Keto diet and high LDL study - Diet Doctor Podcast

Dave Feldman released preliminary data from a lean mass hyper-responder study that investigates elevated LDL while on a keto diet. He presented the baseline data at the Symposium for Metabolic Health in San Diego, and the reaction was notable - both supportive and critical.
The results of the study have the potential to change how we view elevated LDL cholesterol. But for now, we have to be patient for the end results and cautiously take away the lessons we can from the preliminary data.
Table of content
0:00 Introduction
1:45 Dave Feldman
3:11 The preliminary data from the new LMHR study
10:31 The plaque burden data from the study vs similar cohort
18:51 The current take home from the study
26:07 Could the low LDL findings from the study transcend to cases with higher LDL number?
32:17 The public reaction of the study
36:45 Matthew Budoff, MD
37:38 Any hesitation about the study?
46:57 Dr. Budoff and the ketogenic diet
49:42 Responding to criticism about the length of the study
54:34 Conclusion
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[@realDaveFeldman]

Thanks for having us on, Bret. And thanks so much to everyone who has either contributed to the study directly through our charity or is participating directly in the study!

[@AZ89231]

When will you be getting your Nobel Prize, Dave? Can I attend the ceremony?

[@JWB671]

Isn’t lean mass the main issue here instead of the macro breakdown of the diet? Lean people aren’t eating an energy surplus and therefore won’t be insulin resistant, diabetic and developing heart disease? If you are keto, have high LDL, but are eating an excess of energy (and are fat as a result), then you will develop heart disease same as anyone else.

[@zenmindbody2338]

@@JWB671 No. Considering that being lean doesn't prevent insulin resistantance , diabetes or cardiovascular disease. As well , metabolically healthy obese individuals. An obvious difference being visceral adiposity. The unobvious differences between lean, obese, healthy and unhealthy are why the studies are needed..

[@JWB671]

Hasn’t Dr Taylor proven you don’t become diabetic until you reach your personal fat threshold (which may be very low in some people granted but even these people wouldn’t be considered lean but skinny fat)?

[@jillnelson8746]

Please do a TRANSCRIPT version 😢for those of us who much prefer to read -going faster than rate of speech because I am NOT AN AUDITORY learner here. Again please define “low carb “!

[@fritz1805]

" Bad cholesterol" The Human body would not produce something that is bad for it. Now back to my rib-eye.

[@ah3710]

I’m so glad and thankful to be selected as one of the participants in the lean mass Hyperresponder study, started keto June 2017.❤🙏❤️🙏❤️🙏❤️🙏❤️🙏❤️🙏❤️🙏❤️

[@Michael-008]

Can relate to the doctor visit. Yearly check up is a month away last year my LDL was 411. You can imagine what I heard from my doctor I go through several days of stress afterwards.

[@PhilipModDev]

My LDL was 212 and my doctor told me to STOP keto ASAP. Keep in mind my blood pressure is normal, lost 20lbs down, Trip was normal as well.

[@thelaststylebender1678]

@@PhilipModDev why not go on a statin then? I would just say to continue keep but take this crestor.

[@FJB_TheBigGuy]

@@thelaststylebender1678 Because statins are trash and toxic.

[@Angel283]

Same :/ not interested in a statin!

[@2bbossfree]

@@thelaststylebender1678 Statins ar ehorrible.

[@ozysjahputera7669]

I am so happy to see another engineer getting into medical research. Coming from another engineer who did 2 yrs of post-doc in cancer epigenetics.

[@krisjustin3884]

Dave Feldman is becoming a medical legend! Here is someone challenging the so called forbidden boundaries of Science.

[@krisjustin3884]

@@billdickson1142 Oh no! How could I have done this? How I hope most of the forgotten team involved can somehow find it in their hearts to forgive me for this most dreaded oversight! How perceptive of you to have spotted this within 3 months of this comment. Indeed a good learning experience! What a wake up call!

[@Polkadotpup]

You might want to talk to me. I’m 72 and been low carb since Atkins in the 70s. Never smoked, never fat, no hypertension, no diabetes. Not on any meds. Overall cholesterol…263 Trig..59 Hdl..100 LDL..151 Ratio 3 I’ve been pretty much these numbers forever. Hope this helps.

[@n2daair23]

Man, almost a copy of my situation, but I’m 61. Always been healthy, I thought, then went for the CAC scan and BOOM, lots of calcified plaque. Crazy stuff, and scary!

[@Polkadotpup]

@@n2daair23 have you had your ApoB checked?

[@TheFeelyourself]

@@n2daair23 thats scary...

[@beacomrie343]

I'm a 63 year old female with high cholesterol all my life. I've low carbed for about 20 years now. Ldl bounces between 225-325 depending on what I eat. Dr. pushing the new 2 twice monthly shot which I will never take. I had a very bad experince with statins in my 30s that caused permanent damage to some nerves. He ordered a carotid artery ultrasound and a CAC scan. Very tiny bit of plaque in one carotid artery and a cac score of 10. The cac score was lower than the average person my age. His answer was I should still do the shot! After a lot of research I've come to the conclusion that most heart disease is genetic. Blood pressure and diabetes are the next biggest risk. High ldl in the context of those risks is bad. Ldl in itself maybe not so bad .

[@TheRWE12]

My fractionated Lipid results from the Mayo Clinic say I most likely have FH. High LDL 260, low triglycerides 115 (down 60), 40 HDL(up 3). I won't take statins. Research proves nothing positive about statins. Two of my doctor admit 'they don't know how to read the test results'! Jeez. 've been on Keto for 13 months. Lost 80lbs! Feel like a million bucks! Don't feel like I should worry or do anything. Feeling 99% better than last year.

