Never Modify a 300HP SEA-DOO Without a Proper Break-In Period: WCJ Quick Topic

Mark Twain is attributed with saying, “A lie can travel halfway around the world before the truth puts on its shoes.” While it wasn't a lie per se, the misconception that a brand-new 2022 Sea-Doo RXT-X 300 can be safely modified to run 83mph without performing the proper break-in procedure is a recipe for disaster. The Watercraft Journal details exactly why here. While it might sound like a shortcut, you'll be paying for it (literally) in the long run.
And please subscribe to our KZbin channel!
You can also follow us HERE:
Facebook: / thewatercraftjournal
Instagram: / pwcjournal
Twitter: / pwcjournal
And please visit our sponsors' websites:
Sea-Doo: www.sea-doo.com/
Slippery: slipperywetsuits.com/
Windrider: windrider.com/
GoPro: shop.gopro.com/
#pwcjournal #seadoolife #tuning

[@jasonmaria9977]

Kevin, thank you very much for always helping us all. I am an experienced PWC and Boat rider since 1982!!! I watched that video and many including myself truly have respect for that company for their knowledge, openness and full disclosure. After watching the video, I truly thought and was convinced that Seadoo must have figured out a way that no longer needed 10 hours of a break-in but now just 1 hour when it is now even more important to break them in properly for 10 hours!!! Kevin, thank you VERY MUCH for helping me avoid a major problem. I am sure the company thought as I did that it was okay. Hope they have seen your video on this and are now informed as no one knows everything. Love your immaculate Mopar in the background being a Mopar guy myself. Take care and congratulations on your well-deserved success. Jasoninflorida

[@watercraftjournal]

Jason, the reality is that the vast majority of these hardcore tuners are NOT putting the hours on their 90mph machines that the typical owner does. Rather, they spend big money to build them, click off some fast GPS speeds and flip them to the next owner. I was told that shortly after the video was recorded that the modified ski dropped a cylinder and needed a full rebuild. I'm not attacking any builder or racer, but I am trying to caution the would-be PWC owner to consider why BRP recommends the 5-hour break-in period. -K

[@davidmccomb7120]

I don't think I would modify anything until its out of warranty, just a rule of thumb .. I have watched dealers deny warranty for mods or tunes put on motors, and upset customers given the bill instead warranty. You always run the risk of blowing it up when you run it harder than spec... but yes definitely after a good break-in

[@watercraftjournal]

Smart decision. Play it safe.

[@drewkm32]

What if you just buy a scom add-on? I’m waiting for a 2022 or a 2023 RXT-X, most definitely using all 10hrs too break in. Especially because I’m using my own money now.

[@johnzillah]

Great video! I have never modified a ski, but the two that I purchased back in the day were and they didn't last long. This is great information broken down into common sense easy to understand details. Not saying I would not do it in the future but this video comes from a person (Kevin Shaw) who is in the know and experienced with modifying a ski. I think this video will save a lot of people future heartaches. Thanks!

[@watercraftjournal]

Modifying skis for added performance or better handling is always an option and encouraged - just be wise when doing it.

[@nyfan78]

Great info and video!

[@watercraftjournal]

Glad it was helpful!

[@jnasjr]

Great. I was looking for other info. I believe much simple problem. I will read the manual to see if I can find there. Just got my first SeaDoo GTX 170. Two times in the River. 3 hours on it and following the break in period. But I cannot use some functions, such as slow mode and cruise control, only the 5mi/h going forward comes automatically. Also, I noticed that there is no indication of Neutral (N) light or signal in the panel. I imagine that it could be because during the break-in period the computer limits some functions or behaviors, but not sure. I will read the manual deeply to see if I can find this info. Second option call Cycle Springs where I bought it. Do you have any idea why this could be happening?

[@peterbranagan9955]

Is it okay to install the oil catch can on a GTX 300 limited new out of the box or should it be installed after the 5-10 hour break in period.

[@alexkluh1407]

It’s crazy reading on various Seadoo Facebook groups about the number of riders/owners who don’t bother to break in these things properly. It just blows me away how common this is.🙄🤷‍♂️

[@edwardbielewicz2998]

Great video.

[@watercraftjournal]

Glad you enjoyed it

[@BryanDavis3505]

I watched that video and question that as well. I have a brand new 2022 GTX 300 that I just got about 3 weeks ago. I do have a question. Does the computer limit throttle response until the 10 hour break in period is over? Thanks!

[@watercraftjournal]

Bryan, yes. BRP includes a "break in mode" in the ECU tune that limits throttle response and even full throttle operation until 5 hours are racked up on the clock. In the video in question, an ECU reflash was used to override this safety feature. For factory-stock machines, you will find that the ski "opens up" at the 4-5 hour mark. Before then, even engaging "Sport Mode" won't do anything to your speed or acceleration.

[@maistocars21]

I have about 6 hours on my 2022 rxp x 300, just installed a carbon fiber intake and a catch can. Figure that will help more than hurt. Not messing with the tune or anything

[@Nosaj-dt1ij]

Love your passion for fun tempered with a bit of common sense and intelligence.

[@watercraftjournal]

Thank you!

[@philpollard7260]

THANK YOU!!! Got into it with a youtuber last week about not breaking in the engine.

[@watercraftjournal]

Glad I could help!

[@jetskiliferboatguy8140]

And you were wrong on so many levels AND it wasn't any of your business or $$ to begin with. Fact is modern manufacturing yeilds exact and repeated tolerances so break in isn't what is was 30 years ago.

[@philpollard7260]

@@jetskiliferboatguy8140 and you work on them for a living? I also do motorcycles read the owners manual fool.

[@ldsgarage7142]

Enjoyed the video Kev. Wanted to know your thoughts on a ski I'm thinking of purchasing. It's a 2017 gtr 230 with 94 hours and full service history from seadoo. Dealer certified used so comes with 6 months warranty. Haven't owned a supercharged ski before but have been told by a few people now the 2017 to current supercharged sea-doo's are pretty good on reliability and not stupidly expensive to maintain (here on prison island 🇦🇺) I was wondering what you're thoughts on that particular model are. Thanks for all the videos you put out, really enjoy them.

