Old things & Children

Data meets his "father" (or creator) Dr. Soong, who he has very little memory of. Data is curious about many things, in particular, why was he created.
www.faithalivelc.org
For entertainment purposes only.

[@metsrus]

This scene is extremely brilliant, not just because of the engaging conversation. Dr. Soong is actually using the Socratic method to teach Data.

[@benjaminhackett8896]

Very well, too! I'm glad it didn't go unnoticed.

[@11Kralle]

Maieotics - "the art of the midwives"

[@judithsixkiller5586]

I think that he's also trying to make Data realize that he's already had his own form of emotional sentience from the start, Data has always tried to be kind and considerate to reach out to other's even when it was inconvenient.And he doesn't accept rude behavior from those who should know better gladly. Data was always been hoped for and loved by his own " Father". It's a bit like the moment in The Wizard of Oz when Glinda tells Dorthy; "You've always had the power within you, You just had to learn it for yourself!"!" I wonder what David Hanson and Sophia have actually said to each other? A few years of heavy interface experience and R&D might eventually create a real sentience in AI.

[@trollme.trollmehard.9524]

So...I regularly teach by asking questions, to lead people into analysis. It also happens that they surprise me and I learn something new. Is this that method?

[@hardyblues2194]

@@trollme.trollmehard.9524 Yes, it's a way to lead the student to the solution by only asking questions. But there is alot of divided opinions regarding this topic. I have the feeling the dude only wanted to sound smart...I'm sure he doesn't know squat about greek philosophy ;) Read "menon" by platon to learn more about it.

[@neilsanghvi5229]

As an 'old thing', TNG is itself to be cherished, a shrine even.

[@hobomike6935]

It aged very well. It had some terrible episodes but most of it is still very applicable and makes the viewer think 🤔 about important stuff outside the show

[@Spazticspaz]

Kirkman Desecrating the shrine: MAKE PICARD AN ANDROID BLOW UP DATA AND MORE EXPLOSIONS!!!!

[@johntrevy1]

Agreed. Picard is the father you never had, but needed.

[@DeltaAssaultGaming]

It’s way better than anything they’re airing now as “Star Trek.”

[@DamplyDoo]

Too bad you can't watch it unless you subscribe to another crap service. Or pirate

[@bbenjoe]

One of the best episodes I say. Also: Data - played by Brent Spiner. Dr. Noonian Soong - played by Brent Spiner. Lore - played by Brent Spiner.

[@PointyTailofSatan]

I wonder if he got 3 times his normal pay. lol

[@mamat8184]

It's easy to see why Patrick Stewart said he considers Brent Spiner to be one of the most talented actors he's worked with.

[@Nine-Signs]

@@mamat8184 Which was a compliment that was worth far more until Patrick recently said of the writers for Picard TV show that "They are some of the most talented writers I have ever worked with"

[@BerzerkSquid]

@@Nine-Signs some in celeb terms mean not really

[@Nine-Signs]

@@BerzerkSquid You suggest Patrick was effectively goading us to read between the lines while saving face in front of the corporations who have him on a leash via contract. Possible.

[@ecroft1000]

its difficult to realise that he is actually talking to himself throughout this

[@thesilverrook3502]

I actually teared up a little thinking about that. It's much the same, as a parent seeing themselves in their children.

[@flyhyland]

Jeeze, even though I knew I didn't even realise that while watching this after so many years lol.

[@alexhawkins1795]

Erica Croft Data or Soong

[@quantessenz]

Yes? Wow, good job. Stunning make up for that time and budget!

[@jasonleslie203]

Truly a great actor

[@sharkyfish3492]

Dr Soong was loving caring father, always teaching Data lessons. Data was more human then he ever knew.

[@Elly3981]

Data eventually became human in every way except for his physical body. Brent Spiner played him beautifully.

[@engineero73]

Genius level conversation! How he steered data to the answer is pure genius! Then again, this is Dr. Soong we're talking about.

[@definitelynotobama6851]

It’s actually the Socratic method.

