Stoic Secrets to Letting Go (ft. Ryan Holiday)

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There’s an ancient philosophy that could actually help you give fewer f*cks, and unless you’ve been living under a rock, you’ve probably heard of it.
Stoicism has been helping people manage their stress and anxiety for thousands of years and today, it’s more relevant than ever.
@ryanholiday is the New York Times Bestselling author of multiple books on Stoicism. He believes that Stoicism is the framework that can help you be a normal person in an increasingly crazy world.
Today’s episode dives into the life-altering benefits of following a philosophy that encourages you to focus on what you can control, and fuck the rest.
00:00:00 Introduction
00:02:01 What does Ryan give too many fucks about?
00:04:24 What's so appealing about Stoicism?
00:05:50 When and why Ryan pivoted to writing about Stoicism
00:09:22 How Ryan's relationship to Stoicism has changed over the years
00:12:53 What does Ryan give too few fucks about?
00:14:14 Balance and optimization in life
00:20:52 Saying "no" to more opportunities
00:25:21 Spending time with family vs working on your career
00:27:58 What do most people give too many fucks about?
00:29:57 Following the scripts and narratives you were raised with
00:34:50 The demands of the modern nuclear family
00:38:50 What do most people give too few fucks about?
00:45:29 What should we do about people who have given up on the social order?
00:47:33 The evolution of civil rights
Ryan's websites:
dailystoic.com/
ryanholiday.net/
Ryan’s new book:
Right Thing, Right Now: Good Values. Good Character. Good Deeds.
www.amazon.com/Right-Thing-No...
All of Ryan’s books:
www.amazon.com/stores/Ryan-Ho...
My stuff:
/ markmanson
/ iammarkmanson
/ markmansonnet
/ markmanson
/ iammarkmanson

[@gamerguy5749]

OMGGGGGG MY TWO IDOLS IN THE SAME FRAME 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭

[@weebler]

Right!? I saw the two names and thought no way.

[@michaelbateson8636]

Let's fucking gooooo!!!!

[@the_ab101]

really man love them both ❤

[@arbaizac11]

Bro Forreal! I saw this & said my fn heads gonna explode! 🤯😅Let’s fn go!

[@bhand5952]

Same🥹

[@weebler]

Ryan got me into stoicism with The Obstacle Is The Way and changed my life. I’m now a stoic. (Not a sage, just a student)

[@tuckerbugeater]

cope

[@anonymerdude4501]

@@tuckerbugeater Cope from what?

[@carte0000blanche]

@@anonymerdude4501 don't debate children :)

[@israelhigueras4119]

You are not a stoic. Maybe a student of stoicism. Read Epictetus and you will know why he didn’t call himself a stoic. Instead he named students of philosophy “prokopton”. Seneca neither call himself a stoic. He called himself “proficiens”. Marcus Aurelius never called himself a stoic. Why would you?

[@israelhigueras4119]

Don’t believe any of these “modern stoics”. They spread self-help “stoicism”, which, in fact, is not stoicism.

[@MTXCPL]

The two most influencial people in my twenties right now doing a podcast together. This is like christmas and easter on the same day

[@jordanlouie_]

I’ve been reading the daily stoic everyday this year. The timing of this collab couldn’t be more perfect.

[@PHDiaz-vv7yo]

I’ve got his daily mediations. Bite size daily code to life

[@TheChannelofOrange]

You should interview Alain de Botton. His School of Life is what got me into Stoicism before Holiday

[@RJINSIGHT]

Yessssssas pleaasseee

[@stevenbrady440]

He's fabulous. You're right.

[@ulyssesdoroja2973]

I used to watch the School of Life until I realized how hollow the videos are and how morally and intellectually bankrupt Alain de Botton is (oversimplifying complex philosophical topics and making it relatable for the general public all so he could sell exorbitant merch). Not sure if it's still up but Coffeezilla made a video all about it.

