Sore back & painful knees... it could be your Fore / Aft Position // Bike Fit Tips w/ Phil Burt

If you have a sore back, sore hands, painful knees... it could be your fore/aft position that needs adjusting. So here is how to find your optimal fore / aft position :)
Thanks - as always - to Phil for taking the time to share his knowledge with us lot! Find Phil here: www.philburtin...
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[@jerryavalos9610]

I had several bike fits and I came away with the belief that each bike fitter will fit you according to their belief of where they think you should be. One bike fitter had me too far forward and too high and as a result suffered a right knee injury. After getting better, I saw another bike fitter who shoved my saddle too far back and that re-aggravated my knee injury. I finally adjusted my saddle height one centimeter lower according to the simple heel to pedal test and adjusted my fore aft saddle position with my knee exactly over the pedal as a starting point. So far that seems to be it. Crazy.

[@chrismadge7292]

Bike fit is a big business, and people pay a lot of money for an overly scientific process. Science should get you almost in the right position, but at the end of the day the right position is what is comfortable for you. It’s actually quite simple to arrive at the right position, there are some basic rules to follow, and most people could get there without the expense of ‘professional’ bike fit companies. If you are unusually proportioned, or have injury or disability then a good bike fitter might be money well spent.

[@donwinston]

Just put it in the center and be done with it. Most people move their butt back and forth depending on what they're trying to do anyway. Getting fitter will make almost all of these ailments go away.

[@veganpotterthevegan]

​@@donwinstonthat's a terrible idea. Seat tube angle and setback on a post can mean there's a 4-5cm difference from bike to bike using your ridiculous recommendation.

[@donwinston]

@@veganpotterthevegan you are a fool. It is not going to make a shits worth of difference. Stem length is way more important.

[@mathewrose2951]

My bike fit rule is that if I can cycle 100k, day after day, with no pain or niggles, I'm not messing with it. I've spent the last year and a half with a 20 pound short saddle from Selle San Marco on a ten-thousand pound bike, and I have no intention of chasing marginal gains by dropping 100 grams or fiddling around with a different position for a few extra watts. Pain-free is fast.

[@ezquiel700c]

only takes one hard ride to completely screw everything up

[@tefltoulouse]

THat's pretty much what I've told bike fitters over the years, that I just want to ride 100km with no pain, and they still put me 1 - 1.5cm too high.

[@viktorkathi9871]

While it's probably a good video on explaining the 'How to' - I wish He'd speak a little slower , more clearly. I find it difficult to understand him..

[@Tinker1950]

I could barely understand what he was mumbling,so gave up.

[@rgefryer]

Surprised not too see any mention of moving your saddle back to reduce pressure on the hands.

[@45ltr]

Moved my seat forward about 3cm and what a difference , no jarring pain in my sit bones and was able to ride farther and longer , thanks for the great tip, cheers from Scotland

[@KatieKookaburra]

That’s awesome!! Glad it helped!! :)

[@joncorbett4021]

I briefly worked at Ribble so I'm relatively familiar with the geometry of most of the frames. A large amount of them (the Endurance SL being one of them) are (imo) slightly longer with a lower stack for their given size when compared to other brands of the same size. So I can see why you need the saddle positioned as you do. I'd normally pick a 54 or medium in most frames but quite a lot of the Ribbles, I think I'd be happier on a small.

[@saracen888]

Agreed! The Ribble Endurance had a very race orientated geometry

[@shmvon]

This is generally true: when in between two sizes, take the smaller one.

[@monkmchorning]

When your torso says one size and your leg and arm length says another, splitting the difference is often the best course.

[@monkmchorning]

I'm pretty flexible, but I preferred to give up on a Felt F5 for the same reason. Some brands are just a less-than optimal fit for some builds.

