What's the Best 1-Drop Creature? Commander Clash Podcast 116

[@crawdaddy1234]

9:30 The debate between Birds versus Druid is the debate between whether to use the floor or the ceiling.

[@andrewgolubiewski3463]

30 minutes in and I feel like you could revist this episode as two separate rankings- one for staples and one for build arounds.

[@JoshBeatty6]

Or like for turn 1 vs for turn 6

[@jjvh500]

30 minutes in? The very first match up was a discussion of "Generic" v "Specific." It seems like a conversation they should have had before the episode 😅

[@andrewgolubiewski3463]

@@jjvh500 yeah but I didn't comment on a 1 off. I let them have the discussion a few times before I felt like it should be pointed out.

[@nykthosacolyte5710]

I'm just starting the video but if bodyguard doesn't get mentioned I call shenanigans. BB is at least in the top 100.

[@bugwrld8891]

for real and a card being more generally usable does not make it more powerful. And this disconnect happens every single time they compare power level of cards.. Still love these guys tho even if they can be insane

[@Couldnt_Be_Bothered]

I think what we learned most from this is that you guys need a fifth person on the podcast when ranking things

[@SpecialKail]

They have one. It's chat gpt

[@hanschristopherson8056]

Crim and richard are agents of chaos

[@Mushroomhaus0001]

They really need someone who isn’t from their play group to balance things out. Every deck running Ondu Inversion and 5 other board wipes is insane

[@Steven-rb7ph]

Phil! Phil! Phil! Phil!

[@xxbehemothxx69]

Chat gpt is awesome! Lol

[@hanschristopherson8056]

I’m glad someone finally pointed out that commander clash has WAY more boardwipes than your average pod, so cards that “die to boardwipes next turn” are way more playable than they’re being given credit for

[@collinbeal]

I faced a Nethroi HB deck earlier today, and I didn't know Arena even had that many boardwipes 😂. That and toxic-ass Superfriends, which works much better in 1v1 commander.

[@ToSGod]

But honestly players should play MORE board wipes. I’m on the Crim side. I played much more wipes than my opponents for awhile, and I was winning more than I should from a well timed wipe. Now a days my playgroup has realized this and run more in their decks.

[@hugovellver5114]

My pod has even more wipes , we turned to combo focus, we also allow land destruction and stuff but we know how to play into tournament level and play agrro

[@sir_quirkus7206]

I Personally play 5-7 wipes. I’ve noticed any less someone runs away with the game and that needs to be mitigated. Also depends on the deck archetype too, if I’m running combo or aggro I’ll run 2-3 as my game plan is to win quickly anyway

[@person3176]

i like that richard says spectral sailor is good because you can hold up interaction, and use 3U draw a card as a backup but.. what interaction are you holding richard? :D you don't have any!

[@Dom9606]

Richard: don't use interaction because it makes enemies also Richard: don't play birds because it will be bolted what level is this man on

[@SpecialKail]

Teferis protection is what he's holding up

[@bye1551]

@@Dom9606 literally just full of contradictions. If you tried to built a coherent gameplan from Richards "tips" your deck would be just as boring as.... Well Richards decks. Useless 1/1s and literally only going for 2nd because you have no hope of ever closing out a game (I know Richard has won occasionally, but the crew have usually had to make massive blunders for it to be even possible)

[@Lucarioguild7]

​@@Dom9606In Richard's make believe world there's a boardwipe every turn but you still need to run 5 fogs in your deck to stop all the creatures from running you over.

[@BobardeZanzibar]

Generous gift.

[@bobbobo5911]

Someone should’ve told Richard that birds taps for its own Path to ramp

[@felipeguidolin1055]

"we put a Ramp in your Ramp so you can ramp while ramping!!!"

[@doormat85]

And the perfect sword holder with frying and dragon blocker later in the game?

[@hunterhamiltondvdscv2323]

I almost spit out my coffee that would've killed.

[@kaszael]

Crim being a control player and not recognizing the power of tutoring a channel land with Weathered Wayfarer at instant speed for a blowout is astounding.

[@jamespatterson5644]

especially since he is ALWAYS low on lands

[@godspeedhero3671]

He has a deep hatred of White mana it seems. lol

[@jeffreycarey1641]

To explain Richard's question about why the anime art spectral sailor is wearing a school uniform, that uniform style is called a sailor uniform. So the spectral sailor is wearing a sailor uniform.

[@Dragon_Fyre]

I think it just feels out of place and confusing because while the name is spectral sailor, the anime sailor uniform is influenced by old-fashioned naval uniforms and this creature is a pirate. It just doesn’t make much sense.

[@direkitsune]

​@@Dragon_Fyrehow so? Many olden day pirates were former navy, either officially or hired by them to work inder their flag

[@Dragon_Fyre]

@@direkitsune They wouldn’t keep wearing the Navy uniform once they were a pirate.

[@direkitsune]

@@Dragon_Fyre many did, after all they were made to last on the sea. They would get torn, or parts removed, but many kept the garments they had. They would be replaced in time, and some got ride of them entirely out of some principle, but many definitely kept them for practicalities sake

[@Dragon_Fyre]

@@direkitsune They would have to be significantly disheveled or otherwise marked/defaced so as not to be confused with any active navy sailor or it would very likely get them murdered.

