My John Mayer/SRV Hybrid Rig: Wet-Dry, Stereo, 4 Cable Method, Mono

[@VertexEffectsInc]

The Rig Doctor finally builds a rig for himself - a John Mayer/Stevie Ray Vaughan inspired pedalboard featuring the best of digital modeling, with the Line 6 HX Effects, and a combination of analog overdrive pedals, switched with the Morning Star ML-5 MIDI Programmable Loop Switcher. This rig has some major firepower in an 11" x 20" platform, and well under 20 lbs! SUBSCRIBE ➜ kzbin.info

[@XChristianNoirX]

Sweet, versatile rig! I'm just a little weary of the fx loop in the Line6... How transparent is it? I guess I could put the Morning Star before the the amp, the Line6 in the loop, and then the Line6 would control the Morning Star. It wouldn't be as versatile, but maybe could work. After thinking about this, I threw down a down-payment on the Neural DSP Quad Cortex.. Maybe it will dethrone my Kemper and AxeFx II. Hopefully they don't skimp in the converters.. I actually run the Kemper into the AxeFx via sodif because it sounds better that way to me. I barely use the Axe FX at all except for occasional delays and the conversion.. Or some weird routing. The Quad Cortex, if great , might get my whole digital setup onto a pedalboard though. To boot it would probably play nice with my real amp setup and could totally ditch a rack.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@XChristianNoirX it's not really an effects loop, as it is an insert. You don't need to make that distinction of amplifier fx loop versus in front of the amp. The HX can do that routing internally for you. If you want to do 4CM, I showed that routing diagram here. I did use buffers on the input, outputs, and the return going to the power amp with an ISO transformer. There is some loss without using high quality buffers independently of the HX effects, but also the Morning Star is true bypass so you want the buffers on the in and output of the system at least since that's a lot of cable to drive if everything is bypassed.

[@DToneQuest]

@@VertexEffectsInc early last year I got rid of my fractal ax8 and went amp (iridium for church gigs) and pedals primarily strymon single box style (compadre, riverside, volante, flint, ola and the source audio kingmaker fuzz). as much as i love the sound I miss the presets I could change quickly on the ax8. Would I be able to ditch the flint, ola pedals as they are not midi; and use the hx effects for those sounds while controlling the strymon pedals midi inside presets? If so what would i need and how would i know how to achieve that. Is this something you would do a consult on and help set up?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@DToneQuest You can use any non-midi pedals you wanted as long as you hooked them up to the Morning Star ML-5 or similar, another options if the Voodoo Lab Hex. Your HX Effects becomes not only an effects processor but also the footswitches to control the MIDI Programmable Looper. So you could keep the stuff you have now and loop them into a MIDI Loop Switcher and do exactly what I did.

[@DToneQuest]

@@VertexEffectsInc Thanks for reply, I was actually wondering since the pedals i was going to use were midi capable if i could use the hx effects to control them and make presets/scenes whatever utilizing my own pedals

[@itsanthonybest]

What a cool blend of modern and "vintage" style effect pedals. Awesome board!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks Anthony! Turned out great!

[@dvya-lq2yw]

Hi Mason, I have been looking into the HX Effects as of late and stumbled upon this video. I currently use 5 cable method when I run stereo. Setup is: Cables 1 &2: Guitar > front of amp effects > Mesa Mark IV. Cable 3: Mark IV Effects send into Boss CE-3 (Mono input) > CE3 left out into left In of next stereo modulation effect and so on.... Cable 4: Left output of last stereo effect out into Mark IV Effects return. Cable 5: Right output of last stereo modulation effect into Return of 2nd amp, a Mesa Satellite 60. This way the pre-amp of the Mark IV (I use all 3 channels) is driving the power amp of the Sat 60 through cable 5 and I get all of the Mark IV's native overdriven tones in both amps. I'd like to do the same using the HX Effects, however I only see talk of using either 4 cable method OR 7 cable method. With your knowledge of the signal routing capabilities of the HX Effects, could it be used in this manor? Appreciate all you are doing for the DIY community!

[@NJSonye]

This is so crazy! Congratulations Mason you “killed it!” I have visions of a smaller board built around the HX-STOMP and my current pedals swirling around in my head!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Hahahaha! Good luck! This was a fun build!

[@MrDavemiley]

I finally re-did my pedal board using tips from The Rig DR.'s DYI power cables. Though one of my fingers suffered a mis-hap with a soldering Iron , I replaced my power with an 1 SPOT Pro. Now it all sounds better and a couple of noise issues are gone. This guy knows his stuff and is so generous to share his knowledge !

[@VertexEffectsInc]

🙏🙏🙏 I’m so glad it helped

[@frankies.4500]

Using a midi loop switcher in an effects loop actually blew my mind! That was one thing that always bothered me about using drives in one loop, still having to manually activate each one. You're a genius man!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks for watching!!!!

[@RobertNolan]

Your builds get cleaner and cleaner every time. Amazing 👌

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thank you Robert!

[@Diax1324]

You should do a run-down of this board's tones! I want to hear how you have it set up.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Yea, there will be more!

[@WendellPereira_well]

Exactly! Great video, thanks!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

👍 Wendell Pereira

[@frankstabler1920]

Nice playing, Mason! Love the new rig. As usual your boards are works of art.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

🥰🥰🥰🥰 thank you

[@MurrayWilliams]

The show art for this episode is AMAZING ... Love it!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

🥰🥰🥰 all thanks to Mejia

[@MurrayWilliams]

@@VertexEffectsInc Mejia KILT it ... AND, the board sounds unbelievable.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@MurrayWilliams thanks Murray! It turned out great!

[@andyfenton1510]

Great video, I use the HX with analogue pedals, and also a Blug amp 1 . Very compact, complete solution , and I can’t speak highly enough about the line 6 for flexibility.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks for sharing!