[@RachelledelaRosa]

@@ulyssesdoroja2973always felt that way about his content

[@EcomCarl]

Fascinating discussion on the relevance of stoicism in our hyper-connected world. It's impressive how they weave personal vulnerabilities into lessons that resonate widely, reminding us of the power of ancient wisdom in modern times. 🧠

[@TheSinlessAssassin]

This is a loooong awaited crossover between you two. Reading Subtle Art years ago and then getting into Stoicism recently, I was like "why do these ideas sound so familiar?"

[@MartinsBaklansJr.]

However… Mark has preciously clarified that he isnt stoic

[@boyacki]

As a young man facing the genesis of my greatest trials and challenges in my early 30s, I am eternally grateful for the two of you who have made harrowing and life changing material. I believe I have the tools to handle these effectively and set me on a conscious journey to being the man I want to be and thanks to your efforts. All material has raised me on every level without fail or exception so please, please keep up the great work! 🙏🙏

[@brianpso]

It's good that you're facing your life head on but let's get one thing straight, you're in your 30s, you're past being called a young man, you're a fully grown adult. That's coming from a man in his early 30s himself.

[@TheStoicNinja]

Everyday mark uploads is a good day

[@deeprollingriver52]

I found that my stoic ability to not give one fluck helped me shut down my narcissistic brother once and for all.

[@James_36]

I have one of those, any key tips?

[@JackieDaytona1776]

​@@James_36lol the fact that he has to post a comment like this suggests he still has some growth in the subject matter. I dont know you or your brother, but starting with forgiveness is usually a good place.

[@James_36]

@@JackieDaytona1776 I was meaning in terms of practicality

[@jhnokayu6077]

I read The Subtle Art of Not Giving a F*ck and read about Stoicism and after that I read Ego is the Enemy by Ryan Holiday and got me into stoicism. Two legends

[@goasu151]

Thank you both! For your ideas and no BS. Have really helped out this Military Veteran.

[@hithere3684]

Both GREAT AUTHORS BOTH I HAVE TO THANK SO MUCH!!! Ryan brings the ancient words of life Mark doesn’t sugar coat anything!! THANK YOU BOTH!!!

[@MegaBabygal1]

I absolutely love Mark's laugh 🥹. It's just so WHOLESOME and HEARTY and sounds like how a good workout feels! 💯😍

[@ArtByHazel]

Thank you. This is so spot on and the split is happening as we speak. Carry on butterflies. 🦋 Gotta love and bless the caterpillars. It’s time to love them from a distance. Infinite blessings everyone. 🩷✨⚡️🍀

[@clarencerswann1360]

Great show, and I find you both incredibly admirable. Thank you for your works

[@KeeshKush]

The episode I didn't know I wanted until I saw it!! thanks for this!

[@henmat3000]

This is the greatest anime crossover of all time.

[@Jbridge621]

My brother totally used weaponized incompetence to get my mom to do his laundry 😂😂 Yeah, the West Point grad can’t run a washing machine. To be fair he would happily put up barb wire fences all day but somehow laundry was a bridge too far😂😂

[@spiderlilytn]

Mark and Ryan together, best day ever!!!

[@pippaboyd88]

Currently reading the obstacle is the way but have lived as a stoic since covid really and discovering seneca and marcus aurelius. Great way to view life

[@Sunn_3o6o9o_o]

POSTING AGAIN!? So frikin happy you're posting this regularly!

[@cathrinne94]

Thaaaaaank you, you legends!

[@mariolongtin8271]

I manifested this with my last comment 😅 Thank you both for doing this!

[@suekennedy4716]

I noticed the more news, FB and sometimes you tube ( not your feed) I read per day, the more I get depressed, maybe less of these things is best!!

[@ka9202]

I think that's it! Letting go is so key!

[@systemofadown945]

Excellent video guys

[@producedbypodcast]

My favourite two together. Dream episode!

[@gomezjp]

Haven't watched it , yet. Happy just to see those legends together. Seeing it later!

