I Rewrote a Segment of the Steven Universe Video for Comparision

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[@Calico_Daiquri]

"non-violent solutions should not be a lesson for the hero, it should be a lesson for the villain" is a great point. It would be nice to see that expanded in a future Glass of Water.

[@Calico_Daiquri]

@1800ibchillin No one thinks their the villain, that's a decision by the author. Because of how the quote was phrased, using hero and villain. I took it to be strictly writing advice rather than having real world application. Plenty of writing advice is helpful for writing but should not be taken as life advice. I think there's a large different between the words criminal and villain, and even if you want to apply villain to real life, you could just as much make the argument the cop is the villain, in which case the lesson applies.

[@galten7361]

Something like Steven Universe has the hero do it since among other things they're used as a self-insert or at least a vehicle for the author's ideals. And also them being the one who needs to "heal" others.

[@4n0nym0u52411]

How To Train Your Dragon 2 did the nonviolent arc correctly. The lesson learned by the main character is that sometimes people cannot be reasoned with or coerced with peace and you need to pick up your sword and fight. They wont stop otherwise.

[@ColorsOfOrion]

HTTYD is exactly what SU tries to be but fails miserably: realistic pacifism The main character does everything in his power to convince his people that dragons are not merciless creatures. And he succeeded because not only he himself proved he could tame and befriend a very dangerous species of dragon, but because he knew his father, as stubborn and stoic (pun intended) as he was, he did wanted to listen to his son, but they both just didn't know how to comunicate with each other. And once he proved him with actions, which is what his father had known all his life, he believed him But when there was a villain whose motivations were against what the main character preached, and was simply impossible to convince, they resorted to violence THAT is realistic. Neither being a war monger that wants to anihilate anyone that disagrees with you, nor being a complete airhead that thinks anything can be solved by talking

[@DocHoladay1]

Exactly

[@mcdonnas377]

Thank you for mentioning httyd the masterpiece of a trilogy and making a great point.

[@DeathKitta]

Everytime I remember Aang who was a freaking monk and despite preaching against violence have fought. And he didn't consider changing Fire Lords mind. He just didn't want to murder him and even then it was not just because he is such a pacifist but because he was raised as a monk and now is the only one left from his people so his culture is extra sacred now.

[@vincekhenethf.libago8776]

​@@thedesensitizedsympathizer5307 You know how people say that in order to truly understand someone you need to put yourself at their shoes? That applies to this particular situation. Imagine someone trying to convince you about something that you completely disagree with. We all know that in fact earth is round, yet their are people that say it is flat despite the overwhelming evidence that says otherwise. You might think that flat earthers are ridiculous, but some flat earthers think YOU are ridiculous for thinking the earth is round. Everyone in society and almost everything in society is stating that the earth is round yet why are there still people that say otherwise? Why is it that you friend doesn't like you favorite candy, even thought you think its the best thing you have ever tasted? Its not that your friend is lying, it's just that he genuinely thinks its not tasty.

[@Catgirljs247]

I like the bit about if Steven actually loves Garnet. That was really a good point, I've seen him be more sympathetic to pearl (who has almost killed him or harmed his love ones on occassions) but not give an ounce of that attention to Garnet.

[@hiroribeiro2255]

Yezz, she seems to be like that black mama caricature, Garnet and Amethyst dont receive much attention nether from steven or from the writers

[@Rikmach]

Well, she never threatened him or his loved ones. His empathy is largely reserved for those people.

[@Carolina-pr2ug]

it's so shitty bc it basically says "moms aren't real people and can't be emotionally harmed"

[@kittygamer797]

@@hiroribeiro2255 Jezz the white boy and white coded female had more prominent roles then the black and latino coded woman gosh what a mystery as to why that was done

[@puppyproductions964]

@@willhiggins9563 that isn’t true

[@hydrokineticpowerhouse]

Everything Lily said about Steven reminds me of the Last Airbender episode where Toph was teaching Aang to Earthbend. He was trying to move the rock and thinking of ways to approach it and she was telling him there’s no way around it and no trick to it, you just have to move the rock. Then later he was confronted with an animal that wouldn’t back down from its attack. The message was sometimes there’s no way around your problems and some things you can’t change. It’s incredibly immature that SU liked to pretend otherwise. He needed to be confronted with people and situations he couldn’t talk his way out of and that should’ve been the diamonds if nothing else.

[@hydrokineticpowerhouse]

@@baconlettucetomato3894 No if anything that would encourage kids to become vigilantes. Also did you ever watch Avatar the Last Airbender? If you did I don't need to spoil the ending, but Aang brought balance without needing to kill Ozai. He took his power and put him in prison. The show never framed Aang as being in the wrong for needing to kill Ozai just that he didn't want to do it and gave a good alternative to a violent path because there was no changing Ozai's mind.

[@hydrokineticpowerhouse]

@@baconlettucetomato3894 Lily explains perfectly why that's very unrealistic writing so I won't bother just watch the video again.

[@Neo-qt1lc]

@Bacon lettuce tomato yes, okay.. no. if a story's point is to present a moral idea that has to do with the way the human psychology works and how we fucking interact with each other you have to at least *ASSUME* that it'd be done with the idea that we'd think of these walking talking breathing gems as _humans with superpowers_ . They talk like such, they interact with each other as such etc. Stories have core concepts- and no matter how *fucking unrealistic* it is that they present those core concepts, they're on a fundemental level, realistic and human-like in some way. *_Just because it's a cartoon doesn't make the idea's less problematic._*

[@DigitalDipper]

@@Neo-qt1lc Can you sum up what this person said because they are a coward and deleted all of their comments

[@ElSayyidCampeador]

This is actually the best comment I've read on KZbin in years

[@Rikmach]

You know what's something I've never seen addressed? Ever? The show strongly implies that the Gems have encountered multiple planets with organic life on them. It also implies that it strip-mines those planets to produce more gems and create outposts. and while it's not *explicitly* stated that they had sapient life on them, the fact that a soldier caste existed before the Gem Rebellion implies, *yes*, the Gem Empire has had to pacify planets before exterminating every living thing on them. And we know the Gems arrived on earth in Prehistory. This has been going on for *millions of years*. The Diamonds have slaughtered so many living things, including entire civilizations of thinking beings, it's likely we don't have a name for the number. And yet we're to sympathize with them.

[@watchm4ker]

Ehh, maybe not millions. The colony and rebellion was ~5-6000 years ago, so just within the earliest surviving examples of written language. Further, we have a rough idea of how many worlds the Gems have colonized, given the depictions of the Diamonds. But we can also make a reasonable guess that most, if not all, of those worlds had life - The Kindergarden system explicitly drains a planet of some nebulous 'life force' to construct a Gem. Presumably, without this supply of energy, the process wouldn't work. The other abandoned colony we do see has at least one jungle-like biome, which implies a pretty lively biosphere. It's perhaps worse that we *can* conceive of the scale of their monstrousness. Because it also implies a very dangerous question: Can Gem society actually coexist with organic life? Or has Steven just kicked the can down the road another few centuries?

[@rightwingofthenuthouse3232]

@@watchm4ker 5-6000 years for humans. Other planets, we don't know.

[@off-the-grounder568]

@@watchm4ker I think it could because Gems don’t have lifespans, so they don’t NEED to kill off literally every living thing on a planet to live there, since they don’t need to repopulate, they just WANTED to.

[@watchm4ker]

@@off-the-grounder568 I mean, that's a big, unanswered question, right there: Why did the Diamonds *want* an Empire? What was their drive? The only resources that seem to be actively consumed are in the making of more Gems... But why do they need to make so many? Humans need to eat, and need to breed if they want their ideas, their society, to live on past their lifespan. What's the Diamond's excuse?

[@lulul0l039]

​@@watchm4ker My guess is that it's themes of colonialism and fascism. Fascists need outside enemy and story of superiority to justify why everything sucks for average folk.

[@micromints1735]

To be fair, Steven is also a diamond and they seem to just all have the genetic predisposition to be heartless monsters

[@Anima2008]

Oh fu-

[@zachall1573]

If being heartless monsters is in their nature then why are the diamonds converted to good guys in like 30 minutes and a comeback?

[@twisted_jinx1603]

It’s funny. This comment was meant to be a joke, but two dumbasses got mad and started to attack anyone who they thought was making fun of their favorite thing.

[@85Lokiloki]

lol

[@elizabethcabbage9817]

@@twisted_jinx1603 Wait this was a joke? I thought it was genuine albeit lighthearted. It's kinda true, especially looking through the lens of how Steven is a manipulative bastard that shows more sympathy with fascists than his own mother (figure). /srs

[@lionblaze0384]

Even as someone who doesn't hate this show, I absolutely felt like it was a super missed opportunity when Jasper was shattered. Keeping Jasper shattered and finally making Steven deal with some damn consequences would've been nice. Also, the whole... Everything, with the diamonds, is terrible, but we all sorta knew that.

[@metaknight1410]

I agree, but I sometimes wonder if Jasper herself would have deserved death. I mean she was awful to Garnet so maybe not a redemption that ends with her as a crystal gem but she was still a victim of lapis and even the diamonds. Like Lapis literally traps her and isolates her, which is a very undeserving punishment. And the Diamonds abused everyone and brainwashed all homeworld gems. But I dunno, letting Jasper die yet both of her abusers not only get off the hook but live good and healthy lives leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I'm saying this about the show itself, not against your argument btw, like could him shattering someone like a random gem worked instead? Could Steven learn a similar lesson by killing a random passerby on accident?