[@drdre4397]

I have said it on at least 10 videos but you absolutely killed it with the SSS, so easy to get just an amazing sound, stacks amazing too! I spent several thousand on a new rig so it'll be a while before I buy anything to add on; however, the ultraphonix and HRM are tempting.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks so much! So glad you dig it!

[@lukeweiler1192]

Have to love the ARCHER IKON !!! Just got the ARCHER Clean coming in the mail. I’m wondering how they are going to stack. This is cool seeing how your mixing it up. I really dig this kinda under the hood lift up PB. Someday I wanna have a board like that.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Luke Weiler well be selling our Pedalboards in a few weeks

[@wilmer33086]

Omg!!!!! Amazingly awesome 👏. Bravo!!! 👏 Mason aka Rig Doctor. Love the sounds that are coming out of your new pedalboard. You’re just making my decision easier and easier on what pedals to buy from Vertex Effects (Steel String + Tone Secret) my top 2 as of now. Thanks again.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

🥳🥳🥳 so glad you dig them!!!! Let us know if we can help!

[@wilmer33086]

I’ll be going over with my sales engineer @ Sweetwater to get my hands on both of them. Thanks!!!!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@wilmer33086 AMAZING! They just got in a new shipment today! Enjoy! Thank you so much for the support!

[@federicotr149]

6:00 I guess L input can be also used for guitar, R input for amp fx return, L output straight in front and R output to amp fx send If you use just 2 gain pedals like Steel string and Ts to make a "core" sound in the s/r of Hx.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I'm using the input on the HX and an input (via the interface), Send/Return 1 for the Morning Star Looper, Send/Return 2 for the Amp input and Line in or FX Send. And the main output 1 and 2 for either mono or stereo out depending on what I want to do or Wet in mono or stereo.

[@topjimmy77]

Very cool, I’ve had the the HX Effects for about a year now and THIS is how I ultimately wish to use it, thanks for giving me something to aim for 👍🏻

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Glad you liked it! Let me know if I can help!

[@tmitz73]

Looks and sounds awesome Mason!!! Nice playing Bruddah!! Thanks for all the great content!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Glad you enjoy it!

[@aarondarcy8551]

Sounds awesome Mason. What a pedal board!!!!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

🥳🥳🥳🥳

[@RegieJrClaro]

This is it! My dream rig!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks for watching!

[@TheTaulusPaulus]

This is what I've been researching to do (different drive pedals though😉). I really appreciate this post, and guidance.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Glad it was helpful! Hope we earned your sub!

[@michael_caz_nyc]

Sounds great Mason. Nice & compact. Super flexible. I love the Fix pedal risers. you could have used a little Tone-brush action. Good luck with your new pedalboard.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

When I was drilling those risers, I had just given away my last tone brush, now I have a replenished stock

[@esmeecirolozano7618]

Idk why I havent Subscribed and I've been watching ur videos..the good thing u mentioned it in the beginning..and awesome intro 😅👍

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks for the sub!

[@Burst006]

Little gain stacking question! When using a « pure » OD, like a timmy or RC booster (gain at 0, flat eq and volume past unity gain), as a solo boost after your other OD, it seems to me that it colors the sound quite a bit, even for transparent ODs. The first OD in the chain seems to lose of its character. Am I crazy? Why a timmy seems transparent when used alone with no gain (doesn’t change the sound of your amp) but not when pushed by another OD. The more I write this, the more I think I’m just crazy👍🏻, but I’m pretty sure my guv’nor loose its vibe when I step on my Timmy.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

If your boost is truly neutral - the RC is not, has a huge color character, an example of a true clean boost that is colorless is our Vertex Boost, The Creation Audio Lab MK 4.23. Then, putting it after an OD will only add volume (more output), where putting it before will saturate the pedal more (more distortion), and not change the output too much. The clarity is not a one size fits all, and is dependent on the pedal and how hard the input can be clipped or the headroom that it has. The other thing you may be hearing is you like the roll of on how badly a line driver your overdrive pedal is, as most are terrible at driving capactive loads on the output and will roll off a lot of frequencies. The Boost may have a lower output Z making it have a larger shift in EQ with longer lines.

[@bwitt4673]

Awesome Job Mason. Keep up the Good Work. Your a real asset to the Music Business. Hopefully one day I could maybe get you yo do a board for me as I am not Tech Savy all. Your understanding of how all these Crazy Wires work together with Pedals is Amazing to me. God Bless....

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Billy! Thanks for watching! I hope we earned your subscription!

[@MNGuitars]

This is so great! Never realized u could use midi with hx for the Morningstar! I have a similar rig with the hx fx, instead of midi I put my 5 analog drives in a one control switcher n wire that to the fx loop on the hx, I get my analog drives, fuzz n compressor n can use the hx for effects n create different "boards" for different projects/bands, its great

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Glad you like it! Hope we earned your sub!

[@MNGuitars]

@@VertexEffectsInc already subbed😎

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Mike Nappi 🥳🥳🥳

[@anthonyjacob6252]

Great vid Mason ! It would be really cool to make a video that shows how you organize all these effects into your midi switcher for playing ergonomy and different sounds that you can get with it . But I always love your channel !

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I’m not sure what you mean, can you clarify

[@anthonyjacob6252]

Ye sorry :D just to show how your organize your hx effects with all your sounds (presets, IA, etc.)

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@anthonyjacob6252 other than detailing the signal path?

[@anthonyjacob6252]

@@VertexEffectsInc yes, exactly ! Juste a proposal :)

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@anthonyjacob6252 cool! Thanks for the suggestion!

[@4602experience]

that morning star/line 6 combination is very cool, very swiss army knife solution for enhanced flexibility. Most importantly great sounding pedalboard and sweet licks! As a side note, I'm from Toronto and got to play on the El Mo stage SRV played on before they tore it down. Thanks for the vids...theyre awesome!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

So glad you dig it! Thanks for watching! That's pretty epic, El Mo!!!!

