How Runewords RUINED Diablo 2

[@elegyofthering6363]

Tbh, Llama is one of the only ones who can do a complete roast of Diablo 2 and after two hours do a live 8 hours of D2, and beat the game with a Necromancer with a poison dagger lmao

[@7gamex]

Yes...there's zero other people who can point out the flaws of a game that they are in love with. /sarcasm

[@shanerogowski]

I thought some others could @@7gamex

[@ray1170]

@@7gamexhe literally said “one of the ones” x) feel better buddy

[@runerune-_-9727]

Everyone can. D2 has always been extremely easy but time consuming

[@pl00mer73]

​@@runerune-_-9727Easy? Play hardcore and go ahead and recommend that bud

[@Tumasch]

Tried a self-restricted no-runeword run with a frenzy barb. It was amazing. So many awesome items out there forgotten by time.

[@arsteel2388]

I've started doing no runewords for most of my SSF runs and am having a blast. My current char is also doing no diamond studded shields because getting 3 pdiamonds in a shield makes it better than any rare you'd find anyway.

[@kizo82]

You just gave me a good idea. I use Cactus for version switching, so I could use no runewords restriction but still use runes to socket GG items.

[@rainbowGZUS7]

​@arsteel2388 that was my favorite way to play as a child. I'd spend hours looking for socketed stuff in hell cows, then I'd have 6 chipped emeralds in a maul for my wolf druid lol didn't know how to cube stuff back then

[@jch32983]

i went through hell necro never using a runeword because i didnt know how

[@ViktorBlaskov]

Wrong approach imho, just avoid enigma, grief, last wish. BOTD, for example, is an extremely fun runeword to aim for as the end of your game.

[@HonoluluBlueKirby]

I still remember having to repair my items before selling them to get max gold

[@ImperialVersian]

Exactly. I still out of habit just repair all my items automatically when I interact with any blacksmith NPC

[@itsjoel13]

I feel like the meta for a lot of games these days is just run through as fast as you can. Constantly to the next objective. The best play throughs I’ve ever had are when I put limitations on myself and thus have to go slower and think some more. And it’s funny that when you slow down you start to see and appreciate the little details and subtleties that make this game the masterpiece it is

[@Rumblingbelly]

You are right. The most fun playthroughs are something like a frenzy/ww barb when you have to really hunt for items and its challenging. Casters are OP.

[@PierreLucSex]

I fully agree. I still enjoy Normal difficulty.

[@ray_donovan_v4]

​@@Rumblingbellyyeah and how painful that class truly is in act two and 3 when all those little bastards are running around and you're on frenzy.

[@LethargicCarcass]

This is actually exactly why I enjoy playing hardcore

[@benton9571]

the best games dont need this self restriction though... they are designed with those restrictions in place

[@robertkolbe3751]

I stopped playing d2 Just before the big runewords came out. When i came back to it years later it was truly completely different. The original runewords were Sometimes useful but not op. I somehow like and despise the new runewords at the same time. The new runewords are fun but they completely devalue almost all other items.

[@H3Logan]

How did you manage to type exactly what lama said

[@meanmole3212]

@@H3Logan chatgpt

[@mathollaplays]

just play without useing the big runewords.... dont blame the game

[@williamlaubach3285]

Same here, I played with my friend by burning a cd with the single player save file and bringing it to his house to drag into his game folder and keep playing there. Then he would burn a cd with the save file and I'd bring it home to keep playing. It was... magical

[@ismaeldeleija8165]

@@mathollaplays the thing is, the game got harder when the new runewords came in

[@sirmaffew]

I remember early LoD days, the meta for awhile was WW Barb with dual Fury Balrog Blades. One minor change that amped up the difficulty a lot was when they cut the life and mana leech figures in half. You used to be able to get 6% leech on really low level gear and could leech indefinitely on most monsters, potion chugging wasn't a thing back then. :(

[@MrLlamaSC]

Leech got wrecked in the late patches for sure. Not sure my feelings on it exactly but I guess with how much more leech were on new items it made sense

[@BH-gh6qm]

what era did everyone have a barb with a sick rare pike or lance..i remember it being that or you found a grandfather and was pissed you had to recreate a barb to spec him to sword mastery.

[@SlimThicc_Dc5]

I remember when twin doombringers were the go-to. Seeing as how the grandfather was nowhere to be seen Lolol

[@angrypenguin956]

@@MrLlamaSC This reminds me, pre LOD you could get very low-level items with crazy leech. I remember getting a dual leech 5/7 (for level 10) from Ormus

[@Nygaardism]

@@BH-gh6qm Oh i remember that :D and finding the Uniq Lance was so Hype :P

[@Vibrosis8703]

I really loved the 1.09 days running a guided arrow amazon with buriza, shaftstop, vamp gaze or just mowing cows down with frozen orb + thunderstorm sorc chasing uniques and rares was fun because it all felt manageable to do and rewarding. Personally when I put in the time to grind an Enigma solo in the end I felt "Oh god it's finally over", I dislike the system behind HR drops and the overall gigantic power boost they provide simply nullifying everything else and it created a boring economy where trading just didnt feel enjoyable and fun anymore.

[@danwick8566]

omg 1.09 buriza was the absolute bomb. My freezing/guided arrow Amazon murdered everything.

[@JohnDoeses]

glory days brother

[@MotaDhesi]

1.09 was my favourite patch. Getting rushed all the way to hell... Sitting and leeching exp in bloody foothills, going from level 1 to 80 in 2 hours... No need for tokens.

[@shayewatts-bibby5777]

Your entire logic is copium because you don't want to play long enough to build high runewordss. Just get over it, you're not good enough. The rest of us who have spent our time getting godly gear don't need to be hamstrung by old noobs like you.

[@KierzT]

Seems my comment got deleted, you can still play 1.09, just search for Diablo 09 😊

[@iwatchtoomuchhaikyuu5307]

i remember when spirit first came out i couldn't believe an item like that even existed. I thought they had made a huge error on the runes required and thought it had to have high runes and they were gonna hotfix it asap

[@tremblence]

I had the exact same thought We should have been on the design team, not the idiot who decided spirit would be so powerful and easy to make

[@meanmole3212]

we made a huge error and then we DOUBLED it

[@jprec5174]

@@tremblenceback before 1.10 casters whined that they sucked so they made op runewords for them and nerfed melee.

[@jprec5174]

@@jonathasx the mana pot thing balanced out mages before 1.10. Even if mana pots weren't sold after 1.10, all casters would do is struggle through normal until they made an insight. Before 1.10, it was rare items like lidless and sojs that helped mana mangement and mana after each kill was useful.

[@returnofmerenguespersempre6664]

Meh at some point you either powercreep to keep the interest up or let a game rest in peace. Rune hunt is the D2 endgame. I like it. Thats why I still play D2 while D3 and D4 collects dust.

[@MrLlamaSC]

The hunt is amazing I do agree. I'll actually drop a video about that part soon

[@cypherreport]

The hunt for legendaries in D3 doesn't scratch that itch for you?