[@watercraftjournal]

Again, if you "play it safe" and follow the manual (proper break-in, regular maintenance, etc.) your chances of enjoying a long and lasting relationship with your Sea-Doo will be higher than others.

[@jeffheintz3163]

Hello Mark, Just so I understand fully... the 2021 cylinders are plated and do not have a sleeve? I'm asking because I have a salt water damaged 2021 and it literally looks like chrome plating flaking off the cylinder walls. however very confused because Riva sells sleeves for the 2021??? If you could please clarify it would really help me out. Thank you and love your channel

[@watercraftjournal]

Mark? It's Kevin. And the 300 ACE engines are plasma coated in a proprietary coating (not Nikasil) instead of using ductile iron sleeves (like previous 1503 engines). This plasma coating is VERY sensitive to the initial break-in process. When done incorrectly, an engine will often have excessive blow-by issues because the rings will never seal properly. RIVA sells steel sleeves for those rebuilding a 300 ACE engine or competitively racing one and not wanting to grind off flaking or failed coatings, and re-apply a fresh coating (which will require another proper break-in process). Rather, steel sleeves (like Kawasaki and Yamaha engines) require every little break-in to seal up properly. Hope this helps. -K

[@jeffheintz3163]

@@watercraftjournal I don’t know where I got Mark from… sorry Kevin. I have a 2021 Rxp 300 that has salt water damage inside and it has actually made the plating flake off. Is there anyone in the USA that can re plate the cylinder walls? It only has 15 hours however the cylinders look like artifacts from the titanic. Gulped a little water in the intake. Everything else looks really good. Thank you for your time Kevin

[@watercraftjournal]

In the US? Jeez, a lot of places, but you'll need to find a quality machine shop who works on motorcycles most likely. They apply nikasil (a superior coating) to aluminum engine blocks all the time. They need to hone the cylinders first, of course.

[@jeffheintz3163]

@@watercraftjournal ok got it! Thanks for your help. Subscribed and waiting for the next vid. Keep up the good work

[@tarmactakeover1819]

Hello Kevin, I just purchased a 2022 Sea Doo GTI SE 170 with the N/A 1630 ACE, it is my first ski and would really like it to last a long time. In the manual it says to very the throttle for the first 10 hours not going above 1/2-3/4 throttle but some full throttle is ok. I have kept it in eco mode and have been changing the throttle every 25 seconds and have made sure to let it cool off and warm up every time. I am nearing 5 hours and will reach it next ride. Should I start to give it full throttle but still change speed regularly at that time like a 300 hp model or should I wait the full 10 hours?

[@watercraftjournal]

Congrats on your purchase! Although more so with supercharged Sea-Doos, the factory ECU restricts full throttle and alternative mode operation until 5 hours. After 5 hours have been met, Sport mode will be in full operation (if selected). Do not bother engaging Eco Mode, the ECU's default is all that is necessary. And yes, alternating the throttle during these hours of operation is key to properly heat cycling the engine and allowing the sensitive internals to properly seat. -K

[@tarmactakeover1819]

@@watercraftjournal Thank you for getting back to me to clear this up.

[@TimHuffine-sq3pn]

I’ve got a question about the cross hatching of the aluminum cylinder also . As these aluminum flakes or powder fall off the cylinder walls , shouldn’t the oil and filter be changed after 10 hours to get as much as you can out of the crankcase ? There’s a possibility of progressive damage here ?

[@pajamatime5750]

Kevin. Any seat time on the 2022 Kawi Ultra 310 LX yet? Or planned??

[@watercraftjournal]

No production units have been built yet (seriously). Once Kawasaki Corporate has some production units in hand, I'll be flying out for a test day.

[@pajamatime5750]

Awesome!

[@logancriswell4612]

I just bought a 21 Rxpx and won’t be able to ride it for a month or two. I ordered a riva SCOM, Intake, and free flow exhaust. Is it safe to add before break in or do I need to Waite. Also could you make a video on the seadoo coolant hose issues. Id really like to know what all I need to go over to make sure that never happens to me.

[@joeferreira617]

Break in your ski that's what this whole video is about wtf 🤦🏽‍♂️

[@logancriswell4612]

@@joeferreira617 relax joe it’s not an ecu tune. The ecu is still locked and will be able to break in normally.

[@watercraftjournal]

Joe's right. Leave it alone until after the break in.

[@brhntrmd]

I was actually thinking the same thing in your favor. I like the other channel too. I used to be a performance enthusiast. So I like to keep up with performance oriented things like this.

[@watercraftjournal]

Again we’re not trying to denigrate anybody here but needed to address one singular issue.

[@3ftDeepChannel]

Great public service announcement. Thanks, Kevin!

[@Steven-xj2rf]

Thank you for your helpful videos.

[@watercraftjournal]

You bet! Thanks for the compliment.

[@jetbikes1]

Great Information man, thanks , might take me 15 hours now just to make dam sure !

[@watercraftjournal]

LOL!

[@mattfoster9519]

Great content as usual. I did add a catch can to my new RXT-X before hitting the water. I assume the catch can wouldn’t negatively effect engine break-in.

[@watercraftjournal]

No, it wouldn't. It's a safe addition.

[@Dan-qk4ns]

It does void warranty though!

[@mattfoster9519]

@@Dan-qk4ns my dealer told me that it wouldn’t void warranty. I’ll have to do some checking into this. Thanks.

[@watercraftjournal]

No it doesn't void the warranty.

[@jesseespinoza3132]

Firstly. Great content! I’m fortunate to have recently upgraded from a 2016 RXT 260 to a 2022 RXT-X 300. My question is would I be hurting my ski during the break in period by installing JPracing’s air intake at the same time as a catch can? Thanks 🙏

[@samcrammy3416]

Hey Kevin, is it the same with the Yamaha gp1800r svho with break in period ?

[@Aaron.Davis56]

It's in your Owners Manual

[@watercraftjournal]

Sam, Kawasaki and Yamaha do have a break-in period but it’s far shorter (1-2.5 hours).

