MiG-15 Vs. F-86 | Dueling Duos

[@mr.t-7243]

The F-86 looking mildly suprised like •o• And the MiG 15 looks just astounded like •○•

[@MrDino1953]

And that’s the real difference between them. The look of mild surprise always wins against completely dumbfounded.

[@adamdubin1276]

Fun fact the first MIG-15's downed during dogfights in Korea weren't downed by F-86's they were downed by the Navy's lovely F9F Panther.

[@sericono9077]

In fact there was an American pilot that downed 4 Migs in the same dogfight when Migs attacked him. He landed his Panther full of holes but still flyable. That's why during WWII Grumman was called ironwork.

[@sblack48]

Probably because being carrier based they got to the theatre first.

[@felixgaede6754]

A Mig15 was once shot down by an F4U

[@bong4538]

@@felixgaede6754 When I was a kid I'm always confused to the F4U and FH Phantom 😁

[@felixgaede6754]

@@bong4538 Not sure if you are only telling your personal story here or if you are trying to tell me that I was cunfusing the Phantom with the Corsair. But if so, then no, I actually mean the Corsair

[@markthibault8579]

The F-86 also had a flying tail which made it handle better in the trans-sonic region whereas the MiG-15 had a tradtional horizontal stabiliser and elevator arrangement.

[@bobroberts2371]

The F-86 was used as a backdrop for many 1956 Plymouth car ads.

[@hambone4402]

@@bobroberts2371 How interesting. I was a kid in ‘56 but I don’t remember that. Thanks for sharing.

[@fredferd965]

This is true! Also, having the horizontal stabilizer and elevator at the top of the tail was a design misconception that caused a lot of trouble over time. The F-104 had one. There is a danger of the main wing blocking out the airflow over the tail during certain kinds of stalls, creating a severe loss of control. The British airliner, the BAC-111 had a "T" tail, and their "answer" to the problem was to have a stick shaker that would warn the pilots when they were about to get into trouble. That's a crude "fix" at best. The best place for the tail surfaces, preferably a flying tail, was low on the fuselage, but the Russians were copying a lot of data from the WWII Germans and, for once, the Germans got it wrong. The transonic handling qualities of the Mig-15 were shaky at best. For all of that, it had a lot of good qualities too.

[@sblack48]

While the sabre did have a stabilator it was no more maneuverable in pitch than the mig 15.

[@weirdguy564]

That is true, but, as ever, it is more complicated than that. The first model F-86A's didn't have the flying tail. They had conventional tails with elevators on the back. 500+ built. It was the "E" model that switched to the all flying tail where the fin as a whole moves. 450 built, and then the "F" model as well, and that was the majority with over 2200 built.

[@felixgaede6754]

Sabre wins for aesthetics alone, my favorite aircraft when it comes to that

[@carybutters]

Oh thanks a bunch bro. Enjoyed your Vid huge ! Am a cancer patient ( worry not because I have both fists doubled up and will fight like a junkyard dog ) and sometimes I get bored as heck. One can only read a surf KZbin and such so much. Then along comes a new one that entertains me and mucho gracias for that ! 5 star vid in my book.

[@bogdanradulescu870]

Finally some one who give the deserved credits to the german design used for both planes.

[@TitoM72]

Your F-86 is from the Royal Canadian Air force. We flew this aircraft for a long time. What a great fighter.

[@killer1963daddy]

Canadair produced a superior variation to the North American product

[@bobroberts2371]

The F-86 was used as a backdrop for many 1956 Plymouth car ads.

[@appa609]

CL-13

[@ralphhalliwellwright7652]

@@appa609 ye

[@cabobs2000]

They had one flying in air shows for the 2010 flying centenial

[@ConvairDart106]

Boosted controls, automatic leading edge slats, a stabilator and the newer lead computing gun sight were refinements that gave the Sabre an edge. Boosted controls levels the playing field by reducing physical exertion in a tight turning fight. The Canadians had the most powerful Sabre using their own turbine of 7,500 lbs thrust.

[@elphi4321]

I've heard about the differences between the MIG-15, and the F-86. Though each had their strengths, at the end of the day, it was a fair fight.

