Level 5 and who can do it cheaper

[@carpathia1221]

The doctor representing illinois... a lot of good and honest drywallers, tapers, finishers but few 'true doctors' of the trade like the drywall doctor.... greetings from north Illinois.

[@seephor]

I also do A-Z from hanging to finishing to painting. I've never felt the need to skim the entire wall. I've seen "level 5" look WORSE than if they didn't skim it because the finishers applied the skim unevenly and sanded with 80 grit leaving scratches all over the place. If you leave just the right amount of mud, feather your edges, finish sand with 150 or higher, use a high quality sealer/PVA primer, lightly sand the primer before 2 coats of paint, you will get a superb finish and no one would be able to distinguish if it's a level 4 or 5.

[@seephor]

I’ll also add that some say there’s a difference in texture between mud and paper. I would argue that the difference will be void once you pass a roller over the paint. All rollers leave a little texture. Even in spray applications, a good job will include backrollung

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

Yes your right ✅

[@brianteunessen85]

I've been finishing drywall for 26 years and we have always done a level 4 finish 99% of the time and have never had a problem because of it. If you do your finish properly then even the best finishers would have a hard time telling the difference after it's been painted. Also praise God that you're a Christian , we need a lot my good men like you in this world

[@johnsonjj117]

I redid all of my ceilings starting with my nursery which I took to a lvl 5 finish to the point you could shine a light across the ceiling and see NO imperfections…..after that I said screw that and did the rest at a level 4 finish and unless you purposely create harsh light along it you would never know. A good PVA primer does a lot for equalizing textures

[@brock4372]

Lmfao It's sickening that you think being a Christian automatically makes you a good person. Notice how the majority of people in Prison are Christian? How come the majority of mass shooters are Christian? If the majority of the population is Christian, shouldn't that mean crime would be next to zero? Failed logic. Typical though

[@R26T]

I appreciate the 40+yrs of experience you share with us.

[@kirkdunn1379]

agree 100%......a good primer and painter will eliminate any texture differences......level 5 is floating mud to take out framing discrepencies.....bare drywall to taping should never be an issue but will see bows and valleys from framing on a long wall or ceiling.....all drywall should be primered with 2 coats of PVA drywall primer to make all surfaces the same....this is what i do on all my jobs....you cannot see any differences between taping and raw drywall......its alot easier painting primer vs skim coating watered down mud because painters arent good enough to primer all the surfaces!.......its not a product issue with primer.... its really pretty simple, i use PVA primer on all new drywall or taped surfaces.....its a skill issue by the painter if their are issues.. i am the one who gets the phone calls from the owner long after whatever trade is long gone, lol

[@user_skjd82ji]

Man... this guy REALLY knows his stuff! Learned a lot.

[@phoenix2441]

Glad you straightened that out. A good hanger is worth their weight as is a good taper.

[@marcellemay7721]

I always suggest that a hanger should tape at least one or 2 jobs, even if he's slow at it to learn how to be a better hanger. Things like minimizing joints, and learning to look down the wall so as not to put your butt joints on a stud thats bowed in. Hangers will not understand the gravity of the situation until they've had to pay for their mistakes by trying to cover it up with compound. If a novice hanger is trained by a veteran hanger, he might show him these issues. But, unfortunately a lot of hangers are pretty much self taught and never really learned the nuances of being a good hanger. Taping a job that you hung will teach you stuff about hanging that you'll never learn if you just hang.

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

I worked for a painting contractor and he said the same thing about tapers they should paint a couple of jobs to see what it's like

[@1wallywall]

Hey Doc, 46 years in and I have to agree with all you say. Was there also when there were no levels of finish and it was textured or smooth wall. Smooth wall consisted with 2 coats on joints, a tight skim of joints with thin mud, 2 coats in angles, 3 coats nails. There was no prep coat or first coat ever. Painters used to roll instead of spray and backroll. Painters also used to scuff sand between coats to equalize the surface to get final coat. Level 5 is so overblown. I think the biggest problem is in competent training for taping and painting. And yes, those 5" boxes come in very handy in certain situations.

[@1wallywall]

If people want a level 5 then that starts with the foundation forward, not at the drywall stage.

