Looking at Kill la Kill:

Once a show is deemed “problematic” is there any going back or will it forever remain a qualified recommendation?
SPOILERS: This video contains spoilers for the entirety of Kill la Kill.
“Chapters”
0:00 - 1:08 Intro
1:09 - 6:05 The Male Gaze
6:06 - 14:50 Subjectivity
14:51- 15:01 Call to Action
=============================================
Notes:
1. Berger, 1977, pg. 47.
2.Mulvey, 1989, pg. 19.
3. Torres, 2018.
4. See for example, Black, 2019, Kaiser, 2021.
5. Hemmann, 2013. Pp. 25-26.
6. Hunnicutt, 2009. Pg. 557.
7. Sugawa-Shimada, 2019. Pp. 190-191.
8. Napier, 2006. Pg. 41.
9. Hunnicutt, 2009. Pg. 556.
10. This is a good example of how the tendency to take a fictionalized world, with its own inherent logic and coding and interpreting it as being reflective of or commenting on real world situations can be perilous. See Chandler, 2017. Chapter 4.
11. Mulvey, 1989. Pg. 16.
12. For a more detailed examination of how the subjectification of female characters can challenge the presumed male gaze, see. Hemmann, 2013.
=============================================
Sources:
Berger, John. Ways of Seeing. BBC, London, 1977.
Black, Mo. “This Show is Progressive, I Swear! On Kill la Kill”. Moe’s Home For Treatises and Hot Takes. Medium. July 18, 2019. / this-show-is-progressi... , (accessed February 12, 2021)
Chandler, Daniel. Semiotics: The Basics 3rd Ed. Routledge, New York, 2017.
Kaiser, Vrai. “Dressed to Kill la Kill: The overlooked power of fashion’s rebellious history”. Anime Feminist. March 5, 2021. www.animefeminist.com/dressed... (Accessed March 28, 2021).
Hemmann, Kathryn, "The Female Gaze in Contemporary Japanese Literature" (2013). Publicly Accessible Penn Dissertations. 762.
Hunnicutt, Gwen. “Varieties of Patriarchy and Violence Against Women: Resurrecting “patriarchy” as a Theoretical Tool.” Violence Against Women. Sage Publications, 2009. vaw.sagepub.com/content/15/553 (Accessed February 28, 2021).
Mulvey, Laura. Visual and Other Pleasures. Palgrave, New York, 1989.
Napier, Susan J. “Excuse me, Who Are You?” Performance, the Gaze, and the Female in the Works of Satoshi Kon”. Cinema Anime. Ed., Brown, Steven. Palgrave Macmillan, New York, 2006.
Napier, Susan J. From Impressionism to Anime: Japan as Fantasy and Fan Cult in the Mind of the West. Palgrave Macmillan, New York, 2007.
Sugawa-Shimada, Akiko. “Shōjo in Anime: Beyond the Object of Men’s Desire”. Shōjo Across Media: Exploring “Girl” Practices in Contemporary Japan. Eds. Berndt, Jaqueline; Nagaike, Kazumi; Ogi, Fusami. East Asian Popular Culture Series. Palgrave MacMillan, 2019.
Torres, Riane. “My Fave Is Problematic: Kill la Kill”. Anime Feminist. June 22, 2018. www.animefeminist.com/my-fave... (Accessed March 28, 2021).
=============================================
Music:
Algus’ Theme. Hitoshi Sakimoto.
Knowing Nothing {140 & 4/4} by Mid-Air Machine is licensed under a Attribution-ShareAlike License.
Land of a Folk Divided {113 & 4/4} by Mid-Air Machine is licensed under a Attribution-ShareAlike License.

[@alessandrott7568]

I always thought Satsuki's speech was self-explanatory. If SHE does not see any sort of lasciviousness/deprivation in the way she presents herself, all outward attributions will be extraneous to her since her actions are pure in the sense of being devoid of such lascivious/deprived intent. The way the character Satsuki is perceived has nothing to do with the way it is presented (at least not necessarily), it's the viewer that projects their own values/beliefs on the examined subject and assumes others may think the same way. We could say that if beauty is in the eye of the beholder, so is "ugliness".

