Motorsports Wiring Harness Part 2: Concentric Twisting

[@signal_msw]

I forgot to show how I fold the steel braid back over the outside sheathing before I slide the solder sleeve over it! My bad.

[@afiffarhan5298]

I like how you explain slowly without some music or timelapse. Waiting for your next project, awesome!✨

[@signal_msw]

Yeah I wanted to show everyone the exact process, not just a quick shot of it. Thank you!

[@nickfox5446]

Thank you! I build harnesses for heavy duty diesel and had been curious just how that braid was achieved. I'll soon be making some prettier, far more time consuming harnesses. I'll get paid the same but it's the satisfaction I'm after.

[@murraycalavera1834]

Thank you for putting this on KZbin and not making me pay $500 to watch it!

[@philstrohm4181]

Saw that on hpa also

[@signal_msw]

Hahaha, I'm just doing what I can to help!

[@PDXMX83]

This video needs to blow up!!! Y’all don’t know how easy he made that look! He didn’t

[@luketombroek2215]

I really really want you to film a compleet harnass because it's really amazing and you're just good at explaining it. I'm still really interested to see how you get the wires out of the harnass to go to the sensor ect keep up the good work

[@signal_msw]

Yeah I'll definitely be including that in the next video, it's something that took me a lot of time to learn, and I'm still not as good as a lot of people at!

[@Tyler-ek5tj]

@@signal_msw agreed with Luke, I need to redo my harness now that my hacked together solution has gotten my car running. I'd like to see how you build the engine side of the harness.

[@signal_msw]

Yeah, the next harness will be a bit more simple, and I'll cover things like lacing tape and terminating the connectors.

[@СерыйХ-в6л]

After such videos everyone will be able to wire up engine professionally. Thanks man

[@signal_msw]

I'm here to help, hah.

[@sandman_1071]

complete harness build would be nice to see.

[@signal_msw]

Watch for an announcement soon!

[@rogercrier9115]

When cutting the braid off, instead of risking wire damage, try this:- Bunch braid in the area of the cut, just like you did, but then, use smooth flat pliers to form the braid into a “flat disc” exactly where you want the braid cut. Then use sharp flush cutters to cut around the base of the disc. Hope that makes sense.

[@basiclifeskillsasaman1291]

I slide a metal tube over the wires between them and the shield and cut on the tube so mine are safe

[@ther1kid]

Outstanding video, for sure would watch and learn a lot watching a full build.

[@signal_msw]

Coming soon!

[@levifelipe]

Keep it up with this amazing job Bro! Your videos deserve to have more than 1 million views

[@jeremiahjaikol6495]

thank you for sharing how to do the shielded wire connection

[@slightlyrustyracing6831]

Awesome video man! I only wish this was available sooner. Please please please keep the content coming :D

[@signal_msw]

Thanks man, I’m gonna try! Looks my ECU is shipping out next week so I’ll have to start on that harness soon!

[@wrxtawd]

Great video. I use solder sleeves from maven performance. They are nice because they have clean ground lead already in splice. Glad I found your channel.

[@signal_msw]

Yup, I bought these because I wanted to use the same color for all my sensor ground applications, those are definitely convenient!

[@zedaxm]

Very informative video man... Please make a video of building complete harness from scratch....😊✌️

[@rileylilwell5201]

Awesome video man🤙🏼it’s helpful hearing your thought process as you go through trying something new If you did do a full start to finish video there would definitely be a few weirdos like me keen to watch and learn👍🏼

[@signal_msw]

Glad I can help! I’m gonna try to put something together like that.

[@ace23_brz20]

haha, yeah, I'd like to see you do another harness...I'm working my way into doing one myself

[@rickfellowes5233]

Really helpful, I would love a full harness video

[@signal_msw]

That's coming soon!

[@teemukuikka7100]

The wrapping angle affect number of wires, so with correct angle additional wires are allways +6 if using same gauge wire. Additionally, I’d leave filler wires long enough to be able to terminate them with pin if needed for additional equipment, or spare if needed, then just route within harness to connectors. Some harnesses have at least 2 spares on all branches to make even layers.