[@LibertyMonk]

I feel like Richard has 1v1 brain assessing Mother of Runes. It's an "on board trick", which makes people less likely to target any creatures you control or attack you. The threat of activation means they won't commit to you unless they feel they have to. If the people you play with spam board wipes instead of spot removal, sure. I don't understand how Esper Sentinel is "it draws you cards, or makes people play around it", but Mother of Runes is "it's an on-board trick."

[@Dragon_Fyre]

I think if opponents are going to spam board wipes, few creatures are relevant. That would not be much of an argument versus Mother of Runes. It’s along the lines of the ever unhelpful “just play more removal” advice. I think to answer your question, Esper Sentinel always has a significant impact on either card draw or as the alternative, forcing players to go slow to pay the X. Mother of Runes likely just stops one removal then is hit by another while vulnerable and removed (thus it often serves to just absorb one removal). When played very early, it can discourage removal until there is enough untapped mana available for two removals to be played but otherwise it blocks one removal spell/ability. The X cost from Esper Sentinel is frustrating up until end game play. I really like Mother of Runes but I think Esper Sentinel is more impactful.

[@Spaced92]

Idk this is one of the few areas I agree with Richard on, 1 out of 10 games I feel like Mother of Runes is super annoying but in the rest it's just irrelevant, and I'm usually the heavy on spot removal guy. I also can't think of anything worse in a White deck than drawing into Mother of Runes when you don't have anything else going on.

[@Dragon_Fyre]

@@Spaced92 Another argument for cards like Mother of Runes is the re-direct factor. If you cannot target my creatures while she is in play, there is a good chance that you will eventually use your removal on one of the other players rather than just holding it in your hand waiting for her to be removed. Mom is not just protecting your creatures, but potentially turning those removal spells to your advantage. None of this changes my opinion that Esper Sentinel deserved to be crowned the winner, but just that Mom can be very impactful as a card.

[@thatonedudejake]

Mom is really strong in 1v1

[@TheAverageGuyTAG]

​@@Spaced92 As someone who runs Mother of Runes myself, she without fail elicits a ton of groans if I play her turn 1. She is very good at protecting my commander in the early game for little investment.

[@headhunterhades3816]

I think Deathrite Shaman should’ve definitely been in the bracket given its utility, but other than that gripe great video guys

[@alexscott8799]

Deathrite shaman is so versatile. I love it, definitely would have chosen it over spore frog

[@avall0nNn1992]

I think they went with popularity and Deathrite Shanan goes in way less decks since it is two colors.

[@Lucarioguild7]

Yeah I'm pretty pissed there was 4 different 1 mana evasive creatures while Deathrite Shaman and other 1 drops with unique effects were left off

[@HtoC940]

Yet another card that's way better than BoP.

[@windwaker01]

​@@Lucarioguild7lol, imagine getting your feelings hurt over a tcg bracket

[@troacctid]

Wait, why are there three Slither blades and only one mana dork?

[@hopposai787]

Richard's take on mom is crazy. Knowing it's there is part of the power. Half the time the removal you would have to burn safekeeping to stop is just used somewhere else instead. The fog that stops a dozen attacks because its known to exist is way stronger than the fog played only once to stop 1 attack.

[@muditjohar5323]

Agreed. Say the opponent had 3 removal spells in hand. More often than not mom is basically 3 safeties against removal spells rather than just 1. Not to mention, it incentivizes players to target opponent creatures that are not urs so that they don’t just lose the removal spell to mom, giving u even more free value

[@kedros45]

his take is plain wrong. He says there is no removal that Mom counters but forgets that it is because of Mom that no removal is played. Though I know he'll debate that's virtual card advantage because that removal spell will now stay in opponents hand and be cast after the next board wipe blah blah

[@peewee0224]

Mom is so good I play step mom and bug mom just because that effect is so strong.

[@Bstone410]

Spectral sailor is a joke compared to Mom. Bug Mom is dope for getting in protected attacks as well

[@PieEater1492]

"You have to play welder and untap with it" I think I'm going to be way to triggered to make it through this one lol

[@joewhite4456]

Vs a card that needs to attack to do what it does anyway too

[@Lucarioguild7]

Yeah I don't think welder is the best of the list by far, but in this world they live in where the only acceptable ramp is rocks and cultivate how is welder a do nothing card lol

[@joewhite4456]

@@Lucarioguild7 I think it's only one of them that's that stupid, birds did still win the bracket, just that one guy that says mana dorks don't do anything...

[@SuperFlamingTomato]

Richard has somewhat of a point that if you creature ramp to other creatures, you make yourself very vulnerable to wraths. However, my experience with dorks in these decks is that you want to use them to turbo out your engines, so that if you do end up getting wrathed this won't impact you as much. You don't birds into a creature, your birds into elemental bond, or hardened scales, or whatever your strategy is. I also find that wraths are a lot less prevalent then MTGGoldfish suggests.

[@diegotejada55]

Birds vs heritage druid is like debating Cultivate vs Walking Ballista

[@bye1551]

I guess they're debating within the framework of "in a deck that wants this effect and doesn't have enough of them"?

