Narcissistic Abuse Recovery: First Separate, Individuate

Also watch "Deprogram the Narcissist in Your Mind" • Deprogram the Narcissi... These 2 videos are an introduction to my forthcoming dialog with Richard Grannon.
Dissociation (pay heed: do not use the wrong word disassociation!) and objectification are at the core of separation-individuation around the ages of 18-24 months.
Prior to the separation phase, the child is in a symbiotic state. He regards his mother as a part of himself. To separate from her, he needs to cut off this part and objectify it (render it an external object). He also develops transient grandiosity to be able to take on the world, all by its little self.
Narcissism is a failure of separation-individuation owing to a lack of boundaries between the child and his mother.
So, when the narcissist comes across a mother substitute (an “intimate partner”), he tries to recreate the ancient dynamic by forcing her to merge with him (absorbing her in order to eliminate her object status, her individuality).
He aggressively and grandiosely converts his partner into a self-object or an object representation thus eliminating her ability to separate from him - at least in his mind. He violates all her boundaries to negate her agentic autonomy.
I coined the phrase “narcissistic abuse” to describe this inexorable process.
Find and Buy MOST of my BOOKS and eBOOKS in my Amazon Store: www.amazon.com/stores/page/60...

[@user-gu1yf3vx5v]

My mother pushed me not to go seek my dreams. Instead I stayed behind and lost many opportunities bc my mother didn’t want to be alone

[@etechconnect48]

Sam, I first watched you with Richard. I am receiving a lot of help from your video's. Painful but healing. 71 year old man peeling another layer off the onion of self àctualization. I have "hated" this project but now that I am seeing clarity I am fascinated with the learning about my self avoidance of responsibility for my life. I feel I am becoming an adult for the first time in a long time. Thank you for your work. I needed this.

[@lynnglass575]

Me too I totally understand how you feel I am 60 had a narcissist mother then continued with narcissist relationship. Didn’t even know that I was enabling this toxic dance as I was brainwashed as a child so the pattern continued. Only now breaking free and looking after myself.hope you are still doing well.

[@alexam6959]

OMG! So proud of you. The narc in my life is close to your age and nothing wakes him up… because they are perfect… 🤪 to be hable to do this kind of work in yourself is never easy, but I image that it must be more difficult the latter you do it, because trauma grows on you… hope you can feel better everyday. And please know that you are enaugh, because we are all special in our own way, and we deserve to be respected, we deserve that others don’t disrespect our human dignity, our space, our mental health. Always be kind, and sometimes, to be kind to the narc, you have to be true and stand away. Has Kendrick said, Keep the family away, they are not like us 😬

[@soniayegikyan8143]

My ex husband said very calmly "i didnt succeed on destroying you, but i am going to do far worse ".

[@tatrofamily1757]

Holy cow.

[@bentnotbroken4192]

@@Grrrrrrr123I’m so sorry for your loss… I pray you’re healing from the trauma you experienced w that demon

[@bentnotbroken4192]

@@Grrrrrrr123I’m so sorry for your loss… I pray you’re healing from the trauma you experienced w that demon

[@bentnotbroken4192]

When I was so low, my stbx would often tell me to off myself, that the children and my family were better off without me… they’re so sick! He also tried to off me SubhanAllah here I stand!

[@chiliart8056]

My mother told when will you brake!I told never .Ex told where are your wing's now ?!.It's basic for all horror movie's ...those people .

[@M.A.492]

Love the ACID metaphor, such a precise way of expressing how the sense of self is dissolved and the mind taken over. Finding a formula to reverse this process would be like succeeding at alchemy.

[@somnium5603]