[@meatbasedvegan4859]

@@cypherreport not when 50 drop in 1 run lol

[@kyweb-x2c]

@@meatbasedvegan4859 EXACTLY. Looking at item stats all fkking day is a drag, man. Absolute DRAAAAAAAAAAAAG. I don't want to have to read a 1000page book every time an item drops so I can figure out, "are these the best affixes?" Make it simple. Make it compelling. Deleting billions of items IS NOT COMPELLING GAMEPLAY

[@peigen7151]

16:14 I really liked that you mentioned Project Diablo 2. It's a really awesome mod that has improved D2 beyond my wildest expectations. I would love for you to do a more thorough overview of the mod with gameplay footage or at least screenshots covering some of the REALLY cool stuff.

[@robotacid]

Completed LOD 1.07 offline because I didn't have internet back then - and runewords were worthless because there was no way to find out what words worked without losing both runes and equipment. The fundamental problem with runewords is that you have to wiki them, it's unreasonable for anyone who isn't super-online or obsessive to discover their function through play. Even older games like Dungeon Master would at least give you scrolls with recipes for spells. They were implemented in a user-unfriendly way on launch, and then subsequently made worse as time went on. If they were to vanish from the game, I don't think I would miss them. I'd probably enjoy finding loot more, like... I'd actually look at the loot if it doesn''t have sockets.

[@tinutube3858]

Good point!

[@aboutrobots]

yes, I bought D2 and then LoD before I could do online gaming. I never even knew runewords existed. Runes were just a new type of gems that you couldn't upgrade as far as i knew. But because I never knew you could get updates, I don't think runewords were ever in my game anyway.

[@Fender178]

I think Rune Words didn't ruin D2 initially because of the drop tables they had for runes. They were very rare to drop. Yeah during patch 1.09 was indeed the golden age of D2 I remember playing quite a bit on the old bnet servers back in the day and I had zon with buriza and guided arrow and that was amazing. Also remembering having the full mavs set as well. Also old school Windforce added +35 to dex and I remember how much that item was in demand. Not sure when drop tables for runes changed but once they changed the drop table for runes is when I think RuneWords broke diablo 2 because the runes became more common as drops than they were granted the high runes are still rare but they still drop every now and then. Yeah I agree with you Llama there is no simple solution to the problem because if you do one thing you will alienate one group of people and if you did another thing then you would alienate the other group of people.

[@gaspara9817]

I'd say the problem they ran into is some of the most unique elements of those high runewords were introduced to solve the problem of most builds being non viable in Hell difficulty in single player. But they made the rest of the affixes so strong they needed to make them end game cost. But in making them end game cost they made the road to having these build allowing items too long. Really the teleport from enigma (so every non sorc could stop carrying a want with teleport charges), the conviction aura from infinity (so single element casters were viable), the shouts from hoto should have also MUCH weaker but cheaper runeword alternatives that involved giving up overall item slot power for those unique powers. Then you job would be to find other places to make up for the weaker pieces. If they had done it this way they could have left the rune drop rates very low and those super end game replacements could be Post-Hell clear.

[@spaceistheplace8376]

runes didnt ruin d2 ...yeah the runewords did

[@Fender178]

@@spaceistheplace8376 at the beginning runes were very hard to find because they rarely dropped so no one could create rune words. But once the drop tables changed is when rune words truly entered the picture. You can't create rune words without the runes. So yeah runes and rune words go hand and hand.

[@Fender178]

@@gaspara9817 Yeah very true. You make some valid points.

[@saltychipmunk190]

which is why d2 popularized botting

[@K12machinima]

I agree with your point at the end that there isn’t an easy solution to the power creep. I personally find the same joy of grinding my way up to those words, but, it also makes you feel less value to the gear that carried you to that point. I’ll never forget the joy of grinding LK and Countess in Hell, just to get my first Enigma for my first “real deal” summoners. The pure catharsis of earning something, after weeks of grind and willpower, is why I’ve played RuneScape since ‘05, and have played OldSchool since ‘19. However, yeah, once you get your dream words, nothing compares… and you kill the joy of progressing, that you can only get again by making a new character, but, you’ll be tempted to twink to that point. I find the solution more to be Median’s approach, by altering your own gear, and making it work to your skills. That’s just my idea though, and I think it’s a good start. :)

[@MrLlamaSC]

Median crafting was so fun to me. Still one of my favorite ways to modify items while still having RNG

[@JimmyZeng]

"once you get your dream words, nothing compares… and you kill the joy of progressing", if runewords are not that powerful, something else is gonna take its place, it's not the fault of runewords.

[@ApathyBM]

To me synergies are the biggest issue with power creep. It forces everyone to spec into useless early game skills for the insanely unbalanced powerboost and killed versatile hybrid builds. Also pre-Mosiac they could have made Martial Arts viable by giving it synergies but they didn't for whatever reason

[@Hell0spawn0doug]

@@JimmyZeng if runewords were more balanced there would be more options. If enigma was more balanced, barbs would never want it, but that’s not the case. If grief was more balanced maybe you would see more death cleavers, grandfathers or doombringers. The point that I think he is trying to make is once you have grief there’s nothing else, there is no point to any other weapon in game. No matter what you pick up you are “done” with that slot, when that was not the case pre runewords.

[@JimmyZeng]

@@Hell0spawn0doug not really contradict what I'm saying, all amazon uses ethereal titan's revenge, does that mean it ruines d2/amazon?

[@kizzagaming6523]

Ethereal Cruel Colossus Blade Of Quickness (yellow glow) - Or The Lamprey for the red colour. I loved those days, or farming for a cruel hammer of quickness for ur zealot dueller. We were some of the original LLD players as well, and it was so exciting and fun when there wasn't really rules around it like getting hell rushed for the points, then taking your level 21 paladin or 18 paladin in and completely crushing a dueller room. Also in terms of runewords I still love a stepping stone weapon being an Eth " Oath " balrog blade runeword. I wish that runewords like that saw use as a more end game or stepping stone to rare weapon. Anyway, eating dinner don't want to ramble too much.

[@szalaierik]

I loved the hunt for uniques. I would love making rares top tier again. Maybe even create the possibility of personal sets with them: your three personalized rares should become a set.

[@rustyshackleford11]

mate, rares are top tier lol, in many slots

[@guynamedstevo6581]

Especially in the slots where you cant use runewords

[@georgimateev6717]

@@guynamedstevo6581 and then there's arach and war travs and magefist

[@YourAubsome]

Great video. Its so annoying that the best in slot bow for a bowazon is unquestionably faith. Nothing else even comes close. That completely destroys build diversity if you want to use a bowazon

[@MrLlamaSC]

Yeah. I mean windforce still does have its uses thanks to big max dmg but faith is very dominant in the space

[@joeyecc]

Nice vid. One remark: OP rares mentioned like 300+ ED weapons were only introduced in 1.10. Rare affix pool was very weak in 1.07 1.08 and 1.09. However pre-patch rares (before expansion) were indeed strong, and also very common due to the fact that the affix pool was much smaller than today. It was relatively easy to gamble a triple 3x resist boots with STR.