[@lionblaze0384]

@@metaknight1410 Oh no, I'm not saying Jasper deserved it. I greatly understand Jaspers struggle with anger issues, being an abusive person, struggling to improve. She did awful things, but she was on the way to healing, it seemed. Which would make it all the more tragic for her to be killed before she could ever fully change.

[@metaknight1410]

@@lionblaze0384 Oh i was just saying that to get it out there, not that you thought that or anything. And it kinda sucks that out of all the abusers in SU Jasper was the one who did the most but could still have a decent redemption arc. Like her perspective on Homeworld and how and why they basically brainwash their own people could have been fleshed out with her uniquely, but I guess Earth and Steven are totally more interesting. Everyone hurt Steven, and Peridot didn't respect Garnet as a gem either so why is Jasper the one thrown under the bus?

[@phlpcockrell]

@@metaknight1410 even though Steven cares about every gem, narratively, for the shatter to matter (heh) to the audience it does have to be a gem we care about. It could have been white pearl or someone introduced in Future though. Like that little cute one that likes screams.

[@enbeast8350]

@@metaknight1410 Jasper was one of my favorite characters because of the amount of nuance she has. Yes, she's done awful things, but that's because she was brainwashed and then traumatized when essentially her god was shattered. And since she was on the frontlines, she probably saw fusions shattering her friends and allies too. So her hatred of fusions, while not justified, I can understand where it comes from. That moment Jasper says something along the lines of "everyone who fuses with me always leaves", I felt that. Obviously, by that time her views of fusion are warped, but that's because Lapis abused her the entire time she was fused. But that line is incredibly telling. She's lonely, and no one ever tries to help her. Arguably Amethyst tries but that's all off screen so I don't count it as character growth. Especially since in future, she's back to being 1 dimensional. Honestly, I would have loved to see a redemption arc with Jasper and I think Garnet should have been the one to redeem her. Garnet could have shown her what a healthy fusion looked like and that may have helped her with her self-worth issues. Jasper was done dirty in the series. They couldn't even kill her off so she would have a purpose. Her death could have taught Steven consequences, but no, Jesus boy just magics her back to life and everything is fine.

[@storymaster164]

I know it’s not that related to your message but I’m so glad that you agree that Garnet was more of a mother to Steven than anyone else and yet he does not acknowledge that. It’s almost like an adopted kid looking for his birth family and telling his adopted one your not my real mom. You were the one who taught me the greatness of found family and these other lessons on bigotry, abuse, and gaslighting. and I am so thankful that you did.

[@thomasraines1396]

It reminds of what they did with RWBY in regards to a character named Yang except in Yang’s it’s really weird: Yang is the half sister of the main character (Ruby), Ruby’s mom is a woman named Summer Rose, Yang at one point refers to Summer as “Super Mom” along with “baker of cookies and slayer of monsters”, however she later calls Summer by her first name or at one point “Ruby’s mom” as if she didn’t speak about her with admiration and love beforehand.

[@Enigma2Me]

@@thomasraines1396 Checked the most recent Volume, she still calls her "my mom". Which episode did this bit you mentioned happen?

[@TransDrummer1312]

Garnet is Steven’s Piccolo

[@bellj4r]

On Steven's empathy: remember when he tried to force his dad to reconnect with his incredibly emotionally abusive parents who rejected every single aspect of greg's personality and then ignored greg's previous attempt to connect with them after cutting them off???? and then basically said why did you leave??? I personally found this weird as fuck

[@rainbowpuppet2477]

Especially since the diamonds are "family" and Steven supposedly hasn't forgiven them, he should understand where his dad is coming from

[@lyone2983]

I also thought it was strange. More so because when Greg was going through his old room to find something important to him, Steven went off looking at the house. Looking at it in Awh of the life his Dad might have had. But he should know his dad! The house was devoid of anything you would actually associate with Greg, the one thing that wasn't, was HIDDEN IN A VENT. Steven didn't give a damn and went off on him for not having a normal life, even though he's an ALIEN. The fact that he almost killed his Dad for not wanting to have anything to do with his family is horrifying!!

[@lionlickers6058]

that episode mad me so mad cuz after steven throws a hissy fit and nearly kills them. Greg is all like "im so happy you can communicate with me :)" i just like???? wtf lmao this family is messed up

[@laura-ni8ym]

i like the part when Steven tried to kill greg in a car crash because Greg left his abusive parents and tried to give his son a really healthy life

[@watermelonmoonshinee]

it definitely makes sense that steven's empathy was failing during future. a lot of his actions were self centered. in fact, MOST of them were. leaving little homeschool... the bluebird thing... the connie proposal thing? he was basically trying everything and anything to make himself feel better/ whole again. thats why he got so mad at greg for leaving a household that, from stevens surface level perception, was awesome. steven felt ashamed that he had no "normal" childhood and had to save the world and be the chosen one, so he saw greg's upbringing and was like Thats what i want!!! when in reality he wouldve hated it. but thats just how jaded teens are. so realistically it was kinda on point

[@cathoffmann9353]

"Abusers prey on their victims empathy to make them stay longer." YEEEEEESSSSSS!!!! 👏👏👏 SAY IT LOUDER SISTER!!!

[@EyeOfLyger]

Say it louder for the people in the back. This is why I love Lily's content.

[@evanyoung6314]

My dad does this and it drives me crazy

[@lyone2983]

@@erikthomsen4768 Ok look, I am German, and I, not even from relatives who lived through that time, ever heard that anyone gives the allied forces shit for bombing us. If they didn't end that, Hitler would have killed those children in one way or another. I mean that. I never in my life heard anyone say that the allied forces were shit.

[@randompromises1038]

this is why i didn't cut my abusive mother out of my life for years after she lost me, because she kept attempting to keep a relationship with me when i already gave up a long time ago, deciding there was just no point. the day i cut her off, she kept attempting to gaslight me and use my empathy to her advantage, forgetting i'm now in my mid-teens and am no longer a little child and have grown up a lot since then and so her tactics no longer work. it made me realize how childish she was because of how frustrated she got with me rightfully calling her out on her bullshit. i used to believe in staying empathetic, and i still am and stay kind as much as i can, but i'm no longer a pushover.

[@matthewpaul1276]

@Nicholas Negosian oh yes my sibling of the female gender say it louder/s

[@caitlinfowler1098]

I think the episode “bismuth” was a real turning point in the show. I think that when Steven asked if shattering the diamonds would make the crystal gems bad people, if bismuth didn’t snap at him and instead explained why it wouldn’t, that the world isn’t black and white but full of shades of grey. It would’ve been an amazing lesson for a kids show. That sometimes, doing something that feel wrong, that you don’t want to do, (ie, standing up for yourself, leaving a bad situation, fighting for yourself and your friends) is necessary for things to change, to get better. To teach them the responsibility of making proper moral decisions which is a necessary skill to have as an adult.

[@caitlinfowler1098]

@@baconlettucetomato3894 I’m not saying he would have to kill the diamonds in this scenario. I’m saying that turning it into an honest moral discussion between him and bismuth as equals would’ve made a better lesson. For bismuth to teach him that not every problem can be solved with friendship. And from there, they can come to a compromise. Possibly making another weapon similar to roses sword that could instantly bubble a gem so they can’t reform.

[@kyrahfife1149]

I'd personally say that Steven IS as bad as them, just not in the killing aspect. In fact, he's worse because of one thing. HE NEVER CHANGES HIS MIND. He fully expects to change everyone's mind to be on his side (and the show lets him), but not once does he ever question what he's doing. Even with all evidence is dead in his face and just doesn't care. At that point, why try to convince him and I think Bismuth had every right to express her anger. Bc Steven knows how bad this is, and he has seen the pain of the diamonds first-hand in people that he should love. But he can never seperate from his own ideal. I don't think there was anything Bismuth could have said because they already framed the story for Steven to be "right"

[@akaony]

Yet another black coded character that has to be conveniently incompetent to let whitey make their point

[@abdo-dr1tu]

Yes. Everyday we’re confronted with choices, do the difficult thing or do the easy thing. The easy choice usually doesn’t change anything, the difficult one usually makes life better for you in the future.

[@martinbartel6883]

Isnt it also kind of weird how none of the gems questioned the bubbeling of Bismtuh?

[@benjulc9271]

I guess making the final arc about the ptsd of the boy who has to deal with the villains for a year instead of the ones that had to deal with them for centuries wasn't a good idea.

[@michia3765]

Another aspect of why the Steven only prospective doesn't work.

[@10thletter40]

Honestly it came out of nowhere

[@Minkerdoodle01]

Also the idea that having PTSD turns you into a violent murderous monster. Yikes!

[@a5tr4l]

@@Minkerdoodle01 I don’t think you were supposed to take that literally

[@Minkerdoodle01]

@@a5tr4l Probably not, but Steven in general started lashing out at people. While that can definitely happen when you have trauma, it doesn’t always. It’s a little mean to portray a mental illness turning someone into a jerk. It may give ppl the idea that it’s universally that way.

[@hearteyedracoon7930]

This was an extremely cathartic watch. I find myself going back on videos critical of SU a lot because I feel like they give me more closure than the actual show did, so I was very excited for this. This is the first time I've heard anyone else point out just how much of a POS Steven is or just how cruel this show actually is at its core. Seriously Steven is the worst kind of person but everyone ignores that because he's superficially nice.

