Offset, Track and Width - the differences explained, myths busted

[@einfelder8262]

For anyone wondering a GU Patrol has 0 offset wheels as standard, so you can put maximum -25 rims on. Patrols have a very small centreing ring so it's easy to get the wheel on in the wrong position - that causes the wheel to come off, something many have found to their dismay. Always check your wheel nuts many times after taking a Patrol wheel off, especially as the wheel nut threads are loose cut and will undo themselves easily. The Jackaroo I had years ago had a very tight, very positive centreing ring, impossible to get it wrong, and the nut threads were cut tight and never came loose.

[@L2SFBC]

Thanks, that's really interesting, always wondered why it was Patrol wheels tended to fall off, this explains it!!!

[@MntlMajorkozmo]

Its the same for my series 2 GQ. I might go check the nuts before i spend the 500 bucks on bushes. But ive probably screwed the bushes with the loose wheels lol.

[@slothparade4184]

Cheers mate, answered my question, just about to get through engineering

[@MntlMajorkozmo]

As soon as i saw that fold out bowl and the pvc pipe i knew what was going to happen. Thankyou for the super basic demonstration of it. Which you do quite well with in general. Offset positive and negative measurements always confused me. So this helped a lot. The one time positive means youre moving away from something.

[@L2SFBC]

Glad I could help! Please share :-)

[@stevegoodwin5841]

Excellent vid Robert. Can you go further and get into pros and cons of making such changes, especially for 4x4 and include the scub radius changes and the pros and cons re changing that in your 4x4. Cheers!

[@L2SFBC]

Yes I can, but that was long enough already. Might do another. Basically, the main reason is to fit wider tyres, but wider tyres do not give the offroad performance people think they do (more on that soon too). There is a microscopic reduction in tendency to roll thanks to a wider track, but then you have greater moments as the wheel is further outboard which creates extra stress, potential scrub radius/alignment issue as you mentioned..it's a complex subject.

[@stevegoodwin5841]

@@L2SFBC it is complicated and there is none better than you to tackle the subject. I am sure of that.

[@johnsullivan6709]

@@L2SFBC Scrub is dependent on tire width, hight and offset. Will make for a good follow-up vid explaining how they affect each other. Often see 4x4s with big offsets and wide low profile tires. Ball joint killers.

[@kathyl67]

'I'm great at craft by the way" classic ! 🤣 Great detailed vid too :)

[@erichwise7734]

The reason for that(narrower rear track)…we wont go into here…damn, id love to see a video on just that.

[@turbot6592]

What happens if you have toe out on front wheels. How would you measure the track width from front to back

[@L2SFBC]

Toe does not affect track

[@off-roadingexplained8417]

Awesome as always!

[@L2SFBC]

Thanks again!

[@arunvishnum.e3156]

Hey, I am from India. I am using a van/mpv type vehicle. FWD. It came with 215/65 R16. I have now installed alloys with 25 offset in same tyre spec. Tyres are now pushed outside to the fenders. I want to know whether it creates any issues on vehicle, in long time. Now my steering + ride is a bit harder.

[@L2SFBC]

It will stress the bearings and axles more so yes. Use the original offset if you can.

[@arunvishnum.e3156]

@@L2SFBC Thank You for your reply. I would like to know whether it causes severe issues , as originally the ride came with steelies which I hated for its looks 😂. No 2 Any fix for this and how much offset deviation is safer.

[@placestosea]

thanks for posting, great information.

[@L2SFBC]

Glad it was helpful! please share :-)

[@servicetrucker5564]

How about how large offsets and big wheels eat up wheel bearings and suspension parts

[@L2SFBC]

that is a problem yes

[@EduXploR]

How much effect will 15 mm negative offset will have on fuel consumption and suspension components ?

[@L2SFBC]

Depends on the vehicle and if you mean another 15mm, or 15mm total and if the latter, what the offset was to begin with.

[@EduXploR]

@@L2SFBC Thank you for your response. I use a Maruti Celerio with 45 ET in stock rims which I replaced with alloys having 30 ET, effectively popping tyres 15 mm out.

[@L2SFBC]

Probably no effect you'd notice then

[@CliveWebbAustralia]

Great video...

[@L2SFBC]

Glad it was helpful! please share :-)

[@simmobandicoot]

Great video Robert, so is there a legal way to fix the 'track' issue with the LandCruisers please? If not what's the closest remedy please? Makes you wonder how Toyota was allowed to do what they did, whereas we wouldn't be allowed to do such a modification. Thanks 👍

[@L2SFBC]

A few companies offer replacement axles which fixes the track, or go for the Mark's Adaptors portal.

[@Agent.K.]

Why spacers are not recommended? Is there a reason other than legality?

[@L2SFBC]

I would suggest wider offset wheels instead. Spacers just add another thing to go wrong, they may not fully seat the lug nut (did you know that it is a legal requirement for aftermarket wheels to have the same thread engagement as OEM? well it is, and it was a surprise to an aftermarket company when I showed them the doc). Spacers often give a LOT of offset/track increase which can cause significant problems, and it'll lower something called the roll centre of gravity and while lowering that sounds good, it's not always. Most spacers aren't hub-centric, so the weight of the wheel is taken on the studs, and it should be on the hub. And how do you check the tightness of the space bolts, like you would the actual studs? It's really complex. Also, in Australia track increase limits can be achieved with different wheel offsets, so there's no reason to go for spacers except for cost, and when it comes to the interface between wheel and hub...it's not an area to skimp on.

[@Mike_Costello]

@@L2SFBC This one answer right here is it's own video. Especially when so many American car modification YT channels use spacers which may lead to a misunderstanding of their application in Australia and the risks of spacers generally as it's not often discussed whatever country the source material comes from. They are cheap compared to wheels and can easily be mail ordered from the US so I'd like to see a video on basically the answer you gave above.

[@Agent.K.]

@@L2SFBC I appreciate your reply. In the past I’ve heard about wheel spacers being bad, but in recently I see many guys using them and saying they’re not as bad as the claims and companies now a days make them better. As you mentioned cost is usually the reason.

[@L2SFBC]

Thanks, there's SO many topics I have on the list but unfortuately, I don't have the necessary team of 100 to knock even 1% off! That answer was the brief one btw :-)

[@philhealey449]

Both greater offset and spacers will increase wheel bearing loads and often reduce bearing life dramatically.

[@enriquemorenodevega6610]

Robert, let me make a point, because I believe that, starting at the minute kzbin.info/www/bejne/faeloZuho7SgjsU , you are incorrectly using the term "increase the offset" to get a "wider track". I think it's the other way around, the more you reduce the offset (if it's a positive offset), or it becomes more negative, the track (wider) increases.

[@L2SFBC]

Yes...it's confusing and you're right. If the offset number decreases the track gets wider so there's more offset.

[@josephineyao888]

Axle swap > Spacer

[@L2SFBC]

yep!

[@Drunken_Hamster]

Australia is too restrictive.