[@lildavo87]

Noticed that too, cruel(up to 300% ed) of quickness magic weapons were best in slot for most melee characters or I remember making a WW polearm barb socketed with 40/15s. Rares sucked.

[@joeyecc]

@@lildavo87 Yes. And Cruel affix was a magic only affix. 200 ED was the highest possible ED on rares (King's + Merciless).

[@jprec5174]

They need to buff the base of melee weapons and buff rare and magic affixes again. Imo3os magics should make a comeback at least. For rares to compete with grief they need to roll something like 550% ed or somen ridiculous. Thats how good grief is. Honestly path of exile figured it all out with items +crafting.

[@Grodstark]

I hate runewords. They took all the versatility out from the game and made every class the same. Literally. I also think they should remove Attack Rating completely from the game, to boost Melee characters, since magic always hit. Why even have attack rating then? It just nerfs Melee builds.

[@PerceptionsofFate]

at least they made BER the rune for Enigma. and Infinity.. not impossible, but i can count on my fingers in one hand how many i have found SSF... farming bots ruined that and made rune words a problem... i put 500 hours into a farming sorc and found 1 BER in 500 hours of farming. SSF Infinity and Enigma on 1 character is borderline impossible without 1000s of hours in farming. BUT i do agree with Grief, Spirit and Insight as breaking the game...

[@Araghos]

SSF online or offline? Offline you can get Enigma in 20-30 hours of LK farming.

[@vyvianalcott1681]

In thousands of hours of hunting the highest rune I ever saw drop was Um :(

[@lennyghoul]

You could get it in 1 minute, or it could take thousands of hours, because that's how odds work. @@Araghos

[@CCFQuelex]

Disagreed because the overwhelming majority of people aren't getting runewords like Enigma or Grief. It's a goal that you can work toward and can make incremental progress to instead of the lottery that is the rest of the item system. Is it perfect? No. But I wouldn't say it ruined the game by any means.

[@natanportan1676]

Corruptions are always interesting. Many uniques need buffs and reworks. Rares really need an affix pool buff, PD2 did some of that right, like FCR on belts, FCR and +skills on body armors, deadly strike/crushing blow on weapons, things that can get pretty insane, especially with crafting on top. Slapping +skills on everything might sound lame, but not much can be done about it if that's so powerful. Maybe more focus on +% elemental damage affixes to balance it. Immunities were also a mistake in the long run, or rather the limited ways to break them. 95% or so resistances would still be a big roadblock at first, but something that you could deal with using various items with -resistances affixes. Sunders are barely a bandage on that issue when in most cases endgame character prefers Infinity anyway.

[@DorjeB0dh]

+ skills is the only reason I love diablo, it makes it easy for me to understand that I love this skill, and this item provides + to that skill, so this item is for me.

[@alexeski4109]

I personally like how project diablo 2 solves these problems. For example nerfing spirit to +1 skills and less fhr, removing absorb. Or enigma having a teleport with 3 charges that replenish called blink, but most classes also get new movement skills. And the crafting system is neat, allowing crafted items to be a huge part of endgame along with rares and uniques. I didn’t even buy D2R when I realized they weren’t going to truly shake things up or add any kind of endgame mechanics. I would rather just play LoD at that point (although I think I’m in a minority of players who feel that way).

[@MrLlamaSC]

My biggest issue with pd2 is the item power creep is a little high for me. But I do think it does a fantastic job of bringing fun and balance back to an item landscape dominated by runewords

[@alexeski4109]

@@MrLlamaSC definitely true about powercreep, LoD content becomes trivial with the extra affixes and sockets on everything in pd2. Pd2 is definitely not perfect but I have a lot of love for some of the changes they have made. I had hoped D2R could find a middle ground between LoD and pd2, taking some of the runeword nerfs and unique and crafting buffs but leaving out corruptions and puzzleboxes.

[@jlas6637]

Kind of ironic considering the first season of PD2 was riddled with players complaining about how difficult hell was. The crafting season was peak PD2 and I hope they have another one soon.

[@lxreedyxl4605]

Would definitely come back for a full season of no runewords.

[@lmaoious7681]

Hey, might be a lot longer videos but it would be nice to see…. Have to grind hard for a set

[@Rumblingbelly]

We need a version 1.09 updated to battle net season

[@wulfgarpl]

I like that idea. With seasons we could test different restriction on runwords (Not every season. People like Runewords.) Next example of season: You can only have 1 Runeword on character. Though it would end up with Enigma. I really thing teleport should be a unique charm.

[@arkadaurum298]

Can’t you just play classic tho???

[@kevinoneil5120]

Hot take, but I think in a world devoid of bots/duping/jsp, Enigma would be a fair item. If you can find/trade for a jah and a ber within a game economy untainted by the issues I mentioned, not only would we see far *less* of them but you would absolutely have earned everything enigma does for you.

[@Ubeogesh]

Still it's just too easy of a choice which armor to make id you have 3 Bers.

[@kevinoneil5120]

​@@UbeogeshBut again... 3 bers in a world without bots and jsp is no small task.

[@sickofitall8486]

@@UbeogeshI’d make Infinity and farm for a Jah. I could never in good conscience cube two Ber runes.

[@paintspot1509]

100% agree. I don't think I've ever dropped a Jar rune in 20 years.

[@Peter-zg3em]

whubout that ith rune. really drives the price up

[@AG-ld6rv]

So the problem of Enigma might actually be a problem of teleport. I don't think the creators of DII envisioned people becoming so efficient that they skipped through 95% of the game to reach enemies that can drop anything. It's just so crazy when FCR is high. What could be done about that? * Remove teleport completely. * Make teleport have a smaller cast radius. * Make it take longer to cast teleport. * Perhaps provide some kind of debuff after teleporting, potentially stacking the more used in a row. They could also give in and allow people to play a non-sorc as their first toon... and not teleport staffs that suck away all of your gold. Perhaps, it would be a little stronger on sorc as she is a sorc, but come on... everyone needs a sorc. It kinda forces a person into playing one no matter what build they want to go. Well, if they want to keep up with the 90% of players using the logical sorc upon ladder launch. They could make slaying weaker monsters more beneficial so that teleport isn't needed to snipe the best monsters/bosses. They could provide a reasonable runeword that has teleport. I don't know. I'm not a game designer nor do I ever want to be the person who gets the wrath of DII players for changing DII. But yeah, Enigma/teleport makes the game kinda weird. On the other hand, I do like that ber demand is so strong that it acts as a logical currency for expensive items. Most other items, only a % of people need them. A necro, a barbarian, a sorc, an assassin, a druid, and an amazon usually need different stuff. Enigma is different in that every single class, including a sorc, wants it. That's kind of cool. It makes a common currency out of bers. As for Infinity, I think lowering resistances might just need a balancing change. I suppose that's what the 1/5th was trying to do, but when an item gives flat reduction to resistances regardless of immunities like Griffons, it is just insane. You end up doing like 3x the damage from one item. Perhaps not a popular opinion, but I think the rework should be based on immune monsters first and foremost. Those stink unless you have a pack of people all to play at the same time! So remove that (but keep different creatures having higher resistances against certain types of damages than others), perhaps make every source of negative resistance 1/5th what is listed, and at the end of it, reduce the rarity of these items / the runes needed to make them to compensate for how much worse they become. Spirit and double Spirit is just wild... Oh ,one last thing. Another solution would be to increase the potency of super rare uniques. Perhaps if a 2-handed unique staff did a little more, we wouldn't see everyone using 2 Spirits.

