Nintendo's Plan To Ban Palworld Has Begun

[@wolfythyalphapiratewolf2015]

Honestly, I think patenting game mechanics should be illegal. For the very reason that it prevents competition. Also it prevents growth.

[@noxinabox3506]

Agreed. It's a corrupt system that only benefits those on top. No wonder we get the exact same games coming out every year, companies are afraid to make anything "new" because nothing is "new", every good game system is already owned by someone and they will sue your ass for it.

[@1020shaf]

I’m slowly working towards my goal of developing my first indie game. Game mechanic patents really make me think about how the many ideas that I’ve thought of and plan to implement may actually bite me in the ass. It hinders creativity, and I don’t like it.

[@SyphistPrime]

Anything in the realm of software needs to be excluded from patents. Ideally, the idea of patents as a whole should be abolished.

[@immortal_shrooms6757]

Patenting mechanics is like patenting actions, it's so stupid

[@soep19]

​@@SyphistPrimei have mixed feelings about that since patents are the only thing preventing ideas that you worked hard for to be stolen and be mass-produced by another party without you getting a single cent. On the other hand, the idea of the patent itself is stupid because some important inventions can be monopolized even though it's super important to everyone. For example, insulins and stuff. I'm maybe wrong tho, so feel free to correct me.

[@tonydak8573]

Gate keeping the Nemesis System should be an absolute crime.

[@troydenbrum2979]

​@@tonydak8573 7th saga had it before pokemom

[@RegalPixelKing]

@@troydenbrum2979 I think it needs to happen in real-time. So it is not just "throwing an object to catch a creature" it need to be something you do in real time in an open field or in the GTA5 mod's case, an open city.

[@troydenbrum2979]

@RegalPixelKing that has nothing to do with the nemesis system

[@ToyokaX]

If I'm to understand the Nemesis System correctly, I think Grim Dawn even had this system before SoM. The mechanic being; if your negative reputation with a faction is high enough, a special elite monster from that faction has a chance to spawn somewhere in the world [they also literally called it a "nemesis", funnily enough].

[@iaqh]

That would be like if the movie industry started copyrighting scenes, oh we had a scene when he was in a trailer in the desert so nobody else can make a scene similar.

[@gromtar]

If i remenber correct, Gohstbusters had that "throw something at a monster and catch it" first quite a few years before Pokemon existed.

[@nobbyfirefly57]

Fisherman did this much earlier with nets and fish.

[@kabob0077]

I wonder if that can be used in this case...

[@Steve-of1kb]

“Yes! But that’s a cuboid not a sphere” Nintendo lawyers probably ;)

[@HiUnidentified]

@@Steve-of1kb which makes it even funnier because palworlds system with a cuboid is quite literally what world of final fantasy has, a very pokemon-like take on the franchise... didnt see a lawsuit with SQEX. nintendos selective outrage is funny.

[@frankmckenneth9254]

Hunter gatherers have been trapping animals in fields for millennia, are they going to patent that too?

[@kaelanirevyruun1676]

lol the mount travel patent... Nintendo: "We're patenting the ability to travel around a game world on the back of a creature" Square Enix: "Yeah, about that..."

[@exc4l1bur2]

iirc their patents are about the catching/riding mechanics in a 3d space, so ff2 wouldnt count. however wow had mounts long before arceus...

[@josephbarnes699]

@@exc4l1bur2 I was thinking WoW as well as another modded game that could be used for the whole catching in a 3d open world, Pixelmon. Started development waaaaaaay before either of these two made their game, they do get paid for the mod via donations, etc and so forth. @kaelanirevyruun1676 The fact is there's a loooooong list of games that have similar mechanics to arceus in part or in whole that (not a lawyer to be clear) it might be an idea to argue that catching a creature in a ball or ball like object or having them mountable is not unique enough to warrant a distinct patent. There have been enough cases in the past that have been won by proving that the suing corpo didn't create a unique idea and multiple creatives came to the same conclusion that the corpo did.

[@hirukaru4835]

@exc4l1bur2 so did Lineage 2, Guildwars 2, and many many other games. Nintendo and pokemon company should be boycotted. But pokemon fanboys will never do that.

[@darmocat]

The problem with Nintendo's "it was based on Arceus" claim is that PocketPair first introduced this in Craftopia, a game that released TWO YEARS before Legends of Arceus

[@Ailidan]

The Problem of Nintendo is that in Japan patents not working and they can copy anything... but they want to stop copying evryone else

[@PestilentAllosaurus]

@@darmocat As well as Ark's cryopods back when it was a mod!

[@evilbackward999]

@PestilentAllosaurus arks cryoballs have never been a percentage based capture device, nor has it been tied into taming mechanics in any way. It's always been purely a storage device. It would be a, still in accurate, but closer comparison to the pc or palbox than a pokeball.

[@PestilentAllosaurus]

@evilbackward999 But Nintendo is still claiming that- throwing an object at a target in the field and causing an affect. They also claim a patent on storing creatures too- just it's not one of the three patents they're going after PalWorld for. :/ Seriously, their patent is so vague it's just deplorable. I thought it was just a aggressive/battle affecr but after rereading the patent it's much more vauge than that.

[@quodgenusdracolupusrex4337]

Cough Cough Cough, Digimon world 2 done it earlier so is rest of creature capture games. Sorry must been a bad cough, Nintendo.

[@johndorian2670]

I'm still SOOO ANGRY about the nemesis system patent. That's such a good game mechanic that they've fucking squandered and done nothing with, and now no one else can either. There really needs to be a clause that failing to actually use your patents results in forfeiting them. Fuck Warner Bros.

[@kabob0077]

@@johndorian2670 Take it up with a representative or congressman, it's high time we started acting...

[@Prisinence]

I feel like game mechanics in general shouldn't be able to be patented. From my understanding, they were only patented in the first place to prevent those outside of the gaming industry from patenting them and going after game devs (please correct me if I'm wrong). By allowing parents for them, it limits creativity for other devs and results in issues like this; Nintendo bullying their competition because they can. This whole situation will scare those developing their own monster collection games, and I'm sure that's what Nintendo wants.

[@pich7091]

"it's my patent to sit on and do nothing with." -WB probably

[@zombieeightpack1381]

Look on the bright side: WB is dying financially and will hopefully have to sell several of it’s products to keep afloat…Or, they’ll just do another stupid merger to stay alive like they did with HBO Max. Still, a man can dream.

[@coolphoton1234]

@Misha-p5f The thing with that is that a patent like that doesn't need to actually be infringed on. All it needs to be is close enogh for WB to sue. At that point, unless you are Nintendo or Bethesda ect, you have to settle and/or take your game down because you can't afford to fight it even if you are clearly in the right.

[@psully212]

First, thats not what the patent reads. It reads player throws an object at a creature and its “affected” which is the most vague interpretation of a mechanic ever and that patent need to be thrown out.

[@ferinzz]

Yup. I spent some time reading it is vague through and through. Even the mounting mechanic is generic af.

[@solidmoon8266]

Ya, there's a bunch of companies with these absolutely vague, too generic to be unique, nonsensical patents, even ones that they haven't even made a functioning protoype for the patent.

[@EnderElohim]

being able to pattern game mechanics need to abolished like we did with slavery and if just America or Europe anyplace do it that place can have prospering game development. For example if America abolish game mechanics from patterned more game developers gonna be us based and others cant do shit about it and that mean more tax to America :D

[@gamercatmatt6948]

So if I throw a rock at a wild creature in a survival game and it takes damage/runs away, this is infringing on the patent? Have fun battling that one Nintendo.

[@arkorat3239]

like, is a rock that stuns, in breach of their patent?

[@manticoredog2501]

Nintendo, instead of just making Pokemon better to compete with Palworld, does this. Great. Just great.

[@sgunzz8820]

Lmaoo Honestly 🤣🤣

[@jamesschultz2039]

I wonder, what kind of competition could there be between Palworld and Pokemon? These are two fundamentally different games, even if there are some similarities between them. Palworld is a survival game. Pokemon is a JRPG.

[@MysticTheUnicorn]

This isn’t about IPs, or patents. Nintendo is just scared of competition because Pokèmon hasn’t had a good game in ages. Plain and simple.

[@D3adCl0wn]

It's not even about games anymore, it's the entire IP in general. Palworld is expanding similar to The Pokemon Company.

[@ChrisBacon-l7z]

and new generation gamers will most likely choose palworld instead of pokemons boring gameplay

[@ravenspurplebeats5412]

fact pocket pair can do better game then modern pokemon game sales says alot and wakeup call for game freak.

