Lets Delete Half Of The TF2 Mercs For Fun

[@mrstudent9125]

If you remove enough classes, game devolves back into Quake.

[@MegaMicah12]

Quake but in the 60s.

[@altEFG]

Pretty much. Honestly, I don't understand the hate for Sniper. I am convinced that TF2 competitive scene will eventually develop a mod for Quake 3 that adds Medic and this will be their ideal game. But even in the most restrictive, balance-conscious scene full of God-tier players which is competitive TF2 nobody insists on banning Sniper, even though it is the only place where players are dedicated enough to train for insane aim feats like quickscoping consistently. In Casual, it doesn't matter if the opposing team has one good Sniper, one good Spy, one good Soldier or one good Demo. You will be dying again and again and again without time to react.

[@MRworldEtIkA]

​@altEFG I don't understand the hate of Sniper. and I don't even fucking understand the hate of a fucking pellet spread on a fucking shotgun.

[@ignaciocampos5625]

@@altEFG i feel people hate sniper not because it's unfair but because it's unfun rather than interacting with you before he kills you, you just die an that's it, there is no interaction most of the time

[@somnvm37]

@@altEFG because sniper is a class from another game, he has no place in tf2.

[@redstonewarrior0152]

As an Engineer main, if I was in a room with all 9 mercenaries and had to remove 4 of them, I would remove Sniper 4 times.

[@humanhuman7280]

spy would atomize your sentry

[@thegreenline3656]

💀

[@foesio1437]

👍

[@danielsurvivor1372]

Engineer main with good takes? A surprise for sure but a good one

[@fawfulbenivictor5556]

Ah, a man of culture I see

[@shyguymike]

As an Engineer main, I would remove The Spy, The Demoman, The Soldier and The Medic. A completely unbiased decision, I assure you.

[@neopoloniae]

As a fellow Engineer main, fully agreed

[@salsamancer]

As a fun haver I don't main any class and just play whatever the team needs

[@kdevelopergw]

As a Battle Engineer main I would remove The Scout (so that more people play battle engi instead), The Sniper (so that my fights don't get interrupted), The Demoman (There's not much to pick from at this point and Demoman has the best matchup against Engineer), and the Soldier (same reason as Demo)

[@Anarqism]

as a spy main I agree on the spy

[@denifnaf5874]

As an engineer main i see no bias at all

[@BoinglyThe3th]

Valve if the bots come back instead of fixing the game:

[@Xeno911]

Deletes sniper

[@artifactU]

@@Xeno911 i wish but they cant

[@Xeno911]

@@artifactU ass solution

[@DEWILL]

TF2 6v6 Scene:

[@Lonqudor]

6v6 players aren’t going to be too happy that I axed Demo…

[@zypherion516]

@@Lonqudor I really dont know what demoknight could have pissed you off that badly I swear we're not nearly as bad as spy, sniper, or pyro mains

[@Lawlz4Dayzz]

​@@zypherion516pyro mains arent bad tho. People forget that this isnt jungle inferno or before.

[@Lonqudor]

@@zypherion516 These Demoknights think they own the road

[@dr.infernous9342]

@@zypherion516 as a spy main I don't like how you can just walk back and avoid getting trickstabbed in medieval mode because of the increased melee range, and that's my only gripe with demoknight

[@0necraftyninja256]

this video reminds me of the deranged posts on the TF2 reddit that go something like: "If you could add a seventh class to TF2 what would it be?" then an edited image of the select a class screen with only scout, soldier, demo, heavy, sniper and medic.

[@jokerofspades-xt3bs]

I mean- those were the 1.1 quake team fortress classes.

[@0necraftyninja256]

@@jokerofspades-xt3bs ok that makes sense for why they were chosen

[@Lawlz4Dayzz]

​@@jokerofspades-xt3bsThats crazy that Sniper prob was a problem for the game before the hame was around.

[@jokerofspades-xt3bs]

@@Lawlz4Dayzz Well sniper couldn't headshot in quake TF and could only instakill even the weakest class with a charged shot, and his close range was even worse then TF2 sniper at close range with a stock loadout and no random crits. Also movement was generally faster for most of the classes sniper had the ability to instakill. Honestly speaking sniper was one of the weakest classes in quake TF.

[@danielsurvivor1372]

Add Spy and you have almost peak fortressu 2. Maybe remove sniper and replace with Pyro. Or make sniper only use huntsman.

[@Nerdtendo6366]

I would delete everyone and add the Garden Warfare characters. Then, I would remove all the game mode and maps and replace them with the Garden Warfare modes and maps. Finally, I would rework the UI to be like the one in Garden Warfare Boom, game fixed

[@endarkenedgd]

lel gw1 or 2?