[@signal_msw]

Yup yup, and I’ve done exactly that on harnesses I’ve built since this one.

[@paulcharman44]

Agree completely about filler wires being connected, they have got me out of trouble several times

[@jmtworm]

Nice work dude & great video. Looking forward to more videos 👍

[@signal_msw]

Thanks! More coming soon.

[@johnshaft5613]

How do you make the service loops stay in place? When I try it they all sort of unwind....

[@signal_msw]

@@johnshaft5613 you have to use tefzel wire and you have to pull it tight around a rod of some sort.

[@johnshaft5613]

@@signal_msw I do use Tefzel wire, but I think my failing was in not pulling it tight. I would just make loops and they would spring right out, Thanks much!

[@joaovitorrodrigues2009]

Hello. Could you tell me how to calculate the relationship between the increase in the length of the wire and the angle of the concentric twist? I need to estimate how much the wire length would increase.

[@PsBuddha562]

Would be cool to have your opinion and inputs about PDMs

[@signal_msw]

PDM's are great! They can really simplify things, but they're not necessary. You really have to think about how it fits into your specific application. Most street cars with all the creature comforts and necessities are going to have more circuits than a single PDM can handle, and two PDM's is a big chunk of change. You can build a nice, compact relay and circuit breaker board that will still be extremely reliable for a fraction of the cost, and it might fit the application better. Stripped down racecars are another story!

[@JubeeHS13]

awesome work man im in the process of building my 2jz harness for my 240 i keep wanting to make a video but I'm not sure exactly how to start making the videos smh. but good work man love the explanation and not drown out of music.

[@signal_msw]

Well it's confirmed I will be building a harness for my SR20 S13, so keep an eye out for that.

[@Der1320-y6x]

ideal crimp tool for size 20 contacts for AS is a dmc afm 8 with positioner m22520/2-10

[@christophermejia1393]

Awesome video very informative would love to see how you slip you sensors and what not very well explained definitely subscribing

[@signal_msw]

Thanks! I’ll definitely make a video with some more explanation.

[@christophermejia1393]

@@signal_msw thanks man much respect

[@t34admin]

Very informative dude. Also, dope shirt! I run Feal coils on both my cars and actually just watched Odi winning Irwindale like 3 hours ago on YT. Looking forward t more content.

[@signal_msw]

Thank you kind sir! I have Feal's on my S13 as well!

[@cuzz63]

When working with shielded wire at the point you nip the part that you bunched up I would bend the wire at the first cut and pull the wires out of the center, it leaves the shield as long as the wires and you can twist the shield and connect it without out the solder connector. At least thats the way we do it in industrial applications.

[@signal_msw]

Motorsports applications prefer the solder sleeve. Your way is a viable alternative though.

[@cuzz63]

@@signal_msw you can still do the solder with the way I outlined.

[@leozitosantos]

Nice video. I never see someone explain this.

[@signal_msw]

Thanks!

[@robb1165]

I will point out that the wire barn size calculator is for wires in free air, not in a bundle. I have wondered about these concentric bundles. Looks like a nightmare of excessiveness, but I like it.

[@signal_msw]

Indeed. Also the default is a 2% drop, but a 5% drop is generally acceptable in automotive.

[@eletrickblack]

I work very top accompanied here in Brazil because we don't have much information about concentric braids here 🏎🏎🏎

[@signal_msw]

Glad I can help!

[@BrainDeath89]

very nice video!

[@Jonathan_Doe_]

Wire strippers with a depth stop aren’t too hard to come by, or expensive, if you’re trying to trim the perfect amount of insulation off.

[@tylerpienta]

The reason for a spec on the insulation stripped behind the terminal is due to unnecessary strain caused on the conductor strands when the insulation is butted up to the terminal body. Specs are for reasons not for fun 🤙🏻 good video though buddy!

