OUTSIDE CONSUMER UNITS...A CONTROVERSIAL TOPIC!! HERE'S MY VIEW.

[@jonathangriffiths4635]

I've been an electrician for 40 years since leaving school. JIB graded technician, it was 15th IEE regs when i was at college. How sad am i, i run my own business, work all day and then get fed up with paperwork in the evening and end up watching other electricians on KZbin. Most are what i call new wave electricians, Part P and domestic installers WTF, you're an electrician or not. I like this chap and good old Thomas Nagy when he was around, you always learn from someone, most keyboard warriors are knobheads who haven't got a clue. forget the idiots who slate anything, you a do a good job mate

[@sotaelectrical]

Hi mate, thank you for taking the time to comment and watch my video, much appreciated, points taken! Hope you have a good evening sir!

[@wiganPrayersman5177]

Nice from fuse box,with a IP67 consumer unit. When fitted EV chargers if like what you are doing with no access to the consumer unit in the house ,we had to take the internals out a indoor consumer unit and put them in a IP67 enclose with a locking door. We used to use 16mm tails as it was easy to get them inside. As long as you silicone around the screw holes on the IP67 consumer you should be OK, top and sides is a good idea.

[@rogerthomas7040]

LOL, I love the idea of separating networking cables and mains - any large office space has the network cables and mains cables snake under the floor together so that they can be presented at the floor boxes spread around the building. If you have concerns you spec up higher grade 'cat' cables, shielded network cabling or just use fiber, what you don't do is try and worry about maintaining separation as it will never be maintained during the life of the installation as someone will be around in a few years to mess it all up. A good design is one that expects what is known as "Alien Crosstalk" and can operate with the worst possible outcome.

[@urho1]

Found out about your YT channel last week and have to say you make one of the best content on sparkie channels here. Cheers from Finland, also sparkie.

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you mate really appreciate that 👍👍

[@Mattyysimpsonphotography]

The power and data cable issues come more into effect when tight together say in flexi/conduit, if you need to run them together then use Shielded (FTP) like the do in the EV ultra cable and you're good to go

[@sotaelectrical]

Thanks for the info 👍👍

[@davideyres955]

Love the fact your attitude it willing to learn and share. That why I subbed after watching your 1st video. The reason for the cat 5 and power is if you run it in parallel you risk getting emf interference because it runs across a bigger run. Not so much of a problem at the end of the cable especially as you showed the gap between the power and the data connections. It’s a spec so dosnt mean it isn’t going to work it means that a given install following the spec will 100% work. If it’s outside the spec you may get a light come on but you could see 99% packet loss which would give you unacceptable pocket loss and your gigabit drops down to kilobits of throughput. Depending on the data being transferred that could thoroughly bugger up the app in question. CT is not data so different issue. It’s no different from wiring up a 13 amp socket with 1mm. It will work until you plug something that draws too much current and it catches fire. Even if it works now and you get data through there’s no guarantee they won’t change the application or firmware and then it stops working and no one knows why. The only way to be sure is to run a cable certifier on it and certify it to the spec. If your doing an office install this is what you do and send off the checks to the cable manufacturer and they will certify and guarantee it for 20 years or so. However those thing make your mft look cheap so not worth it unless you are doing a ton of these installs and you want the certificates. It would be interesting to see what this does when a full charge is going on. Keep the videos conning fella.

[@sotaelectrical]

Hi mate thank you for all your comments!! Really interesting!! Thanks for watching also, have a great week sir 👍

[@cestemshow]

State of that swa in the meter cabinet 😢. The main concern is an open pen fault. The car wouldn't charge and the consumer is directed to the consumer unit. The metal one outside next to the ground 😮This could be solved if you can get open pen protection in the meter box perhaps. I was trained by dno so perhaps more confident with the procedures and their obligations and would have no concerns contacting them to help re-arrange that meter box to allow this.

[@sotaelectrical]

That’s great thanks for your help!!

[@chas3997]

You could add a supplemental earth rod on the outside metal CU to reduce touch voltage but I’d make sure it’s connected to a common met block with the existing TNCS earthing

[@richcreedy4118]

the data connection is fine, the amount of data is minimal, it doesn't need gb speeds. you could have used an inline connector to join the 2 cables

[@cheatingpunk10]

Great vid! I’m an apprentice electrician working in solar and installed a couple of zappi’s now and picked up some useful tips so thank you!