[@TheRealClaylex]

I actually just got into Garden Warfare 2 and man that game is REALLY GOOD

[@black_grey_white9813]

Bro what

[@prestoncrenshaw2914]

So based

[@Halalmeat187]

​@@bestestbread not possible unfortunately some are unavailable. If you don't use mods to access the unavailable game modes

[@chickenlegsmcgee9246]

It's very simple, the 10th class Has already been deleted, so 4 is accurate, good job!

[@uncannycato]

its the hale

[@Puppeteer_in_the_Void]

I really miss madcap, he was my main when I first joined.

[@MojiEmoji]

​@@Puppeteer_in_the_Void I would combo his grease gun with the nail gun to get easy kills it was so overpowered valve removed him ;(

[@Koshian_Adzuki]

@@MojiEmojiValve didn’t intend for Madcap to be an offence class, but players keep spamming him 😞

[@MojiEmoji]

@@Koshian_Adzuki they were so embarrased about their creation they deleted all evidence of him existing

[@Pseudo_Notfound]

removing half of the Smash roster is a matter of taste and fun. Removing half of the TF2 roster is an EXTREMELY DELICATE balancing act and certainly unfeasible.

[@theblorg]

Heres a good idea: we delete all the mercenaries and the game becomes a scenary simulator.

[@Nocturne232]

Finally. We have “fortress”

[@TheFrozenBoiTF2]

Slightly Smaller Team Fortress 2

[@PracticalProblems985]

watch your back from now on

[@Doktersocks]

It's him...

[@wr3nche5]

he's unleashed the spy without the pyro, so probably a good idea

[@transgirlpiri7487]

(the half is sniper)

[@Bloons_onelove]

(and spy)

[@whyamistupid3826]

(and pyro)

[@uncannycato]

actually you cant slip in half the number 9, if you do it you will get 4.5

[@Bloons_onelove]

@@uncannycato let's delete half of a demoman then - demoknight

[@ojhat]

I actually think Medic would absolutely be on the chopping block. Does that make TF2 similar to deathmatch-y Quake? Maybe, but that's a point proven in that there are FPS games in which players do not have a "healing class", just heal via health packs, or take it to the limit in a teamfight on low health (and likely die immediately). In fact, one could argue it would grant candy cane mad milk scouts and black box conch soldiers a very useful role to providing some tankiness and team healing.

[@4smo]

"When was a group of Bad Actors abusing something, never not a good reason to change it?" I totally agree sister! Remember when those dastardly bots were "abusing" the in-game text and voice chat to spam slurs, so we muted all F2P players? Best decision EVER!

[@danielsurvivor1372]

The TF2 sharty has fallen 2fortisters! *Billions must cry* 😭

[@blu3260]

He said "change" not "remove". A "change" could be adding a QoL feature to mute specific players clientsidedly

[@4smo]

@@blu3260 What are you on about? That "QoL feature" already exists.

[@4smo]

@@blu3260 He said "kill" not "murder". These differences are very important.

[@mrstudent9125]

Let's delete everyone except Scout, Soldier, Medic and Demoman. Wait...

[@MaycolDRoger]

Comp Foetress

[@mrstudent9125]

​@@MaycolDRoger6s Fortress

[@TeaSlurp_SDH]

bruh

[@zypherion516]

sixes is the perfect format, and thats coming from a casual demoknight main with 600 hours

[@altEFG]

@@zypherion516 Perhaps, but it's not TF2.

[@can_sir8391]

Ok which merc did he have to saw in half?

[@sevendeadlysquids404]

This would be a great video to do with the weapons.

[@cuchibambo.p]

10h video but gud idea

[@Lonqudor]

That’s not a bad idea actually…

[@sevendeadlysquids404]

@@cuchibambo.p If you think that would take a long time, imagine hats lol.

[@Doktersocks]

The bison is staying. No argument

[@luk4323]

​@@Lonqudorwell I know what's the next video going to be about thanks for spoiling it

[@danielsurvivor1372]

Here's a wacky idea I came up with for this concept, remove bullet classes, aka Scout, Heavy, Engineer, Spy and leave out only projectile classes, aka Soldier, Pyro(technically his flames are projectiles, but if it doesn't count, make Dragon Fury his new stock), Demo, Medic(syringes technically projectiles but if you want make crossbow stock) and make Sniper's new stock primary a huntsman. This way we get entirely new but similar experience to TF2

[@Caterman_the_pomson_enjoyer]

I understand the decission about engineer

[@Lonqudor]

I’m sorry. You seem hurt by my decision and I want to apologise

[@Caterman_the_pomson_enjoyer]

@@Lonqudor I'm not hurt at all, don't worry

[@zypherion516]

@@Lonqudor without engineer we would be playing fortress 2, there are other workarounds to stacking engineer, there should be class limits on everything, a max of 1 engi, 1 medic, and 2 of every other class, stacking a class can be funny, but its overall detrimental to the balance of the game. you shouldn't be able to stack any class least of all engi but he needs to stay for how much he helps everyone else on the team. also, can you think about how much more boring heavy would be without teleporters?

