vinnie was a fantastic guitarist...but, he seems to be his own worst enemy.

[@andrepires7687]

The best guitar player Kiss ever had. Help the band to be successful again after years of decadence. Wrote the entire Lick It Up album and co wrote the most well known song in Creatures Of The Night (I Love It Loud). People forget that and only bashes the guy!!!! Paul and Gene are ungrateful. Just look at what they done to Eric Carr.

[@Christine16425]

Paul et Gene était toujours en contact avec Eric les médecins ont dit qu' il était très malade il ne devait pas jouer, ils lui ont laisser jouer God Gave R&R to you, P & G ont dit qu'il avait toujours sa place au sein du groupe , Eric s'est sentit rejeter car il était remplacer mais ils devaient faire la tournée et Eric a téléphoner a Peter criss et a plus voulu parler a Gene et Paul dommage.

[@markherring3513]

I wonder what eric carr's contract was like..we all know he got a porche when he joined.

[@DominarRygel-XVI]

Thanks for the upload. It aint KISS without Frehley or Criss. Would love more black magic occult rock n roll type videos. I find those so fascinating.

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Many thanks for checking out, I appreciate!!

[@DominarRygel-XVI]

@@karsguitarchannel6088 You keep uploading, Ill keep watching. Btw I think you forgot the link to the Vinnie interview you talk about in the vid.

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

@@DominarRygel-XVI Big thanks! Yes, I just added the link. Here it is: kzbin.info/www/bejne/gJLTlaGJn5yogrMsi=22fhMpXP7V2gmeLs

[@philipdefibaugh5683]

For someone who refused to sign his contract to be in Kiss and the many times he sued Gene and Paul, Vince Vincent sure as hell doesn't mind wearing an altered version of his Ahnk makeup. Without it, most people wouldn't know who he is.

[@MarvynSyn999]

I sure wish things could have been different between these guys. "Creatures" and "Lick It Up" are 2 of my favorite KISS albums. It bothers me when i hear Paul badmouth the "Lick It Up" album when IMHO it's the stronger (and Heavier) of the 2 albums. VV Invasion have some great songs mired only by the vox (I cant take the girly-high vocals of Fleischman and Slaughter)...imagine what those songs would sound like with the Godly voice of Paul in his Prime ("That Time of Year" springs to mind)! His contribution to "Revenge" put 2 of the best songs on THAT album as well ("Heart of Chrome" and "Unholy")...damn, looks like VV put KISS back on the map (and you all know he did)...I bet if he had the chance to sign that 80's contract today, he'd grab a pen really quick. Afterall, Hindsight is 20/20.

[@toddcastle3926]

Good work from an original Kiss Army member!

[@kiprandom7208]

Turning down a $100k contract because you have bills to pay and kids to feed?

[@chrisblaine1669]

I’ve heard so many stories over the years and I’ve met Vinny many times and he’s musician and I think that when you go against the machine such as kiss that you have to play nice or you can’t play and he burned bridges many times but I think he’s owed money becauseLick It Up was a great album and so was revenge. Pay the guy.

[@billbranch1403]

Wow a lot of behind the curtain turmoil for one and millions made for the other crazy

[@damonstewart70]

Kar I'm a manager at a bar/club. Vinnie band is playing tonight. Me and some of my staff were watching this in the lounge. Vinnie heard this and went ape shit throwing things and threatening not to perform tonight

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Oh I can imagine this. I'm sorry. Where was it? Did Vinnie explain what exactly made him so angry? Because we love Vinnie, he's a very talented guitarist. Me and Shawn love Vinnie. Shawn told me that when the first Vinnie Vincent Invasion record came out, he bought and loved it. Vinnie went through hell and many of us did as well.

[@bobowrathsovine.]

​​@@karsguitarchannel6088I was only 12 and just got into Kiss and saw an ad for the VVI first record in a Hit Parader magazine and had to buy it. I was embarrassed by the screeching vocals that are 2 octaves too high but am still flabbergasted with the guitar solos

[@billtrepkowski527]

TWO songs. Vinnie wrote/co-wrote all but TWO songs on the "Lick it Up" album: "Fits Like a Glove" and "Dance All Over Your Face" were written solely by Gene. I do remember 1980s press releases that referred to KISS as "that unnamed band."

[@wasp4eva1]

Lots of different people bash Vinnie, & some of it may be deserved. But Slaughter sucked, and will always suck. It’s crap bands like them that helped sink the hard rock genre. And KISS benefited heavily from Vinnies songwriting. I wish he had been in the band longer.

[@Rick-jz1vs]

Really if slaughter sucked,why did they have number one songs on mtv.Wasp didnt do nothing worth mentioning

[@jamiejade1971]

Slaughter does not suck.

