Noam Chomsky - Lula da Silva, Bolsonaro, and the politics of Brazil: The Origins Podcast

[@tocatoca6145]

People saying Noam is dishonest maybe are the same people that are used to listen Olavo De Carvalho...

[@globaldigitaldirectsubsidi4493]

some rich Brazilians upset of Noam´s ruthless truthspeak in the comments.

[@Lucan47]

@Cassio Alteirosa Then you are even more stupid, for defending our oppressors.

[@joaotavares078]

eu moro em ipanema. aqui no rio quem elegeu bolsonaro foi preriferia. aq na zona sul o haddad venceu.

[@m.s.nicotdiinc.7645]

Damn that's the dumbest thing I heard in a good while. "Some rich brazilians..." Speaking like you know a thing about brazil's current politics. Lula WAS the elite. If you knew a tiny bit of how the elections went, you'd know that the majority of "rich brazilians" voted for Lula's puppet: Haddad. He had the support of the mainstream media, a HUGE support from celebrities and support from others politicians of different political parties. I live right next to a "favela" (Santa Aliança, Bangu, Rio de Janeiro), so believe me when I say the majority of the poor brazilians voted Bolsonaro (at least in Rio de Janeiro). All you gotta do is ask around. As surprising as this may be, I didn't vote Bolsonaro, but you bet I didn't vote for Haddad (Lula) either. Bolsonaro is a dumbass and also, I believe, corrupt, however if you think Lula is a honorable man, you're either lying or didn't bother looking up all the corruption scandals he's involved. Noam has the knowledge, but he's being dishonest on how he goes about taking only the good stuff about Lula and spreading it publicly and sweeping EVERYTHING bad about him under the carpet. How do you think Bolsonaro won the election against Haddad (again, Lula's puppet) seeing that the majority of Brazil's population is poor and good part of the rich actually declared their support to Haddad?

[@m.s.nicotdiinc.7645]

@@joaotavares078 É uma pena ver gringo acreditando tanto em politico brasileiro com tanta idolatria. Ainda mais o Lula. E nem sou fã de Bolsonaro

[@marcelonoah]

Crystal clear. Brilliant analysis.

A surfaced view... Based on what TV shows??? How is that? Mr Noam's speech is equalized and biased to me also

[@Rafaranne]

It's a sad time in our country right now. We're in a very dangerous path for all of the reasons Professor Chomsky said and much more, such as the overwhelming increase in deforestation of the Amazon Forest in 2019 compared to same period of last year. That alone is enough to bring attention to the current destructive, anti-science, lunatic governement we unfortunetly elected.

[@Cebola123100]

Aos poucos as pessoas vão abrir os olhos

[@fabiengerard8142]

Of course, as it’s always occurred so far for millenia, one generation after the other… Except humankind is presently facing an unprecedented global ‘overacceleration’ of history. Hence the civilizational dead end.

[@brunopbch]

I wonder what Chomsky has to say about Foro de São Paulo.

[@Lavender_enjoyer]

@Cassio Alteirosa troll

[@henriquemendes7938]

He would probably say the truth: it's a international political convention for left-wing parties from all over Latin America, many of which (though not all of them) are overtly socialist. They meet to discuss political strategy and forge alliances, as expected, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. You are aware of the fact that it is not a crime to be a socialist in these countries, aren't you? On the other hand, in Brazil, IT IS A CRIME to publicly support the Nazi ideology or to use Nazi symbols, as many of Bolsonaro's supporters do (Sarah Winter's gang, for example).

[@henriquemendes7938]

And, please, "Chompsky"? Show some respect for one of the brightest intellectuals of both the 20th and 21th century, a man who almost single-handedly revolutionized an entire field of knowledge (Linguistics) and, at the same time, brought so many important global issues to the public spotlight. You may not agree with him, but there is no need to disrespect him... he is always polite and respectful even towards his fiercest opponents.

[@brunopbch]

@@henriquemendes7938 What do you have to say about Farc leaders in these conventions? I used to be a Chomsky fan. Not anymore. Here is one of the reasons why: kzbin.info/www/bejne/f3vbcmqEetNloMU If you think socialism is any good, I suggest you read the book A Theory of Socialism & Capitalism, by Dr Hans Hoppe. You can find a free pdf copy online.