[@TheAxecutioner]

maybe your best ever video doc !!

[@wakeupamericaandresist2413]

100 sheets 2 men 9’ stand ups in hallways with no electrical boxes all day 😂 that was when I was young and dumb , now maybe 30 sheets if my helper is any good 😂😂😂. Love your channel young man ⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️.

[@michaelkistner6286]

If I'm doing an area where lighting is going to be a problem I'll always use butt boards (glued) and then spray a heavy coat of first coat rolled out . I've done a few level 5 ceilings (where the customer wanted a textured ceiling made smooth) and I can't tell the difference. At the end of the day, though, it's the customer who matters. I've had painters pooch the dog and gone back and fixed their mess. I could have told the customer that this isn't my problem, but folks don't hire me to get them tangled up in a peeing contest between contractors. I bite the bullet and fix it. Life gets harder when we discover the cross we're called to bear actually has nails. Oh well. If he could do it, so can I.

[@TruSciencePro]

God bless you brother

[@ProbeGT2]

I do mostly new houses and quite often i do some level5 because painters here won't apply anything else than 2 coats of crappy low budget self-sealing paint. And of course, they will never EVER offer the client, the option to do it the proper way, even for extra money. The other downside to a level5 wall, is you cannot repair it. Every little coat of mud you put on it after it's done, it will be visible to sunlight. But then, i can proudly tell myself i did all i could to make the job the best it can. Also level5 requires meticulous sanding and checking because when the sun's out, it's gonna hurt!

[@gregnixon5770]

You probably could use a drywall lift to push those sagging ceiling boards up to the joists....also, I'm a finisher/painter and I'd prime those ceilings in 1 direction with a 3/4" nap roller and use a 1/2" roller in the opposite direction with the finish paint

[@secordpd]

Exact info I was looking for in regards to painting. TYVM

[@johnp4871]

Your videos are gold. Thank you so much for all your valuable input!

[@aanthonygavina]

As a finisher and a painter it would be easier to skim out the whole ceiling to make it a true level 5. But the average person looking at it will not tell if you do not skim out the whole wall. Unless the light shines in very well.

[@rickysdrywall5288]

We hang all our own drywall, and usually paint it all too. I've done a fair bit of level five, but for the most part it's not necessary. A good PVA primer, sand, Base coat of color, sand, and a final coat will get results that are almost as good as a level 5. The problem is most painters want to come in and spray everything without backrolling, and then to make it worse they don't sand between coats. Then the drywall guy gets yelled at for something that's not his fault. I fixed that problem by becoming the hanger, and the painter.

[@lestalkmorebasss]

In rental houses I’ve done some floor to ceiling butt joints after they’ve removed old wall furnaces….. the whole area ends up about 48” wide when finished and it appears decently flat and ready for paint

[@timgoble9891]

Yes there are a lot of products out there that can be applied to make the Finish look better because the paint just isn't what it used to be years ago but when it comes down to it if there's a problem it's always the finisher

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

How about it your absolutely 💯correct.

[@snapon1993]

Doctor, one of your best videos really appreciate the knowledge and insight. I’m a young remodeler and love to watch and learn from your videos. Could you do a video on first coat USG primer and all the other primers you use to have a better idea on how to make walls look like level five or tie into old work or plaster. Thank you again!

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

Thanks that is a great idea 💡

[@splanzza]

Old-school common sense! In general we lack of it nowadays in everyday life. Listen to the Drywall Doctor people … Liiiiiiiisteee n!

[@HandymanPros]

Great video Ray - a big thanks for all of these!

[@carverdahlin2728]

We have stopped skimming smooth ceilings because we have had very good success with tough hide. It's a ultra thick primer you spray with a big painter (greco mark 5) and it gets rid of the texture difference really well. We do insulation through to finish paint for 5 contractors in my area. We mainly do level 4 and level 5 finishing. On the odd job we do California knockdown. Thanks for the videos

[@Ninjump]

Hey friend, I'm about to do my first tuff-hide job (on my own place), any tips?