[@Houldey]

I only play solo / offline, so I appreciate i have a very different experience to many others - but I love the runewords, because they're still VERY special to me. I still haven't had many of the great OP ones you list here, I've yet to find a Ber rune myself. Granted i've only been playing a few months now in D2R, but I did play a lot back during LoD days. I think for online players - who essentially get access to everything incredibly quickly by sheer number of ways to gear, its understandable - as your gear journey isn't really a journey anymore - just a destination and you need only trade a few neat things you find to get there. I think seasonal models would be a good route if blizz is deciding to continue D2R support, no runes season etc. I think skill charms would be a sick addition though, would need some real hamstringing though to make sure they aren't equally as busted mind.

[@xijinpig7978]

You don't need to find a Ber. You build up into a Ber Go lower kurast and open super chest on P7 Thank me

[@meanmole3212]

@@lespoje8526 The game's a slot machine simulator regardless so you might as well do that.

[@swirekster]

i remember playing diablo 2 and getting rares from time to time and i felt pretty good about their powers, they were pretty interesting, then i visited the Wiki and saw all the crazy stuff and those items never felts as special again.

[@ApathyBM]

At the super end game, some rares are still best in slot. Rings, amulets, and circlets

[@War_Maker]

@@ApathyBM Weapons too.. rare/blue claws > hoto + spirit for a trap sin.

[@rexvectum]

Rares still 100% still shred though especially eth throwing stuff for barbs now

[@jarenb2331]

Seasonal runeword are a cool idea to keep the game fresh though. Similar to how they would implement ladder only runewords back in the day. Also Brevick and Blizz North left before 1.10 was released. They implemented all these items and then blizz north was dissolved and it was never fixed or altered. Peter Hu finished 1.10

[@superanderson]

I think spirit is the true outlier because it's too cheap for what it is and didn't really enable any builds that couldn't otherwise swim, it just became the one and only offhand answer for casters. Bring some uniques and potential with rares up to a competitive level with grief, enigma, and other bis runewords. Don't make one's that are MORE powerful, create some horizontal power in the endgame, options are good. I don't think buffs are the answer for spirit though I would definitely like to see some other shields contend but not at spirits level I think it needs to be nerfed by either removing or heavily pulling back some of the res or replacing one of the runes with a high rune.

[@mescalito1706]

I think we can throw in Mosaic in the broken runeword category. Over the time, I feel like we get attached to the runewords as they offer some form of guarantee in achieving a strong character. If you grind long enough, you'll get to them eventually. Applies to the solo self found game experience. The same could be said for uniques but most come short to the runewords in terms of power but I feel like increasing their power will make them equivalent to runewords. Some form of nerfs is required, specifically the low cost runewords. What would be fun though, is adding possibilities for rare items to be best in slots through very rare attributes or crafting, specifically for shields and armors.

[@jprec5174]

Mosaic is the worst offender. Cheap runeword and completely makes the build as without it ma sins suck.

[@Healcannon]

Cross class skills from runewords were always so neat to me. They were what made the game so fun especially seeing the interactions with the skills on the new class. Melee dual dream enchantress inspired my builds across other diablo games but also across many other rpgs that weren't even made by blizzard.

[@snufalufagas]

Played D2 since release and I never let myself use teleport on non sorcs. A code of my own invention but a code nonetheless

[@bobby4500]

srs the most fun i have with d2 is when leveling and doing quests together, as soon as you hit hell all games are trade game and high char join your hell games just to have players 4 or 8 or whatever, its all messed up in hell

[@josquinlanglois2554]

Nice video, would really love a D2 season without runes, would be very interesting

[@gunrookie2523]

Yes this so much

[@grmigrim9834]

Maybe not without runes, but without runewords.

[@ghhg228]

@@grmigrim9834 just without grief and enigma

[@Yslohr]

hahahaha /s "For the Low price of a Lo Rune"

[@nightechoes6192]

What frustrates me its the huge potential for new items and runewords but blizzard couldn't care less

[@MrLlamaSC]

There is a lot of potential but I would also be scared of what could come out. Seeing items in D4 doesn't make me hopeful

[@danielcox7490]

@@MrLlamaSCexactly

[@Tom_Van_Zandt]

Or, as my old boss used to always say, they COULD care less. Classic Charlie.

[@h3rtzen]

They don’t care about this game anymore, forgive and forget

[@patrickfitzgerald1354]

I just want a act 6

[@dark1021]

I will never understand people (Not you I get where you're coming from) that just can't get it. . YOU DON'T HAVE TO USE THESE ITEMS OR PLAY A CERTAIN BUILD! It's not like D2 is some massive league level pvp game that needs to be homogeni- i mean "Balanced". I am willing to bet most plyers are solo and others are like a few friends groups. A controlled environment in which you can play the way you guys want. Don't expect it from public players. It's like how everyone complains about sorc teleport. So don't use it? Oh you're not a sorc then who cares that's not your class or it's fantasy. Shutup and slap on enigma or get a tele staff. Or the cold sunder with sorc. Don't want the game to be super easy? Don't use a damn sunder charm its THAT simple, like lol. These people are what got us to D4. Just an everyone can do everything and is the same. That want others to play the way they play "Because". Playing without runewords or off-meta builds can actually come to be an enjoyable experience with the things you have to overcome that you'd normally just slap a runeword on and sail by.

[@zickityz6549]

Hardcore Solo self found on player 1 difficulty has made the game more rewarding for me. Although it’s definitely time consuming, u may end up playing the same characters for years. It will take a while to find true gg items. And aside from hardcore just playing through the game.. leveling up, facing true challenges is the best experience for me.

[@Rumblingbelly]

I just did this with a solo self found zealer paladin and the spider at nm a3 killed me with a single hit while i was cursed

[@meanmole3212]

@@Rumblingbelly ribs in crispy zakarum organ grill pieces my mate

[@hueco5002]

Hardcore solo is fun but I still enjoy playing with my friend from high school. We ran 1.09 and 1.10 for hours back then. Still fun to run the game now.

