Layout Update - Autumn 2023

During summer the layout of course took a back seat as it usually does. However I have been continuing to make progress on various sections of the layout. In this video I'll run through all of those small jobs as well as a small update with regards to changes & additions to the rolling stock.

[@UndergroundEric]

Tell you what i like, aside from the layout itself, is that there is someone on youtube with the ability to use the focus on their camera properly without it jumping all over… Makes it much nicer to watch trains running!

[@london19657]

I'm an old Brit that's lived in the USA for 20 years. I wish there was some way of ahem, Tipping. Your modelling skills are a joy to watch. Like many others, I'm living vicariously as you spend hundreds of hours working on your layout. I particularly like the night time lighting. You're a perfectionist and many of us really appreciate that. Cheers. (Plausible Brickwork sounds just great,btw.)

[@GarethDennisTV]

As a pway design engineer, you continue to do a really lovely job of this. Looking forward to the tour!

[@PreservationEnthusiast]

This is the best layout in the country and Richard is probably the highest IQ modeller out there.

[@GarethDennisTV]

@@PreservationEnthusiast I mean sure on the first bit, but the second bit of your reply is a bit weird. Let's not bring pseudoscience or alt-right talking points into Richard's replies.

[@PreservationEnthusiast]

@@GarethDennisTV What is alt right about saying he's got a very high IQ? It's just a statement of fact.

[@kolonjikunjufu1564]

You should righty feel very proud of this layout, there simply isn’t enough words to described just how impressive this layout and you word is, as a person of colour thank you for the inclusion of people like me on your layout. I also really connect with the era that you’re modelling the Rumbelows Shop was a subtle but very nice touch, as was the era correct model of cars that you used…. Lastly you’re weathering of your trains is simply exquisite.. Thank you i totally love your work

[@EverardJunction]

Thanks very much, glad you enjoyed it. Cheers

[@ZXGuesser]

The countryside scene's looking great, everything ties together so well. I'm surprised by just how much of a difference the black boards make to not pulling your eye out of the scene in the wider shots too.

[@trainmanbob]

Oh Richard!! Every time you upload a new video I sit back and watch in amazement at such exquisite modelling. You attention to detail is quite extraordinary and the result is simply superb. in my opinion this is one of the best home layouts I have seen in a very long time. Thanks for allowing us to share this with you and also thanks for the time and effort taken to create great presentation. Cheers, Bob

[@EverardJunction]

Thanks Bob, glad you enjoyed it. Certainly takes a while!

[@georgethomas7814]

@@EverardJunction Just checking that you're okay.

[@paulsymons562]

This really is the art of the humdrum. Resisting all those daft set piece unlikely scenes for just more of the same dull sameness is what, ironically, makes your layout stand out.

[@EverardJunction]

Thanks, I think the dullness is what makes the layout. As tempting as it is to do silly contrived scenes I try my best to avoid it. Cheers

[@CymruJedi]

First time I’ve ever seen a desire path represented on a model railway. Amazing detail

[@johneaton25]

With the empty houses at the back l always thought it was a construction site! Would it look good and ultra interesting with a plethora of heavy machinery with diggers, roofers, brickies, building gangs, generators with work lights etc. etc. and making a complete mini diorama as you did with that wonderful scrapyard 🤔 I reckon you’d make it look absolutely amazing

[@TheShaunBallUK]

I was thinking the exact same thing! A building site would certainly be in keeping with the way towns were increasingly encroaching on the countryside in the late 80s and early 90s. Might save on having to build hundreds of windows too 😉

[@syborgbabe2788]

Stunning layout. Takes me right back to that era. I can almost hear that Marina driving around and smell it of coarse as it would have been burning oil! 😆

[@EverardJunction]

Or a strong smell of fuel due to rough running haha

[@mossi408]

One of the best railwaysceneries I ever saw in my entire life, so far. Everything is matching together.

[@ausfoodgarden]

Yes, painting facia boards in dull black makes an amazing amount of difference. The path lightening is great too. Love the updates as I usually do. I really need to stop watching videos and work on my layout scenics. 😁 Cheers!

[@daviemaclean61]

Lots of little areas of progress and I like the combination of constant running trains while you explain the work done. Always inspiring. I have four Class 31s, but they are all Lima, Airfix and Triang, so they wouldn't pass muster on your layout! They didn't run in Scotland either, but as they're my favourite diesel and I don't film my layout for KZbin I can get away with it!

