Kwasi Kwarteng: The detrimental effects of imperialism are still felt around the world - IQ2 debates

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Kwasi Kwarteng speaking against the motion "Britain's former colonies should stop blaming the Empire for their ills" at Cadogan Hall in London on 17th November 2011.
Event info:
The British Empire has a mixed legacy. On the plus side we brought railways, the rule of law and the English language, the world's lingua franca, to far-flung places. But it's also true that in the aftermath of WWII our rapid retreat from Empire was a bit too hasty: colonial administrators with little understanding of local history or culture created new countries by drawing lines on the map, ignoring the affiliations of religion, tribe or language.
So it's hardly surprising that our former colonies blame us for the subsequent wars and tensions that continue to this day in places such as Kashmir and parts of Africa. But isn't it all too easy for corrupt and unpopular leaders to use the Empire as a scapegoat for their failings? 60 years on, isn't it time for our former colonies to take responsibility for themselves? Who's right? Who's wrong? Come to the debate and decide for yourself.

[@ince55ant]

he would get sacked if he said this today and the newspapers would have it on the front page for days

[@pacboybbb5487]

They finally got him today.

[@KINGOFREVIT]

@@pacboybbb5487 haha

[@soneil]

Very well constructed arguments

[@tkk3852]

Very well educated man.

[@KBWRER]

This hasn’t aged well.

[@czgibson3086]

He's an absolute cretin whose name deserves to become a byword for blundering incompetence.

[@davidnichol6282]

Educated for himself not for those with mortgages.

[@alexanderde-sowah857]

@@davidnichol6282you mean the counter behaviour of the BOE cabal?

[@Soundboy817]

I read the gift n thought yh you’re part of it.... the establishment

[@Delmar483]

🤡

[@mountbatten2222]

SOMEONE COULD ASSUME; THAT HE CAUSED THIS BILLION DAMAGE; DURING HIS TIME AS MINISTER; TO THE NATION; AS REVENGE FOR THIS AWFUL BRITISH EMPIRE ! SUCH PEOPLE ARE MADE MINISTER IN A TORY GOVERNMENT ?!

[@dominickeefe2454]

Well he's certainly done his best to destroy this little ex imperial power in his infinitesimal yet devastating tenure as Chancellor. Talk about harboring a grudge.

[@matthewperrin4366]

It’s exactly what it is HISTORY. move on with something important like our economy climate immigration

[@GTRNR]

HISTORY CAN DETERMINE THE FUTURE AND IT EVEN GETS WORSE WHEN HISTORY REPEATS ITSELF. IRAQ AND KOREA ARE HISTORY... OR ARE THEY?

[@ince55ant]

this is just childish. do you know what history is? its literally the main method of understanding where you are now. how can you understand what the economy is without understanding the history that led to its creation? how can you understand what a nation is without the context of their formation? history is inextricable from the present state of affairs.

[@alimsylla5367]

"an entirely artificial construct"... quite a scholar.

[@saffronskies333]

This guy is a shill

[@SuperJim44]

Could not agree more. There is no hiding from the fact that our imperial past still haunts the present and has a very real impact on our former colonies. Of course this isn’t just a British issue, you look at French, Dutch, Spanish former colonies and you could paint a similar picture. The question for me is… how much responsibility should today’s British government have for the mistakes of the past, and what kind of compensation if any should be given, and really, what difference would it make? Saying sorry isn’t going to change much, and the threads of imperialism are so ingrained into the modern societies of former colonies, how do we undo the wrongs?

[@jimjones8736]

Romanus eunt domus

[@goodlookinouthomie1757]

Quite frankly, my country is being colonised as we speak in the most urgent manner, with the 300k per year immigrants accounting for 80% of our population growth. And that's just the ones that are documented. My heritage is being diluted before my eyes. I'd say we are paying our dues back and then some.

[@philipokoth4218]

First step is to stop any further meddling, going forward, in the affairs of sovereign states and bullying through sanctions.

[@kwameosei2104]

The crux of the issue is what were the British who are anti-immigrant, doing in other people's countries in the first place??? the mass exploitation, rape , torture, castration of Afrikan people which this country this country the UK, gained so much in the form of the Royal Africa Company and many many other companies that the British used to rape Africa and enrich itself -- compensation or even reparations should be paid by Britian for this! - if Britan paid more than 17 billion in today's value in 1839 to more than 40.000 British Slave owners (circa UCL database) which back then represented about 40% of the country's GDP. So if Britian can pay these criminals reparations for so called loss of earnings as the British saw Afrikans not as humas but as property, then why csn't the British pay reparations to the descendants of those it enslaved who todays suffer from gross racial inequalities and please do not mention Kemi and Kwasi as they DO NOT represent the strata of Afrikan intellectual discourse,

[@seawallbird5724]

He's forgotten to take his "jiggling about" pills. Just doesn't look right giving a speach standing still... 🤣

[@RAMSEY1987]

His misreading of Kashmir is hideous

[@jka3777]

He is factually correct

[@traderchamber1806]

He forgot to mention Israel and that raises the question 🙄 why? However grate observation, you are certainly a genius

[@davidnichol6282]

Not a great lover of people who talk to others to make their money.