[@4602experience]

@@VertexEffectsInc from your wet/dry/wet rig video when I brought up the EVH connection.......kzbin.info/www/bejne/fX_GpIqEl7yIepI

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@4602experience can you clarify what this is response to? I write hundreds of comments every week, I'm sorry...

[@4602experience]

@@VertexEffectsInc lol totally I'm sorry man....just following up with a quick blurb we had about a still pic in the intro of your W/D/W video.....I mentioned I thought EVH was an early forerunner pf W/D/W and you correctly referred me to said pic.....then I came across this video today and thought of that exchange of how much EVH has innovated

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@4602experience yes, most people moved to having the dry cab on stage by the later part of the 1980's. Ed didn't event this, but was one of the more well known users that Robert Bradshaw did this treatment for, and then later on for Ed, Dave Friedman.

[@t75ftw]

Hi Mason, thanks for your content :) I am a big fan of yours as well as TPS. In one of their recent videos, they have mentioned you, and that they would have no problem having you on the show despite the occasional differences between your's and Dan's building methods. I think, this would be the greatest idea in the whole wide youtube world for you three to meet. Hope you are well these days and hope this will happen one day! :) Be well

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Hi there! Yes, I saw that, someone sent me a little snippet of a live stream last week that they did detailing this. Admittedly, I've made some comments and some videos that weren't particularly charitable to some of the concepts they speak of and some of the products and materials they use for building pedalboards. Nevertheless, I think they are a net positive for the industry and KZbin, and although I have some fundamental disagreements with some of their interpretations and practices, I appreciate and respect their show and what they've built. As far as being on the show, I think it could be valuable to the audience from a pedalboard best practices standpoint, and showing some different methodologies to build pedalboards that don't only include TheGigRig power supplies, switchers, bypass loopers, etc. However, I don't think that TPS has much to gain by having me on. Presumably they'd be giving me a larger platform where I would stand to gain more than they would, and not sure that I could reciprocate the value they'd impart to me as their guest. Nevertheless, I reiterate that giving their guests an alternative way to build pedalboards, different materials, etc. that will get you a great result, I think it could be cool. Perhaps I build a rig for Daniel or Mick in my format, and they build me on in their format and we talk about our workflow, best practices, strategies, etc. I think that's good content all around - not so much right or wrong, just - "here are two ways of doing it".

[@RobertNolan]

@@VertexEffectsInc I'd watch that.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@RobertNolan perhaps you can encourage them in the next live stream and see if we can't make this happen ;)

[@RobertNolan]

@@VertexEffectsInc definitely! And by the way, you definitely offer plenty to them and their crowd. The beautiful thing is that you both have personal preference and approaches to various things, that's kind of what drives (pun intended? I don't even know anymore...) the show, in my opinion.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I am willing, but I suspect it’s going to be the voice of viewers like you that will encourage them to make that more likely, rather than me.

[@JimsMusicJourney]

This is so cool. You were so right when said I was going to like this last week. Can I share this video on my Facebook group Helix How To Helix? It’s an educational group about helix.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Jim Coleman please do! Thanks for watching

[@thedonrizzguitar]

Sounds amazing brotha! 🔥

[@VertexEffectsInc]

So glad you dig it! Hope we earned your subscription!

[@felinekaiju4517]

Thaaaaaaank you Mason!. I've finally found my solution!. The HX Effects is perfect for what I need as I'm designing around my analog Fuzz pedals. Now I just need to wait to pay off my Peavey Invective so I can plan board size around the Midi amp switch too!.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Glad I could help!

[@felinekaiju4517]

@@VertexEffectsInc Is that a Rory Gallagher strat?.

[@GeoffreyNoblitt]

I see you have two of your Ultraphonix pedals. Are they different or the same pedal just set to different settings? Also, what effects are you using on the HX Effects? Is it modulation, delays, reverbs only? Any drives, compressors, EQs? Thanks, love all your videos. Super helpful.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Completely different pedals, different circuits, different sound. One is based on the class 6L6 Dumble ODS (the one most of us know). We voiced this alongside several original Dumble amplifiers. And then, recently, we had access to an EL34 version with the HRM mods (Hot Rodded Marshall) which has a totally different vice, more of a high gain Marshall voicing, so we released another version the was made to sound like this uber rare Dumble ODS. You can see a good comparison here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nZvclpeMgdyFo7c

[@VertexEffectsInc]

All of the analog distortion and overdrive is coming from the pedals, the HX is doing all the other stuff.

[@JamesAGuitar]

Nice build and sounds great!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks James!

[@AP-ui7oi]

I'm gonna check out those blues jams in Crockett when the world gets back in order. Maybe I'll see you there. Nice rig bro.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Nice! They're cool, another good one is Monday nights at the Harbor in Sausalito, CA - Marin County right before the Golden Gate Bridge

[@AP-ui7oi]

Vertex Effects Cool, I live in Santa Rosa, gig the bars here in Marin and Sonoma County. My girl lives in Martinez, I’m close to Crockett all the time. ✌️

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Aaron Prince nice! There’s also a Gentleman Jim’s in Vallejo California

[@WTC_2U]

Great concept. I am going to try to do something similar. One difference - I hope to put midi controllable stereo effects (Timeline, Ventris, TerraForm) "outside" of the HX Effects, using 4 cable method (Send/Rtn 1)(Send goes to a mono chorus that outputs stereo). Will use the HX Effects for the mono basics - EQ, compressor, maybe Tremolo, possibly clean boost - and of course MIDI switching to control additional drive/gain pedals before the pre-amp (Send/Rtn 2 to a Morningstar or equivalent), with stereo effects after the pre-amp. Only thing I am worried about is any latency when switching between presets, where, each preset will be changing Program and maybe CC values to one or more stereo effect. In some cases, I would like to do this MID SONG - so latency/pops/clicks would be undesireable. But if it works....what a rig! One WISH - that MIDI was assignable at the Snapshots level. As you know, MIDI is only supported on the Preset level. sigh. Thanks for the inspiration!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks for watching! Sounds like you got quite a rig going!