[@DouglasZwick]

0:25 - You know what Michelangelo used to say? "Cowabunga."

[@tsogobauggi8721]

Lol... :)

[@facelessdrone]

LMAOOOO

[@lancer525]

I thought that was Leonardo...

[@sharkyfish3492]

and.. PIZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZA

[@sokratessiou]

One of the best conversations in all the Star Trek saga!!!! I love the wisdom that star trek tried to convey to its audience...

[@DMalenfant1]

Some was wisdom, some was outright foolishness.

[@DMalenfant1]

okay 3rd grade.

[@DMalenfant1]

doctorwho0077 lame

[@hankyboy42594]

Fake wisdom

[@SisyphusianSaturnite]

It's too bad it's too smart/wise for today's audience.

[@jasonleslie203]

I like how he uses a question to answer another question while having data work out the answer in his own way.

[@rfmerrill]

He would have been a very successful teacher!

[@danielblair4413]

It's often better for one to discover an answer for themselves rather than for someone else to supply the answer because if one discovers the answer for themselves you are more likely to hold it as a greater truth that you won't soon let go of.

[@jasonleslie203]

@@danielblair4413 in this case i would agree. Its a way of answering while helping them come to the answer on their own. But also it was a good way for "the father" to see how "his son" has progressed in life. And getting a unique view of how data has perceived humanity's perceptions, an enriching experience for the dad.

[@stillagamer3603]

This is called the Socratic Method

[@rosson1983]

What an undervalued and underrated actor Brent Spiner is. The way he can portray an inquisitive android devoid of emotion on one hand, and a human being with all it’s faults and facets on the other is quite special. Even seeing him in other films and shows he’s good enough that he’s not ‘that guy who plays Data on Star Trek.’

[@adamsanter9385]

Brent Spiner is such a brilliant actor that will be remembered for thousands of years to come

[@Thraxraganharapollyus]

Tourettes guy

[@Elly3981]

I don't know of any actor other than Brent who could make an emotionless robot character so charming and adorable to audiences. He is wonderful in his other film roles too.

[@laurenjcoates]

The writing here is stellar, and Brent Spiner is such an amazing actor for bringing both characters to life

[@ApostolowitzMK]

They don't write such brilliant dialogs anymore. Inside nor outside of the Star Trek franchise.... Deep, inspiring, meaningful & philosophical scenes like these are a rarity nowadays. Live Long & Prosper Data🖖

[@Solidfact42]

Brent Spiner...such a versatile actor, played so many different roles and many of them in one particular show. There are quite a few actors who play multiple roles but often end up seeming like largely the same character throughout. But Brent's characters always felt (at least to me) to be very different from each other.

[@vk_o2540]

"And to yours as well, Data" = you are my son

[@BlueGuitarMusic]

I came here to parse memes not to feel emotions. T_T

[@pclifton4]

I wished they added Data telling Soong he had created a child of his own as he had in the episode the Offspring

[@danielblair4413]

Did the Offspring occur before or after this episode? I'm thinking it was after, but I could be wrong about that.

[@ValiantWrestling]

@@danielblair4413 It was before this episode. The Offspring was Season 3 episode 16. Brothers was Season 4 episode 3.

[@Elly3981]

@@ValiantWrestlingIf the Offspring happened before this episode, then it might explain why Data was able to answer his own question. When he created Lal, he didn't know that Dr. Soong and Lore were still alive. He believed himself to be the only android of his kind in existence and didn't want his father's legacy to be lost when he finally expired since even androids don't last forever.

[@morbius109]

Noonien Soong was a brilliant man. He created the most unique, dynamic, incredible androids ever. He would be imitated often, but never truly duplicated. You see some of his genius here. He asked Data a question in reply to his question, and steered him to the answer, but let him make his own conclusions. In the process, he taught a valuable lesson to Data, and answered the original question. And this facet of Star Trek alone (pre JJ Abrams, anyway), these making you think moments, the periods of reflective contemplation, are part of what makes it so unique. Excellent scene.