[@mathollaplays]

u can play the game without useing the 'uber' runewords... simples as that. ENIGMA was made so solo players could BE solo players and grind as fast as possible

[@bobbarker3306]

I think it would have been better if they made a +1 to teleport affix possible on rares. I personally enjoyed 1.09 more than anything since.

[@qaerkyr]

so much hate... quit crying about infinity. after the new unique gcs, infinity is TRASH. you think enigma is broken? maybe for you getting all those JAHs and BERs for free it is. ofc those RW are broken for you if you use 3rd party cheats such as d2jsp. in 4 leagues in d2r I barely was able to find a JAH and a BER. you and all the streamers ruined dragon and fire aura builds. build extreamely hard to get because of all hrs. but yea it comes natural for you to ruin a chance that casual playe4 would enjoy some P1 farm with them. because in your imagination they are broken.how many ppl still make them in this ladder? Nobody. Thanks alot for your contribution in making those RW useless again frustrated Mr.LammaScrubCore! why is the grief broken when you have no splash damage for melee. do you even farm stuff as a melee paladin to see how hard the game is for a fanaticism zealot? you go farm nihlathak temple as a melee without "killed monsters remains slained". you sure did forget the iron maiden curse skill on monsters. go complain then and play HC not SC which is for babies. Go grief or LW on assassin kicksin and see how useless they are when comparing them to stormlash in P8 hell baal runs. I guess not since the game is so easy for you with cheats like d2jsp or getting all the items and runes for free. enigma isn't the best in slot item. you go and do ubers with enigma instead of guardian angel. you go play passion sorceress build with enigma instead of 4s 100 lf AP. you go equip your mercs with enigma instead of fortitude and other armors.

[@jarchu]

i personally would go a rather rough path to some solution, which is just remove grief, and then nerf rest so those wouldnt be so op compared to rest. i want to see rares in use! also perhaps some way to make said rares more viable, similar to what orbbof corruption did, maybe even have the bricking as part of it 😂

[@Dreamonology]

.09 was my fav LOD patch, 1-99 hell cows with nova orb sorc XD, but before runewords we had open b net hacked items, online play ofc. Legit gear would be eth skulders ire, occy orb, lidless wall shield, 2x 30 mf nagels, war travs, goldwrap, chances, was so fun going full mf on a orb/nova sorc, good ol days Uniques were way more important, and good rares in og .08-09 lod patches. but you could also play devil's advocate, and say there wasn't really any diversity in older versions either, every melee played shaftstop armor, vamp gaze etc etc, most of the gg rares were for pvp only, which sadly hardly anyone does now. (well everyone played all the hacked items lol white rings, occy rings,) people felt weaker when Rust Storm hit the big anti cheat warden update that fixed the open b net exploit to closed b net. (i'm old)

[@AndrewWeber2]

On the release of D2R, I played SSF non-LOD HC. I had played a lot of Slash Diablo, so I was very familiar with the LOD meta of the game up to that point. I was amazed at how well the game flowed, how exciting it was to identify rare items, & how I had to handle different immunities once I got into Hell. I thoroughly enjoyed it. I didnt need to spam Countess til I got the same item everyone else had. I wasn't disappointed at the Hellforge. I enjoyed it so much, it kinda ruined LOD for me. I haven't played any mods recently & I can imagine vanilla D2 not scaling well long term, but the game itself just was such a joy to play.

[@zerogjoe4971]

What hurt D2 the most was getting rid of blizz north !!!!! And letting them all go . I remember the barb gear upped shaftstop p ruby, arrets summit helm ,stormshield ,string belt, raven and leech ring, grandfather. I rememver when 40/15s armor shield combo for java was deadly. On how i would fix it. Give barb a wall brake skill wont be as good as tele but unquie. Zon shift places with a clone or val Druid have him go into the veins underground Necro have him take tge fourm of a dead corp that is far away. Assassin give her a flash step marshel art step. Make them special not just a single skill for all

[@chuckkwaske958]

What if the rune word strength varied based on level of the base item used to create it, so a normal base would have stats appropriate for normal play, etc. You would still be godly in Hell, but at least your normal and nightmare play would be more varied

[@xxxx85]

Runewords should never have been a separate item type, to compete against rares/uniques. Runewords are too strong and make uniques in the same slot worthless. But also, the runeword system is just so much more boring than finding unique items. Runewords should have been something different completely. For example, it could have been a system to augment other items with certain abilities (similar to socketing, but a different system). But that's just an example. If there ever will be another D2 expansion (one can dream), I'd wish all runewords were removed from the game completely, and runewords brought in in a completely different way. Of course adjust skill trees (remove Teleport), other uniques, and so on.

[@lov3masterns]

The one thing Mr. Llama forgot to mention (which is a big part of changing the game forever) is the fact that back in the days you couldn't just open up a browser page and look at the complete list of all runewords that exist (or at least those kind of helping tool sites weren't so popular). What this meant is that you actually had to experiment yourself with putting different combinations of runes into items just to find out what is the exact combo needed for what runeword, and if you didn't write them down (and you for example had your character deleted/killed), you would struggle a lot later on with creating the same thing from the shear memory. That aspect alone, of experimenting and collecting resources just so you can "gamble" with them and very often waste them but also getting the full on satisfaction when you finally succeed just shattered later on. On the other hand, what also kinda changed D2 forever are so called "builds". Or let's say meta builds. I played for an age (don't ask me how) on version 1.07 and then later on 1.09 (until I switched to D2R) and there weren't so strict "builds" you ran with, you had a bunch of characters that are different classes yet they usually had a bit of everything or what Llama mentioned before character resets, we all had characters that had a bunch of "wasted" skills that never got any use. Ahhhh those were the days my friend! :)

[@adamg4912]

I remember the first time I putting a rune word (probably ancient's pledge) into a something that had 4 slots rather than exactly 3 and being dumbfounded as to why it didn't work lol the days before Google.

[@jaredbowen9942]

This is not true. Blizzard released every runeword themselves in the official strategy guide and they were all on The Arreat Summit. You were playing on self Inflicted hard mode lol

[@HermesAthena72]

I have printed all the horadric cube features back then. 30 pages. I still have it and search for combination

[@ulozto666]

Yea Atma was name of that program.. cheating .

[@scipocelah6677]

I just started 4 runs of finding a build that I'm interested in playing at end game, then leveling the build in my own way to reach that point. The only Runeword I KNOW is Stealth and after this video I don't plan on looking up any and just want to experiment. But my melee assassin is sooooo much more fun to play than spamming fireblast for 12 levels. Same with my Spearzon without Poison Jav is so much more fun than just... Spam Poison Jav. The other two are Frenzy Barb (my favorite build so I'm making a new one) and Holy Freeze Paladin.

