NEWS - The Gods of Law ARE BACK And Worshiped In TILEA?! - Warhammer Fantasy / Total War Warhammer

LONG LOST Gods in Warhammer Fantasy are back and it seems one of them it worshipped as a sort of major deity in Tilea! Let's discuss this HUGE lore and what it could mean in the future!
NEWS - The Gods of Law ARE BACK And Worshiped In TILEA?! - Warhammer Fantasy / Total War Warhammer
#totalwar #warhammer3 #wfrp
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[@TheGreatBookofGrudges]

This is BIG news. Why? Cos WFRP has kept Warhammer Fantasy alive over the years and it's very likely these new lore changes will be seen in Old World AND Warhammer 3 should for example Tilea be made into a DLC which we are expecting.

[@TheGoodLuc]

That is awesome. Did they appear just about 1st edition?

[@christiandauz3742]

And yet they never intervened when Diedrick Kastner (Archaon) begged the gods to save him from his fate Probably fictional or very weak 'gods' compared to the 5 Major Chaos Gods of AoS

[@doomedrpgproject4473]

@@TheGoodLuc There were in the 1st edition of WFRP for sure. I don't know about WFB. My own head canon when GMing was that the Gods of Law and the Renegade Chaos Gods were the same thing under different names.

[@stefvanroey8191]

About the Order of Light and Law losing face due to the Mardragg: these events are covered in the second Brunner the bounty hunter book. The only black library book featuring Solkan as far as i know. But it is, in fact, not new lore.

[@HolyLionProphet]

I smile when I see the gods of law. The gods of law in reality is a angels. Since it is not affected by the “growth law” at the same level, they are little boys like “10 Creators” and the Twins Jehovah self. As written in the Bible, the first intelligent life was created in the image of the Jehovah. Adam is a boy, So Jehovah is a boy too. Sorry to break the hearts of feminists, no god is female. BUT TRUTH IS THIS.

[@dobrycreeper]

I hope that GW will actualy use Tilea in the old world

[@TheNorth15]

Southern Realms/Dogs of War baby!

[@liambridgeman4529]

Dow is already there I’m hoping for tilea and estalia

[@JanKowalski-kw5iy]

So basically: Solkan is anti-Khorne Alluminas is anti-Nurgle Astasis/Arianka is anti-Slaanesh Daora is anti-Tzeentch The Craft Deity is anti-Horned Rat at least that's my take on it.

[@Rukdug]

While the only certain details we have so far are about Solkan, it definitely looks like that's going to be the case.

[@ShadowWolfRising]

Who's Anti-Hashut, Anti-Malal, Anti-Necoho, and Anti-Zavussin?

[@stefvanroey8191]

Thats now part ofmy headcanon for sure

[@miningapple1058]

Alluminus is just a large jug of bleach

[@chiefmasterofdeepwarrens3208]

@@ShadowWolfRising None of those are canon, except Hashut

[@AzureDragon100]

Wears a golden mask Balthazar Gelt is Solkan's avatar confirmed. Also, sun worship, mask. Aurelian, is that you?

[@abmong]

What I need is Aluminas being worshipped in Araby as a new rising cult under the Prophet of Law. There were hints of that back in old lore, but GW never expanded on it. It would refresh and make the beliefs of Araby more varied. You have the folk faith of the commoners involving worshipping Djinns and possibily worship of an One Old by the established elites vs the new cult of Law bent on converting everyone.

[@frankk9152]

I think Solkan wearing a golden mask is a reference to one of his inquisitors in the Brunner the Bounty Hunter books

[@h3adban60r]

the summoned demon in Remas is from the books too if I'm remembering them right

[@stefvanroey8191]

@@h3adban60r correct

[@knivesmcdougal6496]

“Where Walks the Mardag”

[@RedOblivion7]

The Crusader look could still work if he looked like Baldwin IV, the Leper King of Jerusalem. Baldwin wore a metal mask to hide his condition, it should not be difficult to translate that into a Solkanite look.

