Oxford suspect's parents had 7 cellphones when captured: New details | LiveNOW from FOX

[@ellybean5868]

My son suffered severe depression as a teenager. He was seeing a psychologist twice a week. One day I received a call at work from the school counselor. My son's best friend had informed the counselor that my son had mentioned that he wondered how he could obtain a gun. I hung up the phone, left work and was at the school within 10 minutes. I took him directly from the school and to the emergency room and he was admitted inpatient for 2 weeks. I was at the hospital to see him and meet with the staff every day. The thought of just ignoring any of it or leaving him at school just baffles me that any parent could do this

[@drummerlovesbookworm9738]

Good job! I pray your family is going strong and your son is better. Parenting is the world’s hardest work. Even if your son was struggling, he knows he is loved. Bless you. 🤎

[@kathyinwonderlandl.a.8934]

You did the best option of all I wish that would have been done in this case.

[@sharigraff871]

Your son is blessed to have you as a mother ❤️Prayers for your son and his freedom from any depression 🙏

[@roostercogburn6469]

Well you're a saint!

[@MasterYota1]

God bless you for being a good parent. You deserve a Tax break.

[@fantastictoad8853]

This kid needed help for a long time. Imagine being home alone all the time thinking you're going crazy, or that you think your house is haunted, asking your mom to come home or at least talk to you to calm you down, but that doesn't happen at all ever. She doesn't text back, call, or come home. She makes it clear she doesn't care what he's going through. The parents are 100% at fault for what he did. He's at fault too, but would he have done this if he had received help?

[@kimberleeh.308]

well said

[@baby8423]

Wow! It's sad and shocking to see such a lack of parenting.

[@marcyc.3311]

He still would of done what he did, remember mom said just don't get caught

[@fantastictoad8853]

@Rude D giuliani I know right?! The mom is disgusting and the dad is worthless.

[@fantastictoad8853]

@@marcyc.3311 I don't know about that. Like I said, if he had received the help he needed long ago, the help his parents neglected to get him. A therapist or a counselor could have helped him to deal with his struggles, along with medication he could have made better choices.

[@poisontoad8007]

I couldn't talk to my parents about my depression and still can't. The times I've tried my mother immediately makes it all about her and my father doesn't want to know. I love my parents but I'm lucky I survived my teens. I'm stronger now, and would never do that to a child.

[@bridgethadley]

Thank you for sharing and hope you know it says more about your parent's lack of emotional intelligence.

[@creatingyourlifeconsciously]

Hey I just wanted to offer some words of support. I totally understand where you’re coming from. Keep in mind that people can only love and understand things at the level they are at. Most people carry around feelings of unworthiness and shame. Most people on this planet are very unconscious. They’re very unaware of how they perceive the world and how they think and believe about things. That doesn’t make it any easier. Know that you are not alone. Depression and anxiety fear things along those lines are too much thought in the past or the future and not enough presents. It is very important for people with fear anxiety and depression to practice meditation and mindfulness. Practice being present in the moment. Be aware of the thought you were thinking and the words you are speaking. Most of the thoughts we think are very negative and not helpful. If we start practicing being aware of all of the thoughts and words we speak we can get a handle on our depression. We can ask her selves whether the thoughts or words we are speaking or true. We can ask ourselves where are these thoughts come from. What are the beliefs surrounding these thoughts. Once we become aware we can start to heal and the depression fear and anxiety lesson substantially. It is also very important to practice regulating your breathing. I suffered with depression and anxiety for more than two decades. I understand how utterly crappy it is. So I like to help people whenever I can. Because you don’t deserve any of that. The depression is some sort of belief or experience that we label and is not actually true. Or we are taking that one as some kind of judgment upon us or unworthiness or shame we accept for ourselves. Know that all of our experience whether we perceive them as good or bad are there to help us grow and expand. They are there for a reason. They can benefit us if we choose to examine these things for what they truly are. It’s not an overnight fix but if you put the focus on healing yourself you will be much much better off. Meditate. You don’t have to go no thought. Just be aware that you were experiencing thought. Sort of separate yourself from those thoughts and just be aware of the thoughts. Ask yourself questions around those thoughts. Also be aware of the feelings and sensations in your body. Where do you feel them in your body? Most likely you feel them in your heart and your solar Plex/stomach area. Bring your attention to those areas. So practice mindfulness practice meditation. Regulate your breathing. Take five minutes a day just to breathe. Inhale for five seconds, hold for five seconds and exhale for five seconds repeat. Bring awareness to the feelings and emotions inside your body. Do not push them away. They are there to help you. They are part of our survival mechanisms. Also what I find helpful is retraining your brain. Sometimes our body cannot distinguish excitement from fear. So any type of excitement or brain will change into fear. So if we go back and start to retrain our systems it’s very helpful. So when you get excited or feel good tell yourself either in your head or out loud, this is a good feeling this is a positive feeling this is an an enjoyable feeling. I understand it sounds silly but it is very very helpful. Practice gratitude. So many of us focus on the things we lack or the negative things in our life. Sometimes the negative things really aren’t negative. We have to overpower our ego a lot of the times. So every morning and every night I think of five things you could be grateful for. Whether they are simply you have a roof over your head food on your table and clothes on your back a warm bed to sleep in and comfy blankets Again sounds silly but if you practice all of these things for 30 days your depression will substantially diminish. The more you become aware of your thoughts feelings and the words you speak the better off you will be. The more you question them and the validity of them even better. Anyway not that you asked for it but I hope that helps. From one human to another, much love.

[@capatga]

Good that you're not on Meds like me . I wish you good fortune.

[@poisontoad8007]

@@capatga I was on meds (citalopram) for years and it probably saved my life. I actually wound up studying psychology (in the main to understand what was happening in my own head lol) and became proficient in CBT and DBT which really opened my eyes as to how my depression impacted my thoughts and emotions, whilst giving me the insight to better assist others suffering the same problem. Thanks to learning to manage my episodes through DBT and mindfulness practice I've been med-free for years now, but that's just me. Everyone is different and I learnt the hard way to take every step in my journey with professional medical and psychological supervision. I really don't think it's something safe to attempt on your own, or at least the times I tried I failed miserably! I wish you all the best man, peace ✌

[@danih7577]

There are many apps for DBT therapy that are helpful and less than $20 a month . I believe many health insurance carriers offer them for free as well. The therapies that you described are wonderful. The brain can change physically and be retrained through neuroplasticity. As a country we should be talking about mental illness and spreading awareness about mental health more . Everyone should spend 15 minutes a day on mental wellness. The proven techniques are out there and easily accessible. I always thought mental hygiene and coping skills should be taught in school . There’s so much addiction and violence in the world . Why not give people tools instead?

[@MsOhsusanna]

Just in case someone needs this information... a parent can take their child to the local emergency room for evaluation and if needed they will find a psychiatric hospital for them. Even if they dont have insurance. Dont let anything stop you from getting help for your child.

[@cristineconnell7803]

Police would have loved to assist i b getting this young man the proper help he needed, but neither the school nor parents alerted them to the very real need! Thank GOD my kids Schools would have called authorities as well as parents! But we had "Parents on Campus" programs at the lower grades, giving kids the tools to stop bullying & calling out the red flags appropriately! By High School it was a pretty smoothly running process & all the kids loved going to school there! Though guns were banned on campus, it is an area where many parents are gun owners & carriers, and kids felt safer! But we also welcomed cops on Campus!

[@marimullan4012]

Not true your child has to be a serious threat to themselves or to somebody else to get them into a facility. You have a huge burden of proof. I havev2 mentally ill children and they have been in the system for greater than 20 years. Navigating the system is incredibly hard.

[@tiffanieoverby7803]

@@marimullan4012 my daughter threatened not wanting to be alive anymore….the school called me and the crisis management team and within an hour and a half we were at a facility and she was admitted for saying what she said….she also did attempt to do that and then went right from the hosp over to a bigger and better facility to handle children and teens and that was two places after the hosp watched her just watched her because she took pills and was transferred and being treated appropriately all within 24 hours….also the first time I was allowed to drive her myself but only if I agreed to take her straight from the school no stop to say goodbye to siblings or anything while being followed by the crisis workers….if I would have denied which I didn’t and never would and would rather be safe than not have my child they would have done it all anyway just with the crisis working doing the evaluations and taking and her and such….guess it depends on where you live

[@DekkarJr]

ANd what are they going to do to the child? Have you ever been in a mental health hold? 72 hours and it's over. I've been there many times, and I've known kids like this. You all out here in society seem to think that "seeking help for the child" is the be all end all of the problem. It is not. Medications, even the heaviest of anti psychotics are not a "fix" to anything.