[@sotaelectrical]

Hi mate, thank you for watching my videos! Hope your doing well in your apprenticeship 👍👍

[@bradleyarcher9840]

Great job as always, only thing I’d be picky on is external consumer units for EV jobs should be 0.9m high in order to maintain AG3\IK10 compliances. I always mount mine the same high as the meter box to square them off. It’s the same with with chargers outside, anything with a digital display should be between 1.2m and 1.4m from the floor. I often see consumer units on the floor or under the meter box and they look like dog meat.

[@sotaelectrical]

Ok fair point! Thanks for the pointer and commenting!! 👍👍

[@KeYzZrRR]

1.2 lowest , I thought that was the highest figure , isn't it between 750 mm and 1.2 ??

[@rattlehead85]

Not necessary to use 25mm2 tails its a fixed 32a load. The main fuse will still give you fault protection to the tails as overcurrent does not come into play.

[@paulmatthews5470]

I spoke to BGs technical feller at a technical conference about their IP rated external CU and said it has to be sealed 100%, as in not use copex for cables and use stuffers only to maintain the IP rating to make the breakers a suitable pollution category. That being the meter box is not IP65 and taking a copex into it (like for the tails) effectively breaks that seal the CU has. I'd imagine fusebox has a similar situation. Just something you may want to bear in mind for future failures. It was explained in a roundabout sort of way but that's essentially what he said after I pressed further. Proper solution is either feed from an indoor CU or suitable rated CU in an enclosure with breakers of a suitable pollution category; but as you say, domestic customers go for looks, not function.

[@shaunkaye9445]

Great vid, I did a similar installation using a metal outdoor fusebox, mine like yours was a pme system, I understand that the charger unit as PEN fault protection built in, but my worry was that if a pen fault did occur the casing of the fusebox would become live, I went back and put a plastic box around the fuse box as an extra precaution. Be great to know your thoughts on this.

[@sotaelectrical]

I’ve heard a few people discuss this recently, I’m going to have a chat with the manufacturers and il get back to you

[@robertharris8106]

Not a sparks so if this is daft then apologies. I thought that anything that could, potentially, become live had to be earthed? If I am right (please correct me if I'm not, I'm always happy to learn) then how does the metal fusebox meet the regulations if it can become live and there is no option to put an earth connection on it?

[@sotaelectrical]

@@robertharris8106 the consumer unit itself is earthed buddy

[@nicks3108]

Nice solution - I'd use the gel crimps rather than the connection block for the clamp. If it was for data, I'd use a Krone punch down junction box to join the two cables rather than 2x RJ45 and a coupler.

[@mikeselectricstuff]

Is there a drain hole in the box ? This (or a breather vent) is important as air pressure changes can gradually pump moisture in past seals. I think a significant objection to outdoor CUs is you're relying on the seal around the flap, which isn't held down by screws on all sides and may distort over time, especially if exposed to sunlight. A standard CU in a suitably rated outdoor enclosure may be better long-term, as the seal is held by the lid screws.

[@KevinSmith-ph6jv]

Nah

[@snozzuk2]

how will a unit with a plastic copex ever create a different pressure, these units are aluminium, thety will outlive the charger 10x over. you worry about this but not the meter box thats has 0 water seals

[@amatchmadeindevon2005]

@@snozzuk2and no RCD protection in sight

[@davideyres955]

Also you have to consider temperature as it affects how long something will take to trip. If it’s really cold then a current overload will take longer.

[@KevinSmith-ph6jv]

Nice work! Very good point about outdoor consumer units not being a new thing

[@sotaelectrical]

It’s very true!!

[@chas3997]

I think if you’re going to use an outside CU and tails fed tails into a class1 unit then I’d want the pen protection at the origin of the meter tails. 🥶⚡

[@bu11rdt62]

I guess the only other way to do it would be an enclosure which would look stupid, nothing wrong with an outdoor consumer unit if installed correctly like you’ve done, cracking video 👌🏼

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you mate 👍👍

[@steveday6104]

Great little video, we are the same as you and only install outside DB's when there is no other choice.

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you, sometimes it’s simply the only option 👍👍

[@lanceeaton2812]

What are rhe chances of the Kw rating of chargers rising similar to how showers evolved over the years? Thinking of running 10mm cable ready for a couple of years time

[@kittsdiy]

05:14 is that class5 wire in that Uv altra cable ? Fine strands ? Can't see clear in video .. Ferrules are not required on class2 ( solid core stranded ) wires . Flexible tails are also Class2 i think ( no need for ferrules ) .

[@kvyng1]

Tidy job as always. Just a thought. What precautions are in place to prevent open circuit on CT?