[@NewSchoolPOKERstrat]

Walking balista

[@Grinthex]

Cultivate is better. 😉

[@traviscochran9253]

The ceiling of Cultivate is two lands, whereas the ceiling of Walking Ballista is your opponents control zero lands. Therefore, Walking Ballista is a better ramp spell than Cultivate :)

[@josephhawkins7974]

Birds of Paradise is a BoP, and Heritage Druid isn't.

[@TonyScimeca]

I love how in an argument about the best one drops in the game we’re talking about “dies to doom blade” as a reason why a one drop is bad when that literally applies to every creature in this list already. “Birds will die before turn 4 guaranteed. But Soul warden is amazing. Play it turn 1 and 5 turns later you’re at 60life!” Love you guys!

[@colecarmichael5724]

Richard is digging this time super far

[@swiftdragonrider]

Not to doom blade to a wrath. Any creature that doesn’t draw a tone of cards or stay post wrath is bad

[@kevinthecarpathian]

Richard is such a troll, he doesn't even play targeted removal just wants other people to take care of it for him lol

[@thatepicwizardguy]

it doesn't apply to that changeling or gravecrawler :P

[@colecarmichael5724]

@@kevinthecarpathian to be fair it’s quite easy to do this it just sucks when you’re at a table with them

[@AgonalRhythm]

Crim is so spot on about Welder. Even if you don't have explicit artifact synergies, someone else may. I feel like maybe the crew has completely forgotten just how much of red is based on discard. Incidentally. The impulse draw maybe overtook looting in their minds. Welder is a red staple while ascendant is just a beater

[@trehenry413]

100% my thoughts as well. Since it is a sacrifice effect, it also gets around artifacts that are indestructible.

[@alttiseppanen]

Even if they have artifact synergies it's not guaranteed at all they have artifacts in their graveyard and cycling some mana rocks is so meaningless. Strong with build around yes, but serra is so busted in every level of commander and in any white deck.

[@Kcfd2024]

Not to mention, with the abundance of treasure and food tokens these days. Red has limited card draw options and welder does what it does welding those weaknesses - getting artifacts that draw card, or just swapping for better artifacts. It's also a 1 drop that does well to disrupt artifact shenanigans yours opponents have. I have cut down the use of serra ascendants in most of my white decks. Just doesn't make the cut anymore.

[@AgonalRhythm]

@@Kcfd2024 Actually, that's a great point we all missed - treasures, clues, food, blood, etc. So many things create them incidentally that artifacts are likely around for most players anyhow. And in red, most of the cards you play for card advantage are going to loot or rummage things into the bin.

[@hanschristopherson8056]

It never ceases to amaze me how Richard can so consistently be so wrong 😂

[@Jug_or_not]

I think he is right most of the time, but sometimes his takes are a bit extreme

[@lach10211]

He was right about heritage druid

[@gibbysg8143]

@@lach10211nah birds is better in like 49/50 decks or whatever which automatically makes it better even though heritage Druid has a higher ceiling in its one specific deck. It’s really not even close in any way whatsoever lol

[@DiscardatRandom]

@@lach10211 how is getting 3 mana turn 2 bad?

[@peewee0224]

@@lach10211no he objectively wasn’t I’m a elf ball player I love my elves heritage Druid is literally only good in one deck and birds of paradise is good in that same exact deck and even more.

[@TheSentientTuba]

I wish there was an actual conversation at the beginning of the podcast about what 'best' entails. Is it versatility, power, consistency, other? BoP falls under the consistent value due to it being bad enough to not be removed while a welder requires instant removal and frog just shuts down entire decks strategies. Without nuanced discussion prior, everyone was often talking past each other Side note: serra avatar vs goblin welder was like saying dark ritual is better then paradox engine because it can go in any black deck vs the engine which requires a mana rock package

[@jackelope6134]

i can't believe deathrite shaman isn't here, it's so underplayed

[@discoviolenza1984]

Did Deathrite Shaman get folded into the mana dork category?

[@crawdaddy1234]

I think it’s because it’s based on the 16 most commonly run 1-drops. Deathrite requires the player to be in two specific colors instead of just one.

[@ray_the_red8047]

They took the top 16 one drops from EDH rec, there is no categories.

[@jebooiii6462]

Doesn't make sense to include a planeswalker into a creature bracket, right?

[@joewhite4456]

​@@ray_the_red8047there is categories, they even said it at the beginning. Hence the fact ignoble hierarch isn't on there despite being the second most used.

[@Lucarioguild7]

​@@joewhite4456Then why tf is there 2 unlockable creatures, functionally 4 on the list?

[@MakeVarahHappen]

I don't fully agree with Crim's opinions on artifact decks but I do think the crew are getting trapped by the word artifact on Welder. Most decks runs a recent amount of artifacts and it'll only increase as we get more colorless staples. The ability to sac a Treasure to get back a utility piece is good. The ability to cash in a mana rock for a big bomb that got answered is *great.* And then you get combo potential. I think Serra Ascendant still wins out but Welder has so much utility for such a cheap cost.

