Lana Del Rey should’ve kept Black women out of it.

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[@ForHarriet619]

Join the Patreon.com/ForHarriet or become a member for Doja Cat talk!

[@teanns.7819]

I am definitely joining because I need your take on doja kitten

[@miyamae.miyamae]

which level of membership do we need to be in order to watch/listen to this talk on patreon?

[@morrisdavidmullings9833]

Did you at least mention raceplay and porn ? Just wondering

[@holigatis7588]

Im i the only one who doesn't can't find it??

[@juliacole5023]

@@holigatis7588 I can't either

[@rileyoffline]

people not knowing ariana is white is so funny to me

[@sharamusica]

Ikr

[@voidhog1028]

This is a really silly joke... But did anyone tell Ariana? 😭

[@stefaniasmer]

tori of course she’s white

[@v.v.9.9.]

Saw a pic of hers when she was young... PALE af (with beautiful black curls tho, wish she hadn't ruined her hair with her Victorious character). But that girl is white, period. She has been progressively "browning" herself to the point ppl forgot how she actually looked like before.

[@tobyfletcher6953]

It annoys the shit out of me sometimes like HOW does she get away with it...

[@ShellyflowersReadsandWrites]

“Like Avril Lavigne didn’t skateboard into our lives...” 😂 😂 😂

[@autumntaylor4630]

Lmaoo i was living when she said that ❤

[@no_peace]

i knew it was coming but i still laughed my ass off

[@jamariturner2717]

😂😂

[@avalonsignoraalmas6150]

That’s my name

[@tntbandit5]

"You don't look at Black woman or Latino woman and think wow, remember the good old days!" Aint that the truth

[@opinionsarelikebuttholes9246]

tntbandit5 that’s a whole gospel

[@mimiwey9014]

Whew Harriet don’t miss!

[@Steve19906]

She says that people are claiming she “glorifies *busive relationships” but doesn’t realize that black women are always being told they are “playing into the hyper sexuality of black people” that’s a direct parallel that she refused to see.

[@louloudemondemon296]

Bi_Topia But she’s only talking about black celebs but also women like Ariana grande

[@legallybl0wn]

MUAHAHAHAHA it’s just tone deaf. she said it as if she’s the only one receiving criticism or that she’s receiving the most. that’s just not true. it’s not valid.

[@juliorosag]

Girl acting like she is more oppressed than other women because she is "delicate"

[@SteganDaMallion]

Well said!!!

[@doggolovescheese1310]

"delicate" = sensitive white

[@Cherishcharmkay]

That is exactly why it's so pathetic because her being looked at as sensitive is still a privilege that black women don't have. Her whole argument is trash.

[@jerrilynpapilon9611]

@@doggolovescheese1310 delicate my foot they are masters of passive aggressive

[@v.v.9.9.]

@@doggolovescheese1310 "delicate" = passive

[@rlee1701]

“She does not have the range.” It’s disheartening how many people can’t think beyond their own front door.

[@KSP30]

She doesn’t have the range nor education. And by education I don’t mean like college because you can be educated without that sort of thing. She does not have the range atallllllll.

[@tieramack9983]

k P she completely lacks the political education as most people do.

[@KSP30]

Tiera Mack yup. And not to sound pretentious but the education is there. Online and in books now it’s about if they are willing to engage. A lot of times they choose not to. And eventually the lack of education shows,because when they try to speak out or make a point they reveal that they themselves don’t even get the point they are trying to so “eloquently” make.And again, it’s not the marginalized groups place to teach the very people who benefit off of their oppression they ways in which they are oppressed,but it just further reveals just how ignorant and mediocre they are.And for all of us to never be fooled because they really are not that great. All tea,no shade.

[@unhoely7925]

I don't know why if her fingers were itching so much to type all those names why she didn't mention lady gaga or Madonna. Madonna was literally a sex symbol back in her time when she was topping charts and making hits. People stay pressed 🤦🏽‍♀️🤦🏽‍♀️

[@michaelaelizabethcaballero7947]

ohhhh good point!

[@dumfriesspearhead7398]

Because they're white.

[@RA984U]

@j4s2v1 She said back in her time...and she had a #1 album last year, so that's not exactly true. Lana could have singled any number of women out.

[@bispo5671]

lmfaaoo She hates Lady Gaga. In 2009 she wrote a song called "so legit" mocking Gaga

[@leonamay8776]

Yep. Also, how about Dolly Parton???

[@BeachBumEvvie]

She’s giving herself too much credit. The Caucasity of it all. She ain’t the originator of her own genre. YET AGAIN black women are catching bullshit when it’s her own people.

[@keepthatenergy5969]

My issue with Lana's statement were not her sentiments towards the critiques, it was the dichotomy she creates between the women she listed and women like herself. She argues that she is more delicate and the women listed are "strong types" (based on her follow-up statements). That's my main issue, and whether or not she is aware of it, there were racial undertones in the contrast she creates between their femininity and her own. Describing herself as more delicate suggests that is to be handled with more care than the strong jezebel archetypes when in reality these women sing about wanting to be treated with more care as well. This is a problem that a lot of black women combat today. Not all of us are "strong" and I felt like Lana played up that stereotype in order to get her point across at the expense of how the public views these womens' femininity.

[@toosweet4candie]

👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾

[@ravencm12]

THIS!!!!!

[@oldhollywoodangels]

She also mentioned Ariana who speaks about cheating, Doja Cat, Meghan tha stallion etc they all speak about shaking their ass etc do they not? Now if u say they don't ur lying to yourself.

[@mermaidtingzzz]

@@oldhollywoodangels That doesn't make her language any less racist.

[@msgirly6827]

@@oldhollywoodangels you made zero points.