[@PIRATEOTR]

Really liked this one, walks through some cool theoretical topics to help me expand my thoughts on the show. I'd always sort of fallen in a middle ground where I partially agreed with some of the male-gaze-related critiques of the show but felt there was more to it that I couldn't express well.

[@StudyofSwords]

Well this is really all I can hope for, providing some perspectives viewers may not have been exposed to, so hooray! My primary criticism with the sources I cite is their prescriptivist conclusions. I think a reasonable case can be made about the issue of continued objectification, but moving from this to shut out alternatives which aren't strawman "look, just admit you want to be titillated " just ignores a lot of other very interesting things the show is doing. It's essentially "this isn't that deep" but couched in progressive talking points. There's also the issue of literalism which underpins a lot of the criticism - that the show ought to reflect a direct commentary on real world issues, rather than using the setting of the fictional world to explore them within its own context.

[@machineofthe6thriver430]

Wow great vid. I had always felt that despite the criticism, kill la kill never felt like a show that was objectifying it’s characters for the purpose of “fanservice”. The characters dressed scantily but it always seemed to serve the narrative and besides maybe only a couple of scenes (which is normal for most anime) the large majority of the show’s nude or semi nude content is not meant to titillate. The male gaze argument felt like a hard one for me to dispute though, maybe because I’m a male and my view is biased and perhaps my viewpoint was just ill suited to fully understand the problematic nature of this show. Uh but you explained it better than I ever could. I feel validated.

[@StudyofSwords]

Glad you enjoyed the video! Yeah, the biggest, let's call it a "problem" for the sake of cogency, with contemporary fan discourse around "the male gaze" in visual media, is that it treats it as an aspect which is dominant rather than hegemonic. Meaning that it's accepted as being the only way to read a text, rather than as a forceful - but not singular - reading. This is where "resistant reading", which I mention throughout the series becomes really interesting, and where a media theorist like Stuart Hall is also quite informative.

[@Sneaker3719]

Good vid. Ever since I first saw the series, I kinda always noticed the dissonance between how the characters in the show own the revealing nature of their battle outfits, and how Ryuko regardless manages to be eye-candy throughout the whole of the show. But now that I use your analysis to reflect, I actually think it's really cool how the show manages to bring Senketsu and Junketsu's synchronized forms to the level of Goku losing his shirt while fighting Frieza, both through the aspects of the rejection of the male gaze that you describe and through sheer constant exposure to them. So thanks for offering that new perspective to me. But that aside, I would offer a critique that the main meat of this video sounded too much like a restating of the introduction. It really takes the "video" out of the essay and makes it seem like a reading of a hastily-written actual essay due midnight tonight. I would recommend experimenting with how you can craft an introduction to videos that gets the job of introducing the subject done without laying down too much of the specifics of what will be talked about. All-in-all, can't wait for your next vid on the series. Probably one of my favorite shows.

[@StudyofSwords]

I'm glad you enjoyed the video! I really do appreciate the feedback as well. Cheers.

[@fluffy_tail4365]

Excellent analysis as always. To em it feels that KLK tries to also grow with the viewer themselves towards the actualization of its characters step by step, like you point out. In fact Ryoku seems to go through the same growth and she is an outsider like the viewer to the word of the academy where this actualization of women already seems to have took place

[@StudyofSwords]

Yeah, given the nature of the visuals and the production company behind it, it can be a surprisingly nuanced and intricate piece of media. This is why it's such a shame that people either dismiss it out of hand, or do a surface level reading without engaging with the core themes, to say nothing of the litnay of scholarly works written about it

[@brew2360]

I really liked your video and how you did a lot of research on media analysis. I’m still trying to decide my own opinions on Kill La Kill and thought the interpretation of Kill La Kill being a subversion of the male gaze and it’s ubiquity was really interesting. Regardless, I love Kill la Kill for its characters and fight scenes and recognize I can criticize the bad parts of something and still love the good parts. It might also be interesting to compare Kill la Kill with Panty and Stocking, as they share some of the same creators and a lot of similar themes.