[@georgeskinner2474]

Good information. I just have one suggestion - if you are making a making a big change in position, do it bit by bit, over a number of weeks. Especially if you are old, like me (68), your body might not tolerate a drastic change done all at once. I had a bike fitter raise my seat (which was too low and giving me front knee pain) quite a bit and shifted saddle fore/aft position. I did a few short rides and felt comfortable. Then I did a 43 mile ride and felt good while riding, but when I stopped I could barely walk. The back of my right knee was super tight and painful. I thought I had wreaked my knee, but the orthopedist said I had strained my hamstring. I have been off my bike for 2 weeks now (sad face) and feel like a hamster whose wheel has been taken away.

[@MsTatakai]

yep... many ppl think its knee pain when in fact is the quad tendon or hamstring got inflammed and it hurts =P

[@ChrisPurdy]

I'd like to ask possibly the stupidest bike-fit question, because I accept there's no such thing as a stupid question, only stupid answers... WHERE do you sit on a saddle? and the bonus question, HOW do you sit on a saddle? I feel this is key to saddle fore-aft and a little toward saddle height as a consideration because I have never managed to get comfortable on a saddle, after trying many saddles, a bike fit, and continued trial and error/improvement afterwards (while making sure I do a handful of short distance rides between each change, and knowing my baseline 'best so far' to return to in between). I get saddle discomfort on the ol' "sit bones" and pain inside (but toward the back) of one knee, so I probably need a visit to a pro / chiropractor really, for a full run down on hip alignment, leg length and so on, but maybe, just maybe its an easier thing to fix than that! The knee that gets pain might be down to the knackered PCL mind, but the core of my above questions is down to maximising saddle and pedal comfort that could help with the knee, maybe.

[@bonbonflippers4298]

First you have to know your sit Bone measurements. How wide you want the saddle to be. Now to answer your question...you should be sitting where the support is at the wide part of the saddle. How do you know you're at the right spot? When you do not shift your position when doing hard efforts. Your sitting area on the saddle should be the same regardless if you're doing seated climbs or high cadance.

[@tefltoulouse]

I'm enjoying the theory to this but she is at least 3 - 4cm too high I'd say. Pause the video at 5.39 or 5.41 to see. Maybe they had to put her up that high to show the KOPS thing.

[@prinbark]

I have the opposite, short legs, long torso.

[@timtaylor9590]

i always had a bit of patella pain prior to cycling, for what ever reason after cycling a lot for a year there was a bit of discomfort at first but now theyre stronger than ever no pain or anything, my seat posts' set back is reversed forward and my saddle is almost maxed forward. knee's over toes isnt bad your knees are just weak. just like how lifting weight with a rounded back isnt bad. things just have limitations its up to you to expand those limits.

[@Jac70]

I remember buying a new set of cranks a few years ago. No 175s in stock so I went with 170s, never thought anything about it. I didn't notice any real difference on the bike. However I noticed pain developing in my left knee and then the right. About 4 months after putting the new cranks on my knees were knackered but it never crossed my mind that 5mm would make any difference. It got to the point where I went to the doctor because my knees were so bad I couldn't bend them. Doctor gave a cursory examination and said 'probably arthritis'! Balls to that I said and racked my brain about what could be causing it. I then remebered the new cranks and though maybe I should do a bike fit and make some adjustments. I altered the seat height a few mill and within a month or so my knees were fine again! It's amazing how much difference a small change can make.

[@Multistan85]

No injury no pain . Especially on 120+ mile rides. Other than the occasional fatigue, I realized all I needed was not a bike fit… but to stretch a lot more than usual.

[@jimmpanik3402]

In understand everything you're talking about I think you missed touching on one point: IF someone has longer legs and the saddle is pushed backwards, the common response seems to be how this will impact the handlebar reach. That tells people to move the saddle forward to correct the reach issue. I think the solution is to keep the saddle moved back and change stems to get the bars closer. Instead of looking at fore/aft in terms of reach to the bars, the real discussion point should be "where is the correct placement of the body on the bike" and then adjust the bike to fit even if the seat is all the way back and the stem gets shortened to 40mm from 100mm.