[@MsOhsusanna]

I'm sorry so many people are having trouble getting mental health assistance. I have an adopted daughter diagnosed with bipolar disorder. She has been in psychiatric hospital 5 times. Numerous prescription changes. I now consider us very blessed to have received the care we got. No not always easy or great but she is still alive and for that, grateful.

[@JP-kw7hs]

If the question is "Could these parents have taken steps in an effort to avoid this tragedy", I believe the answer has to be Yes.

[@ltdc426]

Could ted bundy's mother have done a better job of raising teddy? Where does THAT line end for all parents?

[@GRMLS5]

Ted Bundy did not display mental illness when a young, in fact he helped on lifeline phones, he got to be an adult. This comparison is bogus.

[@ltdc426]

@@GRMLS5 actually it's not. You want to blame parents? Blame them all.

[@Cochise6666]

Ted's parents told him his mother was his sister ostensibly ruining him decades before Ted's activities whereas the blunder Crumblys literally screwed the pooch the day before their little champion marksman's rampage. They were encouraging his love of guns, Ted's parents didn't buy him knives. Terrible comparison, no question.

[@kathypeterson13]

@@ltdc426 I agree ! I think this judge is biased as heck and she should be excused from the bench and I think this is called a lynching

[@brianparent8901]

The officer on the stand is NO joke...WOW!

[@janicefarmer2387]

These are such concerned parents, they hired themselves lawyers and left their child with a public defender.. 😥 How dare her cry, they abandoned their child 😢

[@girlygal098]

It's disgusting, isn't it?

[@Suzie77]

Well they are wasting their money lol because their attorneys seem like they have no clue what they are doing….I have watched all the hours of videos released and the amount of ummmms and pauses that come from the attorney at least representing Jennifer seems like it’s her first trial. Very pathetic parents, I’m glad they didn’t have a lot of money to afford a very good lawyer, they should have saved their money and got public defenders too

[@NajSinghs...NajNibbles]

This comment needs to be highlighted. Sad. It's no wonder this child had issues...TOO MANY red flags from the "parents" that this child had no chance for a decent life.

[@Pinkkermit17]

They also wiped out their son’s bank account and went into hiding.. they only care about themselves

[@Arykperry]

They aren’t allowed to communicate with there son for starters. I ask you people if you were in the Crumbleys position knowing you only had 15k (Hypothetically ) , your lawyer wanted 20k, your sons lawyer wanted 20k, your son was going to prison for life with or without a lawyer , you could beat the case and help your son …………… what would you do ?

[@2morrow789]

This story is tragic in more ways than 1. These parents failed Ethan in so many ways. His community paid the price for their neglect.

[@d8bn]

Excellent comment and this happens all the time. Parenting (or lack thereof) has a huge effect on society as a whole. I believe parenting should be viewed as career choice - "you gotta want to do it". Getting married and having babies is absolutely not for everyone and not for millions that are already in that scenario; they do it in order to "fit in" to society.

[@alwaysyouramanda]

The community too failed in a way. Those teachers had 1 (well, 2) job(s.) Call CPS and the cops when a child is being neglected like that- those parents used the school like daycare and it seems like the authorities there obliged. So many people could have done things differently that day. Kids like that- when they know they aren’t being taken seriously- they’ll give you a reason to.

[@doctilly3539]

@@alwaysyouramanda the teacher did her job and emailed the proper people. it is acceptable for HS kids to be left alone for longer periods of time. He was feed and no marks so why would the teacher call anyone? The counselor and dean are where they must really look at for the lack of care. They did a threat assessment and according to that, he was a lower threat. Still the counselor should be the best person trained to look and the issues and make that call. The principal also got calls about social media and dismissed it. It was not so much the teachers, but the administrators who are paid much more to ID this and prevent this. I think they may have a few job openings there.

[@danimotherofchickens479]

So didn't the school who knew of his threats and let him go back to school without checking his bag

[@mikeymike9926]

@@d8bn also I have a feeling the “it won’t happen to me” feeling did them in. No parent sees their kid as the weird guy who might shoot up the school.

[@briannadaylon90]

This REALLY breaks my heart on so many different levels. He asked his mom “can you at least text back? “ . They FAILED him and his classmates paid thee ultimate price.

[@CeramicShenanigans]

I felt the same way, it's so sad to see how he was trying to reach out for help you have to wonder how often he did this and was ignored by them. It doesn't excuse what he did, but I feel so bad for this kid who cried for help before the shooting.

[@briannadaylon90]

@@CeramicShenanigans I couldn’t agree with you more. It’s truly sad all around

[@M.divozzo]

@G omg

[@M.divozzo]

@@tiredbird471 so u wish death upon them

[@thanosbustedinyourmum]

Boohoo cry my mom doesn't text me back either and I don't wanna go kill a bunch of kids. Excuses excuses excuses 😴

[@joycegullett80]

Great Witness, Direct, Exact answers, quick and to the point,

[@bandme796]

If my kid told me the house was haunted and they were scared I would be calling for help ASAP! He was asking for help and not getting it! His parents need to be held accountable for their negligence!

[@ohmeowzer1]

Me too and they ignored him

[@DustinRodriguez1_0]

You assume a lot if you think those parents are smart enough to know ghosts aren't real.

[@lwrefrigeratedexpress5698]

The kid knows right from wrong.

[@bigdog4574]

@@DustinRodriguez1_0 the ghosts are very rare… what is real is God and demons… and demons are much much more common! look up psychiatrist Dr.Richard Gallagher, father Rossetti, father Thomas and modern day exorcists… listen to their stories… doesn’t get any more real than that.

[@grandmaof4811]

You are absolutely right, they had many signs that he was extremely troubled. It appears he was begging her to come home, yet, her horseback riding was more important than her son's well being!

[@Juiceboxdan72]

This man is every lawyer's dream, in terms of answering questions.

[@MMyers-mh4jq]

He’s a cop! Which is why he knows how to respond so well

[@robc8468]

That's the guy who should be on the team to investigate Michigan election fraud November 2020.

[@wowsean]

@@robc8468 LoL, so many people investigated it and found nothing significant. You can try contacting him and see what he says.

[@TheMusicHeals.kjhjhhg]

That is what happens when you sit before trial you practice and get told what to say with the DA. I mean you act like its new the cops have all kinds of PROFESSIONAL liars to work with.

[@Juiceboxdan72]

@@TheMusicHeals.kjhjhhg What are you on? Because I'll have the same, please.

[@tiredallthetime1636]

It’s so sad to see her son repeatedly texting her scared and clearly having hallucinations and she won’t even text him back let alone get him help. Any halfway decent parent would seek psychiatric help for their child after receiving text line that once let alone multiple times

[@spicyirwin5835]

Ethan mustve been so scared, abandoned & lonely with no 1 to communicate these delusions to. He didnt have a mama bear!

[@simaturna9765]

She answered her son by texting Don't get caught

[@mylesastinnette6208]

I still can tell how my children are doing and they live very far from me. Even as kids, I was so tuned into my children where I would have known immediately if something was wrong and trust me, I dealt with every issue. Parenting is not easy, if you choose to be a good parent whether your child likes it or not, it’s your job to really know your children. I live in an apartment and am ready to lose my mind because there is no reason on an ordinary school night for an 8 year old child is still awake and running around thumping above me. I had rules about bedtime and my children even now at 34, 44, and 45 still have the same bedtime schedule. Note: elementary school kids should be ready for bed at 7pm and in bed sleep at 8pm. Middle school, ready for bed at 8pm and in bed at 9pm. Senior high school, ready for bed at 9pm and in bed at 10pm. Friday and Saturday nights they can stay up late, have sleepovers, watch movies or whatever they choose to do under my supervision if they choose. They can also sleep as long as they like but Sunday evening everything goes back to our routine. There are times where bedtime is later but preparations, homework, papers sent from the school, they knew to give to me, their clothes selected and ready for the morning, lunches were already prepared, just in case they forgot their keys, they all had a 2nd key hidden in their book bag and if they ever needed to use that key, they knew to immediately put it back. I only had 3 encounters with the keys and they still do it. I worked full time 1 hour away and was also a full time college student and a full time mom. It’s always just been me. No other adult lived in my house. We had fun, many talks about whatever. Buying your children expensive or non expensive things is not called parenting. Know your children’s habits, their moods. Ask them about their day. In a nutshell, know your children and don’t worry about material things that can be bought or replaced. My daughter whose 44 now just told on me Sunday- Super Bowl Day that I was the best mother ever and she wish she could be a child again just to do it all again. Trust me, parenting is work but it doesn’t have to be depressing or neglectful. I raised my children not as strict as my dad did me, but I still appreciate his parenting. Wish people would wake up and realize if you choose to be a parent then be a good parent. On Friday’s it was teen night at my house. My children didn’t like spending nights at their friends homes and preferred their friends come to our home. No problem for me. I would pick up the first child who I knew would be over for their regular Friday night get together while heading home, we would go to the store and buy the snacks and soft drinks, back then we would rent a bunch of movies and once they were all at my house at 8pm, I would order their pizza’s, sit with them for a little while and then I went to my bedroom and let them enjoy themselves. Not one child disrespected me, my children, or my home. Their parents went out partying because they trusted me. Parents, please be parents. Think about some things I have written. Unfortunately for me, after my divorce from a drunk, yeah!, I couldn’t do much dating and guys were fed up with me because they said for me, I was too concerned about my children. Probably the dumbest thing I have ever heard. We are 100% responsible for them until they turn 18 or if they receive an academic scholarship so I was still a hands on parent for my son 4 additional years. My daughters both went into the military. They are all Mastered Degreed and doing great. I am still very single and living alone. Wish I could have spoken to Ethan’s parents because I see two very selfish individuals and if they end up in jail for the rest of their lives, they did that to themselves. Who the hell buys a mentally ill and paranoid son a gun and brags about it. Hate to say this but he should have shot his parents and not innocent victims. RIP to those killed and condolences and prayers to those harmed either physically or mentally. Senseless! 👼😇😢❤️🙏