[@signal_msw]

Yeah I knew I was going to get shit for including that section. I realize that you need to keep it off the back of the terminal, I just get annoyed with the people that critique wiring so intensely.

[@tylerpienta]

@@signal_msw by no means is it to put you down, wonderful quality work you’ve shown! For me I’ve formed the habit of being my biggest critic because I’ve gotten to the point I realized you can’t learn from being right, only from being wrong, so I became in love with failure and always recognizing it to learn from it 🤙🏻 cheers man

[@jmtworm]

Yep, film more harness building 👍

[@signal_msw]

More soon!

[@tturi2]

excellent video man

[@FilterYT]

Thanks for sharing!

[@Jandjspeedshop]

Might be a dumb question but I am watching right now and seen you put that grey filler wire in the first layer. I understand it is to fill the gap but if you didn't do the filler wire would is effect the layer on top of it? I understand filler on the last layer so the DR25 heat shrink looks correct.

[@signal_msw]

Depending on the gap, it will. Also, it's hard to get the layer to stay in place if there are gaps, and when using the lacing tape, it tends to move around while you're tying it. Overall, just not ideal. If you're concerned about weight, use a linear twist.

[@heartblitzer7379]

Please what is the part no of the wires you're using.shielded twisted pair and also the signal wires pls.thanks

[@codyzellner]

Liked and subscribed! Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us. I have one question though. I keep reading that white is often the cheapest color, wouldn't it make more sense to use this as a filler? Is grey similar to white in pricing or is white a common designation for something?

[@signal_msw]

Really you could do any one solid color, as the cheapness comes from buying it in big bulk quantities. All of the solid colors (non-striped) are the same pricing from the suppliers I've seen. I think white just looks clean and has good contrast with the idents for easier ID.

[@aukanmeister]

Very good explanation! Thanks for the video!

[@signal_msw]

You're welcome!

[@khemrajhsamaroo3671]

Hey great content, quick question. I'm using IGN1A coils saw you're using 18 guage wire for the power and ground. I'm not use an autosport connector tho. Should I use a thicker single 16 guage wire and branch out to 4 18 guage ?

[@six50motors]

Do I have to pin the drain wire in the shielded cable on both sides of the connector. Im doin a holley efi has 3 wire cam and crank shielded wires with drain wire

[@signal_msw]

Yes. The drain wire needs to go to signal ground.

[@six50motors]

Awsome thanks so much I really appreciate that info. It was holding me up i cant find that anywhere. yes the wire is pinned in ecu connector already I got a flying lead from Holley.

[@joshuarader419]

How much additional wire do you use with this technique? For example, how much wire do you think you need to wrap the outermost layer for a straight 3 ft run?

[@signal_msw]

@@joshuarader419 10-15% depending on layer and length.

[@br1anzkilLs]

to use air quotes for "Mil Spec connectors" is incorrect. Those connectors are indeed a Mil-Spec item. The Part number starts with MS, meaning military specification. Still used today in military and commercial aviation. I work in an Aerospace company where we build a lot of electrical components so I see them everyday.

[@signal_msw]

I just hate the buzz word “mil-spec” when it comes to automotive wiring harness work. It is not synonymous with the best quality one can buy as is implied.

[@orleansky.v]

😯 wow!! Amazing!!!!!😍

[@talhazahid4074]

Love you man❤️❤️

[@Bendover-bv9no]

Question, how do you fit 18awg wire in to 20awg or any larger wire in to smaller pin/socket?

[@signal_msw]

Don't do this. Buy connectors with properly sized pins and sockets. For Deutsch connectors, 18awg wire should only go in size 16 pins and sockets. The pins and sockets are only designed for a certain amperage, and if you need 18awg wire, you're likely going to exceed the seven amps the 20awg pins/sockets are rated for.

[@Bendover-bv9no]

@@signal_msw Did you have 18 gauge shielded wire in this video and 20 awg connector?

