Motherboard PCB Breakdown: ASUS Pro ART X670E Creator Wifi

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#overclocking #amd #ryzen #ASUS #x670e #motherboard

[@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking]

Notes for this PCB Breakdown on Patreon: www.patreon.com/posts/asus-pro-art-pcb-107025418

[@shaneeslick]

G'day Buildzoid, 🤔about the VRM 50A vs 70A could it be different revisions? When you look at the Screen Printing of the A SUS Spec Page The DIMM Layout is Top Right of Socket after WI-FI vs Your's the DIMM Layout is Bottom Right of Socket next to PROART with R1.03 after WI-FI Plus while both the Pics you showed have 2x 90A VDDMISC in the PCCG listing for "PROART X670E-Creator WI-FI" (Shop down here in Australia) when you scroll down to the Pic with no VRM Cooler it only has 1 90A VDDMISC

[@properMBsearch]

Annoyingly, to Paypal Patreon One needs a debit card number!

[@properMBsearch]

Buildzoid, if you search community on the AMD site, you can find an entry by properMBsearch in "General Discussions" titled "X670 motherboard with many PCIe-slots" with CAD drawing and block diagram.

[@JonneBackhaus]

They are thunderbolt and it will install a thunderbolt host driver in windows

[@BillyONeal]

Can confirm, I have this board and use that feature as a funny KVM with a TB dock with laptops

[@acuteaura]

"it doesn't make sense to build a storage server around a high end am5 board" - well you see that's where thunderbolt matters, ingest stations / media servers love that stuff. production companies carry around these huge OWC DAS boxes to shoots and guess what, it's all thunderbolt.

[@Sebyllis7350k]

using a huge ATX board for DAS, good for you! I don't want to carry that thing around anytime soon.

[@voltaren2621]

go for threadripper😊

[@acuteaura]

@@Sebyllis7350k for the ingest station that you offload the DAS from… i said OWC DAS quite clearly

[@devonmoreau]

I really enjoy these, very interesting and i haven’t seen anyone else who can break these down like this ❤

[@Uro666]

2:28 you may have the wrong IC, there is also a MP86992-C787 80A version - both ICs have the same top markings, same footprint and pinout.

[@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking]

I can't find an introduction date for the C787 but the datasheet is 5/23/2024. The chips on the board are made is in 2022 week 16. The regular 86992 datahseet is from 2019. So I'm gonna stick with these being the 50A chips because as far as I can tell the 80A variant didn't exist when this board was made.

[@Sarajiel]

There seem to exist two revisions of this board. One seems to use the Onsemi FDMF3170, the other one uses the MP86992 power stages.

[@Uro666]

@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking I never checked the datasheet publishing dates as I generally find them somewhat unreliable, Monolithic Power arent the quickest in publishing datasheets alongside new IC releases either. For example I recieved some RISC-V dev boards last year with MP1612 & MP1657 step down converters that still do not have any datasheets published/publicly available, yet these converters are used in Xbox consoles released years before these boards were fabbed - which is a real shame as those ICs would be ideal step down converters for a pcb design I have in the works - but no datasheet to work from. :) I have owned a ProART X670E since it was released, it is a great board and I have a 7900X mounted in it with 2x32GB for work, I got it primarily due to the onboard Marvell/Aquantia 10GbE which performs awesome, no overheating that I have noticed (I havent exactly been looking, but I would notice degraded network perf), the rest of the X670E lineup across all the vendors is pretty sucky overall to be honest, they are all full of compromised configuration choices [its a result of what happens when PR takes priority over the engineering, sadly too prevalant these days], or just overpriced halo showpieces / tech demonstrations. :)

[@aviciiaf3099]

​@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking The datasheet is a newer version, which changed 70A into 80A one month ago😅. And before that C787 was only labelled as 70A parts. I've also seen some Z690 boards with these parts, which I think are the same age as those x670s

[@elektronischermeister]

You should definitely go for an Electrical Engineer degree. It will enrich your life, make the see things from a different angle, you can even make a side channel or live sessions with EE stuff. If you keep doing the same things over and over without broadening your knowledge could keep you from growing.

[@LedNe0nDevil]

That's the reason I think he should care about audio, learning. would lead to more info, making better videos.

[@tollph3314]

i think he might still know more than average graduate i guess depends on the level of univesity or location you get degree from

[@Drebin2293]

@@tollph3314 Practical knowledge? Yes. Almost certainly.