[@ausfoodgarden]

The old 31's are not too bad from a viewing distance. They certainly did run in Scotland btw. I know they ran London and Newcastle to Edinburgh. I think they probably showed up in every area at some time. Cheers!

[@EverardJunction]

Some say the Lima 31 is actually more accurate than the current Hornby offering. With a bit of work they can be made to look very good.

[@kittonsmitton]

Really looking good Richard very professional layout, beats other layouts I've seen for skill level and for captivating my interest, everywhere you look there is something of interest. I must say moving to Canada as a twelve year old, my father moved us out to the fringes of the city of Toronto, a couple of miles away across fields was one of the main lines coming into the city, I used to stay awake at night just to listen to the clackety clack of the trains in the distance. You could set your watch by them, the trains would take more than twenty minutes to fade off into the distance. One of my fondest childhood memories.

[@billyjohnesterhuizen6340]

Richard, this is the besti've ever seen. Being a Lima-enthuiast, i adoe ll types of trains, but your layout is outstanding and it sometimes blows my mind with what brilliant ideas you com about. Only started exploring model trains on youtube for about five months, i'm convinced that all model train enthusiasts will enjoy watching you're wonderful work

[@Deebz270]

I like how you've left the semi-detached houses... As you say, a work in progress, but even then, it actually looks authentic in that these semis' look like a new - ongoing - development, with the newest build on the left of the scene and the first build at the right-hand end, the houses look like they would in a real building site. Well cool.

[@ReddwarfIV]

I was thinking that, with some added soot, they would look burnt out.

[@peterdemkiw6858]

Amazing work, as I've said before I worked on the railway in the 80s and I absolutely recognise everything you do, brings back memories.

[@cliffwood4610]

entirely agree with your comments about enjoyment and we entirely enjoy your work...The layout is a labour of love and not just model making,but it comes under the heading of"Art" Long may you entertain yourself and us! Many thanks for allowing us in...

[@bazkib]

Yes, I had a large spare bedroom OO layout and once the scenery was finished after 2 years I started to watch trains going around and found it boring. I sold all the rolling stock and engines back to Hattons, and I broke up the layout with houses etc going to my local Model Railway club. I've returned to wargames but I always enjoy watching what you get up to as you always inspired me. :)

[@toddberry4118]

Loved your ideas and the layout for a couple of years now. The obscure double bridge is what I love about railway scenery , there is no average normal place . When you try to draw or build ,especially70`s & 80`s scenery , you constantly find things you feel you must add , but will always look strange.

[@PZ35Mike]

Never ceases to amaze me how fantastic Everard Junction is. Isn't many days that go buy where I don't watch in amazement how good it is and the detail 👌🏻

[@JamesPetts]

It is always a treat to see a new Everard Junction video. I shall look forward to seeing those signals working one day.

[@paulbaker916]

Superb as always. A real pleasure to watch. Regarding any concerns about bridge/tunnel proximity in the real world I can instantly think of two similar style locations on the Southern region: 1) Redhill tunnel south portal is so close to the Redhill to Tonbridge lines passing overhead you only know there's a gap if you notice the smallest shard of light as you travel north towards London and 2) just north of Penge West as the main lines from Norwood Junction to London Bridge cross over the Victoria to Dover lines going into Penge tunnel. This second example is almost exactly like your depiction and so you're spot on.

[@TanksForTheMammeries]

Hello from the States! I've been watching for a few years now and I have to say how impressed I am with the continual improvement in your technique and layout. I firmly agree with your statement that re-doing part of the layout, even when other bits require attention, keeps you interested instead of begrudgingly working on something because you 'have to". It's your layout and we shouldn't be telling you whats next. It's your vision. The scale and growth is quite impressive. Thanks for being so entertaining. Happy Holidays.

[@valentinsn-ostalgiemodellbahn]

It is always a good evening/afternoon, when one of your videos comes online. Great progress, love it!

[@christophermacleod3726]

Really enjoy your updates, you make the best films and voiceovers, excellent thanks.

[@roystudds1944]

What a fabulous update Richard. I just love the level of detail you put into your layout. Thanks for sharing. Roy.