[@StudyofSwords]

The team of Imaishi and Nakashima really is a powerhouse, albeit only Imaishi was involved in Panty & Stocking with Garterbelt. Of course, there are some really interesting parallels with Re: Cutey Honey, the first project they both worked on together), particularly subversive and "queer" elements (I touch on these aspects of KLK in the last video in this series, "Fanservice as a weapon"). Fundamentally, my goal with this series of videos wasn't to instruct viewers on the best/most authoritative interpretation of the series. Rather, it was to open people up to the availability of multiple readings, and to voice my own perspective(s) on a series which is often, but by no means universally, maligned. So, not being sure how you feel about the series is perfectly reasonable, and grappling with media is, after all, one of the surest signs that you are engaging with it, rather than being a passive consumer, and I think that's a fundamentally more interesting position to occupy in the media landscape. Glad you liked the video!! Cheers!

[@brew2360]

@@StudyofSwords I think another idea I’ve been grappling with is that even if there is a valid reading of Kill la Kill as a subversion of the male gaze, is it realistic to suppose this was all intentional by the creators? Like for example, many queer and trans people identified with Harry Potter and not to rehash the JK Rowling stuff but clearly she didn’t want to put a trans affirming message in her books, yet many trans people felt comforted and inspired by Harry Potter. So I’m wondering if it’s possible that the creators could have intended for Kill la Kill to be a subversion of the male gaze or if that’s an interpretation we as the audience wanted to see and had within us all along. Not that I think art can’t be interpreted outside of the author’s own intentions but I also think those intentions are important in talking about why a piece of media is the way it is.

[@StudyofSwords]

@@brew2360 While I am a "soft anti-intentionalist", in this instance, yes I do think there were deliberate choices made by the production which included a critique of fanservice and subversion of the male gaze. There are simply too many overlapping elements, both narratively and metatextually, to be unintentional. At least I think so. And this is actually the thesis of the last video in this series, so I elaborate on this a lot more there.

[@mirveno]

an amazing analysis, i love the fact you didnt miss anything!! finally someone talking about this keep up the great work!

[@StudyofSwords]

Hey thanks for the kind words!

[@Poliostasis]

I can't believe you only have 498 subscribers, time to make it 499! You deserve way more subs because this quality of content is about on level with many youtubers with hundreds of thousands of subscribers!

[@StudyofSwords]

Well thank you very much for the kind words. I appreciate your support.

[@halfchiangel88]

Great video! I really liked hearing this perspective about Kill la kill, wish there were more videos like this out there

[@StudyofSwords]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@divebombexpert2619]

Most of the video essays I have watched on Kill la kill are about the themes and not the psychology of a show. Though I wouldn’t like this video because of the title, but loved it very well done.

[@StudyofSwords]

That's called playing with expectations ; D (just leaning as hard as I can into metatextuality.) I thought the "hashtag" was a bit of a tell since I only seem to encounter it being used ironically/satirically, but yeah I can absolutely see how taking it at face value could potentially turn people off. I guess I'm also relying a little on the fact that's its the third in a series I've promoted on a lot of the platforms, so I am assuming some familiarity there. But hey, glad you enjoyed it!

[@divebombexpert2619]

@@StudyofSwords haven’t seen the other 2 gonna watch them now

[@StudyofSwords]

@@divebombexpert2619 Excellent. Hope you enjoy them.

[@Miraihi]

Awesome as always, looking forward to the next one! Shorter, but more frequent videos are better in my humble opinion.

[@StudyofSwords]

Thanks. This one was a bit longer than the other two, old habits die hard, bit you can also get a feel for how long this would have been as a single video.