[@IvyWolk]

Lana acts like she paved the way for emotional women. she is far from the first and far from the last

[@AFOS94]

Thank u!! What about the blues and R&B. Those genres were created for that type of expression. She has the nerve to make it seem like she was the first 🙄🙄

[@Aster_Risk]

@Monacita Bonita She straight up refers to herself as the gangster Nancy Sinatra.

[@aiba6540]

That’s what’s sending me. The idea that anyone in the group she named would look to her for liberation is comical.

[@QQKutie]

She lives in the house that Amy Winehouse built. Also Amy did it better.

[@f3042]

MUAHAHAHAHA Correct; her mistake was listing those artists. Katy Perry never made songs about sex or had a sexy image? 😳 Miley Cyrus didn’t gyrate across screens damn near naked? I understand what Lana was trying to say: there has rarely been a place in music -or society- for women who can truly be described as “meek”, “soft”, women who may actually be weak, and their relationship dynamics with men. It’s a real thing! But this wasn’t it. I get it; maybe some critics weren’t fans of her work. That doesn’t mean she needs to list the names of artists who discuss similar themes without receiving the same backlash. That isn’t their fault so she needn’t mention them. Hell, Madonna did all the stuff she’s doing decades ago and paved the way for everyone she listed. Most couldn’t survive that level of scrutiny.

[@molivie1624]

She didn't need to include those WoC or any women period. Be mad at the right people.

[@eduardoherrera8604]

@@centrallistens1713 Her post would’ve been fine if she hadn’t compared herself to a group of mostly female artists of color with the clear tone that she thinks she’s been treated way worse by the media when that’s just observably untrue.

[@karmen8873]

You would've said "why didn't she write any black women?" if she didin't write any. In today's industry, black women are rising. They listened so much that they hit the charts by being number one. She wrote the main stream singers. The most succesful singers of today. And half of them are happened to be black. Isn't it a good thing for black community and actually for world?

[@niyaburke2692]

@@karmen8873 No, she's wrong because she said that they aren't attacked for being sexual, or at least aren't as attacked as she is. Not only is that blatantly untrue, but it really gives off 'poor white damsel in distress' vibes. As if people didn't write off Megan getting shot by the fact that she's a 'hoe' and 'tried him'. As if these women haven't been ridiculed, threatened, and shamed for everything they do that is even slightly sexual. It was a bad take. A tacky, ignorant, bad take. And when people called her out, did she apologize? No! She wanted to argue.

[@karmen8873]

@@niyaburke2692 Where did she say black women don't get attacked?

[@niyaburke2692]

@@karmen8873 she implied that they either didn't get attacked, or didn't get attacked as much as her. Both of which are lies and a very ignorant take. She should have just apologized when people told her, but instead she doubled down so I don't feel bad about the hate she got.

[@sasakiacharo2989]

I love how Lana misaligned herself with feminism by saying “I’m not not a femist” and yet called for feminism to create a space for her and other women like her. She only blamed women in the post. She also let go of all accountability With that post. So what you’ve been criticized for your music? girl is grown and failed to acknowledge that even tho people spoke low of her music and the influence she had on pop SHE chose to stop being prominent. The whole post was tone deaf on all points.

[@CocoaCookies_]

Ooooh, such an excellent, well stated point!

[@ayanomar1408]

Deaf on all Points👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾 I wanted to say when she kept talk: just log out dear

[@lindsayjeanius]

🙌🏾

[@IvyWolk]

"Meyers-briggs is astrology for people who work in offices"

[@TheWonderGirl23]

I literally fell out my chair. This statement is so true

[@Olivia-jw5sd]

I feel personally called out.

[@no_peace]

i'm crying

[@sadtitties222]

@@Olivia-jw5sd Same here, lol!

[@yespls4184]

So true

[@Jaded42O]

“Lana..born Elizabeth” this is way funnier than what I think you intended lol.

[@egyptfrazier]

Lana Del Ray claim to be a trailblazer for women to talk about hardship and sex. Which member of her PR team lied to her?

[@ayanomar1408]

right!!!!😩

[@halroxdynasty8683]

Right

[@magickgeminid2944]

Beyonce was doing that before she came out. Del Ray is as fake as her name

[@Lafemmefutile]

That “delicate” word TRIGGERED me big time because it just exposed her as thinking that all the women she mentioned are not delicate, don’t talk about their feelings, basically just make base/savage music while she’s doing Mozart’s work over there. I was like Elizabeth “Karen” Grant, you have zero idea you are peddling racism by your attitude.

[@briananicole5213]

That dog whistle. And the for her to double down without trying to understand. Side eyeeeeee

[@Lafemmefutile]

Briana Nicole She has a superiority complex, it’s obvious, and doesn’t realize she’s a White supremacist through and through herself. The epitome of the expression “Clueless and criminal”. It’s the same old story. Black people can identify with all types of emotions and vibe to your music even though the whole thing is basically a fantasy/sci-fi for them but some white can’t even put themselves in your shoes, see your art or look at the multiple dimensions in it. I like Lana’s music because I really thought she was aware she was playing a character and her part was “white boogie woman who’s bored and doesn’t know what to do”. Because that’s a luxury most of us black people don’t have so why not indulge in that in music at least, the way some white people like hip hop? That woman doesn’t realize that she dissed the women she mentioned in her post, basically disrespecting their work. A shame!

[@ladygrey4113]

Looks like she’s the real nazi pop Queen they wanted rather than Taylor Swift.

