Learning to Trad Climb: Part 1 - Belaying with two ropes

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DMM Wales

Күн бұрын

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@matthewlambrick6621 2 жыл бұрын

This series deserves way more views!

@AlessandroAI85 7 ай бұрын

I paid a lot of money for a trad course and yet I had no such good and details explanations! Great job!!!

@lukebohemian 2 жыл бұрын

Super helpful actually! Just started getting into climbing now🙂

@DeanWright-gj2nm Жыл бұрын

The ropes are durable and just like the ones at the gym. kzbin.infoUgkxTFxba6lNeHrZaHoY_LXe6ZzmMfaipnwu Caution: I bought the 50 feet ropes and they are long and heavy so make sure you have the space (I do have the space). If I was to do it again I would probably get a shorter version as 50 feet (25 feet each side) is a little long.

@GoodLuck-rh8tb 2 жыл бұрын

Do you really think the sliding/tunneling method of lead-belay is unsafe? DAV actually teaches this as the Standart method.

@visualpoetry3d 2 жыл бұрын

The DAV only teaches this for half-automatic belay devices such as the Jule². As the tuber lacks the automatic breaking of the rope, the tunneling technique would not work as it does with the Jule². So, I think the video explanation is correct on this is one. Greetings from Berlin.

@GoodLuck-rh8tb 2 жыл бұрын

@@visualpoetry3d This is wrong. The DAV teaches this for all devices, assisted breaking or not. They even have a video of this method with a tube where they argue that this method is tested and safe, even for tube style devices without assited breaking.

@visualpoetry3d 2 жыл бұрын

@@GoodLuck-rh8tb You are right. I looked it up and there is a DAV video from 2018 where they use the tunneling technique for lead. I am not sure if this is still taught as the DAV has changed their opinion on some techniques since 2018. When I did a course on multi-pitch climbing in 2020, they also taught belaying as shown in this video from DMM. I wonder if someone as actual data / science to show which technique is better

@GoodLuck-rh8tb 2 жыл бұрын

@@visualpoetry3d It hasnt changed since then. Actually it gets more widely accepted that tunneling/sliding is a safe technique. DAV claims they made sufficiant testing of this technique with tube devices. The channel HardisEasy announced to have made content to this aswell which will be uploaded in the near future. Especially on multipitch climbing i think tunneling is more convinient and equally safe. But DAV teaches belaying with munter hitch on multipitches as a standart technique as it is the fastest to setup.

@Nick-B78 2 жыл бұрын

As to whether or not tunnelling is ‘safe’, I’d say it isn’t ‘completely unsafe’ but it most definitely is lazy and during the time that you’re tunnelling back up the rope, you most definitely are NOT holding the rope with a firm grip. This means that if your climber falls at the point you’re moving your hand up the rope, it’s is extremely likely to slip through your hand and therefore make grabbing it to catch a fall much harder to do a) quickly and safely and b) without causing at least some rope burn on your hand. With regards to HardIsEasy, based on his most recent video where he had a very serious near-miss simply due to the belayer not gripping the dead-end, I suspect he may change his mind about the importance of maintaining a proper grip of the dead end. Oh, and that was with a GriGri too!

@davidgiampietro3567 2 жыл бұрын

At 3:34 in the video it shows the rope being aligned on the gate side of the carabiner while belaying. I was always taught to align the rope on the spline side of the carabiner as it was generally a safer method. Has this changed? Thanks

@dustinswanson2909 Жыл бұрын

It’s a horse a piece. Technically it is stronger on the spine side, but the most important thing is it’s in the basket of the carabiner.

@TarflameH 11 ай бұрын

I’m watching this way later than this comment was posted, so hopefully you see this David haha While Dustin isn’t technically incorrect, the basket of the carabiner is the best spot to have the climber on, I think your question is regarding a more redundant type of belaying safety. In response to your question, it depends on what your primary brake hand is, but yes! It appears the individual belaying is right handed, if this is the case for you then you would want the gate facing your left side with the rope through the right chamber of the belaying device. You want the gate opening on the opposite side from where your braking is taking place, simply on the off chance it somehow comes unscrewed by your braking/sliding movements. It isn’t super necessary, but I always recommend it when I’m teaching classes; when it comes to safety redundancy is key! Not sure if you’ll see this, but I hope it helps!

