Loot Systems in Classic Wow

[@Zatar]

I did not mention GDKP. I might do a video on it separately. In my experience, it is not a system used to distribute items fairly amongst the guild, but rather a means to make the guild money after they have gotten geared. Kind of feels like a separate thing.

[@llwonder]

GDKP isn’t a real system. It’s pay 2 win bullshit money laundering. People only like it because it’s the quickest way to get money.

[@YepMarko]

most GDKP on mien server Pyrewood is pug runs, so pug is like MS>OS, or Soft Res so GDKP is whatever if you like go, but problem is when you have guys who use real money transfer in GDKP.

[@SirLasterOfDesaster]

Here are the timestamps: 00:00 - 04:43 Intro / Goals of loot systems 04:44 - 07:14 Main>Sec 07:15 - 10:06 Soft Reserve 10:07 - 18:30 DKP 18:31 - 21:41 EPGP 21:42 - 26:36 Loot Council 26:37 - 31:52 Onslaught 31:53 - 39:10 Zatars Favorite Loot System 39:11 - 40:42 Conclusion

[@fatherof2husbandof1]

anyway you look at it loot council will always become corrupt, i been in multiple loot councils in different guilds and all of them create favoritism and become corrupt, no matter what preventions you have to stop it from becoming corrupt

[@vj1991fin]

I´ve been using DKP with hidden bids for all of classic. The 100% biggest issue for me with it is that everyone knows what the biggest upgrades are. In p2, every rogue saved dkp for CTS/ Mala and did not bid on ANYTHING else because we´d lose the big ticket items if we did. In the whole of p2 we had 1 CTS and 0 Maladaths drop and me, and like 3 other rogues, ended up with the same gear at the end of p2 as we had when we started. Other good upgrades went to classes that benefited less than rogues just because we did not want to spend the points. Absolutely horrible system with todays min-max culture.

[@Zatar]

I think epgp has a similar problem too. Players should never feel like they have to pass on minimal upgrades just to secure big items. Especially small items that really are meaningless long-term but can throw your prio off. At that point I think it's just straight up not fun when you're disappointed to see an item that you would normally want.

[@recoverygose]

You missed a massive downside of soft rez: Bad luck. It's very easy and quite common to just soft rez the wrong item every raid or you do in fact soft rez something that drops and just lose the roll over and over and over again. There is no sort of priority or bad luck protection involved with soft rez so it gets extremely frustrating when you show every week and put in a lot of effort just to roll like shit everytime something actually drops. Only to watch a player come in 1 time and win all the items they soft rezzed right away because they happened to be quite lucky. This makes it a massive deal breaker for me beyond simple pug raids. But even in pug raids that happen every week it becomes a big problem.

[@HOZI_Y]

In all seriousness, this is a very good video you've made here. 40 mins of solid information! Soft reserve is the future loot system. I really dislike the other loot systems.

[@jfkdidntlos791]

In my guild, players will do various PvP challenges to win gear in raids. But I do like the idea of Onslaught. Essentially a more rigid SR.

[@Riokaii]

A loot council with a knowledgeable class/spec representative who can make onslaught lists that the loot council uses to inform their decisions seems like the best system imo.

[@MRkriegs]

go with loot council or loot list, I don't like combining them.

[@jeffv194]

I like a loot council that identifies order by which class gets the item next, then each class uses an epgp to distribute items.

[@Zatar]

Yeah it can help make sure items are evenly handed out, but I always get caught up on the value of items, and feel like the point system can lead to issues.

[@jeffv194]

@@Zatar no doubt you do make a great point that the point system can complicate things; however, in your loot council example, it was decided that the person receiving dft first would receive the weapons last, in a way, a value system was place on each of those items to determine fair distribution. A pit fall is, that player could receive dft week one, and then think “wow, I won’t receive anything for ages ok so far down the list, mine as well give minimum effort and dodge raids from time to time until I’m next on good loot.” Using an EPGP system to distribute after loot council determines which class is next on an item will help to ensure players continue to show up to raid for their EP and know that if others in their class are slacking that they will be able to pass them up in the loot order by putting in the expected effort. Thanks again for another great video btw.

[@Lordyung89]

Our guild recently collapsed because of poor loot distribution during Naxx progression. We basically gave the lowest performing rogue the first and only Kiss of the Spider.

[@Chazzvc]

Onslaught is interesting. Obviously when naxx25 is released everyone will want the iL226 weapon from KT25, It's BiS for phase 1 of wrath. BUT it might be better if you put the weapon as your #4 or #5. If you have Tier chest piece as #1, Then chances are you will be the first to get them since everyone else has the best item as #1. The issue with putting the best item as #1 is that you have to roll against a few people for it so your chances aren't even 100%. Basically if you put turning tide as #1 and tier chest drops, the person being smart about their list will get the tier chest because it was #1 for them, then their tier shoulders become #1 (i'm assuming) because your number 1 item becomes the next in line. Someone could put the weapon last and potentially get all the gear first since they keep getting #1 status on things when everyone else is focused on weapons. Then when that person has all their gear, the weapon becomes #1 and the odds of winning it are likely higher since a couple have dropped already knocking out a couple other #1s. The issue with this system is that you are punishing people who show up to raid in full naxx13 gear not needing anything but the weapon only to lose it to a new player who needs everything and didn't have to grind naxx for 10 weeks straight.

[@britneyspheres7yearsago11]

Timestamps on this video might be appreciated. You can add timestamps by typing for instance 0:00 - 5:00 Explaining Loot systems In the description of your video.

[@wtfmilk3]

Is DKP new member friendly?