[@SuperDavensuziyoutub]

Was your chat a competition for who could say "like" more times in each sentence like? Your way of speaking IS in your control.👌

[@nymphette175]

One of my favorite mentors said “saying yes to something means saying no to something else”

[@tamarkimmons3417]

Superb stuff ❤

[@micjval1]

This was a great episode 😊

[@Jigolpets]

Thank you 🥰🌸

[@user-xt2zy3kd9o]

Love this episode

[@user-zt6pq5kb9z]

Excellent podcast, thanks. I took a lot away from it.

[@ninglight4433]

Totally entertaining. Two intelligent people, chatting with each other and as it is normal in chatting, making wrong claims based on wrong assumptions. E.g. in former times parents spend less time with their kids (farmers working with their kids spend a lot of time with their kids), opoid crisis is a global concern (the concern is a US thing), civil war was about values (it started over taxes and was about economic resources) etc.

[@ricklubbers1526]

Cant wait for this one!

[@MattSheils]

You two have transcended to Jedi status. There is no going back, just embrace it. Thank You, Thank You for championing the mental tools that help the rest of us deal and excel in this crazy, modern life.

[@crazigrl85]

This was a good one

[@sheetalyadav4563]

ego is the enemy is one of my favourite books of all time.

[@thegamingrelish9272]

I think setting goals or having a purpose is so important. It’s the people who go for their dreams and don’t give in to the challenges they face. It’s creating a dream and bringing it into reality. The people that are the best at something are the best because they had a goal and they didn’t take their eye of it. They might look delusional to some people and they might look inspirational to others but that’s just their perspective of you. Having expectations can keep you motivated to achieving your goals after all if you don’t have any expectations at all that clearly you don’t know enough about your goal or care about it enough. Now this doesn’t mean you spend 24/7 of your living life only thinking about this goal because naturally we have other needs in our lives that we need to have as well plus you have to consider that failure is possible. If a goal doesn’t work out and you know 100% it’s not achievable then find another goal that resonates with you. The world used to be built by dreamers and goal seekers it’s why America is the country it is now or Australia or china or any other country for that matter. People had a goal, they had a dream, and somewhat had expectations of the vision they wanted for their goals. For example if a kid tells his dad “hey dad, I’m going to be the best soccer player in the world and I’m going to make lots of money ”. A kid with a goal, a kid with expectations. Do you think the kid is delusional? No way he is, because who’s to say it’s not possible because? the number one soccers players today are at the top because they had pursued those goals and not just sat back and had the mindset of “ I’ll just see how it goes I don’t expect much from this“

[@wezichilanga]

Learning a lot here, Watching from Zambia🇿🇲 African.

[@B-HolePatrol]

We are happy to report that you’ve been promoted to first general of the B Hole Patrol. Thank you for your service, Mark.

[@ethan-scott]

Always a great collab! 💪🏻 The Stoics and the Buddhists unite.

[@oogrooq]

David Lee Roth was an EMT, not a paramedic. But he did partially inspire me to become an EMT.

[@reynazane5900]

I have never heard of Ryan before, but I was excited to learn more about stoicism based on the title. I might've missed something, but I don't think you actually talked about "Stoic secrets to letting go".

[@maxhuneeus7211]

They did though. The section about how Ryan decided to stay at home was the "secret". There isn't some magic trick that allows you to let go, you can only know what is important to you, and prioritize it.

[@reynazane5900]

@@maxhuneeus7211 I totally didn't understand that that part is supposed to be a "secret". Again, I don't know much about stoicism, so I couldn't connect the dots, it seemed to me more like a personal talk about Ryan than the ideology. Might be wrong.

[@maxhuneeus7211]

@@reynazane5900 It is a personal talk about Ryan, but it does have some fundamentals of stoicism in there somewhere. I think the 'secret' is mostly clickbait.

[@vanshkundu07]

The Collab we wanted

[@Naratifan]

good podcast !!!

[@joequinal]

Love both of you guys. Both my faves 💪🔥💪🔥💪

[@Banditxam4]

NGL I was waiting for this

[@moinali828]

Didn't see this collab coming

[@matthewsteele8448]

Augustus Caesar died a broken man because he cared so much toward the end. Losing those Legions in Germany broke him, but he was still the greatest Roman Emperor and arguably the greatest leader of all time.

