My Final Verdict: Old VS New Pickups - Ry Cooder Tone

[@jamesrapp9778]

Cheers for the video mate 😎 👌

[@TheGuitarShow]

Pleasure James

[@SouthpawSatch]

I saw your Coodercaster video with Henry Kaiser. Have you tried the Lollar Chicago Steel pickup? I noticed Henry had one on his Coodercaster it's a lap steel pickup but lacks the the metal cover. I wondered what tour thoughts are on it. The few demoes I've heard it has more of that vintage grit compared to the Mojo version.

[@TheGuitarShow]

Lollar is a good friend of Henrys and I think they are both working on something together as I speak

[@niklasstadler8329]

Hey How do you find 50s Valco pickups? have the feeling its rare to find one.. Have a great day

[@pstreetblues]

I just bought a set of Gibson Patent Number pickups for my 58 reissue. They are from around 1975. They definitely sound better to my ears than the after market pickups I've bought. The neck pickup has that clarity that I was always chasing and couldn't get from the after market pickups.

[@TheGuitarShow]

couldnt agree more - the older ones always seem to sound better.

[@Stlie1]

Ramon, do you know which cone shaped slide Ry Cooder uses? I see it in his Orleans with Lindley 'Mainline' video + Prodigal Son?

[@BeesWaxMinder]

Showing my ignorance here but there’s no real reason for the bridge pick up to enclose the strings is there? I mean, the top plate, with the two sets of three offset holes in it, isn’t part of a magnetic field… Or is it?

[@TheGuitarShow]

good point - As far as I am aware the whole thing is the pickup. I hope someone here can answer that question with some physics. Maybe it was also practical consideration for the lap steel player - to rest their hand.

[@BeesWaxMinder]

@@TheGuitarShow your description of a magnet on only one side (the other side being a wooden spacer the size of the other magnet) would imply that removing the Top Plate IS possible AND it looks like you’ve removed two of the four screws from the top already so would it be that disastrous to just remove the other two; take off the plate and give it a strum and see if there’s a change in tone, volume or operation? if no problems then if all seems fine, you could try using the MOJO as a second pick up (who knows maybe the MOJO would sound more authentic without that plate with those six holes?) doubling the bridge mounted original 🤞

[@joshcheyenne]

@@TheGuitarShow Hi Ramon, i've enjoyed your Coodercaster videos over the years, thanks for sharing your experiments. I'm a big fan of these pickups and have used them for years as well, both vintage and repro. I'm not a physicist, but my own understanding of the physics for your above commentor, is that the steel top-plate is integral to the design magnetically as well as physically. The top-plate being ferromagnetic, gets magnetised by the two magnets it's mounted down onto. In doing so, the shape of the magnetic field, if you could see it with your eyes from side-on, is modified in its geometry/shape/intensity, compared to if the top-plate weren't there. The whole assembly is magnetically charged and integral to the sound and response, in other words. In particular, the field gets spread over the top of the strings, as well as underneath, which is rare in the pickup world. When i've had people ask myself over the years, i've found a useful way of describing it is to think of the strings passing through a 3-D magnetic field aperture, akin to an MRI machine, just rectangular in shape. Jason Lollar says for his replica design, that this modified field shape reduces the string-pull on the strings, and contributes to more sustain. This makes complete sense to me at least, if you think of how the strings might well be slightly attracted upwards towards the top-plate, as well as attracted downwards to the charged polepieces. (As opposed to a regular P90, humbucker or Tele pickup, where the magnetic field comes solely from below and projects upwards into free space, and thus the only magnetic attraction the strings have, is to be pulled downwards.) Anybody who has played these Supro/Valco pickups can feel the difference in the sustain aspect, and their unique attack & decay volume envelope, so I believe that to be true. To me they feel as if a subtle compressor is always on, in a very fun way. The really early Fender Boxcar and Rickenbacker steel pickups, obviously have some similarities to the Supro/Valco as well, and they're similarly quirky and semi-rare. My own takeaway with these things after years of interest is, when an old design works, it works for a reason, ie: "everything, affects everything". From alnico alloys, to sizes of baseplates, wire gauge on coils, physical dimensions, thicknesses, all of it has an effect with pickups. The tradeoff of adapting your mind and hands to that big top plate there, is the killer sound. One last thought I always keep in mind is, even if they could make this pickup without a top-plate, and otherwise be identical in sound and response (which I believe is likely physically impossible), even Ry Cooder himself would not have sounded exactly the same then. Because he adapted his style to accomodate picking around the big plate there too, just like anyone would have to. So just that alone is another part of the sound, because you are forced to pick in areas that maybe you didn't used to. Hope that's not too much info, and makes sense for your commentor above! That's my best understanding of how this design functions, from a non-scientist. Cheers