[@justinsane332]

yeah mig 8n vertical, but sabre as a rate fighter

[@justinsane332]

mig guns harder for pilots to aim, but hit a lot harder when they landed. sabre had better ballistics, lower caliber. its a classic 6 in one hand situation.

[@douglaswesson2458]

A fair fight as far as equipment, but it's the pilot that counts in the end. With that said, I knew a couple of retired Air Force fighter pilots who said that the F 86 was the sweetest flying plane they had ever flown.

[@patfromamboy]

I’ve lived in Washington my entire life but I still haven’t been to the museum of flight yet. I can see the first 747 parked outside when I drive by on the freeway. I need to go soon.

[@museumofflight]

Get yourself here!

[@patfromamboy]

@@museumofflight when are you open?

[@museumofflight]

@@patfromamboy We're open seven days a week, 10 AM - 5 PM.

[@patfromamboy]

@@museumofflight Thanks a lot!

[@newdefsys]

Locals rarely visit the touristy stuff of their own town. I spent a few months in Orlando (back in the 90s) and I couldn't find anyone that was up to go to Disney.

[@MrDgwphotos]

"What fool will sell us their secrets?"

[@MrDgwphotos]

The Soviets never paid the British for their engine design, as I understand it.

[@billdewahl7007]

@@MrDgwphotos They didn't. But caving to the Soviets was nothing new.

[@reluctantconformist]

The U.S. also stole fighter tech from the british around then too 🤣

[@mackjsm7105]

@@billdewahl7007 I'm Polish and I can relate to what you said!

[@tbyte007]

Same fool that will do BREXIT paid by the Russian propaganda machine ...

[@PaulStewartAviation]

This was a fantastic video! I was due to visit the MoF from Australia last year but alas covid happened. I look forward to visiting again in a few years.

[@marcelkuhne8856]

He really loves his job.

[@combatdoc21]

If I had his job I would be.

[@deanfawcett2085]

(inhales deeply) yeh man he sure does haha

[@linusorm]

The wing fences are not there to solve the "hand built" assertion. But to solve an issue the F86 also shared. F86F's had similar fences, and so do planes up till this day.

[@drperky7008]

sources? and which other modern planes still have wing fences please.

[@Pitchlock8251]

@@drperky7008 MIg17, Mig 19, A-6 intruder, a lot of airliners use just a fence along the leading edge. And its not to fix "build quality" issues, but it one way to fix an aerodynamic issue all swept wing aircraft have. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wing_fence

[@Ace-Av8er]

Function of the wing fence was to prevent washout of air flow which was a pervasive problem in high swept wings. Mig-19, had the largest wing fences.

[@charlestaylor253]

@@Ace-Av8er Wing fences are a rather simple solution to maintain stable, front-to-back airflow over highly-swept wings at high speeds. Although they're highly effective for this purpose they also cause a degree of increased aerodynamic drag, especially while maneuvering at lower speeds. Western designers have traditionally looked at more complex solutions at solving high-speed airflow deviations over swept wings, preferring to not use wing fences at all if avoidable. If not, they tend to use the smallest fences possible. For example, the first fighters designed to routinely operate at supersonic speeds in level flight were the North American F-100 Super Sabre and the Mikoyan/Gurevitch MiG-19 "Farmer". Both aircraft featured highly-swept wings designed to decrease compressibilty near, at, and beyond Mach 1 at altitude. The F-100 used wide-span, variable-position leading-edge slats on both wings, combined with two very small wing fences near the tips to stabilize the high-speed airflow over the wings. The MiG-19, by contrast, used two extremely large mid-span wing fences with no variable leading-edge slats at all to solve the same purpose. This amounts to different design philosophies used by the designers of different countries to solve similar problems...

[@diehardcat]

That comes from the inherent bias that most westerners have against the USSR then and Russia now. They must find flaws even when they're not there! The USSR or Russia always has to be below the US' level on everything. Notice how he said the Russians got 'help' from German designs while the US, which essentially built the same thing, simply 'used' German designs?