[@cambrie7946]

@@mylesastinnette6208 I am in tears reading your post cause this is what I tried to do while sharing custody with a narc dad. It was exhausting. I often wished I had been a single parent.

[@cristineconnell7803]

@@mylesastinnette6208 i actually changed bed times up as they grew & also dependent on each child's wiring! Ie: teen son ended up with earlier bedtime as he had trouble going to sleep & waking up, so got into habit of starting process sooner! Only reading light & reading hour before bed, no screen time, if possible! Sometimes school projects, etc didn't make that possible, but the practice helped them alot! Aids him now well in adult life, a daughter went to sleep asap & got herself up. Another daughter i also moved bedtime up as she needed more sleep time to best function also! Teens require more sleep in general, so it helps if their schedules can accommodate their growing needs!

[@gaylemc2692]

It's nice to see a prosecutor and policeman who came to court prepared.

[@ronnie8984]

I can say from experience that even mild emotional neglect from your parents affects you forever. Even perfectly well behaved kids shouldn’t have access serious weapons, let alone one that’s been telling his parents he needs help

[@polohorse315]

This kid was SCREAMING for help. His parents FAILED him. 20 years each is what they should get..

[@muttsrus1919]

LIFE - with parole after every child that died- ages are tallied together and that is how many years they sit in jail.

[@KaktusLady]

20 yrs for each life lost and a quite a few more for the injured... I think that’s fair.

[@lizf1353]

Manslaughter is a maximum of 15yrs per charge in that state I believe

[@ag4allgood]

@@lizf1353 NOT enough ! They should spend 4 life terms or death ! Why should tax payers pay for their housing / meals while in prison ? Their assets should be seized & used to pay for the funerals of those DEAD kids wonderful Ethan killed !

[@verabolton]

Just wait until your kids grow up and blame you for their mistakes. How many years will you give for yourself then, I wonder... These parents failed their kid but they're not guilty of manslaughter, that's my opinion so far. The school carries more responsibility.

[@PropagandaFacts]

its great when you listen to a person who knows what theyre talking about

[@fivebyfive3560]

facts are easy.. people like Trump make them hard.

[@deannawiederhold333]

@@fivebyfive3560 wow bring Trump into this you are disgusting.

[@ArtfullyMusingLaura]

It's clearly not his first rodeo.

[@sam_s_]

@@fivebyfive3560 Man, you are demented. I hope you are able to recover.

[@alienvomitsex]

@@sam_s_ As demented as the people who still think he won? 😂🤡

[@bellagirlgirl8827]

I agree that this computer expert is excellent. In fact I learned a lot from listening to him explain how info on cell phones is retrieved & downloaded, and his testimony provides a lot more insight / details about this case. Very eye-opening!!

[@xyzxyzxyz8978]

It means even when you delet it really doesn’t mean delete it’s hidden somewhere in the software of later retrieval . Like they say you can run but you can’t hide .

[@ImakeITHappEN510]

@@xyzxyzxyz8978 if you really want to delete data off your phone you need a computer and manually do it yourself . The easiest will be to factory wipe the phone in a hard reset .

[@Just.A.T-Rex]

Cellebrite is useless on newer iPhones ON THE HIGHEST IOS VERSION AVAILABLE without a password being entered within past hour IF you have the usb accessories setting disabled. If you’re on a jailbreakable model or iOS version then your screwed anyway. ANY iPhone model 11 pro and older is completely vulnerable no matter what iOS version you run due to the checkm8 exploit which is hardware exploit not software. If infosec is something you depend on always be on the the newest model and highest iOS and don’t sideload apps and change your root password from apples default alpine.

[@YuTuboTuTubas]

Yeap.

[@ABossIsTalking]

@@Just.A.T-Rex what if you delete the contents thru findmyiphone?

[@MindyBeee]

RIP to the 4 young victims 💔 Absolutely horrifying that kids aren't even safe at school in America!

[@enchanted376]

These parents failed their child, there is absolutely No excuse to be preoccupied with anything else other than your child or children especially when you have been informed that your child needs help. This is a tragedy for both their son and the students he killed and injured. Ethan felt great pain and projected it onto the students of Oxford High. Such a sad situation.

[@orangechickengorl]

“A child who is not embraced by the village will burnt it down to feel its warmth.”

[@ellybean5868]

The poor kid was scared out of his mind, begging her to at least text back. This was around 7pm, and she doesn’t answer until 10am the next day asking where his father was. Where was she all night?

[@happydayz7857]

Having her affair/s

[@StevenHunterPangians1]

The poor four kids he murdered was scared out of their minds too,and will never get a text back from their mother or father ever....smfh

[@meavo1007]

Probably getting f'ed by Chad.

[@amber40494]

@@StevenHunterPangians1 exactly!!

[@crazyboutdanceforevr]

@@StevenHunterPangians1 yeah….it’s almost as if both of these things can be true at the same time dummy.

[@martaparsons5633]

I am pleased that these parents are being held accountable for their part in this school shooting. Perhaps this will alert other parents to their responsibility in these shootings. Every time a child has a gun at school the parents should be arrested.

[@bikeradam]

Yep, kids with guns out of school is just fine. Protect the white kids in school. Screw the rest. I like your style

[@DekkarJr]

I don't get what you can charge them with successfully tho? This pleases the public - but legally speaking this is not going to work against a jury of their peers. Millions of kids every year do illegal things regardless of whether the parents are good parents or bad parents. it is irrelevant the degree of the crime of the son - he could have killed every single person in the entire school and I still do not see a charge that makes sense or has precedent so as to punish the parents. They aren't the one's that killed people. That was their son. The Sandy Hook shooting is VERY similar - the mother had tons of guns in the house and her autistic son took some of them and killed a bunch of little kids at Sandy Hook. He killed his mother first - but if she had survived - what would she be charged with?? You people in this comments section are seeing this and feeling emotionally satisfied that these people are being "held responsible" - meanwhile people like me that watch high profile criminal trials all the time already know the outcome of this - no jury will find them guilty of anything beyond evading the police. Even then I don't think you could get that past an objective jury. Jury's aren't filled with normal emotionally charged people you have to understand - they are filled with people that have time to be sequestered for weeks on end possibly - they don't go through all of that raging with emotion They are doing this to try and satisfy the public's outcry. The public knows they can't punish the kid - because he's a kid. So you, quite emotionally, demand "justice" out of his parental relatives. If you can charge these people with something because their son shot up the school - then you can charge ANY parent for any of the millions upon millions of crimes that are committed by minors every year in this country. Do you know how many kids deal and take drugs at school mon-fri? Millions. If we put all of their parents on trial and in prison - the economy would collapse because all of the adults with children in this country would be in prison and not at work. And you seem to think a "child having a gun at school" is reason enough to charge the parents - but you don't know the law about who can carry a gun and where it can be carried do you? I went to high school with a number of kids that had gun racks with guns on them in their trucks and everyone was totally aware of it and no one did anything or cared at all. You don't have any legal responsibility to be held to just because a human you helped create kills people. It's so absurd..

[@DekkarJr]

@Luke Tykune I agree. It's gross how people think that this is okay.