[@corwintompson9152]

Great tutorial! Thanks very much! I'm seriously considering simplifying my rig and pursuing a more compact board- very much like the one you have created here. In your video you mention that any number of possible routing combinations exists. Would it be possible to run a WET DRY WET rig- in which the DRY is an actual amplifier (Friedman JJ Jr) feeding a physical guitar cabinet- and the Stereo WET uses the Preamp of the JJ Jr but instead of a physical cabinet, utilizes the IR inside the Line 6 HX FX unit? That way I'd just need the one amp/cab live and run the WET FX through the PA. Cheers.

[@CraigRMerriman]

Great setup!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

🙏🙏🙏 thanks Craig

[@IndyDead]

💡! “🥇🐔🍽” That was the one that brought it all together! 😎🎸🎶👍

[@VertexEffectsInc]

🥳🥳🥳

[@jamescosgrove6680]

Hey it'd be cool to see how this could work using one amp and having the wet cabs replaced with a stereo cab sim pedal. Not sure how exactly it would work, but could be cool to get something close to this with only one amp to carry around.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

You could return these line level signals to a powered monitor or mixer or far from the line 6

[@Josbornevonosborne]

You should give it away...…..to me....jk. that's like my dream rig basically. Unfortunately I am a single dad who had to sell most of my gear, so nowadays I am always looking for affordable alternatives to good pedals. I appreciated the video you did that showed you getting sounds at 3 different costs. If you could continue to keep us guys who don't have much money in mind I will continue to hit that thumbs up.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thank you so much, always happy to help!!!

[@lynyrddeville]

Hey Mason, so happy to see you build a rig featuring an HX Effects . I bought one figuring I would replace my pedals but I just couldn't walk away from my handpicked selection of colourful boxes and decided to integrate everything into a wet /dry/wet behemoth .And I will be wanting to route some things from the HX Effects to the front of amps as well as out to the stereo wet portion of my rig. I don't quite get how the inputs and outputs go on the HX Effects unit. I,m hopeful that I can pick up some tips from this episode or a future one.Cool man, you are a veritable treasure trove of information.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks for watching! Definitely watch the signal routing part. I show where all the cables need to be for every routing option.

[@danieljanman3595]

How did you power the Hx effects unit??

[@josephfelice601]

Sounds GREAT!!! POLARITY?. In an earlier Vertex video you mentioned that some pedals w/ different polarity do not get along. I am wondering if this is my problem. In a large gain based pedal chain (no time based). Everything is set at unity gain prior to stacking. No matter what combinations I try I reach volume drop issues that are not mitigated w/o additional noise from extreme boosting. I keep all fuzzes in front and seem to get problems when add in pedals like the Timmy and others. Some pedals are TB and some are buffered. Is there a way of testing pedal polarity, and do you think this might be the problem? Thanks

[@VertexEffectsInc]

If it’s just a single amplifier this won’t be something that’s problematic, and probably indicative another problem on the rig

[@mellowmonsoon278]

Bro, great stuff and subscribed. Can you do a video on building a rack based rig using pedals? Stuff like selecting rack 2U 4U etc, what trays to buy. drawers? ... what cables.... and the process of putting things together...with amp or with amp pedal.... etc etc There are a lot of home studio guitarists who do not gig, but wanna have a tweakable desk height rig while playing and recording. And not everyone can afford rack units of effects. Cheers in advance....

[@VertexEffectsInc]

working on my rack now - doesn't have pedals in it, but the concept is very similar to any switcher based rig in terms of cabling on the drawers.

[@AitorBerdiel]

Awesome video!!! I'm triying to make something similar to your rig, to cover mono/stereo/WD and W/D/W. But I've a couple of questions: You 're using differents loops to separate the morning star(gain pedals) and the amp imput to to add hx delays in front, is it?? Why do you use different blocks for send 1 return 1 and send 2 return 2 instead use the fx loop1 for gain pedals and fx loop2 for the amp?, What's de difference between using it in that way in this case?? Thanks a lot!! Congrats for your job!!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

All the pedals in the Morning Star in are front. The HX is wired for pre/post so I can have effects in front or W/D or in the Loop depending on how I do the internal routing in the HX Effects. Doing it this way allows me to insert effects between the preamp and power amp of the amplifier I'm using or use a line out of the dry amp to feed the wet effects.

[@AitorBerdiel]

@@VertexEffectsInc Aha!! I will try it to do like this, thanks a lot for the answer

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Sure thing

[@ihellspawn]

I want to see this build with the new tc electronic multi effects pedal

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I'm not sure if it can be the footswitches to command other MIDI Controlled Loopers like the ML-5 that I used here. Maybe it can?

[@marcellofloris9223]

Hi Mason, fantastic board, awesome. How about the morning star looper switcher? Is a high quality switcher like, CAE, Voodoo Lab, Gig Rig, etc?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Depends on what you mean by "high quality". Are you talking in terms of the build, the tech, the features, popularity, the price point? All the brands you mentioned vary depending on how you're defining that.