In my relationship with my ex the thing that triggered leaving for me was I had one last piece of me left I want to play music on the piano and hopefully play with other people. The day I played piano and he had a problem with it, I had to stop playing. I started crying to him, saying this is MY dream I can just as well commit suicide if I have to give this up aswell(I already gave up myself, but not this part was fighting) he became rude towards me and just said maybe it's not going to work then. I realized then and there that if I give this last part up of me I will be completely dead. Since then I didn't communicate with him, a few days later I said I am going to leave, and it's not a threat, I am basically out already. He didn't take me seriously or respected me. He suddenly cared about my dreams and what I wanted, but I held on to the part that if he really wanted me to live out my dreams and be me for once, he would have done so since the beginning, not when I'm half out the door. 4 weeks later my sister came to get me and my stuff. If it wasn'rlt for the last part of me hanging on to my dream and him acting in that way I would have stayed longer through more physical, financial, emotional abuse. It's insane to stay in spite of yourself and suffer so much and lose yourself completely to someone who just uses and abuses you. It happens because we or rather I had no self-respect left I had no boundaries. Now life is shitty, but you know I feel so much more free and not as anxious at all. The ex just has to leave me alone in my head. I know he/it is there because I'm being attacked in my dreams. It's like a demon in my head. I'm done with this nonsense. All of us need to do the things, wear the things, listen, watch, eat, be friends with people and everything we were not allowed to do. Take your life back! Not when, now! You are strong, just look at what you went through. Find yourself. Start on a new page if you have to. Just do not give in ever again. You are not a victim anymore as soon as you step out of that door.

[@tanjanikolic2199]

I love when you smile ... you have a Divine particle because the good you do to people is priceless.😊❤🙏

[@nohopeinromania]

I want to send you a bottle of brandy! After I've seen the Vaknin-Grannon video last night where you have explained how to stop the voice I feel much better today after 4 months since break up. It is not easy to stop the voice but I am doing it and I'm getting back to myself. I feel a great pressure in my head and fear but I am doing it. I think you are a genius! I've done one year therapy and so many things to heal and nobody gave me this solution. I dont have enough words of gratitude Great Sam Vaknin!

[@anewchapter1336]

Thank you for this and the deprogram the narcissist video. I watched both twice and am looking forward to the dialogue between you and Richard next week. I have found this information on separation individuation to be extremely applicable and valuable!

[@rhondabrynko8393]

Long awaited indeed. Thank you, and looking forward to it.

[@jasmine8872]

Your knowledge never ceases to amaze me professor. Thank you for sharing your insight for those who look to learn more. Your way of explaining is keen to those looking to learn.

[@southernbawselady7092]

The BEST channel on KZbin! 💪 Thank you so much for the knowledge, wisdom and insight! 🙏💜

[@DoTheMath4]

Please keep posting! I am going through the discard for the second time (truthfully more) but second since divorcing and returning to a narcissist after 20 years of marriage and three children. Your videos are my lifeline. I have been through these phases over and over for 20 years.

[@libertywalker680]

Professor Sam, your videos have helped very much. Looking forward to your new presentation with Richard on separation and individualization.

[@ScarlettTantrika]

Wow this explains so much about narcissism and what I have witnessed with them wanting to recreate the bonded parent

[@Michelle-uz2ch]

Thank you, Prof. Vaknin, for your education and guidance.

[@annelyndorff8381]

Thank you so much professor Vaknin 🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@SummerSweetIlknur]

Once again, Vaknin has outdone himself. Thank you Professor! You are truly changing my life.

[@estefania_jess]

Thanks Sam! Great video

[@va_aakanksha]

Looking forward to this conversation next week

[@lenamaitland1195]

If I knew how bad life would be, I would never of had a child with a narcissist. He has kept me away from my son and done everything in his power, using his money to defame me and create fake evidence. My conclusion is that he doesn't want my son to have a mum so he can control him and be just as screwed up as him with his mummy issues.

[@MrsSimLuva]

I have a 6w.o I need to do separation individuation

[@twinpeetzmoolsaasa854]

Thank you again for the video. My understanding through your work has been that breaching a person's personal boundaries is a big part of narcissistic abuse. That is also where i see what you mean by it being on a societal level an unhealthy organizing principle.

[@karinteeples6517]

You make me laugh all the time! Your dry humor hiding your disgust with human stupidity is very obvious to me! Thankyou Sam for 💯 truth regarding the Narcs mind and how they tick. We can continue to reject what you say or we can accept how they operate and make adjustments to our lives. To accept truth, means change is nonnegotiable and that terrifies most of us, but if we continue to lie about the reality of this, we stay stuck and that’s where we are comfortable but miserable. Thanks for enduring our denial at times and not quitting on sharing the truth of these disorders. You’ve changed my life!🙌🏻

[@mollyryle7625]

All of that, yes. I agree.