[@saltrock9642]

Same crap here, all was great except that LDL was slightly up. My doctor actually tried to negotiate with me about putting me on a statin, I grew aggravated. But when he said…”How long do you want to live?”…..I walked out.

[@thefreshprinceofnohair9703]

Get an Apo B test it’s the best method for determining if you’re at risk of atherosclerosis.

[@TheRWE12]

@@thefreshprinceofnohair9703 That is inconclusive at this point as well. Although I've heard that about ApoB . Is ApoB ...Apoliaprotein B, S on the test? PS two doctors in my clinic didn't even know. WTF

[@jerseyjim9092]

My Cardiologist was certain I was FH with a 290 LDL. But I had my doubts because I could reduce it to normal levels with a low saturated fat diet. Genetic testing ruled out FH but other testing (sterol) showed that I was both a hyper synthesizer and hyper producer of cholesterol. Statins lower my cholesterol but my body compensates by producing more. The typical recommendation is to take both a Statin and Zetia but I am Statin intolerant. So he got me approved for a pcsk9 inhibitor. That with a very low dose of crestor and niacin gets my LDL down in the 80s while still allowing me to eat ketovorish. I haven't noted any apparent side effects except possibly some fatigue but can't say for certain if it's linked to it or not. I'm hoping to get a full blood panel done at years end to see if anything is out of whack with my lipid profile or hormones. I did have a CAC score of 363 in 2018. I had a repeat in 2020 and it had dropped to 269. I'm not sure calcium can reduce so I think it was probably the result of machine or operator variation. I may have another done in a few years.

[@rosalbadelriogarcia9598]

@@jerseyjim9092 why not trust your own instincts instead of doing the drugs. THEY (DR'S) RESEARCHERS do not know the true baseline cholesterol numbers for human beings. It's what Dave Feldman was saying. The supposed 'risk' is yours alone to take. Keto/low carb will completely reverse any calcification in your veins. There's a Dr on you tube that completely reversed his calcification. I always wonder about those of us that really do not want to fully trust our own nutrition in our own hands specially knowing about the current * true science* not the expert panels of mainstream media but the true and tried power of one, you and I and Diet Dr and low carb communities, keto communities and carnivore communities. Dr's are owned by the clinics they practice at and they find it difficult to work with their patients in an honest and open manner. Also they are bound by policies of the medical boards and the medical government entities:( Its like having your eggs and removing the yolks or VS versa. Plus as a cell and DNA epigenetic expressions I would think we know better what to do for ourselves. God bless Always!

[@tuyendo7409]

I admire Dave for his Love of science in medical , it takes courage

[@hikari8858]

Thank you Dr. Scher for having both Dave Feldman and Dr. Matt Budoff together to give us this update about the study. As someone who has been eating low-carb for many years and with an LDL above 300 for the past few years (all my other "numbers" look good), I'm very interested in the results.

[@juhotuho10]

I have been waiting for the results ever since the study was announced! Great stuff overall

[@DanEngell]

Thank you, Bret! I've been ordering my own lab work annually for 4 years now, instead of having a doctor do it. Thanks to YOU and Dave, I ordered lab work last week from Own Your Labs. It was significantly less expensive than the site I used to order through, and that is BEFORE the 10% Citizen Scientist discount. In the interview, Dave mentions that a lot of low carbers don't have previous blood work to compare to before their dietary intervention. I think I have been getting annual blood work since 2010. I always had low HDL (31-35) and high Trigs (around 200). I thought I was doomed. I was put on blood pressure medication at the age of 38 and met the criteria for Metabolic Syndrome. As an experiment, in 2015, I drank bulletproof coffee every day for three months before getting my annual blood draw. I thought it might be a disaster but just wanted to know. It WASN"T!!! I've been keto or low carb ever since with no plans to go back. Last week my HDL was 76, the highest ever. Trigs were 69, the lowest ever. I also did a fasting insulin for the first time with an HbA1c so I could use that "QUICKI" calculator for insulin resistance measuring. Both tests were only 20 bucks! My LDL is 129 (and TC is 217) so of course I devour as much as I can learn about it as a stand alone marker. I like being a guy that weighs 180 instead of 220 (lbs!) for seven years now. People even say I look younger. I'm 59 but people usually assume 45. The LDL and total cholesterol are the only questionable outcomes in my N of 1 experiments. I will stay tuned to this space and thanks again for your work.

[@DK-pr9ny]

Thanks for sharing great info! Did you ever get a CAC score?

[@realDaveFeldman]

Thanks for the shout out on OwnYourLabs. And hey, a portion of proceeds for everyone's purchase helps fund this study directly - so you're actively helping us make it a reality as well. 🙏

[@DanEngell]

@@DK-pr9ny I have NOT gotten a CAC yet but it IS on my radar screen.🙂

[@TheShumoby]

I'm fortunate enough to find a doctor that allows me to get whatever lab work I want.

[@dtla5052]

Eternal keto?

[@robyn3349]

Thank you for adding to our knowledge.

[@entropy0917]

Wish I could have been in this study. I have some near LMHS qualifying factors, but had no non-statin bloodwork from before starting Keto in mid-2019 and stopping statins. (I assume that since I was on a statin that my previous LDL was high) My BMI is now about 19.4 for past few years, and average LDL on Keto has been 230+ (over 17 tests). All other bloodwork is great and am athletic. After 1 year on Keto and no statin I had a CAC scan in mid 2020 at age 69 which was 3.78. I intend to get another CAC scan soon which will be close to 2.5 years after the 2020 test. Am very interested to see what it is now. Can't afford the more expensive soft plaque scan. Another interesting side note is A1C and the apparent gradual disconnect for a number of low carb people between low avg blood sugar numbers versus higher A1C. My A1C went from 4.9 initially on keto to increasing up to 5.6 which from my frequent glucose testing is maybe 20pts different. Healthy red blood cells living much longer than avg? I'd be very curious how frequent this observation is among the LMHS population. I found a thread on Dave's website discussing this from a few years ago. I have a pdf of 30 statin RCT's where nearly every one shows virtually no benefit to all cause mortality.