[@scp--297]

I completely understand you. I really like Steven Universe but as time got on. I realized, I didn't like it. I just wanted closure after I lost so much time from it. So watching KZbinr rip it pieces, call out all the flaws, terrible lessons, how they wasted our time and validate a lot our problems with the show. It feels like they just gave me a hug, hot chocolate and said "I'm going to be the shit of them so don't worry I got this." It's just cathartic and comforting.

[@cassiopeiasfire6457]

i have a hard time myself with seeing past superficial niceness, even with people who've really hurt me specifically, and i'm grateful lily put this analysis out here, it's been helpful for me to reflect on.

[@johnsexton4352]

He is Gaston

[@akaony]

Back when I had the hots for this show I wanted to share it with my partner of the time, something he'd do, but while belittling me and my tastes all. The fucking. Time. Later on I had to realize he was exactly like Steven: a real nice guy, whose manner of abuse came from constant chastising in the sake of "respectability"- in other words, ego politics. I find his refusal to watch his avatar in a cartoon deliciously ironic.

[@davidegaruti2582]

@@3rebella honestly the story would work better without steven , like you could make it so the diamonds don't destroy earth because it's the tomb of pink diamond and that for them is more valuable than all life that exist on earth , the funerary pile of one of them is more important than billion of pepole , so the three crystal gems find a way to re organize a revolution find a cure to the curropted gems and over turn the diamonds , you'd then have a whole plot about humans and gems creating a society and you could have intresting stuff

[@peacehope8149]

Hey, as someone who just got out of an abusive situation with my own parents, thanks for this. I always have this tug of war going on in my head about whether I’d done something wrong, if I’d said or done the right thing if maybe I could have helped them become better. So I always appreciate how much you emphasize that you’re not a shitty person for not forgiving or being able to fix and change your abuser’s behavior.

[@peacehope8149]

On a less personal note- holy shit that part about Garnet was upsetting. Like, if the Diamonds are abusive parent metaphors they’re violently homophobic parents and Steven’s the straight guy who has a heart to heart with them and God Damn that’s disgusting.

[@xolco7081]

@@peacehope8149 the feeling of starting to draw lines between Steven & people you know irl is something I'll never forget...

[@scarlett4417]

@@Boreddddpikapi the issue is not 'what could they have done'. the issue is that the writer decided to make the stakes so fucking high. the characters arent real people, theyre just pawns for the writers to use. they cant make one choice or another. why on earth are we pushed to sympathise with these nazi assholes in this show? why is that the case? bc the writers just want a redemption arc, and for some reason made the stakes really high for literally no reason. also id say steven universe is a pretty irredeamably show. sugar has backed herself into a corner of 'we have to talk to these nazis and turn them to the light side' but that shouldnt be how it works. there is a reason hitler killed himself: bc he knew hed have the exact same fate if hed been captured. we did not sympathise with him bc he was a genocidal maniac who cared more abt his racist ideologies than living breathing people. this is the same with steven universe, but the genocidal maniacs are sobbing grieving diamonds, not what they shouldve been: angry driven assholes who didnt care about anyone else and COULD have been defeated

[@CameoAfro]

One thing I found interesting that you didn't touch on in the original vid is that Steven was far more willing to tell of Connie for not being accepting of his gem family than he was for Andy or any of the Diamonds.

[@CameoAfro]

@@baconlettucetomato3894 Except he didn't "change". His outrage is always selective, in-universe because he's a myopic narcissist, but in reality because no one working on that show can write.

[@CameoAfro]

I was going to make a joke, but the stupidity of this response really does speak for itself.

[@zigzoinks5493]

@@baconlettucetomato3894 Are you serious!

[@carasclownerycorner6455]

I believe Amethyst was subjected to abuse as a direct cause of the diamonds actions, too, just in a more indirect way. I always read her being "overcooked" as being disabled, which the show affirms with Jasper's whole ableist "Gems are made for one purpose, and those who don't fit in and can't fulfill that specific purpose need to be purged" speech. In Gem society, she would have been viewed as a second class citizen and seen as a disgrace for not being exactly like the diamonds want her to be. She already had deep self-esteem and self-hatred issues, so much so that she has a complete emotional breakdown when Pearl visits her kindergarten and sees the origin of her perceived failure. And that was while she was living with the Crystal Gems. Imagine how much worse she would have been off if she had been found by homeworld soldiers instead the CG. Fuck, Jasper even says "time to get rid of this embarrassment", which clearly translates to her wanting to kill Amethyst for not being perfect. Jasper berates her for being different, mocks her efforts, makes her feel inadequate as a person, and wants to fucking murder her over her flaws. And why does she put Amethyst through that bullshit? Who is responsible for that ideology being spread? Again, it's because of the diamonds. Everything Jasper says and does to Amethyst is a direct reflection of the beliefs the diamonds spread among their people.

[@sirembrum49thegreatmoth2]

That is really fucked up thinking about that. Poor amethyst...

[@shumpysheep4751]

Honestly the moment this show brought lars back to life not even a minute after his death i knew they were going to do the same with shattering and idk how no one else saw it coming lol

[@hayamihinata4135]

So true

[@kittygamer797]

It was because so many people wanted to believe that Rubeca Artificial Sweetner was smart and wasn't going to retcon a significant part of the story she claims to have planned out all along

[@nicolovespanda]

@@kittygamer797 rubeca arificial sweetener💀

[@kittygamer797]

@@nicolovespanda What it's more accurate then suger after all you don't know what when in to it, you don't know why it exists, and it leaves a bad taste in your mouth.

[@galten7361]

Pretty much the big problem with Lars is that he reflects how the show made it too easy for Steven to jump across space into Homeworld/its empire and back to Earth since the showrunners never did figure out how make the sitcom/slice-of-life side flow well into the space opera/battle anime/magical girl/whatever side. Him dying then coming right back and becoming a Captain Harlock wannabe also reflects this, making one suspect Sugar was just too attached to him so shs just threw in whatever for him to get him taking part in space opera/battle manga/action show side.

[@darceyanderson2303]

As someone with ptsd SU future was the most disgusting form of “representation” I’ve ever seen. If anyone I speck to ever thinks it’s a realistic portrayal then I know that that person isn’t a safe or trustworthy person to be around like holy fuck it was bad

[@XMarx-it1yj]

Can you suggest a good movie or media (short series, nothing too long) that depicts PTSD in a respectful manner? I'd genuinely like to see it because I also think SU got some things wrong ... i feel it's important to see something that realistically depicts mental issued

[@kobaltblue6119]

@@XMarx-it1yj go watch kung fu panda 2 that shit slaps

[@xolco7081]

...or just watch Kung Fu Panda in general, they're really good movies overall & a reccomend on my part...

[@delusion5867]

@@xolco7081 kung fu panda does the whole "finding strength in who you are and embracing it" thing 1000x better than steven universe ever did

[@Jataro_kemuri16426]

It really was like why did Stephen need to turn into a monster? Are you saying that people with mental illness become monsters?

[@laura-ni8ym]

it's funny how i only thought this show was briliant when i was in denial of being emotionally abused lol

[@WorriedtheCircusDemon]

I think you and I can relate 😔 I think I desperately need to forgive myself for how ignorant I was back then.... watching everything through a rose colored lens

[@mekaelbayati8040]

This is the mood for me right now exactly

[@akaony]

That struck right home. I'm better, hope you are too

[@teanecup5439]

most of the structures and morals in this show are now heavily mirrored from my past abusers beliefs. i only realised this now as i watched lilys video seminars. the show was reassuring me that what i'm watching is normal and okay. that what i was living with at the time was okay. it soothed my confusion on why i kept hurting and being blind to why. it's unbelievable how blind we can get.

[@AkaOtoko1]

Same

[@elleyshark6180]

Thank you for that last bit. As someone who's mother is low key racist and high key homophobic I've been trying my best to get her to accept me as a bi woman dating a black man. She doesn't seem to like either of us beyond the fact that we can give her grandchildren and even then she hopes they look like me, not him. I needed to hear that it's not my fault that she continues to think like this. Thank you Lily

[@thatpunygirl___149yes8]

You and your husband are amazing people and deserve happiness as well as each other!

[@elleyshark6180]

@@thatpunygirl___149yes8 Aww thank you! That means a lot. ❤

[@kyrahfife1149]

Please get away from her for the sake of yourselves and any children you may have. She could very much be a danger to them physically, mentally and emotionally.

[@akaony]

Bless you guys 💕

[@SilverVolo]

Why do you still speak with her

[@tappyokamaniok210]

I think the one thing I hate the most about the protagonist is that he always force everyone to agree with him, and doesn't even give them any space or a chance to think on their own: he literally chases them until they agree to do or act or think the way he wants. I find that disgusting for a "hero/protagonist".

[@thembzz]

@@lovelyheart3745 no, it’s a genuine criticism. steven always gets his way, & a good hero doesn’t always get his way. he faces challenges & sometimes cant change people’s minds.

[@princesspumpkin9900]

PREACH I WAS JUST THINKING THIS WHEN I WAS WATCHING THIS VID. They're always seen as a "bad guy" when they don't agree with his values n beliefs!!

[@rotidedug8883]

he was a kid 💀

[@Cuchufreta]

My now ex used to do that to me, in one session before breaking up with her my psycologist told me that constantly harassing someone to agree with you is emotional abuse.

