I love me some Mary Wilson so much she's so quiet and humble yet classy that's what I love about her❤❤❤❤ she's so incredible
@ShaylaShay-gg8ks8 ай бұрын
Thank you for uploading this wonderful video please upload videos of Mary Wilson and Florence Ballard ❤❤❤
@ClearYourMindTravel5 жыл бұрын
Mary was always the prettiest.
@storiking6502 жыл бұрын
YES MA'AM, she was such a STUNNING BEAUTY at each & every stage of her life!!!!
@ShaylaShay-gg8ks8 ай бұрын
She's so humble an incredibly gorgeous❤
@ShaylaShay-gg8ks8 ай бұрын
I love Mary Wilson so much she's so quiet and humble yet classy that's what I love about her❤❤❤❤ she's so incredible
@johnstirret50215 жыл бұрын
Mary is wonderful and does not have a diva attitude, She was very down to earth. I have had the privilege of seeing her a few times solo.
@michaeljamesleslie5 жыл бұрын
Mary is still gloriously beautiful...
@buzzcut1015 жыл бұрын
Michael James Leslie Black Don’t Crack! She is still gorgeous.
@JudgeJulieLit5 жыл бұрын
@@buzzcut101 From more melatonin. far less sun damage. But see closeups of Cosby's face.
@fostermac71705 жыл бұрын
@@JudgeJulieLit Melanin, not melatonin. As black folks, it's the main physical difference maker. Know thyself.
@cindymckee56495 жыл бұрын
Michael James Leslie yes ms wilson looks younger than me
@JudgeJulieLit5 жыл бұрын
@@fostermac7170 Yes "melanin," thank you. Melatonin secretions from the pituitary gland in all races do extend life and youth, as skin resiliency from sunburn damage, by reducing free radical damage. Those born with more melanin have more ability to withstand solar radiation, but not unlimited invulnerability. More melanin also causes dark eyes and hair, and perhaps more responsivity to immediate environments. Please cite studies that this pigment causes other main physical differences.
@jkwhite21645 жыл бұрын
This is Black Royalty History Black Pop Culture..Thank you for posting this.
@georgemusic4all4seasons5 жыл бұрын
Why does everything have to have race or color. Huge fan of the Supremes and Mary Wilson and they are royalty in the music world and pure pop genius and history. God bless them all
@juniebe45 жыл бұрын
Cudahy 1960 Because They Were Black Girls At That Time.. Crossover..
@skip0318903 жыл бұрын
@@juniebe4 They're black today. Why does everything they did have to be labelled "black" now in the 21st century?
@imadeyoureadthis15003 жыл бұрын
@@skip031890 because what we are talking about was the 60s, when things like civil rights movement was happening.
@storiking6502 жыл бұрын
@@skip031890 He or she is probably noting that she & the Supremes were "Black" whatever he or she said, bcuz in as much as they broke records musically & knocked the Beatles out of their #1 stranglehold with their smash back to back to back to back hits & throughout those few short years that they were the Supremes & Diana Ross and the Supremes, in their accomplishments, they were inadvertently tearing down walls for Black artists to come. Prior to them, it wasn't always expected to see 3 Black singers be so regal & gorgeous in their beautiful gowns, w/the over the top extravagant hairstyles, the long lashes, the long nails & them achieving their dreams, ultimately shattering the glass ceiling that existed for Black major artists at that time & that's why Gordy was so largely successful w/his record label, who didn't want to be just the sound of just young Black or White America, but of ALLLLLLLLLL of America & now fast-forward 60+ years from their original start as thee adolescent & teen Primettes, they are not just musical icons to us, they are civil rights leaders as well & I firmly believe that. God bless you🙏🏾.
@hamishcummings17285 жыл бұрын
Mary is still beautiful and gorgeous she gives the best interview
@ccth224 жыл бұрын
Very true and I find her to be open about Motown’s past. Her book was fascinating...
@Bananadiva15 жыл бұрын
One of the things I love about Mary is that she's so natural. There is nothing false about her. Her voice, her stage presence and her charisma just flows from her so easily. What a soul legend.
