My Thoughts on the Eagle Dynamics - Razbam Dispute

[@MorganMarauder]

No matter who is at fault the customers are hurt. Every single person who paid for the module. Just left hanging in the wind. Neither side cares about the customer- that is clear.

[@nero995]

Nick Grey clearly doesn't with the bashing claim to RAZBAM, naming the CEO by name, and saying he made false claims, but at the very least, RAZBAM does, the CEO expressed that they were actively seeking a solution to whatever issue was disputed, and would do their due diligence to finish their modules once this is resolved, be very careful with what you hear around because it's a complicated issue, and you might know that the inner workings of companies aren't public either, so the real problem at hand is really not 100% clear.

[@__Whisper__]

@nero995 i agree, but i dont think its fair to see ED in general doesn’t care about its customers, theyve been trying to make products more available to more customers who may not be able to afford $70-$80 modules and terrains, for example, the reason for the afghanistan map financing thing is for that reason, and Matt Wagner in an interview about it said that if anything, ED will make less profit by offering sections of the map for $30, rather than “forcing” customers to pay the whole $70 for it (at full release price)

[@MorganMarauder]

@@__Whisper__ ED is selling a module that as of now has no ongoing support. That is not customer focused at all

[@nero995]

@@__Whisper__ I agree but this applies in this scenario and as a by product of this whole ordeal, but not in general, furthermore I think it’s more of an issue with the administration like Ron Zambrano has expressed multiple times, perhaps greed?, or financing issues?

[@iou0]

They don't have to care. Flight simmers are a desperate bunch.

[@xcc2a874]

its always sad to see a small community like this have drama

[@guitargamery777]

ED isnt small anymore, ED is a monster and surely is worth billions

[@__Whisper__]

@guitargamery777 ed isnt that big, its still a relatively small company i think, but ofc bigger than it was, i would be shocked if it were worth billions

[@hbladeh]

Speaking from experience, I've had no problems with Razbam. The modules I've bought from them were fine and very much playable at the time it came out (I don't have the F-15E, and I'm not really planning on purchasing it, so I can't comment on that). ED on the other hand I have quite a strong opinion about. For example the F/A-18C spent 6 YEARS in early access... as a Hornet virtual squadron member I can tell that at least a third of this period it was competitively unplayable because of the lock drops and such issues... The other thing is the T.1A Hawk. VEAO went bankrupt, that's clear, but the crappy contract that made the problematic situation possible was created by ED, because it did not enforce VEAO to hand over the source code. I've purchased it in DCS digital store, so I would assume you take responsibility for that with a refund, which they never did. Supercarrier is also missing some features that they promised, so I think it's fair to say ED took their fair share in not delivering to the community, and then I have not spoken about the misery of OpenBeta in the past etc etc... If the allegations of ED is true that Razbam did not reach out to them to solve this issue, just posted that out to everyone, that's a di*k move, but make no mistake, ED is no saint, and they will f**k anyone over if there is a penny in it for them...

[@__Whisper__]

I’ve had no problems with either company, other than some buggy modules at release, which is to be expected, because they are early access, but none of them were game breaking and prevented me from playing and having fun w them. And I don’t think it’s completely fair to say they haven’t delivered on their promises just because the things they said were coming are still in development and havent been released yet. Development takes a lot of time and basically all modules run into unexpected problems that delay them, which is why they almost never give concrete release dates, but rather a general window of release. Other than the Hawk, I don’t know of a time that a dev has ever not delivered eventually on a module that they were developing

[@GoopGoop66]

They better offer refunds to those who bought razbam products if things do go bad

[@__Whisper__]

I think they r

[@RealTojo090]

Right now they only offer refunds for the Strike Eagle. I attempted to refund the harrier earlier today and they said they only refund the SE.

[@__Whisper__]

@RealTojo090 but isnt the harrier pretty much a complete module, so u arent missing out on any features that were supposed to be added. The strike eagle is nowhere near done, which is y they are offering refunds bc ppl arent getting everything they paid for

[@RealTojo090]

@@__Whisper__ while that is true, the harrier can very quickly acquire bugs. This, unfortunately, has happened to the mirage recently which is a pretty much 100% complete module.

[@__Whisper__]

@RealTojo090 true. Hopefully they will come to a resolution soon

[@AIRWARFAREGROUP]

Everyone has no idea what happened and what's going on. Regardless of what happens in the future everybody has to live with it. Good luck all. Lifetime fair sometimes…

[@__Whisper__]

yep, it is what it is

[@bennguyen1313]

It's interesting how you hear so much about the big game studios, and their massive budgets for titles (ex. Red Dead Redemption2 500 Million, GTA 6 1 billion, etc).. which makes you wonder about DCS/Eagle. I know it Eagle is a private company, but would love to know a general ballpark of how many developers, how often are new releases published, what is the cost to make a new release, etc. And how does the technology (game engine, programming language, etc) compare to other studios?

[@rwhunt99]

I agree, don't take sides, and as pointed out this is not a unique situation, just let it settle and all will be well. What is frustrating, is - things are going slow enough, and when they add delays into the mix, it's the customers that suffer as well.

[@JimboVR.]

Bro I miss dcs so bad. Vr still not working

[@__Whisper__]

There was an update today that fixed it i think

[@JimboVR.]

@@__Whisper__ U LYIN. FORREALS??

