Starship Lore : Constitution Class - A Prestigious Tomb

[@LoreReloaded]

Let me go ahead and address it - I only noticed after I did two different renders that I used the wrong blasted enterprise at the beginning - even if I could try to wiggle my way out of it.. I apologize. I'm trying a new longer form, more research, more information in a single video.. AND I'm making two different versions (watch the whole video to find out more). Let me know what you think about the video in this form, i appreciate your guys patience.

[@IronWarhorsesFun]

A CHANNEL HAS BEEN DETECTED ALTER COURSE TO INTERCEPT. CHANNEL IDENTIFIED LORE RELOADED PREPARE FOR ASSIMILATION.

[@ojisanhoward8940]

Lore Reloaded simply put...I like it.

[@TDBoedy]

Video was good. How many weapon trees does the constitution class have? I suspect that photosynthesis is pretty inefficient for any kind of weapon making - unless they cut them down to make hand to hand weapon handles. I could see that. Issue them to ship security like those schools issue mini-bats.

[@Will831100]

Lore Reloaded Picked on the Oberth long enough now have we? Time for a new target?

[@annatarlordofgifts5767]

Lore Reloaded so does this mean KZbin has surrendered to the The Lore Reloaded and you are no longer suspended

[@redengineer4380]

"Hey we're running low on ships to send to Wolf 359, we need more vessels." "See that constitution ship we keep in the museum?" "Yeah?" "Slap a bunch of fucking cadets on it as bridge crew, put an ensign in command, and give it a full staff of redshirts" -The story of that constitution class at Wolf 359, probably.

[@tongieboi]

Star Trek Online: main campaign

[@60sspider-man29]

@@tongieboi unless you play the TOS intro like a chad.

[@creed8712]

@@60sspider-man29I’m pretty sure genuinely doing it that way gets you a head start over the others because it’s tutorial campaign is much longer than the Discovery one

[@thelordofcringe]

@creed8712 I'm pretty sure all of the tutorials get you to level 10 by weighting the xp rewards. So it's really more a choice of how long you can bear tutorials vs what sound effects you want all your ui, transporter, etc to have.

[@redengineer4380]

@@tongieboi Signals officer: "Admiral, we've got a message coming in from the... USS Excessive Force. Who... named that thing?" Admiral: "What do they want?" Signals officer: "They say their command crew is dead. Borg attack. What do we do? Should I tell them to come back to Starbase for replacements?" The I'm sure incredibly burnt out admiral overseeing STO crews: *Sips from flask* "Meh, fuck it, who cares. Send them out there. I'm sure it'll be fine."

[@CdnFN1]

Weddings are in a multifaith chapel on the Coni, but on a luxury galaxy class they are held in the bar.

[@inlarry4]

I believe I remember reading or seeing in a documentary that Roddenberry was opposed to the chapel, but the people in charge in the 60s just didn't think not having religion was acceptable to the viewing public. Which, we see almost every major species having a form of religion, why should humans be one of the few "higher" beings to have moved beyond it.

[@CdnFN1]

Starfleet officer chaplain like IRE & MASH would be interesting, more interesting if they worship science and they have the catch phrase “science damnit!”

[@positronicfeed]

Michael Sue Sounds like they finally get their heads straight by the time they build the Galaxy.

[@tba113]

Gareth Fairclough Depends on the ship. A submarine or frigate wouldn't have room for a chapel, but a cruiser might, and a carrier (or battleship if you're in that era) certainly would.

[@dougs7367]

They don't worship science. Smart people don't worship anything.

[@shaunmark1]

I like how the torpedo launcher is right where an accidental detonation would completely destroy the ship.

[@NashmanNash]

The torpedolauncher is also right where a butterknife could literally free the ship of its head^^

[@olympicnut]

There was a Constitution Class ship in the Fleet Museum, according to Picard.

[@kyle857]

olympicnut and one in little pieces at the battle of Wolf 359

[@Tar-Numendil]

Why wouldn't there be? NX-01 was turned into a museum ship when she was decommissioned. I imagine every major class of vessel to be used by Starfleet would be in some kind of museum after their service life.

[@Lans32485]

@@Tar-Numendil Assuming they're ever decommissioned at all. Some sources claim the Excelsior seen and mentioned in TNG occasionally is the same one from ST3, meaning it's been in service for 100 years.

[@DannyBeans]

@@Lans32485 Not implausible. There hasn't been a new B-52 built since 1962, and they're expected to stay in service into the 2050s at least.

[@leehilton9669]

One was a training vessel used by star fleet in the 24 century

[@johnpendleton914]

Piece of the action episode.... Ship’s phasers were set to stun fired and put a whole city street of people to sleep.

[@XCrawlFan]

They call the setting; "New Year's Day."

[@drmayeda1930]

Stun is best used on most living beings. Ships have energy shields to keep some of the energy from hitting the ship.

[@anselford3753]

William Signs Shithead.

[@paladinboyd1228]

Ansel Ford, They have a point, why send in security to stop a riot when you do it from orbit.

[@26th_Primarch]

Or if a giant space critter gets a little frisky and you don't want to harm it...

[@DeepVoiceGamer]

I assumed that Kirk ment there were 12 others in active service at the time. Didn't mean there weren't more in production. Or more that had been lost/destroyed prior.

[@deathstrike]

Exactly because at the M5 incident, Excalibur was lost. The Constellation was lost with the planet killer, and the Defiant (supposedly most advanced Constitution was lost in the interphase field. And finally the Intrepid, which was an all Vulcan crew was lost with the space amoeba. So that's 4 lost right there. They had to be replaced right? Also, to address the warp speed assessments, I refer to you #1: The Kelvans has drastically modified the ship to travel intergalactic speeds (Warp 11) by utilizing Omega to reinforce the structural integrity field. The black, conical device Scotty found in engineering is in fact an Omega molecule reactor. Hence the higher speeds and nearly 300 year endurance to reach Andromeda, the Kelvan Empire's home galaxy. In another episode, the Enterprise was exploring an artificial planet when it's AI defense system called Losira damaged the matter antimatter integrator which allowed the engines to run wild and for a brief few seconds, the Enterprise hit Warp 14. Due to the Kalandan's transport beam displacing and reintegrating the entire ship nearly 1000 light years away.

[@deathstrike]

Edit: These are canon sources. The dubious one is Star Trek, the Animated Series. They find a dying star with Commodore Robert April and his wife aboard, when a strange ship is diving towards the dying star, Enterprise tries to use a tractor beam to stop it, only to realize Kara Three, I think that was her name was travelling at Warp 32, not 22 and dragging the Enterprise at the same speed. I won't spoil the rest.

[@NashmanNash]

@@deathstrike Well,non canon whise starfleet might have been allowed to build 24 Federation class dreadnoughts..so just having 12-13 Constitutions overall would make even less sense :D...As Roddenberry clearly forgot after he started to believe his own propaganda..starfleet is military,and most militarys have more active cruisers than battleships...Unless you are germany in WWII of course...than you have NO really usable cruisers(Hipper class unreliable,Deutschland class being too slow to run away) alongside for a short time 4 rather reliable Battleships...

[@Brofisticus]

The Constitution refit was my childhood sweetheart. In fact, I ENJOYED the slow Motion Picture because of all the starship porn. She was a reliable old girl who took tons of damage and still hung on. She would have survived if not for a lack of crew. A few of the old Constitution ships did survive for quite some time. For example, the Yorktown survived to be disabled by the whale probe (Roddenberry suggested she was renamed the Enterprise A).

[@Lans32485]

Actually the ship that became the Ent-A (whatever her original name, I've seen several) is widely considered to have been a brand new ship in STIV, not a refit. Backed up by STV, in Scotty's log, and some sourcebooks which claim all the system glitches in that one were because of a bug in the new computers.

[@pex_the_unalivedrunk6785]

@@Lans32485 but why would they build a totally new ship on a design that was considered to be "old"? You think by then NCC-1701-A would have been either an Excelsior class or something between that & the Constitution. Also, considering the costs of building a starship(in materials, hours, and credits ofc since there is no "money" in the future) you'd think that Starfleet would usually keep a ship service for a century & uprade/refit it over the years as new tech developes, which is convenient with modular design. Idk...Star Trek is really a fictional drama, with Science as a prop & space as a backdrop...so much of what as been written & put on screen is...highly illogical.