[@betsybobenhouse180]

This is both helpful and painful. Makes such sense considering my experience.

[@pg5629]

Sir Thank you so much for the valuable information.I remember my grandmother used to tell me to leave my mother for her who is her daughter.My grandmotheris a potent narcisst

[@AnnaMay77]

This is soooooo helpful, thank you…🙏🙏🙏

[@openyoureyes...]

Thank you so much Sam. 🙏🏻

[@mayparsels2232]

Once I was done grieving myself your videos appeared

[@michelevanlimburgh-lu9wc]

Erev Shel Shoshanim! Abandonment of the mother towards her child leaving nothing but an elusive search, a vindictive search for maternal love.

[@lenamaitland1195]

I thought love bombing was normal, I liked being admired so I had a baby with the psycho very quickly. Withing a few months the Madness had begun. I'm a fool, now ten years later,, 3rd Court case, I am so sorry to my children.

[@BookmarkthisLPR]

Lots of women are in these situations. Too many romantic movies made us gullible!

[@lenamaitland1195]

@@BookmarkthisLPR yes, the Prince turns back into the beast an the beast eats everyone. The End

[@BookmarkthisLPR]

@@lenamaitland1195 funny!

[@kaylaschroeder1]

Sam could have been speaking directly to me. My experience has been mirrored so exactly by the descriptions and explanations Sam provides, it's incredibly spooky. I'm reeling. Thank you so much for this work, Professor! I am so, so grateful for this information, validation and advice.

[@enricio]

Professor Vaknin, all the large language you use in the first five minutes of the video are easy to understand. Before I knew my wife was a grandiose narcist these words intuitively came to my mind. I'm not a professor. I've been working with people in challenging situations for a number of decades. Your language is very clear though. 🤔

[@deylynn6280]

Thank you!!!

[@takasza88]

Thank you...Thank you so much.

[@BlinglishXiaoying]

eye-opening analysis

[@Birdieblogger]

Two down! Off to Prague. Thank you so much. So appreciated.

[@juliesheard2122]

My husband's mother was anorexic. He was always making out I was too fat ( size 14 uk) and I became bullimic. He wanted me to do the cleaning on Saturdays like his mother did etc. He's dead now but my relationships with my children are weird. I would like to hear Prof discuss the issue of the children of narc marriage and how they might behave to the surviving partner please.

[@ThePupidarko]

Bravo!

[@delwarchowdhury505]

Haha, love your sense of humour Sam!!! :)

[@talilindenbaum281]

I understand the ten letter words, they’re all compliments! I speak Hebrew :) thanks for the profound and yet clear explanation!

[@vildanb8038]

Sam you are amazing

[@krileban]

amazing!

[@jessibear8611]

I just love your humor! 😅 Ty

[@dustinM613]

Check mate ..... you Inspire me to think of getting help .. thank you

[@angeliquedemeijere5980]

yes Thank you shushanim! I always have difficulties with spelling dissociation 🤣

[@katiescarbrough3252]

My ex who I left 3 weeks ago told me everyday I am just like his mother everyday, it crazy cause he talks to her everyday, a couple times a day like he did me in the beginning. He even took me to meet her near the end so that she could teach me some stuff?!? Some days he talks good about her other days it was bad since she abandoned him with his narcissistic dad who beat him and played with his head (his words), not realizing he became his father and is now using the court system to torture me, he had the judge eating out of his hands all while I had every piece of evidence, the judge would not look at. Now we have a restraining order and in terrified he will lie and say I'm breaking it so he can get me arrested again, he had them arrest me for misdamenior stalking?!? All due to me leaving and exposing him to my family and close friends because I needed help.

[@rebeccaj7164]

I keep doubting whether the ex is a narc. I can't take him off my mind and that for me suggests he is. You don't feel this maddened after a normal break-up. He was definitely not the one hence I don't feel it's a case of being sad to have lost 'the one.' I'm going to list a few reasons why I think he is a narc: - within 6 days of the relationship he suggested me marrying him, having his children and moving to his native country. - he gave me constant attention all day, texts all days. Constantly cuddling me and kissing me. - a sense of not being able to fully trust him. A sense he was lying at times. - admitted he does manipulate but says 'everyone manipulates' - was obsessed with money etc. - when we broke up (my initiation) he quickly tried to make me pay for it, it was just a general feeling, like he loathed me (we lived together in a house share and so I still lived with him for about 4 months after we broke up). I know he is a narcissist... I mean it is just so plain obvious. I just feel perpetually confused, and I am still thinking about him so much in a way that makes me think he did this individuation thing.