[@doctordetroit4339]

I love Slaughter...but you are correct about Vinnie.....he saved Kiss....not sure why most don't remember that or know the history. Kiss sucked balls in the late 70s and 80s....they couldn't buy a hit. Vinnie brought the goods.

[@xaviercruz4145]

The real issue here is why wouldn't Paul and Gene give him a decent % of royalties, even if he was a (well payed?) employee?? I bet those money grabbers did the same to Bruce Kulick and Mark St. John.

[@blackadder5073]

Ozzy & Sharron grinned band mates big time also

[@naturalbornscorpio929]

Vinnie was given the keys to the kingdom & chose to shoot himself in the foot with nobody to blame but himself. Unlike the guitar the only thing Vinnie ever mastered was burning bridges & playing the victim.

[@BulletsForTeeth5029]

He should have consulted a better attorney.

[@RavnerRavner]

Love your channel. Your voice is perfect for the narration of my 80s guitar heros. Especially the story of VV. His songwriting is great. And I'm a Vinnie defender. I wish he coulda stayed. Played by the rules within KISS. animalize wouldn't have sucked.

[@clutch2827]

Paul complaining about him selling guitars...LOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!

[@MatthewBaumgarten]

It sucks that things didn’t work out for Vinnie in Kiss, from a fans perspective, he was in my opinion the best guitarist Kiss had next to Ace, the music he recorded with kiss was awesome, Lick it up is my favorite kiss album without Ace

[@jtshark5817]

For those in the comments saying VV was an idiot for not signing that contract. The expression that comes to mind is "crazy but not stupid". VV would be treated like a hired hand regardless of how much music he wrote for the band. The people saying $240k is nothing to scoff at, what if I told you that Gene and Paul made 10 mill each over the same time? The keys to the contract that most are over looking are 1) BASED UPON NET NOT GROSS. Ask any accountant about how big of a difference that would make. Example Alec Guiness owned 2.5% GROSS of the first 3 star wars movies reportedly 50 to 75 mill. Peter Mayhew who played Chewie got 2% of the NET for empire strikes back and according to Lucas films; it never made money. For those bashing VV(and remember I called him crazy) would you take 240k while the guy next to you is making 10mill? There is more to the KISS brand then just albums

[@markherring3513]

And making 10 million off of the songs YOU wrote.

[@HappyMachorino-bd8no]

But when he didn't want the contract, why did he then work for KISS?

[@jtshark5817]

Thank you for the video. I thought Vinnie was nut(on some level he is) but as someone who has relatives in the music industry, I can tell ya, they wanted him to sign away a lot of things that makes a lot of money. Say if he wrote 80% of I love it Loud? and say it made 10mill. You would think he would get paid 8mill. Nope. In reading that contract? He would not even make a mill off of it. Before you say my math is wrong. I am given an example of how bad that contract is. Also, he was signing the publishing rights away and that is where all the money was made. Also, never get % of net always gross. Why? That is how all musicians get screwed.

[@ummfish4878]

i saw VV invasion. he said in concert that he hadn't put out an album because he could sit back and take 1/4 profit from kiss till his contract was up, and not give them 3/4 profit from his band...seems he is a lil....ummmmm.....

[@AceGibson1959]

Vinnie is one of the most talented songwriters in the business. He is also probably the worst business man in music history.

[@Grnfinger]

God that pant suit 😂

[@elliotwheeler4164]

Don't really care to be honest. Paul Stanley gave him the name and suggested the face painting. Paul Stanley produced New England album back in late 70s and i think supported Kiss on tour. Sure he help write songs that was he initially asked to do, while Ace Frehley was being difficult in 1982. He helped wrote a lot of songs that never got used. Tears went to John Waite then Peter Criss recorded it. It was a messy time for Kiss.

[@PiTjlang]

"SHOOT YOU FULL OF LOVE"!! lol, Spinal Tap couldnt come up w/ a better name

[@THECHIEF-1981]

Great video. I saw creatures tour with motley Crue easter Sunday 1983.

[@markherring3513]

How big was the crowd? Was it sold out?

[@THECHIEF-1981]

@@markherring3513 it was pretty packed. By memory it sure seemed close to a sellout.

[@markherring3513]

@@THECHIEF-1981 Gene and Paul both said that tour was a bust but any vid ive watched of it it seems crowds were huge..Im sure there were a few outliers where no one showed up. I know they played New Orleans on that tour during mardi gras and were on a parade..they played the superdome that week. I think it was a festival type line up of bands and they were top bill.

[@DunmoresMovieMania]

Excellent presentation, man! Very detailed and non-emotional, with lots of information that allows fans and non-fans to make up their own minds on what a knucklehead VV is.