[@Lans32485]

@@pex_the_unalivedrunk6785 The DESIGN wasn't considered old, the Enterprise herself was, she was actually going on 40 counting the pre-TMP stuff. Also there's enough internal differences between the A and the refit designs (bridge, shuttlebay, etc) that point to the Ent-A being even more advanced than the original was after the refit. Besides, the Excelsior class would be in service up through the Dominion war, and the refit design was barely 10 years old so the design wasn't exactly old by Starfleet standards. Also, most sources say the ship that was to be the A was already built at the time the whale probe showed up, they just changed the name and registry for the Enterprise crew.

[@coldspring8574]

@@Lans32485 Roddenberry has been quoted as suggesting that the Yorktown became the Enterprise-A, which is a nod to the original series before the first pilot was filmed, in which the hero ship was Yorktown, not Enterprise. Considering that only seven years after The Voyage Home, the Enterprise-A was decommissioned, it seems reasonable that she was also an old ship, otherwise, why throw away such a relatively young starship just because her crew is standing down? I reason that the Enterprise-A by the time of STVI was on her last tour no matter what, having already lived a long life as the NCC-1717 Yorktown.

[@slevinchannel7589]

C'mon! You can't expect them being as good as Ship Builders from the Year 2010 (in Stargate)! At least THEY had Internet! The Federation has no Internet anymore!! So yeah, Humanity in Stargate is just smarter and better in every way. They also have more Heroes. Star Trek's Humanity only has Picard, Riker, Data, and some more.

[@rurr1344]

Separate messes for Officers, and NCO's is not unusual

[@anulovlos]

This is totally normal for anything quasi-military; Officers and enlisted have separate problems, different areas allow them to blow off steam without disrupting the work environment.

[@nobodyimportant2470]

Last thing you want when complaining about the jackass commander while you eat lunch is the commander walking in with his lunch.

[@MrStabby19812]

anulovlos I visited a friend on a military base open day they had a nasty mess hall for the grunts a bit nicer one for your SGTs etc and I got a peek at super posh officers bit.

[@vinylpuma1]

Just to expound for other's knowledge, commissioned officers are generally better educated and are given more responsibility than their noncommissioned counterparts, and their junior enlisted subordinates. Enlisted crewmembers are around to do the work and be a technical expert in whatever they do, and thusly requiring a much smaller level of education than the officers. Officers are also a much smaller portion of the crew in a normal world. Star Trek for what I assume are story and budgetary reasons, have the same half dozen officers doing just about any/everything.

[@Pierce1996h]

Malchera but Starfleet is all about everyone being equal so it's kind of hypocrisy to give the enlisted shittier accommodations

[@nicodemusthemidnightdiscip2291]

The largest gathering of Constitution class ships was in the episode when the computer on the Enterprise (designed to replace the Captain) wigged-out and destroyed a big chunk of the fleet.

[@rosiehawtrey]

Spock: Whose engrams did you use? Dribbling Nutter: Mine Spock (sotto voce): Of course you did...

[@Delgen1951]

One thing to remember was that was that most of the people involved in TOS production had served in the US and allied navies in WW2 and this influence the design of the ships, Classes of ships (real navey ) can be as small as 2 ships, Roddenberry is quoted in the book "the Making of Star trek" that the Starfleet ships were to act like the Old frigates of the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries and not only be warships but ambassador and science/exploration ships, that also showed the flag for the nation, which is why the captain had such wide latitude in action, and othern left the ship. As this is what Captains of imperial Britain and France did while patrolling the colonies.Also navy ships do have chaplains on them to minister to the believers on board even today, tho only on the largest sized ones. Which is why Kirt ( he was acting as the chaplin which capians could do in the 18th and 19th centuries), Performs a wedding and a funeral in the episode where the Romulan war bird attacks across the neutral Zone. Any way the actions of the Constitution class ships mirrored what real navies of the age of Empires did, and was a deliberate choice of Roddenberry.

[@matthias6006]

The 1701-A is one of my favorite starships

[@johngregory4801]

"USS Enterprise. NCC-1701, no bloody A, B, C orrrrr D."

[@Ricktpt1]

After the Third season of TOS, the more they tried to improve it, the uglier (and less worthy of "suspension of disbelief") it became. The interiors looked more and more like the lobby of a Howard Johnson's and the Exteriors looked more like...well...the exteriors of a Howard Johnson's complete with Neon signage.

[@johngregory4801]

Well, @@Ricktpt1, since there were only three seasons of TOS, you must be speaking of the movies and subsequent series.

[@Lans32485]

The refit Connie is probably my favorite Trek ship period.

[@chuckintexas]

Lore - NO apology necessary. Simply refer to a revision-item (common in Engineering and Design - MY field) , accept with grace any POLITE commentary on the subject (ignore the rest as never having occurred), thank the reviewer and move forward. I have to tell you, this is some of the most concise and effective work I've seen in this genre. Very well done. For ME, this kind of thing helps fill out canon, and adds greatly to my enjoyment of Trek as a whole. I'm semi-retired now from a 40 year career in Heavy-machinery Design (specialized in oilfield - Land, Offshore Platform and Subsea Oilfield Equipment) and I particularly enjoyed your use of subtle humor to keep it light, without detracting from the primary intent. I FULLY realize this is all for fun and diversion from day-to-day necessities ( I stay sharp daily by helping individuals turn their "great idea" into a genuine "invention") but keep on. Good work, well executed. I look forward to more medium to long-form examinations of various topics related to Trek and the Trek universe ! Thanks ! - Chuck .

[@readhistory2023]

They have a bowling alley and the chapel bothers you? What about the pool on deck 6?

[@dubsy1026]

Hoehner Tim must have been fun when the gravity generator conked out.

[@hudsonball4702]

Star wars Episode 3 all over again.

[@dubsy1026]

Hudson Ball well more the other way around.

[@AsbestosMuffins]

Hoehner Tim or what about those cheeky tv antenna masts/ladders that climb between decks and look like an OSHA nightmare

[@chrisb6196]

Faith and science are apparently incompatible concepts for the hipster generation.

[@hartleydall167]

I'm 3 years late, you've gained many thousand subscribers, and are to popular to see a small comment like mine. But thank you. There are many lore channels but there is something about your delivery that drives me to watch more. This is that moment that happens far to little for any of us: finding a new channel and realizing how much time one could waste (enjoy, spend, donate) watching new content. You are direct and your personal opinions intercede infrequently. The way you have written specifications of detail appreciates your delivery. I may one day understand all of your jokes. Live Long and Prosper

[@LoreReloaded]

Glad you enjoy

[@GildedEntries]

There’s a lot of over thinking about what “canon” is and trying to fit square pegs of a 1960’s show’s backstory into a round hole of logical continuity. Roddenberry probably likened the 12 ships in his show bible to the number of attack carriers in the US Navy around that time; Enterprise the starship gets it’s name from what was at the time the only nuclear powered aircraft carrier in the world. In that era’s mindset a dozen powerful vessels maintain peace in the galaxy the way 12 US carriers maintained peace around the world (again, at least in that era’s mindset). For all of the praise TOS gets for being groundbreaking in its outlook, Starfleet and the Enterprise itself was quite recognizable to US viewers: Enterprise, Farragut, Constitution, The show was made to be relatable to the US audience with a Hood and a Potemkin thrown in for a very limited nod to other nation’s warships (that the US audience could probably understand). You can’t parse Kirk’s statement into saying “maybe what he meant was;” it was a damn tv show from 1967 and when they said 12 ships they meant that was it. I think David Gerrold wrote a book back in the day that specifically mentioned the official names of all existing starships per Roddenberry, there was no mention of other classes or types other than the 12. Look, it was a different time and their view of the future was quaint and naive to us. But it got the ball rolling nicely.

[@mattwho81]

that was one of the reasons for ST success, while other shows were had people flying around in rockets this had a ship. It had a bow, port and starboard, a bridge, a sickbay and engineering and a ship-to-shore shuttle. People could instantly relate to that.

[@TwistedSisterHaratiofales]

There were 14 original Constitution Class Starships. 2 had been lost in episodes before Kirk says that their are only 12 in the fleet.

[@Thane36425]

The number could also be related to the number of colonies that came together to form the United States and the Constitution. 12 ratified it more or less right away, a couple of others did within a few years. The carrier argument is interesting, but certainly they would have needed far more given the amount of space they had to patrol. However, some allies did have their own fleets which would have made up some of that need. The show probably didn't show the Constitutions working in battlegroups of other cruisers and destroyers because of the cost and difficulty at time of building and working with the models.