[@stevea3335]

Thanks for all you do Dave. It would also be great if the results of the study could shed some light on AVSCD risk for metabolically healthy "standard hyper responders".

[@artcoin9699]

Great interview’s as well as much needed information. I’ve transitioned from Keto to Carnivore 1 month ago and turbocharged my health it feels

[@kennethyuman1940]

Huge thanks go to Dave and Matt for challenging what many hold as final and full truth. The next year will be a test on our patience.

[@chriswhitehouse8982]

Very interesting work. Look forward to the final data and conclusions.

[@SamShank175]

I love Dave's work. I've been doing low carb for about 3 years. I'm not as lean and my cholesterol is not as high as a lmhr. That said, my cholesterol is well over what they consider high, yet all of my markers of inflammation are low and I have a coronary calcium score of zero.

[@deborahelizabeth7012]

Found this video after I got my lab results back today. 56 yrs old, 5'7" and 132 lbs. I have been doing keto for 3 months and carnivore the last month of the three. My LDL went from 94 in 2020 to 234 today. Hdl 101, and triglycerides 49 My appointment is in 2 weeks. I'm not looking forward to it! I did keto in 2018 and my levels were ideal. I'm thinking I may need some nuts or some other plant products back in my diet. My problem is I get horrible bloating, cramps, and have a lot of undigested food and fat in my stool when I eat vegetables, especially raw ones. Grains are the worst for me, so I won't eat them. On the carnivore diet all my digestive issues went away and being keto adapted my migraines and elbow pain went away too. I'm not going to worry about it yet. Maybe I'll reintroduce small portions of well cooked vegetables like zucchini or cauliflower or some blueberries back into my diet and see how I do.

[@JD-rc6lq]

Your HDL and trig numbers are amazing. Looks like you are on the right track!

[@farrokhfarr2694]

Dear friend Concedering your HDL ratio you are immortal ❤😂

[@OHBuckNow]

Thank you.

[@louisag5410]

So interesting… Waiting eagerly for the outcome results…

[@hlits6310]

Thank you so much Brett for having these fine people on to illuminate cutting-edge knowledge to us lay-people who otherwise would have no access to this groundbreaking information.

[@wenminli6475]

Thanks Dave and Bret for the interesting talk! I have a naive question and I would really appreciate if you could shed some light. Why wouldn’t you check the advanced lipid panel, such as small LDL, apo-B etc to find out the risk, which seems to be a quicker approach? Many thanks!!

[@kroop5427]

Thank you!

[@minaprice7840]

Dave I have been so happy with your dedication! Your hypothesis is so interesting. I am low carb but not keto. My triglycerides have gone way down and my HDL is way up. My LDL stays relatively consistent between 120-186 when off statins. They make me feel so badly but I can get my LDL down to 106 before a test just taking the statins twice a week for about a week prior. I stopped smoking ten years ago and have a history of bone density issues and this has also improved on low carb. I wish I could be in your study but since the LDL has stayed consistent I don’t think I qualify. Keep up the great work!

[@minaprice7840]

Prior to low carb 2018 LDL 161 HDL 56 Trig 181 After low carb 2022 LDL 162 HDL 80 Trig 71

[@realDaveFeldman]

@@minaprice7840 Thank you for your interest. We may be doing future studies with a more relaxed eligibility criteria, so keep checking in.

[@minaprice7840]

@@realDaveFeldman will do! I stalk the internet for your talks. They have been few and far between because of your study lately. I was excited to see this one!

[@ylcalif3681]

Close to LMHR . . . BMI 22.21 . . . HDL 98 . . . Trig 58 . . . LDL 171 (LDL was 114 before starting low-carb 4 mos. ago) Dr. is pushing a relentless campaign to get me onto STATINS. Other blogs suggested that LMHR's get a CT calcium/plaque scan score before taking statins. I just did that and my CT scan had a calcium score of 11 . . . low risk (I'm 72 years). I'm also requesting a treadmill stress test to test my heart functions and an Advanced Lipid panel to see if particle size is large or small.

[@prins424]

Any updates? Thanks!

[@JD-rc6lq]

Your numbers look great. If Ken Sikaris is right you're low trigs mean you wont have small dense LDL.

[@fabio.1]

following

[@Magdasings]

Following

[@scottstevenson8989]

Glad to see Dave back in the limelight. I always have appreciated his insights on the cholesterol conundrum.

[@bruceprigge5212]

Thank you!! 🙂

[@HollyGeee]

Can we listen to the conference? I'm not sure if it was recorded. I'm anxious to hear more about the results of the study as a LMHR myself. Grateful to Dave and his team.

[@patrickdezenzio4988]

A question I would love to see answered is what is the % of people on keto say at least 2 years who had a heart attack or stroke compared to those that ate a normal diet? My doctor keeps wanting to put me on a statin because my LDL is 192-233, yet triglycerides are at 72 with a normal HDL and a LDL pattern A. I guess a CAC test would be a slam dunk as to what my arteries currently look like. I don't have a pre-Keto baseline to compare to but at least it would show what calcification I do have. Because of keto, my A1C is 5.4, I've dropped down to 148 lbs from a high of 195 and I no longer have GERD.

