P90: FN's Bullpup PDW

/ forgottenweapons
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FN began developing the P90 in the late 1980s, actually preceding the NATO requirement that it would eventually compete for. The idea of the P90 was to develop a weapon for secondary troops to replace 9mm pistols and SMGs. There was an anticipated threat of Russian paratroops wearing armor that could defeat 9mm ball. The P90 was intended to be a light and handy weapon that was easily controllable without a tremendous about of training, and could defeat that sort of body armor.
The result was the 5.7x28mm cartridge, firing a 31 grain armor-piercing bullet at 2350 fps. This was combined with a simple blowback action and a Hall-style 50-round magazine in a fully ambidextrous, bullpup layout. The gun was introduced onto the market in 1990, and has been widely purchased by security and special operations organizations. In its original intended role for support troops, it has only been adopted by Belgium.
Contact:
Forgotten Weapons
6281 N. Oracle 36270
Tucson, AZ 85740

[@BRICK8492]

Gotta love it. "We need a PDW for behind the lines. Two companies submitted designs and we like both of them. Therefore we will adopt neither."

[@punished_gooner]

nato moment

[@chee.rah.monurB]

Why adopt neither? Do they expect someone esle to make something BETTER than a P90?

[@nik021298]

@@chee.rah.monurB they were going to adopt the P90, but Germany vetoed it.

[@krillnyetheshrimpguy6152]

@LOAN NGUYEN Of course it's not Germany's fault for not adopting the P90 XD

[@lordomacron3719]

Well it did not become the NATO standard across all members but some members do have as standard within their own nations military.

[@andljoy]

Highly effective against replicators and snake heads.

[@food_toobs8333]

Good against Russian armor? Sketchy… Good against Goa’uld armor? Confirmed!

[@Eurekanation1]

dont forget wraith and genii assault teams

[@ragingbombast]

Indeed.

[@Dankalank]

All you need is one working hand and a single-point sling, then you're ready to take on the Galaxy(ies)!

[@davidbrennan660]

Several seasons of R+D agrees it has a armour penetration of note to non-taree protective garments.

[@lordomacron3719]

You know one of the main reasons the P90 was used on Stargate SG-1 was the ejection of spent cartridges straight down meant they could get better close ups of the actors without having to worry about cartridges flying around. Edit - they used so much blank P90 ammo on the show they cause a minor supply shortage as the 5.7 x 28 round was not exactly commonplace.

[@DKNguyen3.1415]

Infinite ammo. The pinnacle of Tauri tech development.

[@tropingreenhorn]

stonks!

[@nejinaji]

That is actually hilarious causing a short

[@DKNguyen3.1415]

@@nejinaji It's just the cover story for why there is a shortage like Wormhole Extreme..

[@TheFerrango]

@@DKNguyen3.1415 Indeed

[@89thaharmaiiioptreshenanig3]

HK when they saw the P90 after presenting their MP7 for the NATO contract probably looked like Patrick Bateman during the business card scene in American Psycho lol.

[@maniacaljedi2848]

“Oh my god, it even has a water mark!!”

[@theDarkness558]

"Let's see Paul Allen's gun"

[@groundzero1077]

"I cannot believe that NATO prefers FN's gun to mine..."

[@octopushands6923]

And the 5seven

[@stephendurrant5790]

200 likes in 3 months

[@ScavsAteMyLegs]

Some say it was crafted specifically to rush B sites.

[@rosh5614]

Some say it was crafted specifically to destroy the whole factory with ss190

[@zacheurittz9865]

All we know is, it's called the P90.

[@croncorcen]

Dude you are just everywhere where the topic is guns or shooters! 😂

[@GamingCookster]

P90 is fucking goated on tarkov

[@CssHDmonster]

go away, its wipe week, play 24/7

[@anticarrrot]

"Why did you purchase your P90?" A) Armour penetrating capability B) Compact weight and low mass C) Saw it on Stargate

[@PhillipAmthor]

D) Dual wielding while holding a katana with your mouth

[@leonardusrakapradayan2253]

E) Rushing B site

[@Leonidae]

C.

[@jamiecole2096]

C.

[@getthegoons]

Saaaaaaame Never know when you're going to have to rush the objective

[@jameslewis2635]

To be fair to the Stargate crowd, the choice of arming their main characters with the P90 makes absolute sense (on paper at least) when you consider the teams mission profile and what this weapon is designed to do. That is a team that is sent to explore without transport (meaning a compact and light weight design is highly desirable) without much in the way of support (meaning a large capacity cartridge is pretty handy) without intending to go into direct combat but if they do go into a fight their most regular foe is known for wearing body armour.

[@Attaxalotl]

Shame the pistols weren't also FN Five-SeveNs; it would've used the same ammo which would've made a LOT of sense (they barely have a logistics tail, you want everything to also be a backup for something else)

[@AnimeSunglasses]

​@@Attaxalotl hey, they had to have some realistic nods to Air Force paperwork!

[@mrthingy9072]

The other bonus of the P90 was that you could carry a LOT of ammo for it on your body, the cartridge is pretty small and the ammo is rather light because of it. You can carry 500 rounds of 5.7x28 a lot easier than 500 rounds of .308. For small quick reaction teams that need to move fast (like the SG teams), it seems like the ideal firearm.

[@Edax_Royeaux]

I'd figure if you are going exploring, you'd want a long range weapon like a SCAR-H Battle Rifle.

[@daemonspring]

@@Edax_Royeaux Exploration does not require engagement. Range isn't so useful in a forest and binoculars are much lighter. It's notable that SG-1's typical foes had a shorter effective range than a P90. The team also started to rely on aerial drones. A lot of the areas they had to explore manually would have been short range environments. Caves, forests, buildings. The small team size would also make it awkward to have a dedicated marksman. Typically the team is either being ambushed or choosing when to engage. When they do engage it's rapid strikes and retreats. There are surprisingly few opportunities to make use of range. But sometimes with prior knowledge it would make sense to take different equipment. P90s as default gear for the unknown gives them a lot of firepower that will let them leave quickly.

[@leinadreign3510]

"This particular one is the u SG-version..." Ahhh, the Stargate Version!

[@Folker46590]

It's P-Chan from Gun Gale Online, just paint it pink.

[@zafranorbian757]

@@Folker46590 Stargate and GGO, I see I am in good company here.

[@GingTheGing]

lmao. words of the wise.