@kellygreen55562 жыл бұрын
While I love and miss her too- I don't know why she ( or her ghost writer) wrote in her last book that The Supremes wore FAUX fur. They wore REAL fur! And looked great! Perhaps either Mary or her helpers thought it might be controversial to tell the truth on this now. I don't know. The Chicken I had for dinner last night was real and so is the mink I have in the closet. I do what Mae West once did when asked if it is real: " It's all real dear " as I rub my hands over my body!
@davidrosemale35733 жыл бұрын
Mary Wilson, articulate, beautiful and smart. She's a #1 STUNNER.
@janbriggs73595 жыл бұрын
Miss Mary Wilson remains ," The Heart and Soul of MOTOWN". and she. holds my heart..Love you Miss Wilson....My favorite **Supreme**
@olympiabakingdiva97025 жыл бұрын
Still beautiful. I love the supremes songs
@bryanedney27234 жыл бұрын
YES INDEED. A friend of mine has been her background singer for YEARS. It's true! I've seen her UP CLOSE. She's Gorgeous!
@direfranchement5 жыл бұрын
Interviewer: "Can you talk about the night at the Copacabana?" Mary: "Which night, we were there for two weeks!"
@tillmandavid94485 жыл бұрын
She checked DAFUQ outta that interviewer!
@reneehicks46295 жыл бұрын
direfranchement the interviewer clearly didn’t do her homework and you can see that Mary is clearly not having it!!
@sixtiesfreak48585 жыл бұрын
They were at the Copa in 1965, 1966, 1967, 1968 and 1969! You'd think it was only one engagement listening to this.
@xfiler-gl7nc5 жыл бұрын
tillman david she acted as if they had committed a crime at the copa and the interviewer had the receipts😂.
@andrewthornhill70424 жыл бұрын
direfranchement And they appeared there in 1965, 1966 and 1967....
@mrob755 жыл бұрын
I think that Mary was the "Down to Earth" Supreme....Love all of her insight.
@loveyu27785 жыл бұрын
Mary was the peaceful quiet loyal to the end one..
@dancerdon91755 жыл бұрын
Still have my original vinyl album "Supremes at the Copa" recorded August 1965 and released 11-1-65. Ms. Wilson is spot on!
@mrob755 жыл бұрын
@@dancerdon9175 Hey, Dancer Don...Agree 100% that Mary is "spot on"...I think that this whole LP marked the true success (with a bitter / sweet tone) of the Supremes. Here they were, fairly new, but an oh, so hot African-American group and sharing a venue with the likes of: Nat King Cole, Sammy Davis Jr. Ella Fitzgerald, etal Although proud and overwhelmed at the honor at performing at The Copa, Florence Ballard for many years detested the "boater hat" / standards songs direction the group had taken. Moreover, she was so hurt and angered to have the solo song "People' taken away from her and instead awarded to Diane. Sadly, just two years later from their Copa days, Florence Ballard would be removed from the Supremes.
@dancerdon91755 жыл бұрын
@@mrob75 Making it at the The Copa, then, was the pinnacle -- the apex -- of making it into mainstream acceptance. As Mary said, they were "diamonds in the rough". Still so relatively new to the industry, the Copa engagement of '65 was a giant leap into the Supremes' personal color barrier of top shelf nightclubs and venues. Just like you mentioned, Mario, Nat King Cole, Sammy Davis Jr., Ella Fitzgerald, Harry Belafonte, et. al., received top bookings, but were often not permitted to stay at hotels they performed at. Rather, they'd perform in one cabaret but were forced to take a room elsewhere. Belafonte broke this racial descriminatory practice by refusing to perform unless granted the right to stay at the hotel at which he was performing. Though personally a forever Ross fan, Florence, with angst, took a backseat to Ross (I see you used the correct "Diane") and the Gordy machine. Great insight Mario!
@mrob755 жыл бұрын
@@dancerdon9175 likewise, Don, on the insight...You really brought out the racial tension of the times by reminding us about the color barriers and the "no vacancy" sign on hotels. Sadly, fast forward about 55 years, and we still find ourselves with a long, long way to go. Good to see you away from our playground. :---)
@eliortegajr97102 жыл бұрын
When I first met here..she struck me as a very friendly and nice lady. She and I talked for about a minute and she was kind enough to also give me her autograph after her show. She did a great show. RIP
@marcomitch72033 жыл бұрын
Yes Ms Mary Wilson With The High Note!!
@thomaslombardo34015 жыл бұрын
Mary Wilson was the heart of the Supremes. She looks great.