[@B3an01]

@@rotidedug8883 true but not the whole world revolves around him and if we say he is a kid for everything he could say that one german man doing the salute from WW2 is good and nobody should argue that he is bad because steven is a kid and when someone disagrees he forces them to agree with him

[@majoraswrath6182]

Something that always really exhausts me is many "moderates" views on nonviolence. Specifically the idea that nonviolence is about being peaceful, and quiet, and polite because it's nice and respectful. BUT BEING NICE AND RESPECTFUL COMPLETELY MISSES THE POINT OF PROTEST. PROTEST IS ABOUT SHOWING BLATANT ANGER AND FRUSTRATION WITH AN ONGOING SYSTEM. The point of nonviolent protest isn't "see, we're here to hold hands and show we're nice people!". It is the threat of "if you don't do something, THIS IS HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE WILLING TO FUCK SHIT UP."

[@10thletter40]

The point of a protest is exactly in the name. You are against what is happening. A peaceful protest is loud, it is noisy. However, I disagree. Moderates usually implement this better, or at least, those to the right of the moderates you percieve as moderate and those a bit left of moderate The farther left you go, the more violent the protests are. And yeah, the same can be true for the right.

[@genieglasslamp5028]

@@10thletter40 Is it though? One thing I've been researching and learning about protests is that actual protesters hardly ever start getting violent on their own. The government are very good at being disruptive at protests, combining this with their power in the media they basically can start violence at a protest and just claim the protesters were the ones who did. And if they dont do that they can just claim those protesters were being violent and use violence against them. We've seen both tactics used during the civil rights movement and now. Every time the cops sprayed protesters with hoses and set dogs on them they claimed the protesters were being violent. Hell the media even accused king of inciting riots all the time. The narrative that the civil rights movement was completely peaceful is only repeated now that the goals of king and others like them are seen as good.

[@10thletter40]

@@genieglasslamp5028 No, the protestors are on video getting violent on their own. When it turns night, and a peaceful protest hasnt broken up, that is when lawbreakers take that and cause damage.

[@genieglasslamp5028]

@@10thletter40 So which is it? Lawbreakers taking advantage or peacful protesters?

[@10thletter40]

@@genieglasslamp5028 They arent mutually exclusive at times. _Usually_ the peaceful protests are out at day. Although not all the time, and there are some troublemakers. But at night it almost always turns violent or gets rowdy.

[@saladcaesar7716]

Plus, didn’t MLK said something like « violence is the voice of the unheard »

[@10thletter40]

But, he doesnt excuse riots. He said he couldnt condemn them without condemning the terrible conditions for black people. Nowadays rioting and destroyed and looting isnt a way to be heard, back then it was hard to be heard otherwise. All we do is destroy the very communities we work to build. Violence isnt the answer if this was only to be heard, be listened to. In SU however, it isnt about being unheard, it isnt even about being dismissed or disrespectful. The opposition is outright dangerous, so you cant just take it lightly.

[@saladcaesar7716]

​@@10thletter40 I have to disagree with modern rioting. This is my personal take thought. Nowdays, to be heard by commoners, you start youtube channel but that doesn't guarantee anyone doing anything.Your viewers will just sit, watch and cry. Boycotts, and petitions can work with small racist buisnesses but nothing significant will change the justice system. The establishment won't do anything even if you were a popular youtuber activist. Of course there are donations but with the costs of living vs the average joe' salaries, you won't recieve enough . It will take material damage to actually be heard unfortunately. In SU, I think it's both. It just depends on the hierarchy. They will dismiss gems like Peridot but they will destroy some gems like rutile and garnet to not hear them.

[@ladyblubel]

@@10thletter40 What do you mean? The modern rioting and looting started with a Target that had allied themselves with local police. There was a vvv clear statement in that. Plus, big business that are all over the country are in no way “a part of the community.” If anything, they act as a sign of capitalism and do more harm than good

[@proton8689]

@@10thletter40 This is unironically the same centrist bullshit the entire video was addressing. Let’s get to the meat of it. Rioting is a sociological inevitability, disgruntled people at the bottom of the hierarchy will riot if an incident angers them enough. This is universal and it is not different now, just because you’re alive to see it happening. The best and only civil way to deal with rioting is to fix what social issue causes it in the first place. You cannot just demand the people who are victims of violence to suddenly be peaceful because it makes you uncomfortable. That’s just sociologically impossible, it’s not how people work. Case in point, if we didn’t have a police officer suffocate a black man to death in front of a scared crowd, no one would riot in anger. “Yeah, don’t kill black people unjustly and we wouldn’t have to burn down your stuff,” is really the only agreement that would get through the establishment’s heads. That arrangement pissed off racists. But it’s nevertheless the only agreement that works.

[@elizabethcabbage9817]

@@proton8689 Wellllllllll I agree with you mostly excepting that rioting has worked. Not to say that it's unjustified; I do believe rioting is wholly justifiable to address systemic racism and police brutality (kinda repetitive tbh but whatever). All I mean is that since the riot of last year it hasn't actually stopped or even really affected police brutality whatsoever, which just means that something more severe than rioting is destined to come to attack this issue. Though, it may just be another riot, as we've seen throughout history.

[@ColorHeartCarlie42]

I just wish the Earth of Steven Universe actually felt like Earth. With Governments and untrustworthy humans.

[@johnnygallagher5718]

Legitimate human villains?

[@mrboerger1620]

I know right that was one of my big problems with it. Nobody challenges gems nobody reacts to them. Tons of humans realistically should have found gem tech and reverse engineered it so that humans could have those super weapons in case a gem attacks.

[@sonicfan2403]

@@mrboerger1620 That's something I never knew, how did no government found out about the Kindergarten?

[@sonicfan2403]

@@baconlettucetomato3894 That's not an excuse for not trying to give more depth of potential world building and conflict!

[@mrboerger1620]

@@baconlettucetomato3894 he's right ya know it's kinda lazy. They should've explained things more about this world. At least have the government get involved once.

[@mikeywise3411]

you know how in anime when theres a crazy villain theyre given an insane smile smirk? sugar gave them to the heroes, especially rose. that’s fascinating. she seems to fetishized insane people

[@matthewoherren4872]

Judging by the fact that SU wasn't an anime my guess is those are just smiles

[@DaDualityofMan]

Honestly, Steven is basically Naruto.

[@user-ev9yz1yb7l]

When in the video?

[@mikeywise3411]

@@user-ev9yz1yb7l its not in the video but it’s definitely in the show, specifically rose does it a lot

[@jann5414]

I don’t think that’s really fetishizing….

[@jayelatolbert5822]

That reminds me on how Steven got upset with Greg in Future because Greg ran away without thinking of how Greg family treated Greg, he was upset of the life he could've had which was unlikely he would have that life considering his mother is pink diamond. Also when he proposed to Connie and got upset when she said not now. Even when he got upset that his other human friends had lives outside of him, Steven is self absorbed and needed real consequences that the show never gave him.

[@akaony]

And the final arc was "poor baby, look at how he suffered for our sins" disguised as virtue signaling on PTSD

[@coral497]

It's normal to get upset after being rejected, but he respected her choice. I don't see how he's self-absorbed? He's always trying to help others. And he is reasonably upset over not having a normal life (though I don't think he should've blamed it on Greg)

[@kadenoneill7227]

Steven is exactly the sort of person who says "but they're your family" to someone who has been mistreated by family and doesn't want anything to do with them.

[@skittyhugs7457]

​@Coral except he didn't respect Connie's choice? He submerged in self pity, to the point he had to go to a doctor for the first time

[@EvilParagon4]

About Future, I never really took it as PTSD, but misdiagnosed PTSD. It actually feels like the far rarer, but in terms of protagonists of media, common case of Hero Syndrome. Hero Syndrome can affect anyone, but disproportionately affects police, doctors, soldiers, and especially, firefighters, who have been known to start fires just to put them out and receive praise. Futurama actually had this as a plot for the first half of the episode "The Inhuman Torch", where the Planet Express Crew thought Bender was lighting fires just to put them out (in the second half it was found this isn't true, but this is known psychological behaviour). Steven is used to the world revolving around him but it sort of doesn't anymore. While no academic research has taken place on Hero Syndrome, it is theorised to be part of a broader group of withdrawal anxieties, a group of anxieties which contains separation anxiety, homesickness, gambling/gaming addiction withdrawal, etc. Steven is not going through PTSD, but he definitely is not comfortable with the new changes in his life. His symptoms far better match those of Hero Syndrome, and other withdrawal anxieties.

[@TechBlade9000]

Wanna bet it was suppose to be PTSD but they goofed up

[@EvilParagon4]

@@TechBlade9000 Of course, but the fact is we could read what Steven has as "bad take on PTSD", or we could read it as the very real "accidental take on Hero Syndrome". One makes the show worse, one makes the show better.

[@thesadisticskitty7665]

In the words of one screeching, Sonic-obsessed child, "When will you learn? When will you learn that your actions have consequences?"

[@TheDoomBlueShell]

SU is a great example of "Does putting fantastical stuff on your story really makes your narrative better?" because serious if it wasn't the alien stuff we would get Ruby and Sapphire being Garnet mothers and be Steven grannies and that would fix a lot of the show just by them existing as different characters, and like Sugar wouldn't have allegories to hide behind forcing them not to touch heavy stuff, like you said the show when is trying to pass simple messages works so a show that is just a collection of simple messages and down to Earth would work much better for the narrative, but then again I can see SU gang screwing things up for being too incompetent too.