[@scarlet8078]

What triggered me most was that she's claiming being "delicate" & "fragile" as if those are good. We should all be striving for ANTI-FRAGILITY which means being resilient, strong, adaptable & assertive. It's not cool to be "delicate" & breakable, so you go to pieces every time misfortune occurs - which it will occur, for everyone. In this way, Lana Del Ray truly IS setting women back 50 years. None of those other women she mentioned are glamourizing weakness. On the contrary, they're acting powerful, & across the board they're more talented than she is, in terms of dancing & singing/ performing. Maybe she's a good poet, idk, but her attitude is toxic for women

[@magickgeminid2944]

@@MIHELISHAR so they are not delicate? let's not over interpret the obvious please. She does not mention songs like Sandcastles, the time Ariana was on a kid show, or how hard it was for Cardi B to even break into the mold now over the last 10 or so years its just lets stop talking about aggressive sexualized women and talk about women like Lana or just Lana.

[@sofinaodero]

Lana saying she’s not not a feminist doesn’t negate the fact that white feminism and white privilege are aspects of this conversation. Her having the entitlement to address those other women, specifically women of color, in her statement is a clear view of her ignorance about the ways in which white privilege protects and aids her freedom of speech and expression.

[@the_emmasculator]

Also if youre not a feminist, why are you calling for them to make space for you?? What privileged notion is that?

[@samij6071]

@Queen of Wands 13 her beef isn't with white feminism tho. Her beef is with any type of feminism and it always has been. She has a LOOOOONG history of talking shit on feminism & trust me it ain't the "white" part.

[@bindu996]

embodying the aesthetic of the past in a way that WOC can't. NAILED IT

[@alex-fc7it]

I get that she wanted to mention names. But honestly naming black women without mentioning their struggle in the industry was not the best decision.

[@KSP30]

Yup.

[@unigenius]

I think she was more looking at the speed of which they earned massive critical acclaim vs. Her 12 years of singing professional lullabies.

[@redblackwhitestripes]

@@unigenius and what she wasn't looking at is the amount of work it took them to get there (her statement was thoughtless)

[@whatreallymatters571]

@@unigenius professional lullaby's!!,😂😂😂😂

[@kic.7679]

unigenius Ha!💙

[@rightwingleftwingchickenwi358]

I’ve been listening to Lana’s music since I was 14. I’m 21 now and she’s the only musicians I loved to have survived my teenage years into my young adulthood (the rest were victims of teen angst 😂😑). I remember when the media were real hard on her, so I get what she’s trying to say about critics and their rather biased and borderline sexist critique of her music ( male musicians have said far worse in their music than her) HOWEVER, THERE IS NOTHING DELICATE ABOUT HER MUSIC OR HERSELF IF HER MUSIC IS AS AUTOBIOGRAPHICAL AS SHE CLAIMS. Wtf, she has a song called Cola about her pussy and being a side chick for rich older man, god she has a lot of songs about being the side chick, she has songs about drugs, fucking, loving men who physically and emotionally abuse her, prostitution, fetishing Lolita ( I wonder if her and I read the same book) etc. What I loved about her music is that it’s different to my life and I viewed it as storytelling. God, it was fucking insulting for the media to suggest that her young female teenage fans (like myself at the time) couldn’t tell the different between storytelling and would go out and do the same things 😑😒 That being said her statement was grade a WHITE FEMINISM, funny considering in 2014 she said she finds feminism boring and would rather focus on space x and Tesla. As always love the art and don’t blindly worship the artist. I’ll always love her music, it’s a huge part of my life and got me through hard times but I won’t defend her when she says stupid racist shit. fuck i wish celebs would just release their art and shut the fuck up. Their ignorance taints their art 🙄

[@Aster_Risk]

It's really nice to see someone who loves her music, but can definitely see some of the issues.

[@Missjunebugfreak]

I used to like Lana around 2014 but fell out of love with her music over her next albums as my music taste changed. I'm glad to see a fan who is sensible enough to admit the issues in her music and stupidity of that post.

[@sharamusica]

Yeah I agree I wish celebrities weren’t expected to share their views with the public

[@greatgownsbeautifulgowns]

Lana Del Rey: "*It paved the way for other women to stop putting on a happy face to just be able to say whatever the hell they wanted to in their music." Me: Ummm, so have you ever heard of: Lil Kim-She was criticized as being too sexual and too raunchy. Björk- She's been made fun of and called weird for years not only for her music, but for her personal style. Alanis Morissette- Her music was branded as "angry women rock". Fiona Apple- Her music was called moody and angry. Mary J. Blidge- She's actually been constantly told to STOP putting on a happy face and that her music is better when she's sad. *Because we all know she really meant "I" "...paved the way for other women...." Sure, Lana😂

[@Phoenixhunter157]

D 👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏

[@greatgownsbeautifulgowns]

And while Lana's got Beyonce's name in her mouth, let's not forget about how Beyonce was treated after her Super Bowl performance when she made the "Hands Up Don't Shoot" statement via her dancers and their costumes. And while we're on the subject of being shamed and shunned after Super Bowl performances, let's not forget about how Janet Jackson was treated( but Justin Timberlake was doing just fine) after her nipple accidentally popped out on stage.

[@opinionsarelikebuttholes9246]

Nina Simone , Tracy Chapman , I can think of others on the top of my head who received worse flack. She needs to recognize how high up on her pedestal she is .

[@withalittlehelpfrom3]

That was the angle I didn’t consider in this: she’s also erasing white women’s contributions... ...just at a far lesser rate than she’s erasing black women’s.

[@greatgownsbeautifulgowns]

@@opinionsarelikebuttholes9246 Exactly! Nina was unapologetically black and talked about black issues, so I KNOW she caught hell.

[@IvyWolk]

"and she just does not have the range" LMFAO

[@tylerhackner9731]

White feminism is exhausting

[@peteadenuga]

she’s not a feminist

[@imtiredoftheseniggas6618]

Tired Ass Nigerian she may “not be a feminist” but she has exercised her white privilege. Are you going to deny that too?