[@TheFeelyourself]

wud be interesting to know CAC score

[@zerocarbdoc]

Excellent Excellent! Important step in the progress of improving nutritional recommendations.

[@Philly1958]

Wasn’t there a recent study demonstrating the lack of correlation between LDL level and calcium score

[@GwenMotoGirl]

I went on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet in Jan 2009 and transitioned to a keto diet a year later, now carnivore for 14.5 months. My elevated LDL greatly concerns my nurse practitioner. It has been elevated the whole time I’ve been low carb. She does not support my diet(s). I’m getting a CAC test in 2 days. I’m not worried, but I want to show her. I was so very sick in 2009 and I’m so good now and have lived well for many years. I’m tired of fighting with my practitioners about my labs. I would self-order, but I have to have the labs and nurse practitioner to keep my desiccated thyroid medication prescription going. I appreciate the investment of time, energy and money that has been put into this study.

[@patrickdezenzio4988]

Same here. Been on keto and IF for 2.5 years and my LDL averages between 195 and 230 with particle number at 2,000 but pattern at A, the large fluffy kind. Triglycerides are at 72. My doctor keeps bringing up that he wants to put me on a statin. The only test I want to do is the CAC test because that will indicate what my arteries look like.

[@GwenMotoGirl]

@@patrickdezenzio4988 I hope you get the test. My Agatston Score is ZERO! I ate more saturated fat in the weeks before the test, and my LDL dropped 30 points, not that I care. Given my horrible cardiac family history (lots of deaths on my mother’s side from widowmakers at young ages (50 to mid-50s)), I think I’m winning this war. Best of luck to you!

[@thecolonel-truesoutherngen2230]

@Patrick Dezenzio maybe ct angiogram would be good as well. you need to see the plaque which does not show on cac.

[@terber6700]

I have used "Own Your Labs" multiple times now and really appreciate this video and Dave Feldman. I am curious to see if they get push back from big pharma.

[@dms8772]

What about a high HDL with high LDL. The HDL is like the PacMan and rids cholesterol out of the blood stream. We use to look at the high HDL overriding a high cholesterol depending on the HDL/Cholesterol ratio.

[@rospez1763]

Low carb diet, LDL 158, All other lipid #'s good! Is a Calcium Score recommended? Any advice?

[@lilytea3]

0:19: 📊 Dr. Brett discusses the preliminary data release for the lean mass hyper responder study, focusing on the elevated LDL levels in individuals following a ketogenic diet. 5:34: 📊 The study found that the total plaque score was lower than expected for the population, and participants had a high average LDL cholesterol level. 11:02: ! The presence of plaque was lower than expected for people with high LDL levels in the study. 15:44: 🔍 The speaker discusses the potential impact of data on patient-doctor relationships and the prevalence of familial hypercholesterolemia (FH) in the study population. 21:32: 🔑 The speaker believes that lipid patterns are a reflection of the state of atherogenicity and metabolic health, and suggests that lean mass hypersponders could provide insights into this understanding. 26:50: 🔬 The speaker discusses the threshold point of LDL cholesterol and its impact on lipid metabolism. 31:38: 💡 Getting a CT angiogram or CAC can be a wise move for assessing the risk of heart disease. 36:47: 📚 Dr. Matt Budoff, the principal investigator of the trial, discusses the preliminary data and its impact on the world of medicine. 41:47: 🔬 There is no personal pushback from the scientific community regarding the study on statins and LDL levels. 47:40: 🥩 The speaker was not initially supportive of the ketogenic diet due to concerns about high LDL levels. 52:14: 🔍 The speaker discusses their role in the trial and the protocol for addressing high grade stenosis or multi-vessel disease. Recap by Tammy AI

[@rosalbadelriogarcia9598]

My hubby has reversed his glucose, high blood pressure twice once ten years ago and reverted back to old habits AND again this past year after a severe accident that left him with a wound that wasn't healing due to high glucose and an infection. He again reversed his high glucose, high blood pressure lost 60 lbs or so and his cholesterol is high according to supposed cholesterol standard blood testing..

[@justocruz7479]

Started low carb in 2019, Total Cholesterol was 217/Triglycerides 96/HDL 40/LDL 158/VLDL 19. Last blood test in 2022 total cholesterol 427/Triglycerides 58/HDL 59/LDL 356/ VLDL 12. Weight in 2019 was around 230, current weight 182. In between that time I've been down to 170lbs. I tried to get into Dave Feldman's study but was rejected LOL. I reckon my LDL scared them off. But I feel a lot better than I used to. My A1C in 2018 was 5.9. Went down in 2020 to 5.6, then back up in 2021 to 5.9 and dropped the same year to 5.8 where it stayed for a year and then this year down to 5.7. Been a weight lifter all my life. Now I have included about an hour of cardio along with the low carb eating daily. I'm pretty sure 6 whole eggs per day sent my cholesterol soaring. I've cut down to 2 whole eggs with my breakfast daily. We'll see what that does to the LDL.

[@johnhardin6969]

I believe they were looking for people with a higher HDL. I could be mistaken.

[@TheRWE12]

According to 'latest' study. Dietary cholesterol did NOT affect blood lipids. I know, go figure.

[@DK-pr9ny]

Eggs are good. I wouldn't reduce those.

[@justocruz7479]

@@DK-pr9ny I still eat 6 whole eggs on the weekend (Sat and Sun) but only 2 whole and 4 whites during the week days. So still more than average.

[@justocruz7479]

@@TheRWE12 Not enough studies have been done to know for sure on that. I still eat more eggs than the normal person LOL.

