AR Pistol vs SBR

[@ShiceTea]

You’re like the only person on KZbin who has actually broken this down and made all these rules and classifications comprehensible. Thank you man!

[@blackonblack...9244]

Should note that we aren't supposed to be legally registering them even to the feds. But you know the gov't don't care.

[@s0bedrag0n]

Abolish NFA and ATF should be a convienent store.

[@davelpz3340]

Abolish gravity. You hear how dumb that sounds? 😂

[@Nidhoggr333]

​@@davelpz3340Boot licker 😊

[@faroukm4148]

@@davelpz3340yeah because it has nothing to do what what he said lol

[@6eth_LM]

it would be but there are stoidi with 🔫 everywhere 🐦🧠

[@Iamabot4708]

That's stupid I want the ATF to be there but they shouldn't have as much power as they do now the ATF is objectively good I don't want a bunch of random people running around with a bunch of random guns

[@jbats7152]

Since you mentioned it, I got my suppressor tax stamp back in 43 hours, this month.

[@ronlicari5403]

mine was 3 days

[@shadowball932]

Thank you for the simplified definition's and getting to the point and keeping the video linear and concise! Perfect examples on parts and lengths.

[@dennishines9996]

A person may add a vertical fore grip to a firearm with an overall length of 26 or more inches without creating an AOW.

[@SpaceRanger187]

I was going to rob the bank but glock switches are illegal.. What should I do..ridiculous

[@ramdom_assortment]

Hah! Not anymore. The Chevon Doctrine was just struck down so those ATF letters means absolutely nothing.

[@civicsr2cool]

You missed some very important parts here.. an sbr is a downgrade in every single way from a pistol. In a lot of states Sbr’s are just plain illegal, you can’t travel with them, can’t carry them, can’t put them in a vehicle, etc.. but a pistol none of that applies and are free to basically do whatever.

[@GunsNGames248]

They aren't illegal. You have to have a stamp.

[@civicsr2cool]

@@GunsNGames248 they are definitely illegal in a lot of places still. There is no difference in the eye of the law between a machine gun and an sbr, you can probably guess which states still have them banned without even looking it up. There are no benefits in building an sbr vs a pistol.

[@IMABEAST191]

I can tell you one thing for sure aside from the restrictions like having to ask permission to take them across state lines etc (which is super easy to if you are familiar with the atf forms system) after you build your first SBR it’s no going back!! Not only do they look 10x more badass but they feel super comfortable to the point where it feels awkward going to back to normal “16+ rifles. As far as accuracy goes anything I am able hit with my 16,18inch rifles I can do just as good or even better with my 10.3-10.5 SBR’s.

[@ch3cksund3ad]

Seriously, I don't understand why so many people are so willing to pay the government 200$, to let them put different attachments on a weapon. Attachments that are typically far less than even 100$. And like you pointed out, it comes with many more restrictions. It's pretty stupid.

[@Valorius]

@@GunsNGames248 SBR's are illegal in some US states.

[@robramos211]

Thank you for making this easy as hell. I figured I was good to go down the path that I want to go with my next purchase and your video confirmed it.

[@Valorius]

For me (ex grunt and current gun tuber), the AR pistol in 5.56mm (and similar light recoiling calibers) is superior because the KAK shockwave, my preferrd brace, weighs only 4oz, and is a perfectly good substitute for a stock (I also love the way they look skeletonized) In larger calibers, the SBR is potentially better for recoil mitigation purposes. Braced pistols are inherently better in general because I don't have to pay the US Gov't extortion fee of $200. Finally, because of the various laws in the US, in *some* states a pistol holds significant legal advantages over a SBR, both for transport and for carrying on your person or in your vehicle.

[@Valorius]

@@Noname456-tw7vu You're just not thinking deeply. An SBR can use a proper stock, so it can have, ta-da: a recoil pad. And a full stock is 2x the weight of a KAK shockwave. So...more weight AND a recoil pad. If you need me to help you figure out any more basic facts or physics, I'll be here all day, son.

[@Valorius]

@@Noname456-tw7vu If you put more weight and a recoil pad on any shoulder-able weapon, it will recoil significantly less. You cannot legally put a recoil pad on a pistol brace. Therefore, a SBR has more recoil mitigation potential. I only edit my posts for spelling and grammar errors.