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Many thanks!!

[@sylvainggingras5945]

Simmons and Stanley always use others to make money. Nothing new here. Always been that way from Ace Freley to Tommy Thayer.

[@chrisb3976]

Ah the wonderful glorious music industry lol.

[@JerrodSchumacher-fc1wr]

For some reason I just never could get into kiss.

[@thequintanashow5058]

3:17 why are u showing a pic of Vinnie’s mom?

[@EdwardPigg-ji4yy]

I’m a huge KISS fan but I have never liked Vinnie Vincent. I didn’t like him in KISS and I liked him even less as a solo artist.

[@guitarhurricaine]

Just splitting band money evenly seems to be the way to go. Gene was obviously getting the lion share especially merch.

[@seanabbottband]

Bad decision from a young musician, always take the royalties!!! That’s money for life from your writing

[@michelbanen2797]

I wonder how many fans paid $ 200 for one year access to his Facebook page or bought the $ 350 Speedball jam CD or any autographed KISS CD (signed only by Vinnie) for $ 400 each.

[@careful...Icarus]

And I thought Peter was delusional. Jeezus Christ on Crutches with this guy. I did and still do love the first VVI lp from '86 tho. Wore at least 2 cassettes of it out.

[@DougCanney1]

He's just a pain in the ass, it's that simple. He thinks he's SO good and truly he never was that good. This is a good lesson for keep your mouth shut and work hard when you're young. Getting his face out there would have helped him a lot if he'd have been easy to get along with.

[@jeffgile2921]

Vinnie blew it by not signing the contract. What an idiot. All he had to do was sign and tour

[@danrozsnaki8039]

that was a good deal for the 1 year contract

[@colbyclayton8052]

The best 2 albums KISS released.

[@PowerMedia-kc1wt]

I like how so many of you who weren’t there happen to know so many intricate details of Vinnie’s Kiss dealings. 😂 yeah after he unsuccessfully sued them multiple times over his publishing he was hit with attorneys fees. In just about any legal proceeding, the person with the most resources and best attorney typically wins. Street Beat music his pub co basically became property of Gene and Paul.

[@paulshamblin6260]

People get funny over money. No doubt the record business is cut throat. I think Vinny was a huge pain in the ass but also an incredible talent. Gene and Paul are rich. They could have shared the wealth. I guess they had Bruce and he was easier to work with. Probably more likable. Sux for Vinny. Sux about his wives. As for selling a guitar, who cares. Maybe it was his favorite. Maybe he just didn't record with it or use it on the road. Billy Gibbons doesn't take his favorite guitar on the road.

[@kevincrozier8625]

Well, right out the gate, if it had been me, I would have insisted that I get royalties from publishing. Granted, yes, he screwed himself, but c'mon, there should be more offered, especially if he wrote or co-wrote most of the lick it up album. To me, this is problems on both sides of the aisle. And the way I see it, if I wrote it, I deserve royalties on the song. It's just greed on G&P not offering the royalties. THAT'S where the money is. And I sure wouldn't be selling my songs to the band for peanuts.

[@TheOfficerMahoney]

Vinnie Vincent saved KISS

[@TimAnthonymkmusicnw]

Miss owes me money. I bought tickets. Had to cancel card due to fraud. Concert tickets as cancelled. And I lost 350$.

[@nsbd90now]

So... he worked without a contract?? Sounds kind of like a dopey decision to say the least. He should have had a lawyer negotiating that stuff right from the start especially since he was so instrumental (heh! a pun) in writing the actual music.

[@joeyvanostrand3655]

The section where you discuss Slaughter, you show a picture of Stryper.

[@karsguitarchannel6088]

Sorry, not true! It's Vinnie Vincent Invasion

[@stanlee-eq7lu]

Incorrect. Vinnie didn't play all the guitar leads on the Lick It Up album. Rick Derringer played on the song Lick It Up. Vinnie played lead guitar on the title track for Creatures Of The Night.

[@SpencerHamby-ft1fn]

And Randy Rhodes is TWICE the guitar player VV was/is?

[@CharlesScott-wo8dr]

Owed them money😂I heard they only paid him $500 a week which was shit to be in a big band like kiss even back then.

[@DeoDog2425]

Vinnie didnt owe KISS money

[@Audfile]

You'd have to be some kind of set of monsters to hire a musician for the greatest prospect one can aspire to, to play music in a popular, profitable band, that brings joy to people (I always thought kiss sucked, I'm out), and ostensibly yourselves, and know that one of your members is barely surviving while you're deciding which Ferrari to take that day. The only path is to give that man a piece of each, if you believe in him and yourselves. I never liked Kiss.