[@PirateDynamics]

I spent many years in the drag bike world, and it was common to use what was called "the motoman method" of breaking in a new race engine on a chassis dyno; basically you would let it get up to temperature idling and then do three different sets of three pulls with increasing throttle each time, letting it cool down 15 minutes between each set. This would take less than an hour, and then at the end you would be at the max compression that the engine would ever make. The argument was that you wanted to fully seat the rings while the cross hatching was still fresh on the cylinder walls. We did this with iron or nikasil cylinders with great success; the engines kept high, stable compression for a long time. There is also a "motoman method" for bikes that are ridden on the street instead of on a dyno, and it involves hard sudden throttle pulls in 2nd, 3rd,and 4th gear with the idea being that it's beneficial to put as much pressure on top of the rings as possible while the cross hatching is the sharpest. I can see somebody applying the same logic to these PWC engines. Maybe a good opportunity for a shootout? Two new RXPXs, one broken in by the book and one run hard? This has been a controversial topic among motorcycle people forever.

[@watercraftjournal]

Having build several engines over my career, I can attest to this kind of break-in period for iron cylinders - NOT electro-plated cylinders, which is the concern and the ENTIRE REASON WHY I made this video. The rings are NOT seated at 40 minutes of break-in, so compression is going to suck. This isn't buried in the video. I'm VERY upfront about this as being the concern. -K

[@PirateDynamics]

@@watercraftjournal To be clear this is how we broke in nikasil plated engines too, we did a lot of high-dollar turbo Hayabusa and GSXR builds and you can't sleeve those engines. I'm just saying that there is an engineering argument for a hard break-in as well, and it's common in the motorcycle world.

[@watercraftjournal]

Certainly! I witnessed this myself during my time working at Cycle News. Unfortunately, whatever brand of electroplating Rotax is using for its 300 ACE engines is NOT as durable as MAHLE's Nikasil or similar coatings. It's difficult to come right out and say, "hey this stuff ain't as strong as other nickel platings!" but it's exactly that. We see the service reports, and there's a lot of low compression cylinder repairs out there.

[@seadogg404]

Great insight! Thanks for sharing. Just bought the same ski and she’s amazing! I don’t get why anyone would void the warranty of a brand new ski before the breakin……smdh

[@watercraftjournal]

You and I both!

[@bendytendy9586]

Kev, What about adding say a blow off valve right away or a engine breather? I fully understand the reason for the break in period but wouldn't these upgrades be beneficial in the long run to start early?

[@Steven-xj2rf]

I would guess it would help you keep the intake track clean from the start. I don't see how it could hurt, but not sure how much it might help either.

[@captainawesome5560]

Both of these options will not hurt anything and will help in fact, BUT YOU STILL MUST FOLLOW THE BREAK IN PROCEDURE ..... nice Pete in your profile pic

[@watercraftjournal]

Yes, adding a catch can at the get-go would be beneficial. I've done it myself. Unless you are producing extra PSI your Sea-Doo does NOT require an aftermarket BOV. A factory supercharged (300HP) Sea-Doo peaks at 9psi. Unless you're generating more than that, you don't need one. Any one who tells you otherwise is trying to get your money.

[@bendytendy9586]

@@watercraftjournal Thanks guys, I figured as much just wasn't sure if it would throw off some strange balance in the break in process

[@MikeZ32TT]

Thanks Kevin.

[@watercraftjournal]

You bet!

[@keithknight25]

Would love to see the AFR on those tunes. Especially in comparison to Riva. I’d imagine they are pushing the lean scales.

[@watercraftjournal]

Well, considering that that engine is likely super low on compression because it wasn't heat cycled, the AFR is gonna be WAAAY off.

[@dadecountyriders]

👌👌awesome Chanel

[@watercraftjournal]

Thanks for coming

[@WaltNasty]

Just saw this one, 100 percent Facts,

[@thejayvodlexperience7856]

If guys wanna disregard the manufacturer recommendations, that’s totally up to them. It’s their pocketbook. At least you’ve done your diligence and the warning has been made so for guys that still wanna do their own thing, good luck. They’re gonna need it!

[@watercraftjournal]

Again, our goal is just to keep people on the water as long as possible by providing safe, smart and intelligent advice.

[@thejayvodlexperience7856]

@@watercraftjournal yes sir, a safe ski is a reliable ski

[@adamkastning9471]

Great channel. I modified my Yamaha with 0 hours on it. I think breakin is relative to throttle not to modification. What about the riva ski's? If its made for it let her have it. Dont see drag cars breakin in a thing. Soon as its heat cycled and tuned its to the races.

[@watercraftjournal]

Incorrect on a vast array of levels. Drag engines are literally torn down between heats, nor do they use the garbage plasma coating that this entire video is predicated upon. Your Yamaha has ductile iron sleeves, not a brittle coating that has been proven to fail since 2018.

[@PWC-WORLD]

Kevin, I don't think your knowledge is at question here, you have definitely proven to be a great asset to the hobby/ industry, I've gotten a a lot of good information from the Watercraft Journal Channel, thanks to your video's I made the decision to purchase the ski I currently own. First I like to say the anyone purchasing any of these pwc with a bank loan and has plan to modifying, and tuning it is not a great decision, and I can only hope they understand they're voiding any warranty from the factory the moment they decide to modify it, you would think that's common sense right. Now if you're purchasing this with your hard earned cash, I believe is solely up to the person to make a decision on what they want to do with their property, even if that means voiding warranty by skipping manufacture instructions the are in place to protect the life of the product and mainly to protect the company from "liability claims from idiot customers unwilling to accept their culpability for damaging a finished product once delivered" copy that from your previous cmnt. I understand the you feel responsible to inform people of the correct ways to do such things, but you have to understand is the person choice on what they want to do with their property, at the end of the day videos like these are great information to help the mass on making an informed decision on what they want to do, again "with their property" ignorance is a choice.... I mean if you can afford to drop 20k cash on one of these pwc and get it tune/modify right away I think your last concern is following the manufacturer established procedure to breaking in the engine. now as a professional tuner/shop business in general I believe is their responsibility to inform the costumer of such risk and allow for them to make an informed decision, just my 2 cents. if a costumer wants to purchased a brand new machine and go blow it up the same day, that's their choice and by no means the tuner or business establishment can be hold accountable for their costumer decision, nor are they legally responsible to deny service, that's just bogus...