[@tremblence]

100% agree on Spirit I remember writing entire thread posts on forums...... describing how Spirit is so overpowered, that its no fun even looking for shields and caster weapons.... all the way until late game, nearly ruined d2 for me Unbelievable how stupid ideas like Spirit made it into the game......(should cost 1-2 hrs and be 1-2 all skills and 5-20 fcr)

[@256nightcool]

Better then d4 😊

[@legendcrump23]

D2 will Always be the Best Diablo! #2 is diablo 1 of course ps1 status

[@Parasmunt]

I disagree that they ruined Diablo 2. They made possible a whole group of extra builds. Some are overpowered true but who is going to complain about a runeword that gives teleportation to every class? What's wrong with that? The main complaint that can be levied against Enigma is all the other things it gives, about four of which are extremely desirable and the highest possible you can get for that on that kind of item (or thereabouts - MF beaten by Skullders).

[@Lifeform84]

I strongly disagree that ruinwords ruined the game, the problem is not with the ruinwords themselves, Its that blizzard never bothered to expand upon the crafting system in the game, Eastern Sun its a great example of how Crafting should have been done in D2... Not only you can add modifiers to items, but also spell skills, How cool is it to have CTC Frozen Orb on an item, or fataticism or chain lightning or spells like curse or lower resist, You can also farm materials and make news items from that, i played Eastern Sun for years and i love it, To balence the powerful crafting options you need to farm a ton of materials as they are not cheap.... My point is the lack of advance crafting options is what ruined Diablo 2 for many in my opinion.

[@tylerfrost7831]

Teleport on only sorc is lame; teleport on every class because chest is also quite lame. Teleport could have either used a cooldown or other classes should have been given options for a movement skill. If Enigma has to exist and teleport stays with no cooldown, I don't hate your idea of chucking it on a charm or something similar. Even if just 1 or 2 other classes had a similar skill to teleport I think the game would have been better - giving people options to start with a choice of class on ladder reset rather than making everyone feel forced to start sorc would have been great. I feel like ARPGS are much more enjoyable when you have actual difficult decisions to make with your gear.

[@MythrilZenith]

The Big Issue with Runewords is that they are often far better than the majority of items you could get at that level. If they were less powerful or more niche, that would probably feel better, stuff like Ancients Pledge, where it's a solid option if you don't have anything better but it doesn't push out every other shield that exists. I kind of feel like Stealth itself is still problematic though because there's pretty much NO reason to not use it for the entirety of normal and most of nightmare, potentially into Hell because of how many bonuses it gives. And then once you get to endgame runewords like Enigma you can see how warped the game became around them. On one hand they are THEORETICALLY harder to get because they require multiple specific items, but every rune is far more common than most unique items or even a good rolling rare. In my mind, runewords should be good fallback or niche equipment that can help get you through if you don't get good rares or uniques, but they should pretty much never be BIS.

[@MrLlamaSC]

Yeah Stealth definitely gives a LOT of power through 3 simple affixes at 25% a pop. Sure you may find a vipermagi or create smoke or treachery or something but if you don't hit one of those (like you won't most of the time) you just stick with stealth.

[@thomasrosendahl2783]

Spirit only feels overpowered in normal and nightmare not Hell on players 3+, and a major factor is also how skilled you are at D2.

[@ApathyBM]

Would be great if Runewords mainly provided mid game consistency. Need cannot be Frozen, get Rhyme. Need res and missile defence, get Sanctuary, etc.

[@MrDukeharry]

Wdym ruined, we're still playing this 23 y old game lol. 90% of my thousands of hours have been spent looking for runes. Still haven't found Cham and Zod and can't wait to see them drop in SP. If not for crazy runewords I would have never gotten hooked for life.

[@AlanWake-c7y]

Half of the video can be about just Spirit and how it did it's deed. Changed the primary weapon(shield) for more than half the builds/playstyles.

[@lordthundyr894]

It's stupidly good. Spirit in a shield only or up one of the runes to at least Fal. We have our weapons back.

[@MrLlamaSC]

Spirit is so far above and beyond all other caster shields. All benefit with zero downside for essentially free

[@Parasmunt]

@@lordthundyr894 I would say gul or vex (because no other shield other than Paladin shields gives +2 skills).

[@Hell0spawn0doug]

I hate spirit just because I’ve always hated hammerdins. I’ve always felt like tower shields should have been able to get to 4os so that every caster class could benefit from it at level 25, but no let’s give the most op spec at the time the ability to wear it 20 levels sooner with 1/3 the str requirement and why not have the added perk of 1-40 all res while we are at it.

[@lordthundyr894]

@@MrLlamaSC And at level 25 to boot (though only for the Paladin). I play mostly SSF, and I must admit that it's hard thinking of when last I played a character that didn't have dual Spirit for most of the content playthrough. Certainly none recently.

[@ryanmaxwell5076]

Funny how you sight the single greatest difference between d2 and the rest of the (maligned) franchise as an example of how runewords ruined d2. Truth is, runes _saved_ D2 and quite possibly are what most people remember when they think of the game. And when Blizzard did strip tele from Enigma and other such changes, they all but killed their game.

[@jblps]

I'm not in the "They ruined the game" camp, but I'm pretty close. When the runewords came out we were all really excited, because it was so new, and everything was powerful. We hadn't hit that moment where literally everyone had the same gear but it quickly became that. Enigma definitely changed the game for the worse. Botting really took off after that too

[@jprec5174]

This. I keep telling people the easier you make a game the easier you make botting and a lot of these runewords like insight, enigma and infinity made botting extremely easy.

[@coryhames9331]

Awesome 👍 Make a fun video like this on the super busted 1.08 days of ith balrog blades, 4 socket eth indestructible valors, occy rings, wiz rings 😎 +3 skills on each ring. 160/60 inside an eth valor. What a time.

[@michelle778]

As a casual player there is nothing wrong with those runewords. It takes forever to find them yourself - so the grind is still there. The only thing I miss from the good old days is the community - but that could be solved by an in game trading system and functional chat...

[@Gainz-mg2pq]

Yeah took me 2 years and thousands of hours of farming to finally make enigma. Remove those and ill leave a game ive played for 20 years in my past forever. Everyone who complains about this stuff are those who are lucky enough to experience all of these 1:10000000000 chance of rune drop runewords. Ill always be toxic about these crap drop rates. Ive yet to see a Jah in over 2k hours how tf am i supposed to make last wish etc… 4-500mf runs and thousands of runs ive seen like 1 rare diadem. Among only seing 1 white unearthed wand. Im legit cursed on this game.

[@alisaforster28691]

Yeah, tookme half an hour until my character was farming for spirit and insight. So hard! So cruel! Cry cry cry!

[@bloodfurypk666]

fury runeword already dominitate 1,09 because the eth bug for melee . good video `m sock for your young age you have that much knowlege from this old era 👍 ok i watch all the video old gameplay is far better and the answer is simple balance is better for pve and pvp . enigma and delete 50% of the game item also kill all bashing animation pvp making a lot of melee build a most useless

[@BWGPT]

The runeword Spirit should become ethereal and lose durability over time. It's in the name "Spirit". Then it would be good for leveling but not good as end game gear. It should last for like an hour in a crystal sword and two hours in a monarch.