[@MyfavouritedrinkisWater]

@@Caterman_the_pomson_enjoyerI’m sorry that you can’t stack 68 sentries on the payload cart, making everyone swear slurs at you, I hope that you will grow into a new play style revolved shooting people as a green lime scout and being extremely toxic ❤

[@Lonqudor]

@@zypherion516 You have to remember that I DONT want to delete any. But this video is set in a scenario where I HAVE to. Engie is my second most played class, but I feel he'd be on the chopping list 100%

[@tomsmithok]

6:49 There is a punishment for spamming. Demoman is punished by his long reload time

[@artifactU]

thats not punishment enough, if you were being serious

[@the-tum-tum-tree]

agreed

[@mrstudent9125]

04:40 I think Engi stacking is a disproportionately rewarding type of teamwork

[@SourceBrother]

Agreed, the game is called TEAM Fortress after all. It's the same as mashing together 4 medics and 4 soldiers.

[@Grimmmmy-boy]

Team fortress players when you make a fortress:

[@somnvm37]

"demoknight doesn't count" if you remove the context of what is what, a "rocketlauncher + shotgun guy" and "granade + sticky granade guy" could be considered one thing, meanwhile an entirely melee oriented class would be a different concept. so normal demoman is literally closer to soldier than he is to demoknight. So no, demoknight is basically the 10th class there's literally no situation where you can treat the 2 as the same thing, every "how to fight against ... with ..." video has demoknight as a separate thing. most peopel would agree that if you have 3 demoknights on your team, going demo would make sense, you wouldn't be the 4th player of the same class. the only thing that makes 2 demos the same is that it's the same character and then same class in class selection menu. In terms of strategy and gameplay they might as well be 2 different entities.

[@Lonqudor]

Not reading all that. So instead, I’m just going to assume you got upset by the basic fact that he is not the 10th class

[@zypherion516]

@@Lonqudor the tldr is that demoman is closer to soldier than he is to demoknight making demoknight the much more unique of the 2, imo if you have to get rid of demoman, just remove all of his ranged weapons and rename it to just knight or smth.

[@zoom0451]

Cool stort bro

[@sermer6659]

Madcap class real?

[@Puppeteer_in_the_Void]

Demoman is closer to soldier than demoknight, the thing is that demoknight is a subclass. I know you are going to get mad, but if you actually think about it, I'm sure your brain will be able to comprehend why I said that, and while you may disagree, neither of us have full reign over the definition of a subclass

[@KnownOnlyAsDM]

Thanos Tf2 confirmed

[@georgecaths]

When you removed demoman I took that personally, U better keep Ur doors locked and watch out for stickies...

[@tengoku-hanabanashii3933]

Other than the out of left field Demo removal, you basically made what 6s is.

[@Slenderquil]

Somehow this video is the only thing that's made me respect sniper's existence in years. The reign of heavy begins now

[@Flamma_Dreemurr]

Oh brother You were NOT cooking with this one

[@DelusionalDetective]

As a demo main, ur decision has made my day 100x worse

[@Lonqudor]

100x? TF2? Hmm

[@Svar3n2527]

Tbf this guy having dogshit opinions isn't something new

[@Samuel-ev2df]

The robin music at the end caught me off guard.

[@HOTD108_]

The description says it's Tnbee music. Who's Robin?

[@Lonqudor]

Trying new things

[@Lonqudor]

@@HOTD108_ Robin is the name of the character for which the music is written about

[@hobbs_dogburglar]

I really don't want to hate your opinion because you said you didn't want to remove any classes, but you CANT just REMOVE Demoman, my beloved, and expect to get away with it! RRRAAAAAAAAGH

[@GunSpyEnthusiast]

* Demoman laugh voiceline *

[@noddyinagvnstyle]

"I'm a heavy main" made me subcribe to the channel, but now I am maining demo because of the 1 million explosion damage achivement

[@ClaraCl2005]