[@soep19]

The thing is, Nintendo could always just try to produce better games since people already love Pokemon in the first place. They're basically throwing rocks at other people's houses while their house burning down

[@haydentravis3348]

@@ChrisBacon-l7z And nintendos outright hostility. Nobody wants to deal with that kinda threat.

[@spamuel98]

Ark: Survival Evolved had that "throw a ball to catch a creature" mechanic when it released back in 2013. It even had the mechanic locked behind a tech tree, a tech tree virtually identical to Palworld's.

[@Drengr770]

@spamuel98 i 100% said it in the beginning, this game has no similarities to pokemon apart from monster design. This game is like a rebranded Ark

[@evilbackward999]

Ark has never had throw a ball and catch a creature mechanic. Cryoballs only work on creatures you already tamed, and are only thrown when releasing a dino, not when storing one.

[@Drengr770]

@evilbackward999 the best things about patents are they are explicitly specific, in this case the "throwing a device to capture a creature without battling." There is no implied or interpretation with the patent. Therefore Ark's cryopods fall under this category as you can indeed "throw a device to capture a creature without battling" in a 3d setting.

[@HailFyra]

You also have to consider the fact that like Nintendo, Pocketpair is a Japanese company in which they take their properties and copyright laws much more serious.

[@evilbackward999]

@Drengr770 the only throw animation for the cryoball is when your releasing a creature, you can't throw it to capture a creature. So that wouldn't apply.

[@thegoatarmy6699]

Nintendo: WE NEED TO BAN PALWORLD!!! Meanwhile, Pocketpair: We have a Terraria collaboration now!

[@danielsolyarikov7908]

Watch out, Nintendo: Pocketpair got the power of *IMPENDING DOOM* and master bait on their side now

[@D3adCl0wn]

What's funny about that collaboration, is that if Terraria gets Palworld assets such as Pals in the game, we would technically have Pals present on the Switch!

[@sevenember3332]

“AND we’re working on a massive update to our game!”

[@SuperFlashDriver]

Oh, and uh Nintendo, I hate to say this, but Pocketpair also has Sony, Microsoft, and PC/Steam on their side....What are you going to do Nintendo??? You either need to step up or stand back...Just saying.

[@fientjuhhwowsl4610]

also meanwhile sony : lets brings it to ps5 now 😂

[@GiantMushrooms]

Pocketpair needs to relocate to the USA in order to escape the patent troll known as Nintendon't. Their patent laws hold no sway here and their patents themselves would not be allowed legally in the US.

[@MercuryA2000]

I wonder if that's something they would be able to do. Both legally (since this suit has already happened) and practically. Moving your entire team to a country where most of them probably don't speak the language is a huge task. Even if they don't need to bring everyone, they'd need to bring a decent amount of them at the very least.

[@1KiloDepartment]

I wanna reinforce this, as even the infamous Nemesis System patent is so specific that you basically have to copy it by name too to infringe on it! The reason why, is that when WB tried to patent it before, it was too loosely defined that the US Patent and Trademark Office didn't accept it until it became so specific. (unfortunately all of this has flown under the radar on the internet, so hopefully this bring some awareness to it!)

[@shinyrayquaza9]

@@MercuryA2000 They are pretty much owned by Sony now so I doubt they could, heck this whole fiasco was an attack on Sony

[@XY-mc6zj]

It won't so anything

[@AdamBladeTaylor]

I mean, countless company "in the US" get around most laws by buying some rundown shack in Norway and claiming that's their "corporate headquarters".

[@christmasspiritakagatekeep2308]

IDK if its mentioned later but, Pokemon Arceus came out two years after Craftopia, made by pocketpair, which had similar catching mechanics to palworld. Craftopia also released a year before their initial patents.

[@j.blocher9081]

Also, Craftopia was released in early access in 2020, so you can go back months or year earlier than Arceus if your talking design.

[@IOverlord]

Of course it's a billion dollar corporation. They'll kill people if they had to maximize and squeeze more profit lol

[@LodanSD]

can't wait for the Paltopia DLC...

[@LordEverlost]

I was shocked he didn't mention craftopia, people have known that for months.

[@iwifia]

​@@LordEverlost he would have to do research and not just rip off other takes for his "news".

[@elizabuga4337]

Hi, U.S. patent agent here. So Japan actually isn’t a “first to invent” jurisdiction like you insinuated. Claiming priority to a previously-filed patent application is common practice, so the 2024 filings are not necessarily “new” inventions, but rather are just new filings.

[@Ahouro]

@@elizabuga4337 The 2024 patents is a sub-patent of a patent that was granted in 2021.

[@neeneko]

​@FF8Irvine_Fan not anymore. both the US and Japan are ' first to file' patent systems, though there are a lot of devils in the details.

[@ebhaenger8246]

Now I'm curious. Can you tell, What happens in such a case if it turns out an other party (game) did it before those claiming to be the first once doing it? Could the 3rd party overrule Nintendo's claims? Would the 3rd party have to claim those patents or could palworld dev's say "Look, they where faster then you?" Could the 3rd party claim them and make them like "free to use" for everyone, as long as they hold the patent? (Example Craftopia has mechanics where you have to weaken with weapons like in palworld, and catch throwing a cube since I believe 2020-2021) (EDIT: Jokes on me. I'm just now realizing Palworld and Craftopia have the same Dev.)

[@YuiYuukiII]

World of Warcraft has had this mechanic for years (fight a monster, lower its health, throw something to capture them).

[@lomborg4876]

@@YuiYuukiIIZanZarah has had that mechanic since 2002

[@LightBluMew]

They aren't targeting Palworld for any other reason other than to stop more indie developers from having the same success on a low budget. Palworld has enough money to be fine now but no one else will be able to do the same thing unless they have money

[@metazoxan2]

here is the thing ... Palworld absolutely leveraged it's designs and success off Pokemon. You can't pretend the game everyone and their grandma called "Pokemon with guns" succeeded simply because of quality on a lower budget. It's also frankly not as amazing as people like to say. HOWEVER ... that still doesn't make this lawsuit justified. I don't like how people are treating Palworld as this like ... ralying cry against Pokemon. Acting like Pokemon should be Palworld or something when they're compeltely different games when you take the designs and references away. But it's not a BAD game and while I do think a few designs copied Pokemon ... a bit too closely, the fact the lawsuit is over mechanics is stupid. Again gameplay is the part of Palworld that LEAST resembles Pokemon. Hell if you want a game taht copied Pokemon mechanics, Tem Tem is litterally just Pokemon but with cards instead of balls and some simplification to some mechanics. if you took Tem Tem's gemplay and Palworld's graphics and designs you'd litterally have Pokemon. I really don't see what Nintendo was thinking with this. Sure it puts pressure on copycats, but it's such a bad PR move. and if they JUST wanted pressure. The designs that look borderline traced to Pokemon ones would have worked just fine and gotten less bad PR. What makes all this especially bad is that Japanese Companies have traditionally patented game mechanics specifically to avoid foreign companies from doing it and using it to attack them. There is an honor system in Japan to patent them but almost never use them unless it's really needed. So it's an especailly bad look for Nintendo to go that route.

[@Max-hw7xl]

@@metazoxan2 they were heavily inspired. but open world monster catching has been around for a LONG time. the aesthetics are very on the nose, but thats not what Nintendo is going after. Palworld is much more like ARK (base building, talent tree etc) than pokemon in terms of mechanics and i dont see anyone rage there. as for if Palworld was good or not. i had an amazing time with it, and its reviews show most people did. You dont explode on Steam with a crap game as an indi developer. easily top 5 of the year. It had everything i want in a multiplayer crafting survival monster catching game. some people hated it cause they swallow Nintendo D unpaid in their free time and others just dont like that type of game which is totally fair. There were some bugs and performance issues and i can totally respect people not liking it because subjectively they had a bad time with it. the latter group wont spend their time raging about it online tho, they will say 'meh, not for me' when asked and thats it

[@metazoxan2]

@@Max-hw7xl entirely agree. I've always said Palworld looked more like ARK gameplay wise. In fact if you had shown me early footage and said it was an ARK pokemon mod ... I'd have beleived you. yes the only thing Palworld REALLY takes from Pokemon is the aesthetic and that's oddly NOT what Nintendo is going after. BTW as for me ... I just don't especially care for it. I never like ARK either and the "Pokemon with guns" gimmick doesn't really sell it for me. I don't hate the game but nothing about the game looks like anything more that Pokemon meets ARK. Mixing those two is far from a BAD idea ... but just as people attacked Palworld swallowing Nintendo D. Some people absolutely swallowed Palworld's D. Acting like it was the greatest game of all time and was the game that would kill Pokemon and ruin Nintendo. There are people on both sides of the fight that are insufferable.