[@signal_msw]

@@Bendover-bv9no The shielded cable for the knock sensor is, yes. The wire just fit in the pins, and this wasn't the correct way to do things. Knock sensors are not high amp devices and I should have bought 22awg shielded cable. The other connector that the Injector wiring went through is a size 16 pin connector.

[@nurnadira8023]

hi..what size AWG wire for sensor grond and 12volt sensor 🙏🏼

[@azazeldeath]

Why'd you have to basically attack me over the measuring of the official length of stripping? But being serious. A fast way I learnt to do it when rewiring a few cars as a mechanic was turning basically a set of paper sheers into a wire cutting mechanism. Had a straight edge that could be adjusted in height and distance from the cutting edge. Once the distances are set you strip the wire long. Slide the wire into the trimmer the straight edge catches on the insulation. Cut. Then crimp. Once you get in the groove you can really pump it out faster than trying to be more exact with the eyeball method.

[@luizantoniodasilvaribeiro7169]

Do you have Instagram? Congratulations for your work!!!

[@signal_msw]

Yes, signal_smw. Thank you!

[@teamstreetsweepers4073]

Definitely make a start to finish, any pdm chassis harnesses in the lineup?

[@signal_msw]

I'll try and do one! Not at the moment, I just did a PDM in an Evo X race car, but the setup had all kinds of compromises.

[@ThrottleStopGarage]

Great video - thanks - when twisting, how much extra did you add to the length from your original harness measurement?

[@signal_msw]

About 10% extra.

[@aukanmeister]

Will we see some cool harness building on the carbon Volvo too? It would suit the build quite nicely!

[@ThrottleStopGarage]

@@aukanmeister You bet...I like wiring a lot more than I should.

[@Bcoy15]

Great video man! 👍🏼

[@signal_msw]

I'm glad you liked it!

[@georgemallard4120]

From a signal - noise perspective, you would do better to interweave the signals with the grounds. This would help prevent cross-talk between the sensor leads.

[@signal_msw]

Do you mean twisted pairs, or just in the bundle in general? If there are sensitive signals, then shielded wire is used. The normal sensor and ECU grounds are twisted in the bundle alongside the rest of the wires. Other than CAN wiring and shielded bundles, twisting individual wires together is not generally done in a concentrically twisted harness.

[@georgemallard4120]

@@signal_msw I agree with you a twisted pair is much better at noise rejection. And a shield with a proper single point ground makes it even better. Sorry to go all geeky engineer on you. I really did enjoy the video. I would lay these down, brown, signal, brown, signal, brown, 12V. The interweaving of the 12V with the grounds give you a free small noise bypass capacitor. That bypass is doubled with the core shield. An interwoven lay will give you a slight signal to noise advantage for free. And you never know, a slight advantage might make a difference.

[@signal_msw]

That's definitely an interesting bit. I may try that with this upcoming harness since all the wires will be white anyway! Thanks!

[@georgemallard4120]

@@signal_msw They wired the Cray supercomputer with all the same color wire, you the man if you can do that!

[@kevinschlossser7858]

I personally frown against using that type of shrink tube with the built in solder because you have no way of knowing how good the connection actually is because you can't see it. How you should go about pinning a braided jacket is by slitting up the length of the braid, pulling out the pieces that are cut off basically undoing the braid then twisting the strands together. Then you take and remove some insulation from another piece of wire and slide it over the twisted strands. The use an adhesive lined shrink tube and slide it over the 2 wires and also the new wire you made. This will hold the jacket that was put over the strands in place and it will cover up any exposed strands going into the jacket. less connection points = less points of entry for problems.

[@signal_msw]

These are Raychem solder sleeves, not the cheap chinese junk you see everywhere. They’re clear when they’re shrunk, so you can see the connections just fine, and this is the motorsports approved method at the highest levels of competition. This harness is also completely sealed with Rt-125, so ingress of anything is not going to happen.