[@johnthecrazedsskull81]

It seems like the Unknown Crafter might be Malice's counter, like if the Law Gods want everything to stop, then the Crafter might want to make things that might break the Order.

[@efaristi9737]

Like a anti-order order god?

[@johnthecrazedsskull81]

​@@efaristi9737 I mean the Crafter could want everything to work like one of those penny arcade machines, just automatons performing endless routines within endless cycles. Which is Order, but also chaotic to watchers.

[@adamdouglas21]

Daemons of Order? I hope so!!!

[@ObiadStudio]

In my 3 years old campaign of Warhammer I play as priest of Arianka. I made own spells and faith rules for her, and convince GM to go with serching of The Keys. The fact that she's canon now brings actuall tears to my eyes. Thank you GW. Thank you so much!

[@mrhelzbygrad7485]

I still can't get over how much better the realm of chaos campaign would have been had it been a quest to free/save consume Arianka rather than Ursun

[@foff3804]

Go touch grass

[@harsteu]

Before becoming the god of knowledge, Do you think Dora was an explorer of the unknown ?

[@harryellis910]

Wait! Your telling me that the Warhammer Italian/Romans have a Parthian of Order Gods who’s head is Sol and their symbol is a sun!! And the grade temple is in Remmas!!! Praise the sun and Sol Invictus!!!!!

[@harryellis910]

If their in the old world I will buy sooooooooo many of them

[@Taranchule]

Wait a minute: "Only a Cold-Blooded, Reptillian intelliegence could understand their complexity". ...are the Law Gods the Old Ones now?

[@TheGreatBookofGrudges]

Keep in mind theWFRP books are written by the perspective of an Imperial so it's merely a theory :)

[@Tulkash01]

It's what they are hinting at, clearly. But the Old Ones are Warhammer ultimate mystery (both Fantasy and 40K) so it will stay as a hint. Perhaps Solkan can be a humanisation of Sotek...

[@reiteration6273]

Re: 8:40 If the Gods of Law are actually being brought back as an antithesis of the Chaos Gods, I think describing them as just different types of Chaos God is the wrong way to go about it, since Chaos is clearly not their shtick. However, the Chaos Gods are also known as the Dark Gods and the Ruinous Powers, and those I think would be much better ways of categorising very extreme deities of Law, while still allowing them to be distinct from Chaos. The basic idea would be: "All Chaos Gods are Ruinous Powers, but not all Ruinous Powers are Chaos Gods." To look at it in D&D terms, the Chaos Gods would be Chaotic Evil, while the Law Gods would be Lawful Evil. Both every bit as Evil as one another, but one set being anarchic whilst the others would be despotic. Or, I suppose, there's the option of just making the Gods of Law be Old Ones, like the History part suggests.

[@ashendant1317]

In AoS Dark Gods is a term specific to the 5 ruling gods of Chaos, a inner circle that's also a Pantheon. Brothers in Darkness is a term reserved for the 4 core Chaos Gods, implying they are actually siblings.

[@reiteration6273]

@@ashendant1317 Maybe not "Dark Gods" then... which now that I think about it, probably isn't the best name for a group that includes Alluminas anyway. But Ruinous Powers is definitely a terms used to describe the Chaos Gods in both AoS & WHFB (are probably 40k too, but I'm not as familiar with its lore), and one that I can easily imagine working as a catch-all term for a variety of evil gods, whether chaotic or lawful.

[@ashendant1317]

@@reiteration6273 No, what I mean is that Dark Gods is the name of the inner pantheon of Chaos, sometimes called the Pantheon of the Dark Gods. It includes; Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle and Slaanesh, and in AoS the GHR. Not sure how the Twins of Slaanesh qualify in it, through.

[@reiteration6273]

@@ashendant1317 Yeah, I got that.