[@LordSiravant]

@@metazoxan2 Bruh, Pokemon literally stole designs and mechanics from other properties like Dragon Quest and Digimon, they aren't all that original themselves. Nintendo wants to crush competition, but this isn't just about crushing Pocketpair, it's also about denying Sony the opportunity to use Palworld to damage their Pokemon patents. (and that is absolutely what Sony is collaborating with Pocketpair for) Remember, Sony and Nintendo are bitter enemies. This whole lawsuit is just a proxy war between them.

[@Max-hw7xl]

@@metazoxan2 agreed with all ur points. Palworld for me was a great game because it got a nice balance of a bunch of aspects im already really in love with. im a huge fan of the genre. that said, it isnt a AAA game and certainly not GOTY material. it had some major flaws and just doesnt have staying power for me. my GF and i will spend 2 or 3 weeks getting everything done, then stop playing until the next major patch. replayability is limited unlike BG3 for instance.

[@unqltango]

If you can't throw a ball to catch a monster, throw a cube and copyright it.

[@mymysterymysterio]

@@unqltango or a disk. Shuriken. My dad. Oh wait.... I can't find him. 😂

[@TheSensationalMr.Science]

I'll do you one better... a triangle. then not even Pokemon can use their poke-balls or any rendering techniques ever again. Hope you have a great day & Safe Travels!

[@dmartin-cg4136]

@FF8Irvine_Fan Okay sure 💀

[@bjcantrell1990]

@FF8Irvine_Fan Okay sure 💀

[@dabbingraccoons6416]

@FF8Irvine_Fan Okay sure 💀

[@DJ_Treu]

claiming mounts are unique to pokemon is wild. I can see them saying "Catching a monster with a ball without a need to battle them" was in arceus first but the mounting a monster thing is like...what? Does nintendo not know what an MMO is?

[@user-xc1qy7ed8l]

nope

[@zachcook8972]

It's about the fact that Nintendo made it a patient where other companies didn't and unfortunately it has a decent chance to hold up it Japanese court due to how different there systems work including the lack of fair use laws

[@ViviW1nt3r00]

But craftopia did it before Nintendo released Arceus. I've been playing that game since first release and pal world is basically just a more refined version of craftopia with less scope creep.

[@KnownAsKenji]

MMO has the word 'online' in it, so no, I don't think Nintendo's heard of it.

[@escapetherace1943]

@@zachcook8972 the studio should just flee japan, not even joking. Nintendo's lawsuit wouldn't hold up outside of Japan, because they filed their patents AFTER palworld released

[@bio0link]

I think something people are missing is Palworld developers actually made a different game before Palworld that has many of these patented mechanics before Nintendo even did them. So really they don't need look at GTA. Its called Craftopia and you should look into it. So the irony here is.... Pocketpair could patent these very mechanics and sue Nintendo.

[@akiraangelfire2127]

Indeed that’s why I’m not worried it’s not just the palworld devs they are going after Microsoft and Sony are tied to palworld an attack on one is an attack on Microsoft and Sony too, won’t take much to crush Nintendo with that support.

[@artmanstudios7037]

Well the other irony part is that if they do Sue Nintendo for that then they can sue anybody else as well so nobody will be able to use it either way So we'll be right back where we started if PW is into all that stuff that is And if not then I guess Nintendo will continue to be able to use the capturing monster mechanic thingamajig.

[@mrconroy4672]

@@akiraangelfire2127I doubt Microsoft is going to care unless otherwise. Sony has a full on shot to score a win but it’s likely going to be a bittersweet one long term.

[@spence6195]

I hope they sue Nintendo and win

[@Johnny91832]

sorry but suing Nintendo is not a smart idea.

[@duanefouche378]

If it doesn't matter when they filed the patent, only who used it first, then if we're honest Pocketpair was the first to use a ball capture mechanic in a 3D space as part of an official game mechanic, not Nintendo. Because Pocketpair's Craftopia had that mechanic in it, and it came out 2 years before Legends Arceus.

[@Arjay404]

Exactly, I don't know how all these reports keep missing that, almost as if they are being disingenuous.

[@brettwood1351]

Sadly we're dealing with patent law here. I'm willing to bet that it absolutly does matter who patented it first. Which is messed up, but yeah, law often is.

[@NightmareRex6]

so dose that mean i own nightmare-rex name sinceme and friends atualy came up with it and YEARS LATER beyblade also came up (or maby stole) it? and also made "rage of hell" way before this book with same title was published?

[@Remilation]

I was expecting this to be brought uo by this channel too seeing as asmongold covered this very topic awhile ago. Craftopia is an offical game and not a mod so has a little more standing on pattent office. But im willing to bet when Nintendo filed their patents nobody questions them cause they are nintendo.

[@iossaiken]

Dragon Quest builders allowed you to capture monsters to help you fight and build....

[@8-BitLuca]

8:38 Patenting game mechanics is lame

[@ThomatoSauce]

I’d love for Matt Bozon to call out Nintendo for stealing the hat parachute mechanic from Shantae and the Pirate’s Curse. Would undoubtedly expose Nintendo’s hypocrisy on a larger scale.

[@chuckgreen6386]

@@ThomatoSauce or Ubisoft call them out for climbing to a high point on a tower to use a synchronizing mechanic to mark important points

[@RaceBandit]

There's probably hundreds of examples that need to knock Nintendo off their high horse if this actually hits the court rooms.

[@utlagi3180]

@@chuckgreen6386 for anyone wondering look at Zelda: Breath of the Wild and any Assassins Creed game

[@mimszanadunstedt441]

Big business being exposed as thieves who are favored cuz wallet. Well Palworld might be in the big chair now. Suck it up nintendon't.

[@somethinglikethat2176]

Nintendo don't care about being hypocrites. This is basically a SLAPP suit.

[@Icarus7XD]

I'm always a bit mystified when Craftopia isn't brought up regarding the patent for "Throwing an object at a creature to catch it in a 3D environment", because Craftopia did that very mechanic in 2020, before the release of the game Pokemon Legends Arceus. Craftopia is also made by PocketPair, the same company that made Palworld. I totally understand that Craftopia isn't that popular to be quickly remembered, but since some time has passed, I would have thought the game would be brought up by now. Unlike the GTA mod, it's officially integrated into the game like Palworld and made before even Pokemon Legends Arceus.

[@gigaburgerer]

@@Icarus7XD I was just about to comment about craftopia when I came across your comment. I really hope that pocketpair can beat this thing and it'd be hilarious if they could even turn it around on Nintendo

[@1DigitalFlow]

Ark survival evolved. 2014

[@paradoxwraith5275]

Ark evolved even did that before them bruh.

[@YuiYuukiII]

World of Warcraft has had this mechanic for years (fight a monster, lower its health, throw something to capture them).

[@gigaburgerer]

@YuiYuukiII it has to do with the 3d environment where you aim a capture item. Wow doesn't count. Neither does ark.

[@frostbite0707]

Riding monster companions have existed in dozens of games before Arceus. Monster Hunter, Rune Factory, Digimon, Final Fantasy, Etc. This entire patent is baseless because literally everything Pokemon has done in it's entire lifespan was based on mechanics and aspects from other games.

[@zachcook8972]

It's not baseless unfortunately as for one nobody else made it a pat and Nintendo did also it's Japan not America so the courts are actually pretty likely to side with Nintendo due to money.

[@xtrakulgy]

@@zachcook8972 its baseless because you can't patent commonly existing technologies after they have become common or are already in use. I think the big miss here by most people reviewing this issue is that Cratopia (which was released in 2020) had a oject throwing in a 3d space to capture feature, which was before arceus and even the introduction of the patent. Patents are meant to protect new IP to help encourage inventors, but when it already exists its not your IP, its someone else's.

[@Lunapink93]

The thing is none of those games creatures look exactly like Pokemon. Like using body parts of already established pokemon.

[@rpgfanatic9719]

​@@frostbite0707 it's not riding, it's ride transitioning, like falling and gaining a ride for flight and so on. It's also not true at all that Pokemon has never invented anything unique. The trade system is wholly unique, various moves are unique like transform that would go on to inspire the entire persona franchise.

[@rpgfanatic9719]

​@@xtrakulgycraftopia is younger than let's go Pikachu and Eevee, which uses aiming motion control technology in a 3d space.

[@The_Defiance]

If Nintendo wins this lawsuit, they can be sued for being a monopoly. If they lose, then they lose. Nintendo is trying to fight a losing battle.

[@ToaOnichu]

I doubt Japan has any laws against monopolies. I would love to be proven wrong, though.

[@imonyourside8376]

@FF8Irvine_Fan In this case it should be.