[@franktuckwell196]

Don't you go fretting about what other people think about, what you have done, you've done it for your own enjoyment. We just came along for the amazingly detailed ride. I am a retired BR train driver and am absolutely stunned by your attention to detail, big chunks of which just look oh so familiar. The only difference between your area and mine was that mine had a juice rail and every single junction, and engineers cross overs and sets of points were all protected by signals, shunt signals and ground based calling on lights. If you were to attempt that, you would go potty with all the excessive amount of extra wiring needed. What you have done is brilliant in itself, i still recall with a smile the amount of details you incorporated when putting junk items into the canal. Most people wouldn't bother, or notice. I still want to know when will you admit members of the public for grand tours? Wonderful stuff.

[@nihalweerasena3692]

Outstanding achievement. . Everard Junction is going from strength to strength. 🤘👋👋

[@keithshayle7027]

Arguably one of the most realistic model railways currently on KZbin...The idea regarding the street scene is definitely the way to go, I mentioned on a previous post, that needed to be a proper urban street with buildings on both sides, also I would still add more undergrowth bushes etc on the embankment between the branch line and industrial area. Nature would definitely take advantage of an unused area like that!

[@EverardJunction]

I think so, certainly more bushes and stuff to add to those areas. I think it would help blend that section into the woodland bit too. Glad you enjoyed it, cheers.

[@thepagan5432]

Good update, everything you've done has enhanced your layout. You mentioned Slough and Reading, I was born 3 miles east of Slough and not that far from the railway station at Langley. Total oil had a depot there which caught fire and everyone was evacuated, the bridge by the station was sometimes closed due to vehicles crashing into it, once a garbage truck collided with the bridge as the garbage collector had been switched to empty and it was wedged under the bridge. At Slough there was a magnificent hotel called the 'Royal Hotel' just across from the station's main entrance. It was knocked down in the 70s I think. The taxi rank at Slough had a few of the old style black cabs and one of those green taxi cafes on wheels. That was a trip down memory lane and then some. Thanks for a great post, appreciated 👍

[@buzzard4242]

I love the layout and the scenery is great. I enjoy watching your how to videos. As an American things are slightly different but the techniques are universal. Keep up the great work.

[@nicholashortonjustice4rebe378]

Hi @EverardJunction! As a Kid Growing-Up during the 90's, I Remember the Network Southeast Trains Running Through Richmond Upon Thames, Brings back Memories for Me.

[@Frankestein01nl]

Lovely camera work of a very nicely detailed layout. Much like watching the real thing. Thanks for the explanations and the work!

[@debbiemilka2251]

Yoursenery is extremely realistic. The camera footage and view point chosen is engrossing and the speed of the rail traffic is spot on ! I really appreciate your efforts.

[@coldwarmotors]

Always enjoy a look at what's happening at the Junction! Cheers from Canada...

[@simoncarney9944]

Absolutely superb! Your layout just gets better and better but, like you say, it takes a lot of time so I really appreciate that you share it with us. Looking forward to the tour in good time. 👍🏼

[@NicholassTrainChannel]

Excellent update Richard. The black boards on the front look brilliant and just make the layout more professional. Liking the new building so far for the town scene. Great rolling stock and loco additions. Always nice to go through your existing fleet and update some models. - Nicholas.

[@andrewstevenson5449]

Completely agree with interrupting the view. Makes it so much more interesting.

[@1BCamden]

Great update, the branch line work tunnel work is fantastic, that arrangement was very common in liverpool on the docks goods lines. The comments you made regarding doing a specific area when you were motivated to do so is so true. Thanks again, much appreciated

[@CatPawCreations]

A random little factoid for you.. the type of path where people might take a bit of a shortcut like what you have done at the corner of the field by the farm track, would be called a "path of desire". Caused by humans and other animals, they are far more common that most people realise. But once you start looking for them, you see them all over. Game trails, worn parts of carpets, all sort of places.

[@ReddwarfIV]

A similar name is "desire lines". Funnily enough, this was a plot point in a _Jonathan Creek_ episode. Why would a burglar walk through the dust in an L-shape when he could just run across the carpet to reach the window?

[@frankiepitt9135]

Wonderfully useless information.