[@andrewcarr2431]

hi Ray, as a veteran of the industry you are allowed to tick off people. And only the "cowboys" with the tailgate warranty would complain, and nobody cares if they do. Most likely the person who hung the drywall at the church was pro bono too (and I don't mean they were a U2 music fan). So one can forgive them if it is not perfect. In some places they don't stagger the joints behind kitchens with cabinetry going over the top as well as a tile backsplash, makes it easier and quicker (done it myself in my own home). Will it crack? Any joint could crack but most likely it will be replaced or repaired in 30 years during a remodel anyway.

[@wakeupamericaandresist2413]

Them term of “ A Nailer “ carried over from the wood lathers that nailed of the wood lath all day ✌️ and the guys that tied off the lath to the black channel were considered the “ tie off men “ and were considered the top of the the lath trade. And when the Drywall came out the Lathers didn’t want anything to do with it ? So low and behold the lathers union no longer exists because the carpenters grabbed the drywall work and never looked back ✌️✌️✊✊ , just a little history from this old man 😂😂

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

My dad was a nailer but on lath not drywall. Turned top notch carpenter. 👌

[@wakeupamericaandresist2413]

@@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1 my dad was stubborn until the end 😂, he did well though 😂 the lath trade was dead as far as new work , but he was in demand in the remodeling of HUD jobs in Boston and he was the king lol, and what he taught me is priceless, as i find myself being one of guys contractors seek out for old school lath and plaster work ✌️✊ thanks for videos and the old memories ✌️✌️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

[@wakeupamericaandresist2413]

@@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1 yup the good old days when us youngsters were great full to have someone to take us under there wing and train us 🤣✌️✌️, now it’s a different story. I have so much respect for the young hard working men and women that come to America and want to learn and are great full for the chance, just like my generation. I don’t know what it will like in 20 years because the younger generation are not interested in the trades and the training is not there like it was when I was young man. I like many other companies are always looking for experienced workers , but its getting harder and harder , and even harder to find young people that want to learn the trade and make a good wage and living. Thanks Doc for letting me vent. Oh and if anyone is reading this I could use 8 to 10 carpenters like yesterday ✌️

[@tomprovan50]

great stuff yes the paint was thicker and better years ago

[@othername1000]

Perhaps consider links to products? Digging thru Amazon on phone for the 5" box now. Strangely it seems the the First Coat is on Amazon, but not at the big stores now.

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

Your right most stores don't carry it anymore. I think it's discontinued .

[@amazingpowers6056]

In comercial work level 5 makes sense in certain lighting situations. If you have a floor to ceiling window on the east side and a huge 4 story unbroken wall on the north side sometimes you can see every hair on the board for an hour a day. A tight skim after you sand hides allot of imperfections in the board and diffrince between the paper and mud that you normally wouldnt see. The only teme i leave more then a tight skim on is if its a remodel and you are really resurfacing the wall or covering light texture or ripped off vinyl or something. Sometimes guys just exagerate the humps when they put on those thick floated level 5s.

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

Try USG first coat it does wonders to a wall like that. 👍

[@angelf9800]

I am going on 2 weeks trying to get my room to a level 5, I am tired this is no joke.

[@xCoolBreezex]

Thanks for the talk

[@JB-sz3yw]

He Ray just wondering what would you do & what would you use if you had to skim coat a concrete deck ceiling.

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

Cover coat is made to coat concrete

[@othername1000]

Nothing like the drain pipe bulge.

[@William1990hill]

I've done many level 5s over the years and I never once enjoyed them. I don't even think they look that good! We just recently did a reno where the texutr was scraped and we did 2 coats over it. Looked nice at the end but the whole process just takes too long and it's so much work if ur hawk n trowling it

[@vboutique2188]

I got a quote from a guy to finish a room I wanted smooth wall but he would only offer orange peel texture. Any idea why?

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

No. I have worked with tapers who had no idea how to do smooth wall.

[@morokeiboethia6749]

Ive used oil based primer before and yes it does stack uneven when painted but it does stick better and lasts longer. If you use an oil base conditioner like Flood Penetrol that liquifies the oil based primer so it lays flatter and doesnt leave brush/roll marks can it be used on drywall if you want a smooth finish?

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

You kinda want the stipple to hide flashing.

[@danielbalboa4537]

Nice haircut Doc...great work sir

[@mattelliott2940]

Great content. Do you prefer usg first coat over tuff-hide?