[@TwistedSisterHaratiofales]

That seems Logical, as only 5 models of space ships were only ever shown on TOS. Still there were 14 names and the under modelers messed up the hull numbers creating that fiasco.

[@Thane36425]

14 colonies eventually ratified the Constitution. Two of them did so a year or two after the 12 did. Some of the old technical books about the Original Series listed a few ship classes. These included scouts, destroyers, I think a cruiser class aside from the Constitution, and even a battleship class. Around the time the movies were coming out there was a tabletop starship combat game. That originally came with only a few ships statted out, but other books had many Federation ships, as well as other books for the Klingon and Romulans. It even had a system by which you could design custom ships for the game. Not sure if I still have that or not after all this time. Suffice it to say, the federation would have had more ships than just what was shown in the shows and movies. They would also have had to be in much larger numbers if only because of the long transit times.

[@bjmccann1]

The Constitution class is my favorite. Thanks for posting this.

[@danielhaire6677]

There were actually more than 12 Constitutions in service during their run. When people talk about the 12 Constitutions they are talking about the first production run of Connies - NCC-1700 to 1711.

[@SciFiFan2012]

Daniel Haire that makes sense rather than "just twelve" period. I found this from Memory Alpha, I had been trying to remember what TOS talked about concerning starships, and I remembered vaguely an article I read a long time ago. memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/The_Case_of_Jonathan_Doe_Starship The Case of Jonathan Doe Starship was an article about starship registries, published in the fanzine T-Negative #27 of April, 1973 and written by Greg Jein as a "Trekkie", long before he became an official, long-serving, Star Trek studio modelbuilder. The article had apparently been circulating among fans for some time prior to that date, as it was sent in to the magazine by several people, including Jein himself, as a response to a reader question in an earlier issue of the magazine. With most of its contents adopted and elevated into canon by the Star Trek franchise, Jein's article became one of the very few, but most influential nonetheless, pieces of "fan fiction", to be adopted by the official franchise. www.trekplace.com/article10.html (Original article by Greg Jein)

[@chrissonofpear3657]

The registries are supposedly out of order, but that was something of a personal theory by one production member. Franz Joseph did used 1700 range numbers in his Technical Manual, but then he added WAY too many in total, to about 50.

[@danielhaire6677]

I'd have to check, but over the course of their career, about 50-60 Connies sounds about right for the final end numbers of the Constitution I class. Constitution II probably had similar before they started being retired. Remember that these were the principle heavy cruiser/explorer of the Federation during its time with the sole surviving ship of the class dieing at Wolf 359.

[@chrissonofpear3657]

Depends on fleet size total, I guess. 30 also sounds reasonable.

[@SciFiFan2012]

Chris sonofPear what's funny is GR said the FZ registries and the Tech Manual were official at one time before they began to bicker about content.

[@skyborne80]

Your talent for tongue in cheek statements is uncanny! They are everywhere and I don't think there is one that I haven't chuckled at, hahaha.

[@TheDuck632]

ok two things all navy ships have chapels and Officers and nco's don't hang out

[@LoreReloaded]

In TNG religion is constantly attacked.. and Starfleet was supposed to make everyone equal..thus the light jab..I know that in real life it works that way

[@TheDuck632]

Anthony Dukes in port we do yes

[@KuraIthys]

You know, as dumb as federation bridge placement is, it's at least consistent. Plus they are borderline pacifists relatively speaking. What gets me is that klingon, romulan and Cardassian ships seem to create variations of the exact same vulerability! Where is the bridge on a bird of prey or vor'cha class? How about it's placement on a romulan warbird? It's almost like a universal rule that the command centre has to be in a vulnerable exterior location...

[@markmayfield2228]

NIIIIIGHT CREEEEWWWW!! Beer me!

[@vic5015]

Donald camp pretty unlikely a submarine would have a dedicated chapel

[@rhrpov916]

Just keep doing what you're doing. People will either love you or love to hate you (since real haters will just unsubscribe), but either way [positive or negative] you are and continue to be loved.

[@virginiahansen320]

The separate officer's and enlisted clubs or lounges are very important for good order and discipline. Being a trusted leader who other people rely on to make life and death decisions means you have to maintain a certain stature around the people you lead. You don't want to cut loose in front of the enlisted personnel, neither do the enlisted men want to cut loose in the presence of their senior bosses. It is likewise inappropriate for the officers and enlisted to hang out and become close friends, because then there is a risk of favoritism or perceived favoritism on the part of the officer toward his enlisted buddies, which may influence his judgment. Creating a space where the officers can relax without worrying about how the enlisted will perceive them and allowing the enlisted the same kind of place is extremely important to morale and good order and discipline. They're not equals and they aren't supposed to be. A military organization couldn't function well if they were.

[@lanceheaps581]

Virginia Hansen your dead on in that statement. I had a commander get relief for cause in Iraq because being friends with enlisted soldiers was her priority over maintaining good order and discipline.

[@omegaglory1]

Mixing officers and enlisted men together was attempted during the French Revolution, in the early days of the USSR and in China post 1950. They very quickly realised that not having ranks and making military decisions by commitee didn't work. It's less about privilege for the sake of privilege and more about discipline and doing things in the most professional and efficient manner possible.

[@DarthBludgeon]

Well said. The sad sorry truth is that as a military commander (and even as an NCO) you may find yourself in a position where you must order them to certain death. You can respect your personnel, you can even like them, but you must never become too attached to them. They must be, unfortunately, expendable assets. As you, yourself, are. Comes with the job, and I never envied the Officers that responsibility.

[@Krahazik]

Even in TNG where we see the bridge crew becoming friends, they still maintain a certain level of personal separation from each other and their discipline. Especially Picard. I think it gets brought up once in the show. The reason after the Borg, Picard had to go home to heal. Only in the privacy of his farm and family could he break down and show his weakness. Onboard ship, he has a certain image he must maintain to his crew.

[@SisyphusJP]

I dunno something about this channel and the content delivery I don’t like but this keeps coming up in my home screen.

[@thomaskirkness-little5809]

In a universe with defence shields, I don't think the location of the bridge is too silly. The Klingons have their bridge right at the front. Both are vulnerable to surprise attack, but in a surprise attack the command crew might be elsewhere, and they can easily head to engineering or auxiliary control to fight back. You killed the poor suckers who were on duty, should've targeted the engines.

[@generaljimmies3429]

In terms of warfare, a layout like a Battlestar would make the most sense since the most important parts(bridge, engineering, etc) would be in the deepest parts of the ship)

[@thomaskirkness-little5809]

Yes, you are correct. However, I think they are all so reliant on shields that they don't bother. I think the Dominion ships are designed with a central bridge, but I can't think of any others in Trek.

[@davidatkinson47]

Good point, except that the captain and department heads tend to stay on the bridge even during battle, even when the shields are down (seen several times), even when that place is getting wrecked (as seen in ST Nemesis). The only exception I can think of is the "battle bridge" in ST:TNG which is, you guessed it, right at the top of the battle section (faceplam). IRL, the bridge of a battleship (been to some) has an armored conning tower. Most of the bridge is unarmored, to save weight, except for the part of that tower running through it, where the captain and navigator have their battle stations. That part has a foot of steel between it and everything else. Newer warships than battleships have a CIC, which is sensibly in the middle of the ship. In short, ST is dumb about command functions.

[@thomaskirkness-little5809]

We've seen ships with their shields down destroyed in one shot, and we've seen torpedoes rip straight through the whole ship. Plot shields are the only things that really protect anyone, but since most TOS firefights are face to face and slightly downwards, the bridge was probably very secure.

[@davidatkinson47]

Yeah. Of course the writers are in charge of everything, and to your other point some of the filler detail in TWOK (right when they go to yellow alert) shows some extra protection for the bridge. I still think it's silly (in a solely practical sense, as Trek almost never shows this happening) to stay there versus one of the other 3 locations where those controls are duplicated and it's more secure.

[@warpmine1761]

Love the humor in the presentation.

[@tylerbain8873]

I personally like the longer form videos, it gives more of a deep dive into the information and more of a documentary type feeling rather than a mini break down that just glosses over the information that any subscriber to this channel would already know. I listen to these as background while I'm at work and the longer the better - if I can hit the play button have a fun video to listen to for 20+ minutes that makes me happy. :)

[@MyMomSaysImSmart]

Obviously there were vastly more than 12 (eventually). Maybe not at that moment of the episode, but the class was in use for many decades, and with the second design, they were clearly continuing to invest resources into it.