[@stewburt5089]

I think they're only described as Chaos God's because they're born from The Warp/Realm of Chaos. In the old cannon all gods come from the Realm of Chaos so they're all technically the same. I think it's better to describe them as primordial gods though, divided into Law and Chaos. One born of ideals and the other from emotions. That's how I explain it in my head anyway.

[@stephenlucas8836]

at first ist confusing why balthasar gelt became the elector count of soland in tww2 but now this came out It makes perfect sense why the Gold masked Supreme Patriarch of burning gold became the leader of Solkan worshipers.

[@ziomekszary647]

Sooooo Balthazar Gelt is the embodiment of Solkan?

[@Dr_Doomer]

lol, I thought the same thing

[@samuelansin8307]

I was wondering if there was a reason CA brought Solland back and put Gelt in it.

[@mrhelzbygrad7485]

Cubicle seven fixing CAs lore hole

[@memesofwarhemmer7076]

@@samuelansin8307 Baltazar is now a representation of a god 😝 how can sigmar even compete now

[@Schniedragon88]

H E I S S U P R E M E

[@andrewjones4568]

The Shattered Amulet is a reference to the main quest that came with the base game of Advanced Heroquest which was an awesome game if you can ever get hold of a copy. Skaven were the main antagonists in that quest. I won’t spoil what happens when all pieces of the amulet are put together as that was a really cool twist if you ever play the game in the future.

[@danielmcelwain6841]

So could Solkan be Ptra?

[@stewburt5089]

I wonder how this is going to effect the release of The Old World. Seems to me the only reason to bring back the old gods of law is to bring the faction system in line with Age of Sigmar. Solkans symbol is exactly the same as the Grand Alliance of Order.

[@mistformsquirrel]

Intriguing... this is lore so old it's actually from before my first journey into WHFB (which was in... 6th edition? I think? when I collected) - I actually don't think I'd even *heard* of the Gods of Law until now. It makes sense they'd exist though on some level.

[@SuperRedarmy123]

holy chaos god this is awesome god of law are canon again and arianka as well this surprises times

[@krispinidan1478]

I hope the best for your mother and brother it's very nice from you to keep updating us with your limited time for your self god bless you.

[@cmanmonkeydog]

The Mardadg used to be known as the elemental of death but got turned into a unique demon of khorne

[@KnightInFlames1]

incredible, i hope all this manifests soon rather than later, cant wait to see more of the old world fleshed out :)

[@MaschenkoAN]

I really like what Cubicle7 doing with wfrp4e, I'm waiting for Bretonian and Kislevate books to release

[@Playaplaya18]

Love the lore, can't wait for some follow ups! Thanks Nathan!

[@herbertvonbismarck8303]

My prediction for the southern realms dlc is that it’s going to be mainly focused on rescuing Arianka.

[@ludwiklesniewski7592]

I would like to see Tilea army (in Old World) big block of pikes, supporting infantry and heavy cavalery but with aesthetics like this: a fusion of renaissance Italy and ancient Greeks city states and Romans + some kind of crazy clockwork/steampunk stuff like inventions of Leonardo da Vinci (new steamtank?), Archmides (solar/ laser mirror?) or mythical Daedalus (some kind of steam glinder?).

[@lordmalkus3322]

This is a great milestone for the preservation of Warhammers history. The Pantheon of Law be it of Chaos or their own design adds much flavor to the aspects of the world and beyond which are not in the spotlight of major events for the most part. A big win for every party involved here.

[@MinscFromBaldursGate92]

It's a big Michael Moorcock ripoff though.

[@Vernon013]

This is pretty cool. Don't get me wrong, I like AOS but I LOVE WH Fantasy and wish they would make the two overlap more in AOS.

[@goransekulic3671]

I don't wish for them to overlap at all except for AoS being an afterlife or something like it.

[@DandySlayer13]

@@goransekulic3671 more like an afterthought.