[@lordcawdorofmordor2549]

Really loved how you pointed out Steven's creepy insistence on calling the Diamonds "family" when the Diamonds actively tried to kill the actual family that loved and raised him. It always rubbed me the wrong way. But also what did Abby Thorn do exactly

[@arlink0664]

Here’s a nice comparison for ya: STEVEN UNIVERSE Bismuth: Steven the diamonds literally oppresed, murdered, enslaved and discriminated us for millions of years Steven: No, we have to talk it out. AVATAR: THE LAST AIRBENDER Zuko: I know what you’re gonna say, she’s my sister and I should be trying to get along with her Iroh: No, she’s crazy and she needs to go down.

[@yetravellingsonc8372]

Or another one of the same premise. Steven Universe Bismuth: The Diamonds are literally space Nazis who have made life a living hell for everyone in the Universe, we need to ki--. Steven: No we need to convince them to change, Killing is bad. Tales of Vesperia Flynn: You killed a well renowned Noble! That is a major crime punishable by death! We need Order in the kingdom t-- Yuri: So? If I were to let him live, we'd still have a psychopath on our hands manipulating the law again so he can feed people to monsters for fun. If it means avoiding that, I'll gladly take the mantle of Criminal.

[@waifu_png_pl6854]

funny thing is, azula is a victim of abuse and a literal child. you could even make the argument that not even ozai or azulon were as bad as the diamonds, they were raised in an environment of war by people who were the agressors in that war. if theres any fair comparison to the diamonds, it would be sozin. he tried to "expand" the fire nations glory across the world, similar to how the diamonds wanted to expand the gem empire to the galaxy. roku tried to talk to him and look how it turned out, 100 years of war, broken families, thousands of casualties across the nations, genocide of an entire nation and so much more. but somehow the diamonds were able to make a turnaround for themselves in a matter of days, minutes for while diamond. these are beings that existed for eons. i wish stevens gem was just a rose quartz, then he would be forced to accept the diamonds as the awful monsters they truly are. i wish this show had the decency to show that redemption is possible and very much a choice for minor evils and people who were misguided like peridot, but monsters like the diamonds deserve to be at the very least bubbled and kept away from all the gems they hurt

[@suncricket]

(I stopped at 9:34 to type this, so I will update it if it's discussed.) Listen listen: one thing I never see talked about is how White Diamond admonishes Steven for "acting like a child". Gems... don't have children. It completely threw me off, just like when Steven talked the other Diamonds out of attacking the Crystal Gems. This especially bugs me considering Steven was actually completely willing to fight in the earlier seasons. Like you said, writers almost never have everything ironed out from beginning to end, and the entire show kinda reeks of continuous editing.

[@skeletors]

The movie absolutely RUINED the idea that the diamonds were changed individuals. I never watched it because I would much rather have all my toes ripped off and my corpse dumped into boiling tar than sit through that hot mess, but I do remember hearing one line that went against the idea that the diamonds have changed. WD: I’ve been saying “please” and “thank you,” even to lower life forms! Steven: What did we talk about? WD: Uhg, *equal* life forms. That snippet from Let Us Adore You proves that their sudden change was only so they could keep Pink in their life and 1. They don’t see Steven and Pink Diamond as different people and reminds me way too much of *those* people who’s friends or family come out as trans dunno bout you. 2. They’re still trying to keep Steven or “Pink” away from their loving and supportive family. Reeks of abusers, even in the “honeymoon” phase of abuse, trying to make the victim dependent solely on them for everything. TL;DR: the movie makes things worse for sugar once again by showing that the diamonds are still the most reprehensible people ever and haven’t changed from sugar’s convoluted idea that the diamonds are an abusive family.

[@Trixster009]

I believe another moment of Steven's empathy being good was when Steven saved the Cluster. Because the Cluster was simply several victims of Homeworld and while Steven did not have the power to fix them, he could find a way for them to achieve peace and take away their constant agony. He reached out to something that everyone viewed as bad and horrifying. I think that moment was another example of Steven's empathy being very beautiful.

[@kjarakravik4837]

The thing with trying to talk abusers down or to change their minds is that I feel like a lot of victims will have already wasted a lot of time trying to do it themselves? Speaking from personal experience, "abusers preying on their victims empathy to make them stay longer" is one of the things that makes it so hard to get out of these relationships. You end up feeling personaly responsible for trying to change your relationship with this person, and it never seems to work. The one time I brought up therapy to my mother I got shouted at and slapped, and I had to spend years trying to come to terms with that fact that I couldn't change her if she didn't want to, if she didn't think that she needed to change.

[@insanityeverafter5298]

The concept of the diamonds together being the only ones able to heal a shattered gem would of been really interesting. Like, them hurting so many people and deserving punishment, but those who they hurt needing them to be around as the only chance to see their dead friends again. If the abusive parent allegory was still kept if could of related to having sibling who still relied on that parent and who you'd have to bear seeing to get to. Or even the parent working through doing better with them and being glad for the sibling to have that, but having to deal with the fact that you didn't. But then again, that couldnt be taken from Steven's view.

[@Cevalip]

Ya know.. I always wondered why I related to Steven so much, but after going through some therapy and, specifically in relation to the SU show, I came to the conclusion, that Steven/the whole cast are treated like narcissists and flying monkeys (people who let the narcissist do everything).. I related because, being handled by a narcissist since childhood, easily turns you into one, and thats what I see steven doing. He doesn't even have his own agenda, it just turns into his bc it was his mother. The "my child must be exactly like me to be great, like me" thing is also a thing that happens a lot in narcissist households.. I really wonder if Rebecca was raised by one🤔

[@Oscar_Lasco]

I did a quick google research on flying monkeys. I didn't know Wizard of Oz was used as a reference in psychology. Cool, I guess.

[@sebastianchavez1225]

@@3rebella Dam that "bacon lettuce" tomato is quoted and has erased his comments everywhere

[@jplveiga]

@Pabliski Malinowski wow, just because Greg is not that responsible, he still is masculine, you really wanna define masculinity as being "strong" or "daddy-like"???

[@jplveiga]

That's a great question, and it makes total sense since: white diamond is the original narcissist and then it passed her ways onto her "daughter" pink, then onto Steven.

[@TechBlade9000]

​@@jplveiga Steven Universe redux, narcissist gets vibe checked and grow as a person and maybe some war

[@metaknight1410]

Oh yes everything I had to say about the diamonds. Specifically the bit about people hanging with their friend's or loved one's abusers. I've had plenty of friends who will remain friends or on good terms with my bullies and abusers. Hearing that i'm not wrong and that remaining intact with a loved one's abusers is a massive betrayal was very cathartic. For so long everyone told me that I wasn't mature and that people just "change" and I shouldn't be so "rude" and hold them accountable for their past behavior. Thanks Lily!

[@metaknight1410]

@@baconlettucetomato3894 Yes lol I asked you something but honestly I don't really think you want to hear my perspective. Basically what I said was I never believed or thought that Steven forgave to Diamonds. I don't think a lot of people actually do. I never said I did. I also asked you to elaborate on why you think it's okay to hang around or forgive or whatever people who seriously hurt the people you love. I mean unless I misread what you said you basically said; The people who say that I'm wrong to distance myself from people who still hang around with my abusers are actually right and I'm wrong. (I specifically mentioned abusers not people who only slightly wronged me.) ((Editing before you respond: That's what you meant by "and their right." I assumed.) I also asked you to elaborate on why I shouldn't compare my own experiences to animation or media. I don't get it, isn't the point of SU (besides entertainment) to deliver a moral message? Like deeper themes in SU have to be there for a reason, and I think the point of that is for kids and anyone who watches it to understand them and apply or disregard them?

[@metaknight1410]

Haha well if you ever feel like elaborating you can come back.

[@genieglasslamp5028]

The part of this show that I absolutely hate is when Steven bubbles Bismuth. As a black woman seeing a cis het white boy literally silence a black women until he allows to her to speak again made me unbelievably angry. But knowing a white woman wrote those scenes like that makes the entire thing believable.

[@saladcaesar7716]

Same. It sucks

[@YaburuRunyaru]

I wish I could apologize on behalf of Sugar, but she doesn’t deserve people making excuses for her in the slightest. I am so incredibly sorry all the same that you and all it affects had to see her do something so disgusting 🙏

[@genieglasslamp5028]

@@YaburuRunyaru The thing no one should have to apologize for her because shes old enough to grapes that there are problematic elements to her show and fix them.

[@mollyganasa621]

The worst part was Bismuth was right. The only way to truly liberate everyone to kill the diamonds. How could he silence Bismuth after seeing those gem experiments?

[@penguinstarlette4028]

@@mollyganasa621 and none of her friends even *considered* letting her speak her piece before the wedding, and if it weren't for Steven, she wouldn't have been unbubbled for that, either.

[@mikojones2892]

Thanks for making this. It's important people realise why this show is downright mentally damaging to victims of trauma. On another note about Future (aside from the whole 'giant monster' crap) there was a point when I was genuinely wanting to see how Steven would be helped. Because Steven was depressed and suffering and every character seemed to be reaching out to try and help him (especially Greg) but it wasn't working. They even tried to comfort and hug and listen to him but nothing was working. So I thought "Wow this is new, he's actually going to have to get real professional help for his problems this time. Friendship and hugging isn't working. This is actually a bit of an improvement." But nope, he turned into a monster and then everybody hugged him at once and then he was automatically okay. So the conclusion was that hugs can cure your mental illnesses as long as they are all done at once by lots of people. One at time they don't work. Stupid and lazy.