[@maxwellpauric00]

I wasnt sure at first about longer less frequent videos. But i like the format. Lots of info and great insights into the subject matter. It really shows how long you work on these.

[@adamlemus7585]

I want this go kart your are discribing Sir.

[@LoreReloaded]

It's a pretty awesome go kart.

[@benjamin4673]

Love the longer format. If that means less frequent uploads, well, so be it. Dial up the salt though. It's nice to see someone sharing my opinion. One final goodie, got my hands on a 1960's era print of Enterprise, constitution class, blue prints. There is a third Bridge at the base of the saucer section implying they might have had saucer separation fantasies back then.

[@Krooow118]

I was hoping you'd mention the bowling alley. Thank you for that

[@LoreReloaded]

I'm here for you..

[@TheDutchGhost]

I rather liked how in Star Trek New Visions "Mister Chekov" (a Star Trek photo comic) it was revealed that the "Bowling Alley" was actually a nickname for a very long corridor filled with sphere like high capacity batteries. Scotty found the nickname rather disrespectful.

[@nathanielschaede6651]

I personaly enjoy the longer videos.

[@mattwho81]

I think you can learn a lot about Constitution-class by comparing it to its successor: Excelsior. The Excelsior-class was in service for about 80 years (okay in support roles but still active) But Constitution-class was fazed out after a mere 30-40years service. There was no consideration for relegating them to support roles or less important duties. That says to me that Constitution-class was a ship of her time, built during an era of conflict and tension. The design used existing, proven technologies and may even have been rushed into service. Half the episodes revolved around something important breaking in the ship and there seem to have been repeated, major refits of the ships in an effort to keep up. Excelsior however was made in a more stable time, the design revolved around emergent and even experimental technologies, she was designed to be 'Future-proof' and the long length of her classes' service bears that out.

[@flyboymb]

The Constitutions were primarily made to be explorers. There likely wasn't a way to convert them into support roles or transports without gutting them and doing a second refit. Why make the attempt at that point when you have Mirandas and other ships already filling that role? The Excelsiors may well have been much more modular than the Constitution classes allowing them to be repurposed without a lot of time in spacedock.

[@eXcommunicate1979]

There is no canonical information to tell us when all of the Constitutions were phased out. It's possible Starfleet was still laying down Constitution keels all the way til 2300, as escorts for the big new Excelsior battlewagons.

[@flyboymb]

The writing was on the wall with the advent of the Excelsior. It was supposed to be heads and tails above the Constitution in every way. Look at the attitude guys at Starfleet Command gave to the Enterprise with 'the great experiment' berthed right beside her. When transwarp failed, there was likely some time needed to convert the Excelsior to a standard warp, drop the NX, and get hulls churning out. The Constitutions were likely kept around long enough to see this through then were decommissioned. The original Enterprise, pride of the Federation, had been relegated to a training ship. She was heavily damaged yet still functional, yet Starfleet decided to scrap her rather than effect repairs. This after she had just saved the Federation from the terror of a madman with a planet destroying weapon. The end of TUC pretty well spells this out by having the old Captain give a final farewell to the new, the old ship flying off into the sunset while the new went on to new adventures. And then we have the age of the Enterprise A. She was commissioned in 2286, meaning she was a keel-up construction rather than another refit. She was due to be retired only 7 years later in 2293. That's a VERY short lifespan for a starship. Given how long the original Enterprise served, it seems next to impossible that the A would function for less than a decade. The Stargazer was already being touted by Picard as rather rundown by 2333, 40 years after the decommissioning of the Enterprise A. She was also doing pretty much the same work as the Constitution Class. It therefore is pretty cut and dry that the Constellation Class was the replacement for the Constitution. All good things come to an end. The Big E of WWII fame was eventually sold for scrap instead of even getting the recognition of being preserved as a museum. That doesn't mean that Enterprise wasn't a great carrier or crucial to the efforts in the Pacific. But like Star Trek's Enterprise she was outclassed by newer vessels and her obsolescence resulted in her being taken out of action.

[@MrNoobed]

The staple UFP bridge dome on top explains why we always see so much bridge damage in the shows--enemies are constantly hammering that weak spot.

[@phuturephunk]

11:08 You know, thinking about it, the move, out of necessity, to projecting a big bubble actually does sort of fit better than if it followed the complex contours of the ship. I mean with stuff like electromagnetism in real life it's incredibly well...simple...to have a simple ovoid shaped electromagnetic field rather than a really really complex one.

[@briangriffin9793]

I was reminded of an episode in which they "extend the shields" to provide cover for another ship

[@flyboymb]

Likely the bubble shields require more power to sustain. The episode mentioned by Brian had the Enterprise blowing out their power system maintaining their shields at that distance. It could be that the old style deflectors were a step up from the polarized hull plating of early Earth ships in that local emitters projected a localized field right above the hull instead of some central emitter making the bubble. TWOK and TSFS showed numerous small dots lining the ship. If these represented the individual segments covered by the emitters, then it would be more akin to stronger versions of the navigational deflector than TNG shields. While this would allow more bleed through from hits (TNG still has plenty of sparks flying though), it would be easier to cover down on a small gap from a destroyed emitter than for the whole shield system to fail if the bubble producing emitter was knocked out.

[@JeffDeWitt]

I think it's got BOTH. The bubble is the main deflector system, the shields close to the hull are not only a second line of defense but also help maintain structural integrity and keep the air in if the hull gets any sort of leaks (or big holes!). It may be those secondary shields are an evolution of the earlier polizerized plating.

[@EmpyreanFrost]

Learned a few things in this one ! Cheers !

[@gregoriofeitosa1064]

First, great vid as always Second: Maybe Kirk said twelve like the Enterprise because maybe the Enterprise was a subclass from the Constitution as a whole , as beta canon suggests

[@Revkor]

or that is the inital production run of the class then they more.

[@markmayfield2228]

Years ago, I had a plastic model kit of the Constitution class. There were 12 hull numbers you could put onto it.

[@davidatkinson47]

Oh God, nerd sniped again. The Starfleet Technical manual by Franz Joseph had 14 in the original Constitution class (which would fit Kirk's 12 if one or two were lost at that point), but also a bunch of other classes of heavy cruisers, a couple of hundred ships in total IIRC. This would also fit fairly well with MSGTTE stating that the ships would be constructed at "4 per year" if the ships were produced from the 2240's through the 2280's.

[@vic5015]

Gregório Feitosa additionally, just because there MAY have only been 12 Connies does NOT in ANY way preclude Starfleet from having HUNDREDS, maybe THOUSANDS of OTHER Starships.

[@chrissonofpear3657]

Regarding Starbase 12, the entire supposed run of registries for the Constitution-class was taken from ONE scene at that base, on a chart of unnamed ships under refit. The idea that ALL of those numbers were Constitution class is a bit of a major stretch. TOS remastered still used the numbers though, whilst first generation reference books made up new ones, like Franz Joseph did.

[@KaptinnKyle]

I greatly approve of this format.

[@canisblack]

I've always believed that the Constitution saw a major construction drive between the end of the original series and the events of The Motion Picture and continued to be built up until shortly before Star Trek VI when the Excelsior-class had proven itself and began to be built in quantity to replace the Constitution class as the new backbone of the Fleet. Oh, the slushie machine was Kelvin-timeline only. The higher warp speeds were explicitly the results of aliens with higher tech levels. Sufficient to handwave the excessive speeds and lack of damage as explicitly part of the alien tech's function. The only time I recall the stun setting used on the Ship's Phasers was during orbit to surface bombardment. It's likely that we never saw that used in TNG because orbital bombardment is in direct contravention to their "enlightened society" and it's peaceful ways.

[@flyboymb]

You'd think that a way to non-lethally take out large groups of people on a planetside would be at the forefront of TNG's tactics.

[@canisblack]

You would, wouldn't you. But TNG was somewhat...stupid about a lot of stuff, especially in the early seasons. I could honestly have seen it coming back in DS9, but we only ever saw destructive planetary bombardments in that show.

[@2bituser569]

canisblack yea like Riker saying combat is a small province of a starship Captain’s duty so why prepare by doing drills. Smh. Reason so much stupidity was there because of Roddenberry dreamworld.