[@pauljenkins2501]

I have recently bought a new ebike, and have been getting to grips with saddle and seat post adjustment in the last couple of weeks. I wish I could have seen this video before cluelessly playing about with the bike. But, the good news is, I seem to have found good base settings now. Maybe it's time for some "micro adjustments"......

[@markn4526]

The thing about saddle position/set-back is that it's not static. An experienced cyclist is always moving fore and aft on the saddle depending on what conditions they're riding in. Paying a bike fitter to find "your optimal position" on a bike is sort of funny since it's only one position from the many that you'll ride in off the trainer when actually riding out on the road. I'll bet you that most cyclists will ride further forward on the saddle when riding hard on the road. Also, it has been biomechanically proven that no one position works best for everyone and trying to force someone to ride in that position results in less power output, lower ability to hold that position for extended periods of time and potential injury. It's also interesting to note that what is thought of as "optimal riding position" has changed a lot over the past 30 or more years. That being said, if you are completely new to competitive, fitness or any form of serious cycling, a good bike fitter can probably get you in the general ballpark for proper positioning. But that's only a starting point.

[@Paulklampeeps]

I'm going to install my set back seatpost backwards because my bike has i think 70-71° st angle.😂

[@GNX157]

Not enough was made about crank arm length when talking about seat height and fore aft, especially as it relates to shorter riders on mass produced bikes. Before anything is done with a bike fit, determining proper crank length should be done, and riders over 5’9 will usually be okay with what’s on their bike, but if you’re 5’7 and shorter, you’ll most likely need a 165-170 crank arm or shorter, and they rarely come stock on a bike.

[@bonbonflippers4298]

This! Been rising 172.5 crank for so long, knees and hips felt weird. So I bought a 160mm crankset and felt so much better on the down and up.

[@SilverShamrock71]

I keep repeatedly banging my knee against the top tube when sprinting out of the saddle, no other aches or pains after a long ride, so don't think it's my bike fit, looking at knee strap options, but don't want a dirty great big MTB style protector

[@tonypowers123]

For anyone watching this video. The points Phil is mentioning thru in the list of potential problems with saddle too far (back) can be very much mimmicked by another (huge) factor- saddle height. Saddle too low is as Bad as saddle too high. Be absolutely mindful of that. My experience, Saddle too low led to: Knee pain, (extreme!!) upper back pain, anckle/ foot pain. Then the opposite: "a bit" too high (not extremely) led to: Lowe back pain, and upper shoulder discomfort. The fore-after position, that you will feel more in the hands, wrists, elbows. Definitely find the "near perfect" saddle height first, then figure out the fore/after. Extra tip- heel to pedal for saddle height, that's bs- good luck w solving your correct height w that method! Measure your inseam and go with the two options, multiply by 0.883 and measure from BB, or inseam × 109% and measure that from pedal spindle. And then work from there, few mm up or down. But do not be confused by saddle only being too high, the problem could also be too low.

[@michaellane1316]

Many things to consider. Most folks have one leg/foot, shorter than the other. Sometimes a good chiropractor will detect a longer/shorter leg, due any number of issues. for instance; my right leg was broken early on in age. Since then my right foot is slight shorter due to being in a cast. Another is it runs in mom's side of family, slight curvature of back with hip misalignment on right side. Overall, right side is shorter. I can adjust both sides and the left never is effected by any adjustments but the right takes a long time to dial in. Never have had a bike fit, yet may pick up on that do it yourself trial to see if I can get it closer. Generally don't have neck/back pain issues, just right outer posterior ankle sometimes outside knee. Have bowed lower legs so considering pedal extensions/shims. I can usually notice most things if adjusting, within 1-5 miles. My extended rides of 2 hours will find any weak spots. Each bike is different, saddle, shoes, cleat positions, etc.. My goals at 68 will be a hundred plus a day. Have a trip I'd like to get in before the great, "can't do that anymore", sets in. Overall, I'd give my two cents as, know your own physical body, limitations, experience level, goals. Find the happy medium and be comfortable enough not to make it a chore and ride on.....