[@emoliver80]

Not everytime a child has a gun at school should the parents be arrested.. but in a case by case basis I believe some should. I do believe *these* parents in particular should be held accountable. That's because of the circumstances in this particular case. The parents had many red flags waved in front of their faces that Ethan was struggling with his mental health, including Ethan himself waving those red flags before his parents faces, and they chose not to get him help. They actually out right ignored the red flags and out right ignored him and his text messages for help!! They were too consumed with their own lives, having affairs, playing with horses, caring more about their horses health, etc to even give him some much needed attention. They knew he was "weird" and knew his behaviors were not that of a normal kid his age, and instead of getting him help, they went out and bought him a gun. So yes, in this case they need to be held accountable. I think they are more at fault for what happened than Ethan is. Yes, he should also be held accountable but so should they.

[@emoliver80]

@Rapportus5 I would agree with you if these parents didn't realize their son had mental health problems already. They very much so knew he had mental issues. Besides all the other indications and red flags, Ethan directly texted his mother about hallucinations and being scared to be alone.... she ignored him. She didn't respond. She didn't call and schedule an appt to get him help. She bought him a gun instead, and took him to the shooting range. This case is very different from what you are carrying on about. It has nothing to do with "just because you created a human that kills people." It's because they had been well aware of his mental health issues and didn't get him help. As a parent that is your duty. He is a minor and it is his parents responsibility. They failed him and failed the other kids in that school. These parents need to be held accountable. I dont think thats always the case though.... not all parents should be held accountable for the wrongdoings of their kids. If he had gotten help for his mental health, could this have been prevented? The answer is that it is highly likely it could've been prevented, and it is because of his parents that he didn't get that help therefore they are responsible.

[@shannonyaw5782]

These parents had a child and decided to ignore that child. This is so sad!

[@happytobealive5045]

I sent my kids to Ethiopian summer camp! They came home a bit underweight but great full. I never had another complaint again.

[@gwenstone9685]

@@happytobealive5045 something tells me no one would touch you to make a kid.

[@happytobealive5045]

@@gwenstone9685, so, you have these kind of perverted Trump thoughts this early in the morning❓

[@leelohaskin7941]

@HAPPY TO BE ALIVE don't have anymore kids you freak

[@leelohaskin7941]

@@happytobealive5045 Lame

[@marcimonroe7352]

These parents are 100% responsible for what happened!!! They knew their kid needed help. They ignored it and gave him all the tools to invoke carnage. They deserve to be punished to the fullest extent that the law allows!!

[@danimotherofchickens479]

Ok so that kid who recently shot two kids and a teacher because he was bullied and was out on bail the next day, should his mom be charged ?

[@prettyuglysupernovarudegur2310]

A part of me thinks maybe they got him The gun hoping he would “Un-alive himself “ problem child no more .

[@wendymarie7151]

The kid did the shooting, so he's responsible too! He needs punishment too! 100%!!

[@marcimonroe7352]

@@wendymarie7151 That's painfully obvious.

[@BobSmith-ll9ol]

Nope. Old enough to take responsibility for himself.

[@bernadette8300]

Omg how could his parents not get him help after he was sending text messages to the mom about seeing demons in March 2021? My God this information is so disturbing. He's a child that needed mental health help from doctors. 😭 his parents failed him 110%.

[@robertlaube574]

No he needed to be put down, Or locked in a cage forever. (Put down if victim is dead, locked up forever if alive)

[@marcyc.3311]

For the parents knew he had looney thoughts for a long time they to need their looney head examined as well bc they ok'd him to do what he did. It was all planned out. Hang them all..their all guilty.

[@mckenna9489]

I think she just didn't care and didn't want to deal with it or him it's very disturbing imo

[@toddjohnson5176]

That kid is a piece of 💩. I hope he doesn't get off because he has a vivid imagination. That demon nonsense is B.S. He better get life in prison. Not some mental facility! I will be livid.

[@amandasummers7881]

@@toddjohnson5176 lol you'll be "livid" if a teenager is pronounced to have severe mental illness, then be sent to a psych prison? A place where the child can get the much needed therapy he needs and the right medications. He absolutely won't get that in prison. Good GAWD, I'm all for severe punishment when it's due--but if it comes out by psychiatrists that his mental health played a huge role in the murders, then that is definitely a mitigating factor and should most definitely be considered when sentencing someone.

[@marcyc.3311]

When that female lawyer talks my nerves start rolling...she tries to sound like she knows what she is doing..her clients are far beyond guilty but all she's doing is holding up the court.

[@toddjohnson5176]

I love it.It's a idiot defending 2 guilty idiots. I hope they rot in prison.

[@mylesastinnette6208]

She sounds like an immature child. Makes my skin crawl listening to her. What makes it worse is the Crumbley’s have actually paid them while their son is stuck with a court appointed defense attorney.

[@ashleypg1708]

She is so aggravating and childish. I can't believe she is a lawyer.

[@sarajuanaict]

Well I look at it this way... These two are accustomed to making poor decisions... So they made yet another bad call and hired bad lawyers.

[@plumpeach601]

Marcy C. OMG I feel bad for the defence. They probably will withdraw as the Crumbly's lawyer's eventually. The procecuter has done their job superbly so far.

[@jeanalexander4101]

The parents cared about themselves not their son. Can't believe the mother told her son "got to.lesrn not to get caught". He was crying out for help he knew he was losing his mind. The parents could have taken charge and gotten him help but they chose to not do so. They deserve to be locked up .

[@joane.3533]

What upsets me the most is that the school DID NOT do all they could to stop this. The parents spent about 13 min in the principals office. The school did not call 911 (or just the police). They did not inspect the backpack - they actually left the kid in the classroom with the backpack while the principal tried to talk to the parents.Mistakes like this by the school, for example, shoudln't happen. Procedures are in place, etc but yet, lack of insight by those in charge or their personal interpretation about things, seem too screw it up. I am noticing it is happening alot. Like the case of Gabby who was killed by her BF - the police had stopped them on the road to question some reported abuse and they didn't listen to all of the reports of people seeing the abuse by the BF and they thought it was her.

[@jeanalexander4101]

@@joane.3533 Exactly I agree with everything you wrote. School should have inspected his backpack or even taken it away from him. You are right the police did not listen to Gabby and she lost her life because of their negilance

[@cristineconnell7803]

As a Lay Crisis Counselor & First Responder 45 yrs, I would argue their actions actually drove him to it!

[@cristineconnell7803]

@@joane.3533 bad parenting can be found anywhere in any class! But extremely dangerous & negligent of school to ignore red flags & not call authorities! Parents & School both culpable in my opinion! All the above should face harsh consequences! I would be more shocked to discovery that there weren't more red flags than this that led up to that were ignored! As the txt between Mom & Ethan show! Taking care of the yellow & red flags before they lead to these events is critical!

[@thurston4mor]

Kids are worse now than they ever were Getting more difficult to make determinations

[@nadinesmith-jensen7732]

He really needed his Mom. He reached out to her again and again; with NO response, or results ! The “can you at least text back “ Comment he sent his mom says EVERYTHING!!!! She just couldn’t be bothered! So freaking sad 😞!

[@autumnleaf3667]

Seems like she was more concerned about him being smarter about hiding his psycopathic behavior, so he doesn’t get caught exposing the unhealthy gun obsession.

[@kathyprevo2842]

I so feel that child needed love and was so crying out . As a mom. You children come first!! Shame on them!!

[@DekkarJr]

Love doesn't stop homocidal ideation and acute psychosis.

[@gaylemc2692]

@@DekkarJr yes, but it sure can contain it.

[@DekkarJr]

@@gaylemc2692 No it cannot.

[@lisahannah7110]

@@DekkarJr getting them the mental help they need does

[@DekkarJr]

@@lisahannah7110 lmao no it does not.

[@sarahrobson9566]

He spent months asking them for help and all they did was buy him a gun.

[@chrissearer1896]

Everyone had a gun back in the day! NRA came to the school to teach gun safety in Wealthy Elementary. ONE hand held metal detector cost is far less than the cost of dead bodies and the District Must know that!?

[@MrMEGSWONETWOTHREE]

It’s absolutely insaneZ it’s like they wanted him to off himself so they could be free .

[@courtneypattison4269]

That is soooo sad that she didn't text her son back when he was terrified 😢 I feel bad for the victims and their families and also their son.

[@kaylaspangle9148]

The prosecutor's on this case are so thorough and on top of it. While the defendant's attorney seems so lost the constantly "umm, umm, umm" before she speaks is so 😳. How the heck do you afford $800.00 in boarding rent for your horses, on top of vet care, farrier care, and let alone pay $5000 for your new jumping horse. Yet your husband works for door dash?? You guys had your priorities so messed up. For real. The fact your son was so alone, scared, and needing help yet you showed no care and just plain negligence!