Imo the decision to keep heavy and remove pyro should be swapped. The big issue I have with it is movement, the other four classes you chose to keep in the game either have the highest movement speed, or a way to move fast, heavy only has two speed options and both are melees that punish him heavily for going fast (not including the Dalokohs Bar, that's a bug). This means that to push forward as a team of 5, heavy is left in the dust by a long shot, this is already the case as the game is currently, but it is partially alleviated by engineer. It puts you in a tricky situation when it comes to optimal play. To take a point, it's best to have all your team together especially the damage sponge that shreds at close range, but that limits how fast the team can move up effectively, the other option is to leave the heavy behind and hope you wipe the enemy team before their heavy arrives, and if you don't, your heavy is going to get run down and slaughtered. Both heavy and pyro excel at close range, and become less effective at long range, but with pyro he has the chance to keep up with his team and avoid damage. I am a person that much prefers movement over power, if I am playing a game and I have the option to stay still and do massive damage, or be a mosquito with a peashooter, I will be the most annoying mosquito possible. It's like in Helldivers, a really good way to deal with a horde of bugs is to drop down an hmg emplacement and shred through them all at once, but if that emplacement goes down by being destroyed or running out of ammo, you have very little to prevent you from dying, if you have a standard machine gun with a jump pack, your ability to kill absolutely everything is lowered, but your survivability is increased because you are not restricted to a single location and reliant on keeping your emplacement up.

[@Lonqudor]

I think I would personally be fine with that decision. Heavy never really a very strong contender.

[@te-m4329]

Yeah, engi being gone makes heavy much weaker and imbalanced

[@Lawlz4Dayzz]

​@@LonqudorYeah id def keep Pyro of you are keeping Soldier because Soldier doesnt have many strong counters and Pyro is mainly that. Also Pyro is extremely fun and well designed on his own from his Dragon subclass to detinator and airblast jumps and so forth.

[@LucyTheBox]

I actually fully support the decision of keeping Heavy. Without the Engineer, the role of team anchor opens up, a role Heavy is kinda meant to be. And with both Demoman and Sniper gone, the bulk of the burst damage that usually gets heavy killed is also gone. Basically while it's sad to lose the teleporter, I do think the removal of those 4 classes would elevate heavy's spot in the game.

[@minus100iq8]

​@@Lawlz4Dayzz Using dragon's fury is a subclass now?

[@yourhomiegort]

“Let’s remove half of the classes” So is this just 6s or am I missing something

[@GunSpyEnthusiast]

Yes, Heavy is allowed

[@luk4323]

Heavy mains don't exist

[@ChiefShrek]

there's actually many heavy mains, he's unpopular to be played by most people but actually a popular main for some reason

[@Lawlz4Dayzz]

​@@ChiefShrekHes popular but alot less compare to popular classes

[@ckinggaming5bucketmadness766]

Now, how would this affect the comics, and how did these classes die in such a way they could not be recovered

[@potatoweaver4116]

Did you say the stock medigun is braindead? I honestly dont even know what to say to that. What a weird hot take to just casually drop as if it's not a controversial thing to say.

[@FairwellNoob]

Tf2 bubble reference?

[@DaveMillerDsafReal]

If you remove engi you need to remove scout to because engi is the only way to keep a great scout for destroying an bad or even average team. This is through a casual perspective because most people play casual

[@DaveMillerDsafReal]

And also removing pyro your make scout more dominant. I look through the perspective of casual because that what most people play

[@Mate_Antal_Zoltan]

one Heavy with the Natascha is enough to shatter a Scout's hopes and dreams

[@DaveMillerDsafReal]

@@Mate_Antal_Zoltan I play on server were engis aren't a thing an even with the Natasha scouts are a nightmare they come from no were jump behind you and put you in the grave

[@JoshuahClerice-ys3ye]

i play scout fairly often and agree that he becomes one of the most powerful classes on the list but he is so easily delt with if you have two people fighting him

[@DaveMillerDsafReal]

@@JoshuahClerice-ys3ye and how many casual players play close to each other? No many most do there own thing

[@emmaoo7024]

As a spy main I would honestly delete Pyro from the game infinite times

[@FakeCoconut-v7o]

Finally, we developed Quake: Source

[@elliotthetacreightmore8311]

i would remove spy, engi, sniper and heavy. demo and soldier would have enough dynamic to completely replace those 4

[@PDudeJr]

As a demo main, my only wish is for sniper to not exist.

[@artifactU]

theres a no sniper server ran by pirateer, its dead most of the time but there are bots (not spinbots just the regular bots like in training mode). its pretty nice & getting players active there would d be amazing

[@Matt-qk8yf]

Removing demoman is complete insanity. removing demoknight is based as hell.

[@lambsauce5312]

Opposite, idgaf how tanky a demo is he is restricted to melee and 2 of the most braindead classes counter him

[@Lonqudor]

Teehee

[@Lawlz4Dayzz]

​@@Lonqudorcringe + I will shield crit u IRL

[@wraithofradiation2977]

As a medic main i'd remove the spy, the sniper, the soldier, the demoman, the scout, the pyro, the heavy, and the engineer. ah peace at last

[@GunSpyEnthusiast]

World peace has been achieved. And by that, I mean all of humanity literally tore each other the fuck apart and the only thing left are trees.