[@Elly3981]

Even a real child might as their parents why they had them. This isn't really any different. He doesn't say it but I also think that Dr. Soong created Data and Lore because he never had children of his own.

[@Bearded18Dragon]

Dr Soong reminds me of Miracle Max from princess bride

[@djones148]

yeees.

[@D2and2D]

True life to ones creations is a very worthy cause, nothigns better....Except a nice MLT, mutton lettuce and tomato when the mutton is nice and leeeeaaannnn....

[@Aminuts2009]

Have fun storming the castle! Will it work? It would be a miracle.

[@alanam1439]

totally!

[@pterodactylptroll]

Oh no! 😂 I can't unread that. That's all I can see now.

[@andrewwatts1997]

Do not give answers directly, let them think through the steps needed to come to the conclusion. A powerful teaching method.

[@Hiraghm]

"Creation is an act of love" - Michelangelo, "The Agony and the Ecstasy"

[@tmaz85]

Guys who wrote these episodes were brilliant

[@FATillery]

Indeed my friend...indeed. We have much to learn from them if only we would.

[@Castlecoke]

They were educated and geniuses

[@ryanm7263]

"Tear that old canon down, it's hanging in rags! Film me something new, something with tits, explosions, and lens flares!" -- J.J. Abrams

[@marsneedstowels]

The only thing I think millennials bring down is Star Trek. JJ and Discovery. I can't.

[@sleepinggorilla]

Soong gets Data to vocalize how he feels about him. Data you give my life meaning and purpose.

[@nytrodioxide]

I love the end part where Soong lightly gives Data's face a lil fatherly slap.

[@monx84]

love that face

[@milesthompson9157]

I love Star Trek this is a really nice video data is my favorite character

[@adamsanter9385]

Happy Father's Day, Dr. Noonian Soong

[@mmartinez9764]

I always thought this was a great scene explaining parents and in some way the human condition

[@stanleydenning]

A point well taken and thoroughly thought over. As I, at 59 years of age, have never procreated. May as well be a good thing.

[@animemanXLK]

In essence Dr Soong created his androids to achieve a measure of immortality and so never be forgotten

[@slinkerdeer]

What a pity Data was destroyed in Nemesis

[@Siegberg91]

@@slinkerdeer still data saving his crew means part of him lives on in each of them. As do Dr Soong archivements.

[@PurpleMetal75]

Some old thing from the past brought me here.

[@mikeymcmikeface5599]

Q?

[@movieclipz1441]

You can tell he loves Mr Data also has a sense of humour tapping Mr Data on the face, like he would his own son 🤗 Also Mr Data's reaction to being tapped on the face 😂

[@Elly3981]

Well, Data is his son since Dr. Soong created him. Dr. Soong doesn't say it, but he probably created Data and Lore because he never had children of his own.

[@Hatsuharu1987]

The 3 dislikes are from people who really don't like old things.

[@Talon3000]

This is exactely why I love the real star trek and why I despise what JJAbrams has done with that new.. stuff.

[@Nine-Signs]

7 years, things didn't get better.

[@tsogobauggi8721]

Sad but true. :(

[@a2ndopynyn]

The new series is even more awful, preachy and trite. Honestly, Seth McFarlane's "The Orville" is the _real_ new Star Trek.

[@johnmcallister7833]

This is why Discovery/Picard hurts my soul. They took away the exploration, diplomacy, peace, and overall main gist of TOS - the TNG era. Enterprise was pushing it, but anything JJ Abrams or beyond is just unwatchable.

[@manuelodabashian]

Beautiful question!

[@ShermerHighSchool]

TNG is forever cool! I dream of living on that ship, playing poker with the gang, having a drink in Ten Forward and relaxing to the soothing hum of the Warp Core... I dream of that often :)

[@montyscott1907]

WE LOVE YOU DATA!!!!❤

[@0714will]

My favorite. Thx!

[@tachyontee3877]

You are his favorite son Data. You're creation help greatly to give his life meaning.

[@shawnsimmons1308]

Brilliant!!