[@lizf1353]

Ya for sure but this particular situation is less about one lawyer being way better then another and more about the unlimited resources the state lawyer has to prepare his case vs the one lawyer they have each that knows damn well they are probably not getting paid beyond whatever they already got and certainly don't have the resources that the state has to sift through the endless papers that the prosecution dumps on them and says "good luck 🤣) so are the 2 female lawyers in reality more incompetent then this prosecution lawyer I just can't tell from this situation

[@The_worlddd]

@@lizf1353 it’s the latter. Although they most likely won’t get the best compensation from these clients-defending this case could notably drive their careers. But they clearly aren’t looking at from that view by how they have presented thus far.

[@dolphinluckew]

That’s exactly what I was thinking, with the prosecutors and the defendants attorneys. These parents need to be held accountable!

[@otallono]

@Luke Tykune Luke..I bet if you ever were lucky enough to have a girl like you enough, to have kids with you, and those kids were done this way, you'd most likely feel completely different about the situation.

[@kathleenkennel9237]

This forensic guy in the police force is excellent. So clear in his statements. The Crumley’s lawyer seems clueless of things! Always fussing about nothing. I think she likes to stall everything just to hear herself talk.

[@elizabeththornton2314]

That made me so sad when he asked his mum what time are you coming home and no response from his mother .

[@davenc8527]

So glad the parents are being held accountable.

[@dukadarodear2176]

Yep; The Son to be placed in a Psychiatric institution for lifelong Care. The Parents to be Incarcerated for Life in Prison. That's the proper outcome of this trial, if there's real concern and justice in this case.

[@serenityb5816]

Those parents are awful.

[@robc8468]

Only the problem is that being an awful parent falls more in the child neglect area which they were not even charged for.

[@mydogky]

any parent who has a gun in the house when they have kids is awful

[@JeantheSecond]

@@mydogky I’m heavily in favor of gun control, but I don’t agree with this. Parents can keep guns in the house if they keep their guns in gun safes, keep ammo locked in another place, never let the children know the combination, tell them they are never to touch guns, give them a run down on gun safety, keep any gun they’ve taken out on themselves at all times. Of course, children will be safer if there aren’t guns in the home, but some parents are hunters or trap shooters. They have to be extremely cautious.

[@MelissaDeleen]

“LOL I’m not mad at you,” Jennifer Crumbley texted her son. “You have to learn not to get caught.” - Mom of the Year goes to....

[@marciayoung1094]

Seriously that's what her text read OMG !!

[@bubbamaster3116]

this was a day before the shooting, this wasnt on the day of the shooting. you being fed straight up fake news.

[@Fromplefeet]

How ironic, she's sitting their hand cuffed. Should of took her own advice!

[@automatoncollectives7237]

That doesn’t prove involuntary manslaughter

[@mightysrk]

@@automatoncollectives7237 wow defending these people with such vigor. Let’s just see how this plays out bud. The community at large is beyond sick of this crap and that’s all that matters. You can argue and cry foul all day long but the majority makes the final decision that’s how humanity has survived and evolved.

[@JD10142002]

They had zero intent of getting caught turning themselves in. These 2 are the very reason why society had to pay a great price due to their lack of parenting

[@pastaisgood6681]

My mom was an addict with unmedicated borderline personality disorder and covert narcissism and even she drove my sister to the psych ward when my sister started hallucinating. There is no good excuse, these parents are awful. The lowest of the low.

[@BookishDark]

Just have to note (bc I’m borderline so very familiar with it) - you can’t solve borderline with medication because it isn’t a disease of biology, if that makes sense. You can medicate the symptoms of anxiety or depression that can be a result of the BPD, but it won’t treat the BPD itself - that’s where cognitive therapy and/or dialectical behavior therapy is key. But I’m glad your mom was able to help your sister and I hope you’re doing well - having an untreated borderline parent is HARD. I hope you’ve had the help and love and support you need, to ❤

[@madeleinereed6460]

Me too, Teressa! I didn't get diagnosed until after I had joined the military, but I had struggles with it since I was about 12 or 13. Being unmedicated IS hard. It's exhausting having mood swings every minute...its hurtful to people you care about...which in turn makes you self loathe more because you know it's your fault....but you also can't help your actions either.

[@Dale115]

I didn’t think of this but someone said the parents left their son with a public defender BUT hired TWO private lawyers for themselves. WOW!! Where’s the love???

[@iwuverzyou1]

Lol. He killed people on camera. You don't need a private lawyer. Your not getting out of anything 😅

[@iwuverzyou1]

The parents atleast have a shot to not get life in prison.

[@laleonard]

Yep. These people are all a train wreck. It is no wonder, the boy is insane, he never stood a chance.

[@ALCRAN2010]

Typical Trumpist behavior. Next, they will not pay their lawyer and have a ghost writer author their book.

[@SwampCeeMcGee60]

@@ALCRAN2010 No one is talking about politics here. Kick rocks.

[@kensnedegar5925]

Totally agree this man's right on the spot he knows what he's doing very organized that's why the case takes a little longer

[@jimknapp8731]

However he is misstating the time conversions for several of the texts he is describing. 1806 UTC is not 3:06, it is 1306 EST (or 1:06 pm).

[@newnana9070]

The husband is not to ( at least he doesn’t sound ), bright. The wife is in charge. They shouldn’t have been allowed to parent a puppy. Totally selfish people. Did their son get any real parenting from these people.???

[@mydogky]

you could all say no parent should be allowed guns in fact if you all did not have any possession of guns you would not have these type of gun crimes, sort your country out before you expect parents like this kid got to be telepathic how the hell could they have possibly predict any of this

[@doracampos2088]

@@mydogky 🤦🏻‍♀️ This is all I have for you! 🤦🏻‍♀️

[@cristineconnell7803]

@@mydogky don't be silly! Countries that ban guns have just as many deaths by those who don't obey laws! Any tool can kill, your kitchen knife & fork, car, even straws! Shall we ban them all? More deaths by bare hands than guns, shall we ban them also? The tool isn't the issue, the extremely negligence of parents & school staff failed this boy & everyone else at school that day!

[@cristineconnell7803]

@@mydogky The writing was all over the wall, with multiple cries for help that were ignored! THAT'S THE PROBLEM HERE!

[@JeantheSecond]

@@cristineconnell7803 Countries that ban guns, like England, Australia, and Japan have a fraction the homicide rate the US does. Sure, you can kill someone with a knife, but can you kill 60 people? The Las Vegas shooter killed 60 people. The Orlando shooter killed 49. And on and on and on.

[@francescagibbons5842]

Wow she didn't even respond to his texts ..

[@grammadee94]

I was a legal secretary for 50 years and the defense attorneys are so young and so over their head with this case.

[@valdez3245]

You notice that too?

[@debkski6084]

The Crumbleys were cashed strapped and this law firm offered a BOGO.

[@marieharris1230]

It’s hard to describe the level of disgust that I feel for these despicable negligent parents. I hope they get a maximum jail sentence and loose all custody rites of their Abused child.

[@regaljourney1894]

Their abused child is gonna be in the custody of the US prison system for the rest of his life and will never see the light of day. I agree with you on the parents however. I think they're almost as guilty as Ethan.

[@DekkarJr]

Maximum sentence for what exactly?

[@Casinogirl56]

@@regaljourney1894 I was about to post this exactly same thing. Hopefully people have the same amount of sympathy for all the children this "abused child" injured and killed as they muster up for him.

[@regaljourney1894]

@@Casinogirl56 I agree 100%. The lives of the 4 dead teenagers rests on these 3 monsters consciences.

[@vanadians3819]

I hope they are in jail longer than he is!!!!!

[@boring.doerings]

First they left their son at a school with a gun, then after the incident and he was arrested they again were abandoning him and they were heading for the sunset. Destination unknown. Wow

[@debrabolton9372]

Excellent witness! The Crumbleys should be convicted and spend a very long time in prison. Horrible people.

[@toddjohnson5176]

Life for those pieces of 💩!

[@QueenOfTheNorth65]

I can’t help but wonder what the families of the four victims are thinking if they watched this. I feel so bad for them.

[@kathyinwonderlandl.a.8934]

I’d be devastated and furious at the parents.

[@mariannemarek6683]

We need to learn from this and change the system.that allows this to happen.

[@HJKelley47]

@@mariannemarek6683 : Parents need to return to being accountable parents vs being their children's friends (one of the changes that needs to be made).

[@modemarose4497]

An insightful perspective on an inconceivable dichotomy. This case just blows my mind.

[@carolanderson3054]

Lawyers, Judge and Jury's dream witness! Great job detective.

[@lindauribe6872]

These parents are truly a piece of work and went to bars all the time leaving him alone when really young.Teaching him not to get caught.