[@cptjfk]

@Watzetzface Tial'c complies!

[@mho...]

@@cptjfk Teal'c 🙈

[@plumdowner1941]

The gun every kid in the 90s/2000s grew up with seeing in almost every shooter they played.

[@Mephiles343]

It's a very cool weapon,This gun along with some others like resident evil's samurai edge,Metal gears colt SAA wielded by ocelot,And the Socom pistol got me started in weird or video game firearms

[@michaelgum97]

The only time that I remember seeing it was in Madness Combat videos, mainly in Madness Combat 6: Antipathy and Xionic Madness 1.5

[@kurnhurin4118]

@@michaelgum97 Goldeneye 64 and TimeSplitters 2. And you could dual wield.

[@moritamikamikara3879]

And of course... Stargate bois

[@MrDwarfpitcher]

Oh yeah I remember playing 007 Agent under Fire You had the KA 57 (AK 47) The P100 (P90) Why make over the top futuristic guns when you can just up the number of existing guns and give it a little twist?

[@Summer-it3wh]

Favourite of the air force's extraplanetary branch.

[@food_toobs8333]

The real Space Force lol

[@ragingbombast]

Indeed.

[@keilet]

Yeah. Screw HK! :p

[@ivareskesner2019]

Along side the emp grenades and plasma mines 👍🏼

[@TheAmazingCowpig]

Might be hard to get hands on a zat though.

[@pianomail]

If you've ever held one, you get the sense of why special operations might want to use it. It is TINY compared to an M4. It fits very nicely into your shoulder and is very ergonomically designed. The tip of the barrel is closer than if you were wielding a pistol, meaning, clearing a room and spinning/turning is extremely easy and you can do it much quicker than with something longer. The added benefit of the 50rd magazine and light weight just add to that benefit.

[@DStecks]

That's actually a crazy thought, this thing is so compact that in practice it's more compact than even a pistol. Ideal gun for getting into a firefight inside of an elevator.

[@tropingreenhorn]

and also, it is ambidextrous, you can fire it well both left and right-handed, and the projectile ejects down, gotta love the ergonomics.

[@the-btc-tradingfloor2808]

Close quarter Sweet roadhouse cleaner, packs a nice punch

[@victorpapillon1487]

Very beneficial benefits

[@1olddirtroad]

If you have to sprinkle the torso of an enemy its not effective. A Mid Western Police Dept. Had 14 shootings with this gun/cartridge and switched back to SBR 5.56 due to DISMAL RESULTS.

[@Uneedhelp91]

I will never forget the first time I saw a FN P90. I didn't know what it was as I was a kid, my family was visiting D.C. taking a tour of the Whitehouse in 1999 and when we were waiting online to go through security there were secret service off in the distance that had these guns. I didn't find out it was called a p90 until I started watching Stargate SG1.

[@mikimiyazaki]

Never seen one in person but the first time i heard or observed one in any fashion, was when i first started playing "Tom Clancy's rainbow 6" lol. The P90 is in every rainbow 6 game ive seen.

[@worldprops333]

cool story zuh

[@NAFOSGCFella]

SG-1

[@the-btc-tradingfloor2808]

Me 2

[@beargillium2369]

First saw it referenced in an issue of Popular Mechanics around 1990

[@commandZee]

Every time Ian says "We'll be doing some shooting with this tomorrow." What I hear in my head is a bunch of children screaming in unison, "YAY!!!"

[@seanrosenau2088]

I hear the Halo 3 confetti explosion YAY sound effects.

[@brendonbewersdorf986]

I've been looking forward to this

[@clothar23]

YAY!!!!!!!

[@isveryniceyes]

@@seanrosenau2088 First thing that came to my head lol

[@justignoreme7725]

Given the simplicity of the design can this be adapted for 3D printing, especially as its likely to be out of patent??

[@mightybrows8809]

"Small batch use, by highly trained & specialised units" - Yep my brain went straight to SG1 too

[@amstrad00]

"This is a weapon of war, it is meant to /kill/ your enemy."

[@bgsather]

Pretty sure one of the P90s in SG1 was one I actually fired before the USAF declared them junk and gave it to the TV show.

[@Rudofaux]

@@bgsather To be fair. The USAF's opinions on ground weapons is anecdotal at best. Army, Navy, & Marines opinion on ground weapons have greater weight.

[@bgsather]

@@Rudofaux True. Their not using P90s either.

[@DavidKennedyMontanakennedy]

I kept waiting for a Stargate reference... At least as part of the Elbonian Stargate program...

[@swag8724]

Ian explaining the reason behind this weapons conception is interestingly chilling for recent events, lol.

[@777malkavian]

Turned out to be an overestimation, huh

[@TheTuttle99]

@@LIONTAMER3D you haven't got a clue what you're talking about

[@Mofunana]

@@TheTuttle99 lmao

[@Queldonus]

I first saw this weapon when it was used in the TV show Stargate SG1. I was pleasantly surprised to find out that it was a real weapon. I was even more surprised to find out the show generally represents it correctly: an easy to carry weapon that has good armor penetrating properties. Before the P90 was used, they carried MP5s, so the transition makes sense. It seems that the show had someone on staff that knew weapons beyond how to make them look sexy on screen.

[@hewdelfewijfe]

They had some real air force officers or something as technical advisors to the show. The air force loved the show because the show made the air force look so cool (and hence recruitment benefits). The show got a lot of help from the air force. They even had some real air force generals guest star on the show.

[@FreedomForever2010]

@@hewdelfewijfe that's interesting because of how much of the show was filmed/financed in Canada or with Canadian actors.

[@Birdzlitlehelpr]

@@FreedomForever2010 It was filmed mostly in Canada with Canadian actors, but depicted mostly US Air Force officers and operations. Another fun tidbit, the show was so popular, that at the real Cheyenne mountain complex a broom closet was labeled "Stargate Command". Although the real place doesn't allow for visitors, terrestial or otherwise lol

[@aserta]

All the gun touching crew and cast were trained to operate them.

[@MrChainsawAardvark]

The gun meant for rear-echelon troops to defend against special forces is instead used by special forces against rear-echelon troops.

[@Kiido11]

This is freaking hilarious yet true

[@dekonfrost7]

Well said.