[@landocommando572]

Out of all the jet aircraft the United States used in its history, the F 86 will always be my favorite

[@ryanb9749]

The F86 is becoming my favorite. It just looks so cool and has a lot of interesting stories. The last gun fighters.

[@andrewlabat9963]

Mine too..

[@ryanb9749]

@@andrewlabat9963 My favorites used to be thr FW190, Me163, and Me262, and the F teens. But the Mig 15 and the F86 are both REALLY cool.

[@spreadeagled5654]

The F-86 Sabre would have much better destructive firepower if it had been armed with four or six 20 mm cannons instead of the six .50 cal machine guns. The USAF learned its lessons after the Korean War and armed the newer F-86Ds and F-86Hs and the later F-100s with 20 mm cannons.

[@marioguerrero9527]

I am glad you guys were able to take on Matt from Wings Over the Rockies! I loved his content from there and it's great to have him at my favorite museum!

[@tedse21]

We, Australia, put a Rolls Royce Avon engine in it and 4 20mm cannons.

[@jordancourse5102]

I want to fly a MiG-17. My all time favorite plane.

[@danzervos7606]

Interesting how people say the Me-262 was the superior aircraft over Allied jets because it had axial flow engines of the future but ignore the fact that the F-86 had an axial flow engine while the Mig-15 had a radial flow engine.

[@appa609]

lower specific fuel consumption. Radials are less efficient

[@ryanb9749]

262 is a 1st generation jet fighter and 86/15 were 2nd generation fighters.

[@laure5333]

Actually, it's called...centrifugal flow...not "radial"...!!!

[@bearer0975]

Dood, awesome info. I enjoyed this!

[@BigBossIvan]

I didn't know the MiG-15 had such a terrible gunsight. Superior firepower means absolutely nothing when you can't hit your target.

[@kevinmcdonald6446]

North American had a knack for building beautiful planes. F-86 could win on looks alone. But it had the chops too.

[@nickgardner1507]

Nice Job Matthew, very informational

[@a-hvlogs2046]

You guys are the best! Can't wait to come back and see you all!

[@museumofflight]

Thank you! We can't wait to be back in action.

[@daveg.6820]

Excellent stuff. Details, details. Great video. Thanks.

[@carlcushmanhybels8159]

Hmmm. He concludes the major difference between the two was in the mid and later Korean war the F86 used more experienced pilots. In the beginning, the Russians did. So....that's not really a reason to conclude the F86 was that much better.

[@timthorson52]

Yeah, I was going to say the same thing when I saw your comment. The conclusion about which air raft was better was due to pilot skill rather than the characteristics that distinguished the airplanes.

[@et76039]

The last MiG-15 pilot to be shot down in the Korean War was, by the Russians' own admission, a Russian pilot. Per standing orders, he committed suicide to avoid capture.

[@matheuscerqueira7952]

It is better because of the bubble canopy, situational awareness is OP. Look for John Boyd

[@adityadey8876]

Sir kurt tank also designed hf-23 Marut for India...It was India's first jet fighter plane.

[@hudsonch]

Do you mean HF-24? That fighter wasn't very successful.

[@mrrolandlawrence]

wow what a great video. some new things there. i had no idea of the mig 15 being hand built! indeed in a russian documentary soviet pilots say the koreans had around 20 hours of training and that was it such was the pressure.

[@xzqzq]

This video gives the impression that both aircraft are roughly the same size. When looking at both from above, at Smithsonian # 2 in Virginia, the Mig-15 looks much smaller, a virtual sports car.

[@tsmgguy]

Had never seen the firing pass against a B-29 before. It's at 9:19.

[@SliceofLife7777]

I've been here, at the Museum of flight, 3 years ago? Very cool. They have many aircraft here. Including some of Lockheed's most iconic aircraft. There's a Constellation parked out front, beatiful passenger airliner. They have one of NASA's F105 Star Fighters hanging from the ceiling, and an Archangel A12 as the centerpiece of their indoor display. Outside, A B29, A Concord you can board! And lots of others. There's a diner nearby that fits the theme. Way to hilight a very cool Aircraft Museum.

