MTG Top 10: Discard Spells | Magic: the Gathering | Episode 83

[@MDJ7713]

ONE WITH NOTHING BEST DISCARD CARD

[@willemboele2079]

agreed

[@aspasia3]

It's so obvious, he just doesn't want to state the obvious #1 to make the video boring.

[@goolabbolshevish1t651]

One with nothing suicide by turn 2 is hilarious

[@tobiaspause1775]

But.... you dont get anything in return... isnt wheel of fortune or timetwister better?

[@MDJ7713]

Tobias Pause If the goal is to discard cards, why would you want to draw more?

[@nin_tendo6458]

MTG Top 10: Thoughtseize and 9 other cards

[@batteredskullsummit9854]

Hymn to tourach is backbreaking

[@elainehelmont4647]

@@batteredskullsummit9854 And people say there was no good cards in fallen empires.

[@jasonrustmann9876]

Ahh discard spells, for when the blue player wants to try a different color but still doesn't want to let the other guy play

[@chuggaaconroyfanboy1]

Haven't even watched the video and I can already say that thoughtseize will be number 1

[@theLogicblade]

I did not see Transgress taking a spot on this list. Damn. I wasn't sure whether Thoughtseize or Duress would be on the top just because of duress' multiple reprints.

[@darkmatter32x]

no one expects a full set of inquisition of kozilek

[@Psychonaut165]

No one expects the inquisition of kozilek? I get it.

[@conkyjoe8932]

Underrated comment

[@michaelmolzan3001]

One with nothing ma dudes.

[@GoblinmasterYT]

What do you think of doing top 10 *worst* counterspells?

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Goblinmaster999 It sounds like a good worst video.

[@aspasia3]

Omg YESSSSSS

[@puttputt524]

Remand remand remand remand remand.

[@captainkarnage9874]

As a frequent 8 Rack player I just wanted to say that Blackmail is a very underated card.

[@cooperschulze7661]

Especially if they are playing aggressive decks that dump their hand like affinity and burn

[@joshuaminnich3896]

seeing cards with such high points with being in standard one time makes me want to see a top 10 standard cards.

[@TheDarkever]

Ah I fondly remember the times when I played The Rock. Turn 1: Duress, Turn 2: Cabal Therapy, Birds of Paradise, flashback of Cabal Therapy. Sometimes it was GG at this point xD

[@OneOfDisease]

No hypnotic specter makes me sad.

[@anarchymatt]

hymn to tourach

[@bretterry8356]

I feel like Kitesail Freebooter has a good chance of replacing Sin Collector, especially in Human Tribal decks like 5 Color Humans, Bant Company, etc.

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Bret Terry Could happen. It is strong.

[@KabukiKid]

#1 was no shock at all in this list. heh I do remember when Mind Twist was unbanned in Vintage and... yeah... that card is mean. When it returned, I saw it do its thing. Brutal card.

[@redeagle45]

Thanks for this vid. I love your top 10s. especially the empirical ranking data and history anecdotes of the cards. let’s see more of these!!!!

[@samb123078]

I am surprised hypnotic specter wasn’t on there. I remember turn one hypos wrecking my day way back when.

[@domri4203]

Turn 1 Hippie turn 2 hymn

[@samb123078]

@@domri4203 turn three another hippo. Yeah it was rough.

[@jaredt2590]

Inquisition of Kozilek is a great card. If you get that in your opening hand against blue you can go through all the strategies of the opponents cards as you play.

[@kingginger3335]

Just realized that the creature in the art of Cabal Therapy is the same creature printed in Modern Horizons called Cabal Therapist. I always love when WOTC does these flavor things. Like the art for Krenko's Command is the background art for Krenko Mob Boss.

[@conkyjoe8932]

You should check out Mana Drain (the original printing, I think it's in Legends) and Draining Whelk then. I LOVE that one. We get to see what the creepy thing on Mana Drain is when it's all grown up hahaha

[@AArdW01f]

The thing with cabal therapy in places like Legacy and Vintage is it often won't matter if you don't name the right card. Your opponent doesn't have a FOW and that's what you needed to find out

[@OdinMagnus]

I use ravens crime in my discard deck along with duress and hymns. Was kinda expecting to see it since it can turn all of your lands that you draw into a discarding card.

[@firstandlast.1254]

How many points does collective brutality have?

[@WUZLE]

The first deck I ever got lent was mono black. This was back in 1993 or so. Ritual, Ritual, Hymn, Hymn, Sol Ring happened more than once.