[@blastoise114]

Sounds a bit like the M1 Carbine

[@tehpanda64]

insert spiderman pointing at spiderman meme here

[@user-uv5ld3cx5t]

You have become the very thing you swore to destroy

[@albireo8166]

This is a weapon of war - colonel Jack O'Neill Stargate

[@wyatthausman4377]

(proceeds to blow a whole ass log apart) 😂 god I love that show

[@neon_necromunda]

Likely the most well known (barring video games) use. Stargate made it famous

[@Matt-xc6sp]

Then why the hell did we use those MP5s for 3 years? - Jackson, probably

[@jonathanschubert9052]

Has a high velocity 22 caliber AP bullet, making it superior to the M16 for Jaffa armor

[@danieluchwal3515]

Funny how I've been watching SG1 again

[@fratercontenduntocculta8161]

The thing that impressed me most about the P90 is how crazy simple it is. It's like a top loading polymer sten gun. I'm a huge FN fan, and I got to use most of their weapons in the US Army.

[@Shirkatron]

I only saw this weapon used when I was stationed around embassies. Agents said they requested the weapon for performing VIP work and escort missions. The ability to conceal a fully auto weaponry under your arm (Especially in a work suit) that carries a 50 round magazine was blessing in disguise (pun intended). I see the P90 more as a responsive weapon then an assault weapon. The ability of one person to hold position and offer cover fire during an evacuation is amazing to imagine.

[@fatpad00]

​@El Cactuar maybe they mean to use it as a reactive weapon, then transition into an assault weapon lol

[@MARfilms]

Even now, dispite being almost 40 years old, it still looks like it's from the future. I love the design of the P90.

[@nickel36]

Almost 40? It's just over 30 years old.

[@stapuft]

@@nickel36 some kids cant do math yet, :P

[@DCAKAJ]

l think its ugly AF

[@emperorfaiz]

@@DCAKAJ And that's make it so iconic.

[@AntonAdelson]

Is it just me or it's literally genius-level firearm design?

[@dial0foroperator]

Probably one of the LEAST forgotten weapons.

[@somnorila9913]

I would agree. Probably within the same specter of common knowledge as the AK, i mean it does have a pretty unique silhouette.

[@foximacentauri7891]

@@TheFirstCurse1 what are you talking about? 80% of Ian's videos are about weapons I've never heard from before, and I bet neither have you.

[@paynekiller75]

@@foximacentauri7891 Sorry, but no (and speak only for yourself on what you've heard of, btw). Aces here is absolutely correct. I'd wager it's the case with a good portion of us as well. The "forgotten" part is cool, but hardly why a lot of us are here. As evidenced by the comments, we're here for Ian. He's a good dude with a great temperament. Like the teacher from grade school we all wish we had. Besides, there's an absolute finite amount of firearms/weapons in the world; it was inevitable that at some point and after SO many vids that Ian would surpass what's *forgotten* lol

[@mortache]

Its kinda "forgotten" because it didn't become the standard smg when the Germans pushed their MP7

[@f3uibeghardt522]

Don't discourage this type of content. These are just as or possibly even more interesting than the actually-forgotten weapons.

[@matthijsvvelzen]

Ian missed that the barrel is actually spring loaded to the front and will move back about 1 to 2 mm's during firing resembling a short recoil action.

[@grimlock1471]

Interesting. I wonder why FN did that.

[@matthijsvvelzen]

@@grimlock1471 I think it keeps de receiver locked a bit longer and assists in the start of extraction. Also note the shape of the flashider, which resembles a recoil booster cone. In my experience fitting a silencer greatly diminishes reliability.

[@guilemaigre14]

That is something i didn't knew about. I will look it up if i don't forget when i get back to work (i work there). Also, about the truncated flash hidder, i have been explained that it was so that if it falls to the ground barrel first, it would make it tilt to the side and reduce the risk of having a fire.

[@guilemaigre14]

About that short recoil it has. I learned something today. One of my collegue engineer whom worked on it explained to me that the play was left to accomodate for the thermal dilatation of the barrel, so that it doesn't get seized in it's assembly. But it wasn't designed to opperate with a short barrel recoil and is considered a simple blowback.

[@howitreallyis2235]

The same mistake is often made for the Fiveseven pistol, which has a much more obvious short recoil action and yet is consistently called straight blowback.

[@TheSpenswar17]

FW: This gun was designed to penetrate Russian body armor. Stargate Fans: it can also penetrate advanced space aliens' armor. Do you think this guy has any idea how many people are coming here just from SG forums? lol

[@paleoph6168]

The P90. Future Vision. Exotic Caliber. Kinsgslayer.

[@cerealata9035]

Ahoy?

[@kommandantgalileo]

@@cerealata9035 Yep

[@paleoph6168]

@@cerealata9035 you got it. 😎👍

[@Bluboy511]

I love ahoy

[@niccatipay]

Drrrumm Ting ting ting~

[@smartassdroid5149]

The BEST advertisement for this gun was Stargate SG1.

[@LordSpleach]

Don't forget Goldeneye 007

[@ThePaperKhan]

I never watched the series but i watched the original movies

[@Keti9er]

@@ThePaperKhan I recently finished the series - it was pretty good 👍

[@Nightwyn]

Original Counterstrike made me fall in love with it. But you’re right, SG1 definitely did good things for its fame.

[@DamonInferis]

Or Ghost In The Shell

[@darthhodges]

Regarding the armor penetration capabilities 9 Hole Reviews did a deep dive on the actual NATO trials report and points out that the listed armor spec the gun needed to perforate was NOT anything the Soviets were actually using at the time. He concludes that the armor specified was actually a conceptual one, far less effective than what the Soviets actually had, but guaranteed to prevent a 9mm firearm from being adopted. He refers to another KZbinr showing that neither 5.7 or 4.6 would penetrate actual Soviet body armor of the time.

[@SheyD78]

Hang on, so neither of them did what they were actually supposed to be designed to do? Sad.

[@TheWetworm]

That's it! Soviets never had what they 'claimed' they had but NATO still had this badass P90 which could handle it anyway

[@jetburrito5205]

@@TheWetworm it would have failed against soviet armor

[@aserta]

@@jetburrito5205 What armor? The one they're using now... which can be shot right through with 9mm as seen in captured examples posted by the Ukrainians and Legion members? Soviets had barefuckall, it was all a smoke and mirror bullshit propaganda, mostly fueled by satellite nation successes. Ukraine basically built everything the moscovites prided themselves with, from cold weather machinery to lunar rovers.