[@MrCervuselaphus]

I think it was the British Labor party that gave the NENE engine to Stalin. (for research purposes of course). Australia, the RAAF, later took up the Sabre and built it around the RR Avon engine, removed the wing leading edge slats, bigger air intake, 30 mm canon and a lot bigger range. cheers.

[@drperky7008]

nae nae engine

[@alecblunden8615]

I know the ALP can't spell, but the British equivalent could - they just put Comradely solidarity above the national interest As to the CAC Avon Sabre - spot on.

[@PeteCourtier]

@@drperky7008 sounds like roadrunner😂

[@robertpatrick3350]

It wasn’t given… and the Soviets broke their licensing agreements…… and they sold the stolen technology on to 3rd parties…

[@imdoobie80]

I absolutely love the Seattle museum of flight. I would love to talk with Matt and look at all of the aircraft.

[@egmccann]

You missed a little bit of interesting (and facepalming) information on the Russians getting the Nene. Aside from little things like having shoes with special soles when they were given a tour of the plant that made them (picking up metal shavings for material analysis,) the British had them promise they'd only use the engines for civil use. To which the Russians, of course, went "Da, da, of course, we promise!" ... and promptly shoved it in fighter aircraft.

[@maximilliancunningham6091]

Very good. Thank you.

[@mongoose4117]

These two planes really stand out! Basically my two favorite aircraft, and dont forget the dr-1 triplane that the red baron died in! Its the coolest of all.

[@pepeborrego8006]

"How cool it's that!?!"

[@conlethbyrne4809]

Hi man,I loved the comparison, very knowable with interesting facts on both planes. My favourite has to be the Mig 15, but what do I know. Peaceful respect. ✌️ ❤

[@tommetcalf7032]

Great job on the video, can't wait for the museum to re-open.

[@jamescooper2618]

Just found this channel. Very cool!

[@1joshjosh1]

How cool is that ?? Freaking cool !!

[@leafymarmot6348]

I love how he is whispering I think its cause he knows most of us are watching this at night

[@alexm566]

10:50 PM...

[@at1970]

Best description of a mig 15 I ever heard was “flying tractor”.

[@antonleimbach648]

I think the F-86 represents everything that American aviation can be. Plus it’s a sexy looking ride.

[@dufus7396]

Kurt Tank went on to produce swept wing jets for other countries

[@nowhere529]

Piper Cub in background doe sent need affirmation, He already knows he is awesome.

[@museumofflight]

💯

[@trsnomis6471]

I really appreciate the detailed information

[@michaelpcoffee]

the 50s were higher velocity and higher fire rate; making them more accurate and got more hits. the f86 was armored and far more survivable.

[@w.loczykij5354]

Listening to you made me feel I'm back watching Sesame Street. Sheeesh...

[@museumofflight]

Sunny Day Sweepin' the clouds away On my way to where the air is sweet

[@larrybremer4930]

Don't all airframe mounted pilot controlled aircraft guns get different aim points to a convergence range (around 1000ft)?

[@_skyfox]

My grandad flew the F86 Saber and F84 Thunderjet as well as a menagerie of other aircraft during his time in the USAF.

[@AshishSinghPaL777]

Everything is cool for this guy.

[@fredferd965]

I don't believe the Soviets put wing fences on the Mig-15 because of poor hand-built construction as you suggest. They put them there because of design flaws inherent to the wing itself. They were there to block span-wise air flow. The Americans would have used vortex generators instead.

[@leonidyevseyev888]

- you are right about them trying to correct the air-flow with those flaps.

[@MikeSiemens88]

That RCAF Canadair license-built Sabre you have had a more powerful Orenda powerplant than the GE J47. ;) Thank you for keeping it indoors in such pristine condition!

[@skyborne80]

That's crazy to put a complete rookie into a MiG with that complicated aiming system. I bet that was a huge factor in that lopsided ratio. It must have been overwhelming for those new MiG pilots.

[@heydonray]

Goodness, this guy speaks as if he’s going a Saturday morning kids show?

[@bobroberts2371]

I wonder if pot is legal Seattle?