[@Valorius]

@@Noname456-tw7vu Recoil pads are extremely well known for recoil reduction. So you are, to put it bluntly, completely wrong.

[@toddhenson5570]

I'm not concerned with how an SBR handles recoil over a pistol brace, when the SBR is locked away, unloaded, in a case, in the trunk. I wouldn't pay $200 for that

[@Valorius]

@@toddhenson5570 a lot of people also do not know that there is a huge Criminal enhancement for use of an SBR in a crime. Which is what your self-defense case will be if some d-bag DA charges you. James Reeves just did a video on this last week I believe the enhancement is over 20 years in prison.

[@Flashhideronly]

You’re doing a good job bro. Keep it up!

[@mudgunner]

Appreciate it!

[@coolbreeze2.0-mortemadfasc13]

The rules on braces and stocks and suppressors are really senseless considering that most crime is done with handguns.

[@mudgunner]

Agreed

[@angeldesigns1385]

Not to mention, almost every time I see a pic of an AR pistol that was used in a crime in some random local news footage, (which is not very common) it either has a foam cover on the tube, or nothing at all. I live in Nashville TN and i watched a body cam vid of local police recovering what appeared to be a 7.5 that had the tube literally cut off right at the castle nut where you could see the BCG still locked into battery They obviously knew nothing about the platform and obviously never shot it after making the “alterations” I’d say it was probably stolen from someone who once again, knew nothing about the functionality of it, and I’d say it was probably recommended by a ignorant 60, 70 year old uncle considering the suspect was from the north Nashville area.

[@44Mag]

One disadvantage to an SBR is you have to have pre-approval from the ATF to take the gun out of state, whereas a pistol with a brace is treated just like your sidearm as far as the law is concerned. One disadvantage (for me) of a pistol with a brace is that in my state, if you carry a pistol, it must be in either a shoulder holster or in a hip holster. This means the pistol would have to be kept in a backpack or something. An SBR though, can be carried openly with no worries, as long as you are not carrying it in a "threatening manor"

[@mudgunner]

I don’t mind having both sbrs and pistols so I have options. Arizona is pretty relaxed on carry laws which is nice

[@trippykoa616]

Great video. Personally, I just don’t care. I’m a law abiding citizen who works hard for the guns that I buy, if I wanna buy an ARP and then deck it out like an operator, then that’s exactly what I’m doing.

[@ExpatPlan]

If it is 26" over all length, has a pistol brace you can use a VFG without regisgtering an AOW

[@darrylmuse9948]

NJ “others” 😁👍🏾👍🏾

[@jamesmccreary8246]

Bro backed out a crazy build at the end 😭🔥

[@lucassales6794]

That scar is my dream gun , 2025 I might gift myself and with that same color. Awesome man!!! Thanks for explanation. New follower.

[@jimflowers3105]

My lower was multi stamped, in notes the Sbr rifle is 300 and 556.

[@dannyduke4807]

Here's a question I cannot seem to get answer for. Can I legally install a scope or magnifier to an AR pistol? I heard part of the pistol brace rule the ATF attempted to make also mentioned scopes and other optics with limited eye relief classifying as an SBR but I haven't heard if that was thrown out with the brace ban or not.

[@mudgunner]

Yes, you can have any optic you want on an AR pistol

[@TooManyChoices1]

The AFT has tricked people into complying with their bullshit… The AFT don’t control your personally owned firearms, and have zero say inside state lines. Fck the NFA, it’s unconstitutional as applied to individuals.

[@marcbenoit6974]

I like that I can conceal carry my 556 pistol.

[@ShaneHarmon140]

If I’m not mistaken, it is illegal to transport SBRs across state lines without permission from the ATF whether SBRs are legal in that state or not. In the flip side. I’m pretty sure AR pistols are regulated the same as handguns when going from state to state. State and local laws will determine if they are legal or not.

[@imriggedup1888]

Can I put a pistol stock on a registered SBR so I can travel to a neighboring state without having to ask for permission? …asking for a friend!!

[@ShaneHarmon140]

@@imriggedup1888 😂😂😂I’m pretty sure it doesn’t work like that.