[@watercraftjournal]

Thank you for the kind words. Unfortunately, in today’s litigative society, the defense of “we did what the customer asked for” has fallen apart in court many times over. Suing a shop (after performing mods and the car or ski has blown) has become very prevalent in the last decade. The client will never claim responsibility despite how insistent they were. Previous lawsuits have set a precedent that the shop is recognized as the expert (far above the customer) so the court sees the shop of tuner liable to properly warn or advise the customer of the potential outcomes. It’s a crap decision for sure, but being wired into the automotive aftermarket, I’ve seen this happen a dozen times in the last few years alone. You and I agree how things ought to be, but they’re just not are that way.

[@3akoscielski]

HOLY S*** you have a 1969 Dodge Charger?! Favourite car of all time. What a Beauty. Wish I could afford one. SeaDoo first though, then I'll be eyeing one haha!

[@watercraftjournal]

LOL yeah, I do. Our other magazine is www.moparconnectionmagazine.com - go check it out. -K

[@carloszarco3361]

Question should I wait the 10 hours to install the catch can ?

[@Steven-xj2rf]

No,. You can I stall it anytime.

[@watercraftjournal]

Steven's right. You can install that from the get-go.

[@carloszarco3361]

Thank you guys. I just got my 2022 rxp so I’ll be ordering that catch can

[@Dan-qk4ns]

@@watercraftjournal I'm not sure why you won't answer my question about it voiding warranty!?

[@watercraftjournal]

We have. Multiple times. You're behaving like a troll, Dan.

[@osvaldosanchez5265]

At the end of the day it isn’t the tuners responsibility to make sure the customer properly runs in or maintains the ski. If someone with more money than sense wants to tune their ski and do 80MPH out the box well they’ll have to deal with the consequences.

[@watercraftjournal]

You are absolutely incorrect and your statement would NEVER hold any weight in a court of law.

[@osvaldosanchez5265]

@@watercraftjournal so if i take a brand new Camaro, go down the street and slap a supercharger on it before it’s broken in and blow it up it’s the speed shops fault? How does that make sense?

[@osvaldosanchez5265]

Blow up is a bit of an overstatement but let’s say it develops severe blow by at 25k miles is it still the speed shops fault?

[@watercraftjournal]

A quality performance tuner is legally responsible to deny service if specific criteria are not met. This alone is the basis for half a dozen consumer protection laws. Until the vehicle met certain base requirements. Engine builders and dyno tuners do this DAILY (as me how I know). Tuners and engine builders face liability claims annually from idiot customers unwilling to accept their culpability for damaging a finished product once delivered. This customer in this particular instance should have been denied service until reaching the minimum threshold - or the shop should've offered to rack up the necessary hours beforehand. Familiarize yourself with the legal standing and you'll be shocked how detailed the law is on this.

[@seadogg404]

True but the point of this video is to educate ski owners about the repercussions of forsaking the break-in as vendors just want your money. It’s a valuable public service being provided here. Respect to wcj for this video.

[@TheLeblancGroup]

Kevin do you need a catch can on a new GTR230?

[@watercraftjournal]

Is it supercharged? (Yes it is) So yes.

[@Acula33RC]

I saw that video also. I did a perfect 10 hour break in on my 21 GTX Limited and then had it serviced. Most terrifying thing I saw in the video was how much oil was in the intake and supercharger after only one hour!! Get a catch can people!! And drain your oil to just below the first line!

[@watercraftjournal]

Yessir! There are reasons for these things.

[@thegarraosm.a.9490]

Can you add link to this video ? I want to see it plz

[@buzurk]

Awesome video, Thank you! I did read on a forum that heat cycling is key, in fact one comment read (this is not my advise by the way) "First ride, for about half hour varying rpm, no more than 6000rpm. then let it cool down for an hour. Then ride again for another 30-60minutes at varying speeds with a few WOT runs. Then let cool down. Then basically good to go" ^^^ do not take this as advise, its not my advise, found it on a forum and simply seeking input on it ^^^ Anyway, Thoughts?

[@watercraftjournal]

Ugh no. This is very wrong. Follow the manual.

[@DarylDruesdow]

Can you add just a oil catch can before the 5 hr break in period?

[@watercraftjournal]

Of course

[@jasonmekush5280]

I can say everything you said is correct. I think customers do not now better and expect a tuner to do the thinking 4 them.

[@watercraftjournal]

But who is going to do the thinking for the tuner?

[@andreabta]

😂😂😂 When I saw the video I was really asking myself if it was a normal thing to Do after I spent 10hrs running in my ski after I got it.... And funny enough I'm one of the lucky ones that had no issues with IDF as well.... I'll definitely believe you... Seen a lot of people deliberately break their ski and blame it on the brand 😂.... 2nd seadoo I own one lasted 5 years sold it as brand new this is 6 months old and 20hr later no issue yet 🤙

[@watercraftjournal]

Glad to hear they’re running great!

[@zaneturner8423]

Hey Kev, I've always believed in heat cycling breaking in any of my two-stroke / 4-stroke engines, although I have had friends that did not and made them scream right out of gate. I don't really know the engine longevity because they were race engines anyway and we're coming apart very soon for maintenance. I'm pretty sure the plated cylinder thing came about with Honda's nikasil back in the 80's and everyone else jumped on that train afterward claiming better heat dissipation than a steel liner.....who knows if it really works what I do know is you need to buy a new cylinder when it's worn out and it cannot be bored to the next size over. BTW that Gen 2 Hemi piston you were holding up needs to be gas ported. Lol

[@watercraftjournal]

Great comment. The biggest error in this video is me calling the BRP coating "electroplated" - it's plasma coated, and its durability has been hit or miss. There's a LOT of failures (most searches for "dropped cylinder" will show up), so proper break-in is for BOTH proper heat cycling and seating the rings to the coating. Yes, similar coatings to Nikasil have shown to be very successful, but BRP's is proprietary to themselves, and it's certainly not Nikasil.

[@victorsmikh6264]

Will a scom void any warranty?