[@akaony]

As a mental health professional the ending aggravated me to no end

[@skydroid3141]

So what I am hearing is Steven Universe is just Evangelion but the writers thought Shinji is a good role model for children.

[@Takejiro24]

Funnily enough SU Future's ending theme is a parody/interpretation(?) of Fly Me To The Moon.

[@watchm4ker]

No, but they probably thought NERV's treatment of Shinji was how parenting works.

[@Ulyssa12]

Fuuuuuuuuu-

[@Midnight-Starfish]

I'm not gonna lie, I really think it would be cool if you did another long video like you Steven Universe and Korra video, but on something you like and why you like it. Knights of the Old Republic springs to mind. Obviously you don't have to, but hey, something to put in the idea bucket for fun.

[@ebonyblack4563]

I would enjoy a video on content she likes too, and I know it would be real on what flaws that liked thing still has.

[@octavianjoseph8633]

I will never understand why some people want to hear the positive thoughts on what another thinks after multiple arguments on why they dislike the topic so much. I've even heard others complain that they talk to much about the negatives and should move on to the good side of things. As if they don't want to hear genuine criticism or criticism for the sake of comedy and just want people to praise things non-stop. I can't explain why I roll my eyes at this complaint, (I might even sound like a jerk at this point), but I would love to hear from others.

[@Midnight-Starfish]

@@octavianjoseph8633 It's not a complaint, it's a suggestion for a video idea. For example, going off the format that H.BomberGuy used that Lily emulated, his most popular video is explaining why Fallout 3, a massively popular and widely loved game, is actually really bad. But then later uploaded a somewhat follow up to that video years later about New Vegas and what it did right. Just because I would like to see a video on what Lily likes is not because I'm afraid of people being mad, but rather understand her critiques more with a video in the same format but explaining what she likes about it and what it did right.

[@GingerbreadGerard]

Thank you lily, i have been abused multiple times at a young age. Whenever i see someone defending the diamonds it seriously fucks me up.

[@fireboltinc5712]

We had a generation of writers fell in love with Zuko and his redemption arc. He was Pink Diamond/ Kylo Ren/(Insert pity me villain here) done correctly. He never sought out to hurt people, not even Aang. He just wanted to return home and belong after years of denial. As such, Zuko's methods became increasingly ruthless and dishonorable. No one had to spell out his issues (Iroh giving him advice is not him laying out all the answers for him) because he realized the moral dilemma he found himself in. By the end of his arc, Zuko ushered in an era of peace for the Fire Nation and a lifelong friend of the Avatar. Such a shame to see people misunderstand redeeming a villain.

[@monarch_apostate]

My personal pet peeve is that the entire cast shits on Pink Diamond but White Diamond who's objectively worse is treated as a soft boi with "feewings uwu" Also Steven getting mad at his dad for having a fun and not abusive childhood in Future also pissed me off

[@kadenoneill7227]

Steven is that one kid with hippie parents who somehow became a conservative and constantly drags the parents for not being responsible or whatever.

[@tulipplant9317]

I really appreciete you saying that people gaslight others into thinking they are bad for speaking out and defending themselves as a way to tell them to shut up

[@thomasraines1396]

This sounds like it should be on the CW: they’re all apart reinforcing toxic relationships and having characters either forgive their abusers or simply forgetting about what they’re done.

[@therotryzit]

Can you elaborate on this?

[@thomasraines1396]

@@therotryzit some examples I can think of are Elena Gilbert wanting anything to do with Damon Salvatore after he confessed to murdering her friend (a man named Aaron Whitemore) simply because his feelings were hurt because “that’s how much control you have over me”and while Elena does chastise him claiming he “screwed up” the argument just devolves into a sappy declaration of love which ends with them sleeping together. On the family side of things: Klaus Mikaelson from the Vampire Diaries/The Originals is a whiny, controlling, delusional obsessive man child who lords over his siblings and threatens to magically put them to sleep for anything ranging wanting to live their own lives away from him to “stealing from me”, all of his siblings would be well within in their rights to tell him to get fucked (and to be fair they do) but by the very end of the show one of his siblings (a man named Kol) is completely apathetic to fact Klaus is going to die (being bitter about Klaus being a controlling manipulative asshole) and his sister (Rebekah) chastises her brother despite the fact that she has suffered the most abuse at his hands (being put to sleep magically or having several suitors murdered by Klaus in the guise of “protecting” her, this happened “again, and again, and again” until Rebekah claimed to have “stopped falling in love”). Back to romantic relationships: in regards to “The Flash” the main character (Barry Allen) unapologetically stalks his love interest later in the series (due to time travel shenanigans they never grew up around each other and this never had a strong friendship, so Iris is essentially a stranger minus Barry’s own past perceptions of her), and earlier on in the series he just comes off as a creepy weirdo who won’t take no for an answer, he doesn’t do anything “too bad” he just tries to get with her despite her insistence she isn’t interested in him in that way. Iris is bad as well: she intentionally sabotages a relationship that Barry enters with another woman (Linda Park) by claiming Barry “never got over someone” (I’m paraphrasing as I don’t remember the exact quote). Back to the Vampire Diaries: Caroline Forbes wanting anything to do with (and eventually sleeping with) the likes of Klaus despite the fact she unapologetically tore into him for being a monster who hurt several of her friends, used her boyfriend (Tyler) as a slave (Klaus being a hybrid of vampire and werewolf later gains the ability to create more hybrids and they’re magically enslaved to him due to the debt they owe him for freeing them of having to transform into werewolves) and just in general being a complete dick, this all happens while she unapologetically despises the likes of Damon and who she only seems to begrudgingly accept is around but is a lesser evil then Klaus simply based off the fact Klaus is centuries older.

[@therotryzit]

@@thomasraines1396 I did not watch any of those shows nontheless that must have been really awful to watch through these series.

[@thomasraines1396]

@@therotryzit it’s pretty bad yeah.

[@NoodleNerd]

Legends of Tomorrow has had several episodes and even story arcs about forgiving abusive and/or neglectful father figures. Arguably the worst episode of the show is about Mick (Heat Wave) forgiving his physically abusive dad to the point where there's a scene of Mick literally doing self-harm and none of the characters take it seriously when they absolutely should. As much as I like Legends of Tomorrow, I'm absolutely sick of those plotlines and how they ruin what could've been good episodes.

[@snorp_lord6141]

If White Diamond had been written consistently: "You're acting like a child!" "I am a child. What's your excuse?" *Steven is squished by a giant sandal*

[@baydiac]

It was always so stupid bc the point of the entire episode was that WD refused to admit that Steven was a child. Imagine a grown ass adult telling you "I AM a child, what's your excuse?" and phrasing it like a sick burn. Especially if you believe that grown ass adult to be under some kind of delusion, or a maladaptive liar. That's not a comeback, it's just... sad. A realistically written WD would've had a look of disappointment and disgust on her face at BEST? And at worst? The sandal. Squish.

[@lyone2983]

Wait, wait, wait!!! Hold up!! Gems don't have children! It was shown through the entire series that the Chrystal Gems had a problem grasping what Steven even is. How does White Diamond even know what a child is??? Or how a child behaves? GOD THIS STORY IS SO AWFUL!!!!

[@snorp_lord6141]

@@lyone2983 HEY WAIT YEAH-

[@K4rm4ttack]

@@ibchillin I feel like that's giving the writing too much credit.

[@AshleyTheFighter]

16:21 whoa that mouth sync timing

[@cotren8860]

ME TOO

[@adeleaslan8182]

the clip of the Bismuth episode and and privileged Pink Diamond was like a copy paste of a fight I had with a racist ex friend of mine, and that’s the problem with episodes like these. If you support behavior like this you give birth to a breed of mini Trumpets or a list of excuses for racists to have

[@adeleaslan8182]

@@baconlettucetomato3894 no I don’t hate the show because I was ‘abused’ first of all he and the girl barely spoke when I found out she was racist, and second, I hate the show for the same reason I hate her behavior: it’s blatantly racist

[@adeleaslan8182]

@@baconlettucetomato3894 I’ve never had a boyfriend. I wish but sadly no

[@thegreenrenegade7759]

I genuinely dont get how writers can have this horrific of tunnel vision. I genuinely dont understand how you can botch a story this badly. Honestly, Steven shouldve just taken advantage of the diamonds weird trust of him, gotten into the inside, and started a revolution. That wouldve been a far more interesting twist to steven placating the diamonds than him going all the way.

[@Sarah_Beesus]

Im now really questioning a lot of stuff I see from both the left and the right because of a Steven universe critique of all things. Im still a minor and grew up watching this show. I always thought that peace and kind words were the answer to everything, but when it comes to much bigger issues that involve horrible people, those people never care. I really like this video

[@quin7988]

Why Bismuth was bubbled She was the only character who knew that Roses sword couldn’t shatter a gem

[@jamiedodger2361]

I love this new update! Your format and writing is really to the point and doesn't dance around things for people's comfort. Really makes me consider my own position and feel more confident about not debating my rights with people who don't actually want me to have any.