[@brendonrutherford5118]

Yeah interesting video obviously but I have to say, get on with it as this video is not supposed to be for the entertainment of young kids but for grown men!! I have to move on otherwise I'll be here until next summer!!

[@paulhunter7002]

Hey Matt, your pronunciation is incorrect; its not the 'Ne-Ne' engine (lol) its pronounced 'Neen'; the engine was named after the river Nene in England. Rolls Royce named some of their jet engines after Rivers in England such as the Trent and the Derwent.

[@Mr.SharkTooth-zc8rm]

Still an excellent video! 👌

[@mikyl-fo8rh]

The 86's radar was the biggest factor.

[@brianford8493]

Feck!...i want to live in that museum.......Brilliant!

[@andrewlabat9963]

Nice video.. Gotta love the F86..!!

[@jonmce1]

Which Canadian F86r was that in the video, mark 6s put out 7200 thrust compared to the early US F86 5200.

[@zeeshanabbas9049]

Man, no matter how awesome MiG would look, but i am a huge fan of F-86 Sabres. I love this aircraft. Simply Awesome American.

[@danmaltby3271]

that was great F8 six m15 video

[@Roddy556]

I've been to the awesome Museum Of Flight. How cool is that!?!

[@EndlessOneZeroEight]

His voice reminds me of Owen Wilson F-86 baby!

[@johna.4334]

And his appearance is that of a Doonsberry character.

[@andrewmcanulty3018]

I like his catching phrase “how cool is that “. So please do carry on the other show.

[@marmite8959]

As a Brit living near the river Nene I'm definitely aware there's some controversy over how it should be pronounced. I can say with certainty that "Nae-Nae" is not either of them 😂

[@ronaldtillberry3253]

In an otherwise excellent documentary, you left out an important fact. Yes, the Mig 15 outperformed the F 86 at higher altitudes, but on the deck the Saber and the Mig were were evenly matched. In fact, the Saber was as much as 50 mph faster than the Mig nearer to the ground.

[@fredmdea785]

How did the museum get a mig? Did the soviets start to sell them after they became obsolete?

[@IncognitoDudeXD]

I dont much about that but it could be fake replicas

[@fredmdea785]

@@IncognitoDudeXD not gonna lie, that would be a biy of a let down. Soviets and the other tens of countries that used mig15s probably dont keep too many secrets abt its design tho

[@Kalashnikov413]

that specific MiG was operated by PLAAF, which mean that it's either captured during Korean War or purchased in the 80's

[@Palanibert]

If this guy says "this guy, and how cool is that" one more time....

[@meister550]

While so similar they were made for different purposes. One was made to shoot b-29, the other was to protect them

[@visionary_8865]

They looked so similar coz the one with stripes was a copy of the other one, so had to have those similarities

[@dufus7396]

Its intresting that from WW11 with Spitfires and Messeshmit 109s Then Mig and Sabres both similar

[@fredsalfa]

That was interesting

[@watchitpolitics]

Do Video on Star Fighter

[@nonkynonk]

2:30 “for civilian purposes only”

[@luispalomino5514]

Nice documental! 👍

[@Clueless09]

I love how much he sounds like Owen Wilson

[@BleedingSnow]

As always, pilot skill by far is the most importatn factor be it tank or plane, but great video =)

[@drperky7008]

@Ignacio Muñoz Diaz what a pendejo

[@johna.4334]

@Lil Agin Chill

[@atharrafique1970]

F86 is a hero plane of 1965 war in between India and Pakistan, Pakistani pilot M.M. Alam made world record in 1965 by F86

[@VengeanceSinX]

Russian piloted Mig 15s blasted them out of the sky, one night the Allied air loss was so heavy that they named it black day lol.

[@sheddski2942]

It’s funny how we got that MIG it came from a Korean defector

[@MrTimodon]

And where is the Swedish jet the "Tunnan" or the Barrel?

[@keko_1717]

went from Air over the Rockies to the museum of flight come back bro

[@johnaugsburger6192]

Thanks

[@ParabellumHistory]

Man I envy your job Keep up the good work :D

[@gordonlawrence1448]

The RR engine is pronounced NEEEEN or Knee with an "n" on the end, It's part of the river series and that is still going with the Trent.