[@BeesWaxMinder]

I know it sounds crazy but seeing as you’ve got the MOJO pick up anyway, why don’t you consider putting it in a neck position or something else not just in the bridge? With two of them in a guitar it might produce an interesting sound (especially out of phase or at least parallel?)

[@TheGuitarShow]

A great idea although it would be a real struggle to strum the guitar without hitting that pickup.

[@BeesWaxMinder]

@@TheGuitarShow I guess so (so it definitely needs that plate with the six holes in it over top, yes?)

[@cockysonuvaB]

@@BeesWaxMinder Go mind your own bees-wax

[@davidp158]

Is the top plate required on either bridge pickup? I like to mute string noise, and that plate would be a challenge.

[@TheGuitarShow]

There’s a gap between the pickup and the strings which allows you to get your palm in there to mute the strings

[@davidp158]

@@TheGuitarShow Thanks for the reply! I see the gap, but think I'd prefer to not have that top plate on the pickup. Is the top plate mandatory for the magnetic field?

[@limpindug]

Really enjoyed the show bud, I think the Tele is a lot closer to Cooder the tone. It would be great to hear once altered for string clearance. Wee problem is finding a returnable fix incase the tone doesn't work out. Good luck. 👍👍👍🥃Respect to you mate.

[@TheGuitarShow]

Pleasure bro, yes the Tele really has improved it's sound since I got this new pickup in there I'm really impressed. Thanks

[@andyd._______2619]

Goose! Can you recommend some of Ry Cooder’s cds fo someone who never listened to him? He has a huge discography and I can’t pick all of his masterpieces and I’m afraid to lose something special! Can you make a tutorial with some advise? Thank you 🙏🏻

[@TheGuitarShow]

Yes I can do that ...great idea ..his last but one album prodigal son is a good place to start

[@sixstringsofjoy9053]

I would be interested in detailed pictures of the original valco lap steel pickup if you would ?thanks!

[@TheGuitarShow]

I'll see what I can. If I can get inside the coils

[@francovani393]

Just demonstrates how any slight change can effect the tone and as all guitarists know our tones should sound like home Well detailed and explained thank you

[@TheGuitarShow]

Pleasure thanks for watching 🙏🎸

[@francovani393]

@@TheGuitarShow thank you those pickups the Valpros sound intriguing never even knew they existed till this show . Always a learning experience

[@TheGuitarShow]

@@francovani393 pleasure bro

[@rheinhardtgrafvonthiesenha8185]

Goose should somehow find a way into Bob’s 58 case and swap the pickguard over for one of his choice. Ya know whatever he feels would look best on a vintage burst, perhaps line green or metallic silver and just video Bob’s face. It could be like that surprise Jimmy Page got when one of his house guests re-painted the dragoncaster and painted over the pickups lol. Goose can sure as hell play but God damn does he have a bums eye for pickguards!

[@TheGuitarShow]

Thank bro, yes this pickup is somewhat eye catching lol thanks

[@greham]

Ever tried a Suprocaster from Gemini pickups?

[@TheGuitarShow]

@@greham thanks I'll check then out

[@camsmith2970]

What’s the verdict on the lollar lapsteel pickup?

[@TheGuitarShow]

For a replica I prefer the Lollar.

[@williampayne7678]

Nice Tellys.

[@TheGuitarShow]

Thanks William

[@mickplayfile]

God that was boring!

[@TheGuitarShow]

You obviously came here for the shipping news instead.