[@crispomwangi6297]

Smart stuff

[@thesilentu]

The intro 4 the win.🎉

[@arbaizac11]

So fn the excited for This episode

[@arbaizac11]

I just listened to these two this morning too

[@jonathanm9700]

Damm Mark Rogan, really cranking out the ads

[@Isagi__000]

Haha in tim ferris podcast, you said, I tried to do podcast with Ryan but it came as boring so I thought podcast is not for me. And now here it is haha. When I listened to the podcast I was like "we listen whatever you tell mark, pls do that podcast".i commented that msg too in one of your videos (when you didn't started podcasting) . Now I am happy. Hehe

[@anonymerdude4501]

Letting go is the key to almost everything! I highly recommend to read Letting Go by David Hawkings and The untethered Soul by Michael A. Singer. Lifechanging stuff!

[@endyethan9910]

Better help, does not replace real therapy, they got sued in the past because they were advertising themselves as replacement therapy but in terms and conditions said they do not hire qualified therapists and do not replace real therapy. This was a few years ago I don't know if better help has changed, but be cautious.

[@trainerswash9904]

The collab we wanted

[@whitenbald]

I hope this comment reaches people who need to hear it (like I did a few years ago). I have a problem with the use of "shouldn't" in the statements: "you shouldn't care about what other people think of you" and "you shouldn't care about things outside of your control". Edit: ironically and unsurprisingly, like Mark's arguments with his wife, I think this comes down to your own definition of "should"! It is human nature, and a clear consequence of evolution, to care at least a tiny bit about these things. Instead, saying something like "should try to care less about" is more appropriate. It's a subtle difference, but it's something I beat myself up for all the time. This kind of self-talk "argh why do I care so much about what other people think of me. I *shouldn't* think like that" creates a conflict and a restlessness in the mind, that in my experience leads to anxiety and stress. I agree that what someone else thinks about you in this time period is very often inconsequential, but this is so recent in human evolution. Basically what I'm saying is that I agree that caring about what other people think of us is pointless, but we do it naturally and fighting against it too much can cause more harm than good.

[@djordje16]

when he said he would be considered an asshole if his goal was to sell millions of books, how would that make him one ?

[@youcandoit1369]

Good question. The idea is that he intentionally sets low expectations to manage outcomes that aren’t entirely in all in your own control. So without ever being on the NY Best Selling books, making that your goal with no prior evidence makes it so outlandish that only someone full of themselves would make that statement.

[@PersonalNotPrivate-rl8dv]

He seemed to be attempting to have inferred that many people who see other people making claims like that arrive at that conclusion or at least similar conclusions about their motivational factors. I suspect it may be one and to be fair, only one of the reasons why he focused on generalized concerns over what other people think about other people and how that may likely effects their perceptions and opinions about whether they match or exposed other people's expectations regardless of whether they agreed to so, but especially if they did not.

[@estherrayos]

That’s funny ~ “weaponized incompetence lmao this is hilarious but righteous epic wording

[@ianbaileymusic]

My favorite aspect of stoicism is the theme of living virtuously, with a strong code of ethics. For example, if you have a sponsor that deliberately lied about its use of sensitive user data, then admitted no wrongdoing and continued to lie/misrepresent the situation in their FTC response, the ethical decision would be to cut ties with the company, even if it means that you would make slightly less money.

[@alinerdelav]

i dont know, sometimes also saying no to everything... ive been living the opposite a lot. Also sometimes you cant asked for less if the current income is not enough. :(

[@AndrewThoesen]

Phenomenal collaboration, can’t wait to get through it

[@Chris_Oliver]

Lets get deeper and darker in the mining to find the cave with all preciositys that we need.

[@tuckerdrez]

Ryanus Holidayus!!

[@karlamsterdam983]

please talk more about finance

[@themacocko6311]

I thought this was going to be about stoicism? This was about Ryan.

[@sindreandersen9114]

Excited!