[@Janembu]

I bet you went hype when you first saw this lol

[@specimenlarry6068]

Itd be cool if the southern realms had a focus on technology and science.

[@goransekulic3671]

SUPER EXCITING! The more of oldhammer we get, the better WHFB gets! Not to mention all the Estalia / Tilea callbacks. I hope for more details on the Border Princes. Yeah, I am so purchasing Cubicle's lorebooks! It's winter, let's start with, oh idk, Middenheim? Big

[@ShadowWolfRising]

I hope we just add more unhinged Border Prince Factions. Imagine a Norse Dwarf Border Prince.

[@JustFun-wl3jf]

As a german i agree, Geheimnisnacht is spelled different

[@JZ0UK]

The Mardagg was in the Brunner books...

[@LordBriareos]

This really gives me hope for a DoW race pack for TWW3.

[@miningapple1058]

I’ve always wondered what the laws equivalent of the daemons would be would be cool to see angels or something like that start popping up as a problem in the lore. Since the rise in popularity of the “biblically accurate” angels in media there’s a lot of cool ideas to pull from.

[@balin1920]

Back in the 1980s the southern wasted were law Wastes, frozen crystalline lands, the opposite of the chaos Wastes in the north. I'm looking for the source but I definitely remember the mention.

[@Tulkash01]

A few more notes: -IIRC correctly the whole affair with Morsdag the demon is developed in the "Brunner The Bounty Hunter" books from BL (I can't remember which one), and yes solkanites are in that book an no, they are not very friendly (especially with the followers of Morr...). -The quest for Solkan's shattered amulet is the base campaign for Advanced Heroquest (which includes it as a game prompt) only that, back in that campaign the creature that shattered it was a Vermin Lord not a Khornate demon. -Back in the day Solkan's weapon of choice was the scythe -Myrmidia's birtplace is contested between Estalia and Tilea and unlike tileans, estalians never had proper miniatures in WHFB (but they had Estalian Bravos as a career in WHFRP 2nd ed)

[@ukaszflis828]

If the Gods of Law are back, let's then hope, that Malal will be back in the future.

[@SuperRedarmy123]

no malal still in hand comic book copyright so still no malal only still existed arianka

[@theoverlord9944]

@@SuperRedarmy123 eh he could come back if gw decides to buy him back from wagner and grant or just bring in malice and use that it is not that hard and since old world is coming out at the rate of a crippled tortoise gw has all sorts of time to decide that is if they ever do consider bringing him back.

[@Mathurian]

Solkan is one of my favorites!

[@SolusLupi]

Hmmm, so five major Gods of law yet four major gods of chaos? A direct callback to Malal as well... seems a little suspect just a bit not like the numbers should balance or anything right?

[@TsunamiWombat]

Unfortunately GW literally does not own Malal, any possible references to him are incidental.

[@samuelansin8307]

Could be horned rat as the 5th God as they are in AoS.

[@TsunamiWombat]

@@samuelansin8307 that was part of GW's brief and now aborted push to replace Slaanesh, Slaanesh is back now and TGHR got put back to the kiddie table

[@samuelansin8307]

@@TsunamiWombat I haven't heard that The Great Horned Rat is getting downgraded. Last I heard Slaneesh is still trapped but did gain some power from Morathi's ritual. Then again I am not following AoS's lore that closely unless it involves the skyprirate dwarfs.

[@MrSkabrus]

Could be that Astasis is shen zoo or the inmortal sun of Nippon?

[@richardburke8566]

Well when you nik your basic mythology from one that has a law/chaos you're going to end up with bits creeping back in.

[@MinscFromBaldursGate92]

The Law vs Chaos thing comes from Michael Moorcock's Eternal Champion stories.

[@thoughtheglass]

DORA THE EXPLORA IS CANNON!

[@zodrickzheioh7318]

From listening to you reading this stuff about Solken really makes him out to sort of be one of the old ones. There's all that stuff about the Old Ones organizing the solar system, and the stuff about them being unfathomable to mortals. Really sounds like a mortal interpretation of the Old Ones.