[@richardwalsh5882]

Zappi chargepoint will inhibit charging if the data cable for the CT is damaged. Displays something like "Grid CT Lost".

[@richard_in_rayleigh]

Excellent video as always. Very informative. Have a great week. 😊

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you, same to you sir

[@danj11uk]

I’m more surprised your using a Zappi after your warranty issues in previous videos. I wouldn’t give My Energy another penny or single minute of exposure on your channel after that, so fair play to you. Great channel by the way

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you mate appreciate your kind comments 👍👍

[@joshayres3211]

Excellent work has always as with regards to outdoor consumer units what about the meter cupboard that have been installed in most homes. I feel that if they had a derating factor for Protective devices that are fitted outside or possible a designed for outdoors set of devices. but only problem with outdoor CU in my opinion is water ingress which will most likely happen no matter what. Either through condensation or ingress. But just my take.

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you and thanks for commenting! 👍👍

[@utterlyexiged]

Nice tidy install that. Id be tempted just to run the cat5 up into the meter box though at the expense of another 1m of cable, as you will always get corrosion at some point down the line with bare RJ45 plugs in an external enclosure.

[@EXILEIS]

You're not allowed to run cables through DBs though. So it would have to go into a box first and be much more work.

[@elminster8149]

Just use normal CAT6 external cable and run it alongside your power (should fit inside the clips). Way cheaper and avoids unreliable couplers (they fail in short order in my experience)

[@BLOCKsignallingUK]

Could you run the CAT5 in separate copex, and then use standard armoured ? It would offer the customer a lower cost install as well, but would obviously depend on the visual appearance of the cable run and length of the run.

[@sotaelectrical]

Personally I think it would look awful but it’s up to the clients I guess

[@danward6134]

beautiful data connections there :) however I do love a good wago....

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you 👍👍

[@BryTube]

@@sotaelectrical personally i use gel crimps over the wagos, they seem to be over the top imo, i know the Ohme provide them...doh! lol... wouldnt bother with that connector thing... yet another great video :)

[@jameskane9763]

one way around the separation it to heat shrink the cable as this would make it double insulated.

[@sotaelectrical]

Ok fair enough 👍

[@stephenquinn3358]

Is 25mm tails not a bit excessive for 32amp? I use 16mm. In Northern it's the norm to supply the house with 16mm tails. I have even seen houses in southern Ireland with 10mm t&e that's seems wrong to me but they have their own rules. Haven't seen any signs of over heating on the 16mm tails in 20 years.

[@craig9056]

I don't understand why every one's hell bent on using 25mm tails as well. The overload protective device for the charger would protect smaller tails supplying the consumer unit. It's never going to pull more load than what's connected. Use 4mm straight in a Henley block I say 😂 Maybe the manufacturers should make these boards with one usable way to mitigate the risk of someone connecting something else and overloading your tails.

[@mickbitchum4664]

I use 10mm tails into the BG IP rated boards as there is no spare ways to add more circuits. If there was a spare way then 16mm.

[@heladas90]

Yes its is excessive, you can use as small as 10mm

[@chas3997]

You want a minimum of 16mm2 tails because the BS88 fuse still needs to operate on short circuit faults

[@KimSalmon-i5e]

Doing a house refurbishment is it ok to run 10mm Twin and Earth from the consumer unit position 35metres through the house to inside store ready for an EV installation

[@sotaelectrical]

You’re gonna need a cat5/6 cable with it too!

[@paulj342009]

Spot on that mate 👌

[@sotaelectrical]

Thanks mate 👍

[@davidwhitehead6150]

Interesting seeing you're using 25mm Tails? I had a discussion with my last two annual NIC assessors about this issue. I'd been doing what many guys do when coming off of henley blocks for a new EV CU and using 10mm tails. Similar to decades of seeing a shower CU being added in a domestic. The argument has been put out there that of course the only OCP for those tails is the main DNO fuse, and if that's 80 /100A then surely you should be doing as you are and using 25mm just as you would for a house board. Both of my assessors thought as I did and said there's no problem at all using 10mm, because these tails are and will only ever feed ONE piece of fixed equipment that can never draw more than 30/32A.

[@sotaelectrical]

Hi mate, yeah I understand exactly what your saying, I just put 25mm tails in as I would with any sub board, I know there is nothing wrong with doing that

[@davidwhitehead6150]

Just found your channel btw..thumbs up to your vids, style and work. No messing presentation edits and great content.