[@colecarmichael5724]

Okay mtggoldfish fans when are we having a intervention for Richard?? He might be suffering from some post partum depression with some of these takes. SPECTRAL SAILOR OVER MOM?!? This is clearly a cry for help

[@MentalCrusader]

You should have Phil as the tie breaker

[@kaszael]

1:16:32 Richard: "There are many, many, many ways to draw cards in white(...)" Time traveler from 2018: "what the hell did this guy say?"

[@GoDzJtFr]

Richard has had a lot of wild takes over the years but Spectral Sailor is better than mom is wild even by his standards lmao

[@FlourescentPotato]

his takes are usually utter nonsense lol

[@Crunchatize_Me_Senpai]

Tomer’s “shitty eraser” analogy for Spectral Sailor is the funniest thing I’ve heard on here in a while 😂 so on point too. I don’t even like Mother of Runes, I think it’s only good if you’re playing voltron or some deck that’s desperately reliant on its commander. But Spectral Sailor is damn near unplayable unless you’re getting extra value out of it, like in a Millicent or Edric deck.

[@jaredwright1655]

Raffine would be good

[@kevinthecarpathian]

Seth makes a great point - how can you judge creatures like this if your meta runs sweepers every other turn? This sounds like a brutal group to play with but I'm used to more battlecruiser I guess, maybe 1-2 board wipes a game max

[@ammonaustin9081]

Yeah, I understand board wipes are a healthy part of magic. But this playgroup sounds awful unless you're playing a creatureless deck that durdles

[@swiftdragonrider]

Richard is basically saying don’t play any card that don’t provide card advantage

[@bye1551]

​@@swiftdragonriderRichard both doesn't like removal... And argues everything is bad because removal exists. It's a self defeating argument

[@hanschristopherson8056]

Most people only run 1-3 in their deck max whereas crim and richard run 5+

[@kevinthecarpathian]

@@hanschristopherson8056 That sounds miserable haha. I mostly listen to the podcast and don't watch the clashes so how do their games usually run? Is it a bunch of sweepers until someone combos out?

[@ChinmanPlayCOD]

Tomer isn’t my favorite goldfish crew member but I agree with him, 12:33 what have we walked into? Is there 3 simultaneous gas leaks across the country?

[@bye1551]

I can't believe they actually used "dies to removal" as an argument.

[@TheSpunYarn]

It's actually baffling how wrong Richard and Crim are about Mana Dorks. His argument against Birds of Paradise is literally "it helps you cast your spells which is bad" like how do you have this level of dissonance

[@ArtPlaysGames]

I put the starting bracket in front of my local edh chat group so people could fill out their own brackets. Thanks for the great discussion and the extra discussions the bracket caused with my playgroup. :-)

[@Schmanton]

I am suprised, that there was no dowsing dagger argument for birds 😂

[@gregwylie3970]

Honorable mention for Allosaurus Shepard. I know it’s basically specifically for an elf deck, but it’s an absolute powerhouse for 1 mana. It can’t be countered, the rest of your green spells can’t be countered, and a buff effect 💰

[@FunnyFunFunTime]

The more I play Haywire Mite, the more busted it seems..

[@TheSpunYarn]

Whenever Richard says he's "debated" with himself he really means "I thought about it and continued agreeing with myself. I was right all along"

[@pizzabone9353]

Serra ascendant over goblin welder is crazy, this episode is gonna be tough to watch

[@danielsniff6405]

They ranked it based on general use, not on ceiling power level. Goblin welder only works well in specific decks, while ascendant is an insane beater in any deck that can play it.

[@trehenry413]

@@danielsniff6405 I still think this is wrong. Goblin welder might be at its best in an artifact deck. But it certainly has great value outside of it too. Repeatable artifact hate if your opponent has a threat out (swords, ashond's altar, etc), while also bringing insane value for any red deck. Red generally has a higher amount of artifacts than other colors, and also lends itself towards discard effects. Welder is great is both situations. Welder is also good no matter when you draw it, unlike ascendant.

[@kylegonewild]

@@trehenry413 "Welder is also good no matter when you draw it, unlike ascendant." This is just patently untrue. You can't even activate it if nobody has any artifacts in the graveyard and you can't hate on your opponents' cards with it by discarding your own. It of course has a way higher ceiling but the floor of both cards is "this draw lost me the game" and an average play pattern of "this card got to do its thing once or twice."

[@colbybastian17]

With goblin welder, i think they underestimate how many generically powerful artifacts show up in commander. Both for yourself and your opponents, there is always going to be something good and bad in both the graveyards and the field.

[@trehenry413]

Yeah, it is at is best if you are also playing an artifact deck. But, it can also be repeatable artifact hate too. Especially for powerful artifacts like a Darksteel Forge.

[@oliveleaf7376]

No, I think they correctly evaluate that Welder shouldn't be played outside of artifact decks that use it as a combo piece. It's nice that it has powerful utility to remove enemy artifacts, but that's also only happening in the mid-late in the game, and it may not be possible at all. It's a statistically bad card to run if you aren't proactively using the effect yourself. Serra Ascendant is just better, from a straight winrate perspective. It comes down "earlier", does more, and can snowball games way harder.