[@powerpower-rg7bk]

Always nice to see you go over a part I have. My personal reasons for grabbing this board was the 10 Gbit LAN port, secondary 2.5 Gbit LAN and dual 8x PCIe 5.0 slots. The M.2 layout does have its quirks but isn't bad. I do wish it had a POST code display instead of those simple LED lights. Those 40 Gbit USB-C ports are indeed Thunderbolt compatible. I've attached an external 4x PCIe 3.0 chassis to the board just to see if it'll work. Yeah, it does. I'm also of the impression that you don't need to use the DP input for these USB-C ports to drive external displays either: they'll use the simple integrated GPU to drive them by default which is fine for desktop work but not for gaming. Both LAN ports support AVB audio over the network. Windows doesn't have drivers for it but they do exist on the Linux side. AMD does require some CPU attached M.2 slots per X670E spec, at least at launch. I think this as since change as they've launched the Epyc 4004 line up that uses the same AM5 socket. Having three 8x PCIe 5.0 slots on that low end Epyc would have some server value though it'd leave all the M.2 slots hanging off of the chipset and at 4.0 speeds.

[@shaneeslick]

PS Buildzoid "I've decided to care less about keeping my videos under control" Me "🥳WOOHOO! Untimed Rambling Buildzoid"

[@der913er]

Nice! Teardown of the B650E Taychon would be intresting.

[@JonneBackhaus]

The audio is "cut" but you can use the front panel audio for the missing channels. You can set in the drivers. It also states so in the manual

[@ZeroHourProductions407]

Yeah, nobody that needs analog 7.1 is going to do that, ever.

[@Sarajiel]

The folks who actually want to build PC-based audio workstations, instead of using a Mac, typically use Thunderbolt peripherals.

[@JonneBackhaus]

@@ZeroHourProductions407 ofc not, but its there.

[@fanofentropy2280]

I just use USB-C into a dac/amp combo. From there you can run speakers, headphones or iem's.

[@ZeroHourProductions407]

@@fanofentropy2280 The issue with that approach, is simply the software support... or more accurately, the lack of it. I still use Audigy and X-fi sound cards entirely because of support for Legacy EAX code for games made in that era. I could be wrong (and for once I am hoping I am!), but last I looked into it, I could not find a single external unit that supports 5.1 or 7.1 analog, _and_ supports EAX code, either natively with a Creative branded offering or something that supports at least Creative's ALchemy software. Realtek famously refuses to support it despite claiming their audio chips could even emulate it internally for all their boasting.

[@danknemez]

Great video as always! :D Full-featured USB4 and Thunderbolt are effectively interchangeable, so its just down to it not being Intel certified which I doubt they will ever issue for AMD boards. And oh the CMOS battery... It was a nightmare to get to it on my TRX40 Aorus Xtreme, you have to take off the entire board backplate to be able to take off the plastic bits that cover the battery... And yeah, this is one of the sanest/best AM5 boards in terms of IO configuration, though for actual workstationy use you would probably want the extra IO available on the W680 Intel version tbh, same for storage boxes and such since they will idle a fair bit lower.

[@DV8tion2u]

Thanks Bruh.

[@KenOttaviano]

I like this board too. It's my daily driver

[@night_light2867]

Thanks for starting motherboard reviews again ❤❤❤

[@iDeparture]

Can't wait for x870/z890 reviews

[@xo-Tobe]

Asus ROG STRIX X670E-E GAMING WIFI is a better board without the 10G which you can add in a slot if required. Also dual x8 and has the digital audio and cheaper. Great review btw keep up the good work.

[@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking]

The X670E-E Strix only supports x16/0 and x8/x4 because ASUS though it would be funny to use some of the GPU PCI-e lanes for another gen5 M.2 slot.

[@xo-Tobe]

Thank you for highlighting this, i actually had misread the spec. cheers.

[@ChrisJackson-js8rd]

i think the post code on ws boards used to be a feature cause lots of workstations were booting from pcie network or storage cards that required csm mode enabled to be bootable. and thats just no longer the case.

[@michaelczap7632]

MP86992-C787 is a 16V, 70A (may be a variant of similar items)

[@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking]

the MPS website says that's an 80A part for me. Also I'm pretty sure it's newer than the board.