@milesclarke65923 жыл бұрын
She was so beautiful resting heaven beautiful
@charlierobinson34105 жыл бұрын
Respect to Miss Wilson a survivor.!( of that interviewer)
@nativenuyorker79533 жыл бұрын
Rest in Paradise Ms. Mary Wilson
@johncacciotti49805 жыл бұрын
She is still STUNNING!
@hunkhk Жыл бұрын
Her star will always shine - may she RIP - gone too soon
@waynebrasler5 жыл бұрын
Still absolutely beautiful, still keenly intelligent, still totally classy, bless her.
@pjay59644 жыл бұрын
Mary and Flo were THE BEST!!! ❤💕💗💕❤💗❤💕
@mjc55093 жыл бұрын
RIP MARY AND FLORENCE
@lawrencehielscher1685 жыл бұрын
I always loved. Mary. Wilson. Still just. Drop. Dead gorgeous I've been a fan for 50 yrs would love to see them again. Nobody can ever replace all these. Group pure talent. One more. Concert for all the. Fans I've seen them at least. 15 times still love them. Miss. Aretha. Pls pls one more concert. Love you. Larry nj
@SomeoneHasToSayIt25255 жыл бұрын
Great interview. Mary is so open and honest.
@s.rhockenhull11685 жыл бұрын
LOVE this Supreme Lady. Happy Black History month Supreme Ambassador, Mary Wilson. Supremely Beautiful.
@shirleypoplo33414 жыл бұрын
Beautiful lady really love hearing her talk about the supremes!!!
@reggiecarter71675 жыл бұрын
I love Mary! I can listen to these stories all day!! ❤️
@theronedawson32365 жыл бұрын
As always a very good interview. I learned some more details that I didn't know.
@doriswilliams64223 жыл бұрын
Classy beautiful lady RIP Mary
@rayvincente5 жыл бұрын
Mary did a wonderful interview! The interviewer herself seems a bit unsure of herself but Mary did well.
@jonsa2705 жыл бұрын
I'm not usually a fan of Mary's, but this interview is one of the best I've ever seen with her...absolutely loved it....I was totally engrossed in the way she told the story.....
@Dion_Mustard5 жыл бұрын
she's amazing and very down to earth . a true legend :)
@TONEBHURT5 жыл бұрын
Magnificent memories 💟
@mmwins39005 жыл бұрын
I love that she calls Diana Ross Diane
@JudgeJulieLit5 жыл бұрын
@Judy Gaines "Diana" elevated her to the status of the Greek goddess of the moon, night and hunt.
@kurtsupreme4 жыл бұрын
@@JudgeJulieLit ................and Mary brings Diane's status back down to Earth!!!!!!!!!!! Are you aware that Mary and Diane were kids together in the projects of Detroit? They probably had to share the same bed on the road and sewed their own costumes together. Do you really think that Mary sees Diane as the "Greek Goddess of the moon, night, and hunt??????????" Get real!!!!!!!!!!! Mary probably still sees Diane as some kid on the next court of the Brewster Projects!!!!!!!!!!
@opheliumzone46714 жыл бұрын
@@JudgeJulieLit 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣👍
@MsTexas733 жыл бұрын
@MM Wins Yes. Ms. Wilson always referred to Ms. Ross as “Diane” because that was her name (although her birth certificate said Diana). Friends and family called her Diane. BUT Ms. Wilson was also THAT Sis who would graciously check anyone thinking they were familiar enough to refer to Ms. Ross as “Diane”, when in fact they were not. ❤️🖤💚💫✨✊🏽💪🏽
@ceeceetracey98392 жыл бұрын
That's her name. Diane. That's what they called her from day one so for her to spring "my real name is diana" on them during an interview had to be crazy. A lot of her ways were underhanded and sneaky so they didn't go over well.
@DetroitLives3135 жыл бұрын
She is great. I am looking forward to her upcoming book.
@Danlovar5 жыл бұрын
What book?
@DetroitLives3135 жыл бұрын
@the unreal player Her new, upcoming coffee table book, "Supreme Glamor".
@jonsa2705 жыл бұрын
@@DetroitLives313 I see you had a hand in writing her book for her *again!*
@roberta.lofgrenjr.91825 жыл бұрын
@@jonsa270 HE DID.