[@Nermalton77]

There is nothing to say. It's an normal convention of parties. It has very few relevance even for the left-wing parties. There is nothing secret about that. The only one that cares about that is mr. Olavo actually

[@hakel4372]

& now he's back to be the president Congrats Lula & Brazil 🇧🇷🇧🇷

[@rogeriopenna9014]

And has 45% unpopularity rates. It seems he DID surf the commodities wave, unlike Chomsky claims I guess 45% of the population of Brazil is made of elites. We are richn and we didn't know

Oh my god. How can people be so against economical science? Lula got the country with fiscal equilibrium, commodities being sold through the roof, capitalizing all the spent he did. They spent so much that he delivers to Dilma the start of a recession that she made even worst. That is what happens when you do not have a far sight about economics. You spend everything now, and the bill will come later. And the bill came. By the end of 2016 we had 13 million unemployed. That does not happen by magic. It grows through time when a country makes debt after debt trying to "improve" life. That is impossible. He gained a very well balanced country and left a broken one. People were happy because they think Lula saved them, but that would be impossible if the previous government didn't clean the house. That period was the beginning of a catastrophe. It was cristal clear that was going to happen. A bubble was formed. When the commodities sales started to go down, it only accelerated a little the problem that was going to happen, sooner or later. Why? Why people trust in science but not in economical science? Why people take the immediate result and not the long term results of a government action? Lots of people that were benefited by Lula's spending program are now unemployed. We have now a terrible government, one of the worsts, apathetic ever seen. But stupid as it is, the economical problems we have today are not their fault only. One of the worst presidente ever. And we kind knew he was not going to be good, not by the reasons people think, but because he was closer to Lula's economics, himself not his ministerial team, than people realize. Anyway, his main fault, economically speaking, is not doing what should be done, that is taking Brazil to a fiscal equilibrium again. That's what we really needs. But trying to deny or mask the terrible economic plan that Lula did is absurd. It is a completely lack of good analysis.

[@bia221b3]

Olé olé olá, Lula.

[@thecommunistgodsnews443]

Shoutout to Eugenics

[@rodgev160]

I express my big admiration for Chomsky. However, this is just one perspective, but far from the real picture. I'm Brazilian and lived in the country for many years and witnessed the things as they evolved. I voted in Lula. And I regret that. His actions, plans and tactics weren't looking towards the long term, and that ended up with the promise of the impossible and people instead of maintaining themselves in good life, had to return to a miserable life. And Chomsky is not right when he speaks about the discomfort that Lula caused in the elites, actually Lula bonded with them and promoted corruption after corruption. I wish Brazil honestly wakes up and stops believing in those guys like Lula, Bolsonaro, etc. They're all the same. Lula was a big fraud. Sad but true, I didn't expect to be like that, but yes. Careful with what you watch guys.

[@Junior-my9kb]

cala a boca

[@bia221b3]

meu querido, lula voltou. atura ou surta.

[@joshua3171]

spock in the background, "Logically"

[@joshua3171]

the brazilian rich should pool together and rebuild the slums with the help of those living in them, no rent no buy back scheme, no now vote for me, just improve the quality of life and all that will follow will be a real blessing, build wisely not just housing, all the amenities start at 1 end and work though, all new style water recycling solar wind, composting dr's then these trained people can start incorporating it into money those that rich invested now have a pool of people who want to invest make money, crime down lifestyles up, you got to spend a little to make a little, probably end up being the best places to live, keep it a free area land wise otherwise developers will end up pricing it out of existence, keep areas elsewhere for that, any way that's my take on the slums, still slums but now gallums, glamping in a non-gypsy kinda way

[@Lucan47]

@@joshua3171 Sadly the brazillian rich are among the most backwards people in the world. They are selfish and would rather increase security to kill the poor than help lift them out of poverty. Bolsonaro's motto used to be "A good criminal is a dead criminal". Many of the families in power today are still the same from the time Brazil was a colony, most of which are big landowners. They feel entitled to their inherited wealth and land but cry their hearts out against any social program that helps the poor and disenfranchised.