[@TarsoSousa]

is there a x670e-plus tuf board break down? would be nice to know what kind of cost cuts they did on the "cheap" x670e

[@joelg1318]

i also got the MOBO for the dual 4th gen x16 capabilities.

[@user-yc5fq9bv3u]

really? It does 2x x16 4.0?

[@Sebyllis7350k]

@@user-yc5fq9bv3u no way. zen 4 cpu has only got 24 pcie lanes off of the cpu.

[@user-yc5fq9bv3u]

I wonder how quickly they find out they can put heat sinks instead of heat slabs and save a lot of money on SPSes.

[@rubenschaer960]

@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking On page 4 of the MP86992A datasheet, it lists the high-side current limit as 75A for up to 8 cycles (8 periods of what ever frequency the VRM is running at?). This might just be a case of marketing choosing the highest number they could justify. No idea if the cycle count gets adjusted for the current, i.e. it would not make much sense to have only 8 cycles at 75A and an infinite number of cycles at 74.5A, but maybe it is expected that it would go through a thermal shutdown at that point anyway. With that in mind, it is possible that the ASUS engineers were testing this power stage and found that it could do 70A continuously as long as it had appropriate heatsinking, given the 75A hard limit, then wrote that number down in their internal test documents, and marketing just ran with it.

[@WayStedYou]

15:36 I think it was msi or asrock has a whole bunch of post code back for the upcoming AM5 boards, maybe someone has seen the crys for post costs instead of LEDs back.

[@night_light2867]

And for capacitors for every 10c lower temperature, their insurance dabbles so if it runs at 100 5k is 10k if its 90c its 20k and they usually raun it 70 or lower so they last 80k plus hours

[@Sebyllis7350k]

dO YOu kNoW hOW tO TYpE? OR ENGLISH?

[@HoangDucNuyen]

Just connecting Hyperdrive USB4 40Gbps enclosure into that 40Gbps port. The read speed is just 2000mb/s (same as 20Gbps port), and write speeed is only 1200mb/s (worst than 20Gbps port which is 2000mb/s)

[@Sebyllis7350k]

Thunderbolt on Windows is just bad, but this board is indeed using a thunderbolt controller.

[@andersmusikka]

Just curious: is there any chance they are actually pushing the 50A parts to 70A? Maybe the 50A rating is conservative, perhaps at 80 deg C ambient temperature, or something?

[@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking]

So the thing is that the nominal current ratings is already impractical for real world applications as at 50A output an 86992 will produce over 7W heat(an in my exp any over 3-4W per component is basically uncoolable). Though I've gone through a couple of datasheets for higher nominal current rating MPS parts and they basically have the same performance at 50A output. So from what I can see MPS doesn't make any parts with significantly better efficiency just parts with higher current limit settings.

[@Kallandras]

I picked up the Asus Prime X670E Pro WiFi (Microcenter open box for $260 vs the no discount available $450 ProArt) instead of this board due to the only real differences being, Back I/O (not worth the extra money to me): no 10gb Ethernet (no secondary RJ45 port at all), no 40gb USB-C (10gb USB-C instead), and it has a 5 Audio connectors stead of 3. Internal layout: the second M.2 PCIe is 3.0 instead of 5.0, and the CMOS battery location is below the Primary PCIe x16 slot, (potentially inconvenient) but there is an actual CLR_CMOS button (which stopped working on my board) and the second PCIe x16 is also just an x4 slot electrically, with the middle PCIe slot x4 being a true x4.

[@Sebyllis7350k]

these are fundamentally different boards. why are you even comparing.

[@chronickat5453]

cant you buy pcie slots to solder on to replace the mangled one? or maybe salvage a slot from another board

[@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking]

SMT PCI-e slots are a nightmare to solder by hand.

[@thesunexpress]

I own this board & it's intel counterpart with the same USB4/Thunderbolt chipset onboard. Can confirm the X670E USB4 works just as intended, identical performance with the Intel Thunderbolt hardware devices. If memory serves, the Thunderbolt branding is exclusive trademark to Intel platform chipsets -- hence why for AMD platforms they get Intel's blessing so long as AMD calls it by a different name.

[@LordApophis100]

I don't think it is exclusive, at least the AsRock X570 ITX/TB3 uses Thunderbolt branding. Maybe Asus just didn't want to certify it with Intel to get the branding.

[@Sebyllis7350k]

Apple uses Thunderbolt branding as well. If my understanding is correct, anything with Thunderbolt capability can be called Thunderbolt, no matter the implementation.