[@creativeperson5858]

@@imtiredoftheseniggas6618 what did she do wrong

[@mg.5968]

How is she exercising her white privilege?

[@sofinaodero]

White privilege in this situation is being able to not be cancelled after her statement regardless of the content of the statement. Her figurative “white tears” in this situation were met with mixed reviews though many (white and white-passing women/men) still supporting her stance while denying the racial undertones that she has working in the statement subconsciously.

[@saboo1_2]

WW can also come in and out of proximity to ethnic aesthetics/costumes and the exaggerated sexual expressions they are often coupled with. They can easily be reembraced into the folds of normative white femininity e.g. Miley Cyrus.

[@saboo1_2]

@@SweetieMs she hasn't done the switch back yet, though she very likely will..

[@greatgownsbeautifulgowns]

You are spot on with your comment! And Miley is a PERFECT example of your statement. She used black culture to gain popularity and street cred-- then suddenly she says rap music is "too explicit" for her and how she's "scaring" the country music demographic, so now she's gets to be a good little white girl again.

[@j-hizzy]

If Lana's music is so innovative and unique she should just *release the damn album* and let the music speak for itself. 🤦🏾‍♀️ She can't ask the "culture", and then get mad because the "culture" of the fans of the women she listed actually replied. If she would've mentioned Taylor Swift, Katy Perry, even Billie Eillish, (people in HER genre) and then kept the rest of the statement the same, her point would unravel. 🤔

[@AFOS94]

Right!! Lana should have addressed who she had an issue with. She should have directed and name dropped white women in pop music. That’s comparable. Especially when white feminists and men tore her to pieces. She needs to her community and leave us out of it 🤬 she was being tone deaf and “colorblind”. Not in 2020!!

[@Murdermagictricks]

Like pink wasn't out here writing whole albums about how she hated and loved her man at the same time

[@ayanomar1408]

Murdermagictricks oh I remember the Pink days😩

[@Murdermagictricks]

@@MIHELISHAR but didn't mention Billie eilish who LITERALLY has been EVERYWHERE

[@diya-hn2wy]

her point still doesn’t hold tbh. we can’t just ignore the shit taylor swift has been through in her career (nothing compared to women of colour of course). women don’t have it easy in the industry period. it just differs on how difficult they have it.

[@bonemeringue9464]

I like her music a lot but was embarrassed after seeing that post. Also I was so confused by it, everybody knows Hip Hop is the biggest genre in the country. She mostly does old Americana sounding slow songs, and while she's had a lot of success, that isn't the type of music that makes it to No 1 in 2020

[@danieldini8685]

i think she meant just acceptance in general since it’s true that sexual music doesn’t get the feminist think pieces it used to get yet her music still does.

[@sofinaodero]

It must be sad for her that her genre is losing interest while Hip Hop/Rap and its Pop subculture is flourishing while utilizing themes that she discusses herself. Her genre isn’t evolving and her anger is based in that along with criticism of her lyrics. That isn’t the fault of other artists rather the industry in general. She could choose to evolve her music or just stay in her lane and with her fans.

[@danny.nedelk0]

More like Americana inspired pop.

[@symonew33]

Lana and Ariana collaborating does not mean they are friends. Ariana tried to talk to her about why people might be offended and she unfollowed her.

[@louise-yo7kz]

Wow 🤷🏾‍♀️

[@babybalulu99]

but they were friends before tho

[@BisouspriscillaBlogspotBe]

Wauw Avril Lavigne skateboarded into our life 😂😂😂😂

[@nemos422s]

She is soo entitled it’s crazy. Despite being so privileged she wants more while bringing down women of color. It’s white men and white feminists that she should be after but Lana is out here trying to compete with other women getting so triggered at the success of women of color. Girl we all out here in this mess and to make it worse she literally has blinders and only acknowledges her own pain. Very self centered like the world revolves around her

[@louise-yo7kz]

👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾

[@heatherlouise5270]

Yes, I agree she should put her focus off of black women and onto white men and white feminists.

[@greatgownsbeautifulgowns]

But she won't go after the white men and white feminists because white people as a collective stay on code with each other.

[@Xtinaiyayi]

There are many unreleased songs (which I loved) from Lana del Rey, before Born to Die. While she sang using the same persona, she utilized a lot of Black terms and had many songs similar to the women she mentioned. Some of the songs include - “Ghetto Baby”, “Gangsta Boy”, “Delicious”, “Paradise”, “Summer of Sam”, “Go-go Dancer”, “Behind Closed Doors”, “Playing Dangerous”.....she did a lot of fast paced pop music with hip hop infused elements and language. So it’s very interesting that she sees herself as “delicate” compared to the women she mentioned. Hmmm 🤔 I wonder why??? Lol

[@ellaallen5607]

I was wondering too...maybe she forgot her roots.

[@AlexThe1Menace]

Yeah her music pre-Born to Die was pretty different. Same schtick but far less drab vocally and musically. More upbeat with her 60s rock and hip-hop infused songs. Even on Born to Die she still had that hip-hop shit going on with her beats but now that's completely gone. She either forgot how she started or has outgrown liking that stuff.

[@bajanneka]

She meant to say Rihanna but thought about life!!!!

[@saintjontel]

she was talking about singers & musical artists. rihanna sells makeup & lingerie.

[@the_emmasculator]

@@saintjontel ....Rihanna is a singer

[@louise-yo7kz]

Lol

[@mariinanji427]

@@saintjontel 😂😂😂

[@marinaxlove]

Kaiden yikes! delete this please 😅 please oo. The second hand embarrassment 😅

[@pamhoward1215]

Privilege doesn’t like equality.