[@johnhighway7399]

@@TheWetworm Learn how to read bro

[@GlyntTheCat]

"Why did you buy a P90?" "I think it's pretty neat c:"

[@gunmadonna]

me with my ps90 but also it's the perfect platform for a genuinely kickass cartridge! low recoil - anybody can use it - with the ability to pierce soft armor. in 50 round standard capacity magazines? heck yes. fully ambidextrous, ejects downward... super compact package, incredibly reliable & easy to maintain.. it has sooo many things going for it people call it a "range toy" because they don't want to live in a world where something that looks this weird is also super practical. not at all sorry to say we in fact do live in that world

[@CurtisMenton]

The thing Ian didn't want to say, IMO, about why this got special forces adoption: It just looks really freaking cool. No way the operators are going to let truck drivers have cooler guns than them.

[@luukas2660]

Indeed, it looks sick. Also because it's a bullpup it's fantastic for close quarters, the muzzle is literally right on top of your grip hand.

[@Electromagneticuranium]

@@luukas2660 Not to mention the maximum rof of 1,100rpm lol

[@croccandbaultorcure3295]

@@Electromagneticuranium And it'll turn soft body armor into Swiss cheese

[@lordomacron3719]

@@luukas2660 Ideal for Urban Combat

[@xifel72]

I know you probably are joking, but I honestly believe that this is a bigger factor than most people think. You clearly can see that aestetics play a role in procurment, and these days everyone wants to be a operator with combat shirts and bump helmets

[@nohero23]

Quite effective at defeating the body armour of Jaffa.

[@kafs1822]

KREE!

[@carldavies4776]

@@kafs1822 beat me to it Shol'va!

[@lynchkid003]

Found the Stargate fan

[@Frumious_Jabberwocky]

Indeed

[@tmurdoch2]

INDEED

[@awilywolf]

Love the attention to detail in explaining the nuts and bolts of the gun's operation and design. Was always intrigued by this gun for over a decade, but never knew the history and design.

[@Cyromantik]

Masamune Shirow is absolutely in love with this gun. His Seburo Arms (a fictional firearms company in his Appleseed series) had several variable ammo rifles, machine pistols and mech-operated arms that closely resemble this design.

[@GFMarine]

The P90 became my favorite weapon because of Stargate SG-1.

[@TurinTuramber]

N64 GoldenEye.

[@GFMarine]

@@TurinTuramber I didn't realize until years later that the RCP 90 and the P90 were supposed to be the same weapon, being a dumb kid does do that to you, also I was and still am more of a Perfect Dark type of man myself.

[@TheChitakus]

Same, indeed.

[@TurinTuramber]

@@GFMarine Perfect Dark was awesome game, done all the speed runs also.

[@healingvisioner1]

For me it was Metal Gear Solid 2

[@Deamon93IT]

The P90 has also defended humanity from aliens, too bad FN won't be able to take credit for that!

[@cavemanvi]

it specifically saved me from alec

[@hawkeye5955]

"For England, James?" "No. For Earth."

[@Rangercaptain1138]

IDK if anyone else has said it but the P90 *does* have Iron Sights on it; that notched slit to the left *and* right of the rear of the top assembly (left and right behind the reflex sight) are the rear slit sight and the forward post*s* are the smoothed edged ends at the very front of the assembly. Depending on your hand hold you can use either side to line up a shot. They are *somewhat* effective, obviously non-adjustable, but are a nice built in backup and are moderately useable.

[@jamillejeez4404]

I will never forget this gun. Favorite gun in any video game

[@TheIndianalain]

After 30 years, it still looks ahead of its time. That's why it appears in so many past and present Si-FI movies and series, from SG-1 to Westworld, and counting...

[@Knuspermonster]

also its a stupidly effective and simple design, doenst uses up much space, high mag cap and its ambidextrious

[@chaos.corner]

It should look dated though. There's just a lack of more modern designs.

[@chaos.corner]

@@gratefulguy4130 There's definitely some stuff going on like the gun with the built-in suppressor and the handgun that's curved for better concealed carry and some others but it's a very conservative field.

[@TheIndianalain]

@Shaliqua Smith Show me something that looks more futuristic then.

[@richtenamore9718]

@@TheIndianalain haven’t seen the alien I’m guessing?….I do agree there aren’t a huge number of unique firearms but that one is in a league of its own

[@BBHexKey]

"I would love to get to do some shooting with this.." But? "Tomorrow we're going to do exactly that!" YAY!

[@machina_spirit]

Im almost as old as this gun, and first time I ever saw it was in Goldeneye 007 for N64. I think it was called thw rcp90. It looked so crazy cool and weird, i thought for sure it was a made up gun, especially since it was one of the ‘power’ weapons in multiplayer and prob best gun in the game lol. Surprised theres no goldeneye references here, 90’s kids where ya at?

[@brittgardner2923]

It's really amazing that Pierce Bondsnan could reload that weird magazine so quickly by just dropping it down below his line of sight for a second or so, especially when all he had for hands were two weird boxes with poorly-mapped textures. You good now?

[@neuvocastezero1838]

To me, it will always be an RCP-90.

[@cjaydustie1867]

SOCOM II, PS2

[@johnturtle6649]

I first saw a variation of it in ghost in the shell, the FIRST ghost in the shell.

[@tunatallica]

For me I knew it because it was on Stargate SG1

[@insane0042]

14:21 I heard that the P90 won by a "significant margin." It was more mature, already had* suitable PDW and Pistol designs, and performed better against armor.

[@KayoMichiels]

(Xbox)Ahoy reference?

[@stevenbobbybills]

@@KayoMichiels Stuart Brown hasn't had Xbox in his username for years now.

[@KayoMichiels]

@@stevenbobbybills Yeah, but i had to include it... because his username was like that for a long time.

[@theblitz6838]

The Germans were just salty that they got beaten by the Belgians.

[@Hansengineering]

I do love how every time after the M1c a weapon was developed specifically for "rear echelon troops", it was only ever issued to select few special forces.

[@stamfordly6463]

When you think about it though. SF is either doing FIBUA, where handy and rapid fire is useful, or very covert recce or similar where they've got more important things to carry and they're in such small numbers that their best option on contact is spray, pray and run away. The British Army remains contemptuous of the idea of issuing carbines to infanteers but THEM and semi-special troops like pathfinders often get M4 clones because their primary job is not getting into firefights.

[@LolTollhurst]

Uzi. Swedish K. Skorpion. And arguably the MP-5 because cops buy it.