[@Chalkstix]

Let's discuss how runewords ruined Diablo 2: They didn't. The end.

[@qaerkyr]

if you hate RW so much why don't you go and play only classic D2? nobody is forcing you to play LOD mrIGetAllMyRunesForFreeCryBabySC!

[@pillboxstyx]

Enigma, Infinity, Spirit, and Grief could all use a small nerfing. But more important to me would be making the uniques stronger. Even with a minor nerfing; will something else be better for melee than Grief? Probably not. I feel like hell p8 has basically been tuned with runewords in mind and the root issue is there aren't any uniques that reach the same heights even with how rare some of the unique drops are.

[@SizarieldoR]

But if you make the uniques stronger, then you have to make sets and rares stronger. Afterwards, you need to make monsters stronger. This is power creep.

[@dark1021]

The problem with that is 1 those are ENG GAME runewords(Save spirit, if you're talking shield even that, that's Hell at the very least for anyone but pala). And 2 if you nerf them people are just going to find the next best thing, and the cycle continues until we get stale crackers, Like D4. Where everyone is roughly the same. Everyone has equal movement. Everyone has some big oopsie defensive. Everyone has some big damage CD etc.

[@kalohr]

isn't teleport broken ? I think that there should be a cool off, a timeout... which would diminish with the number of skill points invested. Sorcs should have access to the fastest teleport but they would have to invest some points. At the same time, enigma should give a very slow teleport (level 1)... maybe such an arrangement could lead to more builds and a better game

[@Arrinao1]

Wow, this could actually be THE solution.

[@kalohr]

@@Arrinao1 d2 is full of trade offs... or at least was... or at least it started that way... or at least it should be this way... anyway, this should be an important trade off... mobility should require investment...

[@kalohr]

@@Arrinao1 been writing about it for years in the forums... and in youtube comments

[@MultiEpique]

I remember how overjoyed I was as a ten year old, when set items dropped. The feeling seeing that green was glorious. Now all im looking for is orange and gold. As you said, sets and rares are nearly obsolete.

[@paintspot1509]

Aren't rare ammys/rings/javs/gloves/boots/helms the most godly items? Pretty sure they are.

[@Industrious420]

Orange and gold? What game are you playing bruv cause it ain't D2

[@MultiEpique]

@@Industrious420 Runes are displayed orange, uniques gold.

[@chriskoukakis2285]

Its so sad that items like Grand Father, Arkaines and Hellsalyer lost their value,it was our holy grails back then...

[@jacobwann2280]

One interesting change to solve the teleport and enigma dilemma would be to add teleport as a chance to roll on the standard of hero’s. This way you still have to grind to get it just like a torch but it could still roll as worthless like it is now. It would also take up space in your inventory and you could change it to a 2 or 3 slot item in there where now it changes your inventory some as well.

[@TaigaUppercut]

Gonna have to disagree, without enigma, alot of the skill gap in pvp is removed, C/T, chainlocking, positioning and pacing of the duels, ect… tournaments would be extremely less skilled and deep.

[@Parasmunt]

It was such a good game players try to extend it as much as possible, beating the game on hardcore max players. Then ubers. Then doing it with every class. Then through builds. Then having one of every kind of superweapon runeword. Then holy grail. And you feel disappointed that you finished it. A great game with an atmosphere that cannot be beat. Diablo 3 and 4 should have been extensions of D2 each giving 4 new acts and increasing level max to 150 overall.

[@xijinpig7978]

What?? You want D2 to have Greater Rifts 150? Are you dumb or what? Almost infinite monster hp and monster damage scaling. If D2 has GR 150, only Mosaic can do it. Ask Mr Llama how he increased the player count to absurd numbers and purely crowd control and OP damage beat them, 24 32 64 ...... 2000++ So.. You want 5 Mosaic Assassin + 1 Bo Barb + 1 support static field Sorc + support Conviction Paly to be the meta? Jesus Christ!

[@kril859]

Next idea for a video "How blizzard ruined diablo4" 😊

[@xdaveleex]

The problem with in theory rolling things back (remove runewords or nerf them) is that people will just find the next thing to complain about. Like if you really want, then go play single player without the runewords or maybe open a duel league with rules around banned runewords. For pvm... a hammerdin will still obliterate the game. If anything it feels like having a segregated forum might be the answer. In any case, I still think diablos an incredible game 😂

[@mutant8273]

You can always play the classic game - I personally play the sorceress and pick up every yellow object 😘

[@NBCatch22]

How were the original rune words discovered? Did players need to find them? Perhaps the issue is not that they exists, but players already know what they want and how to get it before you even start a season.

[@aquilonianace4791]

Just play D2 before the lord of destruction expansion. I do. It's more fun

[@StefanRindom]

I remember having to use my mana potion farming barbarian to feed my sorc :)

[@andrew1435]

It's one of the reasons I play classic and have absolutely no interest in expansion. In classic, everyone has different gear. You don't farm for runes, you farm for rares. With a rare, you never know what you're going to get and I just love that feeling when I find a gg one. It's just so much more satisfying.

[@christianvonkeitz7057]

True words! How would you nerf those RW to be fair? I personally would leave Infinity but would nerf Grief (simply less flat dmg, 280-340 maybe), Enigma (only + 1 skills, far less strength and MF but with TP and add/change more uniques with TP) and especially Spirit (+1 skills and less FHR, FCR and mana) because it’s so cheap and too available within a sword that early.

[@tremblence]

Exactly my thoughts Some items are simply injected into the game with too high of stats A simple stat nerfing solves everything cleanly

[@Craftinges]

Nah runes are completly balanced for me thats what made the diablo 2 best outthere. Also greif is not Op it needs a buff. Melee chars have the lowest dps even with grief and also single target. Melee needs a splash area damage then greif would be good. A zeal paladin not work with just grief. You need gore rider, Guillaume's Face etc critic and crushing blow and attack speed. So half items are rare/unique/set and half of them are runewords completely balanced. You farm mephisto whatever to get uniques/sets and 85 areas for runes. whats wrong with that and still it takes 5+ minutes to clear the sanctuary :) while a sorc clears it in minutes. Only thing I dont like is teleporting. It should be removed or only with charged items so no spamming.

[@MrLlamaSC]

I think grief emphasizes how bad other weapons are because you are right. It isn't exactly OP overall but just compared to every other weapon which is bad and needs to be buffed.

[@yorkshirelad3133]

if they removed any of those top tier runewords they would lose most of the player base, me included

[@MrLlamaSC]

Idk if removal is the solution so much as small nerfs or adjustments to other item types to bring them closer

[@lennyghoul]

Too most people those are chase items. It's only people who play this game for a living that actually find this stuff on a regular basis. @@MrLlamaSC

[@yorkshirelad3133]

these items have been an integral part of the game for so long now, I actually enjoy saving up them, and while getting runes is easy on battlenet, gathering runes on SP is by orders of magnitude harder, lots of uniques need re-vamping that's for sure

[@aarongagnow6027]

See I feel like arguably these items are what make d2 so fun. Who wants to sort through 9million garbage items to find what's good, when you could just grind to find the items that make you good. Idk about yall, but wafflestomping monsters is what makes these games fun. Being weak and struggling is not the fun part.