[@Berniefthomas68]

Everybody loves this for clear and obvious reasons

[@RobeonMew]

This explains were data gets his silver tongue from

[@shaalis]

Same as was said with Ghost in the Shell's Doctor Haraway.

[@businessbusiness9407]

Killer writing, killer acting. 10/10

[@douglaslundin4506]

And moments later Lore kills his dad.

[@judithsixkiller5586]

It had a few undertones of the Odin , Thor and Loki dysfunctional dynamic.

[@roberthurd328]

Love it

[@sarahkinsey5434]

I think Brent Spiner was partially impersonating Jimmy Stewart as Noonien Soong. I wonder how many hours of makeup he had to go through. I always feel bad for the actors who have to do this, but it's definitely worth it!

[@DelcoRanz93]

Brent Spiner actually does a mean Jimmy Stewart impression, Watch the first season Gag Reel.

[@nytrodioxide]

I think for the Soong makeup they actually made a face mask that went over his head as opposed to separate prosthetic pieces such as with the Klingons, so the makeup prep time was much less work than the usual makeup for a Ferengi or other aliens.

[@Artisan1979]

I wish the good doctor was one of my university professors. I could listen to his theories all day as much as I could Tom Baker giving lectures. Excellent use of the Socratic method as a commentary before me observed

[@VonSpud]

Awesome!

[@gerardcousineau3200]

Words of wisdom but their is more to it

[@natalieschannel7675]

One of my favorite TNG episodes

[@reelsoffortuneslotsplay4267]

Actually the truth and the pain of this truth is seen here and in Voyager with the man who created the EMH... The pain he felt from his creations not serving their intended purpose was the same pain Soong felt with Lore.... Parents are only as happy as their saddest child...

[@nobody-wk6ej]

And then abrams and kurtzman ruined everything forever... .

[@artygunnar]

You wont get this in the new treks! Lets hope Picard brings some of this magic back.

[@mummra4ever]

Doubt it. It's written by Alex Kurtzman. He's not capable of this kind of good writing.

[@juanchocorleone]

I'm from the future. Sadly, "Picard" is nothing like TNG.

[@zairman]

@@juanchocorleone Was never going to be exactly like it. That's what people can't get past. It's still pretty good though.

[@darksky1186]

I loved Picard. There was a lot of emotion to it. Plenty of wonderful conversations like these.

[@Obese_Pterodactyl]

@@darksky1186 You're a bot. Picard is absolute trash.

[@danielwilliamson6180]

I had liked to believe Dr. Soong created Data to learn about humanity.

[@aionarkhe5260]

TNG was such an intellectual masterpiece of a series. Far too intelligent to survive in today's audience. This scene sort of plays out what many episodes did to the viewer - made them think their way right into a philosophical conundrum. It's a pity to think many new viewers today don't even have the basic free thinking requisites to pick up on all of the nuances these episodes were packed with. :/

[@noeditbookreviews]

Oh wow. I'm reading The Selfish Gene right now and this scene really reminds me of that book.

[@mikeymcmikeface5599]

Well played.

[@evanerickson7416]

Even after this question; Some of can answer this. Yet most of us can't, at least not in our correct terms or diction or whatever we may fancy.. Yet under certain circumstances we all know that meaning, it may not present it at first, but in the end when all is known to look for it... it may be found.

[@nicholerubes2959]

I wonder if data ever wonder why he was never a thing to Dr. Soong but a son. A child of his. Everyone judge him to be a thing but to the one who made him that was his son. His pride.

[@I86282]

F****** awesome.!

[@monx84]

"Always did love that face."

[@MrV902]

DATA, *I AM YOUR FATHER*

[@user-qj8gn5nl4e]

Clever

[@catherinebland2717]

Nostalgia

[@nathanielhellerstein5871]

We like old things because they've survived.

[@amoral_minority]

The past is information, data to be analyzed to understand the present and make predictions about the future. It is what makes any progress possible.