[@jerrilynpapilon9611]

no it doesn't and never will a privilege individual thinks its their right

[@PengMeuf]

19:10 They want to see our bodies and our sexualities so that they can take notes, replicate and appropriate on non-black bodies

[@youmadornahhh]

I don’t think anyone thought she was “coming for” them, everyone is just saying exactly what you’re saying, why even bring anyone else? It just distracts from her point (if she even has one).

[@kaylynloves]

..and she doesnt 😒 honestly and truly

[@AlexisBii]

Because the thing that really pissed her off is that women of color were succeeding

[@Noah-rq3xt]

lana stans PLEASE listen to this. actually listen to what’s being said. it’s ok to admit your fave messed up.

[@anjalyjacob1570]

"A tendancy to ascribe the the worst possible intent to clumsily stated things" - I really like that! Social media seems to cultivate us to take the extreme opinion. I agree with everything you've said in the video, and I think you put it very eloquently!♥️

[@AmyEdo]

I've read the original post several times + the addendums + "clarifications", and I STILL don't know what she was on about (and I don't think she fully knew either). If she's mad at the critiques she received around the imagery in her music then why not just say that and just that? Why all the extra rara and crinkum crankum? Just blowing air for blowing airs sake 😒

[@evawambani7992]

Crinkum crankum... I like that... 😊

[@KK-pu8tr]

I was thinking the exact same thing...to me it didn’t even make any sense. The different points she made didn’t even connect with eachother

[@ariesmry]

Her simplified message is that she is jealous of their success and wanted attention to be shifted to her. She also has product to push.

[@theTruthSeekerishere]

She wants to stir up interest for her upcoming album. In the entertainment industry any publicity is good publicity.

[@josieg5341]

yes this! the whole situation is just so poorly explained. i'm assuming its mostly a publicity stunt but like, be less messy about it next time??

[@tamtaz2001]

That trailblazer line was one of the most ridiculous pieces of that post (after implying that feminism has no place for “delicate” white women like it wasn’t created for them). She co-opted Amy Winehouse’s entire drug addled white girl waxing poetic about her complicated relationships schtick. I listened to Norman F Rockwell, and it gave me Taylor Swift on coke... literally; that’s what I walked away thinking. That Swift is praised for being easily digested while she is criticized has nothing to do with Black & Brown women in her industry.

[@MiniM69]

She needed to work this out in her journal, write a couple of drafts, chat with her therapist, Google intersectionality and try again (off the internet).

[@98unicorngirl]

I enjoyed your nuanced argument bc so many people have dragged Lana without reading carefully. People have been waiting to destroy her, so when this all happened everyone jumped on a bandwagon. They assumed all Lana’s fans were snooty white gays, but I wanted a space for her many fans of color to openly discuss how we were offended

[@DIRTYPRETTY]

Jennipher Smith AGREED. Lana really disappointed me with this one :(

[@TheSomethingnew1]

Yes. I'm a fan but this was really tone deaf and ignorant. It seems she focused on the fame of the women she mentioned yet completely disregarded their struggle and scrutiny from the media. And then when was called out about it, instead of listening and learning, she continued to lean on her own understanding and defended her original stance.

[@nyembsafric1]

Waiting to destroy her?

[@QuirkyTJones]

She should have not started out with...a question for the culture...girrrrrrl

[@Phoenixhunter157]

Wtf has Lana been “crucified “ for? Is she serious?

[@bredan87]

Exactly.

[@Ohnoonespec]

Sza is a great example of what you’re explaining when it comes to white women with just enough talent being granted space that more talented black women have to water themselves down for and be over-sexualized in order to even be considered for....look at what sza had to become in order to be noticed... and look at how she had to switch her lyrical content up in order to be heard.....

[@sharamusica]

I mean I think SZA is very talented but Lana is also talented as well.

[@indigof2989]

My biggest issue is the way white people came to her rescue before hearing the valid points of why she didn’t need to include the women/examples she did. Everyone always says “read the room” and in this instance she should’ve had the foresight to know the way stans react when their favs are mentioned & gotten straight to her point. Canceling, dragging, etc we’re all aware of it. It’s not new. She took away from her own moment by turning the attention to the other women. It was counter productive. Vulnerability is respected but her submission to the oppression olympics are not. Its also easy to focus on the negative but she also gets a LOT of support & love. You couldn’t breathe when Norman Rockwell dropped without seeing it everywhere. The girls were into it! The whole situation is all very selective & I hope instead of continuing to play victim she learns from this.

[@smilergal89]

She did that on purpose surely - clickbait and stans = trending

[@myaco6430]

100% agree. As a fan, I’ve been trying to tell other fans this but they’re still like “I can’t see the racism” or “learn to read”(which is condescending as hell).

[@mimivindireu]

KAREN del Rey

[@opinionsarelikebuttholes9246]

😄

[@hellapuckboy]

Someone shared this video on a Twitter thread. I watched all of it and then immediately hit subscribe. You have a new fan.

[@ramonaflowers2813]

The more I see people cover this Lana thing the more I get annoyed because it is almost unfathomable the amount of nonsense that she said. As Adrianexpression pointed out calling out these women was not even the worse part. The contrast that she made that she is a delicate woman and that her struggle with critics were immeasurable compared to these women. Even if she was not trying to be racist her statements showed her lack of awareness of what most black female entertainers go through, constantly being criticized for looks even their skin tone, constantly being compared and pitted against one another, their sexuality is often weaponized by men in the industry. Also having to put in the work to break through the mainstream it's not easy. Yet Lana is here complaining about critics saying she glamorizing abuse which is what she apparently did and her entire persona was created and bought by her rich father. How does your struggle equate to these women. What a nincompoop!