[@timbombadil4046]

In commander on board is not worse than instant speed from hand. E.g. Mother of Runes or Spore Frog. Richard is always worrying about 1 for 1 trades with removal. But on board answers can continue to exist holding off several other players simultaneously without needing to be expended. Thats value! Someone has a spore frog you might just attack someone else instead. Thats basically working like a pseudo Ghostly Prison while it exists. And MoR means opponents just focus removal elsewhere unless they have the means to peel your onion.

[@Shimatzu95]

As someone that does not play manadorks normally i personally think delighted halfling is the best one, if only for the uncounterability

[@Dragon_Fyre]

I guess it depends on whether you often have your Legendaries countered. It could be potentially very impactful, but mana of any colour for non Legendaries can be equally important. It would depend on your deck and your opponents decks.

[@kylegonewild]

@@Dragon_Fyre It also survives getting got by an end of turn Bowmasters.

[@DiscardatRandom]

@@kylegonewild this isn't cedh where everyone is playing orcish bowmasters you don't need to build your decks around it

[@erysecret]

Stunned by the Ragavan vs Spore Frog debate...

[@tobomy]

Fr. I feel like sometimes they're just saying crazy stuff for discussions sake lol

[@erysecret]

@@tobomy even if we take into consideration the goldfish crew's meta, the fact that it's a one drop red manadork that color fixes is insane. That's the best part- it color fixes, creates a token, and artifact token, and draws a card If you get in a single hit, it's already worth it. Just 1 hit. I'm not sure if the goal is to be contrarian for content or for the algorithm. Idk Just really mind boggling

[@kylewhite602]

Came here to specifically say this

[@bluenewwave13]

spore frog is better tho

[@alicepbg2042]

@@bluenewwave13 but monke is superior

[@JcadeH1]

As far as birds vs heritage druid goes i would agree with richard that the druid is more powerful or has a much higher ceiling it also has the lower floor since you need two other elves for it to do anything so i have to give it to birds since it has the lower floor dince its always going be able to tap for mana. On top of that birds fills the role of being a one drop much better where youre always happy to slam it down turn 1 where druid is a card youd rather hold on to until youve developed your board and you're ready to pop off

[@neros_soren]

I agree with Crim about Goblin Welder - reasoning being, that literally all red decks produce a LOT of treasures. Which in turn gives you so many opportunities to get a really powerful Artifact out of your GY. Any mid-high powered deck play some Artifact that either ramps you or does something powerful.

[@VivBrodock]

Richard as he pulls out ChatGPT once again: "the beatings will continue until morale improves"

[@controlaltdeleteish]

Weathered wayfarer can drop you down a 20/20 indestructible by turn 3 or enable tron lands on demand

[@VinniePaul91]

I'm appalled by your conclusion on ascendant vs welder. You can cut ascendant from any deck its in and barely notice. Welder is such a powerhouse and one of the best cards in every deck it's in.

[@hanschristopherson8056]

I think the conclusion was that welder was stronger but can’t go in every deck whereas you can put ascendant in any white deck but choose not to because synergy is more important in commander today

[@kylegonewild]

You could also cut welder and barely notice. Its effect isn't unique or necessary and is pretty much unusable turn 1 anyway. Everyone is aware it has a higher potential payoff than ascendant. The argument breaks down like hans here was saying. One thing people are forgetting is that it either forces a removal spell because it's *too much* value that's immediately available or makes you untouchable via creatures for several turns without ever having to actually turn it sideways. The Baleful Strix effect but it *can* go on the offensive. All for a throwaway single mana at the beginning of the game. Obviously a welder in any artifact deck will be better than ascendant in white weenies or whatever though.

[@matthewbixler2728]

Richard- “don’t play mana dorks cause they die to removal.” Also Richard- “who plays targeted removal?”

[@AdaWongMistress]

@henrilitor1646 by the same logic, lands die to armageddon effects, birds don´t.

[@kylegonewild]

@@AdaWongMistress Now count the number of armageddon effects and compare that to the amount of creature destruction that exists. It's perfectly fine this logic goes in both directions because there's the additional layer of "what are people actually playing."

[@kevinthecarpathian]

Sylvan Safekeeper is a bit niche but can be the best card in your deck sometimes

[@Lucarioguild7]

The way this group treats mana dorks you'd think they'd never played a 3 drop in their life it's wild

[@traviscochran9253]

21:07 I love when Niuttuc gets to make these little edits xD, almost as good as Tomer screaming from beyond about the crew's opinions when he's not on the cast.

[@natejablonski]

I think Tomer edits the Commander Clash podcasts and he was telling future him to roll the clip.

[@DocShotsPhotography]

im with tomer in most of these decisions. everyone knows ragavan can run away with a game but no one looks at spore frog and think i gotta stop this

[@Spaced92]

Tomers been the only non meme opinion for a long time now, love all these dudes though.

[@lucasaugsten]

And at most games no one will care about ragavan because everyone will randomly have blockers and he can't attack, but if frog is in the field they need to keep it in mind

[@olafwulfgarson1224]

Spore frog can completely shut down aggro decks. There's not many one drops I'm afraid more of than Spore Frog. I can't count how many times it shut my deck down, fogging me every turn, leaving me sitting there helplessly and my only hope was to draw 1 of my 2 grave hate cards.