[@canisblack]

TOS and the TOS era movies didn't have Rodenberry in creative control. It's why Starfleet there was much more militaristic. When talking about Trek you do have to keep in mind that there are three distinct eras: TOS through Motion Picture. Star Trek II through Star Trek VI and TNG. There's some overlap in these eras, but for the most part they are very different in terms of how Starfleet is approached and portrayed. TOS I think is the most balanced. Starfleet is a combined defensive and exploratory arm. They're keenly aware that the galaxy is neither nice nor safe, but they're still determined to go out and explore peacefully...if they can. TOS Movies (2-6) has a much more militaristic Starfleet which, given the way the Klingons are saber rattling, makes sense. Finally you have TNG where Rodenberry went fully commie ham with no one to reign him in. DS9 and Voyager are both set in the TNG-era and show it. Even in the Dominion War-arc I still recall the "Starfleet isn't a military" rhetoric being alluded to if not stated outright.

[@a.morphous66]

When was there a slushie machine?

[@jacenstarheart6256]

Excellent Research and Delivery Lore Reloaded, Enjoyed! 👍👍

[@LoreReloaded]

glad you enjoyed

[@trr94001]

The fleet sizes mentioned in Trek are consistently improbably low. An entity the size of the Federation should be operating thousands, even tens of thousands of major ships at a time to police its territory.

[@flyboymb]

How many carriers does the US Navy operate? Those are the centerpieces of their organization, yet their numbers are dwarfed by the destroyers, cruisers, and submarines that do most of the work beyond saber rattling. Similarly, the Constitutions could easily be the face of the Federation exploration but there could be thousands upon thousands of ships used for patrol, transport, and other tasks milling throughout Federation space.

[@kyle857]

flyboymb The Enterprise was the heavy cruiser of its day. Not the carrier.

[@flyboymb]

The function of the ship is not the point, the strategic limitations on the number of those ships is. If the carrier is the most powerful ship in the world right now, why not make all navies nothing but carriers? Logistics and money aside, it is because the carrier is way too much ship to use for a solo patrol of the Caribbean and if you park one in the Persian Gulf, it will cause a lot more stink than a frigate or destroyer. Similarly, you're not going to put a Constitution on a patrol run of trade routes that haven't been hit by Orions in 3 years. And if you put one on the border of the Neutral Zone, you can expect that the Romulans would increase their force by at least an equal amount and the situation is that much more tense. It therefore makes sense to have a large number of smaller ships to do the small work and stand guard while you have relatively few capital ships to do the heavy lifting and carry the large sticks. This also allows you to have a larger and more robust fleet. If the resources, crew, and construction time to create a Constitution could be used to make 2 Saladins, you now have the ability to be in 2 places at once and the enemy destroys a ship, you have a 2nd still flying. Even if a Saladin was just heavily damaged, it would likely take less time to repair than a Constitution resulting in an overall stronger fleet during a war. It's the same reason the Death Star was a horrible idea for the Empire. No matter how powerful a ship is, the risk of having all your eggs in one basket just isn't worth it.

[@DaiAtlus79]

They did, as the retcon of Disco shows, along with NAR and other older ships.

[@derpimusmaximus8815]

@@kyle857 You'll notice that outside of the Star Fleet Universe game series, there are no carriers, or X-Wing or Viper analogues in Star Trek. At the moment, when the US government wants to swing it's dick around, it sends a carrier group. When Star Fleet needs to show it's swinging dick(in TOS era, anyway), that's when the Constitution class rocks up in a system. It's about escalation. The only way to up the stakes when you've deployed a full carrier group is to deploy another. Same thing with Enterprise.

[@BlindSide61]

My dad had a starfleet technical manual from the TOS Era. It actually listed every Constitution class. there were 12 other Connies just like the Enterprise, yes, but they did indeed keep building them with upgrades. there were 145 of them total.

[@earlallison]

If it helps, Warp One, regardless of era, is the speed of light IIRC. So the Constitution's full impulse would be 80% of the speed of light.

[@TwinPeaksIndustries]

IIRC, impulse drive can achieve very high sublight speeds, up to near lightspeed, but is capped at 25% lightspeed to avoid relativistic effects

[@earlallison]

Thanks for the info!

[@InquisitorMatthewAshcraft]

See my post concerning the speed factor.

[@sakisaotome6753]

Just to help those who just don't feel like looking it up. The speed of light which as stated above is warp 1 is often estimated to be about 300,000,000 meters per second. Or To be specific 299,792,458 meters per second. This translates into 186,000 miles per second. ( It also travels 173 air per day or 1 foot per nanosecond. ) So going warp 0.8 would be about 240,000 km/s or 148,000 mi/s

[@Ninjajp247]

No. Warp factor 1 is about 1 1/2 to 2 times the speed of light. Depends on your engine.

[@garywillig5143]

I wish you had talked more about the major Constitution refit that was used in the TOS movies. That's my favorite ship in Star Trek. Maybe in another video.

[@deusexaethera]

4:51 -- "...and other stations such as the gelato machine..." LMAO

[@allnamesaretakenful]

I love how exasperated you become when discussing the mistakes in Star Trek. Keep it coming please.

[@LoreReloaded]

Mistakes and inconsistencies are my bain!

[@bradwolf07]

Gelato machines? Sign me up and give me that nice red shirt ;)

[@awsomewe360]

Did Gene Roddenberry make the Command colours red in TNG and Voyager just to symbolize the captains in the newer age probably never would have survived back in the TOS era?

[@bradwolf07]

We360 that is a good question. I hadn't considered that

[@nobodyimportant2470]

No. It is because they realized that the red shirts had the highest % of survivors. Outside the main cast who had plot armor that made them immortal, red shirts had the best odds of surviving and gold had the worst.

[@joshuarichardson6529]

Gold shirts represent command, including piloting and navigation. Blue shirts are for science officer. This includes medics, who are technically biological-scientists. Red shirts are engineering. This included security, as they had to be familiar with demolitions. It also included communications, which is why Uhura wore red. BTW: Since the Gelato machine would need regular maintenance, the person running it would in fact be a red-shirt.

[@abrr2000]

I really like the lore implications of prelude to Axanar. It actually explains a lot. I.e. The Constitution class ships are built in a hurry to fulfill a role in a life or death war. There's no time to make the plumbing neat and tidy. Under the described conditions you're going to put it wherever there is room. This would make proper repairs to the 1st wave of constitution class ships a nightmare. Resulting in the need to run constant patchwork jobs just to keep it working. as mentioned in "Trials and Tribble-ations". This also tallies with the "there's only 12 ships like the enterprise" as it would be reasonable to assume that all ships after the initial build run are redesigned internally, now they know how to make it work. It even explains the refit. If everything is intertwined. When it comes to replacing vital systems the only solution is going to be to gut the whole thing and rebuild it all. Only now it's tidy, and smaller and oh look at all that empty space we have left over...

[@Gigas0101]

I liked the Connie because it feels far more believable than the Galaxy class despite doing a lot of similar things. It tried to meet the needs of a crew who would be away from their homes for five years, give or take a few months based on the need for redshirt replenishment. It was meant to serve as a frontline battleship, part of why I'm pissed at Axanar getting Axed, and also worked as a platform for testing new technology. Though it DID need more bowling alleys. Based on the "only twelve like the enterprise" line, I think that meant that there were many constitutions but only a dozen, possibly thirteen, had the same configuration, mission plan or track record as the Enterprise itself. Maybe the enterprise was one of twelve ships taking part in the iconic five year mission of exploration, or a dozen ships, including the enterprise, were rolled out at roughly the same time with the same technological innovations. Maybe only a select twelve or thirteen ships came with those bowling alleys. Kirk saved Lucifer from Salem, Massachusetts by winning a wizard's duel, Picard displaced Chakotay's parents and is quaintly racist. Wanna score a million likes? Review the Magic of Megas-Tu.

[@MotoroidARFC]

Gigas0101 or maybe the number mentioned is the active ones while the other Constitutions are in reserve, just literally parked with caretaker crews all across the Federation because "don't want to look war like with all these advanced, heavily armed ships running about".