[@ocarina0001]

The fact that Engineer slows the game down is good IMHO. I like it when my games last the timer.

[@artifactU]

i agree

[@danielsurvivor1372]

No that's bad. Especially when this slowdown is due to fighting boring aimbot wall 💀 I'd rather we buff Heavy to make him proper wall then fight Engy

[@clareimpeaded]

1:26 they are cheating bots, the exact same question would be asked if they picked one of the 8 other classes because surprisingly the game isnt ballenced with litteral cheating in mind

[@zoomspilo6798]

Yeah, there are plenty of people cheating on heavy dominating just as hard lmao

[@shinyknight1400]

As an Engie, Pyro, Demo player I'm depressed.

[@Lawlz4Dayzz]

You knw Engie had it coming

[@Ham-burger-man]

I completely agree with removing engi because I had a 2fort round last round a full hour because the other team had like 6 engi and they just sentry nested at the little hall way to the outside

[@mikespiehs8860]

Shounic literally made a video where he made a server with Sniper banned, and the game ended up being more fun

[@blu3260]

Yeah, the only technical effect that it had was literally just spreading out the death spots iirc. It was the same balance but fun. Kinda wish there was server still up that does that.

[@somedesertdude1308]

>sniper buck breaks tf2 community

[@Nigolelel]

I luv the editing in this one so much

[@Lonqudor]

Thank you

[@fonsy2580]

Who let Thanos cook?

[@darkidarki1332]

Tbh I don't think you can remove Pyro while keeping Soldier, and you can't remove Engie while keeping Scout. The only class that can easily be removed with little to no downsides is Sniper.

[@lojika1majik]

Nah. I think the 4 classes most easily to remove are still Engie, Pyro, and Sniper. I’d just replace Spy with Demo. With minor balancing, you could shift the Heavy to do something like take less bullet damage as a way to deal with scout. Scout is a good choice against Demo and Medic, Soldier is a good choice against Scout and Heavy, etc.

[@artifactU]

you removed engi? ok then the defending team stands no chance, engi slowing the game down feels like it was done on purpose & i personally think he should stay, sure stacking engi can be problematic but i dont think its worth deleting him over

[@angryamber8711]

Yeah, like I think it’s pretty crazy to define “slowing the game down” as a universally bad thing when any gamemode with attackers or defenders literally defines the entire defending team’s objective as “stalling until the timer runs out”

[@AndrewChumKaser]

Sorry but I take issue with your reasoning about the sniper part. "When was a group of bad actors abusing something not an excuse to change it?" Is very flawed argumentation. That's like saying we should increase/decrease taxes because some people commit tax fraud. Those factors are only tangentially related and just because one part has ramifications on the other doesn't mean we should change the other just because a problem exists in one sphere. To clearly state what my point is: Sniper should be removed because he's unfun and not fitting for the game. NOT because bots and cheaters exist. As for the other contentious thing I want to say: Medic being removed would be because he's too centralizing. To put it bluntly, he wins the game by existing and doing his job. He's the number one target and the number one deciding factor of the match. Assuming roughly equal skill levels, a team without a medic loses to a team with one, full stop. A class being this mandatory, one could argue is not healthy for the game balance.

[@angryamber8711]

Highkey agreed with the Medic bit. I think people just let it slide because while some classes like Snipers have the community feeling like they’re unfun (which motivates people to question his balance), Medic conversely has most people agreeing that he IS fun (so people don’t delve deeper into whether he actually adds balance to the game). People just like the big memorable moments and dopamine hits from Ubers and appreciate dying less to not question it

[@Executable_files320]

Honestly, when I heard 'I am a heavy main' leave his mouth, I thought Spy was dead in the water from that alone, but he stayed around shockingly enough.

[@IwanRoberts-m8j]

I would remove sniper (op), heavy (unfun as a base class), demo (a bit less interesting then soldier) and pyro (a bit boring in character and playstyle)

[@Lawlz4Dayzz]

Heavy isnt 1 Dimensional, hes 3 but 1 of those is useless as melee only and the 2nd is barely useful with the shotgun and the 3rd with the minigun is the only one thats truly viable on its own.

[@regionfuego6]

Wrong! I wanna finally hear someone say that Byleth should stay in the smash roster! EDIT: Honestly, If Pyro wasn't in the game, I don't think I'd keep playnig tf2. No other game has a character like Pyro, which sucks

[@Lonqudor]

My man!