[@rebeccaj7164]

The acid analogy is relatable. I felt like one with him. I feel like he is in my mind. This is awful.

[@Hidden2u]

I know this is years later but this is the part I struggle with as well. Is he really a narcissist?

[@rebeccaj7164]

@melkaye1224 I understand you. The confusion is the worst. The way I've come to terms with this is by making a comparison. If i ask the following - have you been with a partner you know you can trust before? I know people have complex histories but ultimately you can tell when someone has a trustworthy character and when they don't. It's not about you or their feelings for you but about them and whether they have certain qualities. A great and honest guy might not love someone but because of their character traits they can be trusted to be honest and break it off. Equally a narc can 'love' you (have very strong feelings) and not be cheating for a time but they are still a narc. When you can't be sure you can trust someone, then you can't trust them. That area of doubt/confusion that lasts years could indicate a narc. It also helps to think that narcs are on a spectrum so aspects of them may be more integrated than others. You've got people with strong narcissistic traits and then you have Ted Bundy. You don't want to be with either. You may come across a narc who is slightly more integrated but it doesn't mean they are fundamentally worth being with. It takes time and don't beat yourself up for the process. It's took me so long to come to terms with the fact that he is a narcissist but I got there. It's not even about love or anger or any emotion but about the fact the brain is confused so can't move on until it has clarified it so it can package it away. It's easier said than done but for a long time I compared my journey to that of others and that didn't help. Confusion is a kicker but you will get free 🙏

[@Hidden2u]

@@rebeccaj7164 I very much appreciate this response. For the last 7 weeks, I’ve immersed myself in narcissism research because like you-I need to make sense of the last 1.5 years (only 8 months of actual dating) in order to move on. There are so many clear actions where the answer is “yes” (e.g., attempting to triangulate me with the new supply and when I refused to chase/compete, he “hoovered” relentlessly only to then say “oh I just said those things to be playful” when I rejected the attempts or baiting me into a 3.5 hr circular conversation with no resolution, but was filled with every manipulation tactic known to man…first time I was consciously aware of being gaslit). Other times, I’m doubtful because I recall a moment from the relationship when he/things were “normal” then I go into “maybe I was [insert the things he said about me as to why he left]”. It’s all mentally and emotionally exhausting, but I’m going to continue on this healing journey and hopefully join you on the survivor/thriver side of this community. 💛

[@Serpentdipitus3620]

Im a woman in her 20s who had a narcissist mother all my life, what do I do? Am I just a narcissist too now? I don't want to live like this.

[@KatiaBeeden]

Got it Prof!

[@LillianStead]

What happens when the child is physically separated from his mother, from age 14 months to age 22 months? For instance, if the mother spent 8 months of her next pregnancy in hospital as a way of preventing another miscarriage or pre-term birth. How does this affect the normal process of individuation?

[@kristynbramble2657]

This makes me think of the one verse in the bible where they say two become one, and the bride groom, Nonsense. It's interesting though how many religious practices are similar to what your describing here. Thank you for making your videos.

[@mollyryle7625]

Amazing intro! Hilarious. :)

[@berta.ribeiro]

Prof. this process os individualization is related to the brain development, right? What is happening in the brain development "domain" in this process?

[@tazd228]

Question: How do you honestly know what your strengths (S) and weaknesses (W) are after being with a narcissist? In previous recordings about self-love, you mentioned it is important to be honest with yourself about them. I'm in a sticky situation where I haven't been in contact with the narcissist for years and through being honest with myself, I have realised I am not very verbally articulate. Is that something that is an intrinsic weakness or is it because I have been playing the victim card and perpetuating the shit show that is his theatre production? How on earth can you decipher from what your true S and Ws are? How do you distinguish his voice from yours? Am I not very verbally articulate as a personality trait or is it a result of listening to his directions in my head? Is it a self-observation or a continuation of victimhood? Thank you very much for these recordings Professor Vaknin.