[@acheleg]

hard to tell if they say "bar" or "barn", but the parents seemed emotionally neglectful, in a narcissistic manner

[@brichusi]

This defense attorney is over her head. 😂🤣

[@automatoncollectives7237]

The defense will be fine...nothing proves involuntary manslaughter

[@CarrieBiggerstaff]

She doesn’t seem to be able to keep up does she?

[@mlee40738]

Um...umm... umm... umm...

[@kairaramirez9582]

@@automatoncollectives7237 i dont know where you heard this hahaha.

[@smokyo7855]

People so obsessed with weapons….kids and parents. What could go wrong

[@muhfkajones]

And cops are deadly afraid of citizens armed with them. What on earth could go wrong 😕

[@KOOLGREENS]

They kill eventually. They will always be eager

[@justinkoenig]

Umm 2nd amendment 🙄🤷‍♂️🧐

[@doracampos2088]

@@justinkoenig Say that when the next victim is your child.

[@justinkoenig]

@@doracampos2088 I would. People have rights. I would never dispute that. You I guess need to move to China. 🤷‍♂️

[@LauraMidwest]

for those asking why are they in jail clothes, it is because they are charged with manslaughter so they are in jail. the prosecution needs to prove that they enabled the son that lead to his decision to shoot at that school. For those asking why are they in handcuffs, it is because they were told multiple times to stop gesturing to each other during proceedings. They were blowing kisses, waving, mouthing i love you, etc. when you are in court, you are to be on your best behavior, with your focus on the matter at hand. They did not stop in spite of the warnings, so now they have to be treated accordingly in order to stop being a distraction.

[@darlenemaggard6976]

Thanks for the info

[@lindavieira364]

Thank you

[@Illtakeamoodringtogoplease]

“Excuse my language, mam.” Smart, confident, prepared AND polite. I love this guy!!!!!

[@suziewhattley3917]

When was this? What did he say?

[@doreendaykin6693]

This is a quality & extremely professional witness. It is always a pleasure to see all Law Enforcement witnesses this professional. I have noticed this level of excellence in recent Wisconsin trial. All the Law Enforcement Professionals in that trial set a amazing standard of excellence. I would chose to live in Wisconsin if I were not Canadian because of that.

[@mangos2888]

Wisconsin is a f’ed up state. They’re professional because they’re under oath. It’s not impressive.

[@ALCRAN2010]

Kyle Rittenhouse was guilty AF and if those prosecutors had this caliber witness the kid would be in jail a long time. They couldn't even pinch to zoom. Ridiculous.

[@rachelc9908]

Wtf lmao…Wisconsin?

[@michellenainkristinabusch1221]

​@ALCRAN2010 😂😂😂 Yeah, guilty of self defense

[@zeballos5757]

Nice of his mom to text him back. Just ignore it and it will go away.

[@toobeautiful3517]

This kid was actually reaching out for help from his parents. They both were too damn busy having affairs, and riding horses, and wasn’t giving a damn about this kid seeing things. They cared more about themselves and other things than there son. All of this is there fault. Ethan was desperately reaching out for help. The text messages proved that he needed help when he texted and said that he was seeing demons in the house, and once again he was totally ignored. This is what you called horrible parenting!

[@SillyChickens222]

Exactly. His parents should have cared and taken care of him. The seeing demons thing is real. Satan loves using mental illness as a way to torment people to the point where they have no faith or hope left in God.

[@bobbullock1963]

The situation is sick to tell you the truth I don't know who would have affair with either of them. They're not worth anyone's time

[@nhmisnomer]

He killed people, but I'm in an odd place of feeling sorry for him. Hes texting his parents about seeing demons and they're not getting back with him. Wth?

[@jacqui2651]

@@nhmisnomer It's very sad, this kid isn't well and his parents did nothing to help him.

[@lydiakinnaman1106]

WOW SEEING DEMONS !!!!

[@Therapistmind]

This child was clearly disturbed and these clueless parents did nothing! Shameful if a child talks about a demon has pictures you do something immediately! Sickening…. thanks to the Crumbly’s ignorance… people died. They should be punished for neglecting to help their child get help before he went on shooting spree!

[@jilpok1074]

My brother talks about demons and he tried to kill me and my sister several times with weapons my parents bought for him. Parents are crazy negligent all the time. The reason it usually doesn’t result in murder is because there are other people around who are in charge of protecting other children and actually do their job.

[@labyrinthworm4511]

This is what happens when children are raised by narcissistic parents!

[@libralove6042]

I don't think they were clueless, they knew exactly what they were doing. They didn't want to be bothered with their son and his problems anymore. So they "helped" things along, knowing he'd probably do this and they'd be rid of him and free to do whatever and whoever. Probably figured he'd get off easy because of his age.

[@rosesmith6925]

The ONLY reason she's crying at this particular moment is because that's when she realized her life in general was truly fu*ked!

[@MadiHunt-pq3rs]

It is also possible she has realised her complete failure in being invested in her son's life.

[@lynnemiller3633]

I cannot imagine the ongoing indifference to their sons's isolation and psychosis and depression. My Lord - what parent can possibly be this indifferent to their own child's, their ONLY CHILDS cries for help and suffering?

[@chrissymeri4957]

Right. Their only child. It's not even like they had their hands full! They had one job! They failed.

[@deenamarie8024]

It’s inconceivable at how many times his mother, BLATANTLY DISREGARDS her sons pain and detachment from reality. As a mother, I have empathy for how difficult this must be for his parents. Yet, each step of the way , they made a choice to FAIL THEIR SON! He was basically begging and screaming for her help. And her response to his worst delusions and or calls for help, were none? It’s as if she simply didn’t want to discuss or address this with her poor son. Please don’t misunderstand my empathy for removing guilt from this boy. He will be treated like an animal in prison, for the rest of his life. Through these texts, we are getting a glimpse of his reality, where saying those things and opening up may have been very scary. Yet they were all ignored, as if they didn’t want to face or deal with it. I am a parent of five children, and I can’t even comprehend NOT stopping everything to go sit with my son and find out what he was going through. I AM NOT JUDGING her, as much as I am just looking at all of these warning signs, and knowing he was begging for help, and got nothing but more neglect......of course none of us have all the facts, and never will. But I have such sadness for all of the loss here. And we will never know if this could have been prevented with the proper attention and therapy. When his mother ignores his calls for help in the texts, that must have been the worst feeling. Knowing there was nothing he could do to get her to listen. The. They both go on the run after her was arrested. Again, caring for their personal needs first and only

[@deannawiederhold333]

I remember my youngest son was not talking and I knew something was wrong and Family members would be saying that we needed to find out why. Come to find out he was suffering from water in his eardrums. This was when he was 3. He got the operation but we placed him in a The Childhood League School. They had to teach him sign language and basically teach him all the Life Skills. He graduated and moved to Regular School who had Teachers who specialized in Learning Disabilities. We paid for the Best for the Best Teachers. I am internally Grateful for the Dedicated Teachers that I came in contact with. Today's teachers are from a Liberal College and University. Their only goal is to make everyone hate each other. And Critical Race Theory. United We Stand Divided We Fall. WEGIWGA Where We Go 1 We Go All. IMO all of Us Americans are in Jeopardy from the Powers that Be. They want us fighting amongst Ourselves. Party, Race, Religion, Beliefs you name it. But in the End we are all Spiritual Beings living in a Human Body. We all Bleed RED. We as Humans and Americans need to pull together and fight against the People who are Evil and selfish and trying to destroy Humanity.

[@mariannemarek6683]

This is what happens in a culture that warehouses their children in day care and schools to avoid their parental responsibility. Parents fail to engage their children and pour into them. They abdicate parental resonsibility.

[@michaeltuffin5002]

Not once did I see any substantive facts in ur txt.plz.. I need to see something tangible.. can u explicitly name me 3 to 5 things that the parents did that they can be treated like evil criminals with what Ethan did.

[@donnalynn2]

@@michaeltuffin5002 It is what they didn't do!!! He is crying out for help. He sees demons is begging his mom to come home and she ignores him. How in the world can you do this?

[@Dale115]

Well I am judging. I had difficult children. Having to leave work and go to the school on a weekly basis. You don’t desert your children. You fight for them. EVEN WHEN THEY SAY ITS NOTHING! They left him to a public defender and they got private lawyers for themselves. He killed four innocent children. He needed the best defense he could get.

[@LH-hh4rr]

Man if I were the crumbleys and had these attorneys I'd be scared shitless.this lady is terrible as a lawyer!

[@robinlaniertomlinson5373]

Great for the prosecution l 😂😂😂😂

[@Porn05Mouth]

They should consider themselves lucky that anyone is willing to take their case.

[@kassiemontedoro4637]

I agree completely. The one attorney says nothing at all, and the other is a complete idiot. She sounds like she is completely lost and confused and keeps making mistakes when speaking. It is as if this is her first time ever on a real case. Listening to this, it reminds me of the movie Legally Blonde when Reece Whitherspoon is trying her first case and making no sense LOL.