[@91Animeguy]

Every loot council guild I have played in have been very corrupt.

[@HOZI_Y]

*looks at thumbnail* DAMN SON WHERE'D YOU FIND THIS? xD

[@jellyfilled2011]

I've been looking into implementing gdkp as a loot system for my new guild. In theory it can work and there's room to implement some prio with enough gold. I personally wanted to try it because it seems like a good way to keep raiders interested in raiding because they will be getting some extra gold in their pockets after getting the gear they want.

[@Zatar]

I think GDKP is great for running old content that not everyone in the guild wants to do. Seems like it would suck for brand new content.

[@Zatar]

I think GDKP is great for running old content that not everyone in the guild wants to do. Seems like it would suck for brand new content though.

[@klontic]

Serious question have you cleared naxx now then? I presume you went back to raid

[@Zatar]

I have not. After my guild disbanded, I had no interest in clearing naxx. I found that I was enjoying the game much more when I didn't have to raid. Lately I have been busy preparing for TBC. I am playing Alliance so I had to re-level a warrior and a rogue.

[@klontic]

@@Zatar are you planning on returning at all? I feel like the only one in my guild who’s more interested in staying on classic servers lol I’ll probably play tbc but nowhere near the amount I’ll continue to play classic. These days with the naxx pugs it’s not that difficult

[@Zatar]

I have always been a PVPer more than a Raider, and I just don't find World Buffs and classic consumes fun. Combine that with no items in naxx catching my attention I just don't see the point. In regards to Forever classic servers, if they find a way to combine the populations of the server's once people leave, I think it could be really fun to play on. I just think it's a huge shame they're charging money per character (if you want to play tbc as well) as it will discourage people from playing classic.

[@diemydarling89]

Emerisa forget hidden 2 zatar. Its me. I wait tbc and start arena pvp=) think rerol to be hunter if blizzard dont add change fraction

[@fiy19]

My opinion is : I love Zatar

[@Ant3rn]

“Everyone has stories, the item they’ve really wanted to drop …” lol, it’s loot council in the nutshell. Expect to wait until all the close friends and wives of them will get their bis, unless u are the friend/wife. Upd. Prevent drama? Ofc, if there are your buddies in the council. And if someone attempts to say something against they’ve simply doomed. So there’s no public drama, but u can be certain, more than half of raid members hate your officers and their wives/girlfriends/friends. Not healthy for a guild. There is no such thing as objective loot distribution when real humans are involved, just like in the real life. It could be gdkp, but rmt and bots ruined the whole idea behind this.

[@amandaspear6148]

That thumbnail though 🤣😂🤣

[@asfasdfsd8476]

The best loot system is retail personal loot. Removes all rivalry and drama

[@Zatar]

I think rivalry in drama existing is what makes finding a good guild so rewarding. Think of all the crazy stories people can tell about loot too. Not going to hear any stories like that from retail.

[@britneyspheres7yearsago11]

If I ever had a guild, I would like to try out Suicide Kings as a loot system.

[@yukmoutb5885]

onslaught loot system isnt for new players though. you would never see a new player in that guild and on a raid team.

[@Stompinwind]

Onslaught has bias and class restrictions

[@Ewhit-je3os]

We gave DFT to A druid tank who left the guild not long after With DKP

[@Stompinwind]

You do realize agedcore gloves is feral bis til like p5 and it's only bis for anyone else if they use daggers which is a dagger rogue is only prio over druid

[@Zatar]

There are gloves in zg that are almost identical, and there's also gargoyle slashers which you can get phase one which are nearly identical in terms of DPS. Not to mention most Druids use devilsaur for quite a while. I don't remember my exact phrasing in the video, but a dagger Rogue should always get these clubs over a feral.

[@Stompinwind]

@@Zatar devilsaur is for noob druids only and zg gloves still 2 dps lower though as I said as a druid I would give a dagger rogue but no other class

[@Kevin-uj4uu]

i think soft res would be best if you get 2 of them that way it doesnt feel as bad when you want to soft res say last 2 peices of t1 you want and the other peice drops that someone whos soft resing rag loot wins. and for big ticket items you soft res that item twice to have more rolls. not many people use it this way though

[@fujiwhara-]

amazing

[@johnnyborbon5085]

DKP sucks, I was in a DKP guild and it sucks having to spend points on small upgrades even tho no one else wants the item, being in a LC has been much better, they notice if u are good and put effort into the game and reward you accordingly

[@MRkriegs]

does that issue you have not apply to every single other person and thus making it not a problem? like if you were the only person that had to pay for small upgrades yea I get you, but that would apply to everyone else too, meaning they dont just get more dkp than you unless then simply dont take the small upgrades

[@drogoz4042]

tfw no zatar gf

[@crocopde]

I GOT AGE CORSE LEATHER GLOVE. FK ROGUE FERAL DRUID FOREVER. btw am using glove of enforcement and and flex those glove around walking with them nake

[@biscuit6623]

So alpha dude. You sure showed them!

[@TheFunkyfeelings]

DKP IS THE BEST!

[@talaltawfiq2267]

loot council is like North Korea, you join raid do what everyone else does but someone else decide what loot you get??? i mean people talk about OH THIS IS BIS FOR BLABLA dude every fckn raid has been cleared within 1 day of release, shit is easy, people don't play vanilla and TBC a 15 year old game because they want world first, people play for the fun and nostalgia, there are items people prefer to enjoy their game more, maybe it will drop their dps by 10 or 20 but who caresssss you still clear everything and easy. Loot council is like slavery, it is the most pathetic system that ever existed in any game