[@1981ricardo]

The lady picked the wrong bike brand, try an Olympia or a Tommasini.

[@adamvancleave8961]

Is this guy speaking English? Can you translate for us please...😮

[@CycletheNation]

That's so good to hear from a true expert about fore / aft. I'm similar, got crazy long legs for my height and my saddle is way back. I actually had to get a shorter stem too as I was still over-reaching. I guess now I've done a 200 mile ride with no issues, it must be bang on.

[@richardwoad6477]

I love your adventures with Greg, Sally, Dave, and Richard. When you go out on trips to London for example, maybe a London to Brighton cycling run sometime in the near future, you guys?🤔I've just got back from my Hyde loop🤣let onto a lady cyclist on a who just ignored me. Although maybe women alone syndrome, so I let that one go. Something else happened. I was going through a gap in the traffic only wide enough for one car. so I carried on through and of course Mr Nxxhead car driver came through the other way and nearly knocked me off my bike, It was tight from what i remember. I thought about the bus and Katie incident, scary shit cycling on roads, I don't know where you guys get your nerve from? Maybe I'll stick to cycling on my rollers!!!😂

[@clivepritchard]

I have exactly the same problem! Switched to a model with lots of stack per reach (Domane) and really comfortable for the first time ever. Do you find any specific types of saddle help with this?

[@andygoldensixties4201]

I think that once the size of the bike is correct (I mean custom made of course), and the height of saddle and handlebar is correct, the body can adapt itself to "small" errors. This as long as you 1) are young and 2) are not looking for extreme performance. When with age I developed a spinal hernia I recovered with swimming and a saddle-post shock adsorber. When finally came the issues with the thing that starts with "pro" (but is not "professionalism") I tried a lot of different saddles, but it turned out the the best is a saddle for ladies (shorter in lenght and larger in the rear). I mean, Dr.Phil is 100% right, but every body is a unique.

[@monkmchorning]

I agree. The geometry is not optimal for her, but the fit makes the best of it.

[@AndyHill]

Cheers for that. I'm MTB to the core... obviously you're a bit limited on hand positions on MTB bars and for a while now I've has wrist and hand numbness on longer rides. Tried Ergon grips which helped a bit but didn't cure it. After watching this, I started wondering if I had my saddle too far forward pushing me on to the bars... so last ride I pushed the saddle back by no more than 1 cm so it sat in the middle of the rail marks. Wrist and hand numbness greatly reduced! Honestly hadn't thought about saddle position being the issue until I saw this 👍👍

[@robowen66]

Same here Katey, I'm a man with the same thing, short torso, long legs. We're sexy!

[@altern8tive]

Stomping on the pedal downstroke and overworked quads can also be an indicator of a saddle that's too far forward / too high

[@jerrymurphy2314]

Thanks for another class at Phil Burt University. He does a great job explaining complex concepts.

[@YT-op6oc]

Honestly thank you both so much! These vids are brilliant💙

[@spaceplane4541]

Appreciate the video, but I was hoping Phil would also talk about balance as related to saddle forward and aft. I’m also a tough fit, 6’4” with a long torso, and when starting out developed some bad pain in the elbow tendons with a normal (non setback) seatpost. Getting the seat waaaay back helps, but I still need more education on all the factors to help ease the elbow stress, balance being one. Thanks again for putting up all these great video’s Katie!

[@monkmchorning]

I discovered the importance of balance in the mid 1970s. Dave Moulton and Steve Hogg have something to say about it too. It's about keeping your center of mass from getting in front of your feet.