[@snowboundwhale6860]

Would distress count as a slightly worse alternative to thoughtseize? or is thoughtseize outright superior due to effectively being distress with a (life cost compulsory) phyrexian mana & B instead of BB?

[@jaredt2590]

How did I miss Thoughtseize? I'm glad I watched this video. That's the greatest Black card ever printed.

[@Calvert1212]

Laughs in Dark Ritual

[@conkyjoe8932]

@@Calvert1212 Naw, not even close. D. Ritual is mainly used in combo decks, and (especially as time has gone on) has seen minimal usage outside of that function. Whereas Thoughtseize gets played by MANY types of decks, across any format it's legal in at that moment, and T1 "Tap for a black, Thoughtseize you" is generally recognized as one of the strongest opening plays in all of Magic (well...Vintage aside lol).

[@Calvert1212]

@@conkyjoe8932 Tap swamp Dark Rit Thoughtseize x3 tho

[@Calvert1212]

In legacy a T1 Swamp>DarkRit> Liliana otV is pretty dam scary

[@conkyjoe8932]

@@Calvert1212 That's the thing, nobody in their right mind is going to just LET a T1 Dark Ritual resolve though haha. The implications are just too grand to let your opponent have accesss to such an easy 3 mana on T1, especially in formats where they could then turn around and drop a Mox or Lotus Petal on you. If, "T1, Dark Ritual?" is their question, then "Take 1, pitch this, Force of Will that" is my answer. Every time.

[@80budokai]

Great video! Enjoy your weekend! 💯🙏🙌

[@eddinoboy]

I personally love hypnotic specter, wish that one was mentioned...

[@ModelOmegaForReal]

Curious, would surgical extraction qualify? Would it have made the list?

[@shadowcidexz]

I saw the thumbnail and my initial thought was "thoughtseize is at least making the top 3"

[@basicpigeonbee]

Top ten magic decks?

[@lazorwhale6110]

Lemme guess... Thoughtseize Edit: how did I know?

[@SupaFry99]

Because you seized Nizzahon's thoughts.

[@BleechedWombat]

Kinda flawed ranking system considering that there where 5 GP's in 1997 and 53 GP's in 2017. If you just go by pure impact each discard spell has had on competitive magic, a list would look something like; 1. Mind Twist 2. Balance 3. Hymn to Tourach 4. Throughtseize 5. Liliana of the Veil 6. Cabal Thrapy 7. Kolaghan's Command 8. Duress 9. Persecute 10. Mind Sludge

[@phoenixgemini42]

What about harsh scrutiny? 1 black to see your opponents hand, discard a creature, and scry a card is pretty good. Or is Kaladesh too late considering the age of the other cards?

[@sybmike]

I am surprised Balance didn't make this list. It was a truly dominant card in the early years of Magic, absolutely defining the meta pre-Ice Age.

[@jaredt2590]

Duress is an old classic. I'm glad it was reprinted allowing newer players access.

[@martindouge4504]

I really wonder if Divest will get a spot on this list.

[@NizzahonMagic]

Seems possible, but not super likely

[@c_n5292]

Divest and Harsh Scrutiny are awesome

[@davidminor4213]

Divest hits artifact lands in Pauper

[@slayerofmankind]

Dash of hopes is the best mono black counterspell with black discard decks

[@newname5403]

My first deck was centred on Lilliana’s caress which caused them to lose 2 life every time they discard

[@iwatcher69]

Plus mogrim and raider’s wake

[@shadowofseattle1338]

Throw in waste not and you are golden

[@WillArtie]

Thanks again Nizza! Your Top 10s are part of my regular weekly Magic content imbibing. Please never stop. I have to say that the artwork on Transgress the Mind has always disturbed me. I know that Wizards has printed some reasonably gruesome cards over the years, but Transgress, for me, is particularly confronting. Those alien but human-like hands breaching through the head from the back of the head/neck, then reaching around to grab the face. And the Eldrazi is so close, and eyeless. It's SO invasive and awful. And I've always noticed that the closest, spear-like black finger is exiting through the top of the lip - indicating the carelessness and brutality of this mind-read, or whatever the hell it is. The fingers look like a giant spider bursting from the mouth - no doubt deliberate to give us the creeps. Lastly the Kor's eyes have gone milky as the Eldrazi sucks out his life force or some such thing. Poor Kor!! Bloody awful but very good. Anyone else got any cards that they find creepy/disturbing?

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Andre Gulbis Yeah I noticed as I was making this that they like to have artwork involving reaching into someones head on discard spells.