[@stevenhill23]

I really do like the Bridge/Tunnel Combo, added unusual feature that you don't see elsewhere

[@bobsandone3108]

I'm sorry you don't have more than 89K subscribers. Your forward looking ideas and planning are far better then most other layouts, and your modeling skills at scenery and structures, etc are far superior to many others. And I really like your idea of having various trains, passenger and freight, continuously moving about the layout at various times rather then having your trains only move during operating sessions, switching and serving different industries. Good luck with all future endeavors !!

[@grantjohnstone9787]

That's a pretty good number, I can't imagine there are millions of model railway fans out there these days?

[@darz3]

Every new video gives inspiration, having lived in London at the time your layout is set , the one thing I noticed following your comments about building is the lack of a building site, remember those being on nearly every street

[@rupertcarss6704]

Outstanding, Richard. The countryside scene really looks stunning. The camera shot at 14:40 (I think) really highlighted the differencethe black edging makes. Fantastic contrast with the urban setting. Thanks for the update, and most importantly, the inspiration!

[@frankverrico8804]

I've been watching the series "Gangs Of London" on (HBO) MAX...It seems some of the scenes were filmed in and around Everard Junction.

[@ThePhosphater]

The best layout on You tube, I always look forward to your updates.

[@jfzproductions7907]

Richard, like your new building. Also like the thought of your Magnorail going between buildings! Also love the sound of your three unit rail car set. I believe you referred to it as the thumper. Love that burbling sound it has. Don't lose that momentum! 👍

[@wstks-fmworldwide5390]

Just an absolute joy to peruse your work here over the last few years. It looks amazing. Kind Regards from Michigan, USA.

[@tonyslight826]

Very well done Richard brilliant love the plate girder bridge / tunnel looks great keep up the the very professional work and modelling.

[@nig87101]

Great update, Richard, loving your work, as always. Thanks for doing what you do.

[@tonylawlor3503]

When a hobby becomes a work of art really wonderful and fun

[@peterbuysen8172]

I love all the work in progress cause not everything can be done at once. Fantastic effort on everything and every revisit is interesting explanation.

[@richardandrews6754]

Hi this is looking superb now, your eye for real life detail is really starting to show. Best of luck in the up coming awards.

[@Synthematix]

Richard those new houses behind the lines you could turn into a construction site of newly built houses

[@ellaevansbolt]

Yeah, I thought that was the intent. Loads of scope for detailing a building site.

[@DukeofEarl1961]

Your work is so realistic that I was shocked every time your hand appeared!

[@John_N_Quay_Harbour]

You are just fantastic. Not only is the modelling incredible (I have to check if what I am seeing is your model or the "real world") your relaxing presentation is awesome. Thank you

[@Snugggg]

needs more buddleia. (I only mention this because the standard of realism is so high that the only difference I can spot between this and the view from my train window is the absence of thousands of buddleia weeds growing out of everything. absolutely fantastic work! sub'd)

[@grantjohnstone9787]

I'd absolutely love to build a model railway, but home ownership is a must and that's not easy for our generation - especially not where I live! Still, these videos give me plenty of inspiration and I can live in hope..

[@VanWinger]

It was about 2 or 3 years ago when you pondered what to put in the urban plot and I suggested a Pub. So, I am pretty happy to hear you went with a restaurant, although I was thinking of a place with a garden and tables and such.

[@richardserridge2767]

I always look forward to your layout updates! The black baseboards look great as you say and I really like that brick portal behind the girder bridge. A nice little nook and layering of textures. Well done!

[@EverardJunction]

Thanks, pleased with that. Its a very tricky area to get looking good as its all a bit contrived, I've made a few attempts at it. Cheers

[@flatscreenstevie124]

What you have created is remarkable. Really good work. The black boards look brilliant on video. A black border at the top of the shot would really draw our eyes into the scene. Just a thought. Brilliant layout. Its so interesting to see it progressing. 👍

[@MrBnsftrain]

I do like those houses without any siding on them. Makes it look like this neighborhood is in the process of being built.

[@marksinthehouse1968]

That part of the branch and the girder bridge there is a similar arrangement near redhill ,yours looks great 👍🏻😊

[@jamespearson7753]

This is amazing I subscribed when I was in the early stages of building my own layout but I quickly realised I hadn't the time to achieve anything worthwhile. I have since sold all my stuff and unsubscribed from all related channels. I kept this channel as I just love the way you work even if you are a Southerner.