[@simonfisher4592]

I think a case can be made also that the hypocrisy present in the first epsiode doesnt come from the implied power of patriarchy (in the worlds logic) but from the difference in class. Ryuko is shamed by others at points for her wearing senketsu but Satsuki and the rest of the student council arent shamed for their lewd clothing. The only difference being their position in society. It's similar to the perception of drug use in the real world, poor people doing drugs is seen negatively but rich people doing them is glamorized. It's a clever way that the show can have its cake and eat it too as it can function as a critique of systems of patriarchy but the world itself be women dominant.

[@StudyofSwords]

Initially I was going to have a video on class, but it was a bit incongruent with the rest of the video. I ended up using the ideas in the KLK v Edgerunners video though, because I think the series does a really good job of interrogating class and class antagonisms when they arise.

[@Artofjoe]

That was not what I was expecting, haha. I liked this video a lot.

[@StudyofSwords]

Glad you liked it!

[@speeddemon5339]

I still think most of the characters with kamuis should wear hardened life fiber armor, in tandem with their regular Kamuis. I mean, sure life fibers give the wearer enhanced durability, but you still have all of your vital organs on display for anyone to fuck you up. (And before you say that they can’t because life fibers corrupt a person’s body, just remember hardened life fibers are dead).

[@StudyofSwords]

Outside the diegetic basis of Kamui being pure lifefibres and having a deleterious effect on the wearer, there are also few weapons which are capable of harming a Kamui wearer. Beyond the Scissor Blades and Bakuzan (and subsequently B Gako and B Koryu), the only other weapon which was shown to have any effect against them were the projectiles fired by Kinagase) and the exposed nature of Ryuko didn't make a difference. Such arms were, of course, ineffective against a fully synchronized Kamui wearer. Effectively, given the superlative combat abilities given the Kamui wearer, the only effective threats are other Kamui wearers - any credence to real world protection is a moot point.

[@M3rtyville]

Whenever someone says Male Gaze, my head turns it into Male Gays which confused the hell out of me for a long time.

[@StudyofSwords]

Ah, interesting. Well the thing to keep in mind about Berger/Mulvey is that "male gaze" is descriptive and not necessarily a value judgement, which unfortunately is how it often ends up being used when analyzing media.

[@thomasffrench3639]

Ironically due to the male gaze, the female gaze is interpreted as gay because of the assumption of a male audience.

[@NineOuh]

good shit, I mean it!

[@StudyofSwords]

Hey Thanks! I'm glad you enjoyed it.

[@entropete]

don't care still watching

[@jeremiahnoar7504]

The reason why people find Kill la Kill problematic is because in America, we're chained down to looking at stories through this postmodern filter and feel the need to fit everything within a progressive narrative. Kill la Kill doesn't have to be about feminist empowerment or reclaiming bodily freedom or whatever. It can just be a funny show with good animation, striking character design/world building and pushing the concept of fan service to it's farthest extreme for shits and giggles.

[@StudyofSwords]

I'm genuinely curious, but what do you mean by "this postmodern filter"? No, I have no "need" to fit KLK in a progressive narrative. But that doesn't preclude that you can't examine the work through a feminist lens. It also doesn't mean that such a lens is the only one, or even the best one, available. As you said (and as I mentioned at the very outset of this video series, in the first video - "Overthinking") there's nothing wrong with engaging with KLK as a fun, fanservice heavy action show. That's the nature of texts, they are open to different readings.

[@jeremiahnoar7504]

@@StudyofSwords As you pointed out, the only complain that KLK get's revolves around it's fanservice. Your review (and most reviews really) start out with the premise that KLK's fanservice should initially be viewed as problematic. People in the west (mostly those with a feminist lean) explain away the fanservice as empowering so that they can justify its existence. But I don't see why empowerment needs to be involved in order to justify it the fanservice here. Isn't it enough to note that everything in the anime is purposely exaggerated and so the same would also go for its fanservice? By "postmodern/ feminist filter" I mean, those who tend to look at everything as a power-dynamic between men and women. If something benefits women more, it's automatically empowering, if it benefits men more then it must be misogynistic. But that seems kind of wild to me. Ryuko and Satsuki are obviously bad-asses that hold their own. They're likeable, and they have agency (and both guys and girls like the character designs anyways). Yet we're considering it problematic because sometimes, ogling male viewers find Ryuko and Satsuki visually gratifying? If the fanservice doesn't take away from the positive aspects of the characters, then why should we have a problem it at all?