[@ANewKindOfGamer]

Unfortunately, no one will ever say that Byleth should stay in the smash roster, but I think there is at least a case for Pyro in halved TF2

[@regionfuego6]

@@ANewKindOfGamer fire emblem has a bad rep, but Byleth is from the most successful game in the franchise, not to mention the one with the most interesting move set. Marth, Robin and Byleth should be the top contenders to stay from the franchise

[@ANewKindOfGamer]

@@regionfuego6 I'll agree it has a bad rep which isn't necessarily the fault of the series itself, and rotating characters from the series as the games continue would have been the best bet, the series mostly suffers form unfortunate timing. cutting to 3 could leave Marth, Robin, Byleth for me too, (but I'd probably cut FE to 2 sorry) but practically for sticking around I'd cut byleth to replace with a new FE character in a future game scenario, (although if new character was a mage that would mean cutting Robin instead) although I'm an advance wars fan and I want a smash rep too dammit!

[@SirKrook]

Only change I'd make is swapping out pyro for heavy. I just feel like pyro overall has a bit more going for it as a short ranged powerclass with the ability to better shut down overextending scouts and soldiers. Keeping heavy in while keeping one of his main counters in demo out really, REALLY boosts him. So I'd generally just opt for pyro.

[@Ashene64]

it's the pink guy from smiling friends

[@JarrodLaird]

Spy, Medic, Heavy, Demoman, and Engineer, next question

[@Lawlz4Dayzz]

Sounds like Engineer Hell

[@cheapartistcheapy]

deleting scout's head along sniper is crazy

[@rabahaicha7724]

heck the sniper itself is more than half to remove

[@rivvielet]

3:46 Congrats now scouts are free to roam the universe

[@neor2354]

Nice outro, seems like you play Star Rail as well. I am an engineer main, and yes he's broken. I understand the reasoning, for keeping Spy, but to tell you the truth... there's always a semi clone for engineer in a lot of games (engineer has way more buildings than a sentry, but devs just see that I suppose) I have yet to see a game (specially a shooter) where you have such a close gameplay as what the spy offers. And no, the hacker from Overwatch is far from the same gameplay that Spy has to offer.

[@PlatinumAltaria]

Sniper mains when someone suggests that "aim" is not a good counterbalance to being able to kill any class instantly from anywhere on the map by looking at them: >:(

[@Lawlz4Dayzz]

These are real takes by Snipers in Skial and UGC. Any complaints are met with "You shouldnt moved better" or "You shouldnt have been there" like Sniper should be able to take over and controll huge sightlines on maps risk free and kill anybody without risk of being killed nearly as easily not quickly.

[@danielsurvivor1372]

Only downside of removing Sniper is Huntsman. Huntsman genuinely feels like what Sniper SHOULD'VE been. A bow would be ideal TF2 aah goofy idea for stock primary, plus it helps that it's a projectile.

[@GuestsPowering]

@@danielsurvivor1372 change the way the huntsman works or sniper would be even worse

[@Tann3rr]

As a scout main I completely I agree with your engineer decision (100% unbiased opinion, actually tho)

[@danielsurvivor1372]

Not a Scout main, I'd still remove engineer. Only Demos and occasionally Soldiers have fun fighting sentries, WHAT ABOUT THE REST OF US?!? Scout and Pyro are hard countered by sentries. Heavy doesn't do that well Vs sentries, Medic is forced to go stock Uber just to counter that darn thing, Huntsman suffers fighting minis just as much as scout and Spy usually get clapped by any Engy with half a brain so he's not Engy counter

[@L_37]

5:45 "The vaccinator is incredibly braindead" :(

[@lolchipperson11person12]

I do feel inclined to ask, if demo-knight was counted, would he stay over regular demo? Mainly because of the whole melee only play style which is unique.

[@TheCrappyCompletionist]

I agreed with your opinions on scout, soldier, medic and sniper. I was on the fence about pyro personally, and engineer is also a bit of a tough case. I don't really agree with your stance on spy, demo and heavy however.

[@Plackowicz]

I did it with a completely different method, and came up with same results.

[@Jessie_Warren11618]

I will not STAND for the demoknight slander!