[@IMABEAST191]

⁠​⁠@@imriggedup1888no sir that is illegal you have to ask permission. The problem lies in the serial number.

[@sincere0025]

​@@imriggedup1888😂😂😂😅😅😅. We have the same friend

[@fastshuther]

Thank you, i just hate how something so simple has been made into something so complicated for no reason

[@AltezzaDCG]

So the TLDR is essentially - an SBR uses a stock, and AR Pistol uses a brace? Also - wheres the best place to get an affordable silencer for a PSA barrel? Currently it's 8" inches and shoots 556. Thanks!

[@Commonwealth_Prepper]

Can you explain OAL? I hear it has to be less than 26 inches to be a pistol.. but 11.5 inch barrels make the OAL at least 26-1/2 if not more.

[@COMMANDERHAWK22]

can you switch out your rifle upper and put a pistol upper with a brace on a rifle lower ?

[@shadowsteel11]

If you bought the rifle as a rifle you cannot covert it to a pistol. If you bought an AR pistol and converted to a rifle, you can switch it back to its original form as an AR pistol

[@Dsrgreyy]

@@shadowsteel11what if you bought a striped lower

[@shadowsteel11]

@@Dsrgreyy that’s fine, it’ll be registered as a other, your FFL should do it automatically but make sure. Then when you build it out that’s when you choose to make it a rifle or pistol. But you don’t have to register it unless you form 1 to sbr as it’s been listed as other at the FFL. All my ar builds are pistol builds.

[@Dsrgreyy]

@@shadowsteel11 thanks for that

[@3cap97]

Nice job -- to my knowledge your facts are in order and accurate. My only suggestion .... for the "beginner's discussion " wrt "rifles / SBR's / pistols" would be to have mentioned the subject of crossing state lines with a firearm and the different requirements for registered SBR's vs. AR pistols.

[@AZCactusTac]

I like a full stock so i usually go with SBR. It takes a very short amount of time for approval these days.

[@Fnawesome]

I heard that there was an old rule for brace pistols that the Length of pull can’t be longer than 13.5 inches. Is this still current?

[@dnalevelc144]

Soo, can one get an AOW tax stamp for a vertical foregrip on an AR pistol?

[@mudgunner]

Yes you could

[@TooManyChoices1]

Anybody that has complied with the NFA is no friend of the 2A. 🤔

[@LatchkeyKidX]

I stopped running a brace on my ar pistols years ago. IMO they defeat tha major purpose of an AR pistol which is being able to manipulate them in very tight spaces with simply a cheek wield on the buffer tube. You just simply can’t manipulate a buttstock/brace in the same ways as you can with just the buffer tube. I own braces. And I understand a middle finger to the ATF. But somewhere along the way we have forgotten to embrace the real benefits of a pistol.

[@DDesigner123]

Do you know for sure how they measure a AR pistol? Is the brace factored into the overall length being under 26"? It seems noone truly knows this. Also if you buy a complete ower with a stock and you remove the stock and put a brace is it now a pistol? I have also heard different views on this. Thanks.

[@christopherwilliams5808]

I have a SDPE Kriss Vector im thinking about SBRing. How do i go about it? Do I take the pistol with me to a gun shop that offers the SBR service or do I just fill out paperwork, pay the $200 extortion fee and be on my way? How do I know when Im approved or not?

[@Southernoutlaw86]

What if I bought a sbr upper from my brother that he bought at a pawn shop I'm wanting to put it on a lower ... Do I need to get a stamp before assembling it ? I'm so confused about the sbr laws in ga

[@Killswitch1411]

Yes, you need a Tax stamp before building it, and you have to do it for everyone you build. I dont know your Local laws on SBRs look that up before applying for a SBR.

[@yourface3154]

So if you buy the 10.5" complete upper "pistol" kit from PSA, how would it be an SBR?

[@mudgunner]

If you go the SBR route I would do it on a higher end lower like a bcm

[@yourface3154]

@@mudgunner I'm not wanting to pay the tax stamp for an sbr, just have a pistol.

[@mudgunner]

Then you would just put a brace on the lower, not a stock

[@yourface3154]

@@mudgunner So odd. Appreciate the help.