[@sotaelectrical]

@@davidwhitehead6150 thanks David, really appreciate you watching and taking the time to comment 👍👍

[@BillsCountrysideAdventures]

Hi mate put cable strains on data cable, also data guys told me years ago Cat5 at the time needs to be 100mm away from electric as electric can interfere with it. But if using Cat6 or ubove has sheleding. I think the consumer unit looks great

[@sotaelectrical]

Hi mate, ok il look into the cable strains, appreciate the tip!! Thank you sir, hope you had a good weekend!! 👊👍👍

[@zm9865]

Is the CT coil for dynamic load management?

[@sotaelectrical]

Yes exactly

[@matthewfewings6023]

Why didn’t you use 10mm tails? Would have been fine. No issues with outdoor consumer units when they are the only option. Too many using it as the default option tho. I prefer to use the EV cables data and extend it through. My understanding is the use of the EV cable is recorded as a departure anyway. However you are technically using a second departure by using a separate data enclosure with low voltage cables. (Just my thoughts)

[@Rich-Eclipse]

👏🏼Nice tidy work mate.....shame the same can't be said about the original swa feeding the house 🤠🐴

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you mate, and yeah I know 🤣

[@chas3997]

The metal clad box is a worry because meter tails have no RCD protection I’m presuming the black coating might be slightly less conductive which makes live earth faults on the tails less hazardous? Also other concern is it’s completely exposed to things that could cause issues like knocks and damage …….in a DNO box there’s some mechanical protection.🥶⚡

[@chas3997]

I’m convinced it should be placed in another box weather proof for both protection from water ingress and mechanical damage. I think direct contact access to this CU without protected tails is a bad idea even with the IP65 rating 🥶

[@DS1-1a]

Why is there a BS951 earth bonding clamp around the SWA mains cable?

[@sotaelectrical]

That’s how the installer done it, not my work

[@DS1-1a]

@@sotaelectrical no I know you wouldn’t do it like that - it’s just not permitted, bad workmanship.

[@mikeselectricstuff]

Why are you using such heavy tails ? They only need to be rated for the breaker(s) in the CU - 10mm would be more than adequate as regs allow the overcurrent protection at the far end of the cable.

[@sotaelectrical]

I’m just demonstrating that there is plenty of room to work in it

[@scotty2hottyltd]

Future proof? There’s a spare way so maybe could be used to supply garage, out building etc?

[@ianlove3]

Great job.

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you 👍👍

[@chas3997]

Trim that red robin up too! Don’t want vegetation dirtying it 🤪

[@ghostrider67]

Very neat job, I don’t like external consumer units either but sometimes you have no choice. However the people that terminated the main armoured cable in that meter box should be sacked, what a mess! Why not just install a fused connection unit from fusebox, DP isolation and bs88 fuse all in one and somewhere to properly gland in the armoured cable.

[@sotaelectrical]

I might be going back to make some changes to that! Shocking!

[@LMC-electrical]

I’ve just seen this today at a new build maybe 5 years old…. My thoughts were to install a dinrail adapatable box with dinrail distribution blocks or fit another meter cupboard next to existing … at least yours had a switch fuse isolator mine was straight in to a 100 amp double pole switch… any suggestions would be helpful

[@gino2465]

What glands did you use for swa cable on each end.

[@sotaelectrical]

It’s not SWA, it’s hightuff and I used 25mm stuffing glands

[@gino2465]

@@sotaelectrical appoligies I missed that bit.

[@AGRElectrics]

Braver man than me id rather turn job down and not have the liability and having to go around and redo my back catalog of work

[@smiffysmiffy123]

25mm a bit overboard. Western power in my area only fit 80A fuses so 16mm is sufficient.

[@sotaelectrical]

If I have a 100A fuse I install 25mm tails, nothing wrong with it

[@smiffysmiffy123]

The cutout series 7 carriers are rated to 100A. It doesn’t mean the fuses are 100A. They come with 60A, 80, & 100 fuses. The only way to know is by enquiry unless you pull & take a look. I’m sure not a lot of electricians realise this.

[@shaynemacdonald3051]

That SWA feeding the fuseboard inside the kitchen is rough as toast.

[@sotaelectrical]

Yeah I know mate

[@stunimbus1543]

surprised your still using Zappi. Didn't they recently void your warranty?