[@davidnichol6282]

Tell the people what they want to hear. That depends on how far up you are on your career path.

[@rick-sr9nq]

Should've stuck to history

[@patrickkelly9110]

Not quite right in regard to Sudan although I agree with @kwasikwarteng broader argument. The South Sudanese under John Garang were not fighting for an independent South Sudan , they were fighting an Islamist military dictatorship with the aim of establishing a New Sudan as a whole . It was only after the death of Garang that his successors in the SPLA accepted an American brokered deal with the North to found South Sudan . This was mainly because oil reserves had been discovered on their territory and they wanted to get their thieving hands on the oil money

[@benjamin-mh3fw]

A "conservative" MP

[@SuperStevien]

don't forget in defence of the british pagan religions and ancestory, Britain was "imperialised" by ancient rome, had we been left to evolve and not forced into a culture as slaves ourselves, we wouldn't have this problem, so it is always offensive when an argument puts our original ancestry to blame for the culture and technology which has ensued. However accountability and human rights and principles do represent good sense, and the past is water under the bridge for many including the Dalai Lama (I am a buddhist) over what happened in China, based on what is seen in media.

[@wildmanmike100]

We can't undo the past so blame is useless. One could argue that the unification of those regions, those making up Nigeria for example, would have made sense at some point going forward. Albeit as strong independent regions coming together to form a much stronger union unlike the mess we have now of each tribe trying to get stronger on its own but within the framework of one single country, which does not work. We may need to go back to go forward.

[@burhan8795]

If I stole from you last year, should you forget about it because it's in the past?

[@philltech906]

kwasin kwarteng is so out of touch with British values.

[@jacobparker1105]

Who cares, he’s running the money not the schools. He’s the nerdiest economic nerd I’ve ever seen at the wheel, he’s exactly who I want during the cost of living crisis!

[@tvs9978]

What exactly are British values?

[@rainstormwind]

Yes. He is out of touch with hypocrisy, mendacity, and stealth.

[@jimjones8736]

@@tvs9978 British values are very flexible

[@strike497]

@@jacobparker1105 this comment has aged like a warm glass of milk

[@stuffandnonsense8528]

I don't think he's been able to detail these arguments sufficiently here. Just because an entity has been causally involved in a less than perfect eventuality, that doesn't mean it is to blame for what is bad in that eventuality (it might be responsible for that eventuality being as good as it is, or no worse than it is).

[@NateDogg8870]

But that’s the central premise of the motion. People are claiming Britain’s influence on its former colonies is exaggerated. If it wasn’t that big a deal then surely there would be no lasting impact from the interaction? The outcome is very binary-especially when evaluated on economic terms. The countries are either richer or poorer straight after independence compared to their pre colonial state. Clearly that wouldn’t have been the case otherwise Britain (and other empires) wouldn’t have given them independence in the first place…

[@burhan8795]

Casual involvement?

[@eustacequinlank7418]

@@burhan8795 Causal (as in cause & effect... not Mass Effect the computer game) edit: e.g after the fact: Effect - a ruined economy. Cause - appointing Kwasi Kwarteng as Chancellor of the Exchequer.

[@chrisawuyah4618]

Granted we cannot undo the past. Yet, ironically and tragically, we are reliving the past. The colonial history of oppression, economic exploitation, injustices, and discrimination has resurged under the powerful indigenous leadership of the so-called independent nations of Africa and Asia. The complexity of imperialism is such that the current leadership of African nations ferry out and deposit the resources of the continent to Br, etc. The local leaders act at the behest of Western nations and institutions. There's no need to send British citizen to administer their political interests in Africa and Asia. Colonialism has not changed in reality. It has only changed in appearance as the agents of colonial oppression share the skin color/ ethnicity with those they oppress.

[@milorudge5110]

Just love this rubbish. A highly educated black, sticking the knife in. He thinks he's reached the top! Take care brother.x

[@optionsupdate]

india benefited from the british occupation.

[@TheAnkurp09]

optionsupdate and jews from Germany!!

[@goodywardhunt3605]

@@TheAnkurp09 jews have never, for the past 4000 years, set widows on fire....