[@ttss5726]

@@mudgunnerso what makes the two different the Velcro?

[@iseeunwo7390]

What is the 26 inch rule for a foregrip ?

[@Chadh-e6h]

What you meant to say is the vertical grip cannot be 90° but that's all right not everybody knows the NFA laws

[@austinmontes5946]

What’s the mag you have on the pistol

[@jasonreed3119]

Thank you for speaking up. The people need guidance 😎🤙🏼

[@saltpro5603]

No hesitation in putting the can on the scar? Heard they won't honor warranty if you do that 🤔

[@skydivingcomrade1648]

Rifles used to be 18", but the most popular 22lr rifle was 16", so the ATF changed rifles to 16".

[@timothykitchens9972]

That's not how that happened

[@SleepyDubVRT]

Can you put a magnifier on the pistol?

[@marcbenoit6974]

At what degree would you safely say would be angled for sure?

[@chickennuggets2929]

how do you "notify" the ATF if you want to change calibers on your SBR? what makes it official, are they going to send me some paperwork that i need to keep a copy of? How exactly does this work?

[@civicsr2cool]

You have to send them a physical letter saying you’re changing the caliber/oal etc

[@chickennuggets2929]

@@civicsr2cool but how does it become official, like do they send me a different stamp ? (a paper with the updated caliber) , in a court of law, I can say I sent them a letter but what evidence would i have? I could send it certified letter , but even that wouldn't be sufficient.

[@Turn2Ugin]

It’s all a joke

[@justinrichardson4456]

How about just shutting the hell up and doing what you want?

[@robinikeman9360]

​​@@chickennuggets2929 it should be OK as long as the caliber change isn't permanent.

[@The803Hitman]

Is the $200 tax stamp a one time fee or do you have to pay the tax for every other SBR that you purchase?

[@Killswitch1411]

Its for every SBR you build/Purchase

[@RoyClendaniel]

How do you tell the difference between an AR pistol brace and a stock?

[@Dsrgreyy]

Item description

[@KN-cool]

In my state you can have a loaded pistol in your car but not a loaded rifle.

[@senpai_sake3276]

So wait since the ATF can’t enforce their rules and make arrests on them, doesn’t this fall into that category? Or is it an actual law that I can’t add a vertical grip on my pistol?

[@realtruth1448]

Look it up if you don’t believe me, here is the rules You can instantly by an ARP, it takes about 6-7 months to be approached for a SBR, with an ARP you cannot be the vertical forward grip on it

[@ofromda860]

Great video, had to sub when I heard you're here in Az!

[@mudgunner]

Thanks for the sub!

[@Ultrarmx]

Doesn’t it make it illegal if you’re shooting with a pistol AR and place the brace to your shoulder?

[@civicsr2cool]

No

[@hawksnake3372]

It used to. the ATF put out several different opinion letters over the course or several years that flip flopped on that but it ended up landing on the decision that they cant tell you how to hold it.

[@theinfluencechannel3833]

No. You can still shoulder a buffer tube which is why the whole rule is dumb as hell.

[@TMFShooting]

Another Great Video 💯 Thank you 💥💥💥💥💥💥💥

[@mudgunner]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@georgelopez16]

5 star video

[@ino592002]

Your comments have been turned off on your latest vids. Why?

[@mudgunner]

Because KZbin is censoring it for no reason. I keep turning the comments back on but they turn it off again shortly after. Thank you for watching the videos!

[@ino592002]

@mudgunner I seen the same thing on some other content creators vids as well. Well I will just have to use this TTP to give feedback on your work.

[@santanagamingcinema]

Hey, Im having a hard time with this. How do you grip around your Scar 16's handguard and activate your peq15 at the same time? I can do it but its very tiring, especially in classes.

[@pancho4575]

Do you have a tape switch for it? If not it will make it easier

[@demon_milk_man8686]

Probably just a tape switch on the side

[@civicsr2cool]

In the Marines we put the peq on the right side of the handguard for this reason, we tilt rifle to the left to get laser above bore and shoot like that when active aiming.

[@johnneill5960]

You can have a vertical grip on a pistol if you meet the overall length requirement. For example my AR pistol has a 12.5 barrel & I used a rifle length buffer tube to get to a legal overall length in order to have a vertical foregrip .