[@watercraftjournal]

If your dealer sees it on there. Just take it off before you go in for service.

[@jim4551]

I did see that video and questions popped in my head. Must mean I'm learning something from listening to your vids...even if it is through osmosis..haha. I'm feeling lucky and kinda blessed to have such helpful info from solid people like you Kevin and some of the guys that chime in sharing their experience on your videos(Jason, Joe, Captain and others). I am guilty at times of being that anxious guy...but this time, with your help Brother, I will be doing it right. When I reached out to Ryan at JetX about having my new GP modded and tuned he set me straight. First he asked me what my goals were for the ski then he took the time to go through every mod and what it will bring to the ski. And thankfully he also has more than $$ in mind as he told me he would not touch my ski until it had a full 10hrs of running time to ensure a proper break-in and take care of any issues that might arise with the dealer before I bring him the ski. Nice to see that there are good solid people still out there. Oh, BTW, at some point he should send you some thanks Kevin cuz I did let him know that he was getting my business because of listening to you and learning from your educational and expansive topic videos.. Keep up the great work👍👍. Much Appreciated! Tks again, 'Newf'

[@watercraftjournal]

I love to hear it. Ryan and the JetX team are super dudes who know their stuff. -K

[@jasonmekush5280]

Just had to watch it again, great stuff. Got a great one for you Kevin : a rentsl company in south florida has a quad trailer renting out two (2) 2021 fx svho yes without restrictions aka turtle dash mode. They are also renting out ( 2 ) white vx-ho's. the vx isnt so bad , but what dam$$n fool rents out a 62 plus plus mph machine to tourists all her from jersey, new york, michigan and gosh only knows where else. Ppl from Tennessee dont vacation here much, too bad they do have class and would make our tourist season much more enjoyable. best bumpah stickah here : dont new york our florida.

[@watercraftjournal]

That sounds like a lawsuit waiting to happen

[@jasonmekush5280]

@@watercraftjournal absolutely is. a year ago or so there were some cats in miami advertising 2021 rxp-x for 400 / hour with a refundable 2000 deposit up front.

[@racerx2084]

I totally understand a break in period of an engine but I don’t see an issue with doing some mods. Definitely have to get through done heat cycles, but an air intake, exhaust, ride plate, intake grate, isn’t going to affect the rings from seating. Now if you have that stuff and go balls out, yes I see an issue. That goes for a stocker as well too. The 10 hour dealer check are fairly simple but definitely needed. The oil change is the biggest thing especially with the supercharged skis bc of the blow by. Maybe the skis need to be restricted like a new corvette for so many hours (corvette actually goes by miles). Could just use the learner/slow key I guess. But keeping the tune at the regular spot is a good idea for longevity. But….as for the need for speed people, longevity isn’t a thing they are looking for. I mean if they wait the 10 hrs then tune it. Then it blows up bc they accidentally bc they let the gas can outside in the rain and filled the ski or some other oddity. When a new motor is dropped in or rebuilt, the owner isn’t going to go back to the stock tune. Also in that case, every Riva special editions should have 10 hours of play time on the gauge bc the are tuned as well. But I definitely see what your saying and what engineering is saying. They are building the skis to hopefully last a long time bc they don’t want to see an issue bc it puts a bad rap on them. Sea poo, yamabomb & kawisucki aren’t exactly marketing names. Btw. Nice car. My next door neighbor has a beautiful 72🤔 challenger. All original, numbers matching 440 car. Red with white interior.

[@racerx2084]

Man, I should have done some editing before hitting complete. Dam you Siri, lol.

[@watercraftjournal]

Clearly you missed the part where Kevin states that he's 100% cool with mods after performing the break-in process. Watch it again.

[@racerx2084]

No I saw the spot where he says that

[@racerx2084]

I like your channel, Kevin and his team of writers do a great job at covering watercraft. Pwc’s are a piss ant in the world of Motorsports. Any exposure is great exposure. And shops turning out work and making people happy is what it’s all about. Not going tit for tat bc it’s not worth my time. But read my post again. It’s says that I do agree with some stuff. The WCJ has a lot of noobs to pwc. And that’s great, bc your videos and magazine may have influenced them to get into it. But alot ask how to flush their ski, but Walmart life jackets and use mailbox numbers on their skis. Given a time for break in is much easier to get through than giving multiple heats cycle instructions to a person. I’m sure the great engineers at Seadoo who came up with the gtx limited suspension ski can say proper heats cycles at different rpms is way much better than waiting 5+hrs of going ham on the engine bc that is what most new customers do.

[@smokinjoe0878]

Do you think it’s safe to put on a scom after 5 hours?

[@watercraftjournal]

Absolutely

[@smokinjoe0878]

@@watercraftjournal I had little over 5 hours on ski so I wasn’t sure. Been hearing conflicting break in times, 5 hours or 10 hours. Long story short I installed it and it worked MINT! Great add on.

[@jetskiliferboatguy8140]

So it's dangerous and then it's just error on the side of caution. Which is it ?? How do you explain complete engine rebuilds at the track between runs?

[@watercraftjournal]

Racers are not concerned with racking up hundreds of hours on their builds. They're looking to fix a problem between heats. And after the race weekend, they immediately tear down their engines. As a former AHRA racer, I am all too familiar with this. I reason you do too. The advice given here is not for the competitive racer. I think you understand that as well. Rather, we're talking to the novice-to-moderate PWC enthusiast who might be considering modifying their Sea-Doo in the future but don't want to void their warranty too quickly. -K

[@paulpuglia8480]

All I can say is WOW! I know better than that every engine needs to be broken properly. I used to be an automechanic I'm also a big Mopar person I've always had Mopars, my 1st car was a 1970 Dodge Dart with a 318 engine.

[@watercraftjournal]

Sweet! Mopar or NO CAR!

[@dylanjoyce6683]

Kevin my sea doo mechanic says the extra oil in blow by is there for a reason per rotax and brp to help lubricate supercharger and there’s no need for a catch can. Any truth to this?

[@watercraftjournal]

Nope. He's wrong and kinda dumb. The supercharger is SHAFT DRIVEN and has oil galleys that lubricate the shaft, clutches and gears. Never use him again.