[@spicyirwin5835]

They bought them leaving Ethan to court appointed. Great if he got a better 1!

[@codyrussow170]

Smith. One of those female lawyers previously represented Jerry Nasser and Jumana Nagarwala. If you don't know either of these men look em up

[@Firepaw20011]

They have multiple phones so no excuse that they didn't answer the school or couldn't afford to take time from work to actually be parents. This is gross negligence that they weren't involved in helping their child become a healthy and mature person, instead they run and tell their child they shouldn't have been caught and to be smarter about their shady plans. Sadly this boy didn't fall far from the tree because his parents are rotten to the core. Some people just don't deserve to have kids.

[@marciayoung1094]

Not to mention that they hired their own Lawyer but made their son get a court appointed attorney. I hope they both are held accountable for their actions or lack of actions. Who buys their young child a 9mm handgun anyway SMH.

[@debbysalmon2498]

Gross negligence because they missed a phone call?? Maybe she was driving. How many phone calls have you missed??????? You know nothing about these parents. You rely on what information the DA and the news CHOOSES to release. If they had taken him home, and he really wanted to shoot up the school, don't you think he would have done it the next day?

[@pricklypear7516]

@@marciayoung1094 Think it through. The state has an iron-clad case against Ethan. NO defense attorney is going to make a difference; the boy's going away for a long, long time. But the case against the Crumbleys is so weak that the "high-powered attorneys" almost certainly offered their services for free or close to it. A high-profile case with a really good chance of a favorable outcome. . . a defense lawyer's dream. If you're looking for evidence of the Crumbleys' self-centeredness or lack of concern for Ethan, you can find plenty. . . but this point isn't really valid.

[@JakePlisskin12]

@@marciayoung1094 there kid is going to prison for the rest of his natural life in a no death penalty state. There's nothing any lawyer could do for Ethan.

[@Porn05Mouth]

@@Michael_J_M14 Maybe, but his parents are his primary care givers. They bear the weight of the responsibility for him and his actions.

[@coopyduck6901]

I enjoyed watching this pre-trial hearing on this channel. Camera angles great and sound is great. Thank You

[@corinnelsmith]

wait so i thought his attorneys swore up and down they weren't trying to run? if them hiding in a warehouse, having other people getting them necessities, hiding their car, taking out their entire measly savings, even stealing from the kids account wasn't enough to prove they were in fact running....how are the attorneys going to defend 7 cell phones?

[@dorapete4536]

If you find out theres an active shooter at your kids school normal parental insticts would be to go straight to the school and try to save your child from a bullet. They went home and checked to see if their gun was gone which totally says they thought of him as capable of that type of act..they are negligent and played a roll for sure

[@doracampos2088]

Bingo!

[@cristineconnell7803]

And wanted police to come to the house! I would have said I think it's my son, I am going to talk him down if possible! Instead he requests officers at his house! What to protect him?

[@jennibishop718]

Yes!! They knew it was their kid.

[@skye6066]

You got that right💯

[@catbishop27]

Agreed.

[@Hurrricaane]

How many times does the Judge have to remind the Defense Attorney of her opportunities to cross examine, like she is a studying law student? 🤣

[@michelleferrero8206]

As an Oakland County resident, I am quite impressed with our DA's office and our Sherrif's Department. I hope when the Crumbley's are found guilty or accept a plea, I hope the Crumbley's won't be able to appeal based on incompetent representation. The Crumbley's attorneys are full blown idiots!

[@spicyirwin5835]

They got themselves attys but Ethan got court ordered. Karma? Bet that hurt Ethan also. BUT NOW THEY HAVE TIME FOR ETHAN.

[@janetbenning2645]

The defense is also unexperienced and very young

[@toddjohnson5176]

Unfortunately they will try and probably will get one.🙁

[@mylesastinnette6208]

Totally agree and the Crumbley’s are paying them while Ethan is stuck with an appointed district attorney. They wiped out his bank account leaving him with 99 cents. Shameful. I hope Ethan gets the help he’s been begging for. He should have shot his proud parents and not innocent victims. They are scum.

[@cristineconnell7803]

I hope they go hard after the school too! All culpable! The school definitely should not be allowed to only do their own internal investigation!

[@todd9391]

the parents need to be held accountable. i hope they get 50 years in prison so their life can be ruined like they ruined there sons life.

[@janelle009]

50 years for neglect? Most they can get is 15 for manslaughter but that's a slippery slope charging parents. Then every gang members parents would be doing life! They 100% neglected him but it's him who made his choices.

[@lauriepierce4068]

This expert witness is incredible!

[@nellytamayo3414]

They should go to jail just for being horrible parents who ignored their child’s cry for help and caused this tragedy just heartbreaking

[@crystalthornton2528]

How old are you? Do you have kids? I doubt that very seriously. Parents should not be held reliable for anything that their children do when they are not there.

[@crystalthornton2528]

Bet you think Jeffrey Dahmer's parents should go to jail too right? Wrong Jeffrey Dahmer told the news that he had an amazing childhood and he still turned out to be a murderer.

[@girlygal098]

@@crystalthornton2528 Jeffrey Dahmer was an adult, Einstein.

[@irenestrmnss4496]

Many horrible parents. Prisons can filled up. 😢

[@marionfriedenthal7352]

As the mother of a schizophrenic I cannot believe that they never got him psychiatric assistance. He was obviously in a really bad psychological space. March - if not sooner - to November with no treatment. Based on what we've heard so far hey carry a lot of blame for what happened imo.

[@renaraj385]

Why do I feel like James was worried Ethan might come for them. Why did he so desperately want an officer at the house?

[@CensorCipher]

I wondered the same thing. That seemed odd. Tho pretty much everything they did seemed odd.

[@renaraj385]

@@CensorCipher you're absolutely right

[@dorapete4536]

Maybe they were scared of the other parents and the community comming for them idk

[@renaraj385]

@@dorapete4536 that makes sense

[@cristineconnell7803]

Just another display of the self centeredness that drove them!

[@amileinmyshoes24-7]

The fact that these two were taking concrete steps to elude law enforcement illustrates that they knew exactly how responsible they were for the murders committed by their creepy, dead-eyed son.

[@MrJamberee]

No, it doesn’t. That’s absurd. It shows they did not want to be arrested yet. That’s all it shows. You know nothing about this except what the media has sponged you, and you should know better than to take their word for anything.

[@sumyungguy88]

@@MrJamberee no innocent person has 7 cellphones especially burners. They drained Ethan’s bank account and had thousands of cash on them. They were for sure running.

[@Porn05Mouth]

@@MrJamberee Kind of a hypocritical statement. How are you going to claim YOU know what their intent was but the OP couldn’t possibly know? At this point, we are all just speculating based on the information that has been released, and one person’s conclusions are no more valid than another’s.

[@JakePlisskin12]

They didn't want to go to prison for something thier psycho dead eyed son did. They had nothing to do with the cold blooded murder of 4 kids.

[@vickicali]

"Creepy dead-eyed" and we wonder why ppl don't want to be open about having mental health issues, especially kids.

[@dianagable3349]

What is truly sad about these parents is that it seems that they are/were ready to totally abandon their son. He must feel so alone. I understand he did evil and will be punished but I also feel sorry that he had such neglectful parents.

[@myrnawashington9057]

No doubt when this Is all over, and the parents do not go to jail the parents will get out dodge and have no contact with Ethan for ruining their lives. Just wondering if there are extended family members like grandparents, aunts, uncles? What do they known about Ethan's behavior? Did they have concerns regarding Ethan's problems?

[@verabolton]

@Lady CG Are you joking? "Poor kid" who murdered children, and "evil" are his parents? What's wrong with you?

[@Helmuesi911]

I feel nothing for that little bastard.

[@Helmuesi911]

@Lady CG Poor kid? I’m sorry but you are absolutely despicable.

[@happydayz7857]

He’s a direct product of them. Mind body and soul. That’s what you take on when you become a parent.

[@micheledavis9280]

These parents failed him and he was showing questioniable behavior!!! Damn

[@kathysheehan1]

Mother didn't do crap for her son

[@ashleycee113]

This child begged her to at least text him back, and she ignored him until the next morning and then records show she was horseback riding... not a justification but man this child was screaming for help

[@carolr4871]

Given the magnitude of these parents' neglect, this is going to sound petty: they don't even know how to wear a mask properly.

[@roselapp5725]

This is very sad situation for this person, Ethan, he was screaming for help which his parents completely ignored. The images are very real to him. Dealing with a with person with mental illness is extremely difficult. It doesn't excuse his actions but his parents are 💯 responsible.