[@alexeysaphonov232]

In Bundeswehr HK mp7 is exactly PDW. But it seems like for ligistical (to not supply more calibers, 9x19, 5.56x45, 7.62x51, .50 BMG, and for some people 4.6x30 or 5.7x28) when some smaller rifles as m4 or g36c can do similar things with less specific training. And yes, no more the USSR, now the armies are shrinking in size. As economy of China seems better target as its military at least for the our leaders and at least now.

[@Solnoric]

Turns out every time someone came up with a firearm that met the long list of requirements for those rear echelon troop weapons, it turned out to be way more expensive than was desired, because they wanted all those wonder-weapon capabilities but at a price tag roughly in line with a .22 bolt action. Because rear troops.

[@alexeysaphonov232]

@@LolTollhurst Skorpion is Czech, but yes it is a PDW aka better than a pistol smaller than a rifle. UZI and Sterling are not PDW they were here because FAL, G3 and M14 (Battle rifles) were not always cars, tanks, aircrafts, and other small spaces friendly. MP-5 (general issue, which police buys, not PDW) here for precision (closed bolt) and less overpenetration in close quartiers.

[@Memilish]

"I would love to do some shooting with it..." Oh, so you weren't given the chance? "... so that's exactly what I'm going to do!" praise gun Jesus.

[@TheFanatical1]

I am glad I am not the only one who thought this!

[@christianrodriguez3531]

Amen!!

[@scipio10000]

Always be praised

[@Seb-Storm]

Alleluia brothers and sisters... Witness!!! Witness the glory of our all mighty savior!!! Gun jesus bless us again with his infinite power to give us a demonstration of another exotic weapon

[@JohnADoe-pg1qk]

Well, we have to wait, there was no time traveling KZbin link 🙁.

[@gwar180]

One of my favs of all time. Love how the bullets spin at the end to feed

[@incognito1409]

I absolutely love how super innovative FN is. Nice video, Ian. Thanks. Well presented as always.

[@ithinkihadeight]

Ian has all sorts of military uniforms and hats, I really really hope he shows up tomorrow in some SGC BDUs.

[@shooteveryday1841]

Or maybe just an Edina, MN SWAT team uniform

[@FuckYoutubeCensorship]

How about Jaffa armour?

[@tophatminion.7558]

Shol'va Kree

[@herbderbler1585]

It's an old show now, but those vests they wore with the quick detachable backpacks look like they'd still be perfectly serviceable gear in the field today.

[@DiggingForFacts]

The P90 is probably one of FN's best-ever designs. Strikes a good compromise between penetration and terminal velocity for the role that was set out for it, very high capacity while remaining enormously compact, fully ambi while being light and easy to field strip, and absolutely iconic in terms of industrial design by hitting that sci-fi mix of round and flat.

[@W1ldTangent]

They really broke the mold with that gun, but honestly I could see tooled up versions of it being used for quite a long while yet. There's still nothing else that does it's _particular_ job as well.

[@guilemaigre14]

Some would argue you that the FAL or the MAG are also really good designs in their own category. The debate is on i think. :D

[@sickjohnson]

So much want... personal favorite design of mechanical function.

[@angelsfallfirst7348]

@@guilemaigre14 FAL FTW

[@Lankythepyro]

This IS the manufacturer that designed the most successful battle rifle ever made, so there's stiff competition there.

[@TheTech9]

Other than the obvious slow reloads that magazine would cause this looks like an absolutely awesome well executed gun. And 50 rounds! That's a large capacity for such a small package!

[@Gunbudder]

The P90 will always remind me of the Secret Service and SG-1. The SPAS-12 (in pump action mode) also makes me think of SG-1. I didn't even know the SPAS-12 can run pump action until i saw the show as a kid.

[@zodiarkslayer6384]

The most important aspect of the FN 5.7x28mm is its ability to prevent collateral damage. The bullet deforms upon impact rather than being deflected and tumbling. That makes it one of the safest rounds to use in public and especially densely populated urban areas!

[@jeffbenton6183]

The first part of your statement is correct, the second part is - to my knowledge (only Wikipedia, take with a grain of salt) incorrect. It *does* prevent collateral damage, but because it looses energy faster than a 9x19mm (because it's lighter) - so there's less of a stray bullet problem. It also has a flatter trajectory (because it's faster). The 5.7x28 *does* tumble because it's a spitzer round, but it can loose energy that way; I haven't heard of it deforming, but I'm no expert.

[@upinacorner9227]

@@jeffbenton6183 There are some good ballistics test videos on youtube if you're interested in seeing deformation

[@jeffbenton6183]

@@upinacorner9227 Thanks! I'll look into it.

[@upinacorner9227]

@@jeffbenton6183 You got it! Paul Harrell does a good job inspecting the rounds after penetration in this vid: kzbin.info/www/bejne/oZnCiKubhKaWrtE

[@victoracosta4796]

So that's why FN is serious in marketing FiveseveNs to housewives. The price tag, though...

[@thepersonwhocomentz]

This is probably #3 on the list of "the exact opposite of a 'Forgotten Weapon'" behind AKs and AR15-based guns.

[@kiel_3222]

Nah, move it down a slot, you forgot the MP5

[@kingoftherevolution4855]

@@kiel_3222 the irony of this phrasing.

[@MatoVuc]

in 2021, yes. I think we will have an interesting stance towards many of these videos around 2035.

[@weirdeurasianboy8091]

CheyTac M200 Intervention. Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 and Battlefield 4 are two very famous and well known games

[@LightningSaix]

i dunno, i think MP5 gets that #3 spot imo

[@SteamPaladin]

this was such an informative video on the mechanics and history of a gun i've taken for granted in video games; very cool!

[@elisorrells5314]

I’ve been reading this same comment for ten years

[@360lootgoon3]

Absolutely love this channel. One of the most informative firearms channels I’ve found, they never disappoint.

[@louistostmann2049]

I have a felling his video will get a lot of views, judging by the universal popularity of the FN P90.

[@BigGator5]

I hear that a lot of gun enthusiasts (beyond Stargate fans) do not like the FN P90. Is that true and why?

[@ahandgrenade3640]

@@BigGator5 i don't know. I've never heard that before.