[@sucedeu]

I'm an admirer of Mr. Chomsky. Being born and raised in Brazil and having lived abroad the past 21 years, I must admit the news available on the subject is scarce and biased. I don't disagree with him, but it seems he is unaware that what has taken place is sanctioned and decided by the Brazilian people. Whether good or bad, only time will tell what will really happen. Even Chomsky can't accurately assess, much less predict the political/economic future of Brazil, which is being decided by it's people. At the very least, if proven catastrophically wrong, they are likely to own up and move on...at least one should hope.

[@bashrox]

Ever heard of Chomsky's work → "Manufacturing Consent" ?

[@chickenwing27]

the votes bolsinaro has only accounted for about 37% of the Brazilian population so i would not blame them. it seems as if Brazilians are being disenfranchised, but i cannot speak for you all i do not live there.

[@rodrigobueno4304]

Briliant and perfect analisis by Noam Chomsky!! 👏👏👏👏

[@LetMeThinkItThrough]

Been living in Brazil for some months now. The thing is that everybody above 18 years old is obligated to vote by law. It is mandatory to vote (crazy ikr). The people had to choose between bolsonaro and the party involved in corruption scandal (lula's party). Many think both options were shit but bolsonaro was less shit. Couple of days ago, all of the sudden some judges of the supreme court interpreted the consitution differently (this single time) and let Lula free, waiting for his second apeal (third and last trial) and if that doesn't raise suspicions I don't know what will. The system here is corrupt and built that way for politicians. I mean the class society here is gross, a judge makes 29× more than minimum salary, parlament members have insane amount of budgets... Just the whole system is completely fucked. For example, it is prohibited by law to lay off workers in public sector (this is stupid beyond words). When they had economic crisis since 2014 I think up until recently, the public employees werent paid everymonth and couldnt be fired either😱😱. And I see the mentality is what creates this toxic system, it reflects on the system. They solve their problems by adding more problems, it really is amazing how IQ deprived their "leading class" is. They had a problem once that the parliaments werent doing anything, so their genius solution were to introduce a law which forces parliament to make x amount of votations on laws per year (i think it was). What happens? They make bullshit votations like introducing new holidays and removing some others.. oh my🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️ Noam mentioned social security, just wait for when 'Novo' party wins, basically party for and by bankers and corporate people. They want minimal, decentralized, raw capitalism Brasil. It's gonna be shit show and I will feel sorry for workers in Brasil.

[@rodrigovaz9082]

It's a good perspective. Can u tell me a solucion to all those problems?

[@LetMeThinkItThrough]

@@rodrigovaz9082 Mentality must change. I feel like brazil "solves" problems by enforcing them instead of looking at other alternatives, they go harder/deeper down the hole instead of re-thinking

[@rodrigovaz9082]

@@LetMeThinkItThrough and you are right about It. Mentality must change. But in my point of view, the feeling in the workers class is disguss for the politicians class. As you said, in general we do not fell representated by Lula, Bolsonaro or enyone else.

[@sucedeu]

As if this were a "Brazilian" issue. Every single country on the planet has those same systems and goes through waves of development, growth, and recession. There can't be capitalism without those variables.

[@fabiengerard8142]

Why should mandatory voting be supposed to be ‘crazy’? It has always been that way In Belgium as well, for example, and no one ever complained about it. Where’s the problem ?

[@patrickramon5875]

kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk... JESUS

[@bia221b3]

Olé olé olé olá, Lula

[@rogeriopenna9014]

Lol, the right wing in Brazil accusesv the media of hating Bolsonaro. You know what they say .. when both opposites hate you, maybe you are doing something right

[@thecommunistgodsnews443]

Long live Communism

[@thecommunistgodsnews443]

Long live Stalin

[@Nunes2894]

Mr. Chomsky is speaking about a caricature of a country. Although somewhat agreeing with his core assessment, he downplays (not to say, brush them off completely) the corruption scandals and the very real resentment that led to the right-wing rise in Brazil. This is not helpful to the conversation, especially when we, educated citizens, are tasked to finding real solutions. If you fail to thoroughly frame what happened in 2013 and 2018, you just manage to alienate everyone who's not completely sold on their favorite ideological orthodoxy. It's not helpful to good and competent civil discourse, that we brazilians are so in need of. It is disappointing to hear Mr. Chomsky's take on this matter. Not because I think he's wrong, but because it's a shallow one, formed while observing the development in Brazil from a huge distance, and skewed by the lenses of his own personal experiences and world view. Brazilian politics and society is much more complex than that.