[@K.Miller5150]

The barrel has to be 16 inches not the length of rifle

[@K.Miller5150]

If you have a 12 inch barrel and say a 4 inch flash hider for example for 16 inch then your good

[@demon_milk_man8686]

AOW section of classification is not something a lot of people including LEO acknowledge or know about in general

[@K.Miller5150]

@demon_milk_man8686 I agree but the fudds at my local range will ask for tax stamps its insane

[@johnneill5960]

@@K.Miller5150 as long as the overall length of the “pistol “ is 26 inches which on a 12.5 in barrel WITH a rifle length buffer tube can easily be reached with practically any muzzle device than the “ pistol “ can have a vertical foregrip legally . Ask DR google it pops right up .

[@a80Adam]

I’m just getting into guns/building them at 35 years old. I must say, the laws are the dumbest crap ever that can easily cost you jail time. I thought building race cars and avoiding the EPA/local law enforcement was bad… This has to be worse!

[@garykappes4654]

Very good information.

[@User-zl9pj]

I just get what I want 😂 ain’t no dam atf over here

[@TooManyChoices1]

Registering your private weapons with the government, to what? Re own the weapon you already own, is fucking hilarious. 😂! Fcking stamp collectors lol

[@scottbowlin9374]

Can ypu put a lpvo on a ar pistol

[@-Seager]

Yes, that’s not illegal or regulated. Should you? Is a completely other question though.

[@scottbowlin9374]

@@-Seager why shouldn't you

[@demon_milk_man8686]

Only argument i could see is it’s a shorter barrel length but that doesn’t necessarily mean you shouldn’t add a Lpvo. A lot of people have red dot, holographics, prisms, and Lpvos on their ar pistols. Totally up to you and how you want to rock your build

[@-Seager]

@@scottbowlin9374 Yeah I agree with what the other commenter said. However, shorter length ARs don’t push the full potential of a LPVO and some LPVO/Magnified optics are optimized around 14.5” barrels. But honestly, it’s completely up to you. I didn’t necessarily mean you “shouldn’t” put a LPVO on an AR pistol. It’s more of a question of: “do I need/want a LPVO?” or “what optic is best for my AR pistol and my environment?”

[@RigoEscuadra]

Do you only pay the tax stamp once?

[@mudgunner]

Yes

[@ttss5726]

Wait you work in the gun industry yet failed to explain what’s different from a stock and an adjustable pistol brace. I mean you have a sbr with a stock it adjust But then show a pistol with a stock that adjusts. What makes the two different other then a strip of Velcro

[@bondvagabond42]

The weird thing, is that it took 1.5 years, to get a tax stamp for EVER, then, when it looked like the atf was gonna get their illegal pistol brace law making slapped down, all of a sudden it only takes a week? Almost as if they wanted to get as many tax stamps as they could, before the grownups in politics made them stop, and, maybe the whole wait a year and a half thing was just a "soft ban" they were illegally doing without lawmaker oversight. Curious. Can you immagine if you filed your taxes, or voted, and it took 1.5 years to get the results of that from the government? No one would stand for that.

[@riiddisbuk2496]

SBRs. A heavily ridiculous legal concept of many ridiculous legal concepts. The difference between 10 years in prison and/or $10,000 in fines is a damn accessory (vertical grip and/or stock). Fucking abolish the NFA shit. It's "Not For America" =/

[@GaMeRfReAkLIVE]

Your pistol looks like its easily over 26 inches so you can put a vertical grip on it if you wanted

[@oo7-ro6bu]

Yup 👍 👍

[@rickt4293]

That scar looks heavy.

[@screennamenottaken2]

I’ve held one that was for rent at a range. It was deceptively light.

[@imriggedup1888]

Can I put a pistol stock on a registered SBR so I can travel to a neighboring state without having to ask for permission? …asking for a friend!!

[@demon_milk_man8686]

I believe Sage Dynamics covers this topic in one of his videos and he is ex LEO. I believe you can

[@civicsr2cool]

That’s the dumbest way to try do it, interstate travel with an sbr is still regulated as an sbr. Once a firearm is an sbr, it is an sbr for the rest of its life it can never go back. Also, a pistol can become a rifle and back to a pistol, a rifle can never become a pistol. Just buy a pistol lower.