[@gingergorilla695]

@@BigGator5 I love it 💘

[@blackwoodsecurity531]

@@ahandgrenade3640 "optimum foregrip angle" elitists hate it because they can't grab the handguard like the wrist of their redheaded step-daughter

[@BigGator5]

a hand granade ...Again, I could have been misled. I haven't been able to confirm that and I've been dubious of the claim, thus why I asked. I'm guessing the guy I talked to didn't like the P90 because of Stargate. (shrugs)

[@cola98765]

15:17 "[purchasers were] Special operation teams. Small forces. Highly trained." so... Stargate teams?

[@Captain_Draco]

USAF Stargate teams. The marine and other branch teams have their own branch specific loadouts.

[@hawkeye5955]

@@Captain_Draco : Even the USMC teams operating out of the SGC had P90s.

[@A_Salted_Fishe]

It's fascinating to me that one can learn so much about the past through looking at the design and manufacturing of weapons.

[@TheTuttle99]

I love that disassembly, so sleek. I don't know why, but I assumed it would be much more complicated.

[@donvansnarr198]

Body armor, Jaffa, Replicators, Wraith. You name it? It kills it, Ask the SGC for further reviews!

[@Hortifox_the_gardener]

With some gadget expansion it even kills Kull-warrior drones. Very versatile.

[@MrJosephAnthonySilva]

@@Hortifox_the_gardener INDEED.

[@seanheath4492]

I tried, but I kept getting shown to a broom closet. :P

[@sntslilhlpr6601]

@@seanheath4492 lol good one. I forgot about that.

[@KhanSeb]

A lot of SG1 references have been made already... So I'm just going to say that Arsenal Tengu called, they want their weapon back.

[@IvanBarajas9192]

KhanSeb the legend himself still alive, I grew up with your vids :') greetings from Mexico

[@KickingAssDaily]

Metal Gear Solid 2?

[@LKNear]

Arsenal Tengu are underrated

[@Polar_Magnet]

seeing you in this comment section is fkn cool :) I grew up with your videos too

[@shuboy05]

Don't forget the FROGS.

[@MegadethTillDeth]

I can't believe how much I enjoy these videos after 100s. Firearms are fantastic. So is knowledge. They go well together

[@HelroyDelano]

Looks perfect for breach and clear work. The extrnely short barrel length would be exceptionaly good for rounding tight corners. So it makes sense spec. forces teams would use them. In urban and building clearing situations.

[@l00k4tstuff]

And that the cartridge ejects down to the floor instead of up into anyone who is to the ejection side of the weapon. Lends itself for a makeshift brass-catcher when the only clue you want to leave that you were there is the fragmented remains of the projectile in the target.

[@Bandana_Banana]

As a Stargate fan I appreciate this upload

[@awells444]

The Stargate fan in me is very happy. Note: Since finding this channel, watching Stargate SG1 has been very interesting. I spotted them using a street sweeper in one episode.

[@scienceguy8]

Same. Also spotted some Calicos in the hands of an alien civilization they visited.

[@robertgriffin662]

@@scienceguy8 try the website imfdb.com. the have every weapon used on SG-1 and alot other shows/movies.

[@corinthianimperialstudios704]

Funny thing with the P90 specifically: way back in the ancient year of 2004, Stargate Atlantis and Battlestar Galactica were airing their first seasons on the SyFy channel and Stargate SG-1 was airing its 8th season. All three shows used the P90 as the main rifle of their soldiers. When BSG came back for its second season, they switched to the Beretta Cx4 Storm, simply because the P90 was already in use on two other shows and BSG didn't want it to look like they were copying weapons from SGA and SG1. Coincidentally, the attachments they used on the Cx4 to make it look more futuristic would become highly sought after due to the popularity of the show.

[@Joshua_N-A]

Wish more variety of weaponry were added. The F2000 should be in it. Imagine the P90, F2000, SCAR and FNX in a new Stargate, that'll makes you think FN is the sponsor of the franchise.

[@88porpoise]

@@Joshua_N-A The P90 is pretty much the perfect gun for a show.

[@aaronholmes8568]

I remember reading about this in Soldier Of Fortune magazine when I was a kid and being amazed at this futuristic weapon. Fast forward 30 years and it's still pretty much unique. The MP7 admittedly serves much the same purpose, but it pretty much looks like an updated Uzi.

[@v1m30]

It's a legend. There may never be anything like it again.

[@niina83]

I always liked how they engineered the gun to feed in a way where the magazine would not protrude from the main body of the gun, but rather sit snug against the body of the weapon instead.

[@G1NZOU]

I like it too, the MP7 may be more compact overall but it gets a bit unwieldy to carry in a holster with the high capacity mags, so they have a mix of carrying with a small mag and switching to a larger one, but the P90 just defaults to a high capacity with no issues with protrusion.

[@MrBottlecapBill]

I'd like to see a double stack version of the magazine adapted to a wider range of other guns, assuming this design is dependable. Of course from a military perspective I don't know if they want to issue soldiers THAT much ammo. :D

[@bubba200874426]

@@MrBottlecapBill at some point other things become a problem. Like, how does it load, how expensive is it, who's willing to pay for it, and how reliable is it going to be. The ammo having two different presentations coming into the lifter would be one major hurdle, and every problem like that makes the idea less viable for military use.

[@josifvissarionovich5320]

This gun defeated the goa'uld in our corner of the galaxy.

[@ncs2000]

takes the fight to space and takes out snake heads

[@chrisallies6377]

"That is a weapon of fear, you scare people with it. This (P90) is a weapon of war, you kill people with it"

[@mfwicbasterd477]

Replicators too 😂

[@TheLemminkainen]

Even FreeJaffa nation thinked its primitive 😁

[@stdwproductions5090]

By far my favorite PDW. I remember shooting one of these at Drive tanks and I just loved it

[@getsum697]

What a wealth of knowledge you are about this gun. I found your presentation very concise and informative; Thank You!

[@daegiovanni5864]

designed to be roughly the width of a man's shoulders... perfect for moving around in vehicles and clearing tight quarters. the ringsight is special in particular because it is a solid block of glass-- it can never fog or mist because there are no voids for air to enter. they do make battery-illuminated ringsights, but you have to know who to go to nab one, now... my first exposure was the N64 classic Goldeneye, where, due to a coding error, the "RCP90" magazine held 80 rounds... because 50 isn't enough...

[@mathewhex7045]

This thing in goldeneye was a monster when you got two going at once

[@Strawhalo]

Same bro

[@Micah_S_0x4D]

Same, never got into SG-1 but played the hell out of Goldeneye.