[@CM-yo9jk]

You will never have the answer to this question - where does one thing start and one thing end? which came first? You can test and measure with yourself, do 'experiments' on yourself to see what makes sense to you. The answer will also change over the course of your life in any case. You may be 'socially awkward' if a you have Cptsd.

[@sherilynne106]

When will this forthcoming video with Richard Grannon be out? I have watched the two videos and need to see the next one with Richard Grannon.

[@nohopeinromania]

Thank you ! Great Sam Vaknin! Please explain. The narcissist is doing on purpose the mental talking with the intention to hurt us? or is like we feel his state of mind?

[@MrAlarine]

What if your narcissist is your mother? What happens if you didn't realize this and moved back in with her? Well...I'm now aware of this. but wow! These lectures have literally opened my eyes to my whole life being a construct of the abuse I suffered as a child and subsequently the regression i've been going through over the past 5 years living with her again...I feel deeply sad looking back at how I've noticed my behavior towards certain people and relationships I've had that reflect "idiosyncrasies?"(might not be the right word here) I shared with her. :( I'm so glad I hated myself for being a certain way and not knowing why, I wouldn't be here realizing my whole life was a lie. I'm so sorry for the people I've hurt along the way and so greatful that i've had people who saw beyond that for the person i didnt know i was capable of being.

[@sophiemorin7126]

I have appreciated the videos about entraining and the process by which the mind of the partner is kicked out and replaced by the narcissist's. Could this imply that in the context of psychodynamic sessions, as long as the separation isn't achieved, no transference would occur since "there is no longer anybody there", so the therapist might even, after a few months of rather boring sessions, despite no test were performed at any time, end up saying he thinks the partner is a narcissist, because in fact, he can only feel the resident-narcissist's emptyness in her?

[@LM-kr8qy]

I am trying to understand I am here as a victim of narcissistic abuse. Our shared son is with me now as father lost his visits only supervised in which he does not exercise. I homeschool him we are always together I don't want to cause my son to be the same. How do I know I am not causing the same in him?

[@shaldass4964]

what about an absent mother from about 2 weeks after birth does this occur to?

[@alexiscormier7225]

i didn't mind the fusing, then caught him cheating and then I left (key word is caught him, he was probably doing it the whole time)

[@cristianogallo1318]

Professor Vaknin, the existing literature suggests that narcissistic suicide is a rare event, and you have not yet addressed this subject thoroughly in any of your excellent lectures. The relationship of NPD to suicide and its specific dynamics seem quite understudied. Is the inability to access none of the five delusional ways out, when the narcissist suffers profound mortification and he/she is overwhelmed by negative and absent supply, the determining factor for a lethal suicide attempt?

[@fapstronaut3671]

Professor, I was diagnosed with NPD, Im visiting psychoanalyst 3 times a week. , My reality of normal life crumbles with each new video, or new observation about myself i find. It seems like the disorder goes through my whole life. What really hurts me, is my inability to have normal relationships, childish behavior, and now even procrasting on things where I can lose. Is there any chance to fix this immensely painful way of life? Thank you

[@samvaknin]

Psychoanalysis is a colossal waste of time when it comes to NPD. Go through my playlist on therapies.

[@geangray8984]

I am,P, from JAMAICA i have a question for MR VAKNIN on this one, when you force the narcissist to separate from you when that separation take place what happens NEXT? this is so real .

[@ianstewart4922]

Blue oyster cults song .veteran of the psychic wars is worth listening to. How did they write these lyrics in the late 1970s

[@alexpopowski1318]

Professor, I know you’ve said that the mothership model can’t be applied to the narcissist’s relationship with dad. My narcissistic ex, by her own account (and her father even pulled me to the side and repented for his past actions, confirming it for me) her father was an absolutely horrendous overt narcissist and had abused her awfully during her formative years. My ex now operates as what I believe to be a covert narcissist and she put me through profound abuse, of which I am struggling to recover from. I’m convinced her dad ‘made’ her. Could it still be that my ex’s mother abandoned my ex on an emotional level during her father’s abuse, therefore not protecting her and failing as a mother? I’m wondering how much her father had to play in all of this. It *feels* like your model can be applied to her relationship with her father because I began to feel like her dad! She pushed me to the brink, sleep deprived me repeatedly, until I began behaving unhinged, just like he did. I felt like she wanted to punish her father finally. I know you’ve adamantly disagreed it can be applied in such a way. Of course, I am interested in your thoughts. Thanks very much for dissecting all this mess thus far. Edit: come to think of it, her mother wasn’t exactly normal… story for another time. I feel I’m in a pit, attempting to untangle a knotted mess of vipers. Although, I feel the only way to heal is to simply just forget about it. I’m hoping I can, after sifting through these videos.