[@ronalddavis]

I'm a gun guy but lets cut the bullshit. a pistol with a "brace" is the same as an SBR. they both are fired from the shoulder. show me one video where brace is used any other way"

[@LeQuito]

Very true... but lawfully a brace is supposed to utilized as designed for folks with disabilities. Hence forth the Straps

[@realtruth1448]

But they can’t label a gun with a brace = a gun with a stock, because a brace wasn’t created to be shot from a rifle nor from the shoulder, it was designed for pistols to be shot from the forearm, so by the definition not your opinion a SBR with a brace automatically becomes a pistol by the definition

[@pawsandpedals407]

Fed

[@ochi5.56]

Strange ! Glad we Austrians dont have any of these Lengh , Foregrip ,Brace Laws/Restrictions.

[@aprilwine132]

I got my silencer in 24 hours two days ago.

[@Killswitch1411]

Even if a officer seen your SBR I don't think they would even know otherwise lol. If you go walking out in public with it, ya they will probably ask you a huge amount of questions, like wth are you doing!! But in general I don't think many police are very versatile in all the rules and federal regulations on SBRS. They likely wont be measuring your rifle to make sure its 16" Follow the law and most of all follow the federal law and be responsible even if the rules are just stupid.

[@williamcollins3565]

The fact is that an AR "pistol" is a short-barrelled AR rifle, with a funny, uncomfortable butt stock. The only question is "what's wrong with that?" It's handy to carry and use so why should it be "illegal" as long as you don't intend to use it for a crime?

[@darrylmuse9948]

The brace rule has been killed by the 5 th Circuit a couple of months ago. The rule no longer exist 😁

[@ronalddavis]

for now

[@Bstallday89]

I love my arp

[@carbonfibercrypto2919]

2 days for a form 1 - April 2024

[@mudgunner]

That’s awesome!

[@JasonSmith-gq4hb]

I refuse to beg the government before being allowed to cross state lines.

[@anonymoussurname]

Aside from an AR pistols’ buffer tube everything else requires a stock to really shoulder and fire. Join the government list and just SBR it.

[@mudgunner]

I’m a fan of SBRs. This is just info for people who may not know

[@Steezy.gunz_]

Literally the same thing lol

[@thomascharlson9020]

Lewis Melissa Hall Donna Hernandez Richard

[@carldaout8191]

Great information! On the other hand, you really look like Elon Musk.

[@KFish-bw1om]

A pistol is not subject to all of the unconstitutional garbage that the rifle is, and the pistol is covered under my concealed carry permit. Easy decision.

[@chiwalker7325]

👍🏾

[@IngersollMaria-z9s]

Gonzalez Ronald Walker Sandra Lewis Shirley

[@davida.mourino9749]

great information keep up the work we are learning teach us thank you atf is like a woman emotional confused there wives are running the atf

[@dereksekingsman2591]

Walker Brenda Robinson James Harris Frank

[@LewisMabel-z7y]

Gonzalez Michelle Jones Anthony Lee Brenda

[@WellsLindsay-e6e]

Martin Margaret Thomas Jessica Wilson Sandra

[@MPGunther1]

Thanks for explaining silly laws

[@DanetteKshlerin]

Miller Helen Walker Jason Thomas Karen

[@FaceRipprMonkey]

Lmao 😂 I can’t understand why you dudes love to ruled over so much. It’s actually embarrassing.

[@mikewest9033]

Free men don't ask or pay for permission. Imma gonna own what the hell i want to i don't give a shit what the rules are

[@mudgunner]

👍

[@christopherwilliams5808]

You are free to do so. But don't cry "Free me" when you get caught with an illegal firearm. Ignorance of the law doesn't work.

[@mikewest9033]

@@christopherwilliams5808 the hell if it doesn't. Never owned a gun in my name an haven't been caught with one either. They gone have to do they job an catch me first

[@christopherwilliams5808]

@mikewest9033 cool. Then why are you under a SBR and AR pistol video ?

[@mikewest9033]

@@christopherwilliams5808 😂 what does any of that have to do with me watching a video?

[@greatshot69]

Elon Musk!