[@__Whisper__]

@JimboVR. Check the changelog

[@JimboVR.]

@__Whisper__ bro let's hop inda wip later

[@gamerspitt8089]

so to sum up, in this video you basicly told us you dont know anything, and just wasted almost 10 minutes of our time saying in diferent ways that you dont know anything, great job mate

[@__Whisper__]

Thanks for the watch time

[@descentmvm]

yea just was going to say that... wtf was the point of uploading this dude said nothing

[@gamerspitt8089]

@@descentmvm they do it for clicks, good content is hard to come by

[@__Whisper__]

@gamerspitt8089 oh no! The person who has been doing youtube for like a year isnt making very high quality content yet! Relax bro, i wasnt doing it for views, but i will concede that it wasnt a very good video

[@simisg2121]

ED has shown very shady behavior many times over, I’ve been playing dcs for over 10 years, and was part of a team that was developing a mod for dcs. I didn’t do any of the work but I was heavily involved with the team. So I wouldn’t be surprised.

[@__Whisper__]

I would hope that with this becoming more public, that they would change their ways for the better in the future

[@simisg2121]

@@__Whisper__ I’d hope so too, but when that happened, they just suppressed any opposition wherever they could and made obvious points that hurt the team, which they couldn’t respond to because of NDA. It was pretty malicious the way it went down, sadly. Let’s hope this isn’t the situation.

[@__Whisper__]

@simisg2121 according to razbam, smth similar happened w heatblur, and evidently it has worked out for them, so i can only hope it works out this time too, but tbh i dont expect ed to change any negative behavior unless it ends up hurting them

[@simisg2121]

@@__Whisper__ me too, I really don’t want those modules to become irrelevant or removed from the game, and worse case this snowball where other devs are experienceing something shady and a mutiny. That would be very very bad.

[@__Whisper__]

@simisg2121 i hope not too, but I don’t really expect smth like that to happen, because it would hurt literally everyone involved in all parties, and all of their customers

[@ruger2275]

Something better happen fast because both parties are about to get hit with a class action lawsuit. I've already hired a firm out of my pocket.

[@larrythorn4715]

My biggest regret about DCS is spending money on it.

[@johnwicks4936]

Another month, no further info or reason to believe this is getting resolved. I requested a refund/credit.

[@vadimZ2849]

How many umm are you going to use? Ummm Ummm

[@__Whisper__]

Im ummm trying to ummmmm work on that and ummm stop saying umm so much

[@RedTail1-1]

Now I see what that guy was talking about when he said it was hard to listen to me say umm so much.

[@__Whisper__]

Ik lmao im working on it, i notice it too when i watch the recordings back, it annoys me too

[@specialneedsmolester1957]

@@__Whisper__just learn to be comfortable with silence 👌

[@Hellfire0220]

EDs favorite Reddit :DCSExposed called this out months ago and there you can find the complete unbiased story without someone saying "I dont remember all of it" while giving their opinion of it. with actual proof of everything. Jist of it is, ED stopped paying months ago and basically said 'If you dont like it, sue us.' knowing full well that they cant afford to financially and therefore as Razbam started seeking employment elsewhere they posted to the Community. The one thing (Despite '9Line' and 'Mike') best efforts cant control and censor. After that post suddenly ED wanted to talk instead of play Communist HardBall.

[@mikeserds2333]

So you didnt mention anything about WHY they stopped paying them. Biased report. And that´s the whole issue with these statements. I dont doubt they werent getting paid. BUT WHY? There could be plenty of valid reasons to do so or not. Who knows, but unless there is also evidence against any wrongdoing from razbam ill not take sides so easily. If this report is so unbiased why dont you give us the gist of why they stopped paying them too? Apparently you had enough energy to type out the razbam not getting paid. Either you are a troll, or have no idea what BIASED means. Having evidence doesnt deny any bias. An unbiased report is about providing facts and evidence from all sides to get a picture of the whole situation. Evidence stops lies, but you can still tell a story of truths creating bias by not mentioning half of the truth that would put yourself in a bad position.

[@nero995]

summed it up real well

[@mikeserds2333]

@@nero995 how is it unbiased if there is no view from the other side

[@blanchbacker]

What’s the reason ED would stop paying Razbam? That is a pretty incomplete story. The F15E sold very well so it doesn’t make much sense for ED to antagonize them in such an illegal way.

[@__Whisper__]

@blanchbacker i have no idea why, that info isnt public as far as i am aware, ED only said it was bc Razbam violated their contract or smth

[@ericlyrode8724]

Currently, ED discord server is under heavy control Razbam discord server keeps accusing ED The majority rumors are against ED Fair enough since some community managers have to calm the guys, while some has the freedom to express their views. As a result, the entire case is currently Razbam-biased and Pro-Razbam, since only one side of the crowd can shout.😅

[@__Whisper__]

Yes lol they have made up their minds about who is to blame and who is blameless based on one side of the story only. There are only a few people on both sides that really know everything that’s going on. All we as the customers can do is be patient and hope that it gets resolved soon

[@WarDaddyUSA]

there is always 2 sides to every story.

[@__Whisper__]

Ofc

[@SLR762]

Uhm. Uh

[@joejoe2658]

sheesh, write a basic script.

[@__Whisper__]

A good idea. I’m working on the script now for my next tutorial video