[@thedirtinyoureye2133]

At first i didn't knew it was Brent either, until that houston accent hit-

[@Chom-Chom]

good god why didnt i see this instead of the movies

[@chrishubbard64]

I wonder, for a human, being led to figure out the answer for yourself serves to help us remember it, and understand it more than just being told. Does that apply to Data as well? Does the answer mean more to him than if Soong had just flat out said, "I did it because you are like my own child, a legacy for me to leave behind after I am gone."

[@TheMelbournelad]

This circles back to the end of season 1 of Picard. Nice

[@tihoprskalo7719]

Bro I am Tiho_prskalo

[@cleanerben9636]

Nutrek just completely destroyed this idea by having data die.

[@THEC.O.VISIT.]

What an epic scene. As if we could ask God...why?? Classic scene

[@jaridwilliams739]

damn that was deep

[@gude1037]

This dialog is like Sokrates talking to his students using the "question everything" technique.

[@ahmedhussain999]

That's my boy.....

[@randyhayden3159]

The meaning of life explained 32 years ago

[@Arkalius80]

I kind of wonder why they used Brent Spiner in makeup for Dr Soong instead of just hiring an elderly actor.

[@lindaliriel]

Because Spiner is so talented he could pull it off and it was probably fun for him to play something different.

[@Bellicosy]

I wonder then, whose hand stroked Datas face at the end?

[@janosmarothy5409]

On top of giving Spiner a chance to work his chops, it's also thematically significant (almost to the point of becoming a sci-fi trope nowadays) that Soong would make Data "in his own image" - after all, their discussion is about (im)mortality and (pro)creation

[@ComradeRemus]

For one thing, it establishes that Soong created most of his androids to resemble himself.

[@Moviefan2k4]

A stand-in, more than likely. Guy Vardaman was Brent Spiner's main photo double on the show, and also doubled his hands as Data on numerous occasions. However, he was in the hospital due to a car crash, when this episode was filmed...so it was probably a crew member.

[@anthonystephenson4180]

Simple question..Why ? Tougher to answer...

[@malnourish9818]

he acts so much like lore

[@eleonoraformatoneeszczepan8807]

Lineage, of various forms. Interesting juxtaposition, of the elaborate chair made by man from, what was, with an elaborate head made by man from, what was not.

[@peronkop]

I see Data inherented his sharp inhales from his maker.

[@victorsalisbury3554]

Because I was told truth

[@JordanBeagle]

Ah, the full clip! KZbin knew

[@bbenjoe]

Both are played by the same actor :D

[@mikeymcmikeface5599]

Aren't you clever.

[@discontinuity7526]

awww that's his pa :')

[@hmmmmm6056]

Well Data...Arik Soong didn't feel he could perfect humanity....he decided to try with artificial life....Noonian may have inherent Arik's work and completed the work. However, I like Noonien Soong's explanation better.

[@askjeevescosby2928]

Ide love for them to make a animated show about the origin of data and lore. Start off with lore as the hero and watch as he is replaced by data. But they would probably fill it with garbage politics like they did with the new shows.

[@StrangeDuck]

when i watched this the first time i was like, "i thought soong was a human?"

[@catalinastan1170]

I prefer Data to Dr. Soong. And it is the same actor.

[@justincase6655]

Why didn't Michael Angelo scribble that first line was the scribble of life

[@TheRealTorG]

Data should've asked him about that raggedy old bald cap.

[@20x20]

1:21 "If you brought a Newfie into Earth" you got something against boys from The Rock, Singh?

[@metal87power]

Data vs. David from Alien franchise.

[@Thescott16]

When Star Trek was written by scientists and philosophers... instead of the whims of social media trends.

[@markdfreak]

So sad Dr Soong wasn't able to see his grand daughter grow up to be Dora the Explorer.

[@scratchdog2216]

May I ask you a question? You just did.

[@thomasvillanueva7960]

Is there a chance the this character inspires heathledgers joker a bit?

[@emilyrose9854]

1:22 what alien race is the doctor referring to?

[@koshi6505]

And this is why Data chooses suicide in the end.

[@victorsalisbury3554]

Old thing king 🤴🏽 ✨️ build city energy 9 to 1 power cell

[@mattv5122]

Hello from 2023