[@bxbone5942]

This mechanic also existed in "Pixelmon" mod for Minecraft (as far as I've checked it existed since 2013)

[@BlueBD]

Ah! Someone else mentioned it. yeah. the GTA5 mod is old but PixilMon is even older

[@snickle1980]

Thats a mod.

[@akame5584]

@@snickle1980 that’s what they said yes? It is a mod and that doesn’t matter for patents

[@TheThreeDGrasshopper]

if right then that's actually awesome.

[@umelgaming3177]

​@SalamanderMoon they shut down pixlmon for Copyright your correct but BECAUSE they did it mean Nintendo acknowledged it existed and if the mechanics existed then, Nintendo wouldn't have been the first to make the mechanics which means the Patents they are sueing over are null and void. Basically Pixlmon getting cease and deisist'ed might actually bite Nintendo in the ass now which would be great post-mortem revenge from the Pixlmon Devs lol

[@reeven1721]

They chose to fight Nintendo? What a joyous bunch of mad lads. I don't even play Palword, but I'm gonna go buy it just to show support and boost their numbers. I don't dislike Nintendo, but that kind of patent bullying needs to be fought all the way.

[@arcadenoah993]

I bought Palworld for PC and PS5 too

[@Foxigan_XD]

I'll probably buy it for my sis on steam

[@GraveUypo]

it's a good game, give it a whirl. worth playing through at least once, specially with friends.

[@mrconroy4672]

Unfortunately they might need Sonys help on this since they are at a severe disadvantage.

[@gringohispanic]

That’s exactly what I did. Game ended up being fantastic.

[@DraiTheDragoon]

Craftopia, also by Pocket Pair released in 2020 and also had a monster catching mechanic very similar to Palworld, so they had already used this mechanic a year prior to Nintendo releasing Legends Arceus

[@neeneko]

Which may or may not help them. patents go to the first person to file them, and invalidating them via prior art tends to be pretty difficult. patent offices are loath to do so.

[@Enjgine]

@@neenekofucking ridiculous. You can ban all competition by being first, but if someone else was first and you patent, you win.

[@darkling6655]

@@neeneko that's not true its whos first to create not first to patent. the patent office job is to make sure no one else made that first and if they did then your patent gets thrown out.

[@Borsecann]

@@darkling6655 Exactly this, the patent should have never been validated by the patent office. That's an investigation that needs to happe (sadly I dont believe anything will come of it even if it does).

[@Ishaan_A]

@@neeneko the only basis for the patent is for Nintendo to have made the mechanics the first, so if this other game did it before Legends of Arceus then Pocket Pair has the upper hand.

[@JazskiBat]

New extremely OP patent : Patenting the process of creating a game through a game engine in any way shape or form. fr screw nintendscrap if they shut down palworld entirely

[@ghostrecondelta1741]

Lol, someone should patent the same red they use for Mario and then sue Nintendo for patent infringement.

[@maxmikester8185]

Nintendo is basically admitting to their customers that they don’t want to put in the work anymore to make a good game. That’s all their hate for Palworld shows.

[@lienomzekon4763]

MS paint Comic Profile Pick!

[@rpgfanatic9719]

According to pal world developers, they themselves didn't put in work.

[@zoxfalcon2510]

@@rpgfanatic9719 source?

[@logan_wolf]

Too bad their customers are a little too dense to realize what's right in front of them.

[@rpgfanatic9719]

@@zoxfalcon2510 you can't link sources on KZbin, just read their development process, they made their game with minimal people and minimal original resources, it's not hard to believe considering the designs of the pals are blatantly unoriginal taking from all kinds of models from different games and putting them together.

[@DeadEye364]

This is what I took from this whole mess of a situation…Nintendo has so little faith in their own IP that they feel this threatened, and they probably still won’t give Pokémon any more budget.

[@NCC-0000]

“Recycle the same models and mechanics from Kalos? Yeah!” -Nintendo and GameFreak, probably

[@mrconroy4672]

Eh, if anything, they can and likely will do better come next gen. I doubt we will ever see another scarlet/violet unless otherwise.

[@darkendbeing]

@@mrconroy4672 don't bet on it, game freak notoriously hates being know as the Pokemon developer, which is why the best Pokemon games in years weren't developed by game freak (bdsp, and pokken tournament)

[@predat11]

Or they can instead of make money from games, can make money passively by forcing companies smaller than them to pay royalties and licensing fees so they can work less make more.

[@astro_9707]

@@DeadEye364 doesnt gamefreak handle pokemon development?

[@TheSpazzDragon]

Craftopia, Pocketpair's other game that also had a mechanic to aim and throw objects at creatures to catch them. And that came out before Pokemon Legends of Arcious. Craftopia released in September of 2020.

[@theblahhhman2614]

Give pokemon to palworld they can manage the ip better

[@lord_shadowstar8651]

Does not matter. Japan uses a first to file patent system. Not that I agree with it, but japan's legal system is very backwards.

[@noctisthedevious]

@lord_shadowstar865 But the reason that the patent is even considered valid by Japan despite being filed after Palworld was released, is because they tried claiming they did it first. They didn't do it first and that threatens their patent

[@EnderElohim]

@@lord_shadowstar8651 also Japan do not matter for American or European citizens too. They just need to move their company

[@ZeroXSEED]

@@lord_shadowstar8651 First to patent is possible only with the proof to back it If paworld launch a lawsuit at their ass in response Nintendo would be toast

[@SilverTwinkle]

Pokemon was inspired by another Monster Taming game that also had the mechanic of throw a thing at a monster to affect it. You can read about it in the Interview of Satoshi who first created Pokemon on his Wiki.

[@scaredjakku]

if this happens then that would be a giant threat to gaming industry

[@Immudzen]

It could lead to fights between companies as they try to patent various mechanics and make stuff worse for all of us.

[@boomymanlyman9876]

More like cracking Sony's kneecaps.

[@zhuran2686]

and thus a gaming crash will happen.

[@nbshftr]

nintendo lawyers have been a threat since the beginning

[@dra6o0n]

Then keep rebelling and wasting court time, so that in the end the courts would throw the cases out because it's too rampant and stupid

[@rrc3]

Nintendo will do everything it can do to prevent competition. Especially competition that absolutely ate their lunch like Palworld.

[@gorillagroddgaming]

Soytendo games are crap. Odyssey was overrated slop. Don’t really care about soyworld either. It’s just another generic survival slop game.

[@comlitbeta7532]

nintendo dont give a crap about palworld, but sony did and nintedo give a big crap about sony

[@DarkMan307]

nintendo are such scumbags man fr, especialy the pokemon division of the company they will do literally anything to avoid having to work or inovate

[@jamiehobson6336]

@@gorillagroddgaming Speak english and throw away the slang!

[@Xilibrius]

of course because if they prevent competition then they don't have to do anything to try and retain their audience

[@Xaymar]

If mods can predate a patent registration, Minecraft mods had a throw ball-like-object at monster to catch several years prior.

[@tobyzilla]

I know alot of mods that use that system both new and old the best examples is orespawn and alot of other mods that have a similar system in place

[@kitsunekaze93]

they can, something you made as a school project works as well. just need to prove it existed before their claim

[@seanjenkins6947]

so an unlicensed mod created by an individuals(s) who have no rights or licensure over the IP somehow trumps an official patent by the parent company?

[@tobyzilla]

@@seanjenkins6947 how does Nintendo's boot taste

[@Xahnel]

This isn't even "catching", it's just "affecting". Any open workd game with throwable weapons, spells, grenades, etc, is affected by this.

[@summergamer7650]

Imagine Suing the the only competitor that will incentivize you to make a better Pokémon game, as opposed to just making a better Pokémon game. The pettiness goes hard.

[@Krysnha]

Better, watch many there and you see the decadence of pokemon

[@GreyMaria]

Chat, Pixelmon was throwing pokeballs at pokemon in an open world before GTA5 even existed.

[@rpgfanatic9719]

Im sure many people within the Pokemon company already thought of doing this. We had Pokemon snap tossing pokeball objects at Pokemon before in a 3D space. Super smash Bros also has you tossing pokeballs in a 3d space to release creatures, there's also Pokemon pinball which uses physics on a 2D plane to catch Pokemon so to say the idea hasn't been crossed in their minds is ridiculous. Pixelmon is an idea released on someone else's work. That's about as valid of a released product as just thinking about it.

[@jguy2292]

Nintendo proving time and time again they are the villains in everyone's story.

[@RandomBlackBox]

Well, they started as a yakuza. Still hold that mindset to this day.

[@mrconroy4672]

Relatively true, we need to have any future/current devs/creators learn to be humble for the long term.