[@marcellofloris9223]

@@VertexEffectsInc Thank for your answer Mason! I mean only about the audio quality, the transparence. For example, in a older pedalboard I used a MusicomLab but don't like the sound of it and sold it, now my board are without a looper and sound awesome. I have also your Vertex Landau Chorus, my first choice in the studio and live sessions.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@marcellofloris9223 how are you evaluating audio quality? The only real way to do it with a switcher is to put the same cables with the same length through every I/O and every S/R and A/B it with your comparison switcher. Many times, issues are with the user making cables inconsistently, solderless cables, pedals with issues in and of themselves - and blame the switcher. I've done the cable test with 3 ft. of cable in every loop with a 10ft cable in and 20ft. cables out and A/B almost every major market switcher out there. I can tell you that Musicom is among the best. Equally RJM is right there with it if neutral is the goal. Morning Star is very simple. The design is good, but does need buffers on the input and output because it's completely true bypass and the power is only for the switching part of it and relays.

[@srcottle3212]

Great Video Mason. Would this work with the HX stomp? Splitting the stereo effects loop?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

You mean stereo effects loops?

[@martinfeske8510]

Great setup and sound👍🏻! I intend to use the HX effects by itself in 4 cable method. I know that the cable from the guitar to the amp/ effect is crucial. But how about the other 3. What would you recommend, low capacitance cables I.e. or regular once…. Thanks!!!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

They're less critical but ideally they're low capacitance. Our Mogami output cables are a good choice: www.sweetwater.com/vertex-effects-output-cables/series

[@martinfeske8510]

Thanks!!!

[@LuisHernandez-dy1rq]

Uncle mason Sounds fantastic! Why the Gold Archer and not the Silver ?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

It's the one I have.

[@Tino5150VH]

Looks fantastic, Mason. Is the HX attached with Dual lock as well as the other pedals? Thanks for sharing your knowledge, great work. Wish you a lot of success!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Yes it is. Thanks for watching

[@Tino5150VH]

Did you remove the rubber feet?

[@jettramel]

Nice, reminds me this Todd Rundgren song, Yer Fast, (I like it, I like it, I like it) Can the Helix give you a tube amp sound? You've mixed old school analog with midi & modeling, a breath of fresh air. The Steel Stringer sounds pretty damn good, I've had all the other overdrives but having them all together is sweet. To get the Dumble sound, the holy grail, like to have a 5 or 10 watt version for just recording.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

James, cool! Love Todd! You can get amps tones from it, yes, but there are other version that are optimized for IRs and amp simulation. Glad you dig the Steel String !

[@jettramel]

@@VertexEffectsInc Can they match a tube amp, every sim or IR I see is about metal, not my thing, I'm like you, just want a good sounding tube amp & some color like our fav pedals, T8, Tube Screamer, Klon, Big Muff etc...... a dumble pedal is a must have.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@jettramel no sim will match a tube amp exactly, but some of the load and IR boxes can replicate speakers very well. I think when you can use a real tube amp it's a plus, but if you're used to hearing your cab mic'd in protools something like the Suhr Reactive load IR or similar are great at this. I also like the Fryette power load.

[@nilsboberg2137]

Would you say that 1000mA is enough to power the HX Effects? The standard HX adapter provides up to 3A, so I’m worried that using only two 500mA outputs will hurt the pedal. What do you think?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I've not had an issue with this supply using 1000 mA by paralleling two 9V 500 mA outputs. It won't damage the pedal if it's underpowered it just might not work properly.

[@tonygamez8895]

Ok, I think that you just have lot fun doing your job, congratulations and thanks for teaching us all those skills building pedal boards. This ML5 looks the same as the RJM mini effects gizmo. Question: Does the Ml5 have the same programming and routing capabilities as the RJM?? Because this one is cheaper than the other.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

It's not the same, but it does similar things, just as the Effects Gizmo resembled a CAE 4x4. You can only route the pedals in the order their wired in, it's also passive (power only for relays), with no switching matrix to change the order. Another option would be the Voodoo Lab Hex.

[@andywesthead]

Vertex Effects This is something I’ve been trying to understand. Does the Morningstar (or any of the midi audio loops you’ve just mentioned) have a switching matrix that allows you to reorder the loops? I know the Boss ES products do but I don’t need/want the switches and just want to use a midi controller. Thank you in advance. And cool vid 👍

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@andywesthead The Hex and Morning Star ML-5 do not allow for switching in a re-ordering pattern. The only one I know of is from Sound Sculpture - the SWITCHBLADE 8F: www.soundsculpture.com/switchblade8f

[@DavidHernandez-ug7mm]

That Toneee!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks for watching David!

[@tobaccorich]

Nice angle on the intro. The steel string pedal. And the ultra Phoenix ??? Are they anything to do with Jesse Davey ?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks! I'll be using that angle more often now that I got it figured out ;). Steel String = Steel String Singer (the Dumble amplifier used by John Mayer and SRV that we voiced this pedal against), and Ultraphonix = Dumble's name for modded amps he did (this pedal is based however on the Overdrive Special Dumble amplifiers - we voiced this pedal against several originals in our possession). The look and names are all made to resemble the aesthetic of their respective Dumble amplifiers. As to Jesse Davey - I'm pretty certain that both of my pedals, and for sure the Steel String, pre-dated the Duelist that uses the same style knobs (again, both of us borrowed that from the classic Dumble amps). Furthermore, I believe the Duelist is only using the look of a Dumble, but is in fact his take on a Bluesbreaker and Tube Screamer in one box, where as ours is actually going for a sonic replica of the Dumble amps respectively. All great pedals, but fundamentally different things at their core.

[@tobaccorich]

Vertex Effects heheh. I do apologise. Obviously you have your own company I was having a beer or two when I wrote that I ll check out your stuff. Cheeeers.

[@strappingyoungmike]

Awesome board. The MIDI arrangement is an amazing idea!! Was wondering though, in your exact arrangement (with the morning star), would it be possible to use one loop instead of two to control both amp AND external pedals, assuming that the external pedals should always go directly into the preamp section or immediately after it? Asking mostly because the new HX Stomp XL, which I considered buying has only a single loop. My assumption is that you could, by hooking up the amp into one of the morning star’s loops instead of directly into the HX Effects, and making sure that that loop is on in all of your Morning Star presets?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I am only using one loop for pedals. The second loop is used as my amp output and line in from the dry amplifier.