@imadeyoureadthis15003 жыл бұрын
😢😢😢
@dtrn2545 жыл бұрын
Mary just said it. Motown knew the Supremes were going to take them 'there'. Diana was the voice and essence of the Supremes' image. This is an important fact when understanding the success of Motown commercially. This is also one of the reasons Berry adores Diana till this day, she opened doors for him.
@dtrn2545 жыл бұрын
@@williammatthews7252 I'mma ask you a straight up question and I want you to be honest: Have you ever heard Flo actually sing? Be honest....be reaaaaal honest. And I am not talking about Effie or Flo's back up work. I mean have you heard her sing solo? so let's say you've heard her solo album after the Supremes. There is no way in your wildest Motown dreams that Flo's voice was somehow a more interesting voice than Diana's. Motown had plenty of soulful female singers....but NONE like Diana's. You have to accept this....But that said, I do believe Flo had something all her own that could have been developed if she had been able to work out her internal issues....she definitely had opportunities many singers NEVER get.....but I believe if Flo had lived longer and recovered fully she would have found her niche own recording and stage identity OUTSIDE OF MOTOWN. I also trust she would have been loved for her unique artistry. But Diana Ross is not responsible for Flo's death, she loved Flo and Flo loved her. BELIEVE THAT..... Also, Diana has been away from the Supremes for nearly 50 years.
@juniebe45 жыл бұрын
William Matthews Diana Ross Voice The Pop Sound (White America Sound) And Too Whites Were Buying Records More Than Blacks.. Florence Was A Soul Singer.. She Would Have Rock The R&B Stations.. During That Time They Were Just Majority Of The Stations Were Playing White Music.. If A Black Artist Sang A Song That White People Like.. It Went To Top.. For Us We Were Open To Listen To Florence On The Radio.. Holland Dozier Holland Wanted To Have Mary And Florence Record Lead Songs.. Because They Also Wanted To Reach The Soul Station With Them Singing Songs.. African Americans No Longer Cared For The Supremes After Flo Left.. The Muscle Was Pulled Out.. When The Supremes Regrouped In The 70’s African Americans Were Loving Them.. The Sound Of Soul Was Back.. To Prove A Point.. You May Have. A Pop Lead Singer.. With A Soulful Background.. Example.. Elvis Used The Blossoms and The Sweet Inspirations.. Johnny Rivers Used The Blossoms.. Check Out A Bunch Of Your Pop Singers And Who Back Them Up!!!
@williammatthews72525 жыл бұрын
@@juniebe4 I AGREE TOTALLY, THATS WHAT I WAS TRYING TO SAY ABOUT FLO VS DIANA, BERRY GORDY WASN'T TRYING TO GO THAT ROUE AFTER THE FLOP RECORDS THEY WERE MAKING AT FIRST UNTIL DIANA TOOK OVER THE AS LEAD SINGER.
@juniebe45 жыл бұрын
William Matthews And A Lot Of The Early Flops Diana Sung Lead... The Supremes Were Great Singers.. They Maneuver Their Voices Well.. All Three Of Them..
@dtrn2545 жыл бұрын
@@thomasstafford7313 not sure what you mean. When Mary is speaking about the Supremes' here I hear her reference their heyday. One has to include Diana Ross during this reflection right? The same would be true if she references The Supremes and later incarnations, it's only fair to consider the girls who composed each group, right? But listen I'm not against Mary.... I just didn't agree with the books and the way she behaved publicly later on with her childhood friend (Diana)...in fact I've seen her perform and I enjoyed her and always thought Mary was a hell of a Supreme.... Fully dedicated and a unique contributor to the original group. I think Mary is also coming around to the notion she could have handled things differently in the public. Just my positive thoughts.
@lesleycarpenter90665 жыл бұрын
This was amazing! Straight from the originators mouth!
@DetroitLives3135 жыл бұрын
This is one beautiful woman!
@Dion_Mustard5 жыл бұрын
LOVE her x
@terrionwright3565 жыл бұрын
And she can dance to. Especially the way she swings.
@DetroitLives3135 жыл бұрын
@Terrion Wright I agree. I always thought Mary was the best dancer in the group.
@youtubeadministrator41875 жыл бұрын
Mary you all looked so beautiful and I love you all.