[@mrconroy4672]

@@mongoosegangIf they still provide quality products, people will still unfortunately buy. Any boycott will never work because they will be ultimately dwarfed by the massive amount of sales.

[@NitwitsWorld]

@@mrconroy4672 oblivious children buy their games……. 😬

[@mrconroy4672]

@@NitwitsWorldAnd can you stop it? No, in fact nobody here on these comment sections can. Any boycott will likely fall on deaf ears once people are excited about the next console and reveal.

[@ferretzim8694]

Honestly think there should be a massive wave of reforms to copyright and patents, where nobody can patent something abstract like "catching creatures in a field", or the core mechanics of the "nemesis" system.

[@someguy4252]

they also need a "lifespan" after x years it goes in the public domain. all this weaponization of the patent and copyright laws has caused stagnation and a soft monopoly of genre's.

[@Gen0ration9k]

Trying to sue someone over mechanics is stupid as fuck, ngl the copyright laws and such like them are ass backwards and needs fixed

[@DeltaDragon79]

Whole situation is scary for gaming. The nemisis system could of been amazing if it had been allowed to evolve, now its like a cool toy gathering dust in the basement no one will ever be allowed to see or touch. All because of pure greed.

[@Jasonwolf1495]

If it was anyone other than pocketpair it'd be greed, but you don't fly that close to the sun and wonder why you get burned. They knew they were fucking around.

[@eldritchbeauty]

@@Jasonwolf1495 Shouldn’t matter who it is. Nintendo has done what Pocketpair has and copied and stolen from other IPs, and done it in arguably worse ways. Insane that anyone would defend such baseless patents because “a company flew too close to the sun.” Nintendo is not a god, so stop licking their boots and have some common decency and sense. This is how companies are destroying competition and any semblance of the free market, and silly people are actively cheering for it.

[@fuzzyfallthetempest]

Couldn’t you technically just code it differently and say oh well it’s different technically like very technically speaking or does that still not count is it like hard code or an idea that is a patent because ideas being patented or gate kept are literally not even fair

[@zanzabar4ky7]

WB has a copyright on the algorithm and a bunch of trademarks on nemesis system naming; not a patent on the system that prevents people from copying it. As a game element the idea of it cannot be patented in the us. If you called it something else and had a different algorithm to pick who gets upgraded you could get around it. Having a similar system based on xp from killing the player and or time to stay alive is valid and not covered by the wb system. The issue is paying for legal costs if challenged. Unless you get covered by a slap law, you are responsible for your own fees.

[@KPX01]

​@@fuzzyfallthetempestand they still need to fight in court if "patent" owner says it's infringing. No one wants to spend money on a case like that just because the system look similar.

[@amo903]

Bro the thing is that nintendo been had the power to make the ultimate palworld experience with their original ip. But instead they try n take away the one experience we have and leave us with nothing. What?!

[@starplane1239]

So is anyone going to adress how grenades fit the bill of "Nintendo's patent"? Or any throwing item like a knife or hatchet? "Throwing an object at something and affecting it"?

[@danmiy12]

this means they can go after any fps including games from 2000s which imo had grenades, games like league of legends, apex, all of those did throw an object in a 3d space long before acreus did. If we are only counting japaense games then monster hunter did it first with paintballs on the ps2.

[@GorrillaVision]

@@danmiy12 they cant go after games older than the patent

[@danmiy12]

@@GorrillaVision but, palworld came before the patients were filled. So that also is older then the patent.

[@Ahouro]

​@@danmiy12 The patent is a sub-patent of a patent that was granted in 2021 so the patent is older than palworld.

[@GorrillaVision]

@@Ahouro but other games like Borderlands the Pre Sequel had you catch monsters with a ball.

[@solfireblaze9292]

Honestly, ark did that whole thing with capturing in an object and riding the creature way before legends arceus

[@lomborg4876]

The concept of capturing monsters/creatures in magic balls dates back decades. The oldest game I’ve played with that mechanic is *ZanZarah: The Hidden Portal* from 2002

[@logan_wolf]

Pokemon is older than 2002.

[@imonyourside8376]

What about Pong? You throw a paddle at a ball to catch and release it.

[@lomborg4876]

@@imonyourside8376 true. But even real life hunting traps, which have exited forever

[@Krysnha]

Pokemon is older, musch much older

[@tobuslieven]

Nintendo have never heard of a lasso.

[@arcadenoah993]

I wanna see Nintendo sue Red Dead Redemption

[@riam850]

@@arcadenoah993 Rockstar has money, Nintendo is only interested in bullying those who are weaker.

[@Loserstakethebait]

​​@@riam850 Aren't the Palworld devs backed partially by Sony though? I remember that they had some kind if an exclusivity deal. That means they probably have access to Sony's lawyers and a good bit of funds. Nintendo is virtually undefeated in court, so even that might not help. Though, Nintendo almost never wins in court either, they just bully people until they agree to settle. Most of their cases would've fallen flat if the accused actually had money and resources to defend themselves. Unfortunately, Japanese courts are even worse than the US when it comes to money. There is no option for a jury of peers to offset the judge's bias. It leads to the rich and famous having the ability to destroy the lives of anyone they want legally and no real proof is needed.

[@megaman37456]

@@riam850 PocketPair made bank with Pal World.

[@owomushi_vr]

They literally cloned dragon quest

[@LordRazer3]

1:51 Nintendo did NOT do this first! Pocketpair literally did this a full year before pokemon legend Arceus in there other game Craftopia in bloody 2020! Past that Ark survival evolved beat BOTH of them with with the the extinction DLC that came out in 2018!

[@marceloelias9091]

Nintendo should look at their own games instead of sabotaging Pockpair. I hope this new pal launch animation still gets a rework.

[@Think666_]

If they settle these 3, Nintendo will go after them with the remainder, with increasing costs each time.

[@umelgaming3177]

Nah. They chose those 3 cuz those are the only 3 they think they can win with. Nintendo is ruthless of they had more they thought they could win with they would have used all of them at once to have a higher chance of success. They only would need to win once after all.

[@asmosisyup2557]

This appears to be Nintendo's plan, they just want to tie Pocketpair up indefinitely in legal battles until they either give in or go broke.

[@Krillol]

Can't Pocketpair apply for a patent of this since this mechanic is from their game "Craftopia" that they launched in 2020 sep 4. Under the breeding section you can find this mechanic: "Breeding By throwing Monster Prism at creatures, you can catch them as a pet. Not only animals like cows and deer, but most of the monsters are also tamable." This is before Pokémon Legends: Arceus in 2022. So that would mean that Nintendo should actually be countersued for this right?

[@Silath01]

Ark survival evolved has had capture balls since the first DLC. That was 2015 iirc

[@snark567]

Apparently you can make something, someone else can file for a patent of the thing you made. They now own the thing. That's patents in a nutshell.

[@marcosdheleno]

meanwhile you have nintendo/pokemon fanboys that are probably jumping with glee that nintendo sued.

[@metazoxan2]

Except your forgetting Pokemon Colliseum. Legends Arceus wasn't the first 3D pokemon game. It was the first Open world Pokemon game. I'm not defending the lawsuit but people need to stop using Legends Arceus as the benchmark for 3D Pokemon.

[@marcosdheleno]

@@metazoxan2 last i check you cant capture pokemon in those games. and if they wanna play that game, there's a series of games called jade cocoon that did 3d monster capture before pokemon.

[@Taiylim]

Game "Mechanic" patents filed AFTER Palworld was released for things that SHOULD NOT be patent protected. Nintendo is an abusive power horse that needs to be taken down a few notches.

[@Delimon007]

Wrong, they were renewed. Educate yourself.

[@king5327]

Nintendo split an existing pre-Palworld patent into sub-patents. Those may have been filed after Palworld's release but the main patent predates it - but is still newer than Craftopia, at least. That said, the on screen appearance of what is otherwise just a sequence of button presses and computer statistics shouldn't be something you can patent.

[@AmatsuDragneel]

@@Delimon007 don’t care, if they had to go through the trouble of creating these divisional patents just to be able to sue, Pocket Pair should not be sued for it They had 3 years to update it, yet waited until after Palworld It was broad then, and it’s still too broad, Nintendo deserves no respect

[@enjitanaka9020]

@@Delimon007 Craftopia 2020, Ultraman Leo 1974, Ultraman Ultraseven 1967... Educate yourself.