[@karldieter423]

I really like your videos uncle Mason. I always get the feel of spending tons of money and trying to redo my board (although I'm playing all kemper the last years :)). Good job and thank you for sharing your knowledge! Nice board. I got a question. In some other videos you talk about the importance of a buffer. Is the buffer on this board missing or did I overhear something? Cheers from Germany

[@robert6907]

I bought a SuperPhonix mk2, few days back. And a Steel String, I received today. Awesome. I noticed you put the SS after the SuperPhonix. Why? Should not high gain go after low gain?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I think higher gain closer to the guitar, lower gain to amp. See our signal path video to explain why.

[@achill3usoverclocking874]

I think its only about preference. When I was creating my lead tone I tried to place SS before/after of a klon style od and I prefer it closer to the guitar (amp - klon - SS - guitar). I guess everyone should experiment with his own gear and not take these things as golden rule.

[@JohnyMad1988]

Awesome video. My HX Effects demands apparently 3 amps! how did you supply it with that power source!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I'm using a Truetone CS-7 with outputs 6 and 7 in parallel for 1A at 9VDC.

[@NothingHereButMe]

Got my ML5 today. It’s ridiculously easy to program

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Yes, simple out of the box, the trick was getting it to talk with the HX effects, but hopefully that was clear in the video ;). Enjoy!

[@grapyfernandezguitar]

Did you guys are able to send PC and CC from the HX effects to the ML5?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@grapyfernandezguitar you can, I only need to send CC messages for the instant access switches the way I'm using it.

[@grapyfernandezguitar]

Vertex Effects I have mine setup with Instant PC via snapshots I was wondering if you where assigning the CC to a switch.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@grapyfernandezguitar Yes, if you watch the entire video I show how I do this so I can switch to instant access or "direct access" on the fly if I want to get out of using presets.

[@oldtimer99]

Rig Doctor awesome work. Newbie question, where in the chain and how you use the TS10 and Archer Ikon?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I like using Klon style into TS Style, but that' me.

[@oldtimer99]

@@VertexEffectsInc Me too. The Steel String at the end?

[@Sillystan]

Will you be making a guide on how your made that USB hub?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I'm just buying a D style plug from Neutrik and punching that out of the enclosure. I think it's a 7/8" hole. I'm not making the cable custom, rather I'm bundling the excess inside the enclosure.

[@Sillystan]

@@VertexEffectsInc you the man thanks

[@javporin]

Rig Doctor - quick question: what do you think of the Nobles OD-1? It can replace which type of overdrive/boost?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

They're cool, I have one from the early 90's. It's sorta like a Tube Screamer type effect but more transparent and more bass response, less overall mids.

[@UnluckyMinority]

Thanks for the very helpful video, just got myself the hx effects and I'm planning to get a ML5! I just wanted to ask you if making a preset on the line 6 with each switch assigned to each individual external overdrive (through the ML5) will allow me to combine the pedals on the go, like I would normally do if using the sounds within the line 6. For example, would it be possible to turn on the steel string and than the ultra phonix on top of it or would I have to make a preset with just the steel string and another one with the two pedals engaged? I hope my question is clear, thank you for the always amazing content! Greetings from Italy!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

You can use the cc messages to then pedals on and off with one Footswitch

[@UnluckyMinority]

@@VertexEffectsInc thanks a lot for the answer!!

[@savoirfaire8979]

This looks like a lot of work. Also, the Strymon reverb trend seems to be dissipating. I just got a Blue Sky for cheap, but it’s looking like I am five years late to the party. Lastly, people don’t seem to be embarrassed by Line6 gear these days. There was a time when AxeFx and Kemper dominated the “pro” circuit....

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks for watching!

[@DoctorMcFarlandStudios]

HX is a huge step up from the M Series pedals and it sounds amazing with new update a few times a year. There is no reason any guitarist shouldn't have one in their arsenal.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Doctor McFarland Studios 🥰🥰🥰

[@jgl2222]

Great stuff!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks for watching!

[@paulcowart3174]

Do you sell custom cable length builds ? Thanks Great board man

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I do not, but I have some tutorials on how to build your own

[@christianpaulyao4300]

great toneeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thank you so much!!! Thank you for watching!

[@ClarkLamontBeedie]

Hey dude, great video 'n' greetings from Scotland; sorry if I'm being dumb but I'm looking at getting one of these; am I right in thinking if I wanted to run a stereo amp rig with a send/return to the fx loop of one of the amps, the routing is as simple as left/right out to each amp then patch the fx loop to one of the send/return...which would leave one spare send/return to give me a loop for my analouge stuff? Have you found any issues with routing like this? I'm basically trying to achieve a stereo wet/dry rig with the option to run some "taste" verb/delay etc to the dry amp's fx loop while sending my analouge pedals to the "dry" amp only (I'm still not sold on digital gain/boost emulations haha). Thanks for your help brother 🤘

[@89190alexis]

Hi doctor, love the concept and was planning on doing the same kind of stuff. But i have a question : is it possible to control the ml5 using snapshots? I mean if i switch from snap shot solo (built in hx reverb+delay+EQ and jhs angry charlie from ml5) to snap shot clean (a different built in reverb + eqd plumes from ml5), will do all the changes with one tap button? Thanks keep going on!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Yes, but you have to have the entire ML-5 as one loop and then turn on/off pedals via MIDI.

[@rorymcclellan3740]

Rory Gallagher strat!?!? You should do a Rory Gallagher rig!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Treble Booster, AC30

[@renatonyc]

I commented on that on top post... those Strats are very special!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@renatonyc They're great guitars. Got to play several of them at the same time and landed on this one. All were good, this one was amazing.

[@jettramel]

@@VertexEffectsInc ala Brian May, which treble booster would you say Rory used?