[@StudyofSwords]

@@jeremiahnoar7504 Ah, okay. So acknowledging "power dynamics" isn't "postmodern" or "postmodernist" - this is something that is said by people who are critical of a strawman conceptualisation of postmodernism which has been constructed by people who haven't read anything by so-called postmodernists. Feminism, also, predicates postmodernism by decades, so conflating the two is falicious (I'll note you also didn't originally say anything about feminism, I brought that up) so I can at least see where you're coming from ideologically. For example, Laura Mulvey, the person who popularised the idea of the "male gaze" isn't a Postmodernis, her thought deriving from psychoanalysis and Freud (one of the preeminent "modernist" thinker's), though she is a feminist of course. And, again, you're making an assertion that liking the fanservice for the sake of fanservice is somehow ethically questionable. Which is certainly an argument that has been made, and which this video specifically addresses. But that's just it. This video is a specific response to a particular line of critique, not a general defense of the series. The four videos in this series each address a particular way of "seeing" KLK, and so will only have utility in that framing, as these aren't a general review of the show, and so I did not feel it necessary to really address the, "let people enjoy things" argument outside of the first video.

[@hauntedconstellations6039]

Fam I really can’t imagine any amount of justification for depicting 16 year old children in the fashion Kill La Kill has. Like these conversations about the male/female gaze and sexualisation are great conversations to have, but absolutely not with children and minors as the subjects. A huge amount (certainly not all) of the problems with the show would be fixed if the characters being sexualized were adults. The fact that hardly anyone acknowledges that Ryuko is a literal child in their critiques is something I find DEEPLY disturbing.

[@StudyofSwords]

I'm not sure where to begin... but I'm willing to treat this as a good faith engagement with the content of the video. Ryuko is 17, Satsuki is 18. The demographics of the show are aimed at an audience of late teens/young adults and specifically, otaku. As I discuss at length in the last video in the series, while quite extreme in 2013, even compared to shows like Food Wars, SAO, High-school of the Dead, High-school DXD, etc, the depictions lack the ecchi edge. It's also a fairly naive position to assert that teens can't express their sexuality, and frankly I'm not certain there's a lot of anime being produced, not directly aimed at children, which doesn't contain some form of sexualization of teenaged characters? Also, and this is the really important part, these aren't real people right? These are drawings, and the drawings aren't referents to actual, real people right? They're self-referential, this is how semiosis works after all. If you have an issue with the series, well that's fine, it's okay not to like things for any number of reasons and if the content of the show makes you uncomfortable, then maybe skip this one. Cheers.

[@hauntedconstellations6039]

@@StudyofSwords yeah no still gross. The way our society treats children is deeply disturbing, especially looking into how teenagers are sexualized. Yeah teenagers should be allowed to experiment and express themselves, but the writers and animators are adults. As someone with younger siblings and family members this show went from being something I enjoyed when I was 17 to being something I am actively disgusted with.

[@StudyofSwords]

@@hauntedconstellations6039 okay.

[@definitelynotnick2454]

Are you new to anime?

[@thomasffrench3639]

@@hauntedconstellations6039 would you rather have adults be sexualized and promote the idea that only adults can be sexual? Because that mindset is incredibly dangerous and has downplayed sexual assault of men by adult women.

[@davidj.3897]

so in other words: is only okay when women do the gaze and you gloss over the clearly objectified males in the series, and push the "male gaze" trump card, again assuming that only straight guys will enjoy the series, and ignoring the straight women, gays and lesbians who also love the show, because the show is not about or focuses on the objectification aspect, is much more than that

[@StudyofSwords]

Well this video was addressing a specific criticism leveled against the show (I have them listed in the "sources" section if you want to read them for yourself.) So reading your comment, did you watch the video in it's entirety? Based on your comment it does not appear to be the case?