[@Threefiddyz]

and go to a new mechanic lol

[@javiermiranda5580]

Some dealers say there is no need of brake-in, just to receive your PWC to repair and get money out of it. Others say that brake-in is a must because they want to have reputation as a good dealer and not to talk bad about the products he eats from...

[@watercraftjournal]

Some SEA-DOO DEALERS are saying these engines don't require a break-in period? Holy cow. Now, to be fair, the naturally-aspirated Sea-Doos don't have the break-in delay (and ECU restrictions) as the supercharged skis do. So that might be what is being conveyed. But the supercharged skis (particularly the 300s) definitely do.

[@HayPOWER-PR]

I have 2020 seadoo rxt x300 brake timing chain with only 3.9 hours. Zero mods. And dealer decline replace or fix the engine due to rust found at the cylinder but all that rust wast made from the 2 month my Seadoo was seating at the dealer. Sure is going to have RUST. Is crazyyyy and I ending paid 5,300 for a remanufacture engine 😖😫

[@HayPOWER-PR]

Soo now i have a new 2021 yamaha fx svho the best jet-ski brand. I just like the seadoo when came out but. Pleaseee people don’t waste your money. Only buy yamaha

[@watercraftjournal]

Wow! That’s crazy. The first we’ve heard of that happening.

[@Futurase1]

I did not know the SeaDoo engines did not have pressed in steel liners. I assumed they did. Is what Kevin says is true, heat cycles would be an absolute must. Engine breaking in is heat cycles on all engines to some extent. I’m sure Sea Doo engineers is who told him. This proves that changing oil at 15 hours then. Get the grit out that has been wore off the liners. Great info to know…

[@watercraftjournal]

Thankfully, what Kevin says is true because he's got the OE's watching (and correcting) what he says every stinkin' week.

[@richardyorke9055]

What a dick move to not use sleeves in the cylinders

[@watercraftjournal]

No, not necessarily. Performance motorcycles have been using plasma coated and/or electroplated cylinders for decades.

[@callummacleod1921]

Hmmm, are you an engine builder? Or even a mechanic? I've been riding racing and building motorcycle motors for a lot of years now and have found an hours run time is enough to break in an engine. Most race motors dont even see 5hours between rebuilds, let alone 5 hours break in. The processes you describe with the electro plating and ring bed, happen very quickly and if done correctly an hours enough. The crucial point is the warm up so the engine is at proper temp and tolerances are correct before load is applied. Factory recommendations of 5 hours or more are to allow for idiots and non mechanically minded people, as you are correct in saying a lot of damage can be done in that break in period if care isn't taken.

[@watercraftjournal]

Callum, what needs to be understood is that the electroplated coating (no, it's not Nikasil but Rotax's own formula of nickel plating) is NOT holding up very well. Failures have been occurring since the change in 2016, as the tolerances are nowhere near as precise as they were with the 1503 Rotax with pressed-in sleeves. These irregular tolerances are directly responsible for the 300 ACE's excessive blow-by issues. If these engines had ductile sleeves OR were coated in Nikasil plating, I would 100% agree with you that a proper break-in would take maybe an hour max. But sadly they are not, and there's more failures than what the public sees.

[@callummacleod1921]

@@watercraftjournal ah, i see. Thanks for the reply. I've had this break in chat more than once lol. I can see why you are urging a longer break in then. I wonder why rotax dont use a more durable plating? There are some very good products out there now.

[@watercraftjournal]

You and me both, Callum. (Especially given the quantity of failed/dropped cylinders.)

[@MrPink-pe2mx]

I say if he warned them and they said do it anyways let him make his money....at the end of the day it's the customers ski. I get the break in period but that's on the owner.

[@watercraftjournal]

That’s certainly true; possibly if they offered to do it for the client would also be an option. But again, this wasn’t able the shop in the video but the need for the break-in process. We didn’t mean any ill or attack towards them.

[@MrPink-pe2mx]

@@watercraftjournal noted. Kevin I've watch you for a while now and have learned a great deal from you..I know there was no ill intent there.

[@captainawesome5560]

This video is 100% fact! I have raced highly modified engines in everything from four stroke motocross bikes, stroker motors in race quads as well as fully built Pro Am GP motors in closed course racing. DO NOT AND I MEAN DO NOT SKIP THE BREAK IN PROCESS !!!!!!! Unless you want a unreliable 8-10,000 dollar paper weight of an engine. It is only a few hours of your life. You have been warned, do not cry about it later!

[@watercraftjournal]

Thanks Capt! You're always on point!

[@captainawesome5560]

@@watercraftjournal I got your 6 boss, lead the way

[@Steven-xj2rf]

Build any cool Yamaha side by sides? What kind of power are you seeing out of them?

[@captainawesome5560]

@@Steven-xj2rf No I am a Honda guy all the way so I did do a 87 TRX250r with a full forged built 370 stroker motor that was set up for motocross racing, never dynoed it for H.P. numbers, but it would try and hurt you every time it hit the powerband, got to love two strokes, I have always loved the Yamaha banshees and might build a 4 mil stroker in that one day. Side by sides will probably be where I end up when I get older, as the saying goes “ with age get a cage” lol

[@deepdivetrading]

I thought that was kinda reckless when I watched it but it’s not my money.

[@watercraftjournal]

Yup.

[@WolfofPittSt]

I’d rather take my advice from someone who spends day in and day out working on skis like this than someone who cruises on them on the weekend.

[@watercraftjournal]

Thankfully, this has been our job for 17 years. And more importantly, it's not OUR advice, but that from BRP's mechanical engineers.

[@TimHuffine-sq3pn]

If you’re addressing this why aren’t you addressing the increased heat that is generated from MAP tuning and performance tunes in general ? You have to address it but you probably won't because of your advertisers ! You can’t say do as I say without finishing the story of the caveat of performance tunes in general.

[@mattcarter259]

The know it all on skis that has never turned a wrench

[@watercraftjournal]

That you're able to peck out a comment is impressive.

[@Dan-qk4ns]

So....you follow Seadoos 5 hour break in recommendation, but you have also said to put a catch can on asap, which voids Seadoo Warranty!?? I don't get it?