[@DocShotsPhotography]

@@olafwulfgarson1224 the decks that run it are made to abuse it. Ragavan doesn’t have to built around and it’s always a problem. So I’m terms of power it is the more in general powerful card.

[@UniGya]

I don't get Richard's point about using "creature rampant growths" over mana dorks because Sakura Tribe Elder or whatever *isn't a one drop*. The advantage that mana dorks give you is that they get you extra mana on to use on turn 2. It's like saying Darksteel Ingot is better than Arcane Signet because it's indestructible. You shouldn't rely on only mana dorks to ramp you but ramping faster is a big deal

[@Cptgreenbeetle]

Richard, how can u decide between two cards using an argument that fits both? Spore frog is a slow board trick that also gets wrathed, i don't get it lol

[@americoserna1852]

If anyone wants to try getting chat GPT's opinion on some of these cards I've had very good luck using the following prompt: "In a game of magic the gathering commander, which card is better between x or y? You must be decisive in your answer and generalize on the format.

[@Sinistra359]

To be fair and in defense of goblin welder, the floor for serra ascendant is just a 1/1 with lifelink and also needs a turn before it can attack. Not arguing, just pointing out that the floor for both cards are just as bad lol.

[@colecarmichael5724]

I though that was the closest in power was those two

[@Dragon_Fyre]

I think the reason that I might go with Serra Ascendant is that it basically works well in any deck as long as you play it while at 30+ life where Goblin Welder is more specific to the types of decks it is useful in (where you can sacrifice artifact tokens to get artifacts from your graveyard into play, which admittedly is still a lot of decks); Also, when played early to plan, opponents may not have answers to Serra Ascendant, but Goblin Welder typically takes a few turns to be relevant, where there should be removal available by then for a 1/1. Several turns in, the Serra Ascendant has already done its work. The welder is a powerhouse but I think it’s like 55/45 for the Serra Ascendant.

[@colecarmichael5724]

@@Dragon_Fyre people forget goblin welder targets other peoples stuff too tho🤷🏽‍♂️

[@SpecialKail]

U don't have to untap with it to block w a 6/6 lifelink.

[@SpecialKail]

​@@colecarmichael5724Tomer mentioned it

[@JesseKearnsEverydayEveryman]

What I like about this episode is I’m learning each of your preferences in a deeper way, which helps guide me towards the suggestions one or more of you put forth. In many ways this is a question of play-style as much as anything else. Thanks for taking the time, folks.

[@mct685]

Surprised how much Richard hates mana dorks. They rush out your toskis and draw cards

[@jeremymorris6000]

This bracket format is great at cultivating divisive, argumentative debates over the tiniest semantics and I'm here for it!!

[@zotha]

The floor on Esper Sentinel being a 1 mana asymmetrical Thalia is still insanely good. Even if you don't draw a single card you are often half a turn ahead of everyone else.

[@SmashCentralOfficial]

Hopefully this time Richard doesn't change the ChatGPT Prompt right at the finals ;) Edit: 2:08 yeah lol the AI didn't know you were specifically asking about EDH Format until the very end.

[@zotha]

Richard lives on another planet from the rest of us.

[@munsulight721]

Not surprised by the lack of love for mana dorks for this podcast. Your crew is so BOARD WIPE HEAVY that your argument make sense there. On streamed games and onlines games, I barely see any boardwipe. I would gladly take the turn 1 acceleration over rampant growth or Wood Elves in a heavy creature decks even if a board wipe mean I will be set back. I just gained so much advantage from this turn 1 acceleration In the end though I think the finals was spot on for those 1 drops . 3rd would be Mom for me . 4th would be Serra Ascendant

[@bugwrld8891]

seth saying grave crawler isnt good in zombie decks outside of combo is just insane. Its one black mana trigger all your sac and death triggers as many times as you want. I was running it without combos and it was so obscenely good i took it out

[@seththeace6217]

I hate to break it to you guys. All of these die to removal, it's not a knock against or a point for any of them.

[@PikachaoArt]

Richard just here to start fires

[@Enos666]

This is gonna be fun, I loved the last time you called on ChatGPT to break your ties.

[@zenoooooo]

Hey guys! Was curious- why not have 5 members on these bracket podcasts? Prevents the need for the coinflip from Chat GPT

[@MTGGoldfishCommander]

Because we don't want 3hr podcasts

[@deepspeed84]

Crim literally flipped a coin.