[@jettramel]

Can't believe it took me 40 years to discover Rory Gallagher, my homies have been slipping.

[@homerdomer73]

HX owner myself why do you opt for Send/Returns as individual blocks vs the FX loop block?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

The signal doesn’t always return to the effects loop, sometimes it’s only being used as a send or alternative amp input. Doing it this way allows you to do the mono, stereo, and wet dry wet all with the same connections on the line 6.

[@snapascrew]

How much of a bummer was it when you went to get your strat relic’d and instead of it looking relic’d it looks like a really nice wood finish with a random patch of nice paint on the top horn? (Is that what that’s called, horn?).

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Came like that, Rory Gallagher Strat

[@dzines65]

@@VertexEffectsInc Some people's kids huh?

[@snapascrew]

AnthonyG ________ right?!

[@jessejohnson8210]

Where is the buffer in this signal chain? Is it pre or post ML5 in the effects loop of the HX Effects?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Input buffer, stereo output buffer, buffer on the return

[@jcarh]

@@VertexEffectsInc huh? Are you saying the HX has a built in buffer in and out?

[@javiercisternasnajle]

@@jcarh I also need to know this

[@coachcleats13]

Let the haters hate Mason, fuck 'em you doing a great job!!!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Thanks for watching Coach!!!

[@MrUsrg]

Why don't you bring us to tour your factory?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Good idea!

[@prc90272]

Hi Mason - thanks for all of your videos and posts. I’ve learned a lot from the Dr. I’ve heard that the inputs on the HX are buffered; do you happen to know their specs? Trying to figure out if I still need a buffer in front of it.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

I think they're 1M and 500K, input is fine, output is so-so.

[@prc90272]

@@VertexEffectsInc thanks, mason!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@prc90272 sure thing!

[@LoKi6922]

Great video! Any thoughts on the switching speed of the ML5? There seems to be a delay when activating a loop. Thanks!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

You can adjust the speed of the bypass based on how much “pop” you can tolerate on the switch over between pedals. It’s in the manual.

[@kolbyatkins2588]

ive been looking at buying the sp 400s and soldering my own patch cables, and read that the sp 400s are compatible with cables with a diameter of 4mm, but the 2319 cable that you use is 5mm. how vital is buying the right cable with the right plugs? also, what straight plugs are you using? thanks for the great content!!!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

2319 will fit you could also use 2314 alternatively

[@paulrose9046]

Howdy Mason! Planning on running an HX effects rig like this. Have you experienced any ground hum when using two amps directly from the HX outputs? It's been a concern of mine and I've been looking into isolation solutions like the Radial products & the Humdinger. Curious to know your take.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

The outputs don't have any isolation and this is why I used the Suhr box with the Isolated Output to combat against this. You could get something like a Lehle P Split and put it on top of one of your amps, totally passive, and it will provide you a ground lift, polarity control, and galvanic isolation.

[@paulrose9046]

@@VertexEffectsInc Thanks so much!! Probably gonna go with the Suhr unit. Love the compact size & will most definitely be able to fit it.

[@phillipsouthard8285]

I want to buy this board 🤯

[@VertexEffectsInc]

haha

[@carlosm3895]

Good stuff, Mason! Were you running the loops through the Morningstar just for more control options, or was it also a concern to you that the HX effects might compromise the tones from your analog drives? I've heard things about tone color/loss in the FX loops onboard the HX effects, some notice significant effects on amp tone as well - even when bypassed. Although it seems to work out more than fine for your setup. Thanks i hope that makes sense

[@Jackwoolley]

Awesome. Can the hx effects bring in more than one pedal at a time with the ml5 to stack sounds?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

As many as you want.

[@Jackwoolley]

@@VertexEffectsInc brilliant, thank you.

[@GaryIshee]

Great build! How are you powering the HX Effects?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Current doubler cable using two hi current outputs on the supply.

[@malasmusic]

Hello Doctor, I've just discovering this video and it's very useful for what I want to do. You solved my entire problems with one video. My best ever channel is yours!!! I was wondering where I can find the kind of flatboard? It appears in comments from OMG but I didn't see it. Any clues? Kind and thanks for sharing your knowledge.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

These are our Vertex pedalboards, I think this was a Travel Plus.

[@malasmusic]

@@VertexEffectsInc thx for helping !! ;)

[@djhinormas959]

hey Mason is there a reason why u would use 2 blocks in the hx with a [SEND] then a [RETURN] instead of just using the one block with the [Fx/Loop1] or 2 depend what one u were using?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

It would be no way to accomplish the wet dry wet nature in less we use the second set of inputs and outputs of the second effects loop

[@djhinormas959]

@@VertexEffectsInc oh so the 2 blocks was just ur fx/loop1 and fx/loop2 i thort it one block was a send and one was a return, im having trouble with my od-200 in my fx/loop of my hx it feels and sound .. not great, so was mabey thinking u were using the blocks a diffrent way cos u ran into same thing with drive pedals in the loop,

[@JoshKotlar]

How did you connect your HX Effects to your 1spot power supply? Did you use a VoodooLab current doubler & 2.5mm to 2.1mm cable adapter?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

If you use the Truetone power supply you don't need a current doubler so long as you don't exceed the total current in the supply. I made the power cables custom, you can see how to make your own current or voltage doubler on our DIY Power Cables video.