[@sagenebula7120]

@@Delimon007pocketpairs last game craftopia had the mechanics before the patent, educate yourself

[@UtopiaV1]

Patenting game mechanics unfortunately goes back even further than the Nemesis system - The "loading screen minigame" was a patent granted to Namco in 1998 for placing mini games in loading screens. The patent was based on Namco's idea of adding its arcade shooter "Galaxian" to Ridge Racer's loading screens. The patent prevented other developers from using similar minigames during loading screens for 20 years until it expired in 2018

[@Rainos62]

in japan nintendo always wins because of how the system is structured but where palworld may have an opening is with other jurisdictions because if other jurisdictions that are stronger reject it they can force the japanese patent office to re-evaluate the patent causing the patent to usually become invalidated because weaker patent offices have to listen to stronger ones because of international treaties that require they respect patents across borders and valid reason for rejection. Nintendo is known for their patents being very vague and getting rejected a lot to the point where I personally know someone who worked at the patent office and called them the most annoying patenters they have ever dealt with because their patents were usually way too vague.

[@idrathernot_2]

Nintendo always wins because nobody has the money or balls to stop them, not because they are legally right.

[@sheicode3748]

Yeah many People already came out saying that Nintendo isn't using here they are bullying competition

[@neeneko]

@@idrathernot_2 though now that Sony is interested in collaboration, that changes the equation. Sony has resources.. and I don't mean money. Sony has their own massive library of defensive patents, many of which they could level at Nintendo.

[@Dendroapsis]

@@neeneko ​ Sounds like Japan's games industry is gearing up for a metaphorical nuclear war I wonder how far you could take patent trolling? "We patent the concept of animating a character to mimic a bipedal walking motion"

[@Myrmidon7467]

At least a couple of the patents run into issues with Pocket Pair's Previous game from May 2020 called Craftopia which also uses the capture mechanics

[@KonaSuba]

Craftopia did the whole catching monsters in an open world in 2020 didn't they?

[@riptors9777]

Correct, but if nintendo pays the right people in japanese courts theres little pocketpair can do.

[@darkzeroprojects4245]

@@riptors9777 and they say Japan is a country that highly vales honor. Corporations like Nintendo don't have that.

[@EnderElohim]

@@riptors9777 that is where America comes in. If American gamers make their law makers to works on that issue and make it illegal to have game pattern people will create their game companies in America and that way Nintendo cant do shit about it also more tax income for America. You dont even need to be American citizen create your company in America if i remember correctly

[@riptors9777]

@@darkzeroprojects4245 Its specifically because of that "honor" that they side with the big established entities and look down on the new young upcommers. Japan to this day is heavily conservative, and big japanese corporations are favoured simply because of tradition. Nintendo is a household name in japan and alot of japanese are of the opinion that nintendo is in the right with sueing pocketpair.

[@riptors9777]

@@EnderElohim I think they wont be able to file those patents in the US... they are way to vague in their discription. And the US and EU dont give patents for such vague concepts.. you have to be ultra specific... atleast alot more specific then "Character A throws object at Character B to affect it in some way"

[@DennisYangI]

Pocket Pair should sue Japan Patent Office for allowing Nintendo to patent a genre.

[@merp4966]

Uhhh Pocketpair created Craftopia first before Arceus. It also have a creature capture mechanism.

[@SnivyTries]

Honestly, Palworld could easily dodge the lawsuit by just changing the method of capture. Keep the pal spheres, but have them power a handgun or something. Fits better with the idea of Palworld anyway, AND makes it easier to catch Pals since you aren't throwing an object into the wind. Animations for firing are already there, just modify the base pistol's mesh.

[@ZEROGOKI1983]

There is already an entire line of sphere launchers in the game.

[@jamilgonzaga7081]

Sphere launchers brotha But still, the change in summoning Pal really sucks because of the lawsuit

[@metazoxan2]

Honestly I did hate the Palspheres anyway. It may not deserve a lawsuit, but it was a tad overly on the nose to have palworld use "Spheres" to capture creatures ... like we get it you are "Pokemon with guns" but put more effort into branching off some of the aesthetics. Again this isn't defending the lawsuit ... just saying I'd prefer if they replaced that anyway.

[@KimBaack]

The thing is the patent isnt about the spears its about tossing things and capturing things

[@SnivyTries]

@@KimBaack So instead of tossing a thing, shoot the thing.

[@Tarrant220]

Sitting on the Nemesis system for years and doing nothing with it should be a crime.

[@justiciar1964]

Pharmaceutical companies patent genes discovered in nature, and usually do nothing with them... and neither can most scientists! Capitalism is so great, isn't it? If Nintendo could, they'd patent jumping itself.

[@kitsunekaze93]

its not so serious. anyone is allowed to make something similar, just cant make an exact copy

[@malpheus4299]

​@@kitsunekaze93not quite an exact copy, it just restricts how creative your nemesis system can be overall. Look at Warframe with the lich system, they said they had ideas they couldn't implement because of this patent.

[@KPX01]

​@@kitsunekaze93and how much of familiarity is allowed huh? Most of these dumb patent is worded vaguely.

[@TheIrkenEmpire420]

"I can't let them make an independent monster catching game with a nemesis system! It is MY mechanic to sit on and do nothing with!"

[@scribdfukkyu9630]

interestingly enough, this lawsuit reminded me to go buy palworld

[@xxHANNONxx]

If the devs of Palworld end up going down, they should "leak" the source code to the game, so it can never go away, and forever be a thorn in Nintendo's side.

[@electrobob992]

Honestly I am half expecting that, even if they did it privately to some modder who is willing to "take the fall". Pretend to be a hacker, settle it out of court, but shared the source before he was discovered.

[@abaddon1503]

Public domain out of spite sounds awesome especially in this time of animation being thrown in the corporate cauldron for tax benefits

[@jindo5]

Considering Miraibo GO exists, that might have already happened to some extent.

[@kaden-sd6vb]

I can absolutely see the madlads at pocketpair doing that.

[@TheLuceon]

Nintendo making money from broken games: "We love the free market!" Nintendo when a competitor shows up: "Not that free!"

[@LeonardoMascara]

I'm so disgusted with Nintendo right now that I don't know if I'll ever buy a pokemon game again...

[@sebastiennault8466]

I hate Nintendo when they think like they own everything intellectually

[@0x0404]

ARK pretty much had pokeballs for years before anything either of these companies did in 3d. You didn't catch with them but you did store and throw out with them.

[@GeekHelix]

2:20 - Craftopia did this first.

[@lifeforceken]

@@GeekHelix yeah thor (pirate software) called this out

[@Nobodyimportantreal11y]

@@lifeforceken can you imagine a game you left for dead on the backburner coming in to save the day! I love craftopia

[@davidsweeney7837]

Also just make a better game… your Nintendo and the Pokémon games have been the same since I was a kid… I’m 36 now…

[@SuperTheMoonn]

This exactly this. I played craftopia when it came out, Nintendo did not do it first

[@SeanoMitchell]

@GeekHelix they didnt make enough money and get popular enough. Apparently.

[@deadeyemav935]

I would Like to argue that it doesn't even compete with pokemon, because pokemon is only available if you buy Nintendo's console. So until pokemeon is available on the same platforms they cant even argue revinue loss because anyone playing on a PC CANNOT legally play pokemon anyway.

[@Godsavethecrumpets]

Sure but it still devalues their IP.

[@zenthedying91]

how the fuck does it devalues there ip? nintendo literally has a monopoly over there own country and on top of that they have *ZERO COMPETITION* over there for the past 3-4 decades till recently.

[@szlomobronsztajn3115]

@@Godsavethecrumpets this is what is ruining world right now - corporations thinking that not getting the potential revenue is actually a loss

[@Jamie-xe1ux]

@@szlomobronsztajn3115 all these companies counting their chickens before they hatch

[@siyano]

@@Godsavethecrumpets devalues in what manners? its not a game even close to pokemon, that would be like going against Quake because it's devalues your ip for people not buying Pokemon? like wtf, so not buying is the same a devaluing the product? Throwing an object at something and trying to capture it as been done several multiple times in different games, wtf now? Like Pokemon could be devalued anyway lol

[@GamesforYouandBoo]

Honestly. The suits at Nintendo need to get charged with harassment

[@1337penguinman]

Imagine if Apogee had patented the first person shooter when they dropped Wolf 3D. We never would have gotten Doom.

[@LexiLunarpaw]

And no Half-Life... No Half-Life, No Steam... no Steam, Not Webfishing 😢

[@goofy851]

Welp, with the newest patch that removed the "throw a sphere to release your Pal" mechanic that took with itself several other gameplay mechanics and hastily replaced it with "your Pal spawns next to you, usually halfway inside the ground because extremely rushed changes to core systems never work" I have a pretty good idea of how the lawsuit battle is going.

[@SamusKnight2K]

It's still too early to say. Remember, part of Nintendo's plan was to get an injunction to bar sales of Palworld. A temporary injunction can be granted while the lawsuit is ongoing, so to comply Pocketpair just changed the stuff that Nintendo claimed they were infringing upon. Otherwise they'll have to shut the game down. If Nintendo loses, Pocketpair can then add it back in.