[@n2daair23]

Question, but with LDL so high wouldn’t the need for further breakdown of types of LDL that is being observed then be required?

[@alchemy1]

I don't know any thing about the lean hyper thing. Here is what I have to say. Age 65 Height 5'.7" Here is my total report: HDL-C went from 40 to 75 Triglycerides went from 225 to 50 A1C dropped from 5.7 to 5.3. Not sure how long I have had high blood glucose. Weight loss without hardship, 210 to 165 lbs. Average blood pressure dropped from 140/90 to 120/75 ================================================= The so called bad: Total cholesterol from 183 to 491 LDL from 104 to 350 ===================================== Following symptoms vanished Heartburn Dry flakey skin Body itching Sensing things crawling on my skin or hair. Eyes look more clear. Feeling of comfort inside my body at all times. Heart palpitation. Sleep is much more restful if I am not disturbed by whatever it may be. Always some black heads somewhere on my face.. No more zits. I don’t get cuts easily. Stronger skin. A bump, ingrown hair on my leg for years just suddenly came off. At last poof. My morning breath is not so annoying that I can’t wait to brush the sucker. I don’t feel bogged down.. Just a fresher energy. The air feels better and my mood is simply much lighter and better. I used to get light headed more often than I cared and that is gone. There was a strange, odd itch on the side of my left foot. I inherited it from my ex wife. she got it from someone else, it would appear every so often. It is no more at all. I get up less often at night to urinate. In fact I only woke up once last night. I say wow. Oh, no more bleeding gums here and there I used to get when flossing. No more back pain, neck pain especially when I get up in the morning. I tolerate cold and hot weather far better. Very interesting. Glass/shard in my elbows gone, I just don’t seem to notice any hemorrhage. Unlike before when my feet hurt after walking for a mile or two, I can walk for miles and miles without any pain whatsoever. No dandruff whatsoever. --------------------------------------------------------------------

[@SongbirdRanch2005]

Nice! LCHF diet? What is your fat: protein ratio? Thanks!

[@alchemy1]

@@SongbirdRanch2005 To be honest, after some 9 months I gave up strict keto/carnivore diet. Why? I decided that there was no need to keep my cholesterol high. I found no evidence that normal level of cholesterol was bad for you. So I experimented to see what caused the huge rise in my cholesterol level. If it was red meat or just adding too much fat, butter and such to my food. I decided to experiment. I dropped all red meat and all that fat. I added lots of vegetables, I only ate seafood. After a month not only did my LDL-C take a huge dive but I also lost more weight as with keto/carnivore diet my weight had reached a plateau. My LDL-C went from 350 to 150. MORAL OF THE STORY? YOU HAVE TO EXPERIMENT. Oh I should mention that HDL-C went down just a tat and TG went down even more compare to before.

[@2bbossfree]

I'm waiting for the study with the "fat mass- lost lots -responder" people. Volunteering in a heartbeat. Also LDL and stroke.

[@ketodreamofficial]

Great video !! The keto diet is amazing !! It will change your life😍

[@navy80to04]

Need a link to sign up for the study group

[@perrysebastian6928]

The thermal effects of the energy transport is very interesting. The correlation between higher levels of CM, an increase in BG, and a higher body temp shows up in feeding and fasting periods. The CM are fat lipids so an increase in body temp to increase blood viscosity makes sense to increase enable energy transport after consuming fat. During extended fasts the body temp lowers and BG levels go down. The conventional thought is that BG goes down because ketones go up, but if viscosity plays a role then the need to transport large lipid particle has diminished and a lower body temp can be used to transport energy. So the metabolism turns down thermal production to save energy.

[@northerncoloradotransparen1454]

The biggest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge.

[@monetaryjack1705]

I don't even know my LDL- last home test I did the TC was ">500" ie the "mission 3 in 1 " unit was overloaded- my HDL was 75 and TGL was 68.... so the LDL calculation cannot be done without the TC figure....I'm 2 weeks off of eggs as I was eating 4-6 a day so just trying an elimination aspect... 54yo M, non diabetic, bike a lot and RHR is 43bpm and maxed it out on a hill at 192bpm a week ago so assuming my arteries aren't probably blocked lol

[@robertryan1663]

Awesome conversation. I think the fact that the people doing the study don't have a financial incentive to influence their opinions makes this study probably more trustworthy than most of what we see today.

[@georgiesingleton714]

Absolutely!! Very exciting and impressive!

[@nocarbsnation]

Literally had a Dr appointment this morning. To help ease my Dr's concerns of my next lipid panels, I asked if I could get an ApoB and LDL-P test. He informed me my insurance will NOT cover these tests. That's really sad. I have no plans to take a statin, but I was willing to dig deeper with these other tests to get a more clear picture. Not sure why the insurance company would be against this. I am trying to schedule a CAC test since it's been over 2 years since my last one. For reference, I've been eating an extremely low carb (0-10), animal based diet for almost 5 years and feel amazing.

[@ketolomics]

Even if insurance won't cover the test, the lab will almost always give you the insurance-adjusted price. You can have the doctor's admin call the lab and verify the price you'll get. Personally, I find that low TG and high HDL, along with low hbA1c, tends to point to large LDL (Dave Feldman's web page probably covers this topic in depth). If the NMR panel is prohibitively expensive, you might already have some reasonably indicative information from your other panels. Check it out. If there are exceptions to this pattern, Dave would be the one to know.

[@nocarbsnation]

@@ketolomics Thank you!!

[@MrPokerblot]

It all depends on many different factors. Sooooo many. Trying to pin down specific markers etc with diet/health on population trials is the hardest scientific study because It’s impossible to clarify results in any situation as any noise in any particular study or specific experiment and in the individuals involved in the study make the number of factors almost infinite.