[@lynganddistrict]

Well said on the comment about its your layout and you do what you want to do to keep the interest going, and that's exactly my approach to my layout. I constantly flit from one bit to another just because I feel like it! Loved all the scenic updates, I appreciate the subtle changes as well as the larger ones. Regards Steve

[@chehalisvalleyrailproducti8913]

Hey there, brand new subscriber here. What an incredible layout! the scenery is fantastic and the weathering and detailing on the locomotives and rolling stock is outstanding. Cheers from America.

[@The333]

I like the new 2 story building - my vote is for a Pub! ;) Layout is amazing, enjoy seeing all the updates.

[@thomasedwards5700]

Always enjoy your videos and love your layout. Thanks for all the effort you go into sharing. My take on the branch line is that it was actually built before the mainline and originally terminated at a wharf by the canal in what is now the scrapyard. However once the main line was built and as the canal traffic declined the embankment was built and the branch line was diverted up to the existing station. It was actually proposed to close following the Beeching cuts which is why it never received direct connection to the mainline. The scrap metal and a few railway wagons left by the old terminus actually lead to the start of the scrap yard and then the industrial units were built more recently.

[@peterells1720]

Another wonderful update! Your new building would be ideal for illuminating at night in a manner reminiscient of Edward Hopper's painting "Nighthawks".

[@Pizzpott]

You got my vote in the KZbin category in that Hornby thingy...was a toughie though between you and one other, but in the end the extensive, detailed and themed layout, and the realistic lighting etc, is what did it for me. Very glad to see the nefarious character still loitering in the car park....

[@4hillines67]

Such a pleasure to come here to your site to get away from it all and watch trains run through your incredible scenes. Great, great work. As an urban designer, I was curious how you were going to handle that peninsula building.....I think you are spot-on with the two story. If it were a modern era, I could see the addition of a loft unit above (that's my California experience showing). Again, such a pleasure visiting, thank you.

[@louisasutcliffe7778]

Looking fantastic! Thanks for letting us see your hard work!

[@100SteveB]

I think you have got it spot on with how you have dealt with the branch line going under the mainline, a very believable scenario. Of course it would have been nicer to site the tunnel further back, but you can only do so much with the space you have. I love the look of the branch line going through the countryside section - very rural looking indeed. I remember how much i loved the countryside scene on the old layout. But the detail you have put into this layout is above and beyond what you had before. For me, the only thing I think it lacks at the moment is a larger countryside section for the mainline, whilst the branch line looks very rural, the housing that is being built behind the mainline encroaches on what would have been a much more rural scene. But the detail elsewhere on the layout more than make up for it. The scrapyard could have been modelled on any one of a dozen or so i remember from back in the 80's. And the lighting around places like the station area is simply stunning - the colour temperature, the shadowy areas and such make it look so real. Very much looking forward to a new tour.

[@EverardJunction]

It's all a bit compressed on that section. Space is very much the challenge, I've tried a few different ideas over the years, so far I think this is the best compromise. Always room for improvement, I'll keep working on it. Cheers

[@Subbuteo_Passion]

This is an absolute masterpiece. It’s been a pleasure watching the progress. Amazing detail.

[@PreservationEnthusiast]

People don't realise this is the best layout in the UK!

[@Ozbert]

The layout is looking terrific. I really sympathised with your reply to questions regarding why you revisited the scrapyard area - "because you enjoy it", and it stops you from getting stale. Loving the country scene tidy up. It's such a contrast to the station end, just as in real life. Thanks for this update as it's always nice to see one of these pop up. Cheers

[@delphjunction1168]

🇺🇦 Wonderful layout whatever you do to it. Wish I had your patience and talent. Always enjoy seeing the way you do things. Thanks for this vlog. DELPH JUNCTION

[@1A9lis]

Wonderful work as always , and the realism you achieve is so impressive . I did have to smile at your opening shot , as the speed came into view . 60 and 25 mph train’s might be the last mode of transport allowed such dizzying speed 😂 . 👍👍👍

[@IamRobotMonkey]

Great stuff. That restaurant needs to be a Wimpy!

[@sanclewphotographic]

Really fantastic modelling, everything looks wonderfully realistic and it helps where possible that you keep strictly to your era and therefore create these wonderful vistas throughout the layout, looking forward to the next one.