[@danielsurvivor1372]

You get a MASSIVE W for removing Engineer as Second class. I'm so sick and tired that it's just me(I don't main Scout, play tons of classes) and Scout mains who seem to hate him. Sure he isn't op, in comp setting with class limits and unlock bans, but man is he annoying class to fight, his sentry is antithetical to what makes TF2 combat great, aiming and dodging. A thing that sentry does 100% successfully and 0% successfully respectively. It's just so booooring to fight a sentry even as explosive class. If we remove Sniper cause he can hard counter almost all classes if skilled enough, removing engineer for hard countering two main classes plus tons of subclasses seems fair. Removing Pyro is only fair cuz he doesn't have much to provide to TF2 besides fun Pyro vs Soldier fights (yes they're fun for both sides, FIGHT ME!) aka since he has little to provide, removing Pyro won't affect TF2 too much. As For Demo, that's a nuclear hot take from ya mate! Imho I can see the argument but he just has so much good going for him besides sticky spam that it's hard to remove him 😢. At the very least if he was ever removed, Soldier should get his weapons, as an omage to Demo, you can even make a cute lil comic about that time Soldier and Demo from opposite teams became friends, and after Demo gets removed we get a comic where Demo leaves his toys for Soldier and goes "Bye friend, hope my toys will help ya!" Thought while I lole Heavy, I can almost see an argument for removing him over Demo. Also Spy mains will hate me but I can see an argument for removing him as well, it's just Spy is too weak, removing him would be safe pick to keep most TF2 feel alive. Now I personally wouldn't pick him as 4th class to remove due to how unique he is but still

[@ANewKindOfGamer]

I think most lines of logic for lists like this would start with Soldier always stays and Sniper always goes, mostly for reasons you've already stated, Sniper has proven exploitable and Soldier with his rocket jumping mechanical depth would be too much to lose. Although after that, to me a lot of choosing who would be cut to split the roster in half comes down to overlapping in roles, like with Heavy and engineer for all in point defence, or sniper and spy for key target picks. using that would let you cut down numbers to keep the remaining roster balanced against one another, the main big question remaining is whether you want to cut medic or not. with medic being quite team centralising, its more about how you'd want the remaining game to be played so it seems like the most personal choice. all that said; -Keep- Soldier, Scout, Heavy, Pyro, Spy -Kill- Sniper, Medic, Engie, Demo. for higher speed game dropping the defensive options with the least weaknesses (overheal, sentry, stickies) -Keep- Soldier, Medic, Scout, Heavy, Demo -Kill- Sniper, Engie, Pyro, Spy. for positioning contesting games, that would mostly devolve towards how 6s goes -Keep- Soldier, Medic, Demo, Pyro, Spy -Kill- Sniper, Heavy, Engie, Scout. if you (hate hitscan) want to have as many unique TF2 items mechanics and playstyles to stick around as possible damn, this is pretty fun

[@mikebeckett03]

Medic Main here, I’m cutting Pyro, Engineer, Sniper and Spy Sniper especially since he took out my full uber charge before I could even deploy it

[@Gensolink]

1:35 hard agree like game evolve, players get better and with that comes problems that you didnt notice because the meta or player were not refined enough to notice it. Like ffs the west started to ban kakyoin in the jojo fighting game like 20+ years after the game came out. And even the weaker kakyoin is still plenty strong. That's kind of insane.

[@averagegamingplayer]

Has anyone with a server thought to try this in game?

[@dominikkorbely5809]

5:39 i am going to argue this point

[@Lonqudor]

no.

[@dominikkorbely5809]

@@Lonqudor medic is not fun to play against

[@HOTD108_]

​@@dominikkorbely5809How? You're not seriously suggesting that the enemy team being able to heal makes the game less fun, are you?

[@jamesThebulbmin]

​@@dominikkorbely5809become a medic yourself

[@male07447]

Lon'qudor: I am not making this list based on what I like Also Lon'qudor: SCREW DEMOKNIGHT, HE DOESN'T ADD ANYTHING TO TF2 *this is a joke, I just noticed this in the video and decided to cimment xD*

[@oldbenkenobi3280]

Sniper Spy, Pyro, Random class.

[@danielsurvivor1372]

We really would only need to remove Sniper(too strong, can hard counter all classes due to distance advantage and so much dmg) and Engineer(hard counters two classes and tons of subclasses/playstyles, not fun to fight against, even if you pick explosive classes) but if we're forced to remove half of the people... Medic, yeah Ubercharge is cool and all, but imho, overheal mechanic kinda ruins 1v1 dynamic of TF2. Still really wouldn't want to remove him but come on, the whole fun of TF2 is fast paced 1v1 action where 1-2 shots end fights so I don't think removing him would be that bad. Pyro can be removed since he's kinda undefined class and without unlocks just boring. Don't want to remove him either but again, if I had to, Pyro is sort of 3rd safe pick. And that's it, come on man it's nine classes, we can't cleanly remove all of them. As for one more? You can argue removing Demoman or Spy or Heavy but it's so hard. Demoman is a double edged sword, heh, he has boring sticky spam that is just more op than soldier, but the rest of his kit, aka grenade launcher and Demoknight is fun and balanced. Heavy is just kinda eh? I like him as my 4th or 5th most played class but his removal wouldn't be that bad gameplay vise. Then there's Spy who IS most unique but also weakest class, his removal would barely change TF2 feel besides no spychecking. So I pragmatically would only remove/heavily nerf Sniper, personally would wish if we could remove Engineer or at least remove his sentry, and I guess 3rd pick would be Pyro due to how weak he is. And then either remove Medic or Demo or Heavy or Spy, I genuinely can't decide on 4th and 5th choices, Medic 4th Ig and Demo as 5th but Soldier(and maybe other classes?) get his toys

[@AzidDrop]

I's swap heavy for pyro, otherwise its a good list.