[@paynekiller75]

Yep, same! I never cared much for SG but I played an absolute sh*t ton of Goldeneye back in the day lol!

[@Erik-bt3om]

Lol, same here. Best gun in the whole game. Especially when dual-wielding.

[@thekatjon20]

Ah yes, the p-90. Killer of Gods.... and countless of their minions~

[@foxredfield3288]

False gods... Dead false gods.

[@bradleygilmore5638]

Scho-vah!

[@sannidhyabalkote9536]

For rushing B

[@johnnygnoneeded]

Known in South America as the cop killer bullet...FN 5.7 is a nasty little round, very good at making holes in body armour and those behind it.

[@davidandrus323]

Much simpler than I would have expected. Great video.

[@Chris-ct8if]

There are after market illuminators for the 3 different Ring Sights if you want to illuminate the Reticle. The REM T3 for the White Ring Sight, The REM T3GD for the Green Dot Sight and the REM T3B for USG Sight you see in this video. Very easy to attach to the rifle.

[@shingshongshamalama]

"We wanted a gun that would defeat Russian paratroopers." "Yes." "This is a murder weapon for professional assassins." "I mean it doesn't HAVE to be.... but it COULD."

[@victoracosta4796]

To be fair, ANY gun can be an assassin's gun.

[@Khono]

I mean, anything that can hit its target COULD...

[@cleshsesh6155]

@@Khono laughs in Bow and arrow

[@ENCHANTMEN_]

@@cleshsesh6155 laughs in pointed stick

[@7636kei]

@@cleshsesh6155 laughs in a spiked bat

[@codyfoster7183]

Dude, you know your getting old when one of your favorite guns gets a Forgotten Weapons episode.

[@zacharyscott2298]

They actually had to develop a weapon for off world exploration though the Stargate, specifically for SG teams. It kills Jaffa good.

[@parasitic1344]

Love that weapon requirements are based off of being able to penetrate russian body armor. Nothings really changed in 40 years lol

[@victorwaddell6530]

Ruzzian troops are being sent to Ukraine with LARPing helmets and body armor . LOL .

[@parasitic1344]

@@victorwaddell6530 i have a theory that they’re just getting rid of old trash in Ukraine

[@bazej1080]

Not exactly, it was ordered in 1980s to penetrate Soviet paratroopers armor, not Russian. Soviet Union had something like 10 times (!) bigger military compared to today's Russia. Today's Russia military is far too weak and too small to pose any threat to NATO. Different times, different scale, different requirements.

[@parasitic1344]

@@bazej1080 you’re right, I should have put “commie body armor” instead

[@todesgeber]

anybody else fall in love with the P90 after watching Stargate?

[@stevennewman4778]

No, but I enjoyed it playing Golden Eye on Nintendo 64

[@kevindarkstar]

Yup 👍🏻

[@TheArklyte]

Holds up staff weapon "This requires no maintenance, no ammo, easy to learn, can survive use by generations of conscripts, hits like a truck compared to weapons of same size and weight and we have not observed the shot losing velocity or altitude over the distance even once. Oh, and Tealc over there never misses a shot with it." Holds up zat "This is a small pistol analogue of the same thing with even more cool features." Holds up P90 "And this is a plastic toy that is good only in videogames and in marketing brochures."

[@neilwilson5785]

Gosh yeah

[@Charok1]

@@TheArklyte I'd use a gun that had a fan shape of Zats taped to it. Non-lethal for SWAT teams.

[@exudeku]

Ah yes, one of the members of "Real guns that looks like and felt like a toy"

[@spyj1900]

so as f2000s does...

[@MaakaSakuranbo]

Wdym, with the f2000 is like the only two guns that actually look good

[@gingergorilla695]

@@MaakaSakuranbo I want one of these so bad, even if it is a clone, just for my truck

[@ahandgrenade3640]

@@MaakaSakuranbo it looks horrible to me. The only bullpup i really like is the tavor. I should clarify i mean the the f200 not the p90. I love the look of the p90.

[@zekegrimm6137]

@@gingergorilla695 get yourself a PS90 and sbr it

[@MegaSurtr]

Hey great video. I heard in a documentary here in Belgium that the reason special forces, secret service and police like the p90 is that there is little to no chance of overpenetration for combat in an urban environment with civilians around.

[@michaelmichaelagnew8503]

This is the plus of most sub-machine guns their ammo uses smaller cases which means less gunpowder. Therefor the bullets have less stopping power and less of a chance for them to pass through multiple bodies or through walls.

[@l82nite]

If I remember correct, the P90 started out as an experimental caseless ammo design. After the ammo didn't work out, they redesigned it to use a new cased ammo.

[@lasersharksushi1975]

The fact that gun Jesus has posted hundreds of videos yet only just made this video shows how many guns actually exist. It's always a treat to have Ian cover new things.

[@rchouser123]

Praise be to Gun Jesus

[@OoChickenmanoO]

Everyone making a reference to Stargate or counterstrike and nobody talking aboot the RCP90 in 007 Goldeneye.

[@tacklengrapple6891]

I thought the same thing. The RCP90 was just unfair in Goldeneye!

[@MandalorV7]

Man that thing had an insane rate of fire. Or at least that’s how I remember it as a kid.

[@radsbosscraft8476]

Mainly because it's all I play lately but I always am reminded of Escape from tarkov, the p90 is a beast in that game.

[@BeingFireRetardant]

Funniest weapons to dual wield in paintball mode on multiplayer. Just shower everyone with twin fire hoses.

[@deefective1100]

There is a reason why this gun was chosen for Stargate. It is futuristic looking , can fire full auto blanks and is small. It doesn't get in the way when filming.

[@l4n0n42]

one of my very favorites, thanks for the video Ian!

[@Necrodermis]

makes sense when you think about why special forces and military groups around the world would adopt these. Its compact, easy to use, easy to disassemble, light and carries a lot of rounds that aren't half bad.

[@jeffbenton6183]

It's rounds also loose energy faster than the typical 9x19mm rounds SMGs typically use which means that stray bullets are less of a problem (and there is going to be fewer of them because the round is more accurate as well).

[@analogalbacore7166]

You can use ceramic rounds.

[@Heidelaffe]

@@analogalbacore7166 if you hate having a weapon with rifling you can use ceramic ammo.

[@qwormuli77]

@@Heidelaffe You could jacket the ceramic core or tip of the bullet. However, I don't know if there have ever been a commercial ceramic round created.