[@SkyhawkSteve]

agreed. I was expecting a mention that seat tube angle should be based on getting the body balanced fore and aft. Once that is done, then the top tube length should be based on the rider's reach and flexibility. I thought that the KOPS idea was debunked long ago.

[@davewright8206]

5:45 isnt that 3 o` clock?

[@rickmoses5081]

Great stuff thanks for the tip! My ONLY concern is, when speaking, SLOW DOWN. hi our words at times are running together. Hard to understand you sometimes.

[@KatieKookaburra]

I will pass this on! Thank yoooou :) I think Phil just LOVES this stuff so much he wants to get it all out haha!

[@darrenchubb6926]

Hi Katie good video all my bike saddles are all the same level and height take care

[@myroncunningham9042]

Katie thank you and Phil so much...

[@pedrosanciny6345]

Saddle fore atf shouldnt be used to tune reach. Saddle possition is about correct pedaling. Reach is corrected with stem.

[@GoodToCU88]

If somehow you can move the saddle back like 10cm it doesn't affect the reach? One can barely reach the handlebar at that point

[@pedrosanciny6345]

@@GoodToCU88 it affects, but it shouldnt be used for correcting reach. With fore aft position you are tuning pedaling position, not reach.

[@marcpost4034]

Moved my seat forward and higher for a season. Major right knee pain after about 2,000kms. Also noticed my butt would get sore after about 1.5 hours along with wrist pain. Decided to lower my seat and move it back. More comfortable position for me and can ride pain free for long rides.

[@rickyhynd7784]

That was an interesting video, cheers 👍 There wasn't any mention of saddle tilt though, I find even a micro adjustment to the tilt makes a big difference in comfort.

[@abedfo88]

There is a phil burt video (on his channel) about this very subject. Personally i like mine about 1.5-2 degrees down.

[@teecee4459]

Fill Burt?

[@dustisallthings4542]

I hope Phil didn't advise that frame for you. The forward seat rails, and cockpit setup, and positive stem are an indication that frame needs to be smaller. Good example for others to see how to address stack and reach.

[@KatieKookaburra]

Did you watch long enough for me to explain exactly the reason I couldn’t have a smaller frame??

[@dustisallthings4542]

@@KatieKookaburra Looks like your problem with the frame size decision begins here kzbin.info/www/bejne/mV6oYadqqNR_qbc A different frame, a different bike fitter, would improve your ride /training experience.

[@mircea5013]

I see this ALL the time. Short torso = short reach. It's NOT always the case. Some of us have short torso and really long arms, such as myself. 180cm tall, 184 wingspan, 86 leg inseam. I've a positive "ape index". So you would imagine all those people recommending me "smaller bikes" have been so very wrong, and I've struggled so much. I actually needed a pretty long reach.

[@ebikescrapper3925]

Most people's legs are not the same length so would measuring each inside leg matter in the overall saddle height calculations. If so would you use the shortest measurement as the basis for the calculation.

[@jim_nix71]

I used to ride with a guy who used 2 different crank lengths, as his legs were different lengths. It was only way he could ride comfortably

[@GNX157]

Scrapper, a good bike fitter will do a physical check on you prior to the fit, which should include leg length discrepancy, and a difference is typically handled thru shims under the cleats, not different crank arm lengths.

[@Greatfoodssupplementsworkouts]

Thanks 💯💯😎👌👌

[@kiethpederson7558]

My knees have been hurting in the front last couple of rides I'm actually kind of scared to ride again so I don't damage them.

[@triroo107]

How about you ride you favorite bike in one of those T-Rex blow up costume… 😂💪👍🙏🥂

[@mcgarvy7]

I think it’s best to just go down 1 size , u never want to be to stretched out on those long rides 20miles plus

[@tombryant52jumpscoach]

My only comments are I've just fixed my bike seat position fabulously, thanks and if you need someone with long arms to hold you tight, I'm your man.