[@LanceTuckerAPD]

Just FYI chatgpt's database is only up until 2021, so most likely wouldn't consider new cards or meta changes or edhrec deck listings

[@cablefeed3738]

Tournament style I agree with everything. Up to a esper sentinel losing it should have won Ranking 16. Spectral Sailor 15. Slither Blade 14. Changeling Outcast 13. Gingerbrute 12. Gravecrawler 11. Heritage Druid 10. Soul Warden 9. Ragavan 8. Mother of Runes 7. Spore Frog 6. Viscera Seer 5. Goblin Welder 4. Serra Ascendant 3. Weathered Wayfarer 2. Birds of Paradise 1. Esper Sentinel

[@wchenful]

In cEDH the ranking criteria is a lot clearer: T1 (Birds / Ragavan) - go into almost every deck that can play them T2 (Esper Sentinel) - goes into a lot of decks as a value play T3 (Gingerbrute, Slitherblade Viscera Seer, Mother of Runes, Changeling Outcast, Serra Ascendant) - goes in a handful of decks (mostly Yuriko) Rest is unplayable :) I should also mention that Ragavan is practically a red cEDH staple - run in the majority of red decks as an additional mana / card advantage source. An opening hand Ragavan generates so much mana and card advantage that it is generally better than anything short of sol ring / mana crypt - and the smaller pool of played cards in the cEDH format means that you have much higher chances of hitting something useful for your gameplan (card draw / fast mana)

[@michaelcollins4534]

Really love this bracket sytle video, and ngl im pretty happy its been a while since we got an endless spoiler season video Also goblin welder got robbed hard

[@PalPlays]

Mother of Runes basically gives every creature you control hexproof. You're crazy Richard, ESPECIALLY in a pod with Crim! You're arguing that a 5 mana cycler that gives a 1/1 flyer. Yes, a cycler, because this is trash if you're actually planning on drawing cards with the sailor.

[@OhSarcasticOne]

Should get Phil to rate the cards from highest to lowest as the tie breaker

[@sanguavour]

I'm...really questioning some of this opinions, I'm not going to lie. Like, looking at BOP vs Heritage Druid, I feel like it is a very unequal comparison. Obviously Heritage Druid is terrifying in elf decks, because you can tap increments of three elves and and get three mana for each, and you can tap summoning sick elves for the ability. It's basically useless outside of elf decks, and I would hardly consider it a one-drop. I've never seen a deck actually play it on turn one, you hold it until you have at least two other elves to immediately use its effect. Same with mother of runes and spectral sailor, I don't know a single person who would consider spectral to be the better one-drop outside of specific decks that cater to it. Pirates, spirits, decks that need cheap evasive creatures, flash or flying decks, where else would you see this card? Mother of runes actively changes the way other people play the game, and in a group that talks about how Richard constantly goes under the radar and avoids looking like the enemy, I'd point out that people will also look at someone and go "Well I can't do anything to [Player] because of ___, I'll attack elsewhere so I'm at least doing something." It's why pillowfort strategies work, you make it hard to attack you, so people just look elsewhere because they don't want to risk falling behind because they invested resources on relatively small actions. Saying you'd consider playing Spectral Sailor to draw off it seems absurd to me, because I know I would rather pay 3 mana to draw two at sorcery speed with Divination instead of paying 5 mana to get a 1/1 and draw one at instant speed. I understand that card draw is king in card games, but the cost of drawing those cards are important too, spectral sailor is very overcosted for one card in my opinion. It feels like you're trying to equate bronze to gold, to explain how bronze is better than silver. Does it have its place? Sure. Do those specific places make it better than something thats just generally decent? I don't think so.

[@timshuman7746]

Inaccurate video title. Should have been 'Second best one drop in commander after Deathrite Shaman'

[@timc2620]

Just a few days ago I remember posting on Twitter about how at least one person has to be Devils Advocate and be contrarian…and that is perfectly exemplified by the BoP/Heritage Druid debate.

[@Hypnusrecords]

Casual commander is a midrange format, going ~10 turns. What you do on turn 3 is almost irrelevant unless you plan to combo and win on turn 4-5. Drawing cards, hitting land drops consistently is more valuable than sticking your nose out early to have it smashed by three players. Unless you enjoy that!

[@matthewjennings7645]

Ragavan dashing in at points of opportunity, like after chump blockers from the previous player, or after a board wipe, is relevant. IF you happen to find evasion or something synergistic, then you can cast it. Also, exiling the top card is good for disrupting some occasional opponent strategies. In terms of popularity, Ragavan is not going to be in more decks because it's expensive but if it were for the card itself it would be plenty popular.

[@alicepbg2042]

the only reason I won't be using it... $$$

[@ringoderbar1522]

About Golbin Welder, there is something that wasn't said, which makes Golbin Welder the best One-Drop in all of EDH, and easily better than Serra Ascendant. And it's only three word: The One Ring Edit: Spectral Sailor made it, but Shrieking Drake didn't? sadface

[@AxillaryPower2]

Idk what they're talking about with "you don't play mana dorks anymore." If I play Beast Whisperer or Guardian Project (i.e., near every creature heavy deck), I play mana dorks. If I have a 5 mana commander that I want to curve out on turn 3, I play mana dorks. I only don't have birds in all my green decks because they're a little expensive.

[@orgazmo686971]

Richard: Doesn't every elf deck run Heritage Druid. No. No. Seriously?

[@RyanEglitis]

"But remember, you gotta play the welder and untap with it" As opposed to Serra Ascendent, which as we ALL know has haste and can attack immediately... 😑

[@henrybartholomew5383]

One thing I think would have been interesting is asking everyone at the end which of the 16 would be their personal pick for the number one spot. I also think it would be good to identify in advance what the criteria are. I think that would have helped in picking between cards that are S tier in certain decks, and cards that are A tier in very many decks.