[@areebariz1639]

I loved Adrian's video on this! He really broke this shit down layer by layer.

[@ramonaflowers2813]

@@areebariz1639 it really did

[@areebariz1639]

@@ramonaflowers2813 Adrian's video and Tre Melvin's "Lana Del Rey speaks up" are my fav ones right now. The second one is more of a dragging but shit has me weak whenever I watch it

[@amketique]

@@areebariz1639 Tre Melvin's took me out.

[@seongates]

I love Amy Winehouse!!!

[@IvyWolk]

Amy is one of the greatest of all time! she ran so Lana could step

[@cu8414]

THANK YOU!! I am so sick of this hot-take, malicious misinterpretations of hot topics. There are legitimate criticisms of her statement, but the gross misinterpretations of her statement have just shown how little people read with care. I appreciate you reading with care.

[@anony1596]

The Doja situation is so interesting to me. I've never been invested in Doja but my bestfriend is a huge fan (currently going through grief stages lol) and I know she was your problematic fav so I am very interested in what you have to say. My 2 cents: She used the marketable aspects of her quirky internet persona and milked the hell out of it. She's deep into internet troll/dark web culture. Coincidentally, that culture has intense anti women, blackness, and LGBT sentiments. Most people were able to jump over the homophobia part but now the antiblack aspect has _been leaked (? strange how this "evidence" just popped up. I can write a whole essay on my theories)_ . Her black female fans (which I'm pretty sure is the majority of her music fan base. Black women and their allies I'm assuming) assumed she identified with her blackness more similarly to the way they do. And when the truth came to light every one lost their shit. *EDIT* : so my thoughts have somewhat evolved since I first wrote this. Same basic concept just better articulated imo. Long story as short as I can make it: I don't think the things people are claiming she's guilty of are as heinous as twitter was making it seem. They either blew what evidence they did have out of proportion or made stuff up. I think her personality is fundamentally dark web edgelord internet troll and people are primarily accustomed to seeing that on skinny awkward white boys that they can easily ignore not thicc biracial women that rap and chart #1. I just don't think it's as simple as calling her racist or self hating because she is a troll - trolls by definition don't say things because they believe it to be true they say it because it's edgy and out of pocket (Not saying it's okay or that she is an angel- just saying if you're going to drag someone be honest and realistic about the problem. now people that blindly jumped on the hate bandwagon are apologizing on everyone elses behalf lol). Anyway, her real personality took the mainstream internet and her mainstream fanbase by surprise and they didn't know how to digest it. The end. Also, I've noticed the "they're cancelling her because she don't date black men so bm are salty" theories and I think those are fucking hilarious I just don't think the black men checking for Doja have the organization skills necessary to facilitate an internet-wide Doja protest 😭 Again, just my analysis no one asked for 😁

[@elijahlittle7912]

I'm interested in how people are gonna see her now as well. I was very hesitant to support her because something about her didn't seem authentic, I'm not sure if it was the look/persona she has being biracial(more white in my opinion) and using white aesthetics in her style, but also having that copy and paste butt, boob and ambiguous "black" look performers have these days. It seemed like she was trying to pander to everyone being a rapper, but only really wanted to uplift white people if that makes sense.

[@blahhoopla2]

Notice how none of the major publications are reporting this about Doja Cat. But in all seriousness, there is something seriously wrong with her. I mean the internet is going to drag her because it’s the internet lol. But she is really fucked up inside.

[@sjlewis271]

As a fan, I never thought she was anything. I assume she's mixed and move forward from there. If she's not, I'm okay with that too. Make your thesis statements. I'm still gon buy and listen.

[@mylovechoerry2233]

@@sjlewis271 that not that deep I personnaly don't see the problem with her going to chat room to troll that fun

[@yaggayaggaya9918]

Please write that essay, I’m deeply fascinated by this whole situation. Also I feel by the time this lockdown ends we gonna have no celebs left 😂 everybody getting exposed

[@imtiredoftheseniggas6618]

You analyzed this situation perfectly. Well done 💯

[@Rodrasroom]

Love how you touched on the topic of the sexual consumptive programming that black women are only bodies. Brilliant arrival at the reality that THAT IS NOT A PRIVILEGE! Makes the music industry a truly sad place in a way, as mainstream success for black women is garnered by how many clothes they are willing to shed. Seeing women vulnerable and delicate as Solange, and FKA Twigs is a new concept. Yet, back in the day, black artists could explore this more when music was more divided (R&B/soul) Anita Baker, Toni Braxton, Brandy, slayed vulnerability just to name a few.

[@yageshabazz3456]

Sis said, “in conclusion, she did not have the range” 😭

[@jadesmith417]

Someone mentioned your Normani video in the comments of As Told By Kenya's newest video on Lana and Doja. I've decided I want to go back and look every US Number One song on Billboard by a black woman from the past 20 - 30 years to see if they are all sexual/hypersexual songs. I'm already finding interesting things!

[@Aster_Risk]

Oh, man. I'd love to see what comes out of that. I think I might have to look too.

[@Setsunako6587]

YES, THE BOLT CUTTERS HAVE BEEN FETCHED 🤣!! Ms. Apple still got it, she had it before Elizabeth could spell "singer-songwriter" and never lost it. Shameika *did* say she had potential...

[@IshtarNike]

Lana is not a trailblazer. I'm sorry but I don't see it.

[@caseyw.6550]

Not even close. Lol

[@raeannewood]

Totally forgot about her until all this happened.

[@sosopeople9157]

Not a lie spotted.

[@Phoenixhunter157]

I can’t really even remember her music.....

[@opinionsarelikebuttholes9246]

Right. She’s like 50 years late claiming that title 😂

[@vnesje1981]

I was waiting for your comments on this!