[@garyp.7501]

I solved all my bike saddle and handlebar wrist/shoulder issues by riding a recumbent! If you are not racing a UBI race why put up with the pain? I have a Cruzbike, but there are other models that are equally comfortable if not as fast. I understand why racers stick with the diamond frame, and same for Mt bikes, but road bike riders? What is the deal?

[@67er_matze97]

ahhh ok - so the reason T-Rexes were rarely seen on bikes is probably because bike fitting was not yet invented at the time - or ???

[@julianmojica2719]

Thanks for the video but how to know if my torso Is really short? Because my insame Is 74, my torso 63

[@Noneofyourbusiness-rq9jq]

mine is all the way forward cuz my bike is to big and i can't afford a new one

[@lord1999ful]

Is that apply to a triathlon bike too? I did my Ironman and my knee hurts afterwards! But I felt much power on the bike after put my seat forwards!

[@jeffreystefanmaasdam6362]

i have the problem i always had ride an xc bike 29 inc i am 192 cm did great on the old bike now i have an new e bike with an other geometric frame yes i have it on my size and dropper seat on it but havin but problems constant and knee problems its an good tip i wil try

[@mikegreer1829]

If your saddle position relative to the saddle rails is wrong surely in your case an inline seat post would help?

[@restraum]

Thanks, very informative! One small problem though: a text overlay in the video mentions KOPS when Phil Burt is talking about Knee Over Forward Foot or KOFF. (Knee Over Pedal Spindle or KOPS is not used by any serious bike fitter-like Phil.)

[@FooFahFoeFum]

Why is it that Ausies speak so fast.

[@KatieKookaburra]

have to ask one :)

[@Alex-bh4um]

Great little tips , especially on the micro adjustments relevant to feelings... btw, I does feel your saddle height is really high on the video

[@ecopennylife]

LOL, never noticed your saddle was set forwards 😋

[@choppertastic]

Not got sore back or knees but defo get numb nuts when I'm on the turbo

[@rollandjoeseph]

Handlebar hight would be a good video if you havmade it yet

[@mebunzing]

Nice video. Did you use the short cranks?

[@kevinlyon9501]

I hadn't noticed that you r saddle was that far forward, I loved that it was time trailing or Frenchmen with his onions, did make me chuckle.

[@George_ward_kozera]

What is the degree on your stem? I’m exploring different stems to try and give me a bit more handle bar height

[@alijoyce1081]

Is there a bike fit solution for back pain due to hyper lordosis .. where to start when looking for solution? Which factors are most likely? Thank you😊

[@KatieKookaburra]

I don't know but Phil will for sure. I will ask him to comment on these videos. Or if you drop him an email... his website with details is here: www.philburtinnovation.co.uk

[@kennyhollinsworth5395]

❤…I’m gonna try move my saddle a tiny bit forward

[@CarlJ-m5l]

3:24 does it for me. Thanks Phil!

[@biscottigelato8574]

Very long leg and very short torso, relative to ‘bike industry standards’, is not that abnormal… Bike manufacturers stopped making women specific fit bikes is a travesty. You can’t believe how many times I have heard woman saying they always have a hard time finding a bike that fits them….

[@KatieKookaburra]

You don’t need male / female specific frames. We just need bike companies that offer change of components to fit I.E. crank / stem / bar width! :)

[@WillMahler]

Great explanation of your saddle position and not surprised by all the keyboard warriors questioning your bike position. Being a 6'5" cyclist with a 38.5-inch inseam and really long arms and a short torso, I've had to read a lot about bike fitting and find Phil Burt's information quite useful. This a good reminder of when we age that periodically revisiting our bike fit is important. Especially now, that many of us cyclists are working from home, sitting more, and having dietary and mobility changes that are silently affecting our comfort on the bike. Keep up the informative posts!

[@Caleketa]

Great explanation. I have for my size also very long legs. This video is gonna get me better on my bike again. Since i moved my saddle i am having a bit knee sore, only on my right knee.