[@LordApophis100]

@@Sebyllis7350k Intel developed Thunderbolt together with Apple, so they probably are a special case in that regard. Until Thunderbolt 4 Intel required strict certification to use Thunderbolt branding. They eased the requirements when they opened up the specification to USB, but not fully.

[@acuteaura]

the thunderbolt ports on this board are really picky about being hotplugged, the manual even says not to do it (contrary to the USB spec) also i couldn't get 20Gbps peer-to-peer networking working with this thing at all.

[@ProfileUserNumber]

Wait really? Shit I missed that in the manual. I’ve bought this board at launch and hotplug the whole time. Countless times in the last two years. In fact every time I start my pc, I have to hot plug it to get the thunderbolt dock to work properly. But sometimes I do it from the dock side.

[@acuteaura]

@@ProfileUserNumber in my experience it can cause the PSU to trip if the grounds aren’t common

[@cassiohui]

​@@ProfileUserNumber i can confirm networking does not work unless i reboot if i hotplugged the cable…

[@ProfileUserNumber]

@@cassiohui if I need to restart my pc, then I need to, reboot twice, hot plug twice or three times, on the second or third hotplug it will recognize. This is why I’ve had to hotplug so many times it’s the only way to get it to work whenever my pc shuts down or restarts. I probably rekt something because I always hotplug between pcs, I was chalking it up to sketchy amd implementation. Feelsbadman. I definitely will try not to do it anymore but it seems to be the only way to get keyboard and mouse to recognize.

[@night_light2867]

I heard kingpin is working on a new kingpin gpu would you break it down when it get released? 😊

[@user-yc5fq9bv3u]

I wonder if any motherboard multiplexes 4.0 or 3.0 PCI into 5.0 to have 2x or 4x the lanes at full bandwidth. 16 lanes would become 64 3.0 lanes then (basically).

[@Sebyllis7350k]

Not at all. PLX chip and PCIe bridges in general are completely obsolete at this point.

[@fracturedlife1393]

i had a midget land in the 2nd x16 slot on a B550-F and fry itself/short board, no post, took ages to figure that shit out. the boards when you review look sweet without the heatsinks. might nude my board lmao

[@houndsol]

what fell?

[@WillFuI]

Why is intel lan just so much better than the other options? I have had so many issues with none intel wifi or Ethernet solutions

[@Sebyllis7350k]

Chelsio is also a solid option for optical networking. Mellanox has worked brilliantly for me in Windows and macOS, but not in Linux or FreeBSD. Aquantia AQC107 has also been solid on macOS, but not other OSes.

[@onehours]

whats the intel counterpart of this?

[@night_light2867]

1:14:19 Does anyone know why middle pin of ram slots are stiking out ?

[@tlv8555]

It's excited

[@NajiSibin]

what if zen6 ryzen 9 CPUs are 250w or even 300w so the VRM make sense for future proof

[@Sebyllis7350k]

do you use an x370 board for 5950x?

[@ChrisJackson-js8rd]

i would almost say that asus has a very distinctive take on vrm design versus the other manufacturers. this and the gene are the best examples ive seen. its like theyre the only company thats bothered to follow what the rest of the electronics market has learned over the past decade or two the other manufacturers are like theyre frozen in 2006. zero innovation thats not literally forced on them by their suppliers

[@ChrisJackson-js8rd]

basically what theyre doing is like if actually remove power supply ripple effectively at the input .... having a whole pile of capacitance on the output can actually reintroduce its own ripple into the circuit. and it will make regulation worse not better

[@ChrisJackson-js8rd]

problem is that if you try to implement this style of vrm and eff it up... now you got no output filtering. typically you wanna a lot of simulation and then a lot of testing to define ur goldilocks zone, and then your gonna need to be able to account at the controller for whatever future chips and agesa updates might do to your boards already out in the wild and i mean i can go on and on about this , once you have only stage of filtering to speak of, now you end up a far greater risk of feedback loop developing between the switching vrm and the psu that can cause insane swings in the vrm and those single little protection components to break the feedback are really precisely chosen, to filter out very specific frequencies at which what are called "freak waves" can develop honestly the guy who designed this knows what hes doing and knows that he knows what hes doing and everyone on the design team takes his word as like mandate of heaven

[@Mglunafh]

Imma just upvote the whole rant 'cause I take your words as a mandate of heaven 🪬

[@FreelancerVideoDump]

That 3rd x8 would help me so much, but I think it would cut into their TR sales so they don't. Some BS.