[@TsunamiWombat]

Well Gods like Solkan were always worshipped in Tilea and Estalia, technically they never vanished. But I get what you mean, this is re-comfirmation of what was essentially dead end material. That being said, keep in mind that Old World Lore is essentially a cul de sac, GW has made it very clear they'll pick and choose whatever sort of continuity they want, and until The Old World (which is going to be a specialist game anyway) it's also a mute point for a "dead" setting. It would definitely be nice to see more of Solkan and Illuminas, and the general disconnect of The Old World means it's a potential experimentation space where they can play around with idea's without affected Daddy's Cash Cow or it's Space Marine milk.

[@childoftheeternalsky2382]

Please give us south realms CA, pleaseeeeee

[@jiado6893]

I love the concession that Solkan has only been able to persist as a figure to humanity because his domain allows for a greater amount of nastier human emotions. That’s something I’ve always enjoyed about how GW describes the different gods: their ‘marketability’ in different human countries and spheres of influence.

[@fumarc4501]

When Chaos rises, Order rises with it in opposition.

[@silverseer573]

It's such a joy to hear the joy in your voice. :)

[@JClif]

I would like to see more videos like this explaining the lore. I appreciate your work.

[@HolyLionProphet]

I smile when I see the gods of law. The gods of law in reality is a angels. Since it is not affected by the “growth law” at the same level, they are little boys like “Creators” and the Lord himself.

[@RawCauliflower]

Anything else interesting from that book?

[@Tulkash01]

Great news but the bounty Hunter trilogy from Black library already had SOLKAN back as a deity worshipped in Tilea although he was never referred at as a God of Law. And if you care for obscure trivia… in the backstory for Advanced Heroquest an avatar of SOLKAN defeated a Vermin Lord in Remas… which is a city in Tilea (basically Rome)

[@MinscFromBaldursGate92]

FOR LAAAAW!

[@TAB_100]

LegendofTotalWar made a video for a petition about total war warhammer 3 I think it would be a very good idea to make a video about it it might help

[@kahaterein7084]

Amazing news 😁

[@user-ww1vl8jg8h]

Demons of Order in tw warhammer 3

[@gregoryshinn9805]

Thanks for the video

[@brettyeager3406]

God I hope dogs of war are playable in old world I have 5000 plus points worth of them collecting dust

[@mrhelzbygrad7485]

Man I really wish they had made Solkan have the cult based in Estalia, it would have made sense for an Estalian inquisition and added flavour. Tilea to me in lore doesn't seem like the right culture for this kind of deity.

[@efaristi9737]

But if Tzeentch truly imprisoned Arianka, why did he imprisoned her in the material world instead of the chaos realms? It's literally taking the risk that some mortals will free her. Isn't Myrmidia the patron deity of Tilea? Seeking thoses gods of Order is a very bad idea. Absolute order is no better than absolute chaos. I think Daora being a ancient aspect of Verena mean that the goddess, or some parts of her, actually adapted to modern human society and/or the material world and lose her most extremes traits.

[@codyraugh6599]