[@MrWing946]

Love the fact that tomer defended goblin welder because he said he leans into synergistic decks, but just 10 minutes ago he was having a mental breakdown because they were defending heritage druid over birds

[@adamthebatmanwest]

So personally I think the best one drop out of these is mother of runes. Blocks for days, allows your commander to get in for damage, and gives protection from targeted removal. Yeah it folds to most boardwipes but so does almost every card so thats not a great argument

[@geeknseek]

This bracket had it out for Crim 😂😭

[@DarthChocolate15]

I was 100% with Tomer on round one, until he broke the streak at the last moment with Soul Warden. Its probably my favorite card on the list, but I don't think its that strong. The response to "oh, we looked over and the player is at 60 life because we ognored the Soul Warden" isn't "wow, that's really strong", its "anyway, attack you".

[@Torgr_SH]

Seth is dead on about how most people play against Esper Sentinel. I always run into people who "will never pay," then I draw a million.

[@joewhite4456]

But even if you play against the opposite you end up with your opponents using 15 or so mana to stop your one mana creature.

[@Torgr_SH]

@@joewhite4456 for sure. It’s very powerful.

[@Torgr_SH]

@exsnypre your LGS is on it then. My main one has a lot of people who don’t pay, so it ends up getting a wild amount of value. It’s down to meta wherever you play I’d say.

[@joewhite4456]

@exsnypre I mean, the fact that it's killed says how amazing of a value engine it is, that they'd waste removal on a 1 drop.

[@HtoC940]

How did you guys go from stating that none of you even play BoP, to deciding it's the best one drop in EDH? Lol. I may have cast one BoP in 7 years of EDH. It is probably the least played (worst) one drop of the entire list in any play group I've been a part of.

[@Summer_Snows]

Absolutely wild that half the cast is so anti mana dorks They aren't strong because they last forever, or even because of creature synergies necessarily. They're strong because they're, on average, cheaper than land ramp

[@jamesclare1858]

I appreciated the entertainment value of this podcast. It's also great to hear white get a shutout for their 1 drop creatures. This bracket showed the range of effects & power of white one-drop creatures.

[@yaboityler2617]

If Birds of Paradise is a stand in for all similar mana dorks, you gotta consider Gilded Goose and its role in different combos. Heritage Druid has combo potential, but so do other mana dorks

[@jeremymorris6000]

Crim: "There are a LOT.... a LOOOOOHT.... of things I LOOOOOOVE..... about SLITHER BLAAAAAADE!"

[@Kopekemaster]

Here's a hot take for ya - I like Gilded Goose more than Birds. Birds just makes mana. What does Goose do? ETB ability to double/flicker Creates token Creates artifact Sacrifices artifact Activated ability to make more artifacts Artifacts can sacrifice themselves to gain life That is a lot of possible synergies. Birds is certainly STRONGER generically, but I think Goose will play better in some decks due to having a lot of potential synergies.

[@adamparker4580]

Their interaction amongst each other, especially debating rankings, always has me smiling.

[@marsrocks247]

It's obviously elixir of immortality. That's the best way to stop Crim from getting you with his unstoppable mill sword and honestly what else is there going on in commander

[@nathanstruble8587]

The Weathered Wayfarer take beating out Changeling Outcast just absolutely had me putting my headphones speechless haha. The amount of combat damage focus in the design space is absurd! Factor in how most tribal decks tend to be naturally synergistic with the combat step and you’ve got legit gas that just fits more archetypes and decks as a whole.

[@danielsniff6405]

But I have to agree with Seth. Playing a changeling in place of an actual tribal card just feels lame as hell, even in decks like rin and seri where a changing is debatable better since it has both creature types.

[@SamuelKacerik]

You see, clearly it's the matter of perspective cause I was just wondering wtf are we even talking about here. It's not even close and WW is just MUCH better in my opinion.

[@siener]

Weathered Wayfarer is seriously underrated. The fact that it can fetch any land makes it so much better than other white catch up ramp. In fact it makes your other catch up ramp better. By fetching cards like Lotus Field, Karoo, etc, you can ensure that your catch up ramp keeps firing. And if you're not just looking to ramp, it can get you Field of the Dead, Strip Mine, Glacial Chasm, Reliquary Tower, Bojuka Bog, or whatever else you need at that moment.

[@stormycat0905]

You forget that Goblin Welder can target any player. So you can make people sac indestructible artifacts like the Ring and Darksteel Citadel.

[@SpecialKail]

Tomer mentioned using it on opponents

[@kylegonewild]

You can't target them if they have nothing in their graveyard. It requires removal to already be used against your opponent to later act as removal against an opponent, but yes, it is a niche answer to indestructible artifacts, or just problematic artifacts in general, in decks running enough artifacts to get one in the graveyard.

[@Icarus_inc]

Wonderful video guys, good job

[@Zookmottin]

Changeling Outcast vs Weathered Wayfarer is a perfect example of why you need to to only look back so many years. (I would argue determine the top 16 by all time vs top 16 of 5 years vs top 16 of 1 year vs top 16 of last set release).

[@ig7398]

Seth: Gravecrawler is better because it's unique and irreplaceable. Also Seth: Birds is better Serra Ascendant.