[@pamelalovell917]

How do you deal with scoliosis on a bike when hips are parallel left to right? Thanks Phil and Katie

[@MRPC5]

I'm just a random guy on the internet but from the kops demo it looks like your saddle is waay too high.

[@KatieKookaburra]

Yeah random guy on the internet.

[@Minieken1]

That is a nice tip ! I'm going to try that on my E-bike, can't find a good position. Thank's Katie .

[@kennethkuhl1188]

Very helpful video Katie, thank you.

[@John64125]

Looking for a free tip. I do tend to get a sore right knee (left is usually OK)but what’s strange is that it’s fine then feels very painful quite suddenly, normally about 90 mins to 120 mins into a ride? I wondered if it was cramp but could it be related to saddle position?

[@GNX157]

Get checked for leg length discrepancy.

[@elbugspinetta]

foward saddle gains more height, back saddle get shorter lenght

[@madaboutgolfs]

Wrong

[@pkeelan56]

Why are all the bike fitters British? We don’t have cyclists in America?

[@Horus-Lupercal]

Less cyclists in the states as it's too dangerous a place to bike.

[@guidovankemenade2564]

Very useful post. Thanks a lot !

[@soapowejazz]

In the fitting video from Francis Cade with James, he mentions that moving the saddle forward to feel less stretched out is a bad idea because that offsets the center of gravity of the rider with respect to the bottom bracket. This can result in too much weight on the hands. They, and also Neil from the video of Cam Nichols, also say that knee over pedal spindle is also a bad way of finding the correct fore and aft. I’m not pretending I know bike fitting, but who are we supposed to believe?

[@MrJaycobsen]

I think he's trying to simplify the topic. Neil's videos is much more detailed and thought out, listen to Neil :)

[@pauljohnson6955]

After a good number of years of trying loads of different saddles I came to the conclusion that there is NO such thing has a comfortable saddle. Think about it. I’ve sat down on a chair at home or work - after a couple of hours your up out of ya chair with a numb arse, so when your basically sat on something not much bigger than your mobile phone you get a sore botty. It’s that simple

[@SkyhawkSteve]

I hope you can find something that works for you, but I have to say that I don't have any problems with saddle comfort. I've got a variety of leather saddles on my bikes, but mostly Brooks, and have no troubles with 100 mile rides.

[@DAZLIN6]

Been getting knee pain on my roadie will try these tips thank you 😊

[@Dangling_Carrot]

Fore and aft what are we on a ship.

[@michac4744]

I've got weirdly long legs and a short torso too! Going to try playing with the saddle position 😊

[@wolfade89]

Can Phil or yourself Katie recommend a bike fitter based in the Midlands please?

[@KatieKookaburra]

Sorry I don’t know any - but can recommend Manchester for a great one :)

[@norcothesingingcyclist9129]

My own problems is a get a bit of a numb bum ! & and very tight up hill turns my foot will hit my my front tyre !!!!

[@MrLuigi-oi7gm]

Toe overlap with many of today's frames (when your front foot hits the front tyre on tight, slow turns) is not uncommon at all. It's more common with medium and small frames, typical length cranks (170mm) or larger, folks with big feet, and attaching your cleats further back on your shoes. You'll adapt. If you don't, you'll fall. 😳

[@gavinneale6651]

Great video, as a starting point how far back from the centre of the centre bracket to the seat tip be, I’m 5ft10 and ride a medium frame

[@michaelconway8352]

I use the lemond formula .... inseam measured in bare feet multiplied by 0.883. Stand against wall with feet about 8 inches apart. Take a thick book and push it up high into groin as if mimicking how sitting in saddle feels. Get somebody to mark where the spine of book touches wall. Measure to floor then X .883. Or use a long spirit level alternatively. In my case my inseam is 81cm. So the height from BB to saddle top is 71.5cm. I'm 5'9 1/2 and cranks are 172.5

[@andrewcrookes5775]

Katie I'm sure I saw you cycling in Ramsbottom East ?