[@64girl2thresq4]

You know what's funny? A lot of people, when this video came out, disagreed with the statement that "not everything is planned" in terms of writing or making a show, etc. Not long after, Hbomberguy uploaded his Deus-Ex Revolution video (and we know this same crowd of people watch and like Hbomberguy), which brings up the fact that the team behind that game planned everything from the beginning, strictly stuck to it while making little to no changes, and made the game suffer overall. The original Deus-Ex had the team scrap their original plans and had them embrace changes and new ideas, which led to a better game. And after Hbomb's vid, those same people complaining about your statement when eerily quiet. I find that hilarious.

[@sundaefrobase6031]

This whole video is what has been nagging at me for a fat minute, but I just couldn’t put it into words. Thank you, Lily!

[@tricks1118]

This looks really interesting, can't wait to see how different your analysis of this is from more experience and more information the show itself Update: I just finished the video and wow. Lily you've really outdone yourself with this one. I like how this was a lot clearer when it came to what the core problem so Steven Universe. The part where you we're talking about if steven loves garnet was just... wow, really good and probably my favorite thing you've ever put in a video. Keep up the good work :]

[@kingpagie]

5:09 Lily Orchard admits she like Steven Universe at some point. 2021 (Colorized)

[@hockeater]

People rarely get this passionate about things they didn't, at some point, either like, or at least see some degree of potential in. If the work never, on any level, stirred any sort of positive feeling, the person likely didn't force themselves to watch it. In the rare cases I've seen where this is not the case, the resulting criticism is very brief, very blunt, and while venomous generally a great deal less detailed. To put it simply? Terrible things hurt worse when they manage to take down your guard, and render you vulnerable on some level.

[@CameoAfro]

She did this a lot. The denouement of her original video is her explaining that part of the reason she's so pissed at the show was that she initially thought it had promise and it meant something to her.

[@kharlos_]

I appreciate that Dr. Doof reference

[@VirtuosoI]

Steven: says shattering gems is bad Also Steven: proceeds to try to shatter White Diamond in future and does shatter Jasper.

[@ZessXXify]

It would have been more interesting if the show even once suggested that Steven, a literal child without even access to regular education where he might have learned what a nazi is and put two and two together, might be wrong or incapable of understanding deep seated political issues that date back thousands of years before he was born. Or if they showed him giving his friendship is magic shpeal to someone truly irredeemable who goes on to do something horrible and irreversible that he could have prevented if he stopped them when he had the chance. The fact that a 14-year-old boy who has barely seen more than a glimpse of the millennia of gemocide and war must somehow know better than all of the victims involved is insulting and creatively absent.

[@YaburuRunyaru]

Choosing a non-violent route and not standing up properly for a cause are two different things. The latter isn’t being bigger than the situation; it’s being a coward who doesn’t understand what it takes to actually solve difficult problems standing up.

[@emilyquintero2656]

What's even worse with bismuth is that the time that steven decides to unbubble her, He doesn't do it out of compassion or even try to apologize. He does it because he needed people for garnets wedding and also to basically say "Oopies! You were right all along! Can we just forget all this ever happend?" And its almost like bismuth is not allowed to say "well looks like my ideology was right all along, time to use the breaking point!" Another thing that I'd like to point out is that everytime someone in the show gets called out for shitty behavior, it get swept under the rug. Case in point, when amethyst masquerades as Greg's dead wife to try to punish him for leaving for wanting to see the fireworks with his son. Steven decides to yell at BOTH at them even though amethyst was making fun of his dead mother and preventing him from leaving and greg was trying to do the right thing and be a good father. You know what would be better than amethyst cleaning out Greg's garage as a way to apologize? AN ACTUAL APOLOGY!!! that's just one of many things that have bothered me for years!

[@Sigmaqueen6969]

Okay so you think that everyone who doesn’t agree with you deserves to die in other words?

[@zcdace2204]

Steven was fighting for his life when confronted with Bismuth, and that's the reason he bubbled her, Steven doesn't need to apologise for surviving

[@Emma__O]

@@Sigmaqueen6969 Human rights violations are not a matter of disagreement

[@nickie3835]

​​@@zcdace2204even if that is true, the show making Bismuth just shrug and go along with Steven after all that is just wrong. And of course Steven fought for his life with Bismuth, instead of y'know, his incredible persuasive skills that got others to listen. Wonder why the show chose to have Steven bubble her as his only option🤔

[@SoulQueenoD]

I got on this channel because of LOK. Best decision I ever made. Love your content.

[@hearteyedracoon7930]

I got here because of the Steven universe video

[@HaHaHannah1369]

I’d love to see so much more of these long form criticism from you, lily. This is truly inspiring and honestly when I hear the complaints from the right of “I don’t mind BLM it’s just the rioting and destruction of their own property that negates what they’re saying” as if they ever tried to understand them before deciding that without respectability politics, they aren’t worth listening to. And honestly this one video on how violence to change oppression does not make you as bad as the oppressor makes more sense and is more concise than half of lefttube. Of which I do love, I just think it’s geared towards an already left audience and does little to change minds or opinions or educated. Just talk about the thing so we can all nod in agreement. So, thanks. This is so great. I’d love to see more long if less frequent videos. ❤️

[@donutzero]

I would love it if Steven would have actually realized he silenced others. The whole theme of the show is to show others a chance to have there own will and opinions, but Steven just takes that away. If Steven would have actually realized this that would have been great. The diamonds to me are all horrible, minus blue sometimes? I mean Yellow and White are clearly horrid. Have you met the selfish brat we call pink? Blue just feels like a hodgepodge of I'm depressed but like also I abused Pink apparently? Personally I think every diamond maybe minus Blue should have just been bubbled or shattered. I mean I can see Blue being redeemable but I'd rather she just get the whole bubble treatment also. All in all, I feel the diamonds were just all extremely dislikeable. Even if you look past all there cruel acts, who would want them to be saved? There all 1 dimensional and like the worst character traits possible. If you took away all there space dictator crap, they'd feel like off brand Mean Girls and Heather's. Like literally Blue could be compared to McNamara, White to Chandler, Pink to Duke because of the selfishness of each of them, and Yellow to like Regina because literally she doesn't care about anything and she's intelligent. The fact I'm comparing space dictators to High school Popular girls already shows an array of problems within the show.

[@thesireen]

They're All equally terrible , just because one is " depressed 🥺 " doesn't mean she's redeemable

[@Light-ro5bp]

That LISA comparison caught me by surprise, an unexpected, but welcome surprise

[@bryonmurphy7049]

i really did hate the fact that they used stevens morality as the shows morality as well. it means that steven can never be wrong, even if he’s being a brat or a dick to anyone and everyone around him, he’ll still never encounter consequences for his actions, because his views on good and bad have to be what’s right. To contrast this, in ATLA aang has a seemingly pure morality by the end of the show, but many moments in the first season show him making mistakes and facing the consequences for those mistakes (i.e. “Bato of the Water Tribe”, “Warriors of Kyoshi”, etc) which shape him into a character similar to steven by the end of the show. but where they differ is that the shower doesn’t hesitate on making aang wrong. his views on not killing the fire lord is wrong. literally everyone else says this is wrong and it’s true. but when steven doesn’t kill the bad guys, it’s right, the villains not only live but get redeemed. i’m so glad you made this video clear on how the morality of the show and the morality of the shows main characters need to be different to actually give the characters some depth and conflict rather than him always being in the right.

[@rickpool6437]

Thought I might throw something else in there: Did you never stop to wonder why the main gem cast is still referred to by their gem type alone, like naming a dog 'Dog'? Because they're not really individuals, just glorified slaves to the character bordering on Gary Stu status. Reminds me of my favourite Clone Wars character, Captain Rex: "I used to believe being a good soldier meant doing everything they told you. That's how they engineered us. But we are not droids, we are not programmed; you have to learn to make your own decisions!" (Insert visual of Peridot saying this to Pearl, as Pearl desperately tries to defend Steven's horrible behaviour.)

[@autobotstarscream765]

"Steven must be stopped, no matter the cost."

[@hearteyedracoon7930]

It would have been cool if the crystal gems choose new names for themselves like PD did to show even more that they reject the roles given to them by homeworld and are their own gems not just a cog in the machine

[@atkvin]

Mm, unfortunately I have to chip in my little knowledge of SU Future (refused to let my time be wasted by Sugar's drivel) that one of the few times the writers gave a gem a name was arguably way worse. Specifically the Pink Pearl in Future whose character is in denial of being a victim of abuse -- they.. not the characters - the WRITERS, named her Volleyball. Like, something to be hit for fun, for a character who was physically abused. I wouldn't be surprised if the writers thought it was just too 'smart' or - god forebid, too FUNNY of a dark joke to whichever fucked up individual wrote it and the rest who left it in. (This isn't my imagination either - even fans of the show felt off about the unusual nickname and some were actually disturbed recognizing a joke about the character's abuse in her name.)

[@hearteyedracoon7930]

@@atkvin that will never not bother me. The One time a gem had her own name, and not only she wasn't given the chance to choose one for herself, she was named after an object that only exists to be punched around. Again another case of Steven actually being mean if not downright cruel. It would have been fine to name her something like taffy, peach or some other shade of pink for example, why volleyball?

[@rickpool6437]

@@hearteyedracoon7930 That completely slipped my mind -- the one time they tried that, and it was to name a domestic abuse victim after an object designed to be hit -- naming her what she is in the eyes of Pink and White? Clone Trooper 99 would be fucking sobbing if he knew this. And speaking of 99, let me cleanse everyone's pallet with a snippet from a far better show: "Hevy? Stop calling me that! We're just numbers, 99. We're just numbers." "Not to me. To me, you always had a name." Ah, 99, perfect disabled representation hiding in plain sight.