[@kevinschlossser7858]

@@signal_msw I am surprised that they use those things at the motor sports level. The single biggest thing about motor sports wiring is to eliminate possible failure points. Any time you join 2 wires together that becomes a potential location for a failure. The way I described to do it doesn't join wires together so that would make it a more reliable way of doing it. It's as more connections = increased chance of having a point of failure. I am also going to tell you there is no way on earth those shrink tube solder connections contain enough solder to penetrate the wire and also the braiding to make a 100% connection. It takes a lot of solder to tin a wire even when it's a thin wire. The other issue is if the solder is not 100% silver solder it is going to have some resistance to it. Keeping resistance down is a very important thing to do.

[@stevenlocke4769]

So the shielded wires will be for injectors? Like the ground or power side?

[@signal_msw]

They're direct injection injectors, so they actually pull a lot of amperage when they first open. It's to protect the other signals around them from interference.

[@signal_msw]

Both sides.

[@stevenlocke4769]

So is that for just one injector? What about the other cylinders?

[@signal_msw]

@@stevenlocke4769 there are four shielded injector bundles in one connector, and one shielded cable in the other for the knock sensor.

[@georgerobartes2008]

Solder , not soder unless sodomy is your thing . Its an English thing LOL . Like ' soldier ' or ' sold ' , even solution . No silent L here . Silent Ls in ' would ' , ' should ' etc. Interesting stuff . Very useful for Canon plug wiring for both motorsport and aero applications . Depending on pitch of twist , you will need to add a percentage to your original measured lengths , between 15% - 20% is a good start . Incorporating twisted pairs for CAN buses etc., makes it fun and these are typically core wires . I like to incorporate plumbers Teflon tape between layers . Its thin and reduces friction between layers in bending and vibration and keeps layers tidy and is a good dielectric when running voltage wires in the core .

[@MIEDEPAIN20011]

Hi . Noob question : Concentric twist must be only used with circular connectors ? Tia .

[@signal_msw]

Nope, you can use them in any kind of harness.

[@MIEDEPAIN20011]

@@signal_msw Thank you 😎

[@LurkerDanny]

Do you take orders for custom harnesses?

[@Gunnl]

where do you buy those connectors ?

[@notsponsored103]

Wouldn't you risk melting the insulation on the conductors and grounding the injector (or the other sensors you use shielded cable for) when you solder the shield like that?

[@signal_msw]

If you can see my pinned comment, normally your roll the shield back over the cable before soldering. Either way, the insulation on tefzel wire is rated for higher temperatures than solders melting point.

[@notsponsored103]

@@signal_msw ok got it, thanks. Amazing work.

[@joaooliveira837]

Did you actually used the AF8 and the TH1A turret to crimp those terminals? Assuming they are size 22 that's not the correct tool for the job, or am I missing something?

[@signal_msw]

No, I used the TH163 head, and these are size 20 contacts.

[@joaooliveira837]

@@signal_msw not what you said you're using in the video but thanks for the carification. Keep up the good job!

[@signal_msw]

@@joaooliveira837 yeah I probably switched the deutsch dt connector and the autosport one around.

[@infocentrousmajac]

Excellent video. I would like to see the complete harness build up and termination process if possible. Also, what is your rate ($)? I would like to contact you via email if at all possible. Your workmanship is excellent and I am also a wiring harness manufacturer. Cheers

[@signal_msw]

I charge $60/hour. The best way to get a hold of me is through my instagram @poormans180sx.

[@xyzebruh1083]

Hell no way too much work but does looks neat

[@davidciena7625]

Defenetly do a full in depth video this isnt a topic that is covered. I have been looking on here for about a year now and other than your 2 part video and HP Academies thsts it. So if u have the time it would be apreciated.

[@signal_msw]

I'm announcing a new harness project soon, keep an eye out!

[@incolink]

Hey did Ya'll see that merican accidently say Solder properly that was hilarious ...

[@signal_msw]

Hahaha! Yeah I’ve just decided to say it the proper way from now on, sahhder never seemed right haha.

[@TheKillerMarine]

What is the gold tape that is thick and thin called?