[@christinashawgo6510]

I’m living this right now. My CT scan is 414. My LDL is 334. Been keto for 3 years. Weight loss was in first year. 65# I have no other risks. I am 68 years old

[@justocruz7479]

Just out of curiosity if you don't mind me asking are you exercising on a regular basis? Taking any supplements like vitamin k2, vitamin E, vitamin D3?

[@christinashawgo6510]

@@justocruz7479 K2, D3, Eating raw garlic daily. The CT scan was just this week. My cholesterol has been high for years. My blood pressure is low and stable. I have no pain. I am active.

[@bighands69]

I suspect that your age is playing a part in the figures.

[@SC-xo4lz]

There a lot of videos about keto diet and LDL level, but what do you think about someone with high lipoprotein(a)? Is keto diet still suitable?

[@n2daair23]

I have been trying the low carb/keto diet with pretty good results, although my ldl is a little high. Hdl and triglycerides were at a good ratio. I’m 61, not overweight, no hypertension or diabetes, 6’@150, and no family history. Decided to get a CAC scan which came back VERY high (over 1k). A complete shock to me as I have absolutely zero symptoms of CAD. I’m assuming that I must be one of the lmhr by the numbers I’m seeing. So, I ended up going to a cardiologist who has now put me on crestor and aspirin. I’m just hoping this is the correct approach for this situation as I have become more and more confused. Really weird cause I’ve always been pretty proactive about my health, always active and always at a healthy weight. Oh, and never smoked.

[@primalspirit1]

Do you have any data on whether a keto/low saturated fat diet raises LDL as much as a keto/high saturated fat diet?

[@MsElke11]

I'd like to offer my data for this study. What was the link??

[@dacisky]

Thanmks for thgis. The waiting is the hard part.keto sixteen years with the usual results. I will not take statins.

[@vas4739]

In my 5th year of regular keto /IF and have elevated LDL.waiting for a hard copy of my blood draw to go over it with information from the internet. My PCP doesn’t like it and I want to be able to defend it.

[@habashyrhabashyu29]

Hello i have a question .. is the nicotine liquid wich contain glycerin not for keto

[@wenminli6475]

Hi - I'm a LCHR myself - BMI 18, exercise twice a day (i.e. cardio and weights). Recently I visited a professor cardiologist in a top private hospital in London. The Professor treated me as one having the same risk as FH (Familial hypercholesterolaemia) and urged me to have 10% calories on starchy carbohydrates in diet to bring my LDL down. He told me CTCA (i.e. calcium score) was not a useful tool for younger people (i.e. below 60) and therefore asked me to have Carotid ultrasounds instead. He also told me that large buoyant LDL is also harmful (maybe in the context of FH)...

[@jackieburns5257]

Why is Calcium score not valid for those under 60

[@thelaststylebender1678]

I’m a lean mass hyperresponser. I’m also a physician. I do cardio and weight training. LDL above 160. Can I be enrolled.

[@jencieedwards1735]

I have been on carnivore for almost 4 months. I had my labs done. I’m about 10-15 pounds of where I want to be. Cholesterol is 408, triglycerides 240, hdl 72,ldl 288. What reasons for this is possible. On not on statins and don’t want to be. My A1C is 5.1. I’m a healthy person. I work in a lab and have plenty of lab history.

[@deekana]

I think I fit within this type. I'm 5 feet 4" (162 cm) tall, weighing 46 kg. A bit muscular. I exercise at least a few hours everyday at an intermediate level for many years now. I used to be an Atkins but my Lipid went sky high, together with some other health problems. Not wanting to depend on drugs, I dug deeper and found the China Study by Campbell and was converted to a vegetarian. My LDL was quickly brought within a healthy range. I remained a vegetarian for 8 years. However, this past year I suffered autoimmune diseases and herniated disk that won't get better. So I dug again and tried low carb. I was definitely not a Keto as I heard many caution about it. But I eat now meat, fish, and eggs. After 1 month, my LDL went up to 235, from 135!!! My HDL improves a lot too though and my TG was reduced significantly. So I wasn't worried about it at first. But as I dig deeper, I heard many concerns about high LDL and that it should be controlled. So now I'm a little lost. Anyway, I'm not a Keto person. I'm just a little perplexed as to why now that I'm eating animal-derived protein, mostly clean and not too much, less than 2 gram per kilo of body weight, my LDL seems to be going haywire. Should I be concerned and what should I do?

[@Lalalalalelo]

I have the same markers as you and I don’t care. So what if ldl is high? It would make sense since the lipoproteins are needed to carry fat all over the body in order to fuel it

[@SongbirdRanch2005]

I want to sign up to Dave’s test team. How can I do that? I’m 64, high LDL 300-400, HDL 80. Triglycerides 100. CAC 16. My doctor pushed me to take statin. Now on statin 10mg. And my hands suffered arthritis. I really want to get rid of statins.

[@nerolowell2320]

what about carnivore diet and high LDL ?