[@watercraftjournal]

Does it void their warranty? (No) And before going to the dealer, could you not take it off and return the PCV hose to the intake tube in a matter of minutes? (Yes)

[@Dan-qk4ns]

@@watercraftjournal of course it voids the warranty! You know it does, thus why it would have to be brought back to stock before you do. You are great at spreading mis information....Joe Rogan

[@Dan-qk4ns]

Unsubscribed

[@chriscooley2163]

@@Dan-qk4ns I don’t know what dealer you have but a catch can definitely won’t void warranty and they’ve done all the warranty work with no question

[@watercraftjournal]

@Dan is a troll, Chris. He's spamming our channel after Monday's video.

[@maybe5883]

Nice PSA, however the type that doesn’t have common sense won’t listen. Just don’t buy a used unit that was modded without a leak down and compression test. You’re really speaking to the second buyer, more than the first owner anxious to be the man.

[@watercraftjournal]

We're TRYING to intercede before then. We might need to do videos on leak down and compression tests!

[@jim4551]

I've always been a little overzealous but as I get older more willing to listen to those with experience. Looking forward to those videos Kevin. Should be interesting and educational as always. Tks.

[@GCJetskiFishing]

I can tell you are not an engine builder, and I think you need to be 100% sure of your knowledge before trying to educate everybody. Piston rings have NOTHING to do with keeping a piston from 'wobbling' in the bore like you state, the piston to cylinder wall clearance is what stops a piston wobbling in the bore hence why engines with forged internals with larger bore clearances are often prone to having noisy pistons or 'piston slap' present. Piston rings require break in periods as friction is created between the ring and the cylinder wall as the rings bed in, pushing full engine load into a new engine at first start up has the potential to cause excessive friction between the rings and bore, which in turn could overheat the rings causing them to lose their tension, this tension is the pressure that pushes the rings against the bore creating a seal, lack of ring tension = increase in blow by. Just how much engine run time is needed before you can safely put more load on the rings without overheating them is debatable, but modern engines often have extremely fine hone patterns on the cylinder walls, which is less at risk of causing excessive friction and overheating the rings, so you could be completely fine after just 15 mins of run time to push it harder. A manufacturer will ALWAYS be over generous with run in time to err on the side of caution. If he has done this multiple times with success and no evidence of excessive ring wear further down the track then I don't see the issue. In the performance engine building industry you will find that everyone has their own opinions on engine break in, and their recommendations will very often differ greatly from what the manufacturer state. I wanted to write this because from a technical perspective (engine building is my occupation) some of the things you are saying in this video make you look like an idiot. Sure the general public will think you know what you are talking about because they don't know any better. But I think you should stay out of this unless you are actually properly educated on the topic. Don't mean to come across harsh, just saying it like it is...

[@watercraftjournal]

I think you're focused on the wrong details here. Certainly, the "wobbling" line was hyperbolic and exaggerated for sure, but was to emphasize the role of the rings in locating and guiding the piston as it travels in the cylinder. Again, this wasn't a clinic on engine building... Rather, the over-simplified language being expressed in this video was to help a VERY novice audience to understand the differences between an iron sleeve/cylinder and a Nikasil/electroplated one, and how the piston rings seat to those cylinders, respectively. (With a direct focus on the 300 ACE engine.) The electroplated cylinders in the Rotax are nowhere near as precise as a finished ductile sleeve; even properly broken-in 300 ACE engines suffer extraordinary blow-by, and irregular compression (varying as much 15 lbs. from cylinder to cylinder). This is not conjecture. BRP engineers (via Rotax) have confirmed that properly heat cycling the engine during the prescribed 10-hour break-in is more to "finish" the surface of the cylinder than seating the rings (which as you noted is typically accomplished in the first 15-20 minutes of break-in in an iron sleeve/cylinder engine). Again, this recommendation is given with the intent of a customer wanting to rack up hundreds of operating hours, not a limited use race ski. Certainly, 10 hours is excessive, as is the minimum 5-hours that has been programmed into the ECU. Even BRP representatives joked that the prolonged break-in period was as much for the engine as it is for the rider. But the poor longevity of the electroplated cylinders is enough to strongly advocate to the widest audience possible to follow the OE recommendations.

[@salvadorponticelli]

Those against breaking-in the skis… they did their own research and know more than the engineering team that built the skis 😂 😂 Thanks Kevin… as an engineer myself I know how frustrating is to argue with people that do their own research

[@watercraftjournal]

LOL! What do those dumb mechanical engineers know, right? They only designed the engine itself!

[@Dan-qk4ns]

Then why does Kevin say that a must have for Turbo skis is a 'catch can' which voids Seadoo warranty! Getting confusing info!

[@watercraftjournal]

Because if you're going to tear off the factory supercharger and install an aftermarket turbo kit, you're kissing your warranty goodbye already, Dan. (Or is it that you don't know the difference between a supercharger and a turbo?)

[@denniswilder3014]

All mods these guys are doing is making motors run more efficeint.a motor does not care if it has more boost or its running a tad leaner or in most cases fattening up the fuel deliver.motors in this day and age has way more tighter tolerance than motors ten years ago.these motors are run at the factory so that's one heat cycle.when the dealer set the machine up its run that's 2 heat cycles.now when a guys puts his tune and so forth they start and run it on a hose to check for leaks.heat cycle 3.then when it's dropped in the lake you fast around again checking for leaks and testing it.thats heat cycle number 4.if break in was so important then the manufacturer would have to do it before a customer takes it.

[@watercraftjournal]

Unfortunately, no. Unlike Kawasaki and Yamaha, Rotax does not perform a "bench break in" prior to shipping the engines to Juarez for assembly. When the skis are assembled on the line, they are "wet tested" for leaks, but this last seconds, and no throttle is given. Dealers hardly ever "heat cycle" the engine, particularly in any manner that would load the rings enough to properly seat them - especially for Sea-Doos which require to be in water or damage the carbon seal. So this claim is also false. The KEY problem raised in this video fails to detail the single greatest issue, the quality of the nickel plating that Rotax is using in its cylinders. Nickel plating is nothing new and is a proven technique, but that's when proven brands like Nikasil are used. Rotax has its own formula of nickel plating, and it's not holding up very well. The specific formula has been tweaked since 2016 and is getting better, but still is resulting in poor seating and loose tolerances. The annual service records do not lie.