[@jeannesgm7564]

What really hurt me is the episode where blue diamond takes Greg. Garnet admits that it would've been game over if she was spotted by Blue Diamond, yet Steven still tries to call her family

[@timmytimeturtle6331]

Using "Arrow to The Head" at the start immediately triggered my Lisa neurons.

[@joybouley9314]

And the “why lily is wrong” videos are already on the makings arent they? Yeah. I guess so. Anyways as most times I agree with lily again

[@LooneyNuke]

Soooo... You're not going to listen to what other people have to say? Listen to opposing viewpoints?

[@starborngamer7433]

You know, it'd actually be cool for the white diamond scene if it was the cluster that started talking. Just because they found eachother doesn't mean they won't be forever damaged, even with Yellow starting to fix them. They'll still be cracked and unstable. If they get poofed by accident their forms will return to broken messes; literal symbols of what the diamonds did. If they started talking to Steven, little lights to show the gems talking and bringing him back to the time they were all screaming for help, the imagery of Garnet nearly splitting and torn apart just knowing that she was the reason homeworld thought to try and replicate it. Quick side note: It wasn't Garnet's fault they did so and that they did it in the way they did, but she knew that she gave the idea and that was far too close to it for her to emotionally handle. She blamed herself for giving them the idea when she didn't even mean to. Sapphire was going to be hurt, something by the way that homeworld conditioned her not to care about. She didn't even care about her own life nor form, but Ruby did. She blames herself for something she could have never prevented just because she was the first. I think it would've been good if both white and Steven were reeling from that. It'd be good for White to see it up close. And then? Have her be in denial about it, have her dismiss it once the shock fades. Turn an eye, pretend it isn't there because 'oh we're fixing it now aren't we? We're reversing all the damage!' and then just have steven lose it because that's not how trauma works; because they'll still carry those emotional scars forever. They won't just be ok after they form, they'll remember the haze of being forced to fuse just to live and not kill others, the pain of being shattered just for an experiment and being deemed useless. Actually they shouldn'tve been happy when yellow was fixing them. They should've reformed screaming for mercy or in shock or angry. They should've been messy crying or dissociated from the world because the person that shattered them was right there. They would be fixed physically.... but never mentally. If they showed that though then the utopia would be shattered.

[@dianabollenbacher7856]

That is NOT Lisa the painful rpg music I hear in a Lily Orchard video, what a pleasant surprise

[@CrabGuyy]

Also the "non violent" shit doesnt stand up. Rebecca Sugar went tunnel vision *after* she wrote the first season, or thats what it feels like. During the end of the season when lapis is in prison she say the exact summary of the Steven at the end of the cartoon: that jasper is evil but we cant fight her cause she is too strong/doesnt deserve it *and Steven straight up denied it* like BRUH. He tells lapis that jasper is evil and deserve to die BRUH

[@egon2499]

And if not die, then at least to be bubbled for eternety.

[@AJLaz000]

"Killing a tyrant makes you no better than that tyrant" = *WRONG* ^ this, this is why I prefer Red Hood to Batman

[@ledetbrothers9210]

Remember how Spinel reset all of Steven’s friends’ memories and injected bio-poison into the earth so Steven would die alone on a barren world? Lets go and treat her like a damn cinnamon roll since she was LeFt iN tHe GaRdEn AnD tHaT eXcUsEs EvErYtHiNg DoEsN’T iT.

[@hearteyedracoon7930]

The thing is that at that point redeeming her was kinda mandatory since the diamonds were already redeemed. They probably realized that they couldn't just redeem the space nazis and then say that Spinel is unforgivable

[@ledetbrothers9210]

@@hearteyedracoon7930 Yeah. That’s another issue with redeeming the Diamonds. The Crewiverse now need to redeem every villain now because of the Diamonds being redeemed.

[@ledetbrothers9210]

@@ibchillin I know that the garden didn’t excuse Spinel’s actions. I was referring to how the fanbase cuddles Spinel like a fucking teddy bear, acting like Spinel was 100% right for her actions.

[@Persphone_cabin]

19:12 in retrospect maybe Stevan failing to change the diamonds and being killed up in the process would’ve been a better ending. it would’ve actually taught the lesson that trying to change and abusers mind is a bad idea

[@sagastar4108]

2:15 completely unrelated but why does Steven’s hand look so weird.

[@LilianOrchard]

The animators are terrible

[@Cluestblue]

I'm at a lack of words by how good this was, thank you so much for putting yourself through this again but I'd also love to see you make a long video about something you do enjoy and why you do so!

[@Pfpsaredumb]

The diamons said they are sorry Is that gonna give back the lives of the planets they colonized? The whole races they killed? No, when you do a crime, you pay for it. An apology does not fix things. Justice does.

[@zoeb3573]

I've been hoping you'd make a follow-up to your video after the season finale and Future, and while that's not actually what you did, I thoroughly enjoyed this rewriting and I can only agree with what you said. Seeing people excuse and "explain" (as if people who don't like the show don't UNDERSTAND what the show claims to have achieved) this show is frustrating and exhausting, and seeing someone put into words so well why they're... VERY wrong is cathartic.

[@laura-ni8ym]

steven universe is just performative activism: the poorly drawn show

[@GenderFluidDragonKing]

what Steven did to White Diamond is basically like if you walked up to Hitler and you said "Hitler causing mass genocide you know isn't poggers and it's pretty cringe *Vine thud sound effect*" and he just stops the Nazi party

[@josesilva3176]

this video seems to have taken a lot of time and effort to make. I loved each and every second of it. i don't care what SU fanboys say about you or what bronies say about you, everything you said about both of those shows was true. I'll support you to the end.

[@ryanmatthews3609]

me too

[@viper6163]

POV: your scrolling through the comments trying to find haters and angry fanboys

[@amsocool3890]

I think it's crazy I used to idolizes this show and I watched to be just like Steve at one point

[@elehko2661]

Great job Lily! I love hearing your newer thoughts on the show and open my mind to things I haven't realized about the show :D Overall: it's really improved

[@akarikazi]

ANDUIN BEING DUBBED OVER WITH STEVEN'S VOICE KILLED ME

[@bananachild7139]

When you stop and think about it you can see how desperately Sugar wanted Steven Universe to be Avatar, even down to the main character's philosophy in the final fight. Man, I love Avatar, but sometimes I wish it hadn't had the impact on animation that it did...

[@hearteyedracoon7930]

People need to understand what actually made avatar great instead of superficially copying it

[@juliannasreddin5226]

Heart eyed racoon exactly. Don't try to be the next someone else. Try to be the first you.

[@lhayciasamiels4752]

The way Steven behave is the same as the people who are upset about black people for not being passive and content about BLM protests. How we are just as bad for making a stink about something that already is concentrated shit.

[@saltinfinitum4066]

its been two years since i saw the previous video, and a lot of my political views have gone from lukewarm to 'burn it all down.' the video you made was a little part of the spark that fueled the inferno. thank you.

[@gabrielfiore8847]

I'm reading a fan comic on Steven Universe called "Stevan *AU*niverse: Ask WhitePearl and Steven". In it, Steven is the son of white diamond instead of pink's, and honestly, after watching this video, I can see how much more empathy WSteven has over OG Steven.

[@noteansylvan6051]

Sick of hearing white this and white that and all of the senseless buzzwords but at the core it makes sense what you're saying.

[@LilianOrchard]

Well it's nice to see your reflexive white fragility wasn't completely blinding

[@oreo-postraphe]

​@@LilianOrchard "White Fragility," someone's irritated Good vid tho, I'm glad not everyone bought into the forgiveness of the Diamonds. It frustrates me to no end how even if they're just suddenly gone from Homeworld that it doesn't mean Homeworld won't be making Gems the same way. It just means the Diamonds get to get off scott free and vacation

[@Fatmoviewatcher400]

Great video, I hope people watch this and learn that they should show empathy to oppressed people rather than the oppressors.

[@CHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAIR]

If you kill a murderer, the number of murderers stay the same. But kill *two* murderers-

[@theboogyman569]

why does the quote always assume the person being told this isnt ALREADY a murderer?

[@siqxyre8473]

Gah I have no idea how to praise this because there's so many ways I can fawn over this! All you said is 100% correct, and i fuckin love it! I am at a loss for words on how to keep blabbering on my love for this! Thank you so much for creating these SU videos, they've helped so much in my own analysises.

[@mj91212]

“That is a lie, and it’s a lie perpetuated by white supremacists to muscle people of color and LGBTQ people out of the conversation.” Ach, that just *chef’s kiss* perfectly describes it, thank you Lilly. Keep on living your best life, Queen!

[@yurililly1978]

“ good people don’t kill, good people spare their enemies.” well luckily for me I’m not a good person and I don’t wanna be lol.

[@yurililly1978]

@PitBot-d7k I don’t believe in God. But amen to that! Bad people should be forced to work in prison camps without pay.

[@offdutyenglishmajor9924]

This comment will probably get buried, and you may not even see it, but I wanted to tell you that you gave me a different way of looking at forgiveness... not for Nazis, because fuck them, but with abusers. I think I had a pretty toxic idea that I had to forgive people who were awful to me, and that led to me trying to do the same with one of my abusers. Guess what? They hadn't changed, and I got hurt again. My point is, I needed to hear your words. Thank you.