Ok. I have a real long and complicated question (lol). I can't think of anybody more qualified to answer this. I really hope and wish you could answer, Mason! Thanks in advance. I'm looking to buy both a Line 6 HX Effects and Boss MS-3. Here's my thinking of why: I'm looking to get rid of some pedals and I'm looking to have a very versatile board. I tend to plug either straight into the front of the amp or with a 4 cable method. That said, I made a Junction box (very similar to the one you use here) which allows me to either to the front of an amp or with 4 cable method by just pluggin to a different output in my junction box. I usually have "two paths" of effects. One plugging to the front of the amp (drives, comp, filter, synth) and the other plugging to the FX send and return of the amp. If I'm not using an amp with an fx loop, I'll use both "paths" as just "one path" (pedals in series. Like a "normal" pedalboard. One pedal after the other.) I love this flexibility because if I can't use my amp and have to use somebody elses amp I don't have to unplug stuff... I was traying to figure out a way to be able to have a setup where I can change the order of the loops. I know both units are capable of doing so... I want to know if this is possible: If I use the Boss MS-3 as a multiFx and pedal switcher for my "front of amp" pedals and the Line 6 HX effects as a multiFx and pedal switcher for my "FX loop pedals"....would it be possible to use 1 "loop output" of the HX effects to plug as an "external" pedal INTO the Boss MS-3? and use 1 "loop output" of the Boss MS-3 to plug INTO the HX effects as an "external" pedal in the HX effects? Why do I need to do this? Because I'd love to be able to plug 2 external drives to the boss ms-3 so I can change the order of the loops in any way. For example, If I plug both my external drives to Boss' Loop 1 and Loop 2 and connect the HX effects to Loop 3, I'd love to have the ability to put my drives first or after the HX fx as well as other effects inside the Boss MS-3, and I'd like to do the same inside the HX effects...I don't know if I explained myself clearly or this makes sense hahah My routing would be GTR into Junction Box, Junction box "to front pedals" output connecting to Boss MS-3, Output of Boss to Junction Box "from front pedals" and then from junction box to amp's front input. Then Amps Send to Junction box and from junction box "To loop pedals" and connect to HX effects input, the output of the HX effects to the junction box "from loop pedals" and from the junction box to the Amps Return. Thank you very much for your time and help, Mason!!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Why not just do it all with the HX Effects and a MIDI looper of some kind. You can do all the effects inside the HX and have MIDI control with something like the Voodoo Lab Hex. The MS-3 isn't bringing anything to the table.

@@VertexEffectsInc The thing is that with the looper like the morningstar I can't change the order of the pedals in it. I mean I understand I may ask too much haha but I'd love to have that flexibility. I woulnd't be able to place an effect from the HX Effects between some loops from the morningstar Looper switcher or change the order of the pedals inside the morningstar. Thank you very much for your help, you truly are my "family doctor" haha THANKS!!!

[@Dankflamio]

What kind of reverb/delay is that? It sounds really good!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Plate reverb (wet/dry/wet) and spring reverb (in front of amp), and the tape echo (wet/dry/wet)

[@ForsellOfficial]

I'm thinking of doing something like this as well! One question I have is: Can I run one of the HXFX loops into my amp's effect loop and use HXFX's own reverbs/delays so they don't distort (as they are right now when I run them in front of the amp with amp distortion)?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

You can, they have diagrams for a 4CM that's in the manual of the Line 6 HX Effects.

[@ForsellOfficial]

@@VertexEffectsInc Thanks mate!

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@ForsellOfficial sure thing!

[@prestobeen]

This is exactly the kind of thing I want to do. I have the helix floor but i would like to create a hybrid board with hx effects and real pedals. However, Midi intimidates me and Im not sure that after I do all that it takes to create the board that it would just end up being something that I can replicate near perfectly with my helix. I don't know what to do.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Shouldn't be too bad, be sure to lean on us with questions.

[@prestobeen]

@@VertexEffectsInc thanks for the response!! I’m on a KZbin binge at the moment to see what I need and what I don’t. Lol

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@prestobeen Sounds good!

[@TheChrisHarper]

I’m new to stereo rig set ups, but do you pan them hard left and right or do you keep them centered? Hopefully that makes sense.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Depends on who's mixing. In many of these pedals you can adjust that if you don't want them both down the center.

[@justindarden5998]

Watching your video at .25 percent speed is hillarious

[@VertexEffectsInc]

As God intended

[@qortnglap3]

I love your tone!! Can I know the order of the suhr buffer? Is it the front of the pedal board?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

There are four buffers on this board, everything else is set to true bypass or in the True Bypass Looper in the Morning Star ML5. Input buffer (1), Output buffer left (2), Output buffer right with ISO transformer (3), FX Return or To Power Amp Input [Suhr Buffer] (4). The Suhr is there because I couldn't fit another iso transformer in my interface box with the other Vertex buffers I made for this rig. However the Suhr is a good buffer for the output if you going to use a commercially available buffer.

[@qortnglap3]

@@VertexEffectsInc THX! Thank you for always being a big help!

[@TristanHurd]

Does the Morningstar ML5 allow you to switch the order of its effects loops? For example, can it be programmed to run Input > Loop C > Loop E > Loop A > Out? Or can it only program on/off combinations in Input > ABCDE > Out, order?

[@thesphericalguy9018]

Loop order is fixed.

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Tristan, no. Only in order.

[@JC-xy3lm]

Uncle mason please do a step by step DIY pedal board (for starters) 🙌

[@VertexEffectsInc]

We have several like that, check our catalog of videos

[@ryanwhite5482]

Did you use an input buffer or does the HX serve as your input buffer since it's first in the chain?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

My interface has an input and two output buffers and I have a fourth buffer with a transformer that I couldn’t fit in the enclosure under the Ultraphonix by Suhr.

[@the_travelers_band]

Wow. That sounds amazing! Do you remember which pedals were on during your play through the board?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Should be on the screen when those examples get a few seconds in.

[@the_travelers_band]

@@VertexEffectsInc Ah, thank you. I missed that haha

[@VertexEffectsInc]

🥰🥰🥰

[@VertexEffectsInc]

@@the_travelers_band all good, enjoy!

[@rhysplaysguitar2106]

very cool! What case are using for this rig?

[@VertexEffectsInc]

Pelican Air Case