[@youtubeuniversity3638]

4:00 As someone who WANTS slow, who thinks games go by a bit quick as is, I always get a bit surprised when somebody reminds me that I'm weird for that. As for stack fix... maybe some weapons that deal a ton of extra damage to buildings in specific? Maybe even a "heads" collectine weapon that obly collects off buildings, so that if you manage to break the one Sentry you'll automatically be made more capable of destroying the next one.

[@Kidneydiseasegaming]

Engie main here, it's no contest spy sniper heavy medic. You still have demo and soldier to counter engie, and no-one plays heavy.

[@LucyTheBox]

Before any of the choices were revealed, I came up with removing the exact same 4 classes.

[@scottthewolfgamer]

I think removing Engineer is a bad idea due to how essential his other buildings are. Games like Payload and Attack/Defend that require a strong defensive stance and pushing back the offense fall apart without dispensers. Players would either need to scramble back to spawn or fight over getting ammo boxes from the map. And without teleporters, getting back to the action takes longer and to me, that feels like that would slow the game down more than any sentry does (subjectively)

[@foryolkinjotunn9540]

I wouldnt necessarily say engie stacking on defense is a guranteed win, since a team of demos and medics can take them out, it just takes an incredible amount of team coordination especially depending on the map, which is relatively scarce in casual.

[@ShandoGuardian]

the solution to engineer stacking is uber and demo men

[@escouleshaire]

I play Heavy 1 dimensionally but that‘s only because I don‘t enjoy how slow the characters regular play style is, so when I say I‘m playing Heavy 1 dimensionally by that I mean I just love using the Eviction Notice, I rarely use the minigun + the Eviction Notice is so fun on Harvest!

[@GuestsPowering]

In all honesty, I would swap medic and engie. They are both supportive classes but engie is more versatile and more fun to play imo. Also for me, engie is way more balanced than medic as you need good strategies, skill and teamwork to maintain buildings efficiently. On the other hand you can still build up übercharge by healing anyone on the team as a Medic .

[@PlatinumAltaria]

Remove all generalists, long live the specialists.

[@GuestsPowering]

@@PlatinumAltaria yes

[@kmyc89]

Engineer--> buildings. Also: in mediaval mode, his is the least choosed class (with max 2 good weapons).

[@smargeniusnewadmin]

As a spy main i cheered at our victory, its hard enough playing him, thank you for at least letting us play him 😢

[@denispusnei4608]

rip solar light and demoknight tf2 if i would remove any classe from tf2 are: space ranger from overwatch, glove from valorant, marakov from cod, and pesi from sodas tbh i dont anything abaut overwatch and valorant i just googled it lol

[@JoshuahClerice-ys3ye]

i think that i agree with this list even if i am an engineer main the game becomes far too unbalanced if you get rid of the 5 that remain and i can also think of no reason to axe scout and soldier

[@demitrischoenwald1436]

If you remove Spy, you'd need to have Pyro be the dedicated Medic counter, which would be disastrous. Pyro has SOME medic counter aspects, like his flames reducing enemy healing and the Third Degree existing, but keeping Spy is a much more reliable means of hard countering pocket pairs because you don't have a time to kill, just a single stab.

[@floofykxtty]

very interesting video I’d have scout, medic, soldier, and pyro to be the classes staying in the game my reasoning for this is trying to keep the amount of playstyles and skill ceiling in the game as high as possible, I feel like these 5 classes can have the highest skill ceiling in the game (not counting sniper) and open up the most playstyles also when looking at the big picture I think its a nice dynamic to play with, you counter explosive classes with pyro and scout to avoid spam and they both explosive and non explosive classes have to get more skilled to overcome the counter I don’t really want heavy in here because I see tf2 at it’s most fun as a movement shooter, and as much as I love heavy he just doesn’t have that many fun movement options, I think each of the classes I’ve chosen has a high skill expression of movement though, (yes, including medic, jumping when soldiers shoot at you to rocket jump off their rocket) which makes the game more fun because of the high skill ceiling

[@male_07official]

if lonqudor pins this i will explain how the loch and load has 3 grenades

[@osobatalentu6944]

You could make a video about which class would benefit the most from removing random critical hits