[@Helmuesi911]

He tortured animals as well as shredding his classmates with a gun his scumbag parents bought him. There is *no* sympathy for this family. All three of them need to be removed from society.

[@alwaysyouramanda]

Shocking that the teachers just obliged when the parents refused to take action. They should have immediately contacted CPS and local police. I picture the adults as well as the kids simply laughing at this boy. He was probably filled with rage over the fact that no one would take him seriously. They had a chance.

[@KindCountsDeb3773]

@@Helmuesi911 If someone is mentally ill, it's a reason that can be used to defend a client and person can be found not guilty due to insanity. It's a real reason, a real condition. His mind was delusional, and he lost his grip on reality. Mental sickness is real.

[@Timmichanga361]

I grew up with severe anxiety. Suffered from depression. Parents fought constantly. Had money problems. We had guns in the house. I watched Stallone and Schwarzenegger movies all through the 80's and 90's. Had toys guns. Played video games. Went to school with jerks, was picked on and made fun of, made to feel self conscious. Not once did it ever cross my mind to murder people.

[@ronnie8984]

Anxiety and depression don’t usually have violent symptoms. Ethan’s mental illness goes beyond that and he’s even experiencing hallucinations. I think what might also separate you from Ethan is that Ethan’s parents didn’t care much for him. I suspect he felt he didn’t have anything to lose.

[@madeleinereed6460]

Same here, but my parents were also very present in my life regardless of their divorce, and my mom and I moving to the other side of town. They were very strict but they weren't uncaring and never ignored my cries for help. These people were too wrapped up in extracurricular activities to give two eff about Ethan.

[@anniemythiabright5055]

me too never wanted to murder anyone but I did want to kill myself...is this the same kind of mental illness??

[@Suzie77]

To me IMO her tears weren’t even about Ethan they were about her husband and the fact he was emotional on the call or probably her fear that his call to 911 already assuming their son was involved was very incriminating.

[@bibit3856]

In a way….I feel bad for Ethan….he was calling his parents for help.

[@sdub7045]

I feel badly for him too. He did a horrible thing, but it could have been prevented if he had received the help he was crying out for. Instead they bought him a gun.

[@bikemutant]

nahhhh

[@alwaysyouramanda]

I really do too. I mean, what he did was horrible and absolutely unforgivable but at one point, that was a baby boy who just wanted someone to take his problems and feelings seriously. He was all alone with very big and scary thoughts. What a shame. I’m so glad those parents won’t get off. Hopefully this sets an example for the rest of the parents out here who put themselves first. I decided I wouldn’t have kids at 13 because I felt so unloved. I didn’t want to put another human through what I went through. I’m 30 now. Happily living my OWN life till I feel ready to take on another.

[@deannawiederhold333]

You know what I am beginning to believe that alot of haters on here aren't Parents.

[@deannawiederhold333]

Heartless and have no SOULS and Compassion. Yes I agree that Ethan needs to get punishment. A Child learns from his or her Parent or Parents. Another Point A Child isn't born a racist He or She is taught that. Just like the Critical Race Theory taught by Liberal Teachers.

[@Lianne459]

Sure, 7 cellphones means they werent planning to run away and abandon their son.

[@latoya278]

And no ones going to tell me any different that these parents did not know what their son was about to do the next day!!!!!! Rest in Heaven to all the beautiful students whom lost their lives in such a very tragic way🙏🏾

[@robc8468]

They knew their son was totally screwed up mentally but they were probably in denial, otherwise they would have stopped their son to save their own sorry asses.

[@Coolkids-zu9md]

You’re right, they didn’t know what their son was planning because they ignored every plea for help from him, they were busy with their double affair, they were busy spending 1-3 hours 3-4 days a week caring for their horses. They were so busy with their own lives and hobbies that they ignored and negligented their son to the point where he took a gun they provided and didn’t safely store and their son killed and injured people. I’ve been watching all the videos, testimony, etc and they are most definitely guilt of gross negligence leading to involuntary manslaughter

[@kainmarco4323]

I think they wanted to be free of caring for him. so they let him do what he did and it backfired on them

[@hilarriet1075]

What lousy parents. He was crying out for help 😢 😡😡⚖

[@triley1709]

But yet not one adult checked his backpack!! They are responsible also!!

[@cathycrowder2226]

I am not sure the school can check a students backpack. The school can check their desks and lockers but backpacks I think are personal property. They would have to have almost certain knowledge of a gun in his backpack and if they had that knowledge then the school would have called the police right away. I am not excusing the school or administrators but there are laws regarding how much authority the schools have especially in a complicated situation like this one.

[@triley1709]

@@cathycrowder2226 I believe that they are allowed too, because whatever is on school grounds are subject to search..

[@pricklypear7516]

@@triley1709 New Jersey v. TLO (1985) holds that backpacks are students' private and personal property and may NOT be searched. I can easily imagine the Crumbleys being self-righteous, belligerent, and contemptuous of the school's concerns for Ethan: The very type who are apt to scream "Lawsuit!" at every perceived slight. Since the administrators /counselors had no idea that Ethan had access to a gun, and since they seemed to have been more concerned about Ethan self-harming than harming others, they erred on the side of NOT getting sued rather than on the side of safety. A truly tragic miscalculation.

[@triley1709]

@@pricklypear7516 It is very tragic. I feel so sorry for the parents that lost their children. And it sounds like they didn’t want to b bothered by their son’s problems and kept their distance. They are very selfish..

[@cathycrowder2226]

@@triley1709 I cannot find anything that says they can search personal property like a backpack without reasonable suspicion(4th amendment). In fact it's just the opposite They can search desks and lockers because that is school property. They can take your phone but cannot search it.... Only a court of law can determine reasonable suspicion. Now if someone had seen Ethan with a gun in his backpack and reported it then they have enough reasonable suspicion to search it.

[@EmilyElizabethxox]

This sh*t just gets weirder and weirder. The more I learn the more I blame the parents and feel bad for Ethan. Even if what he did was reprehensible, his parents are puppet masters. Hands down.

[@thatdude3977]

I'm here to kheel the puppet Master Him and whoever love the bastard

[@lorikirkpatrick2653]

It's a little too late for mom to start crying and acting like she loves her child. Nice try having her attorney wipe her tears. Who is wiping the tears of the loved ones who lost their child.

[@AAAReview]

Wow she didn't even text her son back when he was scared and asking for help. Just repeatedly abandoned him home alone to go horse back riding.

[@GRMLS5]

Considering she has full blown family discussions on her work phone oin work hours, loud enough for others to her it, it is no surprise she thinks her son using his phone during a class is funny.

[@cynthiaconnors183]

This is SO sad! Ethan is a victim as well. Had no hope, desperate, disturbance and depression. Mix that in with selfish parents that are emotionally absent, it obviously breeds tragedy for many. Their clear neglect caused catastrophe that their son will suffer forever. An edit add on...I feel it wasn't just the above, but I feel Ethan felt that going full on, was the only way to get help. By causing mass destruction, arrest and a possibility of getting the help he needed.

[@timothyfreeseha4056]

Very possibly correct.

[@pandaprophetable]

Ethan was very depressed, you do not buy a gun for a depressed teen. Maybe they thought he might shoot himself. Despicable parents

[@acheleg]

hate to say it, but i suspect the same. they didnt want the copays for mental health, or the liability of him not being able to work as an adult & ruining the parents retirement plans

[@messenger8854]

Possible...I can't understand the logic behind buying a gun for your depressed son

[@vondalynreddick7343]

Why. Buy. Son. A. Gun. Crazy. Parents

[@vickiekasafirek9096]

Omg this kid was crying out for help and his parents totally ignored him. SMH

[@bobbiechinn9578]

These parents need to pay for this. Ethan needs help and love.

[@Karmabitt]

This is so sad because I honestly don’t know how I would go on without my son. To lose a child in this manner has to be devastating and horrific but I pray for God to give them all peace.

[@WingsofWendysChilli]

How the hell could you sleep under the same roof with him after receiving dozens of those strange texts ??

[@lexilouwhoo]

I couldn’t even watch this. Gave me so much anxiety and bad vibes. Sickening. Rip to all the young lives lost. Praying for our world.

[@johnanthony2333]

Let me get this straight, during the meeting at the school, the parents said they didn't have time to take their kid home due to work, but in his 911 call, the father states that right after leaving that very same school meeting, he "raced home" to check on his gun. hmmm And what kind of mother describes her own son to her friends as "weird"?

[@happydayz7857]

Shyt talking about your kid on public is a sign that kid is being abused at home.

[@UnequallyYolkedCouple]

Make sure they are accountable, mass shootings are out of control. What parent encourages this behavior?