[@sebastianromero7085]

How are you like the smartest effin person on youtube!!!!!! Queen! And I say this as a Lana super fan, you really gave a great analysis to both sides, how yes she's been criticized, but also how unaware she is (at least in these posts) about certain issues regarding race, and how in no or very little way has she paved way for any of those women in that list (with the exception maybe a little of Camilla, Ariana, and Khelani)... also, I also think that "sexual" white women are also more criticized because white male critics/patriarchal establishments often want to preserve a certain "white purity" in women, versus the constant fetishism that PoC in particular WoC face, so them being "allowed" to be more sexual is a natural next step of constantly being fetishized, which is problematic in its own right.... the fact that people like Taylor Swift or Selena Gomez have lately been a bit more "allowed" (WTF does that even mean tho?) to be sexual may be more because of Lana than anything Beyonce, Nicki, Doja do... and has nothing to do with Lana's career. Altho I will say I do think Lana has paved a certain way for alternative indie-pop-rock women such as Marina, Billie Elish, Halsey, Melanie Mtz, etc... (of course, not just Lana, because we do have Avril and Fiona Apple and Regina Spektor and the likes, but yeah, in contemporary music/last decade she was/is like one the first and biggest indie darlings for some people).

[@brokenvieehs9361]

I disagree. Melanie, Hasley, Billie and Marina are in a league of their own. Also noting, FKA twigs.

[@Juiceharlot]

Lana has had multiple successful albums been featured on multiple movie soundtracks and had plenty of endorsement deals all while sitting around talking about coke and sugar daddies on pretty much every single album she has released. This last album was my least favorite. Honeymoon was a chef kiss for me. Lana just can't take criticism she went off about this last album because one critic didn't like it. and she likes to pretend that she don't be in interviews saying weird stuff I remember that one interview she did where she said she wish would have joined the" 27 club". Like girl, Amy Winehouse walked so that girl could run and she's really out here acting like she walked so any black artist could run is absolutely crazy. if you ever been to a Lana del Rey show all that happens is she stands around on stage with some flower covered mic dressed like a Sims 2 character before you download updates moves from side to side comes off the stage sign a copy of your vinyl and then go on with her life I don't know what she thinks she's out here doing for the girls but it's not what she thinks. And she should have kept that same energy with those criticizing her. She wants to act so not mainstream but then why you worried about what mainstream says about you. Knowing fully well she has had mainstream success. Just say you want a Grammy and go. Also she has a whole song called "fucked my way to the top." So what even is she talking about??

[@hubbthepoet612]

10:26 “Everybody fake around here!” 😂

[@ZombalayaQ]

I choked on my drink at "Rosa Del Rey" 😂😂😂

[@kunupinyana]

No one: Internet: Assigning the worst possible intent to the most clumsily said things. I love how you articulated this Kim.

[@AlllSmiless]

Lol @ "vaguely ethnic moniker" I didn't even peep that 👀 I guess Elizabeth woodridge grant sounded too "regular white woman"

[@omosummer840]

"MBTI is astrology for offices" I did not expect to get dragged like this 😂😭 I do take it with a pinch of salt though 👀 with my INFJ self...

[@soyveritas8262]

Sadly, most people do not get to experience the MBTI accompanied with an accurate explanation and supporting documentation on validity and peer reviews. A psychologist or at least someone who is certified/qualified to administer it should be administering it with an explanation. As a result of poor administration, many people end up with an experience that resembles a cursory understanding of astrology. When administered properly, it's nearly impossible to think one could be inextricably linked to behavioral preferences (as is the case with astrology).

[@eliseweiland3133]

What you were saying about being empowered in pop music!! Yes! Was watching a video by the take on the strong black woman trope and it said a similar thing - they laid out the argument that because the black women depicted are so strong and make it through okay despite major adversity, that society feels okay the way it is being sexist and racist towards them. White people enjoy watching those depictions bc they can breathe a sigh of relief that it is “not that bad.” We need more disruptors that show the realities of abuse, sexism, and racism in our media! And not just for entertainment, but to really understand what people go through and create real empathy. Strength in the face of adversity does not make the adversity okay!

[@milaniinalim3357]

Talk about entitlement! That’s what you get for praising people based on their skin color and being ‘delicate’ smh

[@camden7846]

I’m pretty sure Fiona Apple had similar qualms to those Lana is claiming to have but Fiona didn’t drag other people especially other women while expressing them. Lana thinks she’s special 🙄 women are judged for everything and WOC even more. Why make this a her thing and put herself above other women while doing it?

[@Missjunebugfreak]

It's funny how Lana states that she paved the way for women in music to "not put on a happy face and sing about whatever they want" when artists like Nina Simone, Billie Holiday, Janis Joplin, Joni Mitchell, Lauryn Hill, Kate Bush, Fiona Apple, Bjork, PJ Harvey, Amy Winehouse and many others were doing it years before her and got tons of criticism for it. She needs to get off her pedestal. Also I love how you shouted out Fiona Apple's new album. You're awesome.

[@isabelchaparro2608]

Lana is delusional if she thinks Nicki or Beyoncé haven’t had more pushback than her 😐 every other week these women alone have think pieces written about them because of their music, their clothing, their relationships, etc and all they do is exist.

[@kidfresh351]

The posts were riddled with microaggressions and she really doesn't understand.

[@DominiqueShaunte]

Right! Alanis, Tori, Fiona, real OG’s with great music. I’ve listen to Lana’s music and it’s ok every now and then, but she is making the same sounding songs since 2010! Lana De Elizabeth sit down somewhere, we just don’t like you right now, chill!