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

It's what worked for me for years.

[@jpvielleux]

Hi Doc, in your opinion is it the tapers job to vacuum the walls after sanding to prep for paint? I have a contractor that insists I do it. Just to be clear I do vacuum the floors. I'm a hand taper and hand sander, no automatic tools or orbital sander.

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

I have never dusted a wall off in my life or vacuumed.

[@danielbalboa4537]

Great schooling Doc ...I go at it with the painters here where iam from ...they like to throw the hot potato around

[@jasonfuessel2961]

What primers do you recommend for level 5 finish for a novice DIY. I just scrapped my popcorn and reapplied mud to tape, seems, joints, screws. I keep seeing on google people recommend high build primer.

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

USG first coat I'll try to add a link

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

www.walmart.com/ip/New-US-Gypsum-544825030-Ready-Mixed-Primer-Gallon-Each/275786672?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=101024090&&adid=22222222228000000000&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=m&wl3=42423897272&wl4=pla-51320962143&wl5=9021519&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=231376939&wl11=online&wl12=275786672&veh=sem&gclid=CjwKCAjw0dKXBhBPEiwA2bmObVybfnmmQmwgu28mHPB12FSLGAQ6dAI9SXHrSOawQYevm0pVP05i_xoCIVIQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

[@arpadcsorba2053]

I've heard of the levels before and someone told me level 1 was just embedding the paper tape, level 2 was the next size knife and so on. As long as it looks good when it's done, do the number of coats really matter?

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

Mud today is much better than before so before the number of coats did really matter.

[@georgetsetsakos6088]

LEGEND

[@thegourmetgolfer5544]

What's your opinion on using high-build drywall primer to achieve a perfect smooth?

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

I love it. It takes a level 4 and turns it into a level 5.

[@thegourmetgolfer5544]

@@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1 Awesome, I'll be giving it a try on my home soon. Do you know if it's okay to use drywall primer on a painted wall too?

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

Yes, you want to, so it keeps the same stipple.

[@thegourmetgolfer5544]

@@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1 thank you! Yeah that's exactly my thought process. Thank you for answering both my questions! You got a new sub

[@sleepingnoises525]

We did a level 5 finish, primed, spray painted and a lot of touch ups done are showing. My are thinking to roll second layer of paint. What’s our best option?? Any help would be sooooo appreciated!! @THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1

[@Stevesbe]

I just picked up a 5 gallon bucket of mud and they me think that I haven't seen any of your videos in a while so no I had to come by and say what's up doctor . I'm subscribed but I guess my notifications were turned off

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

I slowed down on my posts my new camera is still a learning curve. How do you like the new camera and sound?

[@Stevesbe]

@@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1 is great you're moving up in the world

[@fbad3]

Hey Doc. I have sort of a random question for you. Is there any quality difference between a finished butt joint done by flat box vs by hand? Does the box give a better end result and save time? Just curious.

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

I think so my hand is not as consistent as the boxes.

[@bradandersen3153]

What a Great Video! Look me up if you're ever in the KC area and we can tag team a basement or bathroom remodel! 😁Thank You my brother in Christ!

[@nanokcasts9187]

I am one of the drywall finishers that goes to work and screws off😂

[@oddopops1327]

👍👍😊

[@mikecase9365]

I have a cheap cheat I've done for years when level 5 is required and it works everytime.

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

Pray tell?

[@1painter4hire]

" Beat it to Fit , Caulk it to Match. "

[@THEDRYWALLDOCTOR1]

One foot is 11" plus caulk

[@rickjohnson1632]

👍👍

[@rickjohnson1632]

My parents grew up in Oak Park, Forest Park , Maywood. We moved to Elmhurst where I went to school , graduated HS there. I lived in Vernon Hills , Mundelein area for 30 yrs ✌️

[@allensadicario5196]

You them they want level 5 but they don't want to pay for it

[@TobiasRaphael1]

Video way too long, you could have summed it up in three words...'skim it good!' ;D

[@vinceferraccioli4661]

That's whats you call a screw up. Lol

[@christians.3825]

First

[@rickjohnson1632]

👍👍