[@mana_station]

This was awesome and maybe i missed something but i feel like yall didnt talk enough about stoicism and what the title of this video says

[@Brandon-os3qr]

My favorite part of this is how many times Ryan tries to refer to the "fCks to give" phrase and mis-phrases it every time. So endearing heh

[@mariolongtin8271]

To Ryan's point of choosing your battles - mine currently is with Gary Vaynerchuck, the manipulation king of NFTs, and why this is so concerning is because he's the founder of a children's brand - teaching them how to scam - its horrible for society and justice needs to be served, a lot of investors are seeking refunds.

[@Canooboy]

Mark „yeah 👁️👁️, yeah, yeah, yes, yeah“ 15:30

[@cienciabit]

Your diction is really good, very important for non English language natives. You could teach Elon Musk. 😂

[@Rejuvism]

Was just thinking the same thing! I want to learn how to speak like these guys

[@istolongg9434]

Lols. Holiday and Manson in one video

[@crazigrl85]

Yes it’s too crazy and confusing out here

[@ChessSniper]

I like that this video touched on some politics. Although I hate that everything has become a political issue, some topics cannot be discussed effectively without understanding history and discussing politics/policy.

[@jwetzel3141]

When Ryan came out strong for Biden (very unstoic) he put himself in the same category as Robert Kiyoski. Just saying stuff for money. If any of it helps, it’s by accident.

[@JDBarker2]

That’s a lot of commercials

[@ericdraven3654]

That is the way podcasting is taking: more ads than content.

[@samspencer5279]

Get KZbin premium or just listen to the audio on a podcast app

[@sliderfonia]

It's not as obscure as you make it sound like. It is being taught in high schools all the time.

[@davebrooks452]

BJ Novak interview!

[@darrengagliardi1540]

The opioid problem probably has more to do with a lack of proven solutions. Many of the purported “solutions” are knee jerk political actions that are more about posturing than about getting real results by attacking the root of the problem. It’s tricky because in our culture it’s not even allowed to propose particular types of solutions. For instance, to demand more responsibility of addicts is not PC. It is seen as heartless and victim blaming. I don’t know where the answer lies, but it seems detrimental to limit any and all potential solutions to one ideological or philosophical approach. Furthermore, real solutions probably require digging into family dynamics and community values that are either too complex to address or, again, perhaps out of step with prevailing political inclinations. Sadly, the end result seems to be stagnant defaulting to just throwing money at programs that attack the symptom and which are proven to not work very well.

[@Elgringo2180]

No it’s not. That is just not owning up to one’s flaws. Pointing the finger is easy

[@Big_E_247]

A more modern version of stoicism is probably the famous psychologist Albert Ellis... 🤔

[@Wisdom_007]

I am 14 and I feel like shit. I have been going to the gym for one year now. I have been trying to improve myself through meditation, journaling etc. I am just sick of not seeing any results. I don't have any kind of purposeful work yet. I am confused whether self-improvement would actually make me successful. The daily grind does not feel good as you don't experience the results. You just don't feel like you're improving. How do I cure this?

[@ericdraven3654]

It takes time. Keep going. Look for help, someone Who can guide you.

[@aarondavis3907]

a lot of commercials for an hour long convo.

[@ethan.wroblewski]

🔥🔥

[@billsmith6543]

What's with the edit cuts while Ryan is talking, or is it just the playback?

[@dre7256]

Holy fucking legendary crossover

[@Alex.Winchester]

Isn’t that every ancient philosophy?

[@yamsm5823]

I clicked so hard on this one holy shit what a great talk

[@RajHidesHere]

At 3:50 - Projection

[@G_volve]

The crossover we didn't expected

[@leeprince2396]

The only people in this world that don’t care about what other people think are psychopaths and sociopaths and even sociopaths find ways to care.

[@tresleches3]

Ryan Holiday has the sunken in eyes and jawline of a vampire.

[@snoosnoo6381]

Mark please get Brene Brown!

[@hypnotechno]

mark says he never had a job. ever. it's difficult to connect with what he says as he's never experienced that

[@Zer_O._Juan]

❤