[@PaulinesPastimes]

All the things you have done since the last video add up to a lot of work and the visual difference is really noticeable. I really like the effect of the new building. To me, it seems like an image gradually coming into focus. Enjoyable to see as always. 😊

[@radders261]

Nice update! I have to say that the extra building really makes up the urban area. Well done mate and can't wait for the next update!

[@afm1948]

Thank you for the update Richard. Great modelling as usual. Looking forward to the layout tour and the continuing additions. Always enjoy your videos. Arthur

[@ruthlesslee]

I was really hoping you would put an old pub in that triangle section. layout is amazing

[@ChadwickModelRailway]

Nice update Richard, much appreciated. Regards Charlie.

[@jimtrack3786]

Hello from Wisconsin USA, the layout looks great. The improvements are excellent. Keep up the great work over there cross the pond!

[@robA2345]

A market would work in that space but I agree the restricted view will make for some great photographs. With regards to the relay boxes and dummy point motors they look a bit overscale to my eye, it might just be me but they really do jump out when the stock is going by. Speaking of stock, I have a lot of the same vans etc and will definitely be following your example when weathering them over the winter. Keep up the great work.

[@EverardJunction]

Those are Peco ones, the point motors they do are certainly too chunky. One of the many jobs planned for the future to sort out. Cheers

[@anthonyborden2513]

Excellent layout I'm from the US and the layout here dosen't have as much detail depth as your layout in so little space superb work 👌 Im working on my layout and learning alot from your channel thanks 🎉

[@mikeryan959]

Yet another great video from you. I like your philosophy too - it's supposed to be fun, so don't slog away at something unless that itch really does need scratching. Keep up the fantastic work.

[@herrkiwi3110]

Couldn't agree more about doing stuff on the layout that you really want to do at that time otherwise the finished product will reflect that. Love that scrap yard. Cheers.

[@lindaoffenbach]

Great update and quite the progression occurring. A layout is evidently never finished but to have finally have arrived at its current state as it is must be feeling highly rewarding, we can imagine. Lovely. We are looking forward to an entire overview of this new layout as well. Thank you so much in advance 🙂

[@EverardJunction]

While there is plenty left to do it's nice to have established scenes on each board to look at. Glad you enjoyed it, cheers.

[@bradleysmith2021]

Always love your videos. Top tier work, as usual! Thanks!

[@patmoore1875]

With regard to the Tunnel mouth being very close to a railway over ridge two examples are The South end of Penge Tunnel on the Chatham Main line where the line almost immediately goes under the 4 tracks of the former LBSCR main line from London Bridge towards Norwood Junction. And, also where the Brighton Fasts (Quarry Line) exits at the south end of the Redhill Tunnel (AKA Sand Tunnel) and within less than 4 metres goes directly under the former Southeastern line from Redhill to Tonbridge. As you said there are other examples of this elsewhere. Wonderful modelling of a fascinating period on the railways, always look forward to your videos.

[@Xantec]

The black edging also gives greenscreen possibilities when filming as its a flat uniform shade. Layout looks great too

[@davidstrains4910]

A good update overall here, layout is looking really good and coming on really well, keep up the great work.

[@andiscott8470]

Absolutely LOVE the new building scheme for the street scene! In my mind, absolutely the correct and proper thing to do. I love the trains and track, but for me, it is the street and urban scenes that really make layouts for me. I really appreciate you sharing all your hard work and imagination with us, it is looking absolutely wonderful! 👍🙂

[@matthewtrains7504]

You have done a great job of the layout I would love to see a layout tour

[@WhiffTheRubbishEngine1869]

When I build my layout, I’m putting a pile of bread with birds around it next to a station. The backstory is, last time I came back from London on holiday, I got back to County Durham and saw, just next the the station, a pile of bread slice corners. I don’t know how, I don’t know who and I sure as hell don’t know why it’s there but it was and it’s now inhabiting my mind so I need to give it a physical form in my layout as a tribute to that spectre that fits in perfectly with the completely bizarre aesthetic of my town. A pile of bread slice corners, multiple shops with a flag of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, three competing kebab places with the same exact name, three unprofessional driving instructors all ran out of homes within 100 feet of each other etc.

[@raymondrion6712]

Thanks for the tour. The layout looks fantastic great job.

[@itsmyview2024]

Love the cut off corner on the path, very much what you woud see anywhere