From a marketing and writing standpoint it makes sense to revive the gods of law as a "secondary" force in the Old World. GW still wants to copyright with full force but they also should have learned their lessons from the terrible show that that early AoS. That they can't just copy paste other people's IP with a new name and think fans will blindly accept it. AoS did rake in new fans but even now well idk it sorf of feels hollow in a way, particularly since they're still trying to shoehorn Warhammer into AoS and their just so different. BUT assuming Old World is a actual effort and they hope to use it as a springboard should it succeed. Then they'll need things to set each fantasy culture further apart from their historical roots in a way GW can copyright and use to take the story a unique way. So we have Sigmar in the Empire and the pantheon up there, but in Tilea and Estalia? We have litterally A Goddess whose "unique" adding the Gods of Law gives us a chance to take these cultures a more unique route, eplore the seldom touched "not-roman empire" of ages past before Sigmar and allow for mythical and distinctive creations to set each of the human kingdoms further apart from one another. Because also mind this has to compete with WH40K which has Tau, like 4 (technically 6) flavors of eldar, Neceon, Nids, Genestealers, and all the more inhuman stuff that even humans seem inhuman compared to the baseline, where the historical game roots of WHFB meant that the initial attempts at humans were sort of samey. (Which I as a Strategy guy don't mind, just don't dumb down the game to squad tactics if i wanted squad tactics I'd play Republic Commando, or a more dumbed down less model intensive game) But if they can make each "southern realms" kingdom, Cathay, etcetera all seem like they'd have a expansive and unique roster, that will get sales.

[@ShadowWolfRising]

'Arianaka' ....... Malal?

[@jasonsantos3037]

Sound like the cult for this specific God or more fanatic than Sigma.

[@marcus3457]

This does sound really cool, but also very cramped. What is everyone's opinion on stretching the map in some places instead of expanding it? Don't get me wrong, I want to see us go all the way to Nippon, and get everything. But in the meantime perhaps enlarging some of the already existing areas also feels like it makes sense to me. Agree? Disagree? Thoughts? All are appreciated.

[@danmorris5498]

Solkan demons when? 😂

[@Pandarian300]

wait is it a new book published by GW ?

[@samuelansin8307]

It was made for the TT Rpg that cubicle-7 produces. But they have to get GW's approval so it was signed off by them.

[@joewilliams3006]

Probs not correct video to comment on but its a new one to do with warhammer 3, but does anyone know of a mod to fix vampire counts lord skill children of the night? as in be able to gain plus 1 vampire hero, as they were my favourite faction in warhammer 2 but now they nerfed the playstyles i enjoyed the most with them and looking at them i need level 4 or 5 to increase hero caps so would need a ridiculous amount of capitals to have anywhere near a decent amount of heros, and no necromancers dont cut it, they cant fight an also cant be used for useful hero actions

[@HH-hd7nd]

What has always bothered me is that Chaos in Warhammer lore has always been depicted as destructive and the bad guys. The so-called Chaos Gods are even called the ruinous powers. That is not Chaos. That is not even a good representation of Evil (evil isn't necessarily destructive, it is just uncaring). Chaos means unpredictability and change and randomness. This can mean evil and destruction, however it also includes everything good, randomly changing from one to the other in just a moment after an unspecified amount of time. The so-called Chaos Gods are anything but chaotic. They are extremely static, with agendas that never change. That is in fact a representation of Order, not Chaos! Why is something that represents a static order called Chaos? Connecting Order and purity is also problematic because Order has not necessarily to do with purity all tat much - it just means a strict order of things and no change. As mentioned above - Khorne with his neverending, neverchanging agenda of collecting skulls is a representation of Order. What purity does he stand for? The Purity of Bloodshed? Anyway, about bringing these other gods of order back - that's a good thing because it fleshes out the world and lore of warhammer.

[@willferrous8677]

Dogs of War confirmed!

[@dragonseer6667]

In all fairness it kind of sounds like you're saying Gods of Lore with a british accent XD

[@GreasusGoldtooth]

PRAISE BE TO SOLKAN. HE HAS NO MERCY, ONLY JUSTICE.

[@MinscFromBaldursGate92]

Michael Moorcock wants to know your location.

[@zypoquiz1444]

Solkan another name The God Emperor

[@TheGoodLuc]

Yes, there are similarities.

[@shadeblackwolf1508]

Now, does this sound like a fun dlc, with humans morally alligned closer to dwarfkind

[@CommanderBohn]

Quick! Somebody wake up Arianka and tell her she's not non-canon anymore.

[@TheAtlasReview]

Seagull

[@mnk9073]

C'tan? C'tan.