[@bia221b3]

Lula is back, thank God

Ah come on! Lula is a rich guy now, like any politician, wealth, unlike 50 years ago... The workers party did not stopped poverty here, so people elected another one capable of, by democracy, we are only trying to prevent further money washing and robbery incidents. It is not easy to deal with an ideological transition of political parties here, we still have communism ideology parties. The argument in the speech here is all distorted and biased. People want an economic boom, we can not get alone, especially after decades on leechers intervention from all parts of the world. I really respect Mr Chomsky, but sorry for you this time.

[@Lucan47]

Trying to prevent further money washing and robbery by electing a family of money washers and robbers with ties to violent extorsion paramilitary groups? Well good job, Bolsonaro voters managed to make things even worse... Like, Bolsonaro himself has been a politician for 30 years now, doing basically nothing except draining public money and teaching his sons to do the same.

[@bia221b3]

O que ele falou que é mentira? Nada, absolutamente nada. Apenas falou verdades e deu seu ponto de vista.

[@flaviosalgado2108]

Are you serious? When you want to understand the Brazilian political story you need to be serious. See the things in a particularly way only mess the understanding. Try to do a methodological research, not a superficial one. Brazil is too complex for beginners

[@bia221b3]

Aprende que é o Chomsky depois você volta para comentar. Apenas o maior linguista vivo e um dos maiores intelectuais do mundos.

[@anamarialouzada8817]

Elogiar o Lula e dizer que a pobreza diminuiu na era Lula. Ridículo.

[@bia221b3]

Ele voltou, graças a Deus.

[@Edi_Jr10]

THE INTERVIEWEE DOESN'T KNOW WHAT THIS IS TALKING ABOUT, LULA HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO CHANCE BRAZIL BUT DIDN'T DO IT, WHILE VARIOUS CITIES IN BRAZIL PEOPLE WITHOUT JOBS WITHOUT STUDY WITHOUT BASIC SANITATION..... LULA WAS WORKING IN OTHER COUNTRIES INVESING TO INVEST IN HIS OWN PAIR SPENDED ALL THE MONEY OF TAX OUTSIDE BRAZIL LAMENTABLE WHAT LULA DID SORRY I AM SO BRAZILIAN I LIVE IN BRAZIL

[@arthurkades4886]

He really believes what he speaks about Brazil?

[@fabianovideotube]

Well... you know... How someone cam say that a influential man like Noam is completely, absolutely far away of reality? It is sad, really. I mean, is like you, a very serious scientist, listening someone tellinig you the earth is flat. Who knows... maybe you can find the other side of the story, call someone that acctually lives here... As I said. It is sad.

[@globaldigitaldirectsubsidi4493]

you are dumb, chomsky is never wrong.

[@Lucan47]

I live here in Brazil and Chomsky was absolutely right. His comments were all surgically precise and show how he still has a very sharp mind. You should question whether you're not the one who has left reality behind...

[@Lucan47]

@Cassio Alteirosa Thanks bot.

[@vitormanoellima9080]

Brasil presidente Jair Bolsonaro Brasil América great Brasil 2 Power world América

[@klarastern5597]

trolls are pathetic.

[@heliogabriel8125]

Ahhaahhahaha teu cu

[@bia221b3]

se fudeu

[@Barachodasilvassauro]

It’s appalling to watch Noam talking about Lula as if he was Mandela. He is cleverly omitting facts to solidify his bias. veja.abril.com.br/blog/veja-international/the-end-of-the-pt-s-history/ I wonder why people pretend to be oblivious to facts as such?: www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-35810578

[@Barachodasilvassauro]

Also, Brazil’s miracle economy growth he speaks of, actually means the expansion of credit to more vulnerable classes. If this info bugs you, just look out for data on Brazil’s debit per capita...