[@goofy851]

@@SamusKnight2K If that were true, they would also have to remove the mount mechanic because, according to Nintendo, they also invented mounts. In my opinion, the more likely thing is that Nintendo is suing them for every patent individually to maximize profits and minimize risk, and Pocket Pair lost the "throw object to release a monster" lawsuit, hence they had to hastily rip it out of the game.

[@umbra717]

Palworld recently updated the mechanic to send out pals in a patch a couple days ago. Now, instead of aiming and throwing spheres and having the pal come out where you aimed, you just kinda “drop” the pals next to you. Some are speculating whether this is a result of the lawsuit and a means to try to circumvent the supposed patent infringement. However, this new system has been received with criticism by their community and also seems to be rather buggy. I hope they can either revert or improve upon this mechanic, as it seems to be an integral part of the game. Just thought I should mention this as it wasn’t brought up in the video, probably due to the fact that this was already scripted or filmed before the patch released.

[@zephyrias]

Dang.. i was wondering why the game got updated. :/

[@imonyourside8376]

Yup I don't like this at all

[@flache1086]

8:05 GTA ? Man, Pixelmon, the mod for Minecraft has had it since like 2013.

[@BongRipBing]

Boycott Nintendo. *_DO IT_*

[@valekofastora1027]

Done. I sold my switch, all the games, won't buy their PG "soft" games anymore. They aren't aimed at my demographic these days anyway.

[@BongRipBing]

@@valekofastora1027 _Hell yeah, brother_ !

[@GreatRaijin]

Already got my steamdeck OLED, im not afraid of getting switch games on it

[@dzangordenakha3995]

Easy AF, nintendo is very expensive here in Ukraine. (instead i waste my money on Kamen Rider toys)

[@arcadenoah993]

Thank goodness I was a Playstation kid and never had an ouce of nostalgia for Nintendo's crap

[@jonklemenc]

Palworld x Terraria collab is planned and having re-logic and their fans on their side is certainly good for palworld

[@MaoRatto]

Lol, Palworld representation on Nintendo's own console is hilarious.

[@jonklemenc]

@@MaoRatto so true

[@cosmosofinfinity]

I'm a Terraria fan, but still a Pal World hater

[@MaoRatto]

@@cosmosofinfinity PalWorld is a Pokémon art skinned Ark survival game... I want to buy it and rooting for it to win this lawsuit... Nintendo should be forced to compete as... If Pokémon didn't suck pokéballs, maybe this game wouldn't have existed. Nintendo as a company. As a developer of many games, they are rather excellent, but come on. Their company needs to stop being so vengeful, they should be mocked... What makes you hate PalWorld as to me. It is rather harmless and good competition. When Terraria was inactive before 1.3... There were competitors that wanted a bit of the Terraria pie. Those Terraria-like games have long since failed or made their company look bad... I am looking at you ChuckleFish and Starbound. Nintendo are the only Triple A studio that doesn't annoy me outside of Pokémon. There's no excuse for Ocarina of Time trees to blow the shoes off of Scarlet and Violet, or having Yandere Dev levels of code in the texture files. Pokémon, just sucks as a franchise...

[@MaoRatto]

@@cosmosofinfinity What makes you hate PalWorld?

[@AHeinermann]

Nintendo is a patent troll. Full stop.

[@__Nameless_one__]

I don't understand why they chose to attack pal world when there are legit tons of other games that actually strait up copy and paste the Pokemon ip but change things up a little like coromon, temtem, nexomon, but because pal world blew up they wanna destroy it. It's disgusting on Nintendos part.

[@WIImotionmasher]

This story was a big eason why I set my Switch down for the last time. Nintendo has nailed several nails into their own coffin for me. I'm a Melee player, and they wanted our community dead many times throughout the years. They killed Project M too. And more recently they've been attacking KZbinrs, modders, and preservation and rom sites that do not affect their bottom line at all. It's pathetic behavior you don't see much from other competition, though as Nintendo has gotten bolder so has their competition. Not to mention their awful pricing strategy with the Switch, leaving every game at full price no matter how small a game it is. Banking on the Nintendo name. They used to release Nintendo Selects for like $20 late in a console generation. And lets not forget how shit the Joycons are their stubborn insistance on not fixing it because that'd be admitting fault. Nintendo used to genuinely be pro-consumer. Their products used to be designed to be affordable, and durable. Their games explored mechanics other developers weren't willing to try. Now Nintendo has been pumping out the same old games remastered or renewed on Switch for nearly a decade, all at full price, while fighting everyone who dares to have fun without their permission. I recently got a Steamdeck and that has replaced my Switch. I own a lot of digital games on Switch so I'm keeping it for now, but I'm really bummed by their behavior. I skipped the last couple Nintendo games I was interested in. I might end up skipping Metroid prime 4 if I am especially sour about their bullshit. Nintendo thinks this won't hurt their reputation. And sure hardly anyone is gonna stop buying their games over it, I'm an anomaly. But lots of people will see Nintendo as that shit company they aren't going to return to later.

[@ericmann1781]

I agree with your sentiments, and it sucks that I only collect nintendo games because of the very reasons you outlined. The Wii was the last console I bought new, I bought the Wii U and Switch used just so nintendo didn't get my money directly as I started to notice and have great distaste for how they operate, same goes for controllers and any game I possibly can. I hate buying new but the used market is a problem with everyone selling a game with a higher price than what it costs either full price or on sale brand new. I remember talking about this before as well, the damn infinite remasters. I collect Zelda games since I absolutely love the series, but ffs I have every Zelda from Ocarina of time and onwards in double or triple in the case of OOT, N64 + gamecubes OOT Masterquest and the 3DS release. At least I can buy new Zelda games used in mint condition for $60 or $50 if I wait a couple of YEARS, but that price is getting more and more disgusting and harder to swallow as time goes on, of course it's my fault, I can choose not to buy them but I'm not there yet for Zelda. This recent Tears of the Kingdom costing over $100 cad after taxes though, holy hell man... With the recent black friday sale of $62.99 cad after being out for 1.5 YEARS, ridiculous. Zelda will surely hit $99.99 + tax in Canada one day and sell used for $70+, at that point, the last thread will have snapped and I will be done with anything nintendo, unless by some miracle they change for the better, but I won't be holding my breath.

[@Tashenubast]

I LOVE palworld and loved my switch and been playing Nintendo since the first one came out in the 80s but I don't think I'll buy the switch 2. I'm kind of disgusted with them right now. Palworld is a great game and they really shouldn't kick a small company like that.

[@logan_wolf]

I haven't bought anything new from Nintendo in over a decade. If more people acted like me, they'd have changed their tune long before becoming the evil they now are.

[@The_Defiance]

I stopped since the scarlet and violet releases. They need quality control cuz out of all the games, this one is the deformed creature that you want to put out of its misery. The story was mostly uneventful until the very end, which was short, lacked any good villains (which started from sun and moon), and lacks challenges, which I do understand is a child’s game, there should at least be a feature to let me make the game even harder without mods.

[@Ayarte]

​@@The_Defianceyes that is why so many love Palworld, because this game is what many pokemon fans wanted from pokemon games (open world with good fight mechanic not guns lol). I got my switch as a christmas present from my boyfriend so i would feel guilty by selling it to anyone, but since the lawsuit i did not buy any of their games, but nintendo, like sony, have many psycho fans who defend them no matter what they are doing🤦

[@nobbyfirefly57]

I’m pretty sure it began earlier than that.

[@MoreImbaThanYou]

This is what I point at when people whine about "western" publishers destroying gaming. This, Konami and Square Enix. And the many Gacha games. Companies are not your friend is a global rule.

[@madokakaname8953]

Very glad that you bought Gacha into the topic too. We have too many gachapologists nowadays.

[@cablefeed3738]

At least nintendo doesn't do layoffs, and instead just cut c e o payment

[@abaddon1503]

Louder for the people in the back! People are way too comfortable with individual companies. They treat them as if they’re the dev teams and not as a conglomerate that happens to have that specific dev team. I don’t praise Nintendo for Kirby, I praise Hal Labs for Kirby.

[@TheNameIessKing]

Ngl I really hope that other massive game development studios behind games like elden ring, skyrim, etc, come together to send Nintendo to court for their BS. After all, all these games would be affected by patents such as the mount patent.

[@Legonist1]

This may be relevant news, Palworld updated the game 2 days ago to remove the ability to throw your pals out (they now appear next to you) and removed the aiming reticle when you are not aiming.