[@LillianStead]

Sorry Sam, you explain what happens further on in your video. I was too hasty with my question.

[@lilrascalish]

Prof. Sam, I was living with someone younger than me. Can someone young display narcissistic behaviors without them knowing what they are doing is narcissist? Because this guy has a horrible behavior but I know he doesn't know what narcissist is. Or is not adult enough to know he is doing it.

[@alyajewellery]

What if Mummy was enmeshed until adulthood. My Therapist said we need to get my mother out of my head. I’m sure I’m not a narcissist. I was very resistant to enmeshing with the ex in the beginning.

[@lorrainebuono8824]

Once the narc has separated and individuated from his mother successfully ( by devaluing the intimate partner) does he remain so? Or will he just repeat the process in every intimate relationship thereafter.

[@samvaknin]

Watch the videos in the shared fantasy playlist.

[@mhashas1]

Dissociation

[@loubrielsosalac470]

Dr. Vaknin, Do you have any Information on the origin of the term “Verbal abuse”, I did some research and it seems to have been coined in a book by Patricia Evans. I took a look at the etymology of those words and they don’t make sense together. What are your thoughts on the history of verbal abuse?

[@mino7166]

Thank you, is it the same for narcissistic fathers? In this discussion you talked from the perspective of a woman with a narcissistic husband, is the dynamic the same for a son of a narcissistic father?

[@samvaknin]

Children separate from mothers, not from fathers.

[@mino7166]

@@samvaknin so is the recovery from narcissistic abuse from son to father different than it would be from wife to husband?

[@karinteeples6517]

@@WeezelWayz Truth! He detests learned helplessness! We have to do the work in educating ourselves. He gives the tools!🙌🏻

[@mino7166]

@@WeezelWayz my question was focused on the recovery of narcissistic abuse from the perspective of a son who was abused by his narcissistic father. I also hope this will be discussed in the conversation with grannon. Regarding your advise to search his channel for answers, I watched most of the videos related to the topic but this seems to be new information which is presented for the first time.

[@alisachaise3]

😂 I only now know 3 Hebrew words thanks Sam!

[@leelamarie513]

Dr. Vaknin, I'm very sad to see that your work was taken without credit by R. Gannon kzbin.info/www/bejne/ipC7iGR_r5mcf6c What would you call his behavior in doing this? It would be helpful to spot it as we come across these types of people all the time. Using his relationship experience is one thing, but passing himself off as an expert while using your work feels... dirty. It's like he never cleans his washing machine and people are using it expecting clean laundry but he's just further staining their clothes. You say it much more eloquently and confidently... because it's your work!

[@user-gv1ee7xc8g]

Sam is sugar and honey and funny!!!

[@hollymayersky5105]

Good morning ☺

[@HoneySuckle123]

Time to learn 📖

[@user-ph9tj2rk6d]

My ex said more than once, " I will scar you, phisicly and emotionally."

[@mirellam2431]

My said I will drive you to that level that you will want to take your own life. 😏 For something he did to me.

[@itarah1]

😄😄😄 Narcissically mortified us

[@Sophie-uc8vp]

I'm not narcissitically mortified, sorry 😂

[@samvaknin]

Narcissisticly.

[@karinteeples6517]

@@samvaknin 😂😂😂😂 I feel your disgust…….

[@cinpoggio2]

Dissociation hahaha - there’s no arse in there

[@theresacane971]

How appropriate that Dahmer literally injected acid into his victims brains and kept them as zombie company. 😳

[@alexam6959]

Omg… narcs are BORG!!!!

[@Schneewolke]

this was the longest intro so far😂

[@barry_g8443]

Wow... I always thought it was a shame thing.