[@denniswilder3014]

@@watercraftjournal they don't use nickel they use plasma coating and the coating and cylinders none of them have hade zero flaking or peeling it fails because of other factors

[@watercraftjournal]

First, yes. It's plasma coating, not nickel. That was an error on my end (particularly as Martin Lachance just wrote me so last week.) But the coatings are CERTAINLY failing. I've got a whole file on my desktop of service reports of failed ("dropped") cylinders & pictures of failed coatings. There's threads dedicated to this exact issue on greenhulk.net as well. This is not a secret by any means.

[@denniswilder3014]

@@watercraftjournal I work at a dealership and have zero cyl issues and I have done lots and lots of tunes and mods on sea doo and ski doos the only problem is guys getting a bad batch of fuel.so I'm gonna disagree till I personally see a problem.

[@watercraftjournal]

I'm very glad to hear it, Dennis! Honestly! I think by the nature of my job, I'm sent all the bad news from everywhere. At first, I thought the images and reports I was getting were from guys poorly tuning their 300 ACE engines, and detonating the crap out of them (which is still very possible). Yet, at the same time, I received emails and PMs with reports of stock units with the same issue. Simultaneously, I got tuners and builders getting HUGE blow-by issues/full catch cans even when running >3qts. of oil. This means either poor ring seating, loose tolerances or irregular cylinders. If not a failure of the plasma coating, what do you think might be causing this? Is their another possible solution that we're not considering? -K

[@afrobryan]

Never try to teach a fool bro. Lol if they don't understand this simple process then let them take the consequences that comes with it.

[@watercraftjournal]

Appreciated! But we're not calling anybody fools - this stuff isn't common knowledge so we want to be as helpful as possible.

[@afrobryan]

@@watercraftjournal yeah you right, I take the foolish part back.

[@Steven-xj2rf]

Some channels are geared more for entertainment. I would classify the one you are mentioning into that category.

[@watercraftjournal]

But it is setting a dangerous precedent that less educated people are believing to be factual.

[@Steven-xj2rf]

@@watercraftjournal I know. It is like watching CNN. They seem to be more of a performance shop than a race shop from what I have seen. There certainly is a difference.

[@Futurase1]

@@watercraftjournal I watch the channel in question as I think we are talking about. I saw the video. Anyone who buys a brand new $20,000 ski and sends to be modded to death I mean it is what it is. If it blows in first 5 hours I mean come on it is the price to play. Reliability goes out window with every MPH you go faster. We all know it. I mean folks should know it. When they change the SC wheel, add a tune that may or may not be lean, change out the valve springs, cam and everything but the foam on the deck it is just a toy. They will ride it 10% gas in it. No seat, no deck, they will sit on engine and duck to get out of airflow. I mean doesn’t everyone ride like that? 🤣

[@Steven-xj2rf]

@@Futurase1 You seriously missed the point. The point is break it in for best results.

[@Futurase1]

@@Steven-xj2rf no, my point was 100% about no break in.

[@Threefiddyz]

some people have more money than brains. they blow it up and will just put a new engine in it. seriously doubt the owner cares. shrug

[@watercraftjournal]

Doubt he knows, but rather trusts the shop's judgement.

[@jetskijunkies4660]

I think Hyundai needs to learn how to build good engines because they are all garbage and blow by oil past the rings.

[@watercraftjournal]

We hadn't heard about Hyundai having such problems.

[@JLK8339]

Step back from the ledge man, it’s only a hobby.

[@watercraftjournal]

Folks are pouring a lot of money into this hobby; it’s important that they have the correct information.

[@johnnytimiraos6570]

Instead of cracking down on a small business that is growing your answer should’ve been hey guys you can modify your skis but try not to run them hard for the first 10 hours but it’s none of your business to say anything like you said in your video And I know for a fact that no one in seadoo even those who the hell you are Mr. breaking professional engine man

[@watercraftjournal]

Sorry to disprove your claim, Johnny but I'm in regular contact with the head engineer and the head product developer of Sea-Doo, the Global Brand Manager, and all of the media relations. And at NO time did I attack or even mention by name the business, the owner or even the channel by name. Nor did I denigrate him or his business in any form. I carefully chose my words and was respectful enough to not call anybody names or question their character. The only thing I addressed was the mechanical need for proper and complete heat cycling of the 300 ACE engines. Go through my video and tell me when I did anything you claim. -K

[@johnnytimiraos6570]

Look man you are a guy trying to become famous on other people what do you have 18,000 subscribers in like what eight years you do three minute videos that most of them are a waste of time you should look at your videos the way you ride a ski you really do look like a clown you don’t even know how to ride a ski properly but then you wanna come crack on on a good business that is great for the industry that business has build two of my skis and I’m talking lots of money not just a little built turbos at all you could’ve handled this completely different like I said you could’ve said hey people you can modify your skis before 10 hours but recommend try to take it easy with them for they break in properly and of course you had to go out there and see a bunch of people called you from the industry which I know and everybody else knows that’s a lie because I’ve heard lots from the people in the industry that are laughing at you so how does it feel for someone to come crack on you right now grow up and be respectful to the other businesses that are being respectful out there and I’m talking all of them in the industry

[@watercraftjournal]

Johnny, this KZbin channel is a fraction of the total income generated by The Watercraft Journal. If you think our video was about eliciting views or subscribers rather than helping people new to PWC ownership, then you're clearly diluted. I'm sorry that you (and so many others) had such an emotional reaction to us advocating the proper break-in process as prescribed by BRP's mechanical engineers. This isn't about one man's shop or another KZbin channel, it's about helping our viewers. -K

[@supergwizzo]

Thats B S . If u mod out brand new no issues.. Even some hours not problem ! Im Race Engine Builder .. Hagamans racing engines toms river nj.. And Also top street racer 4 yrs

[@watercraftjournal]

Sadly the cylinder coatings aren’t as durable as Nikasil and many of these skis drop compression within a few hours of operation.