@Dion_Mustard4 жыл бұрын
Love these stories by the absolutely genuine and gorgeous Mary Wilson. The same cannot be said for Ms 'me me me' Ross unfortunately!
@cravendubose81792 жыл бұрын
Mrs.Ross is who Mary Wilson wanted to be.
@Dion_Mustard2 жыл бұрын
@@cravendubose8179 no incorrect..mary wanted recognition and friendship from diane ross..anyone who wants to be diana ross needs their head examining!
@DRock69065 жыл бұрын
Love all of the Supremes songs!!!
@loveyu27785 жыл бұрын
Love YU Mary...❤
@MARCIE12ification3 жыл бұрын
RIP MARY ❤️❤️❤️❤️
@patriciaperry-malone33115 жыл бұрын
Beautiful Mary
@REDD_BLITZ5 жыл бұрын
A true music survivor.
@Dion_Mustard5 жыл бұрын
A rock n roll legend
@davehart20943 жыл бұрын
R.I.P MS. WILSON
@nicolabrooks17953 жыл бұрын
Rip Mary
@pbamse3 жыл бұрын
MARY WILSON (1944 - 2021)
@babak64093 жыл бұрын
Queen cleared that up showed the cultural return to our self esteem
@jacquelineferguson65984 жыл бұрын
Thank God they invited Diane, because the world got 2 watch her evolved into Diana Ross, a true determined star that is still burning in spite off,,,
@sashineb.21145 жыл бұрын
Does anyone know more about the time she was signing with Carolyn Franklin? Thanks.
@Ineedpeace2153 жыл бұрын
Its really difficult for me to enjoy these stories. Yes, their experience could have been the greatest times in their lives becoming stars but, the story relating to Florence Ballard makes me sad, not just for her but the entire group. Motown should have had a counselor for these young people that they clearly took advantage of.
@yeracmitchell99715 жыл бұрын
Mary is wonderful
@earlgoodlett7593 Жыл бұрын
great interview
@pastcineo2 жыл бұрын
it's amazing to hear herstory.
@sheilapalmer2243 жыл бұрын
I miss her
@longbranch112075 жыл бұрын
Lmao Mary is sassy and I love it
@patriciagoh52 жыл бұрын
Mary was not only the prettiest but had the best voice. Diana Ross played her cards right, hooked up with Barry had a daughter with him hence became the front singer. He made her a star and that's the truth. Barry Gordy had the power and that's Hollywood!
@abdurobinson68275 жыл бұрын
It's amazing how if u ask Diana Ross about her time with Supremes she acts as if she wants to forget those years. At least Mary will give u intimate details. And she's entertaining.
@jeromeelstonscott37944 жыл бұрын
To be fair I think professionally the Supremes are the highlight of Mary’s career and legacy and is rightfully, her moment to be out front. Diana Ross has been put in a difficult position. Clearly they have two different memories of the time as would any lead singer (Michael Jackson/ Paul McCartney/John Lennon etc). She had different aspirations and a different work ethic(which clearly worked for her and her emotional stability: I.e.: look at those kids) It seems in the last few years especially, she has let Mary talk, doesn’t defend, debate or disagree and has moved on.
@AntonioSantos-gv9xi4 жыл бұрын
That's all Mary has!
@ceeceetracey98392 жыл бұрын
People try to act like Mary is dishing dirt. Shit. Mary is the only one who will talk!!! Florence CANT talk and diane ain't gonna tell the truth. You ever hear her give those bullshit, empty responses when someone does ask her about the Supremes??
@ceeceetracey98392 жыл бұрын
@@jeromeelstonscott3794 I openly don't like diana ross. Not gonn beat around the bush. But I can respect what you are saying and there may be some truth there. But is it wise to think you won't have to talk about being a part of one of the most iconic, trailblazing African American vocal groups of all time?? That's just not reality.
@Dion_Mustard5 жыл бұрын
BEAUTIFUL WOMAN
@ENDTIMEsVideoLibrary5 жыл бұрын
Doesn't seem like she cares too much for the Quirky Interviewer.. If you're gonna interview someone as famous and experienced as Miss Wilson.. by ALL MEANS get AN INTERESTING INTERVIEWER who KNOWS HOW TO RELATE TO THE ARTIST.. Nuff said..
@Elmaestrodemusica5 жыл бұрын
And Mary always gives credit where credit it due ....