[@kazibaker6747]

Naya deaths shadow, aka the legendary blackless shadow

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Kazi Baker Well, Naya-Black. I should have just stuck with "Death's Shadow Zoo"

[@davidminor4213]

@@NizzahonMagic this is another one that probably could use an update. I bet Collective Brutality and Kroxa make the cut now.

[@silverknight6831]

You have the best top 10s, an actual score system. Why dose no-one else do this?

[@NizzahonMagic]

+John Tiffee I suspect now because they would feel like they were ripping me off?

[@thetruth4654]

Mind Twist is the best discard spell. You can basicly just win with Mind Twist you can potentially win With hitting the right card with Thoughtseize but the barrier for that to happen is way bigger then with Mind Twist. Mind Twist also is only Vintage legal because it simply is too strong for any other format

[@nifynitm]

true. if it was legal in other formats it would’ve had a competing amount of points to face thoughtseize. thoughtseize has some upsides like the knowledge of knowing the full hand and being able to cast it more efficiently, but the potential mind twist has to take away a player’s whole hand (and therefore know the cards anyway) is unrivaled

[@SeanHrecho]

Wow, so many good cards that Collective Brutality isn't in the mix.

[@marshallwhite7865]

What about tidehollow sculler, and raven's crime?

[@NizzahonMagic]

Tidehollow Sculler has a respectable 18 points, but not quite enough to crack this strong list. Raven's Crime has 8 points.

[@lancourt]

When i used to play casual with my friends I had so many games where Hymn was cast turn 2, or turn 1 with a dark ritual, and my opponent would insta concede. mmm Turn one ritual into hypnotic specter would do the same tbh.

[@ApexZer0]

No mind rot? Figured it would of been reprinted enough that it'd have enough points to get 9 or 10

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Apex 0 Nah, it only has 14 points. Reprinted a lot, but never heavily played.

[@Psychonaut165]

@ 6:03 says this card was played in jeskai. I’m confused. Jeskai doesn’t have black

[@NizzahonMagic]

Well, it was "Dark Jeskai," which basically meant Jeskai with Black.

[@julianlastname5730]

Turn one dark ritual hymn to tourach thoughtsieze go

[@andreyutiamco9201]

Julian Barbieri _brutal_

[@garrettmartin4750]

Nasty and filthy. Wonderful.

[@gwikeh]

Thoughtseize first though.

[@marcobiraghi]

@@gwikeh it’s better to try hitting the dope cards with tourach first

[@gwikeh]

@@marcobiraghi , i see both sides, Thoughtseize is pretty versatile, but I always like using type-specific discard (Duress, Distress, Thoughtseize) before random discards. If Hymn knocks out all the cards of the appropriate type, then the Duress fizzles. Hymn never fizzles.

[@luxcannonyosafani3729]

13:37 you forgot to put a parenthesis around the 100 for legacy

[@NizzahonMagic]

Oh no!

[@d2champion93]

You should write the card lists in your descriptions. Many of us have to watch them multiple times because of our own poor management xD

[@stephenwadkins4722]

I'd love to see a top 10 decks of all time

[@sutfolsemaj]

I'm kind of surprised Karn wasn't on here. I'll bet he was pretty close. Anyway, as a dedicated Jund player, this list pleased me lol.

[@imreadydoctor]

Wild Mongrel? Not exactly the sort of discard you're thinking of, but that thing was a killer.

[@xXRickTrolledXx]

Noggin whack is a potent discard for control in a rogue tribal deck

[@eduardonavarro525]

As an 8 rack player, l approve 👍

[@czajda]

I love black becouse of duress, IoK and Thoughtseize

[@davidminor4213]

And push

[@canismajor1186]

5:30 Atarka's Command is the best command card in Khans. It lets you win turn three.

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Canis Major It can. But I think K command is better - I am also more of a control player.

[@canismajor1186]

Kolaghan's Command looks like it fits in more decks but winning on turn three with burn really sends a message.

[@bladerz1191]

I have 25 copies of duress

[@chrisgsauce]

LOL too true. I don't even know how I accumulated so many, either. I was building a deck last week and found a ton of them.

[@shadowofseattle1338]

Only?

[@Catequil]

That typo on the thoughtseize score chart tho

[@lancechesticles]

Where did kitesail freebooter land on this list? Any points? I was expecting to see it

[@tobiaspause1775]

Hmm, i would say inquisition is better than duress or maybe even thoughtseize. I mean it does always hit something in constucted format. And you dont loose live.