[@ebay242628]

I don't really see any way there could only be twelve unless they were somehow difficult to construct compared to others. The fleet could've been comprised of many easier to build and crew ships and the Connie's were more resource intensive or demanded too high a crew complement. In some ways the Connie was almost as much a failure as the Galaxy Class would later be considering they destroyed or lost at least 4 during the TOS run. I know off the top of my head the Constellation, Intrepid, Exeter, and Defiant were lost during those three years. That's 1/3 of all the Connie's. Another was implied to be lost in The Ultimate Computer but I interpreted that one as just being severely damaged but salvageable.

[@TJ347]

The Connie seems more believable than the Galaxy class... I'm so taken aback by that statement I don't even know where to start. No. Just... no.

[@MotoroidARFC]

TJ347 maybe referencing the bringing the families with children situation.

[@ebay242628]

4 Connies lost in 3 years is faster than they went through Galaxy Class ships.

[@PlatinumDragon2003]

There were three aspects of the Constitution class that you did not mention in your breakdown of this particular Federation vessel. Allow me to elaborate. 1. The Galaxy class was not the first Federation starship to have a battle bridge. Should there be a catastrophic failure of both shielding and structural integrity on the bridge (deck 1), there was an auxiliary bridge located just fore of the impulse engines on deck 5. This would later be called the "battle bridge" in TNG. This brings me to my second point. 2. The Constitution class starships were designed to have the saucer section separate from the secondary hull by using shape charges at the base of the saucer support structure, often referred to as the "neck" of the ship. The purpose of this was to turn the entire saucer section into a life raft should the fail-safes in the secondary hull result in a core breach. The saucer section was designed to make a controlled landing on a planetary surface and maintain subspace communications for rescue operations. It needs to be noted that the saucer section, on it's own, is only capable of sublight speeds as most of the components that make warp speeds capable are in, or on, the secondary hull. 3. The main deflectors maintained safety parameters for the ship during normal operations. However, there were secondary deflectors running around the saucer section that did not come online unless the saucer separated from the secondary hull. The same can be said of a secondary shield array that was designed solely to protect the saucer from disintegrating upon entry into a planet's atmosphere. They were not designed to prevent damage from battle.

[@aperson22222]

Honestly, I find the longer form . . . a bit too much. By the end I was having information overload. Could just be my lack of familiarity with the technical aspects of Trek ships; I used to know a lot more many years ago, but in-depth knowledge of made-up technology is definitely use-it-or-lose-it.

[@Daveyk021]

Good video. It made my bowel movement go much smoother and quicker! Thanks.

[@LoreReloaded]

I'm here for you

[@barrybend7189]

Considering the chapel even our large ships had chapels in them.

[@brianhuss9184]

Just FYI, speaking as an old Soldier, the Enlisted and Non-Commissioned Officers do NOT want to be around the Officers all the time. ;-) As for Constitution Class Cruisers, in Canon from TOS I recall seeing Constellation (destroyed), Defiant (destroyed), and Lexington, Potemkin, Excalibur and Hood, the last four of which engaged in war games with the Enterprise. TOS ships could also detect, lock on, engage and destroy ships while the shooter is traveling faster than light, and the target can be either faster or slower than light.

[@hypeninja4786]

You ought to know that even in the US military, in most cases, the Commissioned officers have a separate mess from the non-commissioned personnel

[@chrisbingley]

Depends on the ship. The US Ohio class and British Vanquish class have a Ward Room for the officers and two mess decks; one for the senior ratings (Petty Officer and above) and one for the junior ratings. Generally, only smaller vessels will have a Ward Room and one mess deck. I've never been on the floating cities that Americans use as aircraft carriers, but I imagine they have even more mess decks (I heard rumours that they have McDonalds and a Wal-Mart), and possibly multiple Ward Rooms segregated by rank.

[@DarthBludgeon]

I remember that as one of the perks of serving on Alert status when I was in SAC... the chow hall had to be up to Officer's standards... the food was so good the Wing Commander usually had breakfast there. :D

[@TheTurnipKing]

It can be assumed that Kirk was correct about the Constituion Class at the time he uttered the line Production on the class seemed to be winding down by the movies though: They were talking about mothballing Enterprise, though they might simply have been referring to those specific ship frames, and more modern redesigns of the Constitution class might have remained in production. STO made the class widely available and with a very robust selection of era components meaning you could have a very Next-Gen era looking Constition Class (though by then it is considered a Light Cruiser. rather than the Heavy Cruiser designation of it's forebears)

[@Notarobot562]

Lol the title alone really grabbed me. Also why did Because Science get to use Star Trek footage but you cannot?

[@LoreReloaded]

Couple of reasons, they could be willing to fight CBS when I'm not currently in a position to. They could also have a special status through a network that bypasses the content ID system

[@skyborne80]

18:12 Sometimes the "same" ship would have various compliments of shuttles too! Apparently the Enterprise had zero when Sulu and some crewmen were freezing to death in the episode, "The Enemy Within" =P

[@Becka_Harper]

I always felt that the show writers put the line in about 12 Connie's because it reflected the limited number of battleships, and later carriers fielded by the US Navy; there were never very many at a given time, thus they were/are extremely prestigious to command or serve on. But that being a reasoning for there only ever being 12 is so much horse shit. The fact that we see them multiple times 80+ years after the TOS era...no way in hell those are all sightings of what must've been a TINY number of survivors of the 12. Still, TWofK version is my second favourite Trek vessel (the Archer Class is just delicious); and I'd give good money to see that format of ship on screen again. No more USS Apple Store please.

[@SciFiFan2012]

Amanda Harper I know we see Excelsior class ships a LOT in NG, but with a hazy "could be" a Constitution class ship at Wolfe 359, when do we see any Connie's? IDR any.

[@Becka_Harper]

I have a vague memory of seeing one in Sacrifice of Angels, but I could be mistaken.

[@chrissonofpear3657]

Ex Astris Scientia shows seperate saucer and secondary hull wreckage at Wolf 359 in screencaps. Would be to the left of the image shown on the video. DS9 showed kitbashed designs, including a Constitution saucer and neck connected to two close together nacelles.

[@SciFiFan2012]

Chris sonofPear an article on EAS about Wolfe 359 claims the Constitution class ship debris is from the studio model from The Search for Spock. www.ex-astris-scientia.org/articles/wolf359.htm (Way down the page under "Status of Identification")

[@flyboymb]

It could be that long range ships like the Constitution just weren't overly necessary in a resource rich institution like the Federation. You have your warships on the border of the Neutral Zone and various support fleets centered around major planets. Not every heavy cruiser has to be able to take on a 5 year mission to go out into uncharted space with minimal support. Perhaps the Constitutions were Starfleet's first steps into making massive jumps in space exploration and so not many of them were made?

[@iancarpenter441]

The TOS Constitution is the most beautiful Star Trek design ever!!!

[@pokepress]

I refuse to serve on any starship that doesn’t have a gelato machine. 😉

[@Jack_Stafford]

I am a new subscriber after hearing about your channel from Captain Foley! Congratulations on getting your channel back and I feel fortunate because now I have been pointed to a Channel with a lot of videos I plan to watch! The long-form Geek breakdowns look fascinating, as was this shorter video about constitution-class ships. And I'm a big fan of Adam ruins everything so keep doing what you're doing! LOL I look forward to spending lots of time looking, liking, and sharing! :)

[@LoreReloaded]

glad you enjoyed and welcome!

[@NimhLabs]

Today on Adam Ruins Star Trek: Lore Reloaded xD I love it! =D

[@mastercaon5209]

You are kind of the Adam ruins everything of trek, but you make enough good points to keep watching. Don't stop man.

[@KertaDrake]

It would be so in line with pre-Dominion war Starfleet's only one ship allowed in range of Earth policy if the reason that the Wolf 359 fleet was steamrolled was because of them literally emptying fleet museams and literally sending out the 1701-A to the battle! Someone should do a frame-by-frame to see if any of the smaller bits of debris was the Phoenix or NX-01!

[@LoreReloaded]

I know Ex Astris broke it down - but to that detail, i don't know..

[@wedgeantillies66]

Agree with you on that point, about that episode not being the one where we see the most constitution class sips on screen as it memory serves in TOS, that honour goes to episode the Ultimate Computer, where we see five of them,the USS. Enterprise, Hood, Lexington, Excalibur and Potemkin.

[@LoreReloaded]

agreed

[@hudsonball4702]

The reason why their is a chapel is because the show was aired in the 60s when Christianity was a higher priority in peoples' lives than they sadly are today. There would have been a massive uproar had they tried to have a secular marriage on the ship.