[@skip2820]

Not worried about my high LDL. Less Carbs, Less Insulin, Less LDL-Receptors in Liver, Higher LDL

[@WFPBFORLIFE]

Food Choices DOCUMENTARY- The truth about Food, Diet and Wellness

[@Magdasings]

Anyone here that has been through the tests In they’re 80s? I am 81, had open heart surgery in 19…5 bypass surgery and have never taken a statin. I am also in AFIBS for 2 years. My brain washing keeps me in anxiety but keeping strict keto anyway. I am looking for tests related to elderly CAD. I am a homeopathic practitioner and I am extremely healthy in every other regard. Looking for feedback and other older CAD patients. Thank you ❤️🙏🙏

[@Spongebob007]

I’m one! 22 bmi, so I’m not sure how lean ha. My dr is supportive of my diet & thankfully said he thinks my “triad” is fine

[@sarahb.6475]

The end result of the study is important but for me it doesn't really matter because I can eat what I can eat (due to numerous allergies + food sensitivities).. And my main food is grass fed beef. So even if it turns out to be bad (which I seriously doubt) my diet is not going to change. Because most carbs make me sick. Which is why I am almost carnivore. I don't like all of those reactions I get from carbs, including joint pain, peeling skin, etc. But otherwise I am very healthy. Was out walking for 5.5 hours yesterday and today I rode my horse. Feel fantastic as long as I get enough vitamins + minerals to fit my exercise. And I don't know if it matters or not, but I have not had that C19.

[@fabio.1]

I feel the same about changing my diet.

[@amandahuynh4307]

I want to start on keto and I need to get a good and simple cook book. Do you have any recommendations?

[@dietdoctor]

We have many recipes on our website available for free! dietdoctor.com

[@bakingbunny198]

The fast 800 receipe book has good low carb receipes

[@HeyHeyAlabama]

Was blood pressure part of the study?

[@OIOnaut]

Finland mentioned, and I was excluded from the study. I could have been your courier, Whyyyyyyyyyy?

[@barkeater7867]

So is saturated fat a concern now?

[@mark11145]

As a hyper responder with LDL at 292 I am very interested in the results of this study. I have chosen to start natural ways of lowering LDL, not because of my LDL levels but do to the corresponding high level of Oxodated LDL. Which is simply due to the total amount of LDL I have. I may modify this once the study results comes out.

[@jimo559]

Have you heard about the “Feldman Protocol”? 3 days before your blood test …. Have no coffee. Eat a sweet potato everyday. Boom!!! ….. normal LDL

[@fabio.1]

have you tried it, does it work? thanks@@jimo559

[@KevinSmith-4Liberty]

My first comments since my CAC Score was done this Friday. Bad news for you all. I have had 4 CAC Scans now. First two were before Keto. My current age is 55. Age 42 score was 0. Age 51 score was 62. I started Keto in 2019. Been strictly Keto/carnivore now for over 3 years. Triglycerides were 500 now they are 90. A1C was 5.9 now its 5.2.....labs are good.....Age 53 (2021) had another CAC Scan score was 108. This Friday was 2 years so I had my CAC Score done.....it was 226. That is a 45% annual increase on keto. I'm getting my APOE Gene test this Friday. Eating saturated fat is killing me. Sorry to burst your bubble but I have been totally on board...I listen to Ken Berry, Ivor Cummins, Eat Mostly Fat guy..... I also been taking double dose Vitamin K2 every day for 3 years! Didn't work for me. So I'm going low fat, complex carbs, Fish, skinless chicken breasts, lean protein with daily exercise. Be very careful eating all this saturated fat. Some people absolutely can't handle it. I'm apparently one of them. 3 years I have been eating pork rinds, fatty meat, bacon eggs.....it was killing me.

[@TheFeelyourself]

thats scary, wasnt expecting CAC to go up so much.

[@KevinSmith-4Liberty]

The thing is....being on keto/carnivore for 3 years did make all my blood work awesome....except LDL was a little high. But statins and prescription fish oil brought my LDL down to 65. If you only look at your lab numbers you are foolish. KNOW YOUR SCORE. Like Ivan Cummins says. Get you CAC Score...it cost me $55.00 dollars.

[@TheFeelyourself]

@@KevinSmith-4Liberty thank you, will check

[@JasonFuhrman]

Do you know your c reactive protein?

[@jeffj318]

What truly makes a lean mass hyperresponder? If one is close enough to the numbers, can they be considered a lean mass hyperresponder?

[@chazwyman8951]

I have a total serum cholesterol of 7.2 mmol/L What numbers are you using here? And how to convert?

[@jaywhoisit4863]

Google is your friend

[@btudrus]

1mmol/l = about 38.67 mg/dl which means 7.2 mmol/l =~ 278 mg/dl which is considered HIGH BTW, my numbers are somewhat lower but doing a multiple-day fast got me to >8mmol/l. I don't believe fasting is atherogenic, LOL.

[@cps_Zen_Run]

Instead of the position, Low carb initiates ketone production , better to say higher carb interrupts the preferred state of Ketosis.

[@terihooper789]

I am finding it hard to get a CAC scan. My doctor won't order it because insurance won't approve it. I am willing to pay out of pocket but the facilities who do the scans won't do it without a doctor's order.

[@Shakerhood69]

I paid out of pocket for mine at the local hospital, it was $80.

[@terihooper789]

@@Shakerhood69 They let you make an appt without a doctor prescription? Everywhere I've checked so far won't even make me an appt.

[@n2daair23]

I needed no appointment, just cash. Someone is blowing smoke at ya.

[@bighands69]

@@terihooper789 Go and find another doctor to refer you to the service.

[@Philly1958]

Are you looking at apo B? Not sure ldl c is relevant.

[@btudrus]

LDL-C *THAT* high is not possible with low apo-B. But I would suppose they do, if they do CAC and angiogramm which are waaaaay more expensive than a simple blood test...

[@traceydailey3254]

How high does your LDL need to be to be helpful in the Study?