[@sotaelectrical]

Customer chooses the charger

[@grantpatterson1441]

Omg. What was that swa submain 😮

[@ChooseLife.YourLife]

A power supplier special mate. You ought to see how rough these meter boys chuck in meters and tails for companies like BT and so on. They have to take a picture of their work so they take a picture up close to not show how rough they are

[@chas3997]

Even with IP65 plastic construction on the CU I’d still be concerned about mechanical damage ………if you think the class of construction isn’t an issue why are most EV chargers of plastic construction ( class2) their not stupid mitigation the shock risk!🥶⚡

[@sotaelectrical]

The consumer unit is metal buddy 👍👍

[@6r4metroman]

Nice IP rated consumer unit but can't see it on their website!

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you! I had an early release one, they will be out soon I believe 👍👍

[@dead.format]

Now im all for high standards. And questioning products/standards/techniques. But there really is no debate here. Manufacturers Instructions feature heavily in todays regs. And it works both ways. If MI states IP65 ... And you've done gone above and beyond to protect it then theres just no discussions to be had - fit it as MI and you're covered. On to the next one!

[@e5Group]

I am a tad taken back by that SWA in the DNO cabinet. Wow. I assume you issued a danger notification for that? Also I wouldn’t advise using non IP rated kopex on a IP rated board. Manufacturer should offer better fixing and sealing data for the board. I had heard about these boards. And I see your points. But I also disagree. Relaying data cable in charger and board. Keeping seperate where practical is good advice. EMI in charger would be different in board as far as susceptibility to EMI of RCBOs. Pollution degree. Whole mother debate. I would have also recommended a breather gland on the board to allow temperature and pressure to regulate better. My experience on IP rated lights is they condense without them. But near and fascinating channel.

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you for your comments much appreciated 👍👍

[@adamseddon1555]

why the 25mm tails and not 16?

[@sotaelectrical]

Because that’s just what I always use

[@chas3997]

Just looked at the SWA again in the meter box it’s not even glanded into an enclosure 🥵 looks like a cowboy installed this🥶. Look your not frying the bigger fish first! Shock and fire risk need more attention! IP rating is important but put the bigger risks first 🥶⚡👍

[@chas3997]

Think I can explain my logic here Extraneous conductive parts ie CU being metal , is the first consideration! Because IP rating although important! You have a more direct already exposed risk !!

[@peterigrenyi9176]

I have to say, going from 1 connection to 4 on cat 5 coupler is mad.... if you wsnted to make it neater, I'd suggest using crimp in joint box for cat 5 cable. I dont think them couplers are great.

[@sotaelectrical]

Ok thanks for the tip!

[@peterigrenyi9176]

@sotaelectrical i tried to attach a link to one but i didnt manage 😔

[@sotaelectrical]

@@peterigrenyi9176 that’s ok no worries, thanks for trying, il do my homework

[@scott4shell]

Only thing I don’t like about your chargers is they are tethered, be better if they were just a plug but you always do a belting job new fav you tuber. Sorry bundy 😮

[@sotaelectrical]

Hi mate thanks for commenting, so I always give the client the option of tethered or untethered, the tethered option is popular I find because of convenience, I’m doing an untethered zappi this week though!! Appreciate your kind words!! 👍👍👊

[@Ronny86_]

Tidy install mate! Not a fan of the outdoor CU’s but understand why sometimes they have to be used. No complaints from me 👌🏻 Some of the comments are worrying though 😂

[@sotaelectrical]

Thank you mate, I’m not a fan either, sometimes there is simply no choice 👍👍

[@acelectricalsecurity]

Really a data cable installer giving an electrician advice on how to install cables, an installer that can't install their own containment and runs cables as the crow flies 😂😂. That existing Submain cable looks ropey, that board looks similar to a BG one. Also as long as the cable is insulated to the highest voltage present, 230v in this case you are covered.

[@lloydg4079]

Nice job f**k the haters 👍🏼

[@sotaelectrical]

Thanks mate 👊👍

[@stuartcraigon2003]

Don't silicone the bottom, if water does get in it has no way out.

[@sotaelectrical]

I didn’t

[@stuartcraigon2003]

@@sotaelectrical I couldn't see if you had or not, however, always useful for others. 🙂

[@mattsan70]

Can you lock that CU? Looks like anyone can open it and fiddle about

[@sotaelectrical]

You can lock it yes

[@TooMuchInfoSir]

Data guys think the cable is carrying data, which is why they get hissy. They don't realise that its just carrying an inducted current. Where it does carry data, its terminated to 8P8C meaning the twisted cores are reducing interference up to the endpoint and insulated throughout. Its also running max 10mbps of traffic, not datacentre level loads and reliability requirements, not to neglect ethernet has its own mechanisms to avoid corruption & packet loss. Data guys like to think there job is important, when in reality they are just cable monkeys.