[@russellharrell2747]

Hudson Ball the chapel is on the ship because even 250 years in the future religion exists. I’m sure even some alien ambassadors occasionally use the chapel for their own religious needs. Of course Klingons have no need for a chapel since they killed their God’s long ago. Earth’s gods ended up all being aliens themselves (even ‘God’ himself in the fifth movie) so the Klingons may have literally killed their gods in the distant past.

[@CaesiusX]

Well, when it comes to the Constitution class, either TOS or movie versions, I can't get enough of watching it in action. So, I really like the picture in picture, while you went over the specs.

[@hershman1956]

Oh, my son, I should educate you. I am a long time hard core ST fanatic. Also, BTW, a measurement scientist in real life. I can point out things that your assumptions are correct, and some where you are mistaken.

[@LoreReloaded]

Oh thank god, I thought this whole shebang was going to burn to the ground.. thank god you've come to educate me - being the natural idiot that i am.

[@hershman1956]

Not an idiot, only some mistakes. For example, based on the Star Fleet Technical Manual from the 1970s, there are three appropriations of Constitution Class Starships. Appropriations 2 and 3 had more than 13 each. There are a few others, but understand, we all have mistakes.

[@LoreReloaded]

The Technical manual, unfortunately, is not considered canon - though i would like to get that back in its original form - because i think it has some great insight.

[@EvilHomer1973]

Scotty used the ships phasers to stun Krakos men on "A Piece of the Action". There were like 20 or so guys outside the building and Scotty stunned the whole block.

[@JustanOlGuy]

Gelato! I prefer Frozen Custard.

[@europademon]

Ardy Head got custard? Souix did.

[@tdog999100]

Honestly i think a second turbo lift would be a good idea, you could have anywhere between 8-12 people on the bridge at any one time so in case of emergencies when the bridge needs to be evacuated i doubt you would be able to fit everyone in to 1 tiny lift

[@stevenjones2673]

I like your snarky asides. They are full of love.

[@Press_START360]

The constitution class was really versatile, equipped to deal with a lot of stuff, they didn’t just cut production of the constitution class at 12 ships, maybe he was referring that at that time there were 12 ships in the fleet, and the shipyards were getting ready to produce more

[@ThatsMrPencilneck2U]

I like how you poke fun at "canon." When they created the original series (TOS),, they just made it up as they went along, and then all sorts of different directors and show runners started putting their fingers in the pie. Star Trek doesn't make sense, so anybody that wants future productions to stay true to "canon" are mistaken. This is in no way meant to excuse STD or the other crap JJ Abrams is responsible for. I believe the time restriction preventing CBS from create its own ST series has expired; however, Abrams licenses do not expire until 10 years after his last abomination hits the big screen. This means that if CBS has to worry about another competing ST until 2026, and worse, Abrams can extend that indefinitely should he, God forbid, make more films. Why CBS is encouraging Bad Robot to make their pitiful productions is beyond my reckoning. For all we know CBS has a team slowly working up a new world class science fiction canon to recreate a new ST, in the 2020's, just a fantastic and fresh as TOS was in the 1960's. Then again, they may be trying to figure out how to dumb down Abrams Trek, as if that's really possible.

[@Krahazik]

Yes. Considering that at one point during the first season of TOS, 'Dilithium' was the 'fuel' for the ship but that later evolved and changed as they figured out how the engines were supposed to work. At best I think we can assume that the powerplant, wasn't a separate reactor as we see in other iterations, but an integral part of the ship structure at that point.

[@44WarmocK77]

The reason for the contoured shields in the TOS and the movies set in that era can be found on page 14 of "Mr. Scott's guide through the Enterprise" from 1987. The ship used an experimental shielding system we would see again a few decades later in Voyager's "Endgame" finale, the ablative generator (sort of). According to the book, the shield consisted of a transparent diburnium-osmium alloy mounted on a transparent aluminium matrix, which was then replicated and projected onto the outer hull with a small gap between the hull itself and the armor. Both A, B and C deck were protected by an additional bubble-like energy field. So much for the ablative generator being an invention from the 25th century, Janeway probably just found it in Starfleet's archive collecting dust and pimped it a little bit.

[@andrewwblanchard6037]

the CAPTAINS personal TOUPEE shop on deck 11

[@ancientflames6679]

Love the longer form. You're doing great Lore.

[@rueceless7580]

I'm assuming beta canon is where the theory for none of the Constitution class ships outside the enterprise surviving the 5 year mission? Not sure I buy that theory either -yeah we lost a few over TOS but the fate of two of throes ships is quite...up in the air (one was wrecked but could have possibly been restored to working order and the other could have been cleared of the virus and again used). In fact the Intrepid and Constellation is the only two we know was destroyed really. Agreed though there was clearly more Connies made after these 12-seems like a waste not to make more as time went on given they were superior to the D7.

[@arklestudios]

It was my understanding that the Enterprise and the Lexington were the only ones of the original Constitution-class line to make it back to Earth under their own power, while all the others were either destroyed, or crippled beyond repair (or lost, in the case of the Defiant). Hence why future ships with both names got letter designations with the old registry numbers instead of new registry numbers.

[@rueceless7580]

Brian Webber Yeah but im curious where that was mentioned in alpha canon though.

[@dubsy1026]

I'm pretty sure the A is supposed to be the Yorktown, but renamed. The thing is, between TOS and the late TMP era, we see only Mirandas and Oberths. This leads me to believe that Starfleet dropped the heavy cruiser concept for a while in favour of Mirandas. Either that, or they kept making more Connies. They certainly didn't do another design.

[@arklestudios]

I think it was in the Star Trek Encyclopedia, a licensed book that the Okudas worked on with Paramount's approval, but I lost my copy when I last moved.

[@arklestudios]

The Yorktown thing was Gene's idea for that, but Shatner ignored it for Star Trek V. :/ I think we all know how well THAT turned out. I'm not usually one to hold Gene's ideas as sacrosanct, as my occasional clashes with Discovery haters shows, but that doesn't mean I never stand up for the man's ideas. Especially the ones that aren't stupid.

[@rtherria]

In skin vs bubble shields: 2 different kinds of shields that maybe used simultaneously. Deflector shields are close to the surface of the ship and navigation/force shields are bubble shields. They are even projected by different tech. In the deflector version, they reinforce the hull and armor . . . something akin to the polarizing affect given on the Enterprise show.

[@ojisanhoward8940]

WOOOOO!

[@LoreReloaded]

YAYAYAYAY

[@rjonboy7608]

I thought that there were 12 Constitution class starships. The flagships. There were other classes. I know a lot of this has been retconned, but "back in the day" the Enterprise was a force to be reckoned with. It was assumed there were varying sizes of patrol ships and classes that had been but still functioned. Most were well able to defend themselves. And several kinds of scientific and engineering oriented vessels. And, yes, originally Enterprise could maintain "Time Warp Factor Six". Then it was upgraded for Kirk's 5 year mission and could hold Warp 7. After Mr. Scott played with it awhile it could make Warp 8 for short bursts.

[@CaptainGeronimo]

I still dont get where engineering is, where is warp core and so on.. Because when you look at the specs, what we see as engineering in TOS is in front od impuls engines Too late, you are Adam of Star Trek lore 😁 Love the longer vidio style, I would love to become Patreon bit I still cant :/

[@LoreReloaded]

glad to have you back ;) And no big deal man, just glad we can interact and such

[@chrissonofpear3657]

Originally, the engineering room was supposed to be at the back of the saucer, but the episode 'Day of the Dove' implied it was in the middle of lower hull.

[@davidatkinson47]

"Engineering" is in both places, according to the FJ plans and MSGTTE. The original set was implied to be near the impulse engine, but that was changed later during The Original Series because Gene wanted those functions to be more below deck. It makes sense to me that there would be two rooms anyway, one near each engine. The "intermix tube" in TMP through TSFS runs vertically from the dome on the impulse engine all the way down through the secondary hull (implied to nearly the bottom, where the fuel is also implied to be) and horizontally straight back from there at the top of the secondary hull to where it breaks off into the pylons and presumably to the warp engines, this is visible in TMP and TWOK, and you can infer exactly that's at the top of the secondary hull by the curvature of the ceiling. Quite a beautiful set. In ST VI they used the set from TNG, so that's a bit fuzzier for the Enterprise-A. Through most of the secondary hull-ish? Maybe? no plans were given.