[@KatieKookaburra]

Yesterday? That was me :)

[@lostboy8814]

Great video,I have to admit on first visuals I thought Katie's bike frame was too big.....now all explained it makes sense.

[@KatieKookaburra]

I’m a weird T Rex shape what can I say? 🦖🤣

[@daves5243]

@@KatieKookaburra My ocd would kick in and I'd have to swap out that offset seatpost for a zero setback post

[@matthewvelo]

I could watch Phil Burt videos all day. For a guy who's made a reputation as a professional physio/bike fitter, his simple and pragmatic approach is just brilliant.

[@jimmyhor78]

He got it wrong. You need to raise the saddle height if moving it forward.

[@yojimbo2812]

I rewatched that part and at 0:53 he says "If you move it forward, your saddle height effectively drops" ie, raise to correct.

[@donnasimpson8703]

Female here. Pressure pain front slightly left pubis. I keep shuffling back... pressure pain starts around 50k mark. My seat is like yours Katie, a lot of rail forward. Do you think maybe move a bit more forward?

[@KatieKookaburra]

It's worth a try! Make sure the saddle is between 0 and -3 degrees :)

[@donnasimpson8703]

@@KatieKookaburra thank you for reply.🌻

[@monkmchorning]

In my taxonomy for fitting bicycles, there are five body types: orangutans, dachshunds, tyrannosauruses, spider monkeys, and normals. Well, I guess we're all normal, but you know what I mean. Each type has its own set of fit issues. Katie's a T-rex, which explains the need for a short, high stem.

[@apair4002]

She maybe need smaller frame.

[@monkmchorning]

@@apair4002 a smaller frame would require a taller seatpost and even more stem rise. I'm inclined to say her current choice is hard to improve on without ordering full custom. Or perhaps she could have found a model with a little less reach and a little more stack.

[@amllubnrut]

Classic, a little T-Rex you crack me up 🤣

[@KatieKookaburra]

🦖🦖🦖

[@mohamedrawshan280]

Hello, Thank you for the great content. My height is 177cm and my road bike size is M. I set my saddle all the way back to make it knee over the pedal spindle. What is your opinion in this regard? Is it okay to make my saddle all the way back or I should go with the L frame where the saddle will be in the middle?

[@KatieKookaburra]

I can’t say as we all have different ways to ride so if it works and is more comfortable for you then go for it.

[@mohamedrawshan280]

​@@KatieKookaburra Thank you so much for your reply. I will check that with a couple of rides :)

[@chrisstrider]

Velociraptor ❤

[@jean-paulchaudron3104]

Welcome to the T-rex club!!! Same problem here..187cm tall but arms that are most of the time 10cm shorter than most people....

[@KatieKookaburra]

🦖🦖🦖

[@jean-paulchaudron3104]

@@KatieKookaburra have you ever thought about getting a bike made for you? Maybe something that Ribble should offer in the near future. Custom painted. custom build. We are allowed to dream right....

[@drken70]

Go Phil.

[@dheat24]

Great informative video again. If your on a 54 frame when you should be on a 52 is it still achievable to make it fit?

[@KatieKookaburra]

It depends totally on your make up. Defo go see a bike fitter :)

[@GNX157]

It’s easier to make a slightly smaller bike fit you than a slightly larger bike.

[@timluscombe6686]

I’d like to see you on a smaller frame to see how the set up would be. I find the same issue but I can’t just buy another bike to see the results, whereas you have the contacts to try different frame sizes. I’m sure a lot of people ride the wrong size frame.

[@KatieKookaburra]

A smaller frame would be waaaay too short on the head tube so would be too dropped down. I’m 5’ 10 so a small frame on this bike just wouldn’t work.

[@Barrygee]

In other words the ribble geometry is wrong for you….do you have the same issue with other brands?