@Nick-B78 2 жыл бұрын

That lead belay technique was super awkward. Sliding the hand down the rope is absolutely fine and ISN’T the same as tunnelling. Tunnelling is where you slide the hand UP the rope which means it isn’t possible to be in control of the rope at all as it’s physically impossible to slide up a rope and keep any amount of grip on it whereas you can easily slide your hand down a rope and keep a grip on the rope. If you don’t believe me, go try it for yourself.

@TarflameH 11 ай бұрын

I’m a PCIA certified lead climbing instructor, and I second this. I thought it was a fantastic video, and I love to see people learning to climb, but I was definitely a little unhappy watching that technique haha Basic PBUS; Pull, Brake, Under, Slide should definitely be, if it’s not already, the universal standard. It definitely feels to me like it’s the safest and fastest way to belay. The way demonstrated here feels like it adds unnecessary movement and allows for more opportunities to mess up and not have tension on the brake end in a fast paced scenario. PBUS is the PCIA standard, I’ve had to fail people during tests for doing it the way she taught her to belay in this video. No hate at all to the content creator or instructor, again, I enjoyed the video, I just hope everyone is safe! If anyone somehow sees this late comment, slide don’t skip!

@CharfishDesign 10 ай бұрын

Happy to read this, @TarflameH. The belay technique shown in this video has the brake hand being removed from the rope, being replaced by the other hand, then being put back on again. If you're in a rush or get the timing just wrong, it's no stretch of the imagination to see how easy it would be for someone to fall mid hand swap. With the method you describe...your brake hand NEVER EVER EVER comes off the rope. That's got my vote simply for being the more common sense approach.

@dankmemesstudios3987 7 ай бұрын

@@CharfishDesign You're not timing it. You remove your hand when the other hand is placed so one hand is always on the brake strand. If you don't feel your other hand on the rope, you don't move it. If it is learnt like this, it's completely safe and valid.

@charlie.carter.outdoors 2 жыл бұрын

Fantastic, thanks 😁

@uttley23 10 ай бұрын

Hi, new to trad here...in what situation do you use 2 ropes? Are you belaying 2 climbers at the same time? Thanks

@bernardmcgrath7341 10 ай бұрын

I would love an answer to this as well, never seen a double rope belay untiI I was at Avon gorge yesterday, couldn’t figure out why one guy was belaying one other guy with two ropes

@peak_interest 9 ай бұрын

Pro's using double or half ropes (different to twin ropes) over a single rope: - less rope drag if the climbing route is zig zaging i.e. you can clip all the protection on the left side with the left rope and visa versa, meaning the ropes run smoother as opposed to a single rope that runs through each bit of protection. Also better protecting routes with a traverse. - 2 x 50/60m ropes allow you to abseil the full 50/60m length; useful on some routes particularly in North Wales. Whereas a single can only be folded in half so becomes a 25/30m abseil which may mean you have to multi-pitch abseil to get to the bottom. - Redundancy - in the unlikely event a rock fall (or an ice axe in winter) severs or damages one rope you have a back up on the other side. A severed/damaged single rope is going to give you squeaky bum time half way up a route! - A lead climber can bring up two seconds in parallel if climbing as a three. Cons: - cost - twice the expense of a buying a singe rope - weight - even though normally slightly thinner than a single or triple weighted rope, you have to carry two ropes into the climb which means heavier bags. - can be more complex to belay with and set up anchors. Hope this helps!

@markstuart8401 6 ай бұрын

called twin or double ropes and usually used in winter mountaineering incase of icefall or on steep trad routes when rope drag could become an issue.

@SebaCufer Жыл бұрын

Why 2 slimer ropes? Why not just 1 thick like 9.8mm ?

@BenLMitchell Жыл бұрын

A thicker rope won't allow for as much stretch, if you Google rope types, there are pleny of articles explaining the different type of dynamic and static rope.

@SebaCufer Жыл бұрын

@@BenLMitchell i know whats the difference between them. I use 9.8mm dynamic rope, and i have no problem falling with it

@maple_fields Жыл бұрын

In trad climbing, “half” ropes can sometimes be useful because they let you reduce rope drag. If you have to place pieces way off to the left and way off to the right, it’s nice to have a rope for each side, rather than having to snake one rope back and forth across the wall. Also, psychologically it’s just nice having two? Climbers are always trying to reduce single points of failure, but if you’re using a single rope and it breaks, none of the redundancy in the rest of your system will save you. Finally… it’s just kind of a cultural thing? Half ropes aren’t super popular in the US, even for trad climbers, but they are in the UK.