[@timhens1674]

The "Warp Core" was a next generation creation. A stupid one in opinion. Now it's the catch all, eject the warp core.

[@davidatkinson47]

Incorrect. It is explicitly visible in ST TMP, a decade before. Again in ST:TWOK, using the same sets but a few years later. Interestingly, "warp core breach!" and "eject the warp core" hadn't happened in either movie. In both cases there were enough (writer unbreeched) fail safes that neither seemed to even be an idea. Instead of exploding the ship, Scotty turned off the warp engines. Twice in TWOK. "Warp core" problems where they couldn't do something like, I don't know, turn off the engine, or in extreme cases, physically cut off the one-millionth-of-a-second-of-fuel-in-the-engine are too much for the thousand or so people on board..."FIve minutes 'till a warp core breach, nothing I can do!" *(ST-Generations) Of course, there is eject the antimatter. Explicitly available option, per the ST:TNG technical manual. Nor was ejecting the core entirely (which would include the remaining antimatter fuel of the ship). So, it becomes "I can eject this whole motherfucker in a second and a half, but somehow I can't, but you've got five minutes or so ish to contemplate your lives and my incompetence with no explanation!" Yeah, call MST3K on it if you want, except that I thought that very thing WHEN I FIRST SAW IT IN THE THEATRE. AS GEORDI WAY SAYING IT And, for the writers, I can think of half a dozen ways to accomplish the same result without that kind of stupidity. It struck the same nerve in me that the rocket boots to deck ninety-fucktheplans had in ST-V.But I digress. No, do not credit TNG with the one vaguely interesting tech idea that you think they might have had. It was way earlier. And very much more well considered. I have very similar problems with speed II. Is there someone with an engineering degree out there? or (not to diminish engineering degrees) experience as a mechanic? or (not to diminish experience) any knowledge of how engines work AT ALL?!?! I"m an IT guy, Give me a wrench and a minute and I'll stop the fuck out of your engine, computer controlled or not. There are many with this superpower, and I would suggest that those in charge of said engine could do the same.... see what I'm saying?

[@JAGtheTrekkieGEMINI1701]

Nice one! 23rd century has the BEST starfleet!

[@GeneralPadron]

What is wrong with having a chapel? Psalm 19.

[@LoreReloaded]

Quoting the bible isnt relevant.. I dont have an issue with it.. the writers of tng do..which I was highlighting.

[@carlnesbit6767]

The top reason TOS is my favorite Star Trek.

[@bird718]

i agree, they had 12 constitution class ships during the first year of the enterprises 5 year voyage. as we seen during the years they had other ships being built in space dock on multiple occasions and many times the enterprises as replaced almost immediately after they get destroyed. those ship yards are always producing something and who knows how many they got. the federation is always strip mining new member planets and making sure they got something they can contribute before being allowed to join.

[@ozziemederos]

There is hood Yorktown Lexington Essex excalibur enterprise Defenit

[@chrissonofpear3657]

All the ships listed on TOS besides the Antares, Valiant and Carolina basically. The Republic and the Eagle do not have to be of the same class though, being unseen.

[@flyboymb]

Don't forget the Constellation, Intrepid, and Potemkin!

[@BloomerMindset]

The officer's lounge seems like an obvious thing to have. It has to do with fraternization. Having a dedicated space where higher ranking crew members can relax, vent, and discuss in unofficial capacities is important for the crew. This also helps prevent the crew from seeing their superiors' doubts and frustration. Basically helps to keep the officers image as stoic as possible.

[@richardscathouse]

With all those mini skirts I'd assume fraternization was rampant! Yet no sexual assault complaints! Truly humans had evolved! 😁😁😁

[@absolutebs3360]

6 forward torp. tubes? On a Connie?.. WTF are you smoking? Im gonna assume my hearing is fucked. Nice vid!

[@MatthewCaunsfield]

Kirk lists them off in one episode; tubes 1, 3 & 5 then 2, 4, 6.

[@ericreese7792]

The number was clearly modeled on submarine torpedo tube counts.

[@chrissonofpear3657]

Supposedly 4 on the upper saucer and two on the lower. the Defiant had an aft tube also.

[@Justicar333]

As I remember my stats, the Connie had 4 forward facing tubes, not 6. As well as either 4 or 6 phaser banks. I think each two nozzles counted as one bank.

[@thetreblerebel]

Usually in military environment. Officers and enlisted are separate because of the chain of command as all enlisted are to follow the officers orders. Fraternization is frowned upon because it breaks down the the chain of command. And that's why there's a spot for officers only.

[@Pekingesejedi]

Why do you find it so hard to believe that the ship had a chapel? Are you another one of these SJW God haters who think that in the future of Star Trek technology will become our God and we forget the God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob?

[@bleirdo_dude]

Theists are cognitive crack addicts via the *Holy Dopamine Ghost* and a living testimony to it's power (evolutionary treadmill).

[@goaway152]

He doesn't even understand how Shields work so what do you expect

[@goaway152]

@@bleirdo_dude says the guy with a literal puppet as his Avatar

[@tag1462]

I miss that old ship. But to clear up something, in TOS they had both deflectors and shields which would explain the bubble effect you spoke of. And would perfect sense. The deflector screen would be a bubble that protects the ship against most things, but those shields would be needed to stop what does get through. Sad thing is, that the ships had no armor plating and no structural hull integrity. You could tear that ship to pieces easily.

[@Kenny4AG]

This guy sounds so displeased with star trek

[@LoreReloaded]

Well might want to do more research before you make yourself look silly

[@Kenny4AG]

@@LoreReloaded research what exactly, its a statement about your tone in this video

[@LoreReloaded]

@@Kenny4AG my videos

[@barthoaj2323]

I like the long form, welcome back.

[@dylanlewis3038]

Enterprise was the only ship of the original 12 Constitutions to survive their 5 year mission. That is why the Enterprise ship patch became the Starfleet logo. I think that several Constitutions were built from scratch to the Refit configuration, after Enterprise was refit. One of these ships was the Yorktown, which was rechristened Enterprise-A.

[@That80sGuy1972]

Great video. This also opened up the observation "Constitution class, now the most underrated starship class." Constitution class ships can theoretically be used far better than the TNG's Oberth class ones with very little refits. Well, I'm sure you are about to correct me on this. As for the shields, I was a player in some Star Trek role-playing games. I pointed out the different shield levels, the bubble, and the hull. The bubble is for relatively easy deflection and lets hard-hitting energy hits through. It was best for standard energy point defense and torpedo hits (torpedos stopped by it explode too far away to do any worse). The shielding on the hull works in combination with the Structural Integrity Field to give a far better shield with less used power. The shield operator can make judgment calls on the application in defense against each weapon, but the computer usually makes the best call if not overridden by the one operating the shields. Also, the bubble shield automatically deploys against surprise debris that isn't moved away by the front-facing deflector dish. Oh, and the easy-target bridge... it was explained to me that it was there for practical reasons. Also, with the way the shields and structural integrity fields were worked, it is supposed to look like and not really be a smart target to kill the ship. It takes less energy to take a ship apart via weapons power than to kill the bridge in a directed attack. The only real reason to take out the bridge is to kill the command crew, disable it and leave most of the ship intact while you board it and rid it of its Starfleet vermin. Then again, you are probably about to correct me because this is stuff relive to the Star Trek role-playing game I was a player in. Now you have gone and done it... I'm subscribing to your channel. ;)

[@LoreReloaded]

I think we don't see mass production of the constitution out of a respect for it honestly..

[@That80sGuy1972]

Fair enough. ;)

[@TwistedSisterHaratiofales]

The Shuttle compliment was 8. They always used Galileo 7 as the prop, but there was suppose to be Galileo 1 through 8, with room on the deck below the hanger bay being accessed with the turntable deck that could be lowered to that deck with hydraulics.

[@climhazzard115]

The Constitution class makes me nostalgic for StarFleet Command 2, though I mostly played the Excelsior class.

[@climhazzard115]

Also, in reply to your last question, I prefer longer videos since I often watch youtube when I'm at work and I don't like changing videos all the time.

[@timothyrichard8241]

I enjoy the longer formats - I wouldn't go too much longer though. Also, have you considered switching the screens sometimes where the videos are taking place? My eyes are always drawn to the small video in the corner.

[@Venti470]

Constitution Refit was the best. Beautiful design.