[@newdefsys]

Nay-Nay sounds like the response you give when someone says NaNu-NaNu to you

[@Diwana71]

He is really good.

[@anthonystark3959]

Sabre dance, baby!

[@migueldeniseful]

Today, Russian and American historians such as Cookie Sewall and Diego Zampinni admit that on 10/01/1955, not 10/08, there was the first kill of a jet by another jet. An F-80 Shooting Star patrol engaged three MiG-15s and veteran First Lieutenant Semyon Fyodorovich Khominich spotted 10 F-80F aircraft. Khomonich turned left, leaving the sun behind in combat formation. As a result of their attack, an F-80 was shot down. He opened fire at 800 meters, and stopped firing at less than 200 meters. Coming out of his attack, the lieutenant struggled to gain altitude. Major Bordun with the rest of the team attacked four F-80s that were trying to attack Khominich. The Americans went to the others without success, and finally abandoned the fight..." "...The Russian-built fighter was flown by five Air Force pilots. The F-86A-5 Saber underperformed when compared to the MIG-15. However, the superior training and tactics of the US pilots established a "kill ratio" better than 8:1 over MIG. [ kill-ratio also fixed: 1.3 to 1 ] (Photo: National Archives and Records Administration) *www.aviation-history.com/mikoyan/mig15.html*

[@stealthhumor]

The Americans got to wear pressure suits, permitting pilots to withstand higher Gs. The 50 BMG ammo was API (Armor Piercing Incendiary), allowing the pilot to reach 1000 yards at high altitudes ≈ 40,000 feet. The Migs weren’t too sturdy, and often as not, the API rounds would light them up. The 37mm cannon could take out a plane with a single shot, but its trajectory looked like a punkin’ ball. The American pilots were more experienced and just better trained. I recall the flag at Nellis AFB (Red Flag - the Air Force version of Top Gun) flew at half-mast a lot more often than you would hope. Oops, I’m thinking 1962; I don’t know what was going on in ’52, but the story is too cool to leave out.

[@geraldrembert2461]

I would love to see them resurrect this plane. I feel like there is a place for it in our arsenal.

[@babysaver98]

Ha ha! Excellent education in a few minutes, thanks brother from Wenatchee! See you soon!

[@Krzemieniewski1]

Wing fins on MiG reasoning sounds BS but I may be wrong

[@MrFarnanonical]

3:15 why are you whispering? did you sneak in there or something?

[@mencken8]

All these “Which plane was superior?” videos bypass the most important variable: the pilot. The race to out-develop the other side in weapons tends to produce equipment that is roughly equivalent, making the experience and skill of the pilot crucial.

[@caelestigladii]

The issue was actually addressed in the video. Between skilled pilots, the score between the two planes was almost even.

[@MistaWeeGee]

RR Engine Nene is pronounced "Neen" RR Jet engines were named after rivers, other examples that spring to mind are the Avon, Dart (Turboprop), Derwent and Trent

[@johna.4334]

I'll never forgive the Brits for giving the RR jet engine technology to the commies.

[@MistaWeeGee]

@@johna.4334 A particularly short sighted and unbelievably stupid move by RR for short term gain. As I recall the government of the day initially blocked the export then relented. That said the Russians would have got it anyway one way or another, once a technology exists it's inevitable that the other side will access it by hook or by crook.

[@MrDino1953]

I’ll never forgive his American mispronunciation. 😅

[@robertpatrick3350]

@@johna.4334nope….. selling to the Soviets for commercial use was at best naive and certainly stupid…… anyhow the Soviets effectively stole the design at that point…… never paid the licensing and then shamelessly sold the tech to 3rd parties…. Still of the US hadn’t unforgivable mistake and suddenly pulled the plug of Britain after the war and left them in a series of financial crises then they probably wouldn’t have made such an unforgivable mistake…..

[@Ghost0fPakistan]

F86: Made to counter mig15. Pakistanis: Yeet Hunters and gnats with them