@jamescarter86995 жыл бұрын
Wish I could contact her/ Mary their is a girl in Richmond Va. Monic S. That has the perfect voice to sing the old Supremes tunes and the look to go with it. And the right age range with forever youthful looks like Mary.A Perfect fit.
@hiltonbailey96714 жыл бұрын
I think diana voice did made the group sound different.
@STUNNA-KALEB4 жыл бұрын
Worse. Her voice was terrible when it was nasally. It was way better when she sang normal.
@morganwhite2176 Жыл бұрын
She should only talk for herself, not say ‘we hated them’, as that may wrongly sum up the voice of others. Thought after her tell all book she’d be finished telling all by now 🤷🏾♀️
@NathanAHogan5 жыл бұрын
Is the interviewer talking about the Copa live album of 65 or before Flo left in 67???
@SupremesVideos5 жыл бұрын
1965
@manuelcampuzano5585 жыл бұрын
I think when Mary's talking about the Supremes at the Copa LP she's talking about the first, then later BG took "People" away from Flo was 67 so she's talking about both
@andrewthornhill70423 жыл бұрын
@@manuelcampuzano558 I thought 'People' was taken from Flo during the 1965 Copa run. This was mentioned in Tony Turner's book 'All That Glittered'
@therealsongstress4 жыл бұрын
Diana loved the gowns 🤔🤔🤔
@d.singler-kron9034 Жыл бұрын
."..they gave us all the ammunition they had, and we were able to do it. "
@DLFfitness13 жыл бұрын
I wonder if the supremes would have remained relevant without Diana Ross’s solo career?
@gracegreen18593 жыл бұрын
That’s actually a good question cause now that they are all gone you will solely have to depend on Diana Ross to be the supremes. It’s crazy tho she never stopped singing her early songs so… maybe it did keep it relevant.
@Jasper7182009 Жыл бұрын
For goodness sakes! Mary Wilson, why don’t you want to talk about your first appearance at the Copacabana in New York? It was historic. Why did Mary Wilson fudge and hesitate and even seemed a bit belligerent in answering the question. Of course we want to hear about the opening night! What the heck??
@Jasper7182009 Жыл бұрын
Why couldn’t Florence Ballard sing the song People? Sometimes I wonder about Mary Wilson.
@hiltonbailey96714 жыл бұрын
What i meant it give them a distinct sound apart from the other female at that and even today.
@therealsongstress4 жыл бұрын
Diana Ross kinda sounded like Frankie
@guygrip21205 жыл бұрын
I CAN SAY I WAS IN LOVE WITH SURPREMES. NOT THEM INDIVIUALLY ECCEPT FOR FLORENCE. SHE HAD HEART. BUT SUPREMES THEM SELVES. BUT AS, ACT. THEY WERE NATURED AND THEN DESTROYED. FOR PERSONAL MEDIA.
@ernestchacon49284 жыл бұрын
I love Mary Wilson, but her always comment is; is not the Supremes, but yet and still it is, I'm like is it or not????????
@angelocatapang60543 жыл бұрын
2:42.
@hiltonbailey96714 жыл бұрын
Time.
@raycurry41682 жыл бұрын
Horrible interviewer!!, Mary = fine.
@SassyBratt15 жыл бұрын
She should never have gotten the chin implant.
@SassyBratt14 жыл бұрын
@Linda Hines that makes no sense.
@andrewthornhill70423 жыл бұрын
@Linda Hines I thought the implant was necessary due to injuries suffered during the 1994 car accident.
@babak64093 жыл бұрын
Didnt need it still luv
@tomgraves35815 жыл бұрын
“Colored boys” ???? 😳😳😳
@buzzcut1015 жыл бұрын
Leave her alone with that colored boys comment. She is in her 70s here and was exposed to that terminology decades ago. She did amend her statement with the African American correction. 💕❤️💕
@annadraper65 жыл бұрын
Im forty and my birth certificate says colored.
@juniebe45 жыл бұрын
Anna Draper My Birth Certificate Says Colored To..
@juniebe45 жыл бұрын
And Today These Older People Still Use The Term Colored...
@rawvision67015 жыл бұрын
Yes, that was the term in the early 60s, get over it.
@Elmaestrodemusica5 жыл бұрын
And Mary always gives credit where credit it due ....