[@BattleBear96]

ASUS X570 Crosshair Impact is damn awful in regards to the CMOS battery, it has to be completely disassembled to get behind the IO shield. I am definitely looking out for battery placement for my next board :D

[@Sebyllis7350k]

it has a clear cmos button on the rear IO. why do you need to remove the battery?

[@BattleBear96]

@@Sebyllis7350k because after a few years the battery is empty and has to be changed for a new one

[@Drumaier]

You should be a concultant for Asus, gigabite, msi etc. Before they send their stuff for mass production, they should send the motherboards and GPS to you and ask "we are about to produce this sht for x price....can we?"

[@spewp]

Asus cooked my 7950X in this board and it scorched itself. Never again, Asus.

[@johnpaulbacon8320]

Thanks for this very in-depth & informative video. I use this exact board for my machine and love it. Running 4 x 48-gb ram kit ( 192 gb ) hasn't been a problem.

[@mostlyindica]

What kind of speed and timings are you able to get with such memory kit ? TIA

[@Sebyllis7350k]

Wondering about your speed and timing as well. It would be brilliant if you can share them.

[@butanding1987]

Do a Gene X670E PCB breakdown and show us how it manages to kill itself just by using synchronous BCLK OC at +103.💀

[@Sebyllis7350k]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/j6nYq5h6hJWSb5I can you get lazier? google search isn't that difficult last time I used it.

[@WayStedYou]

ay SUS putting 50 amps instead of 70 amps

[@Gohjunyi88]

Is this board worth the moolah?

[@chengong388]

onboard audio is only useful for low end boards, high end users will all be using external audio solutions.

[@LedNe0nDevil]

Why do you want to have/pay another power supply when one good already exists inside your pc? also paying the enclosure, knobs, tax premium brand, when none of it gives better audio lol The max you need is a 200$ Pci-e sound cards with Dolby. Jealous much? Which if you look at component choice dunks on thousand$ externals. and for less money....

[@LedNe0nDevil]

But of course normies followed the external trend by brands that wanted to be able to charge more and so they did.

[@chengong388]

@@LedNe0nDevil because power supply is unbelievably cheap? Because external audio interfaces can also be powered by USB? WTF are you raging over?

[@LedNe0nDevil]

@@chengong388 you being such an idiot. Who has 0 clue what he is talking about.

[@voltaren2621]

iam not asus fan anymore. i had strx4 MB from asus for my threadripper and had always issues. I had 3 of them and 3 of them had different issues😂😂😂

[@ericsynchrona5495]

He knows everything there is about the chips on the computer, but he cannot fathom why the humans made a typo from 70 amps to 50 amps.

[@TheHighborn]

finally, some good fucking rambling.

[@Lucaat]

I had 2700x, 5800x and back in the day various Athlon. I am not against AMD, but I went Intel 13th when released because the boards often have 4x m2 sockets at low price. My board was 180€ and I dont understand why this board is 400€. OK it has 10G LAN, but I dont see any other advantages.

[@cassiohui]

Thunderbolt with Intel chipset also adds to the price

[@Sebyllis7350k]

I don't know, Thunderbolt? Dual PCIe x8 off of the CPU? VRM? Loads of USB ports? Also, Intel boards only have one NVMe m.2 slots off of the CPU. AMD boards can have two.

[@Beezleybuzz]

Not having at least an optical out for audio is CRIMINAL.

[@Sebyllis7350k]

professionals and enthusiasts use USB and thunderbolt based DAC, whereas normies don't use optical anyway. who is optical audio output for?

[@SpoiledBadgerMilk]

Still a proud owner of the gene. Totally overkill and I love it.

[@Sebyllis7350k]

many people have reported problems with gene, and Asus has discontinued the board apparently due to some quality control issues. have you encountered any of the problems?

[@SpoiledBadgerMilk]

@@Sebyllis7350k Just not good boost clocking. Board itself is well made

[@a_fish_that_loves_to_overclock]

first, this is surprising

[@shaneeslick]

I got well over 500th but... 69👍 😁

[@tns6862]

Great, i got 4x48gb 8000mhz from the QVL...thanks for nothing asus

[@Wasmachineman]

I have played so much STALKER I can't stop thinking of Shadow of Chernobyl when I hear SoC lol