[@Heidelaffe]

@@qwormuli77 I don't see the advantage for private use. And for the military it is also questionable if this would be considered as a proscribed weapon as it increases the suffering of the target (as ceramic is rather likely to shatter and you are unable to detect it easy b X-ray).

[@mbmann3892]

I don’t know what I’m more impressed by, the P-90 or the fact Ian found 5.7X28

[@NoNameAtAll2]

Is it rare?

[@PromotedPawn]

@@NoNameAtAll2 AFAIK it’s only compatible with the P90 and the accompanying pistol (the Five-seven), so it’s not like your local WallyMart is gonna be well stocked with it.

[@LordKhyron85]

@@PromotedPawn Kel-Tec and Ruger both have 5.7x28 pistols out now.

[@mbmann3892]

@@LordKhyron85 yeah but that Kel-Tec is hideous. And I want the Ruger57

[@mbmann3892]

@@NoNameAtAll2 yes the ammo for it these days is exceptionalally rare

[@OspreyKnight]

So just found out a thing about the p90. The barrel reciprocates, not by much but it is there. The barrel moves back a few millimeters and just behind the flash hider there is a barrel return spring that pushes the barrel back forward.

[@Rallarbusen]

My dad drove tanks in the Swedish army 1961-62, and they had KSP58A:s mounted coaxially and pintles on top. He told of one excercise were they shot their MGs, where on Friday morning the officers in charge found that they had two crates of ammo they hadn't used. (WWII vintage 6,5x55, tracer mix) "Crap, if we don't shoot all of it we won't get the same ammount next year!" "OK boys, shoot these to crates and then we'll head home for the weekend". The KSP58A was going to be re-built anyway, to KSP58B in NATO 7,62, so "Don't bother changing barrels". Standard practice was swapping barrels after every 200 round belt. So they just started mag-dumping, not aiming more than somwhere close to the berm. Dad said, by the fourth belt the tracer bullets never got more than 20 meters from the guns, looking like a swarm of fireflies.

[@monkeespit]

It makes a great home defense weapon (PS90 variant). The light recoil makes it easy to handle, the USG sight can be purchased now with an illuminated reticle, and the capacity makes round count a non-issue in a stressful situation. Another great detail of this weapon is that it was designed to be snag free. Notice how most of the exposed surfaces have been rounded off to prevent catching onto gear or clothing in tight handling situations. It is also extremely easy to use with one arm should the situation call for it (they really thought about the truck drivers lol)

[@BerndFelsche]

Which army employs one-armed truck drivers? Asking for a friend.

[@michaelcase8231]

@@BerndFelsche Basically everyone does. Given the facts that one hand on the wheel, and the other can use this to shoot while running through an ambush. 50 rounds makes it even more useful in that regards.

[@BeingFireRetardant]

You can also open doors and still run the gun. Why does nobody think about doors? Lol.

[@clothar23]

@@BeingFireRetardant To be fair in your average combat situation if you can't spare a dude to open the door while you cover him shit has really hit the fan. Besides I would rather have a rifle caliber carbine than a P90 if I couldn't have a full size service rifle. The ability to engage at longer ranges is always nice. Not to mention having the same ammo as your unit's light machine guns is a bonus.

[@ShagShaggio]

Me: "Hmm I kinda want to watch some stargate again soon." *Forgotten Weapons posts a video about the P90* Me: "It was meant to be."

[@therizinosaurus214]

one thing I can see being handy with the P90's compact design is that walking up to a hall intersection you dont have a barrel that gives away your position long before get to the intersection.

[@philfastmike3496]

Excellent and very detailed review as usual! Thanks Ian!

[@TechyBen]

If movies and TV have taught me anything, it's that these were invented to fight aliens...

[@lelkr]

"Don't worry...I know what the aliens like." -SGT Avery Johnson

[@basedgodstrugglin]

If movies aren’t real life then I don’t know what real life is

[@stein1919]

"we got nukes, we got knives, we got sharp sticks!"

[@wesleychapin4284]

You can never watch too much stargate.

[@agvulpine]

@@Tounushi you're crazy! Once every 10 years for me.

[@hothoploink1509]

Unless it's Stargate Universe, that sucked ^^

[@Clintondmb]

Skip universe. That was painful. Guess syfy wanted to infuse some “BSG” grittiness and it doesn’t work with star gate.

[@hothoploink1509]

@@Tounushi I'm pretty sure Atlantis Season 5 takes place after the execution, but I know what you mean ^^

[@Joshua_N-A]

If there's a new SG, they should add variety of Earth's weaponry. XM8s need a more exposure.

[@PurpleNoodleFace]

"the russians are going to attack western europe and theyre gonna drop all kinds of paratroopers behind european lines" well this is oddly accurate considering the announcements

[@Uneedhelp91]

The countries in NATO have so many good weapons that were designed for one thing...a Russian invasion. Russia attacks with t-74 tanks... Surprise we have a weapon that we have built just for taking care of them!

[@BrentWalker999]

Instead they were shit and wore almost nothing

[@jrksoldierx1436]

How is the P90 a forgotten weapon?

[@protogenxl]

Richard Dean Anderson's favorite Hand Rest

[@krashd]

It's funny seeing all the SG-1 comments as I'm currently re-watching SG-1 and it was not until the fifth season that O'neill and Carter started toting P90s, for four seasons I was thinking "I could have swore these guys carried P90s!"

[@Codesiderio]

True, in the beginning they used MP-5s, SG Atlantis always had P90s.

[@housecoatgaming]

They started carrying them in Season 4, episode 8, to be exact. For the cool factor in production terms, but the AP nature of 5.7x28mm ammo might've made an in-universe reason to switch it up.

[@Aspra]

The p90 stood out to me when I first saw it on SG-1 because of how different looking they are. At first I thought they were fake guns made just for the show. lol

[@terranempire2]

By season 7 Carter cooked up a custom AR pistol deal. Season 9 Mitchell gets an occasional G36K and the team sometimes switched to Mp7A1.

[@chandeepa90]

They switched to P90s because blanks for them were cheaper than what they were using.

[@stuborn-complaining-german]

🎶...P-chan, P-chan, best one in town, every minute shoots 900 rounds. Everyone else goes "Click, click, click..."...🎵

[@agreenwood1990]

I owned the civilian version, the ps90, and absolutely loved it. Very little recoil, lot of firepower in a very compact package even w the 16 in barrel.