[@jwalt8019]

Not the "Rosa Del Rey'.😂😂😂😂

[@JukuduB]

Lana is blaming the wounded person instead of the shooter. This happens often, not surprised.

[@lotusfaeee]

You almost said calm the fuck down I heard you pull it back 😂😂😂😂

[@Qaxoontii]

She just wanted attention. The best thing to do is ignore her.

[@blackforestkirsch7971]

well, didn't work out cause... everyone's talking bout her ;)

[@ewancowie]

Thank you for a thoughtful and clear analysis of this whole issue. The quality of your scholarship strips back the layers in these discussions revealing perspectives and truths perhaps not immediately apparent to others that come from a different context. You are doing great work.

[@blazebaby89]

I was busting up at the part where you mention Avril Levine skating into our lives 😂

[@diemdia]

I feel as though people (celebrities in particular) really need to get a friend or a therapist or a journal to vent this stuff to lol. I get that it’s human nature to need to bicker about shit sometimes, but they should know better than to immediately broadcast their complaints to social media.

[@TroyTalks.]

What a respectfully honest and introspective analysis of this Lana Del Rey schedule. This is how a supporter, fan, or enjoyer of an entertainer's music should disagree. Gained a subscriber.

[@priestesstapes]

"Our bodies and our sexuality." Jesus, Kim. TALK ABOUT IT.

[@Katyob7]

Loved thisssss. Super interesting points. Thank youuu x

[@maliquemorris123]

“What is this pink erasure?” 😂😂😂

[@sarahlapointe2452]

You have the range Kim. Thank you for sharing it.

[@Angel-cq8sg]

thank you. thank you for making this. i really wanted to hear this from you. you opened the doors. 🤍

[@amandamosteller1371]

All I will say is for the 2020 Grammy's Lana said she picked out a dress from Khols or Macy's. Everyone complimented her for it, now if Cardi, Beoynce or Meghan showed up to the red carpet in a dress like Lanas, they would of been crucified by the press. Omg it would of been horrible. Just recently a dark skinned black contestant on Rupauls Drag Race wore a body suit from Amazon and he was read to filth for it. Its sad that Lana cant see past her ego to notice that the women she named suffer from white privilege more than she does with feminism.

[@womanistwoo]

i love your lipgloss here!!! okay back to the video ❤️

[@klinksss]

Girl you're amazing! The amount of arguments you gather when debating anything is really respectful and incredible. Stay home, stay safe! Lots of love from Brazil! 💕💕🇧🇷🇧🇷

[@stephenburgess5710]

So glad I waited to read about this to get your perspective.

[@stephenburgess5710]

FKA Twigs is relevant to the discussion as well because she's been depicting those complicated relationships since her debut years ago as well.

[@musicismyhothotsex92]

Good for you on learning French! I'm learning Spanish :-)

[@ArrielleD]

Please talk about the Doja Cat cancellation situation

[@ShyRonnie13]

When it comes to moody sad alternative white women music I stick to Lykke li she never disappointed me and talked about white supremacy and police brutality several time on her instagram also I really don’t like Lana music.

[@akuasunshine]

Omg yessssss✨ I follow you deep sea babbyyy🎶

[@Aster_Risk]

Absolutely. Also, Lykke Li is what I would refer to as delicate and vulnerable and feminists, myself included, love her stuff.

[@christinemalary]

I love the way you said that you could only traffic in her aesthetic of you're white. I've listened to her music, and I tried to get into it because it sounds beautiful, but I simply can't. I couldn't understand why but you hit the nail on the head. Her aesthetic is only relatable to white women.

[@peach_ringz_4evz]

“My bolt cutters.......have been FETCHED” 🙌

[@CheyenneLin]

loved your take Kim! thank you for bringing up her real name

[@ER_Utube]

You are seriously one of the only people on the internet that approached this with any damn sense. Everyone was so quick to drag and cancel her, that they didn’t see her point, which was mostly legitimate...And they also didn’t care to analyze just how dangerously racialized her construction of that message was. All they saw was their faves’ names, and the message stopped there. It was a lot. Also, Fiona’s “FETCH...” was BRILLIANT. You got a playlist???

[@lowrider276]

Probably because she didn't have a point

[@NS-gu3qy]

Such a great review, thanks for a well rounded perspective on the subject matter

[@danny.nedelk0]

My problem with her brand and image is not that she's fake. Although I do have issues with artists that make disingenuous, heavily manufactured art I get that this is how the game's played and people need to pay rent. However, Lana and her team lied about her upbringing and past, glamourizing not only abusive relationships but also lack of resources to sell mediocre music. I confess I'm biased because in my youth I had financial stress inherited from my parents but sorry for not feeling any sympathy for an executive's daughter lying about living in a trailer park in the hopes of making her music seem more genuine (oh, the irony). I will not be supporting this type of charade.

[@Aster_Risk]

This is the same type of thing that made it so I could never support Lana. I did live in a trailer park and my family struggled when I was younger. It's irritating that she uses it as a part of her manufactured aesthetic.

[@scarlett7613]

Well, then you have a problem with her being fake, why not just say so then.

[@danny.nedelk0]

@@scarlett7613 She might not be fake personally. Some people accused her of being fake because of her surgeries or stage presence. That's not an issue imo since many artists have surgeries and stage alteregos. I have issues with the way her team markets her products by exploiting struggles that she hasn't personally been through which is insulting to people who have.

[@katefriend4085]

I knew nothing about the original Lana Del Rey post... Don't follow current pop music these days. Can't stop following this video saying "fair... Yes... All right... Indeed... Thank you!" Feel weird sitting alone in a room talking to a video, but I'm enjoying this a lot! Thanks!

[@CallMeHunnyB]

Well done video. I love hearing your thoughts on everything