[@dawudcharlton]

Thought sieze ,and hymnn to torach.... there's other's??

[@Coffeemancer]

is ther esuch a thing as blue/black control or do you need a 3rd color

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Coffeemancer There have been - look up Psychatog decks from old Extended. But these days it is usually Grixis or UW in Modern.

[@jeffreymitchell5321]

Loved the list, but I cannot believe you never mentioned 8 Rack as a deck, it is basically the deck. I was expecting to see Raven's Crime and Wrench Mind on the list as they are really good too...

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Jeffrey Mitchell It isn't a deck that has found consistent success, so it hasn't contributed very many points to these cards.

[@Bartleby1892]

Feels like Cabal Interrogator is only feared in my play group and noone else gives a crap about it.

[@erysecret]

Surprised at no Unmask, but I guess it makes sense

[@rshinra]

Coercion?

[@FranzNagy]

Collective Brutality?

[@CoachJEFF_CG]

I know this is old, but any thoughts on Thought Erasure?

[@shadowofseattle1338]

What? I don't remember it 😉

[@ScaredMotion]

I've got a Liliana Vess in my Zombies deck

[@VotelessOrc497]

I feel "Appetite for Brains" should have been on this list.

[@senfschmade]

How can thought knot seer not be on the list? It surely gathered more points than liliana vess by that time

[@The_Hissing_Fool]

Anyone remember "Two Hymns to Win"??? Anybody?

[@wackywong]

#1 Sadistic Hypnotist.... in EDH.

[@Awelbeckk]

No mind twist ?

[@josephalger8879]

What about despise??

[@froggerpirate]

One with nothing is the best discard for price up to 7 cards for 1 mana

[@josephblattert6311]

Surprised Collective Brutality didn't make it.

[@Monechetti]

I'm genuinely surprised Blightning isn't on this list.

[@zulfyby]

2:49 Not to keen on printing Planeswalkers *cough* One year later War of the Sparks drops :-D

[@N0mni]

Reprinting, not just printing, its very different to print a bunch of new planes walkers into standard than it is to reprint older ones into standard.

[@dawudcharlton]

Hymn the only playable Fallen Empire card. I wanna draft Empires again lol

[@shuboy05]

Don’t forget High Tide

[@kekleon-Gamer]

Are you sure Naya Death's Shadow is even a thing? While it may be the name used, it's not Naya with Black.

[@NizzahonMagic]

+kekleon9999 - Gamer You're right - usually just called "Death's Shadow Zoo" which makes more sense.

[@sladjanavukas5420]

"Consult the necrosage"is fine for me,isnt dead card at mid or late game...

[@Swamp_Thing_4487]

Cards like Persecute maybe?

[@xXRueMorgueXx]

No Karn?

[@scott-e5548]

I’m a year late but where is the 8-rack love my dude

[@iceicicle3046]

Predicting thoughseize to be on the list unless it was made after this list was made Yep it was number 1

[@jakobandersen3210]

do the top 10 cards, with highest mana cost

[@thefounder681]

One with Nothing?

[@Dazulolwarrior]

There's thought erasure now

[@jennyxie5382]

Spit at opponent is the best discard spell

[@hediinn125]

Why do you not mention 8 rack, the discard deck

[@NizzahonMagic]

+heðin tórstún I could have, but it is a fringe modern deck thAt hasn't really done anything yet.

[@hediinn125]

Nizzahon Magic I ges, it's just that it's the deck that uses a big part of these cards

[@NizzahonMagic]

+heðin tórstún Yep, but it doesn't get them any points.

[@deathmetalmachine]

What happened to ostracize???

[@kakahpt8525]

Hypnotic Specter should be on the list

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Stand Relax I almost included it with Mind Twist as an Honorable Mention because of its history, and probably shouod have.

[@xyzz101]

Mind twist should be number 1

[@DJVinyl]

Where is Timetwister?

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Geometry Dash _DJ Vinyl_ Not really what I would consider a discard spell, since you reload your opponent's hand.

[@cashnsplash8939]

Unstable draft?

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Cash N Splash Nope! Going to be Vintage Cube on Monday though

[@cosmotect]

Thoughtseize, killer of all fun since printed

[@LainKaplan]

A fair list. My list was dramatically different, with my number one not even being on your list. Then again, my number one isn't even black.

[@jerred9655]

thought seize is number 1 cause cabal therapy is banned in modern

[@NizzahonMagic]

+Jerred Not banned, just never been legal