[@reason3581]

“I just don’t see a reason to have an ApoB ever north of 60 milligrams per deciliter.” -Peter Attia

[@darlafitzpatrick8770]

Here, let me summarize the criticisms of this study. "Doctors who believe LDL causes heart disease despite utter lack of data suddenly concerned about validity of LMHR study design" ... (I'm lookin' at you, Peter Attia)

[@OIOnaut]

Nightingale Health I presume :)

[@Davidkxf]

I had a STEMI after 7 total years on a keto diet, with the last 2 years being carnivore.

[@kevinf2021]

Sorry to hear, what diet do you follow now?

[@Davidkxf]

@@kevinf2021 I'm on a modified Keto diet.

[@AZ89231]

Lipid-heart hypothesis = Newtonian Mechanics; Lipid-Energy Model = General Relativity 😂

[@bhfourtwoeight7343]

What the heck is a lean mass hyper-responder?

[@derryshore5586]

This will confuse people..We are told that loads of studies have been done and that Keto is good..Sat Fats good, and so on. Getting fed up with so called new studies when we have been told that enough studies have been done to warrent that Keto or low carb is the way to go. This is people's health here.

[@TerriblePerfection]

How is it confusing? It supports the view that cholesterol guidelines are arbitrary and not a measure of metabolic health or heart disease risk.

[@jacquelinefransaw6911]

IS KETO GOOD OR NOT

[@Nancy-Miles]

YES, KETO IS GOOD! And YES, it can elevate your cholesterol, but that's NOT the death sentence we've all been LIED to about. Over the last year it has literally saved my life and put my autoimmune conditions into remission. FACTS! I'm 50 and have not felt this healthy in decades. There is a transition period where you feel rough for a week or two while you're electrolytes get a bit imbalanced from the change in eating. Drink plenty of water and get plenty of electrolytes and that passes easily. Fat and cholesterol are NOT bad for you. In fact, that's what your BRAIN is mostly made of. Look into Dr. Ken Berry, Dr. Robert Cywes, Dr. Shawn Baker, Dr. Anthony Chaffee, Dr. Christopher Palmer. The gates keepers are losing the narrative. More and more people are learning the truth and are reclaiming their health. I'm just one of MANY. God bless!

[@timshel011]

If "Low Carb" (14 years for me) is not good I would dead already. Time to move on to something else ...

[@derryshore5586]

@@timshel011 What do u mean when you say, time to move on to something else?

[@chazwyman8951]

My view is that if you have a tendency to put on weight then you have to lower your carbs. Carbs are what is driving your hunger. On the plus side, meat and sich are very rich in micronutrients and this means Keto is great for getting everything you need with minimal or inflammation. Going keto makes fasting easy too. I've lost 45lbs doing keto and omad together this year. Now my weight is steady and no longer prediabetic. My HDL is up. MY LDL is still high but I think I have to accept that if I want to stay thin and healthy

[@hardtruth2039]

Having a Hdl/triglycerides ratio of 2 and under is key.

[@northerncoloradotransparen1454]

The Animal Ag industry has been pushy for decades with all these sexy diet names to romanticize and excuse mankind for the abuse of animals and make them feel good about their poor choices. Look around, Mother Nature is very angry with mankind.

[@WFPBFORLIFE]

Diabetes and obesity are caused by insulin resistance which is the build up of animal fats in cells that are not meant to store it. This causes insulin levels to rise and glucose levels in the blood to rise because it cannot enter into the cells.

[@alexmorgan3435]

Addicted to food is a pretty sweeping generalisation. What type of food? Food that makes you unhealthy, fat and diabetic or healthy food which is good for you? Without being more specific this is a pointless study and video.

[@MorrisseyMuse]

A diet that increases my cholesterol? no thanks! lol

[@robinbeers6689]

The LMHR phenotype is a small subset of the people who do low carb diets. Also, LDL by itself is irrelevant to health. These people have high LDL but also have low trigs, high HDL, a great HDL/trig ratio and zero blood vessel blockage.

[@DARKLYLIT]

Leiden 85+ study (724 patients from 1986-1996) People with highest cholesterol have: Lowest overall mortality (LDL above 250mg/dL) Lowest overall cancer mortality Lowest overall respiratory mortality Lothian Cohort Study: 1078 people followed in 2010 at 70 years of age People with highest cholesterol: lowest risk of hypertension lowest risk of stroke lowest risk of heart disease the higher your cholesterol, the better your cognitive function kzbin.info/www/bejne/p4nXlaNqd7Oshck

[@hiker-uy1bi]

LDL is an independent risk marker. The "Diet Doctor" and Dave Feldman are hacks. Doesn't sound like Feldman's "study" even has a control. Lmao

[@hiker-uy1bi]

@@gkelley77 Nope! Lots of animal foods don't raise LDL. Study the nutritional literature instead of "Diet Doctor" and Dave Feldman.

[@Beer_Sheva]

The drug companies have convinced everyone that LDL is the most important independent risk marker. Multiple studies (the ones that aren't sponsored by drug companies) show that insulin resistance and it's various symptoms (metabolic syndrome, T2D) is THE most important risk marker. Remove insulin resistance and LDL levels become meaningless... That's what we're going to see next year.

[@thefreshprinceofnohair9703]

Show me a case study of someone with very low triglycerides, optimal HDL , high LDL and a good HDL to LDL ratio, and has atherosclerosis.

[@thefreshprinceofnohair9703]

LDL doesn’t tell you how much cholesterol you have , it tells you how many vehicles you have that move cholesterol around, this is why people who fast often have high LDL. I agree high LDL matters if APO B is also high.

[@hiker-uy1bi]

@@thefreshprinceofnohair9703 Any young person who's ever had FH? Are you stupid? People with genetically high LDL regularly develop atherosclerosis and experience heart attacks in the 20s and 30s. This has been studied.