[@signal_msw]

Kapton!

[@TheKillerMarine]

@@signal_msw Thanks! How do you branch off connectors?

[@signal_msw]

@@TheKillerMarine A little hard to explain in a paragraph, but it's something I will be covering in the next couple of videos.

[@TheKillerMarine]

@@signal_msw Great! I look forward to it! I am adding a second fuse box to my overlanding rig and wanted to do the concentric twisting method but I will need connectors that branch out all over the twist. Great videos man!

[@flowwizardz6695]

Did it work

[@signal_msw]

Yup! It’s running the engine now. I did have to make an extension for the crank angle sensor, otherwise it was good to go!

[@katywalker8322]

Solder is the English pronounciation. Sawdor is the Amercian pronouciation.

[@edwardlacson2592]

Code colored esily deteded during wiring shorted harness

[@mikegruizinga6875]

mate i think Sole-der is the British pronunciation :)

[@signal_msw]

HAH! You're correct good sir! I'm not sure how I managed to pick that up as habit, but I don't feel quite as ridiculous now.

[@Jonathan_Doe_]

Am British. Can confirm, I was confused when he tried to correct himself, because we pronounce it as it’s written.

[@signal_msw]

Haha, thanks! Maybe I'll just keep saying it the "proper" way then ;).

[@GeenIdee2]

Why do you need 6 more wires on the next loop?

[@signal_msw]

Because each layer has to cover a larger diameter, so more wires are needed to keep the same lay length in the twisting process.

[@GeenIdee2]

So if I understand correctly, if you use more, the lenght will be different from the previous layer? Makes sense, didn't thought about that

[@signal_msw]

The length yes, but also the diameter. The more layers you add, the more wires have to be in each layer to fill it and maintain the same twist rate.

[@jordansauerwald79]

Do you have an IG?

[@signal_msw]

I do. @poormans180sx

[@researchdevelopment9088]

What are you doing

[@mk2vrt]

I watched till the end that harness is way to tight

[@signal_msw]

How so?

[@lowside67]

@@signal_msw There are two wires - an orange and a white (I think) that are at the "bottom" of your 90 degree angle. They definitely look tighter than the general "arc" above it - they look pulled. Probably never a failure point but that's the only thing that jumped out at me which might me what he is talking about?

[@mk2vrt]

Looks like you watched HP Academy and are trying to make a video that's already been made but not close to the infk.it's like your learning as your explaining. Your not even making that harness right your running power wires with sensor wires which is going to cause all kinds of interference.

[@signal_msw]

Nope, haven’t watched the HPA video, and this harness works properly. Thanks for your input though.

[@kevinschlossser7858]

Now using a twisted and shielded pair of wires of the injectors is just plain silly. The shielding makes sense. The twist doesn't. The injectors are going to fire at a different rate based on the engine RPM, that means the frequency in the electrical signal traveling down the wire is not going to be something that is divisible by a constant. The twist in the cable does absolutely zero. There is a reason why data speeds going over network cables has the speeds set as they do. This is to reduce the amount of EMI and that needs to be tuned to the frequency. The number of twists are done so that different speeds are able to be used and still get the benefits of the twist. 100mbit, 1000mbit, 10000mbit etc.... Not gonna see that the injector pulses. All it being twisted does it take up more space and get you frustrated when making a harness like this...

[@signal_msw]

The oem injector wiring is shielded on the vehicle this harness is currently running, so I used the motorsports equivalent wiring. It comes twisted. It was simply a matter of practicality.

[@kevinschlossser7858]

@@signal_msw I get why it was used. IDK if they make a shielded wire that is not twisted. If they do that would make things a whole lot easier when doing the twisting that's for sure.

[@octymocty132]

Easy Step 1 strip and crimp all pin Setp 2 place pins in plug and stick plug in vice Step 3 stick loose wires in a drill and pull trigger Heay persto one wound harness Easy

[@signal_msw]

If only it was that simple.