[@MrLlamaSC]

I think the nice part about D2 is that you don't have 9 million garbage items and then 1 good item. Many items are good enough so you can upgrade at a pretty solid pace.

[@Marko_Ilic]

I still, to this day, play D2 in version 1.09. It is, in my opinion, the best version of the game. It has the expansion and all that it contains but at the same time no OP runewords, the caster/melee characters are more evenly balanced (no mana pots to buy) and more diverse builds (no synergies, more points for different/unrelated skills). Edit: In 1.09 the only way you could get Tal from Countess in normal is by cubing, the highest rune she drops is Eld. Not very time efficient I think.

[@Setixir]

Build diversity? Eh Diablo had alot going for it but build diversity was not it. Most were just completely not valid skills. There's way more usable skills now than before.

[@MrLlamaSC]

I actually didn't know she only dropped up to eld then! TIL

[@zfeazcesd1047]

sometime early 2023 was my first play through of D2. i played a sorc and used a guide a little bit. I can't echo enough just how much spirit took away from the game for me. i play games like D2 primarily because i like getting cool items and getting stronger. within the first several hours i got a spirit sword (which rolled 35 fcr) and it was great how strong it was, but literally every single wand that dropped was useless from there on out and I knew that I wouldn't get an upgrade until i get HOTO, more runes. what was especially disappointing about it was I found the wands and oculus-type weapons to be some of the coolest pieces of gear....but all useless....I still ID'ed them all and looked at them...and many looked interesting too....but they were al worse. the best I could find was just a 'slight' downgrade from my spirit.

[@tremblence]

100% Spirit alone nearly made D2 unbearably boring I nearly quit.... because of spirit and how it RUINED the fun of finding new caster weapons and shields

[@IAmJustAnUser]

Also hoto is op...

[@ryanswalm9481]

Hello, Mr. Llama. I think that the player should have a choice between playing with the ruin maybe. At the start of the game picking. An option between. Today's patch and the old patch

[@justinlautzenheiser3132]

I always thought it was hilarious devs thought enigma needed faster run walk as well when it should have went on chains of honor. Giving an alternative to people that don’t want to teleport

[@MrLlamaSC]

They really just super buffed enigma in so many ways lol

[@BH-gh6qm]

orb of corruption was my favorite part of path of diablo

[@FoodDipFan]

If I could play act 5 in classic, I wouldn't even bother with the xpac. I enjoy classic's itemization more

[@IDESTROYER236]

I'm not gonna sugarcoat it. Ral Tir Tal Sol.

[@Amateur2CombaT]

The real problem is not the power of those runewords , it's the bots finding the runes to actually make them.

[@MrLlamaSC]

Yeah botting hurts a lot because everybody gets access

[@wulfgarpl]

Best thing about Diablo 2: Runewords Worst thing about Diablo 2: Runewords

[@MrLlamaSC]

Essentially...yes

[@theadderallavenger]

So I missed out on Diablo 2 for a very, very long time. I played a little bit before D2r, but have played significantly more since the remaster. I mostly play offline, and my luck seems to be a bit skewed as I have found a Zod, a Cham, and several Bers before a Shako (still don't have). But I made my first Enigma like 3 days ago target farming a third Ber at Trav, and that feels incredible. I personally don't mind the power of rune words *right now* because I haven't gotten to play with them as much as others have. I'm looking forward to making an Infinity next. But I also completely understand how stale gameplay can get when it's pretty much only the same stuff in every slot for every character. I like the idea of charms adding a skill like Enigma, but again, I feel like I'm too new to really have a fair assessment of what would work best for the game.

[@Elvetos]

No it dint ruin anything, in fact it made things better. It made D2 a platform where you can simulate different types of builds and spend hours and hours to figure out the best items, find glitches. They put hard caps on the bosses so that no matter how strong you become BAAL can still kill you if you don't pay attention. It made trading more accessible. In lobbies the cool thing was to show off your gear because it gave a sense that you're better (even if you got it for free or what ever). Your gear are the trophies you want to show off. Either its a Perfect Ebugged Vortex 45 res or a Perfect Coa 2os you threaten the whole J2SP forum to sell it to Charsi if no one pays 5k for it. Runewords fixed Diablo 2 and made the game even more popular and accessible but still remained very hard to achieve the top end perfect gear

[@borisdochev2940]

All of your points still remain exactly the same if runewords didn't exist or weren't BiS on 95% of the builds, except the game would have 1000x more variance

[@Elvetos]

@@borisdochev2940 How so? Why should teleport be available just for a sorc? Sorc becomes the default MF hunter and she cant even do all of the it by her self solo or its very difficult to do it without Infinity. When you play solo, achieving an Enigma is a reward for collecting all these hard to find runes. It takes alot of time by it self. If you removed Imunities off monsters i would agree with you. but since you have immunities and the vast majority of the people just want to play solo 50% of the time then it makes sense to have rewards like reunwards in the game.

[@Loser91915]

How D2 was runed... bah dum tsk!

[@stefanjohnson9480]

I think they need to add stronger acts after act 5 by the time you grind your way to he'll ball with all these runewords. would be nice to go into a completely different difficulty where rares and uniques are in fact as powerful or more powerful. then toss in blood shards to upgrade them. make it so that once you do pass hell baal you can't go back. and neither can your items

[@Royy]

This is why me and many other stayed in classic D2. So many good rare items and no runewords. Loved my old collection of duped execution swords, lances and ornate armor. I remember people leaving for xpac. They’d get rich instantly by converting their duped ammys, Sojs and boots because those were viable in xpac

[@deadzeddicious3684]

I understand what youre saying, but i must disagree. Runewords are incredibly powerful, but actually getting high runes in a normal play through is incredibly rare. Runewords are one of the most iconic items/concept in the diablo world. Some of them are op, yes. But for you to legit obtain these items, you deserve the amount of power they give imo.

[@MrLlamaSC]

I think they fit in SSF better to be honest. Because the grind to get many of them (besides spirit, insight, and a couple other low level ones) takes months usually and is super awesome. But even still once you get there they are possibly a bit too much

[@deadzeddicious3684]

@@MrLlamaSC i think my biggest concern is lots of classes would have an immense amount of trouble beating the ubers without the power you gain from runewords(aside from cheese specs like smite and kicksin). You're definitely not wrong that some runeworda might be overtuned, but I think its far fetched to say they RUINED D2. I just think they should have introduced competitive uniques and set pieces. That being said, I know who you are and what you do. I also think you're someone who understands the game more than 99% of players. Maybe I'm just stuck in nostalgia land 🤣

[@ak_getright9905]

Botting duping and the encroaching runewords, combined with most importantly many uniques being unusable even very rare ones, kind of did it for me