[@GrieverIIDX]

The "worst" lawsuit I remember is Konami v. Roxor Games. Konami didn't like Roxor creating kits for their old DDR cabinets (kitting cabinets is standard coin-op industry practice). They also had a patent for pressing up, down, left, and right in time with music... Konami failed to meet the demand of the western coin-op market. By the time the Super Nova machine was released, popularity was waning.

[@KnownAsKenji]

Kinda funny considering how all-in Konami has been on arcade/gambling parlors in the past years, and not focused on gaming.

[@YammoYammamoto]

I will never buy a single game from Nintendo ever again. They're morally and creatively bankrupt.

[@four-en-tee]

I haven't touched a modern Nintendo game in over a year now. The Steam Deck has been occupying a lot of my time recently.

[@mimszanadunstedt441]

The fact you can lose what u earn in splatfests by being too busy the next day, is a load of shit and why i stopped playing. And Bayonetta 2, I bought Bayonetta, not yugioh, Why is Marik trying to join my party lol. And BotW was too open-empty. Get lost, and there is nothing to do. Its like Jack and Daxter but empty.

[@jamesThebulbmin]

*pirates of the Caribbean theme starts playing*

[@YammoYammamoto]

@@jamesThebulbmin The only nintendo game I ever even had an urge to play - was after watching BreathOfTheWild - but I got Elden Ring. :D

[@jamesThebulbmin]

@YammoYammamoto botw is definitely a different game and it and it's sequel are definitely worth playing you don't get in trouble for sailing the 7 seas

[@Supreme-Power]

lets not forget craftopia released in 2020 with the throwing mechanic too, also made by pocketpair

[@BlueBD]

Has everyone forgot about Pixilmon? Features the same mechanics and was first released in 2013. It's a Minecraft mod.

[@neeneko]

yep, that would check the box too. there were multiple minecraft mods in that area that had similar mechanics.. so even if nintendo wanted to argue that pixelmon was some kind of pokemon rip off, something like industrial forgoing would be harder.

[@fangofshadows5371]

Dragon Quest Monsters literally predates pokemon but you don't see them going after that series at all

[@Dorrovian]

Moon Channel has very good analysis from lawyer point of view, arguing that Nintendo is trying to stop not exactly Pocketpair developers, but Sony. Edit to make it clear: Moon Channel, not Moon. Different creators.

[@gorillagroddgaming]

Who is moon channel? The conspiracy channel? He’s one of the worst channels. Refuses to talk about the juice and thinks the male loneliness epidemic is caused by video games and corn. Wouldn’t bother watching him tbh.

[@Dorrovian]

@@gorillagroddgaming Not Moon, Moon Channel. Different creator.

[@dychostarr]

To be fair, this vid I've read is fairly well done by them. I just refuse to watch after the extreme reaches the guy did to try and paint The Completionist as a "misrepresentation" done by Karl/Muta. He had a few points, but too many bad faith arguments to give Jirard an out for not donating charity money and lying about it. I won't say he only does bad research as again the vid about this event is positive. Just hard to wash the bad faith in one vid for another.

[@Dorrovian]

@@dychostarr I know about it, but he admitted his mistake, apologised and took down the video. For me it's enough.

[@dychostarr]

​@Dorrovian i assume as a current watcher it makes it easy and him being so quick to apologize when he does a good deal of vids with no problems that makes sense. My issue as an outsider is this and makes it difficult for me to see through the hurdle. BUT, I'd be in bad faith if I didn't also say that most people's reactions have been positive here and the like. So more power to the guy for keeping up that route

[@LordStrell]

As much of a Nintendo fan as I am, I do want Nintendo to get a black eye for once. They’re going way too far constantly and the fact they’re going for a win in Japan knowing they cannot win in the US is proving that they know they’re in the wrong. US patent office won’t honor the patent claim because of how ideas are absolutely insanely difficult to get patents for and have to be exceptionally unique and specific. The nemesis system has a loophole given that it’s only how it was implemented down to exact specifications within shadows of war. If someone were to take a system inspired by it with enough differentiated parts the mechanics would not be considered infringement. Nintendo is really only doing this because they realized they screwed up scarlet and violet badly and there is already a lot of blood in the water regarding Pokemon. They are not wanting competition especially since the franchise is at a vulnerable point given its been stagnant with releases outside of mobile games.

[@vixxcelacea2778]

You can like what a company produces and hate the company. Same as art vs artist. Nintendo themselves though are just holders of the real MVP's that make the games you and many others love. It sucks that the attachment goes to a publisher, not the actual people and companies that make the games, because they're the face of the umbrella of repertoire we attach ourselves to.

[@ROFLWAFFLELAWL4]

To be fair Nintendo has filed lawsuits several times before and actually have lost a few of those. So fingers crossed the same happens here, though in those cases they lost I think they weren't within the Japanese jurisdiction so it might not go as smoothly here.

[@SciRei7H3dEG3NeR4T3]

I recently played PocketPair's previous game, Craftopia. And while the capture mechanic isn't as refined or focused as Palworld's capturing mechanic, it still pretty much the same capture method. So if we wanna play who's on first, Craftopia was released on 2020, while Pokemon Arceus was released on 2022. So...

[@neonswift]

Nintendo as a family friendly company are surprisingly a bully.

[@Cakehai]

Nintendo: **sees a competitor in the creature catching genre** “Lets go into a expensive lawsuit to try to shut them down instead of spending that money on making our own game better to beat them” Me: “Tf am i witnessing😟”

[@marcosdheleno]

its nintendo, making shit worse because they are assholes is nothing new. didnt they sued to try and force monopoly on video game development back in the 90's?

[@GOLD4DJ]

Imagine somebody patent the process of making bread and then try to enforce it on the entire world. Then Big Bread sues you for using their patent.

[@SocialisedPsychopath]

dayz also beat pokemon to the idea, they added an item in april 2021 called "eggsperimental capsule" where you throw a easter egg at animals/zombies and can catch it to release it later It was added for the easter event food for thought, plenty more examples

[@chrisspellman5952]

Remember folks, Nintendo spends more time suing folks than spending time on things like, new game ideas, polishing up games that are to be released so they can even get to 30 fps, or even finishing up the Switch (yeah, the Switch has fewer features than the 3DS and it runs awful). Remember all this when the next Nintendo console comes out. Don't buy it. They've clearly had too much success over the last 40 years in video games and are the Ubisoft/EA of consoles. Don't buy Nintendo products. Not the console, the games, or the merch. If you want them to do better, stop giving them money, let them sweat it out, force them to learn. If you keep giving them money when they behave poorly, they learn nothing.

[@malpheus4299]

Game mechanic patents are far too problematic for how much companies abuse them.

[@44burn1]

Ubisoft did it first. Assassin's Creed should sue Legend of Zelda. Square Enix did it first. Dragon Quest should sue Pokemon. Turnabout is fair play, Nintendo. If you win this battle, you will lose this war as the world will throw you to the wolves.

[@NoNo-el8gj]

What did AC do before Zelda? Isn't it younger by a wide margin?

[@44burn1]

@NoNo-el8gj Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom stole climbing a tower to reveal portions of a map from every Assassin's Creed game. Nintendo shouldn't be throwing stones.

[@nw8608]

Craftopia(another game by Pocket Pair) also had capturing pets with thrown spheres back in 2020 or at least September 2021(based on a quick youtube search for video evidence as I have not personally played it).

[@vicariousmonarch]

As of currently they have removed the ability to toss a pal sphere, now only being able to spawn your pals next to you on summon.

[@danmiy12]

not much they can do about that, they took a early rushjob to fix it and now everyone on the forums is complaining, funny enough not to pocket pair but to nintendo. It is one of the biggest anti nintendo forums i ever seen. Hopefully pocket pair will fix the clipping into the floor part of the new spawn in the pals mechanic.

[@vicariousmonarch]

​@@danmiy12as long as we can still play it I'm not complaining, they will get it fixed when they can.

[@fientjuhhwowsl4610]

it probally was also needed due to this court battle can take long. or who knows sony or microsoft told it to change beforehand to avoid being pulled from storefronts. (the ps version released end sept just. and japan is even also launched)

[@gwentarinokripperinolkjdsf683]

I think you got the legal side of things wrong in this video. The pattent is an amended patent IIRC which basically means it is a more specific version of 1 or multiple patents that had a prior date

[@TheDragonLegacy]

Oh no! The thought of throwing a sphere and counting to 3! If only that wasn't a basic thing that shouldn't have been patented.

[@xanderlyc2038]

The irony of this is that Pal Spheres only shake twice. Nobody's talking about that.

[@ReaperTheRogue]

Fun fact pocket pairs previous game craftopia released in 2020 and has the same ball catching mechanic, meaning they did it first